I've made the video below, and provided the transcript if you are unable to watch it. Fleas cannot even remotely imagine what is outside the realm of your carpet, your pets and you. Just like fleas exist in their current state, they’re unaware of the world outside where they live. They are unaware of all the advances humans have made and all that exists in the known universe, just as we are are capable of being unaware what exists outside the boundaries of what we can perceive. In that scenario we may exist in a smaller universe that is a part of a larger one, such as fleas can be unaware that there are other planets. Or that we may exist in a simulation, because that’s also beyond the boundaries of what we have technology or capabilities to comprehend. Beyond the universe that it’s taken us so long to know so little about (in proportion to all that may exist), we could exist on a microscopic scale to larger beings, who might also be unable to perceive us. Outside of any speculation, just with what you can see and feel for yourself - Do you believe that as a society now, we will continue improving technology as far as computers and AI and robotics? If so, consider society will get to a point where we can create a technology that can simulate life, and artificial intelligence which learns and continues developing. Give that artificial intelligence enough time and you will get to creatures like us, that are completely incapable of perceiving any existence outside of the realm of the simulation that they exist in. When that is possible, we will also have created a simulation which can create a simulation of themselves. P.S. - (I was inspired to make this as I was recently dealing with a small flea problem my dog picked up while at a local dog park, which led me to a cycle of research)
The fleas might lack visceral evidence of even their own limited, local environment. Should their sensory processing be too primitive to yield intuitions or qualitative showings of any kind. Yet the outward body behavior of one of the parasites would still be guided via the microscopic operations of its nervous system. (The insect's awareness would thereby be demoted from internal experiences to just that successful behavior of its body alone; a philosophical zombie). Another way to put it: If what "perception" corresponds to in terms of existence is nothing but another biological complex of interacting components, then that mechanistic version of receiving and analyzing / organizing information and responding to it (in contrast to the simple, brute experience of such) still causally gets the job of consciousness done. Without the "superfluous" addition of those private and inter-subjective manifestations which we're familiar with. (Considering the latter to be an emergent knowledge of be-ing rather than the manner or substance of being itself -- so as to avoid panpsychism, idealism, etc). Similarly, if the "minds" of simulated humans / creatures reduce down to the artificial circuitry of microscopic electronic switches that are devoid of any deliberate engineering intent for phenomenal properties to supervene upon their changing patterns... Then they could be p-zombies like the aforementioned fleas. Their sensations, feelings, personal thoughts (intellect) would lack exhibited evidence of their occurrence, as well as their virtual world which would otherwise have been featured in such. Validation of their simulated existence would come from observers at the level which created them -- but only if those witnesses oppositely did have experiences. Philosophical zombies usually carry the onus of constantly pretending or speaking as if they do have shown content in their sensations and thoughts, when they actually do not. But their dishonesty is set aside here to better point out the difficulty in confirming their own be-ing. The problem with a (zombie) virtual inhabitant alternatively declaring that "I have confirmed the existence of myself and my realm by formulaic proof instead of by qualitative showing" is that the existence itself of such an inference or reasoning would go unsubstantiated. Because it like everything else would not be "given" as an object of manifestation slash intuition (whether in the context of visual, audile, olfactive, tactile, gustatory, or other alien / unknown modes of experience).
I think most people think artificial simulation must require computers but it might be done without them. If the universe is 4 dimensional, there may be 4D beings who created & control what we perceive as the universe & it could be as artificial to them as a computer simulation would be to us. Their inexplicable mucking about may be the basis for god belief. If we someday have very good simulations, that will be evidence that we could be in 1 but if we cannot do it, that does not mean we are not in a simulation. With Star Trek & other stories with artificial simulations, I always think when they exit a simulation, how can they possibly know for certain they are out of the simulation? <>
You know, if Minkowski's 4D spacetime had explained something like conservation of energy at at deeper level (and it doesn't), I would have been onboard with it even more than I was when I was much younger and infinitely more gullible. But adding higher dimensions identical in most respects to lower ones without a better motivation than "LOOK! I can do math in higher dimensions!) is not a motivation. Likewise, parallel universes. Conservation of energy exists in ONE universe. THIS universe, and oh, by the way, to FABRICATE other universes and higher dimensions out of whole cloth is going to require them to be populated with something we actually care about other than manipulating numbers there. Oh, I don't know, maybe ENERGY would be a nice thing to have there, particularly if anyone expects anything in a higher dimension to have any impact or communication with ENERGY that is in THIS UNIVERSE. Having complex numbers to explain potential energy is totally cool, but Hilbert space? Come on. Total loser. Just like Euclidean Relativity would be. There's no coordinate system in inertialess space, and nowhere to plant or nail an origin to either. The Lorentz roadbed has inertia, and it works if you can do all of your measurements INFINITELY FAST. And then Minkowski trashes the idea of infinitely fast before you can blink. Absolute time exists. Absolute space is a fantasy. Fleas are very small and very fast. Maybe they actually know more about that scale than we do.
Brain in a vat? To much watching The Matrix ? does not sound quite correct Do you mean We don't know what we don't know (self evident) or We are capable of being aware of boundaries to our knowledge while at the same time capable of knowing something may exist outside of our boundaries of knowledge (self evident)? On a personal level I can recall reading a comic book in which the main story line was the Earth existed as a speck on the leg of a flea who existed on the back of a dog So that puts that idea at least 60 years ago and I suspect further back On what scale are you measuring so long and so little? And how have you decided we know so little as a proportion of our knowledge since as has been stated we don't know what we don't know? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Oh no. Please, no more Donald Rumsfeld (unknown unknowns) philosophy. Yes, my first thought was "brain in a vat" as well. It's good to consider metacognitive limitations sometimes. I have a whole spiel about finite minds using symbols to try and grasp the infinite. Same idea.
Since we don't know the percentage of the knowledge we know set against the total amount of knowledge out there (if there is even a total) we cannot say we know if we know a little or a lot Same applies to the time line It appears our accumulation of knowledge is accelerating My thoughts go to will the acceleration slow and almost plateau and only move up slowly? Since we don't know how much knowledge there is left to chase it makes it impossible to set a time line for when we can expect to know everything Which means we have no idea if we are within a few years or millennium of knowing it all I discount the few posters in this and other such forums who either say they know everything or post a link to someone who makes the same claim If only the thousands of paranormal ideas were real perhaps we would be closer to knowing everything Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Disinformation is increasing exponentially as well. With Trump as president, it is much faster of course, because of his keen interest in using fabrications and conspiracies to eventually replace facts. His supporters no doubt believe this will level the playing field between them and those who have actually scaled a learning curve or two. Makes perfect sense. Push back. It's a long way down.
I'm not to worried about disinformation Or alternative facts since disinformation generally gets found out fairly quick and alternative facts just don't work By the by how are the 3 investigations going? Looking into Trumps ties with Russia looks like a job for life Trump We haven't found any evidence yet but we know it exist we just haven't found it and it (the evidence) is why he is President Sounds like they are looking for god god We haven't found any evidence yet but we know it exist we just haven't found it and it (the evidence) is why he is god OMG you don't think.......? Could it be........? Looks different from his paintings Na just coincidence he has come to save us Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! How many lanes would you like the bridge to be? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
For once, Trump did the right thing, even if it was for all the wrong reasons. Comey was conflicted for some time. He's a good man, and this does not reflect badly on him at all. It will be a chilly day in hell the next time the FBI briefs Trump about ANY investigation into Trump or his administration, EXACTLY AS IT SHOULD BE. Sounds like something he might have said at his graduation address at Liberty University. The advice he gave them was very bad: "Be an outsider." I'd be very circumspect about hiring anyone from Liberty university for any job outside of the clergy. Certainly their science credentials are going to be lacking some considerable depth.
I saw part of his address to the students I'm guessing he didn't tell them "I'm only here for the religious vote" Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
We do not know how much we do not know but I'm guessing it's more than 30,000 times what we do know. <>
What ever amount is guessed at I would contend it remains constant This phenomenon is the result of every question we find answers to results in a host of further queries Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! True Why did I miss that? Grrrrr to myself Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
From ZoddyDoz Post 1 This & other speculations in Post 1 are nonsense. The Matrix is interesting SciFi & perhaps should be considered fantasy instead of SciFi. I doubt that any technological culture would be capable of creating such a simulation. I am in my late 80's & have memories of my past as well as knowledge gained through 16 years of schooling. I consider myself unique in that there is no exact copy of me, but not unique in having memories of my past. There is no reason for me to believe that the humans I encounter & billions of others do not have similar memories. Not all will have 16 years of schooling, but many will. Even if such a simulation were possible, why would any technological culture expend resources to create such a simulation? Everything in the mindscape of an individual is not necessarily possible. The above is one of the not possible thoughts.
BTW: The Matrix series has a basic flaw which occurs at least twice. Virtual activities have effects on the reality level.
