View Full Version : This is an outrage!!!
joepistole
06-10-09, 07:37 PM
This aged woman was pulled over by a deputy for a traffic violation. His supervisors say he did the right thing. The right wing news publications, Fox, etc say he did the cop did the right thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn2IpEC2cBU
The elder grandma said she would sign the ticket, but the cop shoved her and then tasered her. Why couldn't the cop calm the woman down down a bit? Why was he so aggressive? This seems to me a failure of the cop to handle the woman appropriately. He escallated the event which climaxed with him tassering the elderly woman. Seems to me a few words and a calm head on the part of the cop would have gone a long way.
This is nothing I am proud off as an American. And it bothers me that some people think this is ok.
This aged woman was pulled over by a deputy for a traffic violation. His supervisors say he did the right thing. The right wing news publications, Fox, etc say he did the cop did the right thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn2IpEC2cBU
The elder grandma said she would sign the ticket, but the cop shoved her and then tasered her. Why couldn't the cop calm the woman down down a bit? Why did was he so aggressive? This seems to me a failure of the cop to handle the woman appropriately. He escallated the event which climaxed with him tassering the elderly woman. Seems to me a few words and a calm head on the part of the cop would have gone a long way.
This is nothing I am proud off as an American. And it bothers me that some people think this is ok.
I agree. What did they do before they had taser guns at their disposal ?
StrangerInAStrangeLa
06-10-09, 08:15 PM
-=-
billy clubs
CutsieMarie89
06-10-09, 09:16 PM
That woman was clearly out of line. It did look like he shoved her too hard, but if the woman had of been 32 it wouldn't even be news. All she had to do was sign the ticket why did she flip out? As I have learned from hanging out on a military base little old ladies don't get special treatment and they shouldn't when they break the law either. She assaulted the officer verbally and more importantly resisted arrest. He warned her and she still wanted to act crazy. She got exactly what she asked for. I don't pity her and agree with the officer.
joepistole
06-10-09, 09:21 PM
What is the purpose of the police officer? Is the police officer not a public safety officer? There was nothing safe about that situation. There is nothing safe about tassering an old lady.
The whole situation could have been defused with a few words on the part of the police officer. Instead, the police officer escallated the situation to the point where he lost control. I am not a police officer, but I could have difused that situation easily. I was a paramedic working in big urban area. So I have seen a lot of this kind of stuff. The police officer should not have lost control of the situation.
He could have avoided violence with a few simple words. He did not need to resort to physical violence and pushing. If the cop cannot deal with upset people, he/she has no business being a cop.
nietzschefan
06-10-09, 09:23 PM
Jesus fucking Christ you guys - he's three times her size, he couldn't even bend her arm back and cuff her and stuff her in the back of his cruiser and cart her off for obstruction?
No wonder cops are getting smaller and smaller(with long nails and fake eyelashes too!?). Someone is gonna get seriously hurt and I don't me the offender. Cops are pussies.
joepistole
06-10-09, 09:26 PM
Jesus fucking Christ you guys - he's three times her size, he couldn't even bend her arm back and cuff her and stuff her in the back of his cruiser and cart her off for obstruction?
No wonder cops are getting smaller and smaller(with long nails and fake eyelashes too!?). Someone is gonna get seriously hurt and I don't me the offender. Cops are pussies.
Having known a more than a few in my time, there is a lot of truth in that statement. And I might also add narcisist to the discription as well...especially junior cops. But some senior cops also share the trait.
PieAreSquared
06-10-09, 09:45 PM
Why didn't he just cuff her and arrest her?
Crunchy Cat
06-10-09, 10:44 PM
The cops actions appeared quite correct.
The cops actions appeared quite correct.
What if she died from a heart attack ?
Would that be the same as if he shot her ?
Same result.
Tasering was unnecessary.
PieAreSquared
06-10-09, 11:13 PM
Certainly not the actions of one who should be wearing the title "professional"
joepistole
06-10-09, 11:21 PM
Agreed, he was being a bully...pretty sad but not uncommon. There are a lot of good cops out there. Cops who view themselves as public servants...but not this guy.
codanblad
06-10-09, 11:50 PM
That woman was clearly out of line. She assaulted the officer verbally and more importantly resisted arrest. I don't pity her and agree with the officer.
agreed. but...
The whole situation could have been defused with a few words on the part of the police officer. Instead, the police officer escallated the situation to the point where he lost control.
Jesus fucking Christ you guys - he's three times her size, he couldn't even bend her arm back and cuff her and stuff her in the back of his cruiser and cart her off for obstruction?
also agreed.
nietzschefan
06-10-09, 11:52 PM
BTW why in the hell you they have the offender sign the ticket? In Canada they just hand it to you - if you lose it it's YOUR problem. What are you signing off on exactly?
PieAreSquared
06-11-09, 12:21 AM
it's a promise to appear... if you really want to get to the officer ...take your sweet time reading the ticket before you sign it.
legally there is nothing they can do.. and if they interrupt you then say... dang you made me lose my place.. I have to start all over
Crunchy Cat
06-11-09, 12:43 AM
What if she died from a heart attack ?
Then she would have died. Generally speaking, if a frail person breaks the law and gets caught then it's not wise to create a situation where law enforcement would use force. Fortunately for her, she wasn't frail so the application of force was quite successful.
Would that be the same as if he shot her ?
Same result.
Not really. Tasers aren't designed or used to kill people.
Tasering was unnecessary.
It was a good option for the cop to make the situtation safe efficiently.
nietzschefan
06-11-09, 12:44 AM
it's a promise to appear... if you really want to get to the officer ...take your sweet time reading the ticket before you sign it.
legally there is nothing they can do.. and if they interrupt you then say... dang you made me lose my place.. I have to start all over
That's....awesome.
I think she got what she deserved! I am so tired of having people use their age, race, or condition to try and get away with breaking the law. She was speeding through a construction zone and she was a danger to those working along the freeway. She deserved the ticket. As far as the officer pushing the lady, how many of you have seen clips of cars tailending a police cruiser or other vehicle on the side of the road. She was putting them both in danger. He gave her more than enough chances. She sounded like she was drinking to me. Wonder if the did a tox test on her. Listen to her, what an old bitch. And those of you who think officers of the law are pussies, call your old buddy or defend yourself next time a crazy person starts shooting your way. Some of you guys are really a piece of work....
pjdude1219
06-11-09, 02:06 AM
cops fault. If he even tried to reason with her to get her off the road it would never happen. But since this was texas what do you know people got belligerent and someoneended up hurt.
PieAreSquared
06-11-09, 03:33 AM
I know every trail in the Lone Star state
'cause I ride the range in a Ford V8
Yippie-yi-yo-ki-yay
now taser da bitch
cause i gotta badge
apologizes to Frank Sinatra ;)
As long as the American people feel safe from er, old ladies, its all fine.
For a fun exercise, pick out the Americans in this thread. :bugeye:
Neddy Bate
06-11-09, 03:55 AM
He called her "Ma'am", which is very respectful and polite. But then he sort of tazed her and stuff...
joepistole
06-11-09, 04:32 AM
He called her "Ma'am", which is very respectful and polite. But then he sort of tazed her and stuff...
Then pushed her and tasered her.
joepistole
06-11-09, 04:40 AM
I think she got what she deserved! I am so tired of having people use their age, race, or condition to try and get away with breaking the law. She was speeding through a construction zone and she was a danger to those working along the freeway. She deserved the ticket. As far as the officer pushing the lady, how many of you have seen clips of cars tailending a police cruiser or other vehicle on the side of the road. She was putting them both in danger. He gave her more than enough chances. She sounded like she was drinking to me. Wonder if the did a tox test on her. Listen to her, what an old bitch. And those of you who think officers of the law are pussies, call your old buddy or defend yourself next time a crazy person starts shooting your way. Some of you guys are really a piece of work....
Tiy are quite judgemental. How do you know she was speeding through a construction zone? That maybe what she was accused off but that does not mean she was guilty. You ever heard of agencies using the power to issue tickets to raise revenues? The other day I saw an interest setup as I was driving along the freeway. There was a cop at the begining of a construction zone, no construction workers anywhere. He was zapping people at the entrance to the construction zone before they entered the zone and by the time he had them pulled over they were in the construction zone. And he was chargeing them for speeding in the construction zone...cool racket. That was in Kansas City, MO. This was a county cop on an interstate. In Ohio the state governement put limitations on local governments from issuing tickets on the interstate...too many local governments were using the opportunity to generate cash to fill local pockets.
This aged woman was pulled over by a deputy for a traffic violation. His supervisors say he did the right thing. The right wing news publications, Fox, etc say he did the cop did the right thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn2IpEC2cBU
The elder grandma said she would sign the ticket, but the cop shoved her and then tasered her. Why couldn't the cop calm the woman down down a bit? Why was he so aggressive? This seems to me a failure of the cop to handle the woman appropriately. He escallated the event which climaxed with him tassering the elderly woman. Seems to me a few words and a calm head on the part of the cop would have gone a long way.
This is nothing I am proud off as an American. And it bothers me that some people think this is ok.
Ok that woman is a bitch, but the cop could have been a lot calmer. He was way too aggressive.
If he would just have let her sign none of this would have happened.
PieAreSquared
06-11-09, 08:35 AM
They were both out of line. But the officer is suppose to be the one who is trained to handle the situation properly. he was chomping at the bit to use his gadget.
Challenger78
06-11-09, 08:57 AM
Eh. Elderly people shouldn't get special attention. Personally, I found the woman more aggressive. However, the officer should not have raised his voice initially. She was warned, and she insisted that he tase her.
People who say that, after being warned, should not complain if they are tased.
This aged woman was pulled over by a deputy for a traffic violation. His supervisors say he did the right thing. The right wing news publications, Fox, etc say he did the cop did the right thing.
The "right wing news publication" was The Today Show, not Fox News.
Tazing her may have been safer than physically engaging her, where there would be risk of broken bones, sprains, etc.
Maybe waterboarding would be even more effective.
Eh. Elderly people shouldn't get special attention. Personally, I found the woman more aggressive. However, the officer should not have raised his voice initially. She was warned, and she insisted that he tase her.
People who say that, after being warned, should not complain if they are tased.
The age doesn't matter to me, the cops behavior would have been uncalled for if it was a 19 year old guy as well.
Maybe waterboarding would be even more effective.
He would still have to subdue the woman before he waterboarded her, which means either a fight or a tazing.
Challenger78
06-11-09, 09:50 AM
The age doesn't matter to me, the cops behavior would have been uncalled for if it was a 19 year old guy as well.
She grumbled, yelled at him, ignored his warnings and then dared him to tase her. She lacks common sense. In terms of idiocy, she's in deeper.
The cop may have been loud and unruly, but he had the weapon. people should use their common sense. The cop did try to cuff her, but she resisted.
Don't argue with the guy threatening to tase you.
joepistole
06-11-09, 09:53 AM
The "right wing news publication" was The Today Show, not Fox News.
Tazing her may have been safer than physically engaging her, where there would be risk of broken bones, sprains, etc.
No I saw it on Fox News. The Bill O'Riley Show commentators said point blank, the cop handled the situation correctly.
And it would have been better if the cop could have resolved the situation peacefully with words and not violence...even easier than taser.
joepistole
06-11-09, 09:57 AM
The age doesn't matter to me, the cops behavior would have been uncalled for if it was a 19 year old guy as well.
Agreed
joepistole
06-11-09, 09:59 AM
She grumbled, yelled at him, ignored his warnings and then dared him to tase her. She lacks common sense. In terms of idiocy, she's in deeper.
The cop may have been loud and unruly, but he had the weapon. people should use their common sense. The cop did try to cuff her, but she resisted.
Don't argue with the guy threatening to tase you.
Agreed the woman was not acting rationally, she was angry and maybe justly so. The woman is not the professional in this instance. The cop is, and the cop should have acted professionally. Maybe some people think ruffing up citizens without cause is professional behavior, but I do not.
Challenger78
06-11-09, 10:35 AM
Agreed the woman was not acting rationally, she was angry and maybe justly so. The woman is not the professional in this instance. The cop is, and the cop should have acted professionally. Maybe some people think ruffing up citizens without cause is professional behavior, but I do not.
I don't get why he yelled at her at the beginning.
Also, do elderly people have a sense of entitlement due to their age ?
CutsieMarie89
06-11-09, 11:24 AM
Tiy are quite judgemental. How do you know she was speeding through a construction zone? That maybe what she was accused off but that does not mean she was guilty.
And whenever you feel like you are treated unfairly by the police do you try to beat them up and verbally assault them? How well has that worked for people? She should have just signed the ticket and fought it in court, but she chose to act crazy and stupid. It was unfortunate for her that the cop she decided to mess with wasn't Mr. I'm a Nice, Empathetic, Patient Guy.
joepistole
06-11-09, 11:30 AM
The cop is a peace officer. He should act like one. It does not matter what I would or would not do in that situation. As a cop he will encounter all kinds of people and he should be able to peacefully handle folks like this lady.
By the way she offered to sign right before the cop pushed her.
CutsieMarie89
06-11-09, 11:43 AM
The cop is a peace officer. He should act like one. It does not matter what I would or would not do in that situation. As a cop he will encounter all kinds of people and he should be able to peacefully handle folks like this lady.
By the way she offered to sign right before the cop pushed her.
And all waiters and waitresses should serve you with a genuine smile and sales associates should always be kind, outgoing, and friendly. But if everyone got fired every time they deviated from this behavior at work there wouldn't be many waiters or sales associates.
Like waiters and sales associates not all police officers are really nice people with excellent social skills.
joepistole
06-11-09, 11:49 AM
And all waiters and waitresses should serve you with a genuine smile and sales associates should always be kind, outgoing, and friendly. But if everyone got fired every time they deviated from this behavior at work there wouldn't be many waiters or sales associates.
Like waiters and sales associates not all police officers are really nice people with excellent social skills.
No doubt true. But if their skills do not match job requirements, they should not be employeed in jobs where those skills are required. There would still be enough folks to fill the jobs. We have almost a 10 percent unemployment rate.
PieAreSquared
06-11-09, 12:03 PM
I didn't re-watch it , but wouldn't it been better if he said "Ma'am I going to have to take you to jail " instead of "I'm going to tase you" ..if you don't co-operate.
70+ years old.. she probably didn't even know what a taser was... although she knows now.
Orleander
06-11-09, 12:22 PM
I think people underestimate thew elderly. Didn't an 88 yr old guy just kill a guard at the Holocaust Museum? The guard opened the door for him and he was killed for it.
Plazma Inferno!
06-11-09, 12:33 PM
If he hasn't used taser on her, she'd cut him in a half with her crochet set. :rolleyes:
Orleander
06-11-09, 12:37 PM
no, stabbed him with her knitting needles.
crocheting is so last century
Plazma Inferno!
06-11-09, 12:44 PM
She'd gouge his eyes and drink his blood. That's better.
Why not just give everyone a permanent shock collar? That way the local chief of police can press a button at will and make them all go off at once - ensuring a safe, peaceful, and prosperous community.
Plazma Inferno!
06-11-09, 12:55 PM
Why not just give everyone a permanent shock collar? That way the local chief of police can press a button at will and make them all go off at once - ensuring a safe, peaceful, and prosperous community.
My thoughts exactly after seeing this (and many other 'taser') video(s).
grimace
06-11-09, 12:57 PM
that weird because i dint know you had to sign a ticket. that is the problem right there though, if he could have just handed her the ticket without having to communicate with the her then this would not have happened. it doesnt bother me though.
grimace
06-11-09, 01:03 PM
What is the purpose of the police officer? Is the police officer not a public safety officer? There was nothing safe about that situation. There is nothing safe about tassering an old lady.
The whole situation could have been defused with a few words on the part of the police officer. Instead, the police officer escallated the situation to the point where he lost control. I am not a police officer, but I could have difused that situation easily. I was a paramedic working in big urban area. So I have seen a lot of this kind of stuff. The police officer should not have lost control of the situation.
He could have avoided violence with a few simple words. He did not need to resort to physical violence and pushing. If the cop cannot deal with upset people, he/she has no business being a cop.
you are crazy. there is nothing safe about an old lady speeding.
Maybe it's a Texas thing? Seriously, you don't shove someone like that. That's not the proper way to relocate someone. Quite clearly, Deputy Bieze is a sadist who just wanted an excuse to hurt an old woman.
I don't think the deputy can argue that he was ever endangered by the woman. But maybe in Texas you don't need to. If Tasers are punitive devices, there is a due process question. But hey, it's Texas, so due process isn't particularly important. And when incidents like this come up, the only thing I can think is, One more reason to stay the hell out of Texas.
Disgusting. Repugnant. I know a cop down in San Diego who is the height of professionalism, courtesy, and even humor. And one from Maryland who is much the same. I can't imagine either of them conducting themselves so poorly as Deputy Bieze. In civilized corners of the country, the police don't act like this.
• • •
She got exactly what she asked for. I don't pity her and agree with the officer.
(chortle!)
• • •
The cops actions appeared quite correct.
(guffaw!)
• • •
I think she got what she deserved! .... Listen to her, what an old bitch.
(titter!)
• • •
Okay, now that I'm done laughing at people's craven need for brutality, a couple of less ridiculous points to consider:
How do you know she was speeding through a construction zone?
The assertion is included in the television report.
• • •
The "right wing news publication" was The Today Show, not Fox News.
Indeed. Matt Lauer may be a shill for all things pathetic, but the Today Show isn't a news outlet.
• • •
She should have just signed the ticket and fought it in court, but she chose to act crazy and stupid.
It's Texas, for heaven's sake. Acting crazy and stupid sometimes seems like a God-given right in Texas.
• • •
I think people underestimate thew elderly. Didn't an 88 yr old guy just kill a guard at the Holocaust Museum? The guard opened the door for him and he was killed for it.
That's seems to be a lack of professionalism on the part of the guard. The Los Angeles Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-holocaust-shooting12-2009jun12,0,7406829.story) describes the incident, "Authorities said he opened fired, striking Johns, after entering the museum through the main entrance with a rifle in plain view." The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/11/AR2009061101086.html), which includes the part about the guard opening the door for him, also includes details from an affidavit by the FBI: "He stepped out of the driver's side of the vehicle and approached the entrance to the museum. The defendant was carrying a rifle at his side as he approached the building." And according to the Seattle Times (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2009325745_museumshooting11.html), "Washington Police Chief Cathy Lanier said, 'It appears that the gunman entered alone,' carrying 'a long rifle that was visible.'"
I would think noticing a "long rifle" that is "clearly visible" in "plain view" would be among the really important duties of a security guard.
And yes, Stephen Johns paid for his error with his life.
However, I don't see where the Texas great-grandmother could have been hiding a long rifle. I mean, sure, there's a joke in there (heh!) somewhere about her vagina and things that are "Texas sized", but in all seriousness it's not a matter of underestimating the elderly in the case of Deputy Bieze. It really looks like he lost his composure and started looking for a reason to tase an old woman.
• • •
you are crazy. there is nothing safe about an old lady speeding.
So you turn on your emergency lights, pursue the vehicle, and she pulls over. The old lady is no longer speeding. Problem solved.
• • •
A note on signing the ticket:
There are three general purposes, as I understand it, to having the motorist sign the ticket. As mentioned, PieAreSquared noticed, it is a promise to appear (or simply pay the ticket and shut up). Also, it is acknowledgment that the alleged offender understands his or her position in relation to due process. And, perhaps most importantly, it shows that the person named in the citation actually received a copy of it.
______________________
Notes:
Meyer, Josh. "Investigators in Holocaust museum shooting continue to look for clues". Los Angeles Times. June 11, 2009. LATimes.com. Accessed June 11, 2009. http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-holocaust-shooting12-2009jun12,0,7406829.story
Duggan, Paul and Ashley Halsey III. "Holocaust Museum Shooter Could Face Death Penalty". Washington Post. June 11, 2009. WashingtonPost.com. Accessed June 11, 2009. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/11/AR2009061101086.html
Seattle Times News Services. "Suspect in Holocaust Museum shooting linked to Neo-Nazis". Seattle Times. June 11, 2009. SeattleTimes.NWsource.com. Accessed June 11, 2009. http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-holocaust-shooting12-2009jun12,0,7406829.story
Crunchy Cat
06-11-09, 03:41 PM
Disgusting. Repugnant. I know a cop down in San Diego who is the height of professionalism, courtesy, and even humor... In civilized corners of the country, the police don't act like this.
My opinion is that you are gravely mistaken, so let's test the hypothesis. I can find someone in San Diego to replicate what the old lady did. All that's needed is a time and freeway that we know your cop buddy will be watching.
shorty_37
06-12-09, 11:43 PM
This aged woman was pulled over by a deputy for a traffic violation. His supervisors say he did the right thing. The right wing news publications, Fox, etc say he did the cop did the right thing.
It's disgusting and pathetic. A man of his size couldn't overtake her and get her up against his cruiser and cuff her....:rolleyes: FFS I could have done it!
Yeah she really looked like a big threat, with him towering over her. It's just like the polish man in the airport who died from being tasered. The 6 or so Big Cops couldn't take 1 man down. Oh wait he had a dangerous weapon in his hand a plastic stapler. :bugeye:
It's a joke and an embarrassment.
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