beer woman spared a good old fasioned caning

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by Michael, Aug 24, 2009.

  1. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    Malaysia beer woman spared caning
    Isn't this quaint? It's like a scene out of 1700s America.
    Except she'd also probably be charged as a witch and flogged a couple times for measure

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    Do you think it's good justice? I mean, having two systems of law? One for he theist and one for non-theist? Does this woman need to renounce her faith in order to have a drink of beer? (oh, sorry that may be punishable as well).

    All civilizations ... hell, since the time of Egypt drank beer. I wonder why Malaysia has criminalized it?
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    Check this chick out ... I wonder if she is single?!?!?

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    Drunk driving, most probably - its a major issue with beer drinking.

    For some reason people don't take beer seriously as an intoxicant.
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    This chick looks like she needs a good caning!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  8. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    Really? Huh ... so only Muslims are irresponsible enough to drink and drive?!?!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  9. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    probably keeps the Hobbits out to!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    Malaysia has serious alcohol problems and there are RTAs in Saudi Arabia due to beer drinking, IIRC [although insignificant overall due to banning of alcohol and hence reduced access].

    So, that would be a no.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2009
  11. Meursalt Comatose Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    395
    Don't be ridiculous.

    I've lived there. It has nothing to do with drink driving, and everything to do with their religion.
    Which is why the Chinese and Indians drink as much as everyone else and the Malays barely touch it. Malaysia does not have "serious alcohol problems". It is, in general, one of the driest countries I've ever lived in.

    The Malays are Muslim, and the Chinese aren't.
    And that is all there is to it.
     
  12. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    Or the Malays think they have an alcohol problem and the Chinese don't.

    I think the statistics would be much higher for drunk driving in other countries, but they don't see it as a problem.

    The Malays didn't just adopt Islam btw.
     
  13. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    30,994
    It's an Islamic law, directed at Muslims, with Islamic penalties. It has nothing to do with driving. Islamic countries that ban women from driving also ban them from drinking beer.

    They see it as a driving problem.
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    The original debate before PAS co-opted it [and ironically it is the Muslims who will face a problem now, if the current "self regulation" in Selangor takes off] was the ease of access of alcohol to children under 18 and the rising problem of alcohol dependency in the poorer classes especially work related, which usually results in vicious cycles of unemployment and alcoholism.

    But politicians being what they are, it was grabbed by hardliners and became a sectarian issue where none existed before. Nevertheless they rejected the beer ban, so its good. Now to see how long the self regulation lasts.
     
  15. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    30,994
    I've got a hundred bucks says the people in Malaysia were brewing and drinking some kind of alcohol more than a hundred years ago.

    If they've got a new problem, it's a new problem - no sense blaming the beer.
     
  16. Meursalt Comatose Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    395
    SAM knows damn well it's a religious law (if not, it would be applicable to non-Malays as well), she's just trying to obfuscate the issue.
    The Malays have Sharia courts which will deal with Malay cases quite separately from those of other ethnicities.
    She's become quite silly these days.

    The Chinese have too much a vested interest in the finances of the country for the Malays to try any anti-alcohol laws anyway, and they know it. There is no way Malaysia can become a purely Muslim state while the Chinese are there. The was quite a kafuffle with some old Chinese temples a while back which ended up causing quite a disturbance until the Malay government backed off. The message was quite clear.
    A place like Dubai can slap a total ban on something like alcohol and get away with it because business there is mostly multinational investment rather than grassroots. The Chinese in Malaysia (and Indonesia, incidentally) are rooted like 400 hundred year old oak.

    It's a shame, really. The ethnic Malays are fantastic people, in general. It's a pity someone had to go force some stupid antiquated laws down their throats a few hundred years back. Seriously... how many countries in the world hold that an ethnic native is a member of a particular religion by constitution?
     
  17. Enmos Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    43,184
    Seriously ? That's moronic..
     
  18. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    Like ethnic Europeans are members of the Lutheran church?

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    As for the Malays, it was the government that voted against a ban on the beer, not the Chinese. Allowing people the choice of their own religious systems and laws is something widespread and Asia. It avoids the aftereffects seen with ethnic cleansing and then allegations of people being held accountable for what their ancestors did or did not do.

    I'm sure aboriginals have their own courts in Australia for matters pertaining to them as a nation, just as Jews have their halacha courts in England and sharia courts for their Muslim citizens in Israel. But yes, Jews or Muslims following their own laws historically leads to wet pants in some nations.
     
  19. Enmos Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    43,184

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  20. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,825
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_religion

    Its probably based on the Roman system.

    In some European countries becoming a citizen automatically makes you a member of the state church.

    In fact, I'm pretty sure that separation of church and state was seen for the first time in Islamic cultures, although as you can see, they seem to have little memory of that now.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2009
  21. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    So, in theory, this woman could renounce her religion and go get hammered legally and then get behind the wheel illegally and drive?

    That aside, I don't get the whole "they" are poor and so it's to protect them. I mean, presumably there are a lot of poor non-Muslims there as well? If all the poor are Muslim, then there's a problem going on.

    RE: 400 year old oak
    It's interesting to think that Chinese merchants are such big players in the economies of Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia - I wonder why? Is it just connections? Chinese looking out for Chinese?
     
  22. Meursalt Comatose Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    395
    Is that a law in Europe, SAM? Is it written into the constitutions of all these European nations?
    They've made it a law that all Europeans of a certain ethnicity are automatically Lutheran, and have to undergo all kinds of hell trying to convince their families they're not?
    Malaysia has many of it's own ethnic citizens fighting for the right to be recognised as a member of another religion, or an atheist. Now you tell me once more, because I want to hear you say it, that a European deciding he's a muslim, or any other religion, is subject to the same degree of estrangement. That the laws which apply to his own family no longer apply to him, and that he is no longer recognised as a member of his own ethnic community.
    You show me that.

    ...Duh, SAM.
    Malaysian law is very closely tied with their religion, and Malays have, and will retain, all the power in government for the foreseeable future.

    ... eh?

    Wrong. They are subject to Australian Law.
    Certain leeway is allowed in some minor instances for tribal punishment, but I think that's about as ridiculous as this woman... or anyone else... being caned for having a beer.
    Want me to laugh at someone being speared for hitting someone else's wife?
    I will. Bloody stupid barbarians. tee hee. There. You happy?

    Next time, Don't assume that you can point at something wrong with Australia and think I'll defend it. You, on the other hand, can not be perceived to be able to debate anything with anything resembling a balanced view, nor can you be trusted to have an argument without trying to redirect attention elsewhere to cover your own gaping wounds.

    Not wet pants, SAM.
    Ridicule.
     
  23. Meursalt Comatose Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    395
    She'd suffer for it.

    Partly. They're very insular, very canny, and look after their families. In terms of world economic performance, you have to admire the Chinese for their ability in this area. They've been doing it for thousands of years, in all countries all across the globe. Discover a new continent, and there'd be a Chinese laundry and takeaway there the next week, because someone's grandfather was reading a newspaper in China and saw an opportunity to set up a family member for success.
     

Share This Page