Israel moves Right?

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Zakariya04, Oct 27, 2006.

  1. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Let me get this straight: settlements are the only part of this issue???
     
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  3. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    Please do get it straight. And no, settlements are not the only part of this issue. Hence the link, to clear data showing how "both sides of the story" are a consistently lopsided affair in a multiplicity of injustice.
     
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  5. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    still confused, if all the sides of the story can be explained in neat graphs, were is the graph showing rate of Palestinians leaving in 1948 war on the premise of all the Israelis being killed off and then returning home? Where is the graph of west bank and gaza rulership by egypt and jordon utill 1967? where is the graph showing at what level of civilians death tolls a country cannot claim counter operations are valid for self defense?

    I'm not saying israel is right in it occupation and settlements of the West Bank and Gaza, but the issue is not as simple as the Israelis pushing out and tormenting the Palestinians for no reason.
     
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  7. StrawDog disseminated primatemaia Valued Senior Member

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    Of course there`s a reason. They WANT the land, and they ONLY want Jews on the land.
     
  8. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    No as simple as that either.
     
  9. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    ElectricFetus: "were is the graph showing rate of Palestinians leaving in 1948 war on the premise of all the Israelis being killed off and then returning home?"

    That was never the premise. You really need to get an education about the refugee experience, to be ashamed of what you have posted, and get in touch with reality and your humanity. If you will only take the time to talk with people who have been, or who remain refugees it may help you to understand things very differently. If you will at least read some of their stories. If you don't happen to live among the Palestinian diaspora, then chances are good that there are still many other refugees living around you. Talk to people who have been forced to leave behind everything they had, their communities torn apart, to run for their lives from the Nazis, or the Soviets, or Janjawid, or any other oppressors. It was no different for the people who fled Palestine at the bitter beginning of modern Israel.

    My wife's family were European refugees, driven out by the Soviets and their local collaborators. Many of their friends didn't make it- I don't mean they didn't escape the country: Friends and neighbors were killed, and their properties stolen. Once they were gone, lies very like what you are repeating were told- that they were merely bitter people who needed to move on, and accept what was done to them. My wife's father and grandma waited a lifetime to return to their farm. Grandma was able to die at home, and now my father-in-law is working the land again that he was born on. Considering your callousness toward Palestinian refugees, I wonder if you can imagine how profound are the emotions. Maybe in other contexts I hope you may see things more clearly, removed from the prejudices you display.

    I've known refugees from many places, and that's probably why it's easy for me to recognize that your description of 1948 in Palestine is the very same as the vicious lies that were told by the murderers and thieves and their supporters who took the lands and lives of friends of my relatives, and relatives of my friends. If you can't empathize with Palestinian refugees as victims, then you are sadly misinformed, and should have the decency to get informed before further parroting the heartless rationalizations of thieves, oppressors, and murderers.
     
  10. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    The half that ignores the murder and suicide bombing atrocities of the Palestinians.
     
  11. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    If you will click the link, you can compare the butcher's bills as well. It's one mouse-click away from you right now.
     
  12. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I've been long friends with an Iraqi Armenian, 'nof said. Just because I my empathies with some Israeli positions does not mean I believe in their oppression of the Palestinians. You need to see the world in color not black and white.

    Oh yeah prejudice for wanting Israel to end is occupation of the west bank and gaza, soo prejudice, I guess I would be tolerant if I want Israel to be destroy instead, ehh?

    Who said they aren't victims? Victims of the Israelis, victims of the Egypt and the Jordanian dynasty, victims of fundamentalist Islam, victims they are, they just aren't innocent, no one is down there.
     
  13. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    ElectricFetus: "victims they are, they just aren't innocent, no one is down there."

    That is a killing mentality, and a lie.
     
  14. StrawDog disseminated primatemaia Valued Senior Member

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    On the contrary, it IS that simple.

    Israeli Tourism Ministry wipes "Palestine" of the Map
    (http://www.imemc.org/article/60452)

    They are ALREADY behaving as if there is NO Palestine or Palestinians. Disgusting, dishonest and hypocritical. No surprises.
     
  15. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Palestinians live in bondage

    http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/06/even-gas-comes-through-the-tunnels-.html
     
  16. werzil Banned Banned

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    "we know were your one eye is looking, your missing half the picture."

    Nope, "we" actually know that blind people are looking at their half of the picture and hiding the other half out of sight where, it comes to mind with the occasional war or two, when the other half of the picture refuses to hide from the blind ones.
    The ones who like to salute the ideal nationalistic socialist ideology, gather together in large numbers and wait in hushed tones for their great and powerful leader to tell them all how "we" will crush opposition, defy all, since the vaunted national socialism is far more important.

    After all, what would you all cheer about, if not for your dear leader there at the rallies to lead the chorus?
     
  17. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    So I can't object to terrorism without bing called a advocate of murder and a liar? You think people blowing them selves up in restaurants, buses and schools are innocents? Sure the Palestinians are right to resist but how they do it does not thwart their attackers, it only pisses them off more and encourages them to oppressed the Palestinians more, and it is morally wrong to punish innocents men, women and children for the actions of their military or government.

    StrawDog,

    How is that proof "its that simply"???
     
  18. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    here is something you have ignored along with all your fellow pro-Israel advocates those civilians that are being attacked are being used as a weapon against the Palestinians in an effort to deny them land. roughly half of Israel is land that Israel illegal moved its civilian population into to prevent Palestinian return to it when it occupied it in 48 during the war of Israeli aggression.
     
  19. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    ElectricFetus: "victims they are, they just aren't innocent, no one is down there."

    That is a killing mentality, and a lie.

    "So I can't object to terrorism without bing called a advocate of murder and a liar?"

    Declaring that there are no innocent victims, and then trying to obscure the declaration as "objecting to terrorism" is dishonest. You are repeating the very same lie that is routinely passed off as an excuse for cultural/race aggression and ethnic cleansing.
     
  20. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    pjdude: "[Israeli settlers] that are being attacked are being used as a weapon against the Palestinians in an effort to deny them land".

    That's an important point. Israel has been exploiting settlers as (often willing) "human shields" for expansionism: New settlements are a means of moving the goalposts- tripwires for the zionists' next excuse to continue breaking Palestine.
     
  21. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not talking about the settlers. Israel has a history of taking land(ie occupying it) and than moving its civilian population into in violation of the fourth geneva conventions. They did it 48 and since. I don't think their has been a war in which Israel took land and followed the fourth geneva conventions about moving civilian populations. The settlers are just the newest expression of this kind of behavior on Israel's part.
     
  22. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Again, so your saying I'm advocating for Israel to commit agression/genocide agains the Palestinians just because I see terrorism as wrong?

    Ok so then it alright to attack people that are being used as "human shields", great that totally takes my conscience off when israel bombs some terrorist hiding in a school or hospital. the 1948 war was a war of Israeli aggression: I guess the arabs were not attacking but were sitting their minding there own business moving in tanks and planes and shooting at things when suddenly the big bad israelis attacked them??? The israelis agreed to the UN mandate if the arabs did too there would have been no war of 1948.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2009
  23. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    16,479
    do us all a favor and shut up. If you can't even at least try and to debate like an intelligent adult don't even bother.
     

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