Clever Car -- the future of automobiles

Discussion in 'Business & Economics' started by Harmonic_Subset, May 5, 2006.

  1. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    I feel like the Indian car looks kind of ugly. That Mexican VW was brilliant I'd buy one right now for 10K if I could
     
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  3. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    If speaking of the red nosed one with photo in post 152, I agree, but not if speaking of Tata's Nano. I don't know the name but "Rudoff" would seem appropriate if all are to have that red nose. I bet it is very cheap (< $2000) - cheaper than the Nano's ~$2,500 certainly.

    Probably less than a "bicycle nut" friend I had in USA had paid for his custom-made titanium bike. He both raced it and rode long hauls for exercise - all day trips. One day, I told him I had read about a "minor mod" that would make it even better for exercise. The next day after work in the parking lot, I gave him two bricks joined by short piece of rope to drap over the handle bars. He did not think that funny. My brick pair would have about doubled the weight of his bike.
     
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  5. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    The next better thing? (Take that Segway):

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    That is the Honda CEO on it.

    BTW a few days ago while stuck in Sao Paulo traffic a Segway with man in a business suit scuttted past our stopped car. – First time I had ever seen one outside – only in airports etc. before. The top loop interests me. Perhaps it is like one of the semi-circular cannels in the ear? Probably not - just to make space for the twin seat pads to fold down into. Note also, in first photo that the foot rests in higher unit are folded up into the lower black disk. I.e. Whole unit can lay flat in trunk of car or stand in back of closet as only about < 10 inches thick!

    Photos from today's Chinese Poeples Daily, but not much data as to price range speed etc. Perhap someone will search and post?
     
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  7. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    Electric car status:

    BMW is producing 500 all-electric MINI Es using Li-ion batteries in 2009.
    All of the following are NOW using lithium-ion batteries (BUT not as many as BMW, I think):
    The Tesla Roadster... Chrysler EcoVoyager... Dodge ZEO... Jeep Renegade... Saturn's Flextreme.

    Toyota plans to launch plug-in hybrid Priuses with Li-ion batteries later this year.
    Mercedes-Benz plans to launch its S400 Blue HYBRID with Li-ion battery next year.
    Nissan is set to put 65,000 lithium-ion batteries in car in 2010.
    BMW plans to launch its remodeled lithium-ion battery-powered 750i luxury sedan in Japan in 2010.
    Ford's Escape plug-in hybrid is coming out in 2012.
    (GM's Volt was not listed by my source, but I think they hope to have some by 2012 too.)
     
  8. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    "... The {newly} affiliated Beijing New Energy Automotive Company is responsible for the R&D, manufacture and sales of key auto parts, electric cars, hybrid cars and charging systems, according to BAIC.

    The company is expected to have an annual output of 20,000 to 40,000 new energy cars in 2011 with its own brand "Beijing."

    BAIC displayed a "Beijing" electric car numbered "BE701"at the launching ceremony. The maximum speed of the car is 160 km per hour and it can run 200 km once charged up to its full, which takes one to 10 hours depending on the charging mode.

    The "Beijing" electric car costs 12 kilowatt-hour electricity every 100 km. It can save more than 5,000 yuan (732 U.S. dollars) fuel costs every 15,000 km compared with the gasoline-driven cars. ..."

    From: http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90001/90778/90860/6813260.html

    No photo at this site.
     
  9. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member

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    Is it just me...or does that look like it's an incredibly awkward way to be positioned? With no back rest or hand holds of any kind, there's no way for the rider to hold their upper body stable, while in motion. Seem to me, it would be really clumsy to ride. I wonder if you steer with your feet or with your ass?
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2009
  10. kmguru Staff Member

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    Nissan LEAF all electric coming in 2010

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  11. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    Chinese BYD S8 car is displayed at the Guangzhou Autoshow November 23, 2009
     
  12. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    Well for a family of 4 you would have to multiply the foot print X 4 but only if the kids were big/old enough to drive. This is a motorcycle with a roof a single person vehicle it is in no way comparable to any of the cars listed in the OP. I have a bicycle that it only carbon foot print is me granted it can be a bit larger after the consumption of beans but none the less it is lower than this car. Is it a viable mode of transport for the family NO single seater a bit hard to fit 4 people on a bicycle. When they produce a car that can comfortable seat a family of 4 there belongings and pull a trailer that gets 111mpg that is when I will say WOW now there is a vehicle that is worth having and by trailer I do not mean a 2 foot x 2 foot 3 foot tall tailer I mean a trailer that can haul my 2 cars around from show to show.
     
  13. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    I am not sure this model (the car) meets all your requests (but it comes closer than anything you can buy in the US at even twice the price):

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    cost =$22,000

    The "e6" also was shown at the 23 Nov09 auto fare (for first time, I think). I think it is the the more advanced (larger/ more powerful etc.) electric hybrid model of the one showing on the right for which there are detailed specs (from mid 2008):

    “…BYD's F3DM model operates in either full electric or gas-electric modes, and contains an electric battery that can be charged at a regular plug or at a recharging station. It can travel up to 100 kilometers (62 miles) solely on battery power, and contains a back-up gas engine, BYD said on Monday. Drivers alternate between the two power modes by flipping a switch: the electric mode is optimal for city driving, as gas engines are more wasteful under constant acceleration and deceleration, and the gas-electric mode is more appropriate for travel on highways and outside of cities. The battery takes up to seven hours to {100%} charge with a regular plug, and up to 15 minutes to be 80.0% charged at a special recharging station. …”
    {I.e. the Li-ion battery can rapid charge, but your house wiring cannot deliver power at that rate.}

    Specs from: http://www.forbes.com/2008/12/15/byd-hybrid-car-markets-equity-cx_twdd_1215markets04.html

    BTW, either should get infinite gas milage for first 100Km of travel (More than your requested 111mpg for about 100miles of travel.)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2009
  14. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    So these cars can pull a trailer loaded up to 10000 pounds Damn that is good.
     
  15. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    I did not say they could, but I am nearly sure even the older one could pull that load up a modest grade for a couple of minutes.

    DC electric motors produce their max torque at zero speed - very different from and IC motor which can not produce any torque at 0 RPM. What would limit you is the internal heat producion. At least 5% of the electric power would be transformed into heat. I.e. you could go up hill longer in winter before needing to stop and let motor cool off.

    Starting from a "standing stop," on the hill, I would guess that the bigger "e6" can pull 10,000 lbs load up such a steep hill than even a 300HP IC motor can not move up the hill at all! (that hill might be a 30 to 40 degree up slope).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2009
  16. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    Well I would have to say that for it to be viable as I mentioned to suit the needs of a real automobile user not just some tree hugging greened out hippy freak. That the development of this type of vehicle has a ways to come before you can say Wow that is a really good Idea. As for a particle purpose for driving from one point to the other at city speed the electric car has an advantage.
     
  17. kmguru Staff Member

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    Lithium shortages could put a damper on electric car production unless new battery technologies are introduced.

    "Tahil estimates as much of 15% of the world's known reserves of lithium carbonate and lithium chloride would be required to equip each of the world's 800 million cars and trucks with a relatively small, 8 kWh battery pack. GM's Volt concept car is powered by a 16 kWh lithium battery pack. In his view, this is unsustainable.

    Instead, Tahil is proposing that two other well-understood battery chemistries be more actively investigated and developed: sodium nickel chloride and zinc-air, both of which offer comparable or greater energy density than lithium without the attendant safety or resource depletion issues. After iron, aluminum and copper, zinc is the most commonly used metal by modern society. A 2005 USGS estimate placed American zinc reserves a 30,000,000 metric tons and world reserves, excluding the US, at 220 million metric tons. Tahil estimates total world lithium metal reserves at just 6,200,000 metric tons."

    http://www.azom.com/news.asp?newsID=7648
     
  18. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    What they need to do is look at reclaiming the resources once used and recycling them back in that way the resource will not become depleted as fast and hopefully they could find a way to just reuse the materials once depleted in the Battery.
     
  19. kmguru Staff Member

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    Good idea. Which means someone should set up a recycling center and pay money to collect them everywhere.
     
  20. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Is this thing really more efficient than a push bike???

    or one of those small Italian mini-motorcycles? I mean, come on - it must take a lot of energy to make and maintain this thing!

    I say buy a bike (I have a great bike [no bricks on the front

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    ] and I use it daily to go almost everywhere.
     
  21. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    You would not have to pay money for them, people would have to pay you to take them as hazardous waste.
     
  22. kmguru Staff Member

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    Lithium batteries are very expensive. So paying money to collect is a better idea than just saying that one should return it. Lead Car batteries though have core charges that provides the incentive. Nissan will lease the batteries so that they can recycle. But soon flash lights, small tools will have them, they need need incentive based recycle process.
     
  23. Grim_Reaper I Am Death Destroyer of Worlds Registered Senior Member

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    Yes the incentive would be why pay 10000 dollars for your Batteries on lease when you can return them to me and I will replace them with a one time fee of 2000 dollars there is your incentive and no money out of my pocket.
     

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