A French parliamentary panel has called for a ban on Muslim women wearing the full Islamic veil in public institutions, describing the dress as an "unacceptable" challenge to French values. In its report, released on Tuesday, the panel also recommended that authorities refuse residence cards and citizenship to anyone with visible signs of a "radical religious practice". "The wearing of the full veil is a challenge to our republic. This is unacceptable. We must condemn this excess," it said. The commission stopped short of a full ban on the veils, which it deemed unconstitutional, but said they should be banned from schools, hospitals and public transport. It has called on parliament to adopt a formal resolution stating the all-encompassing veil is "contrary to the values of the republic". But the opposition Socialists, who condemn the full veil, have said they would not endorse the final report, saying it would amount to an inconsistent "ad hoc law". The veil is widely viewed in France as a gateway to extremism, an insult to gender equality and an offense to France's secular foundation. A 2004 French law bans Muslim headscarves from primary and secondary school classrooms. Andre Gerin, chair of the parliamentary commission and a communist politician said the "wearing of the full veil is the tip of the iceberg". "There are scandalous practices hidden behind this veil," he said. Shaaz Mahboob, the vice-chair of the British Muslims for Secular Democracy, told Al Jazeera: "The niqab has no place in Islam. It is incompatible in Islam. "It's a security issue, it's a communication issue and it's a barrier to integration in a lot of ways. So it disadvantages those who are trying to communicate with them; those who are trying to live alongside them, and those who are trying to share the same public sphere as them." http://english.aljazeera.net/news/europe/2010/01/20101269170257444.html So the commission has finally recommended a veil ban though it doesn't say what the penalty would be for breaking the law, perhaps fines. I suspect that the ban though unpopular with many muslims will eventually give way to normalcy just like the ban of the veil in school. As with all new laws sometimes people just don't know what's good for them.
I forsee private hospitals coming up which caters to the need of veiled Muslims and an increase in the number of women who veil I also forsee an increase in "radical religious practice" in Muslims. This is free recruitment for them
Evidently, they felt they needed to draw a line somewhere. And, after all, it's THEIR country - they have the right to establish any law they wish. :shrug:
Well, remember when we banned Slavery, that radicalized a hell of a lot of Southerns (who weren't fighten ta own slaves but fer 'States Rights'). The Civil War was hell, but, things ended on the right side of history. I don't think France has to worry about a Civil War and I'm sure things will land on the right side of history. Sure, some will be "radicalized"... there always are. I'm looking forward to the day France starts teaching a thing or two about Religion in the School system. Now, THAT will be interesting.
Why would it mean an increase in radical religious practice if 'radical islam' is simply in the paranoid minds of western 'xenophobes' as you call them? Is the muslim community so wealthy that they can forgo the excellent free medical care provided by the French government? Also you yourself have said that there isn't anything in the Koran stating a woman needs the veil as a religious requirement. If this is so why do you expect religious radicalism on the issue? Why do you assume its common for muslims to use radical islam as a threat? Its like saying 'I will twist your arm by threatening to join jihad' I say your prediction is wishful thinking especially if the bulk are moderate muslims as we all know. I think most muslims will obey the law and get on with life just as they had when the veil was banned in schools. Oh yes, try and remember that France isn't the Emirates
Human nature, remember that picture of Lahore vs Dewsbury? France has the highest population of Muslims in Europe, what is it, 14%? And the number of women who veil is maybe 1% of the Muslims? Around 300 of them? Thats going to reverberate in the community those 300 women belong to. They are going to feel disenfranchised and communicate this to their children, their friends, their relatives Jannah in the feet of the mother, is what Muslims believe. How do you think this will be perceived? You're asking their mothers to strip in public, against their will. I've lived among women who veil, it would be like asking you to walk into a mens room, stark naked. They would rather die. It would be too traumatic for them. If they cannot, then the women will simply forego it.
Yeah Yeah Yeah, and this time it's all the fault of the evil French. Always gotta be some one to blame doesn't it? The world over from China to France.
I'm betting almost all the women who veil stay in Paris and are all second generation French Muslims who wear the veil even if their family does not traditionally veil. If 4% Muslims are a problem in France, there is something very strange going on there. This is a reactionary ban, not a ban against traditional Muslims.
What could be going on? The only thing I know of is that it just started snowing, and that it's awfully cold here.
Would you have a problem with people wearing a KKK white Klan hood in Mumbai? Suppose they these Klan members were really very peaceful people. Think maybe that could, oh I don't know, still piss people off in Mumbai? Suppose they were second generation Indian Citizens from English ancestry. They didn't really want to integrate into Mumbai, expected you to make any and all concessions to them (they are Indian Citizens) and, being KKK tended to send home for "traditional" "Good White English" girls that wore modest clothing - mainly Klan hoods. Now picture there they are in their KKK Churches preaching about the evil shit hole India and Mumbai is. One day a few members blew up a train killing a bunch of innocent Indians in the name of Whiteness. Oh, but these weren't "real" KKK members the rest of the KKK said. We're peaceful!! KKK means peace. And suppose 99.9% of these KKK members living in Mumbai really were truly peaceful. They had nothing personally against Indian folks - just didn't want their daughters or sons marrying one the brown sunabitches. Yeah, something is going on in Mumbai everyone would say. :bugeye: Something weird, but no one can quite figure out what? :shrug: The one day Mumbai people banned the Klan hood and complained about the KKK members seemingly not wanting to fit in and be part of society. Well, I suppose I wouldn't be all that surprised to tell you the honest truth. While I'm not Indian, you know, I can see where they are coming from. If I were Indian, I'd probably think somewhat similarly.
I have mixed feelings about this law. I dislike the full body veils, but I am not sure legislation like this is the way to go. I wonder if the French would be willing to put a ban on repeated plastic surgery - some people, mostly women seem to be rather addicted to it and end up as distorted cartoon figures. Is a woman getting 45ddd breasts in line with current French values? Or the woman who has had so many operations on her face that she no longer has much flexibility or ability to express? I suppose these women could also suffer the partial ban and not be allow in schools on or public transport.
Well Australia has banned small breasts and female ejaculation, so anything is possible. As long as its about women
Oh, I'd ban the extreme end of male body builder bodies just to eliminate the feelings of revulsion I have when I see them. Whatever the rule is, it should be very abstract: where an ideology creates an unhealthy presentation of the self. Or some such. Women need vitamin D just as much as men and no one should have a vein in their bicep explode as they try to scratch their nose but find, despite hundreds of pounds of pressure exerted, that they cannot reach it with an extended index finger.
No. 1% of 4% of half of 62,000,000 is about 12,000. That's forty times more than your number. Don't you think arguments that use figures should use correct figures?
I was assuming with the 7 or 8 children they are no doubt having, the number of adult women would be 1% of 1/8th of the Muslims. You're right, its far less than 1% then - Another search, its actually around 300. Bizarre.Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2304749/posts
Malay had a law for years banning nonMuslim Malay from using the word Allah. Did we ever hear anything from Muslims protesting the unfair discrimination? Nope. But, France bans a Klan-like hood and oops out they start popping. Funny that.
