A large group of Hunter College students occupied the college president's office yesterday to demand that she take a public stand against the proposed tuition hikes, budget cuts, and war on Iraq(which is where all that money is going) or participate in a public forum with students to discuss these issues.
After the president refused to even listen to the students and turned her back on the student speaker a group of slightly under 20 students(myself included) spent the night in her office in order to present the demands to her again in the morning.
That morning, after again turning her back on us, we were threatened with arrest and suspension if we didn't leave. As a matter of principle, nine of us opted to stay anyway until we were forced out or she at least acknowledged our demands...faced with the choice between agreeing to look at our demands
and dragging students out bodily throught the college they caved in, and agreed to respond by friday.

What do people think about this type of tactic? Is it effective? Is it justified?

http://nyc.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=46431&group=webcast

So let me get this straight... you occupied her office and demanded that she take a stand on a war against Iraq, because you don't believe the US should be forcing their own opinions down everyone elses' throats?

Originally posted by The Marquis
So let me get this straight... you occupied her office and demanded that she take a stand on a war against Iraq, because you don't believe the US should be forcing their own opinions down everyone elses' throats?

No. We occupied her office and demanded that she take a stand on a war against Iraq, the budget cuts, and the tuition hike because we, the students will be adversely affected by these things and she as the president of our college should represent our views on these issues. We gave her the option of agreeing to a public forums to address the issue as well, knowing that she would never agree to take a stand that might hurt her politically.

Not effective in my opinion. Taking on too many issues simultaneously to push through any message.

hypewaders,
in general, I agree that having a very specific target is crucial, in this instance the budget cuts, tuition hikes and war are all sufficiently connected to make it effective. This action was aimed at hunters working class student population who are going to be hit with a 1200 dollar tuition increase, by drawing people's attention to the connection between their tuition increase and the war budget we showed how the war effects us all personally.

jps, yes I can see now that it would make sense, and strengthen the message among Hunter students- Like they say "Think Global Act Local". Congratulations on your initiative. I'd like to hear the news on the college's promised response Friday. Can you link a website covering this?

I often talk with people about the economic downside of our Mideast "nation-building", and many are far more interested in that aspect than in the human costs. As you rightly point out, it's all tied together.

You have me thinking, maybe the disastrous economics of Bushevism do need more daylight, along with the grisly human costs of the coming American Anschluss. If Americans are unshakeably hard and callous when it comes to brown people 6k miles away, maybe more emphasis on the damage here at home would help break the ambivalence, apathy, and blind nationalism. Unfortunately, I personally am an Economics moron.

Well, until I think on it some more, my marching sign just says "DISARM DUBYA!"

yeah,
Although in a way I think its reprehensible to talk about the war in economic terms when the human toll of it will be so terrible, but I think the most important thing is to be effective in getting people mobilized against it.
With any luck this action will increase Hunter's contribution to the CUNY contingent for the 15th demo.
updates will most likely be on nyc indymedia, linked above.

I'll watch for your sign. seems as good a slogan for this issue as any :) I still haven't come up with a good one yet, at this rate i'll get stuck with one of the mass produced ones they hand out there.

Do you happen to live in California? I just received a letter that my college is more than doubling the tuition costs starting in the fall. I thought this was only because of Californias economic nightmare, is this happening other places too?

Oh, and I dont think your scare tactics are a good idea. I agree with The Marquis, you cant expect anyone to take you too seriously if your being hypocritical.

Oppose the war on Iraq or else!!!!

That just doesnt settle too well with me. But at least your doing something about what you believe in. Theres at least honor in that.

" ...your doing something about what you believe in. Theres at least honor in that."

Yes!

I live in New York City, Hunter is part of the City University of New York(CUNY)
I don't know about all around the country, but it wouldn't surprise me, there's certainly been a lot of cut back in NY state.
This economic nightmare doesn't have to exist. The money is there. The problem is that Bush has given a bunch of it away in a huge tax break to the obscenely wealthy and has allocated the rest for killing Iraqis.(thats an over simplification, but its basically true)

I'm unclear on how demanding that the president of our college take a position thats on the side of the colleges students is hypocritical. We didn't say "oppose the war on Iraq or else" we said either oppose the war on Iraq or meet with the students in an open forum and tell us why. We were forced to camp out in her office because she refused to even look at the papers we had drawn up, and instead made a vague statement about how "we all want the college to be as affordable as possible" and then turned her back on students responding to what she said.
Of course I respect her right to hold any opinion she wants, however, if her opinions, and actions, are fundementally opposed to what is in the interests of the students she is supposed to serve, then she should not be the president of this college.

This tactic was used quite a bit in the 60's {I was a bit too young to remember it}. Anyway, some form of protest it better than nothing. I too live in NYC and this is the first I've heard of this talking place.

Does anyone in the NYC area know where the protest will be taking place this weekend?


Of course I respect her right to hold any opinion she wants, however, if her opinions, and actions, are fundementally opposed to what is in the interests of the students she is supposed to serve, then she should not be the president of this college.

In an ideal world, you would be right but in this day and age...

dkb218,
The rally will be near the United Nations (First Avenue stretching north from 49th Street) beginning at noon.
for more info:
http://www.unitedforpeace.org

Also today another group of activists blockaded the hollland tunnel. Hopefully this is the start of a trend.
I think the best place for information on activism in NYC is indymedia
http://www.nyc.indymedia.org/

Better than a riot, or blowing up her office.

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/db/1970/db701130.gif
Doonesbury (http://www.doonesbury.com), Nov. 30, 1970

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/db/1970/db701201.gif
Doonesbury (http://www.doonesbury.com), Dec. 1, 1970

and one last one:

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/db/1971/db711117.gif
Doonesbury (http://www.doonesbury.com), Nov. 17, 1971

So history is cyclical. I'm not sure what else to say. Sit-in, love-in, pray-in, do whatever. Sure, not everybody's Rosa Parks and not every issue is Civil Rights, but if it's what you gotta do ....

:m:,
Tiassa :cool:

Originally posted by jps
No. We occupied her office and demanded that she take a stand on a war against Iraq, the budget cuts, and the tuition hike because we, the students will be adversely affected by these things and she as the president of our college should represent our views on these issues. We gave her the option of agreeing to a public forums to address the issue as well, knowing that she would never agree to take a stand that might hurt her politically.

How can you demand that she take a stand on those issues? What if she required all students come to a forum so she could demand that each of YOU support a war with Iraq? Would you? As president, she's not required to express your views. If you have a cause (and you've got too many) then have your sit in and hope you get some media coverage to express your views, but don't expect the school administration to echo your beliefs.

Originally posted by Coldrake
How can you demand that she take a stand on those issues? What if she required all students come to a forum so she could demand that each of YOU support a war with Iraq? Would you? As president, she's not required to express your views. If you have a cause (and you've got too many) then have your sit in and hope you get some media coverage to express your views, but don't expect the school administration to echo your beliefs.

As president, she SHOULD be required to support our views on issues which put us at risk of not being able to afford tuition anymore. Again, this is not a matter of individuals demanding that other individuals accept out views, this is the students demanding that their president, whose salary WE pay not be acting in a way that is counter to the students interests.

Originally posted by jps
As president, she SHOULD be required to support our views on issues which put us at risk of not being able to afford tuition anymore. Again, this is not a matter of individuals demanding that other individuals accept out views, this is the students demanding that their president, whose salary WE pay not be acting in a way that is counter to the students interests.

Then drop the anti-war demands and focus on tuition hikes. Money earmarked for the war would not have trickled down to institutions of higher learning anyhow. Those are basically funded by the states, or as is often the case with private institutions, by a particular religious denomination. And don't expect much help from the school president on that end anyway. She can have little effect on what a board of trustees decides about tuition; that's not really her area. She is there to oversee the funds that are provided for the operation of the school.

jps

thanks for the information. My birthday this weekend and I can see no better way to spend it!

Thanks!

Originally posted by Coldrake
Then drop the anti-war demands and focus on tuition hikes. Money earmarked for the war would not have trickled down to institutions of higher learning anyhow. Those are basically funded by the states, or as is often the case with private institutions, by a particular religious denomination. And don't expect much help from the school president on that end anyway. She can have little effect on what a board of trustees decides about tuition; that's not really her area. She is there to oversee the funds that are provided for the operation of the school.

As I stated above, by educating students on the connections between the war and their tuition hikes we hoped to show how it affects them personally.
The college is funded by the state, however the state's lack of funds is in no small part caused by the federal governments diverting money away from social programs and towards war. The federal and state governments are not independant of one another.
The war also effects students directly as many of them will be called up to go to Iraq.

Originally posted by jps
A large group of Hunter College students occupied the college president's office yesterday to demand that she take a public stand against the proposed tuition hikes, budget cuts, and war on Iraq... My opinion is that if you want to take a stand on your own free will and conviction make sure you are not forcing someone else to take you own stand and convictions.

Why would she have to take a “public” stand on something that she isn’t responsible for just because the students do not agree with Government policies?

You are students, you are there to attain intelligence and if you attain it, use it wisely.

Chaos takes place when people wake up, having missed most of the movie and start throwing tomatoes for a lousy show.

:rolleyes:

Originally posted by jps
As president, she SHOULD be required to support our views on issues which put us at risk of not being able to afford tuition anymore. Again, this is not a matter of individuals demanding that other individuals accept out views, this is the students demanding that their president, whose salary WE pay not be acting in a way that is counter to the students interests.
Was there a vote by students, a petition, or any other kind of proof, that your demands reflect the whole of your school's student body? Is she not entitled to her own opinion, why should she be forced to voice the views of 20 people?

No offence, but your peace efforts seem to be aimed in the wrong direction, and at the wrong people...

Originally posted by jps
The federal and state governments are not independant of one another.

Well, yes they are independent of one another, but I understand what you're trying to say. However, federal school funds are already set for this year's budget, so no money will be directed away from them.

The war also effects students directly as many of them will be called up to go to Iraq.

No student will be called up unless he/she happens to be in the reserve, but odds are, if that was the case they would have already been called up by now.

static 76,
Yes, there was a petition signed by many thousands of students.

Coldrake,
The state budget is not independant of the federal budget, the federal govt gives states money for many things.
There are students in the reserves who just recieved notice that they have been called up.

Microsoft, again, I respect her right to hold whatever opinions she has, I do not respect her right to be the president of a college while holding views that harm the students who pay her salary.

Originally posted by jps
Coldrake,
The state budget is not independant of the federal budget, the federal govt gives states money for many things.


Read again what I said.

Well, yes they are independent of one another, but I understand what you're trying to say. However, federal school funds are already set for this year's budget, so no money will be directed away from them.

There are students in the reserves who just recieved notice that they have been called up.

If you join the reserves you have to be prepared for that.

Coldrake, this years budget is not the issue. tuition for this year has been paid for the most part. and in any case, if there was no war in iraq the money that has been set aside for it could be freed up for other activities.

Many students join the reserves soley because they have no other way to pay for college, not because they want to go kill people for uncle sam.

Originally posted by jps
Coldrake, this years budget is not the issue. tuition for this year has been paid for the most part. and in any case, if there was no war in iraq the money that has been set aside for it could be freed up for other activities.

Other issues wasn't part of your original gripe. It was tuition. Now your adding grievances. Look, I admire your willingness to take actions for your beliefs. But I still go back to my original point. Your president is not going to be your voice. Take your fellow students and go stage a sit-in in the studio of a local nes network. Maybe they will air your grievances.

Many students join the reserves soley because they have no other way to pay for college, not because they want to go kill people for uncle sam.

If it's a state run college then they can get Pell Grants or other forms of assistance. And sorry, but as a veteran I have little sympathy for someone who uses the military to pay their way through college and then complains if he/she gets called up. If you're prepared to take advantage of the positives of joining, then you have to be prepared for the negatives.

i'm not adding other issues, i was speaking generally,
what i meant was, if there was no war in iraq there would be more money for other things, meaning there would be money to keep tuition down and the schools budget up.

I have the greatest sympathy for lower income kids who are enticed into joining the military by promises of a better life only to be shipped off to fight a war that s not in their interest and that they don't believe in.

The money for scholarships has also been cut, and even before this there wasn't enough of them for everyone.

The military does offer them a chance at a better life, but nothing in life comes without a price.

Hunter's president responded to the demands we gave her last week with a long, vague, and somewhat insulting letter which completely ignored our request for her to hold an open forum. This letter was sent out to all the schools e-mail accounts.

In this letter she said that shes has

" been asked by a certain segment of the student population to make a public statement against the potential war with Iraq. While I appreciate and respect the strong feelings of this group, I believe such a statement would have the effect of chilling campus discourse on this issue and suppressing the climate of openness that I am committed to fostering in our community."

this is incredibly hypocritical given the fact that she turned her back on, and ultimately threatened to arrest and suspend students who tried to express their views to her.

she also said that

"In the near future you will receive information about how you can make your voices heard by those at the city and state levels who are making decisions regarding state support for higher education."

which clearly is an attempt to get students who aren't already invovled in this struggle to look to her for information on fighting the budget cuts and keep them from getting involved with the movement that also opposed the war and tuition hikes, as she is well aware that we already know how to do these things far better than she does.