What is the worst act of the Iranian government towards another nation?

Discussion in 'History' started by S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010.

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  1. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    I'm trying to accumulate verifiable evidence of Iran as a threat to world peace.

    Assuming that there is a reason that Iran is the bogeyman of the day, what would you say is the worst act of the Iranian government towards any foreign nation so far?

    Which country in the world would you hold up as an example for what Iran should be like to be considered "safe"?
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #1

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  3. Asguard

    Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    Blowing up a commercial plane
     
    Asguard, Nov 30, 2010
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  5. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Which plane was that? Where? Why did the Iranian government blow it up?
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
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  7. Read-Only

    Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    That sort of rings a bell, Asguard, but I'm not certain...

    You aren't thinking of Libya, are you?
     
    Read-Only, Nov 30, 2010
    #4
  8. Gremmie

    Gremmie "Happiness is a warm gun" Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, was Libya..

    Pan Am flight 103..killed 270..
     
    Gremmie, Nov 30, 2010
    #5
  9. Read-Only

    Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, I certainly remember Lockerbie *very* well. That's why I was asking Asguard if that was really what he was thinking about - Libya instead of Iran.
     
    Read-Only, Nov 30, 2010
    #6
  10. Gremmie

    Gremmie "Happiness is a warm gun" Valued Senior Member

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    I have to assume, he got the two confused...I don't recall Iran ever being charged with the destuction of a commercial airliner.
     
    Gremmie, Nov 30, 2010
    #7
  11. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    I looked it up in wiki, apparently Iran was the one with the most "motive" seeing as it happened just after the US shot down an Iranian commercial plane. It was only later that Libya took responsibility for the act.
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #8
  12. Gremmie

    Gremmie "Happiness is a warm gun" Valued Senior Member

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    Iran may have had the most motive. But, it was a Libyan national that was convicted of the crime...And, Libya took responsibility.
     
    Gremmie, Nov 30, 2010
    #9
  13. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, although there were allegations that Libya was framed. But I could not locate any evidence that the Iranian government was involved.

    So scratch the bombed commercial airliner?

    What next? What crime can be laid at the door of the uber evil Iranian mullah regime?
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #10
  14. James R

    James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    The Iran-Iraq war would be a good start.

    Australia! Yay!

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    James R, Nov 30, 2010
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  15. Gremmie

    Gremmie "Happiness is a warm gun" Valued Senior Member

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    maybe just a tad bias, James?..

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    Gremmie, Nov 30, 2010
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  16. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    You mean where Iran defended itself against an Iraqi invasion and even after Iranians were attacked with chemical weapons agreed to a ceasefire if the Iraqis would withdraw? Why would that scare the west?



    So Iran should send its soldiers to liberate countries that don't follow its social and religious systems? Do you really approve of such behaviour? Would you want Iranian soldiers shooting children in Australia while imposing sharia on the Australian people? All for their own good, of course.
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #13
  17. James R

    James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    I don't remember saying that would scare the West, SAM. And yes, that sounds like the one. How many years did it go on again? And how many civilians died? Roughly. Remind me.

    Which particular countries are you thinking of that need liberation? Liberation from what?

    Give me a specific example and I'll tell you whether I approve. It's hard to talk in non-specific generalities.

    I don't want any soldiers shooting children anywhere, SAM. Do you?

    Can you think of any instance where shooting a child would be for its own good, SAM? Or are you just being inflammatory?

    Would I want Iranian soldiers to invade Australia and impose Sharia law? No, I wouldn't want that, SAM. Especially if they felt the need to shoot Australian kids to do it.

    Do you think it would be acceptable?
     
    James R, Nov 30, 2010
    #14
  18. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    No idea, but as far as I know, Iran was attacked and was willing to end the war at any time.

    Well you're the one who wants Iran to be like Australia, James. You tell me, why would you happier with an Iran which did this:

    rather than an Iran which only spends its defense budget on defensive equipment?

    What is YOUR justification for thinking Australia is a "safer" bet than Iran where peace is concerned? How many innocent civilians have Australians killed in the last 20 years they have occupied Iraq and Afghanistan [I'm assuming they supported the US in Desert Storm as well]?

    Would you really feel safer with an Iran which was occupying foreign nations and killing civilians?
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #15
  19. James R

    James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    SAM:

    I read that Iran took an offensive stance for the last 6 years of the 8 year war.

    I notice you didn't answer my questions. As usual, when things get too hard for you, you divert and prevaricate instead of being honest and up-front about your beliefs.

    I notice that you have prejudged the Australian incident that you cite. Have you looked into the outcome of the investigations that occurred regarding that incident? I don't think you have. Get back to me when you've followed it up.

    Such as...? I'm guessing you have your defensive guns, defensive bombs, defensive tanks, defensive fighter planes, etc.

    Australia has no enmities towards any other nation such as would lead it to want to invade or destroy any other nation or its people. Australia values the rule of law and has always been a leader in terms of its support for international organisations and cooperation. Australia has a free and open democratic society with separation of church and state. Australia is a multicultural, modern nation which promotes tolerance, understanding and cooperation among nations. Australia has no ambitions to be a nuclear power. It has no ambitions to expand its territory.

    As far as I am aware, very few. The size of the Australian military force in Iraq was small. In Afganistan, Australia has mostly been involved in nation building in cooperation with the Afgani government and its people. Australia has never occupied Iraq or Afganistan, both of which today have their own governments.

    Didn't I cover that point before? I don't approve of killing civilians under any circumstances. I will ask you again: do you?
     
    James R, Nov 30, 2010
    #16
  20. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    James, I'm trying to ascertain exactly what it is about the Iranian foreign policy position or history which makes it such a bogeyman.

    You state that it is the Iran-Iraq war in which "Iran took an offensive stance for the last 6 years of the 8 year war."

    This is the same country that Australian troops attacked pre-emptively TWICE, ie not after two years of war and have occupied for the duration of the better part of 20 years from the Gulf war through Operation Liberate Iraqis

    Further, you state that you prefer the Australian position as safer, the Australian position since post Vietnam being one of active military intervention with boots on the ground from the Gulf war to Afghanistan

    To wit, in your opinion, Irans "offensive position" two years after it was attacked and the fact that it does not engage in active military interventions makes it an object to inspire fear in western hearts

    Forgive me for being nonplussed at this state of affairs
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2010
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #17
  21. James R

    James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    It probably has something to do with its "Death to Israel" stance, like I said earlier.

    Yep. Read the rest of the wikipedia article you extracted your quote from.

    Australia has never occupied Iraq. Australia went into Iraq in support of its allies, the United States and Britain (and others), with a small force of special operations soldiers. Mostly, Australia has been fighting Al Qaeda, a terrorist organisation responsible for the 9/11 attacks on the United States, both in Iraq and in Afganistan.

    Most of Australia's military involvement post-Vietnam has been in international peacekeeping operations under the auspices of the United Nations. As I said earlier, currently Australia is involved in assisting the Afgani government in nation-building. We have soldiers there at the request of the government of Afganistan. There is no occupation.

    I didn't say that. Maybe you need to read back over what I did say.

    Get back to me once you've done that, if you like. Right now you seem confused.
     
    James R, Nov 30, 2010
    #18
  22. GeoffP

    GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    GeoffP, Nov 30, 2010
    #19
  23. S.A.M.

    S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Okay so we'll take it as a given that you prefer Australian foreign policy decisions to Iranian foreign policy decisions and you would feel safer if Iran were to emulate the Australian position. Would that be an accurate summation of your stance?
     
    S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010
    #20
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