A US conflict with China just what this world needs!

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Brian Foley, Mar 18, 2006.

  1. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    I came across this yesterday in the Australia media , clunk head Condi Rice is here in Australia , the first crap uttered from her mouth was a threat to China .
    What the Fuck is it to America what China is doing in her own nation ? This has been of a nation is getting really dangerous to be around at the moment , the US is threatening any nation which wont tow the economic line the US wants .
    This unprovoked and threatening US military build up is why China is bolstering its military .
    This is the reason for the belligerent and threatening American tone .
    This wouldnt help either China cutting the US out of major deal with Iran .
    Of course the old bankrupt US machine is putting the lean on other nations to fund this belligerent move .

    Gee I wonder what is in store for Australia ? Seeing since 9/11 and our alliance with the US has cost us the hate of Indonesia and the MidEast now China will hate us , Great . I hope Australians will realise once the US has disappeared from the world scene we will be carrying the can for policies we enforce today .
     
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  3. Facial Valued Senior Member

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    That's horrible.
     
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  5. android nothing human inside Registered Senior Member

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    If you were China, why wouldn't you take out the USA? It has been their major political and military opponent for forty years now. USA sponsored the Chinese Nationalists/Capitalists whom the Communists deposed in 1949. The USA's support keeps Formosa/Taiwan from rejoining the mainland. And, the USA is decaying in its own filth. Why not just kick it over and enjoy the war? The Chinese are your new masters. Bow!!!
     
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  7. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    Ill say , it clearly demonstrates how defenceless the 3rd World is to military intimadation from powerful predatory capitalist powers .
    I think China is preparing to defend itself against US aggression , there is no way China could beat the USA . America is attempting to influence Chinese economic policy with a 21st century version of gunboat diplomacy .
    I think if you look at the current leadership of China you will see that they do not differ from Chiang Kaichek regime , they are both repulsive capitalist regimes .
    Taiwan is a link in the chain of military outposts which complete the encirclement of China . Beginning in Japan , Korea to Taiwan , the Phillipines and ending in Australia .
    With Americas 12 super carrier battle fleets at hand and Chinas military technological backwardness there would be nothing to enjoy just a massive replay of the Iraq kill fest .
    The Chinese are a paper tiger , their supposed economic miracle is a creation of Western finance , and as such can easily overnight be turned into a vast peasant society by the withdrawl of western finance .
     
  8. Neildo Gone Registered Senior Member

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    Gee, probably the reason why many other countries are boosting it's military as well? America is on an imperialistic rampage wanting to declare war left and right on any country that tries to compete with them economically. China would be stupid not to increase it's military against the American threat.

    - N
     
  9. towards Relax...head towards the light Registered Senior Member

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    .

    If the United States had such an economic influence of China, then there certainly would be no 300 billion dollar trade deficit, and China would not continue to blatantly violate all world trade rules by continuing to link its currency to the dollar.

    China is gaining the biggest by the trade policy. If you do not believe this, than ask this question: Why are half the products in America made by China?
    Considering the extremely close trade relationship between the two countries, I hardly think that China feels any threat.
     
  10. towards Relax...head towards the light Registered Senior Member

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    What threat? Lets face it, nuclear ballistic missles prevent any threat of invasion.

    China's miltary grows because, like the United States, conventional military is still required to keep influence over other nations with the raw materials required for your economic expansion. China, just like any other growing economic powerhouse, must now expand their sphere of influence in order to feed its hungry economy. Control is done with military prowess.

    For those of you who welcome the rise of China, I warn you. If you do not like American foreign policy, imagine the policy of a nation that so controls its own people. A nation that smashes its own people with tanks, and has such a firm grasp over its press.

    What prevents a nation like the United States, from say, turning Iraq to dust to gain control of oil has to do with the opinion of its own people. If its military goes to far, a democratically elected government with feel its people's wrath.

    Now imagine a nation like China, were the population is so strictly controlled by its own government. There is no way for its citizens to prevent its government from abusing other nations, even if they had the freedom of the press to receive proper information.

    If China gains control, you will wish for American influence again. They will no longer historically be the nation that keeps to themselves. They will expand their power, and they will do it in a ruthless manner, not seen before.
     
  11. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    I am not so worried by the Chinese military build up , nothing China can do to resist an imperial onslaught . I am worried more about the Bush junta's willingness to use its might .
    That 300 billion $ defecit is actually in Americas favour as US manufacturers have decided to utilize cheap labour therby saving some $500 billion in wages and resources in America . And then you add in the fact that this Chinese economy is fueled on loans from the West at high interest rates its a win win situation .
    95% of all manufactured Chinese goods are outsourced work on behalf of Western companies . That means 95% of all Chinese exports are in effect re-exports .
    Know what is happening the capitalist imperialist US administration is threatening China to bring its Yuan currency under financial manipulation of a privately controlled Central bank .
     
  12. -iLluSiON- Registered Senior Member

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    Don't you think that North Korean conflict will also spark something between the Chinese and Americans?
     
  13. The Devil Inside Banned Banned

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    there wont be a "north korean conflict"

    north korea has a history of challenging every single american executive administration.
    its just sabre rattling. nothing more.
     
  14. -iLluSiON- Registered Senior Member

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    That doesn't solve the conflict between North Korea and South Korea. They're still split. Something is going to happen soon, I can feel it..
     
  15. QuarkMoon I Registered Senior Member

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    Calm down, Brian. You obviously have little understanding of politics, it's all talk. There will be no military conflict between the U.S. and China, that is laughable. The amount of trading the two countries do and given the amount of debt that we owe to China, it would be economic suicide for both countries.
     
  16. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    I am , I just thought it was funny you trying to act as though you know something .
    Yeah right .
    America and China clashed in Korea , America has been arming Taiwan and has guaranteed Taiwans defence , since 1949 the US has surrounded China with military bases and recently a US intel plane was rammed . So what is laughable about it ?
    Trade : 95% of all Chinese exports are simply re-exports
    That means it is American goods that US manufacturers have had made in China and sent back to the US . And overnight the US could outsource this work to India and China would collapse .

    Debt : China buys US debt big difference and China has stopped buying US debt and the US carrys on .
    And as for borrowing China borrows from the US
    End of lesson .
     
  17. QuarkMoon I Registered Senior Member

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    Oh really, I didn't realize I had posted in this thread before. Either I have and it was deleted, or your sentence doesn't make any sense. Like I said, clam down, the conspiracy theories are getting heavy.

    Thanks for agreeing.

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    Are we talking about current times or ancient history? Again, military conflict between China and the U.S. would be economic suicide, one country can not completely defeat the other, it would be a waste of time, lives, and most importantly for the politicians, MONEY. The politicians know that, it's all talk.

    And you're point? Are you saying that does not contribute to the Chinese economy? That is the only point you must be making or else pointing this out is pointless. A blatant lie, China benefits greatly from the manufacturing jobs being outsourced to them. It's the main reason why China is lifting itself above third-world status.

    And overnight China could call for full repayment of all debts, the dollar would collapse. Both countries are tied together economically.

    Yes, we carry on by borrowing higher amounts from other countries and printing more money adding to inflation. The government also "borrows" from the treasury, by making plans to pay back the money taken from the treasury.

    Obviously, many countries borrow from the U.S. Like I said, the U.S. and China are tied together economically.

    End of Lesson.
     
  18. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah , whatever ...............
    OK its fairly obvious you are out you depths on this thread .
    The US has 12 super carrier battlefleets equipped with 1,000+ combat aircraft China doesnt even have the capacity to build one , they were considering buying the decommisioned French carrier but thats a tin can compared to the US carriers . So demonstrate to me how China with what military equipment would cripple the US in a war .
    The Chinese economy floats on Western finance and outsourcing of manufacturing work , its like a massive Mexico . All the West has to do is simply place orders with Indian factories to make their goods and China is left high and dry .
    For the Love of Mike could someone here please explain to this clown what the purchasing of debt is . America has no debt with China ! China has debt owing to America and the EU .
    US debt is public debt got it , it is domestically raised debt through the federal reserve which is a private concern . And as petroleum is traded in US $ nations must purchase US dollars therby giving America a carte blanche to print money .
    How the fuck is America and China tied together economically ?
    Here one last time
    Thats only 13.3% of US imports and when you deduct the 74% which are re-exports of outsourced US manufactured goods you are left with $51,141,000,000 which are true Chinese exports which is a nothing 3.4% of US trade figures ! Got it !
     
  19. Hurricane Angel I am the Metatron Registered Senior Member

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    America is in the middle of a military build up as well, why the fuck are they pointing the finger at China.
     
  20. towards Relax...head towards the light Registered Senior Member

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    Did you read your own article....???

    http://www.tdctrade.com/econforum/hkcer/hkcer010901.htm

    Official U.S.-China trade balance (U.S. data)........................... -83.8

    Official U.S.-China trade balance (Chin data)........................... -29.7

    U.S-China trade fob balance adj. for reexports (U.S. data)......... -58.9

    U.S-China trade fob balance adj. for reexports (china data)........ -52.6



    The table points out how high the trade deficit is still even including reexports. This data was also back in 2000, so how high is it now. Whats with the 95% reexport? I have seen this before, you do not read your own articles.....

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    Actually China buys U.S. bonds to support America's debt at a growing rate
    The U.S. has 8.1 trillion in debt. 3.1 trillion of that is to Social Security,pensions, and Trust funds.

    4.1 billion of debt is what the U.S. has borrowed. 2.2 is in treasury notes and T-bonds. Japan is owed about 1.2 billion. China, thus far, is owed about 323 billion by 2005.

    The amount of debt that the United States buys is a tiny fraction, considering that China has a very small budget deficit. Where do you think these high interest loans come from?

    This article mentions a 5-billion dollar nuclear plant deal, and has nothing to do with an overall borrowing trend. It is like Bill Gates buying a Porsche and saying his debt has risen.

    This article from 2005 is exaggerating. China is indeed slowing down buying dollars, but certainly cannot at this point stop, unless they wish to see the Yuan rise in value and or have unsustainable inflation.

    http://transcripts.fxstreet.com/2006/02/how_will_china_.html

    About three quarters of its forex is still U.S. Treasury Bills...

    China will slow down its buying of american debt, but it must do it slowly. This certainly does not prove your earlier assertion that the United States is suppying China with high interest debt. It simply means that China is buying less of the U.S. debt.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2006
  21. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    You obviously have a problem understanding the post , I was showing the total effect of Chinese - US trade on the entire US global trade figures to show how China trade is not at all that crucial. The table you have provided is only for China -US trade . Hardly a comparison
    The figures are from 2004 and when you take out re-exports the total trade with America is 3.4% of the American total. So how would a trade dispute with China cripple America ?
    If China is such an economic powerhouse why does it need $5 billion to build a nuclear power plant ?
    Like I said China floats on Western capital .
     
  22. Mosheh Thezion Registered Senior Member

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    its a valid question... china has no enemies... no threats... who would mess with china today??? ha.

    a military build up is not a good sign...

    have any of you actually read 'MAO'S LITTLE READ BOOK'???????

    IT IS BLANTENT IN ITS HATE FOR THE WEST... and it promotes violent conflict between the left and right... or in MAO'S WORDS.... THE IMPERIALISTS...
    I.E... AMERICA..


    SO...
    -MT
     
  23. Brian Foley REFUSE - RESIST Valued Senior Member

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    As I said earlier .
    Now explain to me why America has an open policy of military encirclement of China and show me what military weaponery China possess's that can match Americas might .
     

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