So? Xeelee could ERASE it from SPACE-TIME. I doubt you know any universe without god-like races that can beat the Xeelee.
No, they're just space-time defects nearly invulnerable to everything but gravitational singularities and magnetic monopoles. Not mystic.
Here are some possibilities: Dune- 1. Any active No-ship or foldspace ship in transit during the wipe in space-time would be outside space-time. So, some survive. Norma Cenva returns from another universe and transports the remnants to a secure universe to prepare a counter attack. (what counter attack, I haven't a clue) Result: an uphill battle with little chance of success... and that little chance is Norma Cenva. Origin Universe destroyed. 2. Leto II assured the survival of humanity with the scattering. Seeing that no-ships can jump universes, it would be fair to say that humanity from the Dune universe has populated countless universes and is beyond the scope of the Xeelee to destroy them. Result: origin universe destroyed but the golden path remains; Xeelee seek to accomplish an impossible task. UFP- 1. Future Feds protected by their temporal shielding. Seeing that they lack any true ability to cross universes, they remain stuck. Result: Future Feds cry as their universe is wiped from existence while they are stuck in limbo until they can bridge the universal gap. 2. The Q may or may not have mercy on the Feds, depending on whether the continuum wants to risk challenging the Xeelee. Result: an indeterminate outcome. 3. The Xeelee decide to travel in time to just after the big bang and destroy the ST universe that way. When they get there, they are confronted by............... Guinan?!?!?! Result: Xeelee inadvertently spare the ST universe because they spend the lifetime of that universe talking to Guinan. Borg- We are the Xeelee, resistance is pathetically futile. Result: The borg, collectively, are wiped away. Romulans- Romulus and Remus meet Fenrir. Result: Fall of Rome. Cardassians- ... Result: ... (nothing witty to say.... who likes the cardassians anyway?) Galactic Empire- 1. There is a distur... no, a big fucking hole in the Force! Result: George Lucas decides to make episodes iv-vi again because the Xeelee have wiped the original trilogy from his mind. 2. Xeelee destroy universe. Force draws everything into it as a last resort. Force is outside space-time. Result: An immaterial universe full of ghostly force apparitions. Xeelee consider that good enough. Imperium- (I'm guessing from 40k) 1. Chaos mythology is completely true. Xeelee attack with whatever method. The Gods tell them to GTFO of their universe. Result: Xeelee GTFO of there. 2. Chaos mythology isn't completely true. Xeelee attack with whatever method that is not the timetravel-bigbang method. Emperor forges an alliance with Chaos to combat the threat by using the Warp. Result: don't know enough specifics to posit an answer. 3. Chaos mythology isn't completely true. Big-Bang method used. Result: most likely wiped. Don't know if Emperor can influence temporal changes beyond freezing time for a short period. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Question about this whole thing: So, have the Xeelee given an eviction notice or something, and is it really an alliance with the ability to prepare before the Xeelee act?
Incorrect. The Xeelee would have foreknowledge of the No-Ships, centuries actually, so they would TIME TRAVEL before they can leave the universe, and kill Leto II, then the rest of Dune. Flawless victory. The Xeelee learn everything about their enemies when they first encounter them. The alliance is united together, but Xeelee will still laugh off everything. Gee, I should have put Culture in to even it out. But they don't have time travel, so I should have put Doctor Who into the alliance, but they don't have the ship capacity, so I should have included the Irken Empire. Guess that would have split the 0.00% chance into a 30% chance.
Problems with the whole time travel bit. 1. It assumes that time is linear in every universe, but this might not be the case. Universes can have three representations of time. First, that time is non-linear (past, present, and future happen simultaneously); there is no such thing as cause and effect in this representation of time, there is only an infinite continuum of now. Time becomes a meaningless concept; it becomes non-temporal. Second, is a fusion of non-linear and linear time; linear time branches out from an infinite well of possiblities in non-linear time, and these branches are interlinked by possible causes and effects. From this, all possible timelines play out along the linear branches. Third, is linear time that either has a definite beginning, a definite ending, both, or repeats itself in an infinite loop. A purely linear conception of time can easily lead to paradox in the event of time travel. This version of time is deterministic in nature. I'm guessing that you assume every universe has a linear time with a definite beginning (the big bang). The end would be indeterminate with the introduction of external causes to the timeline. An external cause enters the timeline at point A and stops the prerequisites for point D. That would be the primary method of the Xeelee. I contend that Dune is based off of a synthesis of linear and non-linear time. While the non-temporal continuum of potentialities is infinite, the current transition of events that compose the progression of a linear timeline sets a limit to the possible events that can immediately follow. Prescience is the ability to access the non-temporal continuum and foresee these possible futures available to the current temporal construct. With prescience Leto II looks into the available eventualities from the well of the non-temporal continuum of possibility and then forges a linear path to ensure human survival, the Golden Path. So, when the Xeelee enter time-point A, in what they think is a simple linear timeline in the Dune universe, they set in motion a progression of events that creates a new range of potential futures. Their actions create a new linear timeline out of the non-temporal continuum of possible events. Time-point A was only a parameter from which they created an independent and alternate universe while the original universe continues along its linear timeline. 2. Temporal changes in one universe might not resonate in another universe. Say you change something in universe A's timeline; it doesn't necessarily follow that universe B, which incorporated a piece of universe A, will be changed as well. So, even though universe A's timeline is completely from a point prior to the interaction with universe B, the change to universe A is happening after the interaction between them from universe B's perspective. This could be a pseudo-theoretical explanation behind temporal shielding.
Minus all that, remember, Dune has to fight them. You also ignored that the very SECOND they encounter the Dune universe, they will know everything about it, and they'll send a ship to destroy them in the past.
They may be able to observe the linear timeline, but they cannot alter it. If you actually read the last post you would understand that any alteration only creates a separate linear progression of time. Hence, any incursions upon what has already happened would fall into an alternate universe while still preserving the original. The time travel tactic will work on the ST universe, because they have shown that it will alter the timeline afterwards. However, it won't work on universes that have a different conception of time. Granted, the overwhelming tech advancement of the Xeelee would make fighting them extremely difficult. However, the golden path remains intact; since it is the single goal of Leto II's Empire, that means the Xeelee will never stomp the Dune Imperium because of its success in scattering humanity throughout the multiverse. Essentially, there is no need for the Dune universe to fight the Xeelee and win; all they have to do is survive to win.
Ignoring the Xeelee's existence? They time traveled back untold times to create themselves, the Ring, and many other things. A low baryonic empire barely containing a million worlds is not going to stand a chance, AT ALL.
I never said ignore. I just said one option for the Xeelee wouldn't work. I don't think it would work on 40k either if the Warp really is non-temporal like you present on the Dune vs 40k thread.
The Xeelee can utterly destroy Dune before they can escape, that's the truth. They can destroy their galaxy by sending in their Nightfighters, or better yet, destroy it with an unseen ship.
Federation + Asgard learn to shoot magnetic monopoles in place of phasers and unravel the secrets of Xeelee Construction Material thanks to actually having scientific capabilities. Xeelee find their ships spontaneously disintegrating while their weapons are being shrugged off. [/thread]
Prove this bullshit. Xeelee could beat all of the 31st century ST universe and SG universe without a sweat.
