Misogyny and Health Care: When it doesn't take two to tango?

In other words, once she reaches 20 weeks, she is no longer in full ownership of her body and the State controls and owns her uterus until that baby is born.

Correction, viability is now down to when the State believes the baby feels pain.

It is not easy, but it is not that hard either. If her doctor believes that the pregnancy will impact on her mental health, she can and will be granted one. If the pregnancy puts her life at risk in any way (even depression which could lead to suicide), she can legally obtain an abortion in this country. Many women have.

And you seem to believe that your personal opinion should matter and should factor into a person's rights over her own body and her reproductive organs.

Don't you get it yet?

What I personally believe is beside the point. What I personally believe only applies to my own reproductive organs, no one else's. It is not my place to impose my personal beliefs on another woman's uterus. You seem to believe that men such as yourself and Mr England should have more rights over a woman's uterus than she does, based solely on your personal beliefs.

The same applies to the OP of this thread. Men are declaring ownership of women's uterus because of their personal and at times, religious beliefs, to the point where they are declaring that women should just no thave sex because they personally believe in abstinence, ergo women should not be given easier access to birth control. And that is the hilarious and somewhat appalling thing with this whole debate. It is men who control it, just as they are currently trying to control the reproductive organs of women. And the extent this is being pushed is ridiculous and pathetic. We are watching your fellow conservatives in your country limit birth control to charging women with murder because they tried to commit suicide while they are pregnant to doctors refusing and being denied the right to perform abortions on women who are miscarrying because the fetus still has a heartbeat. If you want to see the true level of the misogyny of Republicans and what they are subjecting women to, you only have to look at Arizona, if the examples cited in this thread aren't bad enough:

Arizona legislators have advanced an unprecedented bill that would require women who wish to have their contraception covered by their health insurance plans to prove to their employers that they are taking it to treat medical conditions. The bill also makes it easier for Arizona employers to fire a woman for using birth control to prevent pregnancy despite the employer's moral objection.

Under current law, health plans in Arizona that cover other prescription medications must also cover contraception. House Bill 2625, which the state House of Representatives passed earlier this month and the Senate Judiciary Committee endorsed on Monday, repeals that law and allows any employer to refuse to cover contraception that will be used "for contraceptive, abortifacient, abortion or sterilization purposes." If a woman wants the cost of her contraception covered, she has to "submit a claim" to her employer providing evidence of a medical condition, such as endometriosis or polycystic ovarian syndrome, that can be treated with birth control.

Moreover, according to the American Civil Liberties Union, the law would give Arizona employers the green light to fire a woman upon finding out that she took birth control for the purpose of preventing pregnancy.

"The bill goes beyond guaranteeing a person's rights to express and practice their faith," Anjali Abraham, a lobbyist for the ACLU, told the Senate panel, "and instead lets employers prioritize their beliefs over the beliefs, the interests, the needs of their employees, in this case, particularly, female employees."

The sponsor of the bill told the committee that it is intended to protect the First Amendment right to religious liberty.​

So please, can your moral indignation. Who do you think you are fooling here? Keep your opinion about reproductive rights to your own gonads and allow women the dignity to have control over their own bodies.

 

Really? Because here in NZ I can go to my GP and get a perscription for a dozen boxes of condomns for 3 NZD (2.45 USD).

Also not covered by my employer, but under government provided healthcare.

The idea being, in theory at least (I believe anyway), that by making birthcontrol cheap and accessable, you save money in the longterm because you're no longer paying for unwanted pregnancies and STDs.

 

I can do, I don't have to. I can also buy them at the local supermarket.

Meat, Eggs, Milk, and condomns.

Pharmacy, Supermarket, and Rest-rooms, yes, they are also available at all of these locations.

And it's fine if I'm in a jam, or in the mood for something a little different...

But really, what's so wrong about planning ahead?

It's not like Durex gets screwed out of any money.

 

Because you consider a 20 week old fetus to be a person, do you? A viable person?

I can assure you, that "person" does not yet exist. It has no rights under any law in the land. And yet, Conservatives such as yourself deem it more a person than the actual person in whom it is being carried, thereby stripping the mother of any rights she may have over her body. The funny thing of course is that those against in the Republican party, or more to the point, those going rabid about it in the public arena, are all male. It is the men of your side who are comparing women to cattle and even denying women the right to access birth control measures, let alone abortions.

It is misogynistic and paternalistic, not to mention controlling and domineering.

We will forget of course that fetal age can be off by quite a few weeks and that Republicans are trying to push not just from fertilisation, but from when the woman last menstruated. That is the level of control Republican males feel they should have on the reproductive organs of women.

And you live in a country where your law makers compare women to cattle and others are willing and desiring to let women die while they are miscarrying because the miscarriage has a heartbeat. Others are having to drive up to 90 miles away during a miscarriage, with a limb sticking out of her vagina, because men who share your beliefs feel that they are less deserving of life than the child they are miscarrying and refuse to actually treat her, because the treatment would amount to an abortion - which would ensure she does not die bleeding or go septic during her miscarriage. That is the extent the pathetic men you are here defending are pushing for in your supposedly non-barbaric country.

In my country, that would not wash. Quite the contrary. Here, we value the woman's rights to her own body and if her health is affected, even mental health, than she is paramount. Not a 20 week old fetus that may or may not make it to term. In other words, in Australia, men such as yourself, could not lay claim to every woman's uterus and vagina because of your twisted belief systems.

My personal beliefs about abortion has no bearing on this debate. I have neither crowed or exclaimed pride in our health system. What I have reiterated is that no one should have rights over the body of another. You should not have any rights over the uterus of a woman living 2000 miles away because of your personal belief system. Nor should she have rights over what you do with your sperm.

But before you declare any country barbaric, keep in mind that it is your country and the men you support in your Government who openly declare women to be cattle and are openly willing to allow women to die because of what is in their uterus. You are openly trying to control and enslave women to be some sort of baby factories, because you seem to feel that you should have more say over how, when and where a woman reproduces than the woman does. Which makes you a misogynist.

Ah, more classic dishonesty from you. The Bill had passed but had to be ammeded when even one of their best supporters on the floor couldn't swallow it due to his daughter's experience. And now, people like you consider him unworthy of his seat because he dared to put a woman's life before that of the contents of her uterus and the combined male pride that seems to dominate the Republican party.

You'll excuse me if I don't take you seriously at all. This coming from a man who just asked if he could sexually harrass women on this forum and then openly supporting a system that is denying women ownership and basic human rights over their own body, you really have no grounds to refer to anything as pathetic or anyone's "interpretation" as twisted. What is twisted is that you openly support a system that views women as cattle and property, to the point where a woman is controlled by men like you about when, where and how they can reproduce. To the point where the men and party you support are pushing to allow employers to fire women who use contraception. Really? You don't see that as controlling anyone? Right.. You fool no one on this forum Arthur. No one.

 

Give it a few months and it will go down to 18 weeks, and so on and so forth. You are, however, the first person I have seen declare that a fetus is viable at 22 weeks.

Actually, no she does not. Because in your supposedly non-barbaric country, the Republicans are trying to push a Bill through the Senate (it passed in the lower house), which would give doctors the right to allow women who are miscarrying to die if they do not want to perform an abortion. A state in your country is also trying to pass a Bill which would allow employers to fire women who use contraception because it goes against their personal or religious beliefs.

You call that being in "complete control"? One only has to look at the OP of this thread and see that she does not have complete control. It is getting to the point where the men you support are declaring that not only are women like cattle, but that they should just not be having sex at all. Again, who do you think you are fooling?

And the mother's rights over her body disappears, to the point where she can be charged with murder if she is suicidal and she attempts suicide, which results in the death of her fetus. And this isn't even a hypothetical in your country anymore. This is reality. And you consider this 'complete control'?

Then I would suggest you contact your local representative as your Federal Republican cronies are trying to get a bill through the senate which would allow doctors to allow pregnant women to die if their life is at risk during the pregnancy and the doctor does not want to perform an abortion based on his/her own personal beliefs. So no, the life of the mother does not always trump that of the fetus. Women are going septic during miscarriage because doctors are legally allowed to refuse to perform an abortion to save their life. Some women are being turned away during a miscarriage, because there is still a fetal heartbeat, some with limbs poking out of her vagina, meaning that it is a definite miscarriage. And you have the gall to say that the woman has complete control and that the life of the mother trumps that of the fetus? You fool no one with your dishonesty Arthur.

And this is why people consider you to be dishonest. Because even with ample proof to the contrary, you will still declare that you are right because you say so. You are either dishonest or delusional.

No. You advised of a problem and then out of left field decided to ask if it meant you would be allowed to sexually harrass women on this site, including moderators. When I openly advised you that it was sexual harrassment and that such behaviour is against the rules, you appeared to ignore it and kept on trying to do god knows what with the subject and refused to provide any links to the incident or report it. The question had been answered and we offered to rectify it and you refused.

I guess when you told Gustav that what you did with his girlfriend when you are alone is just you being immature and not crass or behaving in an inappropriate manner?

Don't worry Arthur. The greater majority of us say the same thing about your posts when we read it.

 

Tell that to the women who have already lived through it and are living through it.

 

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