Is there any experimental or observational confirmation of curvature of spacetime?

OK, this thread is heavier than usual on the flaming and lighter than usual on content - and that's saying a lot for SciFo.

I'd prefer to judge for myself who and what is worth reading.

Could those who are interested only in poisoning-the-well and other ad hom fallacies please set the font in a different colour so it's distinguishable from the actual content relating to the topic?

That'd be great.

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And you've read many papers in relativity you say?

Cosmological expansion is spacetime curvature.

So you have this imagination that, somehow, one could have gravitational time dilation without spacetime curvature? That would be a fantastic theory to develop; good luck.

You can't get the time dilation of the specific amount without the spacetime curvature and vice versa. That's just GR. Again, if you think that GR is wrong and there is some super-secret hidden theory that GR just stumbled on to aping, then fine, that's your prerogative. You don't have any evidence for this claim, and in general I follow Newton's 4th Rule of Reasoning. In this case I suggest, hypotheses non fingo.

 

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I'm glad that Farsight demonstrated that he still doesn't understand cosmological expansion.

 

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It's sad that he can't actually hide the googling he is doing to cherry-pick. "https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...ed=0ahUKEwidr8_Kn4XNAhXrCsAKHelyDEcQ6AEIHDAA#"

 

Sadly, I'm trying to save you a lot of grief re: Farsight. He really is obsessed with his particular TOE. The text of 95% of his posts (along with good rebuttals) can be found here: http://cosmoquest.org/forum/archive/index.php/t-96659.html

 

Lordy, I'd forgotten!

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Note the date. And the same tired one-note tune...

 

Please don't. I am participating in this thread because I want to discuss this topic. If I wanted to discuss the flamage of forum members, I'd go elsewhere.

This is Ultron's thread. Can we keep it about the OP please?

 

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As you have rightly stated that bending of light can be explained by Newtonian Gravity also, accuracy apart. You have also rightly stated that there are no direct evidence for curvature of spacetime. I, and I am not alone, do not understand what is this curvature of spacetime in reality......those who are supporting this, also do not understand what is this curvature of spacetime in reality. You will be further confused that the path traced by lights and objects in curved spacetime is called as straightline, so if it is straightline by simple generation old definition of straightline, there should not be any curvature, but they say it is there ? Moreover light is also following curvature of spacetime and planets etc are also following curvature of spacetime around massive star ? So what exactly is the curvature of spacetime ? Is it curvature of space ? No it is not, but such mix up is present in literature too. If it is the curvature of space, then why it is initial speed dependent of the moving object ? Moreover you can create curvature of the space, only if it has materialistic influenciable property, but we are silent which aspect of space is responsible for this curvature.

Then we do not know how this curvatue can change if two objects are nearby, say two almost equal mass Neutron star are orbiting each other (Binary combination), then we do not know how do you get resultant curvature, consider the two binary BHs and it defies all logic. It is more than 100 years and we do not know how to solve these EFEs, still eluding.

Yes, I would agree that spacetime is a mathematical model, it is geometrical representation of gravity, and involves curvature etc, associating it with space or with anything realistic is bad...neither side should push it.

Please note spacetime is not space....

It is like when you solve a difficul stokes non linear equation in fluid dynamics and map it then the curve may involve many curvatures, these curvatures can be assigned certain physical meaning but strictly under mathematical interpretation. Associating such interpretation with Physical interim reality is bound to create problems.

 

Ignoring the rest of the unscientific babble and attending to the above .....
Space and Time have been shown to be interchangeable.
Although negligible at Earthly speeds, when one approaches relativistic speeds, it has been shown that "the faster you travel in space the less you travel in time...... The faster you travel in time the less you travel in space".
Both space and time are non absolute quantities, that vary and change according to one's Frame of Reference.
Herman Minkowski was one of the first to recognise this quality and extend it by stating that which follows and which is now generally accepted......
"The views of space and time which I wish to lay before you have sprung from the soil of experimental physics, and therein lies their strength. They are radical. Henceforth space by itself, and time by itself, are doomed to fade away into mere shadows, and only a kind of union of the two will preserve an independent reality."

 

There is much evidence that not only explains and supports it, and it can be shown mathematically that proves it is a realistic view of the universe. But you ignore that, and hold forth your torch of obstinate ignorance.

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Throw some light please.....this can be very profound as well as very stupid depending on your explanation.....so I want to know, on which side you are...

 

Actually more a case of just foolishly or slavishly following the anti science religious brigade with underdeveloped critical thinking.

 

Dr Toad,

Pl let me know what is the curvature of spacetime in reality...

 

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Not really that profound, more common sense and an application of the principals of SR.

 

But I thought he was talking about curved spacetime...GR not SR.

 

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My reply was to your statement
"Please note spacetime is not space"....Not about curvature as such.
I would have thought that was clear.

 

Where?

 

What do you mean where ? Playing Smartass ?
Just let me know what is the curvature of spacetime in reality ?
And what evidence you have for curvature ?
And how you link with the space ?

 

Paddoboy,

I see no commonsense in your below parrotized statement....

"the faster you travel in space the less you travel in time...... The faster you travel in time the less you travel in space".

Pl explain how you travel faster in time ??