An update to this summer's "burkagate" discussion. The BBC brings us the latest on the situation: France's opposition Socialists have come out against a law banning the burka - even though they remain firmly opposed to the garment. The announcement comes ahead of a parliamentary report on the issue that is due out later this month .... .... While the Socialist Party opposes the wearing of the burka, it was "not favourable" to a legal ban, said party spokesman Benoit Hamon. "We are totally opposed to the burka," he told French radio. "The burka is a prison for women and has no place in the French Republic. But an ad-hoc law would not have the anticipated effect." Jean-Francois Cope, the parliamentary leader of Mr Sarkozy's party, has said he would put forward a bill this month banning the wearing of the veil in public, as a means of defending France against "extremists". (Boldface accent added) What the Socialists, apparently, have not done is propose an alternative means of dealing with what they consider a problem that "has no place in the French Republic". The underlying question seems to be whether the point is to liberate Muslim women—who are widely perceived as exceptionally oppressed—or to make France unappealing to Muslims in general so that fewer will come to the country. That would certainly make an uncomfortable position for those who would assert liberation through enlightenment. The slower process would leave more women in the prison of the burka for a longer period, but avoid the appearance of outright bigotry that comes with using the force of law to suppress a religious custom. ____________________ Notes: British Broadcasting Corporation. "France Socialist party opposes burka ban". BBC News Online. January 6, 2010. News.BBC.co.uk. January 6, 2010. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8443989.stm
Ooh, yeah, those French can't be pissin' off the Muslims. Look at the carnage those Muslims created before with practically burning all of France! Nooo, noooo, don't piss off them thar' Muslims ....unless you have a large supply of body bags. Baron Max
I think burqu‘ with niqāb (the face covering) should be banned in public for security reasons. Without face covering should be OK....
i agree, i can't walk into any place of business with my motorbike helmet on, and it partially solves the problem. how do people in muslim society recognise each other anyway, can everyone tell minute differences between eyes and stature? or do they wait til they hear the person's voice?
Right! For instance can we walk into a store with a full ski mask on with only our eyes showing?:shrug:
I'm curious about the 'slower process': would Muslim women from conservative families ever be liberated from the burkha? Any answer at this point would be speculation, but my suspicion is that it would linger on forever.
Some would cling as long as possible Well, to the one, Christians eventually abandoned their Biblical instruction that women should cover their heads and be silent in church. To the other, Mormons are still scandalized by women wearing pants in church, and a Southern Baptist congregation a friend of mine was involved with in the '90s obliged their women to never wear pants at all, only dresses and skirts. Religion is often one of the things that challenges my boundaries of liberty. I'm of the opinion that deliberately teaching children to follow dysfunctional or demeaning customs ought to be illegal, but even setting the First Amendment aside, I can't imagine enforcing such a standard for the obvious slippery-slope argument.
Anecdote time. I know an awesome Egyptian chick. She's a devout Muslim, and wears the whole shebang, face covered and all, in public. Her sister doesn't wear it at all, ever. Her parents don't care if she wears it or not. But she believes it is appropriate, so she wears it.
if you are in a ski resort then probably yes.if not then it is likely you are going to commit a crime so no.i dont think women in burkhas rob that many off licences and those that do are probably easy to catch as it's difficult to run when wearing 200m of cloth
I don't think its either. I think its a move to integrate and assimilate a group into French society which doesn't particularly want to further the use of the Burkha which does separate them from French society. Its their right. In truth the French are not particularly interested in absorbing MORE muslims and that is also their right.
I'd be wondering if all these Christians can point out where, in the bible, it requires women to wear pants. ~String
I don't know. It's an interesting question. Or not wear pants, as such. Personally, I have no idea. But then, I'm not a Christian. And when I was, I certainly wasn't a Southern Baptist.
Well there you have it. We don't ban a specific item of clothing because we dislike what it represents, we ban all garments that mask one's identity. Balaclavas, hoodies, baseball caps, .... beards, glasses, ... oh wait, where do we stop allowing the fashion to rule our lives?
Who is 'we'? I mean you do know that there are examples of societies controlling dress wear because of what it represents, like wearing a bikini and skimpy clothes in UAE or in other nations a woman going out without their head covered.
None of those cover the face. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! I think both burkas and naqabs should be outlawed for security reasons. Although the hijab is acceptable: Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
East? West? American? European? Which 'we'? I bring this up because it sees as if the 'we' in some European societies disagree with you, I mean Sarkozy obviously disagrees. Then there are cases such as the following in Sweden though the education minister refused to legislate such a ban: "In a recent case a niqab-wearing teaching student was told that she couldn't wear the face-covering head scarf by a school she was going to work in." http://www.sr.se/cgi-bin/internatio....asp?nyheter=1&programid=2054&Artikel=3124666 Remember the 'head scarf martyr'? This Egyptian woman was murdered because she was wearing a burkha: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8136500.stm Very sordid case indeed! The point is whether the veil/burkha issue will bring said communities together or create a social and cultural incohesion. i mean this has been an issue in Europe for a while now: BRUSSELS — In the Limburg city of Maaseik the first fine for wearing an Islamic burka has been issued. Police booked a young woman of Moroccan origin three weeks ago for wearing the all-concealing Islamic veil, newspaper 'De Standaard' reported on Thursday. The woman will now be required to pay a EUR 125 fine, Maaseik Mayor Jan Creemers said on Wednesday. Ironically, the city will probably end up paying the fine because the woman is receiving social security payments from the OCMW benefits office. The woman will not be the only one fined however. Police have already booked four other women for the same crime. http://www.expatica.com/be/news/local_news/city-to-pay-womans-fine-for-burka-ban-breach-23108.html
