Star Wars vs Star Trek

Discussion in 'SciFi & Fantasy' started by Pollux V, May 9, 2002.

?

Which universe would win?

  1. Star Trek

    227 vote(s)
    35.5%
  2. Star Wars

    268 vote(s)
    41.9%
  3. Spaceballs

    47 vote(s)
    7.3%
  4. Farscape

    12 vote(s)
    1.9%
  5. Dune

    50 vote(s)
    7.8%
  6. Stargate

    36 vote(s)
    5.6%
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  1. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    a dwarf planet? a dwarf planet is about at least 1000 km in radius. the 200 gigatone figure from the ICS are the MAXIMUM firepower for the guns. didn't you got that yet? i did the same on the calculator...400 gigatone is for an ICE BODY! what reason you have to believe it was an ICE BODY?
    the fleet was taking a heavy bombardment from the asteroid field if you haven't watch the movie yet. its shields were already weaken. you don't seam to understand that asteroid carry a large amount of destruction power. the asteroid Aphophis is not that big: some 600 meters wide, yet it carries the force of Earth's nuclear arsenal!http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/99942_Apophis#Possible_impact_effects
     
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  3. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    1-We can't determine hollow volume from a 2 Dimensional picture.
    2- The size of the Oberth class ship is a HIGHLY disputed topic in Trek...HIGHLY Disputed) The makes no sense and is consistently scaled oddly.
    3. The distance to the asteroid is irrelevant. We're comparing heights and the Enterprise is on a direct course for the asteroid therefore in line with it's height in the second image....It's the perfect image to determine size. We couldn't ask for better.
    4. Kim says 50 Isotons can destroy a small planet (hyperbole)
    But a 5 million isoton yield effects an entire solar system so it seems plausible.
    80 istons has a blast radius of 800 km.

    Note: last post was deleted I got my conversions wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2011
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  5. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    Length:150 meters
    Width:82 meters
    Height:44 meters

    isotons-a unit of unknown meaning
    a entire solar system?
     
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  7. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    Oberth Scaling problems.
    http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/oberth-size.htm

    Most importantly there is no asteroid comparison shot for the Pegasus so it's extremely dubious how Wong got his so called calculations from scaling Pegasus.
     
  8. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    carefully observing the footage of course.as much as reed so far,150/82/44 is the best supported; the others are to small or to big. the Pegasus at least is to small compared to the Enterprise for 300 meters. even that site agrees 150 is the most plausible figure.
     
  9. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    recognize the Enterprise over there? figure how he get it yourself! at first i thought he used the Pegasus, however it turns out it was the Enterprise. sorry,by bad. so he uses the Enterprise. now compute it.
    as for kit' statement for MASSIVELY dwarfed, close up images don't work for that kind of claims,especially for a non-spherical object.
     
  10. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    The links don't work for me I can't see them.
     
  11. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
  12. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    ... there isn't even a single piece of evidence to support his numbers on that page George... not one. All that's there is the lines on the viewscreen image, and nothing at all to compare it against...

    and by the way, this is from the SD.net page:

    So right there you have it - he doesn't even give a shit about maturity or the like... he's right, and nothing anyone says will convince him otherwise.

    Further proof that he's a biased windbag.
     
  13. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    right...dude, this whole debate is immature, if you haven't realize that yet. it really has zero to do with maturity, and you yourself being here proves that your what you said!lol.
    as for evidence, it is there. just look for it before discarding it as useless!
    please, don't bring "maturity" up again.
     
  14. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    No, there is no evidence there... there is this one, and only one, picture:

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    No indication of where, or how, he got his measurements.
     
  15. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    yet for unknown reasons, you didn't mention THE OTHER IMAGE!
    it either isn't working on your computer or your intentionally excluding it.
     
  16. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    That looks real dubious he doesn't even measure the whole asteroid to the bottom.
     
  17. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    other... image?

    Sorry, but there's only one image on that page as far as I can see - can you download, rehost, and post the other one?

    *chuckles sadly* The man can't even host a damned image on his website correctly and we're supposed to believe he's a physicist... right...
     
  18. TW Scott Minister of Technology Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,149
    Seeing this picture I do agree that 5km is a WAY too consevative. I would put a call on 25 km total making the Eneterprise the good size it was. Of course still a single 1 gigaton explosive inside the asteroid, properly placed, should easily split even that massive asteroid.

    Of course, this is assuming Photon Torpedoes work like actual explosives. Given theeir usage in the past they may very well be a way to greate a phaser grenade. Basically the projectile travels at near light to the target then emits a 360 degree phaser burst. It would explain nearly every inconsistancy about them.
     
  19. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    That... is an interesting theory scott. Problem is, wouldn't that be useless against high-warp targets that are headed away from the point of origin of the explosion, since we know phasers are just below c? Otherwise, simply running from the explosion would keep you out of harms way so long as you moved faster than the phaser bursts emanating from the weapon.
     
  20. TW Scott Minister of Technology Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,149
    Well, remember that untill Voyager it was pretty much unheard of to fire forwards while travelling at warp unless you were firing at stationary target or were firing disrupters. Ather times the Photon Torpedoes were fired at ship approaching at warp. There is also the point that when the torpedoes reach the vessel in question they would effectively be inside the warp bubble of the target...



    I mean it is just a thought and would completely explain some of the bizarrness of Photon and Quantum torpedos
     
  21. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    curiously i see it but you don't. i've visited the page a dozen times, its there. how about you check your computer...wait, your a computer specialist,aren't you? how could your computer can't see it, but mine can't (when you actually helped me fix mine)? the only conclusion that can be pulled out is that you lie about not seeing it!
    I SEE IT! SO WHY CAN'T YOU?
     
  22. George1 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    929
    the asteroid has a non-uniform shape. the "bottom" you mention (at least i think it what your talking about) is at the end of the potato shape rock.
    http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/7650/pegasus1.jpg
    you can't measure a miss-shaped body as if it would be a spherical.

    and another interesting thing:
    the second image really did disappear, interestingly right after you guys started debating against the 5km figure...
    i posted both images right here! someone has either vandalized the site, or the image is corrupt. now isn't it interesting that it vanished right before kit posted:
    cuz as i recall it was there just minutes before this post.
     
  23. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    *facepalm*

    There's a dozen reasons I might not be able to see it, starting with the fact that SD.net doesn't allow image redirects, and thus if anyone has, in the past, used a link to that image (with the tag), I would be unable to see it even AFTER going to the website because my cache would store the "not hotlinking allowed" thing, which for SD.net is a blank page (where previously it was a link elsewhere).

    Among the other dozen or so possibilities, including that some bit of code for his site might look "off" to my firefox security settings, and thus cause it to be blocked (already happened before with other bits of his site during the period where he would redirect links from st vs sw.net to pornographic sites).

    Thus, if there is a second image, as you claim, kindly save it to your computer, host it on imageshack, and post it here. It should take you all of twenty seconds at most.

    EDIT: actually, now I know why I can't see it...

    [img]http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/9923/imageifg.png

    That's what I get when I try to force refresh the images on that page - for whatever reason, the second image is attempting to redirect back to my computer instead of accessing his websites storage for wherever the image is :shrug:

    And yes, I am a computer specialist - however, web design and programming are not exactly my best areas yet.
     
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