View Full Version : why did GOD stop sending messengers?!!
riverline
03-12-09, 04:24 AM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
It is just hard to start new religions these days.
Baron Max
03-12-09, 07:18 AM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
How do you know that there are not any messengers now?
Baron Max
How do you know that there are not any messengers now?
Baron Max
Probably because he's not getting the message. You can interpret that as you see fit :D
Ladicius
03-12-09, 07:46 AM
You ever realize how in the bible. When 1 of the messengers died, "God" abbandoned them? Read the end of Joshua. The god of the bible. most likely didn't exist. It was created to boost confidence.
There's been lots of messengers. Joseph Smith, David Koresh, Haile Selassie, me, just it's difficult to know who to preach to these days.
joepistole
03-12-09, 07:51 AM
I think some body pissed him off. Maybe it was that little thing about killing his only begotten son?
I think some body pissed him off. Maybe it was that little thing about killing his only begotten son?
Nope, that's not it. God sent him down here to get killed..
I think it would sooner be because we didn't ever change our ways.
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Didn't you know? God has adopted the new age and technology.
You just need to make sure you're on his email friend's list and that your mobile number is saved so he can SMS you. Why bother sending people when you can get your message across at the touch of a button?
lightgigantic
03-12-09, 06:50 PM
On the contrary, there is literally tons of theistic discourse available
geez
ever wondered how those little bibles end up in all those motel rooms?
Orleander
03-12-09, 06:57 PM
There's been lots of messengers. Joseph Smith, David Koresh, Haile Selassie, me, just it's difficult to know who to preach to these days.
or they are fed Prozac
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
God did not stop sending messages; people stopped listening.
On the contrary, there is literally tons of theistic discourse available
Any new Scripture?
How do you / would you recognize it?
lightgigantic
03-12-09, 08:06 PM
Any new Scripture?
Why would timeless wisdom require to be revamped?
NB - I would have thought a more apt OP header for atheists would be GOD, stop sending messengers!!
:shrug:
superstring01
03-12-09, 08:20 PM
why did GOD stop sending messengers?!!
God never did.
~String
nietzschefan
03-12-09, 08:22 PM
I keep hunting them down and killing them.
Pay me now?
TheVisitor
03-12-09, 08:31 PM
God never did.
~String
That's right. He's always had a voice here.
He's still available to be found by those who seek Him with all their heart.
EndLightEnd
03-12-09, 08:35 PM
Even if genuine messenger did pop up, they would throw him in the looney bin unless he started turning water into wine or some shit.
theobserver
03-12-09, 08:41 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Not really... He just stopped sending wise and good ones across. Last time he send a wise one, things got only worse. :D
Why would timeless wisdom require to be revamped?
So that's a "no".
Why do you think that new Scripture would necessarily revamp existing Scripture? You don't think that the world could benefit from more "timeless wisom"?
And you seem to have avoided the follow up - how would you recognize new Scripture if it were written?
Do you think that there might be new Scripture that you haven't recognized?
NB - I would have thought a more apt OP header for atheists would be GOD, stop sending messengers!!
What an odd, irrational, and irrelevant thought. :shrug:
PsychoticEpisode
03-12-09, 09:06 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
If the Earth was empty, then I guess they only sent messages to each other. This qualified them for Messenger status? Is that honor the Academy Award for message senders?
lightgigantic
03-12-09, 09:16 PM
So that's a "no".
no
it was a question that would hopefully lead to the real reason a scripture might be termed "new"
Why do you think that new Scripture would necessarily revamp existing Scripture?
interestingly enough, this question is answered in scripture
BG 4.7 Whenever and wherever there is a decline in religious practice, O descendant of Bharata, and a predominant rise of irreligion—at that time I descend Myself.
IOW when the practitioners make a thorough mess of things, divine intervention (either personally or through an empowered representative) re-establishes things in their proper order
You don't think that the world could benefit from more "timeless wisom"?
If they are capable of distinguishing between an essence and a detail, certainly.
And you seem to have avoided the follow up - how would you recognize new Scripture if it were written?
By contrasting it with existing scripture in a critical analysis
Do you think that there might be new Scripture that you haven't recognized?
Feel free to lodge what you think might rate as a "new scripture" and I will critically analyze it, if you want.
What an odd, irrational, and irrelevant thought. :shrug:
really?
you haven't seen bumper stickers like these?
http://images6.cafepress.com/product/253939866v2_350x350_Front.jpg
Thanks, LG, that clarifies some things.
By contrasting it with existing scripture in a critical analysis
But first you'd have to recognize it as a candidate. How?
And the obvious follow-up question:
How do you recognize existing Scripture?
lightgigantic
03-12-09, 09:30 PM
But first you'd have to recognize it as a candidate. How?
And the obvious follow-up question:
How do you recognize existing Scripture?
This seems like an obvious question to answer (scripture essentially makes claims about the nature of god, the nature of this world, the nature of ourselves, and the essential relationships between these three)
Is there an example of something which you might consider a "grey area" for being termed an existing scripture or not?
This seems like an obvious question to answer (scripture essentially makes claims about the nature of god, the nature of this world, the nature of ourselves, and the essential relationships between these three)
Is there an example of something which you might consider a "grey area" for being termed an existing scripture or not?
Different people call different things scripture, so it seems to me that it's all grey. But, I'm interested in what you think is and isn't scripture.
So, when you read a piece of writing that makes claims about the nature of god, the nature of this world, the nature of ourselves, and the essential relationships between these three, how do you decide whether or not it is scripture? (That question applies to both existing and potential new scripture.)
superstring01
03-12-09, 10:43 PM
That's right. He's always had a voice here.
He's still available to be found by those who seek Him with all their heart.
Oh... wait....
I just puked up a little bit in my mouth.
~String
lightgigantic
03-13-09, 01:01 AM
Different people call different things scripture, so it seems to me that it's all grey. But, I'm interested in what you think is and isn't scripture.
So, when you read a piece of writing that makes claims about the nature of god, the nature of this world, the nature of ourselves, and the essential relationships between these three, how do you decide whether or not it is scripture? (That question applies to both existing and potential new scripture.)
Once again, it seems like an obvious question to answer.
For instance, when you read a piece of writing that makes claims about biology, how do you decide whether it is scientific?
.... assuming this is a straight forward q to answer, the same general principle holds for determining scripture.
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Sending a messenger is only needed when you have got a message to send.
If you have sent your message already all you need are people to take note of that message and share it with each other. The only time you need a Prophet is if you have something to add to what you have already said.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Bishadi
03-14-09, 12:48 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
sorry........................ there is ONE more!
God don't send anyone, people make choices.
The good guys choose to give, share knowledge, contribute; while the other team are self preserving, unevolved, corrupt beast of propriety.
Not a one contributer ever started a religion. The following people did.
The last chapter comes from combining the religions, sciences and philosophies into ONE frame; the truth! :)
Every religion (for the most part) has all said a day would come.
And knowledge is what unfolds the 'end of days' as then the people are equiped with truth, not beliefs.
"we the people' are the judges :eek:
nothing magical about it! :cool:
eddie23
03-14-09, 01:12 PM
simple.
No god... No messengers.
joepistole
03-14-09, 03:21 PM
I still say, someone pissed him off.
joepistole
03-19-09, 11:20 PM
Maybe it was limbaugh or hannity that pissed him off?
Anti-Flag
03-20-09, 12:20 PM
Some people just don't want the work.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-20-09, 08:38 PM
I keep hunting them down and killing them.
Pay me now?
How do you find them???
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-20-09, 08:39 PM
That's right. He's always had a voice here.
He's still available to be found by those who seek Him with all their heart.
He's playing hide&seek?
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-20-09, 08:42 PM
“ Originally Posted by lightgigantic
“ NB - I would have thought a more apt OP header for atheists would be GOD, stop sending messengers!! ”
What an odd, irrational, and irrelevant thought. :shrug:
As usual for him.
lightgigantic
03-20-09, 08:45 PM
“ Originally Posted by lightgigantic
“ NB - I would have thought a more apt OP header for atheists would be GOD, stop sending messengers!! ”
As usual for him.
guess you missed post 23, eh?
;)
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-20-09, 08:45 PM
really?
you haven't seen bumper stickers like these?
http://images6.cafepress.com/product/253939866v2_350x350_Front.jpg
Some of those aren't atheists. The 1s who are atheist are obviously being sarcastic.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-20-09, 08:49 PM
guess you missed post 23, eh?
You guess wrong.
lightgigantic
03-20-09, 09:12 PM
Some of those aren't atheists. The 1s who are atheist are obviously being sarcastic.
You guess wrong.
just as well atheist and theistic posters alike have persons like yourself to clarify their thoughts for them
:rolleyes:
Once again, it seems like an obvious question to answer.
For instance, when you read a piece of writing that makes claims about biology, how do you decide whether it is scientific?
.... assuming this is a straight forward q to answer, the same general principle holds for determining scripture.
That would imply that all scientific writings are scripture, although I'm sure that's not what you intended. Can you explain further?
Itseemstome
03-22-09, 04:06 AM
The problem is not with the transmitter, its the receiver. We forgot how to operate it. The Egyptians knew, so did the drawers of ancient cave paintings and the originators of every single religion on the planet.
Instructions. 1. Clear your mind of every single thought by meditation. Prayer and hypnosis get quite close. 2. Take your choice of halucinogenic. Magic mushroom or LSD to name but two. 3. Report your experience to a third party. 4. Let him do the interpretation.
Step 1 can take years. In ancient Egypt it was called initiation: remember Hermes Trimigestus? Also why hermits retreat to remote caves. Also remember the Greek oracles.
At step 3 the Receiver was called the Prophet and the interpreter, the Priest. They both reported to the King. Or maybe Pharoah ( I'm not sure whether he was the receiver or not.)
These days step 2 is illegal and, therefore, the priest is having to work on some very distorted, ancient information.
That is why there are no prophets around these days. Like many things, not so strange at all; once you know the reason.
inzomnia
03-22-09, 06:11 AM
Sending a messenger is only needed when you have got a message to send.
If you have sent your message already all you need are people to take note of that message and share it with each other. The only time you need a Prophet is if you have something to add to what you have already said.
Exactly. According to Quran, there will be no other prophet after Muhammad:
"This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion." (Quran 5:3)
That was the last message the prophet Muhammad received from God and he revealed it during his last pilgrimage. On that occasion (http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-AAbout_Islam/AskAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE&cid=1123996015862), he also said:
"O people! No prophet or apostle will come after me and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore O people! And, understand words that I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the Qur’an and the sunnah and if you follow these you will never go astray."
Some people just don't want the work.
Lol :D
The problem is not with the transmitter, its the receiver. We forgot how to operate it. The Egyptians knew, so did the drawers of ancient cave paintings and the originators of every single religion on the planet.
Instructions. 1. Clear your mind of every single thought by meditation. Prayer and hypnosis get quite close. 2. Take your choice of halucinogenic. Magic mushroom or LSD to name but two. 3. Report your experience to a third party. 4. Let him do the interpretation.
And how would you distinguish between a prophet who followed those instructions, and a prophet who followed only 2, 3, and 4?
:bugeye:
DiamondHearts
03-22-09, 07:10 AM
If the message is complete and available in full, then there is no need to send more messengers. Messengers were pioneers in an age of disbelief sent by God to guide humanity and eventually lead to the revolution which is brought by the Prophets (those messengers with scriptures). Once the last Prophet has come, as believed by Muslims and Christians, there is no need for further prophets. The age of prophets is over, it is now the age of the disciples (followers of the Prophets).
Bishadi
03-22-09, 10:39 AM
Exactly. According to Quran, there will be no other prophet after Muhammad:
"This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion." (Quran 5:3)
That was the last message the prophet Muhammad received from God and he revealed it during his last pilgrimage. On that occasion (http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-AAbout_Islam/AskAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE&cid=1123996015862), he also said:
"O people! No prophet or apostle will come after me and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore O people! And, understand words that I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the Qur’an and the sunnah and if you follow these you will never go astray."
Lol :D
oooooops!............
you made a booboo....................
God himself is not a man to walk around. Muhammed was a teacher/prophet just as jesus moses and darwin.
But be certain, there is another chapter and that is what the 'second creation' is all about. Most of the whole Quran is talking about the coming 'days of judgment'.
You have misinterpreted the idea that quran was the last book. If you like we can play with this ALL DAY LONG and in that, both of us could learn a bit more. But i play no haddith, nor interpretations of preachers (Imans/caliph).
What i did notice in your post what that last 'fact'........... that there will be no further 'religions' as the truth, the last chapter, removes beliefs from ever imposing upon mankind again.
Be certain when the truth unfolds, the jinn will be over!
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-22-09, 10:49 AM
just as well atheist and theistic posters alike have persons like yourself to clarify their thoughts for them
Too bad no 1 can clarify yours.
joepistole
03-22-09, 12:21 PM
Too many ditto heads in the world.
inzomnia
03-22-09, 01:02 PM
oooooops!............
you made a booboo....................
God himself is not a man to walk around. Muhammed was a teacher/prophet just as jesus moses and darwin.
But be certain, there is another chapter and that is what the 'second creation' is all about. Most of the whole Quran is talking about the coming 'days of judgment'.
You have misinterpreted the idea that quran was the last book. If you like we can play with this ALL DAY LONG and in that, both of us could learn a bit more. But i play no haddith, nor interpretations of preachers (Imans/caliph).
What i did notice in your post what that last 'fact'........... that there will be no further 'religions' as the truth, the last chapter, removes beliefs from ever imposing upon mankind again.
Be certain when the truth unfolds, the jinn will be over!
Actually I was just quoting the related verse of the Qur'an and the story behind it, I didn't make it up. Must be looked rudiculous for many people, but that's what I believe. :shrug: It's about faith.
Itseemstome
03-23-09, 04:05 AM
And how would you distinguish between a prophet who followed those instructions, and a prophet who followed only 2, 3, and 4?
:bugeye:
You can't. Thats precisely the problem. That very weak vessel, Homo Sapiens, chooses which he wishes to believe. Then how to interpret the one who's chosen. It leads to some very peculiar and contradictory religions.
why did GOD stop sending messengers?!!
"He" never did. Not once.
But the self proclaimed messangers are still around. Go downtown in any major city and you can find the one's off their meds.
You can't. Thats precisely the problem. That very weak vessel, Homo Sapiens, chooses which he wishes to believe. Then how to interpret the one who's chosen. It leads to some very peculiar and contradictory religions.
If there is no way to distinguish a true prophet from a false prophet, and given that some prophets contradict each other, then the logical conclusion is that they are all false prophets.
What leads you to believe that any of them are true prophets, and how do you determine which prophets are true?
Exactly. According to Quran, there will be no other prophet after Muhammad:
"This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion." (Quran 5:3)
That was the last message the prophet Muhammad received from God and he revealed it during his last pilgrimage. On that occasion (http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-AAbout_Islam/AskAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE&cid=1123996015862), he also said:
"O people! No prophet or apostle will come after me and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore O people! And, understand words that I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the Qur’an and the sunnah and if you follow these you will never go astray."
Lol :D
muhammed was not a prophet of God. But i guess you probably knew that was my belief.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-23-09, 08:26 AM
There are no prophets of God. But I guess you probably knew that.
All Praise Beautiful IPU
shorty_37
03-23-09, 08:28 AM
why did GOD stop sending messengers?!!
I think his account went to collections and his Internet Service Provider cut him off.
The question is a fallacy to begin with.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-23-09, 08:32 AM
God is whacked because he can't get any.
Bishadi
03-23-09, 08:58 AM
Actually I was just quoting the related verse of the Qur'an and the story behind it, I didn't make it up. Must be looked rudiculous for many people, but that's what I believe. :shrug: It's about faith.
fair.
I have faith in the whole of existence (GOD) to provide, and thereby then each of God's revealings from all of His variety is what unfolds the truth.
To believe that ONE of the religions has already completed the works is what has maintained the divisions of mankind. Combining the knowledge is what the last (second creation) is all about.
You in them 'end of days'!
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-23-09, 09:18 AM
Your faith is proof of gods???
Bishadi
03-23-09, 09:38 AM
Your faith is proof of gods???
If God is all of existence, at the same time; then i are a believer!
'I am, therefore i exist!'
proves to me i live within EXISTENCE.
I can read the history, i can observe what i experience; these are truths!
But i do not believe in the omnipotence of a separate entity pulling the strings of my soul. I live with choice and do by choice!
I am man, i am responsible for my actions.
If what i do is GOOD, then i will live within Existence (God) based on what i do and what I contribute by choice; i am responsible for the mass that my mind can cause action for.
No one controls my choices but me!
I choose to live in what I do!
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-23-09, 09:43 AM
WHY are you attempting to make others as confused as you are???
Bishadi
03-23-09, 10:16 AM
WHY are you attempting to make others as confused as you are???
if truth 'confuses' then be honest with yourself and check everything to remove the confusion.
i find, that many who state as you have, are not really confused but are becoming aware and choose not to face reality!
nothing being said is against common sense
it may be against beliefs and accepted paradigm but that is what using your mind, the internet and questions allows you to address
if you allow honesty to step in, then be humble and simply allow yourself to begin the new homework to be absolutely certain.
but to roll over and say "i don't wanna" is not my fault, but your own choice.
Either you want to know, or you don't!
That ain't my choice!
DiamondHearts
03-23-09, 01:45 PM
Your posts are very much confusing. Truth must be absolute, and furthermore falsehood must exist for truth to exist. Just as for there to be light, there needs to be darkness.
The question is why did God stop sending messengers. It depends on who you ask. For Muslims and Christians, God has sent his last messenger, therefore all that remains is the second coming of Jesus (peace be to him). For Jews, there Messiah has not arrived yet and they are awaiting his arrival, as they don't believe Jesus (peace be to him) was the Messiah.
Bishadi
03-23-09, 02:13 PM
Your posts are very much confusing. not the intent
Truth must be absolute, and furthermore falsehood must exist for truth to exist. since mankind created 'all' words, then would you agree, there are a bunch of 'errors' to be made?
sure a we bit of good comes from some of it, just as birds came from dinosaurs.
but the beasts are extinct over time
Just as for there to be light, there needs to be darkness.
not in this existence. Since there is never anywhere possible in existence a perfect vacuum, then never NO where in existence is there a place without em (light).
Just because we (mankind) can only see a little sliver of the spectrum of light, then it may seem like darkness in some places but be certain, there is no perfect vacuum ever between a point A and B...........anywhere in existence!
The question is why did God stop sending messengers. It depends on who you ask. For Muslims and Christians, God has sent his last messenger, Wrong! Both the quran and bible are practically all about the 'days' to come.
It is the preaching and teaching, not the books themselves that push that idea, you are holding on to
therefore all that remains is the second coming of Jesus (peace be to him). For Jews, there Messiah has not arrived yet and they are awaiting his arrival, as they don't believe Jesus (peace be to him) was the Messiah.
jesus was not the messiah and even said 'another' is coming
first he said HE aint GOOD and to follow the rules mark 10
18And Jesus said to him, `Why me dost thou call good? no one [is] good except One -- God;
19the commands thou hast known: Thou mayest not commit adultery, Thou mayest do no murder, Thou mayest not steal, Thou mayest not bear false witness, Thou mayest not defraud, Honour thy father and mother.
then in john 14 to keep the rules and 'another' will come, and this time will live with the PEOPLE
15`If ye love me, my commands keep,
16and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you -- to the age
this shares that Jesus himself knew he was not the messiah but the religious preachers would not just tell it like it is.
Most of the world has literature that the last chapter is yet to come.(and by a man)
see the kalki in hindu, the pahana of indigenous, the shaman, mahdi, great white brother........... the list is huge and can be found in most every religious belief system on earth............
Never before in existence has the knowledge evolved to such a point, as well in a venue (the internet) for any to observe, study and combine the various ideology.
The last is a person of choice, who simply put in the time to do what this earth and her population knew would occur ONE day; to reveal the truth!
Nothing magical about it!
and then again; since messengers are what people call the contributers, notice non of them had the ability to change anyones mind.
:bugeye:
.
DiamondHearts
03-23-09, 03:48 PM
not the intent
since mankind created 'all' words, then would you agree, there are a bunch of 'errors' to be made?
What makes you assume mankind created words? God created all which exists, He taught man words and how to make his livelihood. God is as close to us as our jugular vein.
sure a we bit of good comes from some of it, just as birds came from dinosaurs.
but the beasts are extinct over time
Your parable is wasted on me. I don't believe in evolution. Nor do I believe dinosaurs turned into birds.
not in this existence. Since there is never anywhere possible in existence a perfect vacuum, then never NO where in existence is there a place without em (light).
Just because we (mankind) can only see a little sliver of the spectrum of light, then it may seem like darkness in some places but be certain, there is no perfect vacuum ever between a point A and B...........anywhere in existence!
Darkness and light are not absolute, their definition depends on the other. The vacuum or void is another issue altogether and unrelated.
Wrong! Both the quran and bible are practically all about the 'days' to come.
It is the preaching and teaching, not the books themselves that push that idea, you are holding on to
As for the Quran, I challenge you to provide evidence for your claims. I am well acquainted and your point about the Quran being vague about this is wrong. The Quran clearly mentions the Prophet Muhammad (peace be to him) as the last messenger of God. How many times is the kalima present in the Quran?
jesus was not the messiah and even said 'another' is coming
first he said HE aint GOOD and to follow the rules mark 10
18And Jesus said to him, `Why me dost thou call good? no one [is] good except One -- God;
Actually this supports my view. I view Jesus as fully human prophet, and not divine.
19the commands thou hast known: Thou mayest not commit adultery, Thou mayest do no murder, Thou mayest not steal, Thou mayest not bear false witness, Thou mayest not defraud, Honour thy father and mother.
Prophet Jesus (peace be to him) did not have a father. This is general advice for his followers.
then in john 14 to keep the rules and 'another' will come, and this time will live with the PEOPLE
15`If ye love me, my commands keep,
16and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you -- to the age
this shares that Jesus himself knew he was not the messiah but the religious preachers would not just tell it like it is.
I agree. This is what Muslims believe. Hence the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) being the last messenger and the seal of the Prophets. There are no more to come.
Most of the world has literature that the last chapter is yet to come.(and by a man)
see the kalki in hindu, the pahana of indigenous, the shaman, mahdi, great white brother........... the list is huge and can be found in most every religious belief system on earth............
The Mahdi is not a prophet, he is a pious man who will rejuvenate faith in God and establish the law of God on Earth. Hadith are quite clear concerning him.
Never before in existence has the knowledge evolved to such a point, as well in a venue (the internet) for any to observe, study and combine the various ideology.
The last is a person of choice, who simply put in the time to do what this earth and her population knew would occur ONE day; to reveal the truth!
Nothing magical about it!
So you pick and choose from differing and contradictory religious scriptures to draw your personal beliefs? If God wills to reveal truth, he does not need to confuse us with inconsistency and contradictory systems. As truth is absolute, so is God's law absolute. Many religions have some truth, this shows the level of deviation from the true original religion, Monotheism. That monotheism is compeleted and perfect in Islam, which is a complete way of life for human beings.
and then again; since messengers are what people call the contributers, notice non of them had the ability to change anyones mind.
:bugeye:
.
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) had a very major impact on the pagan Arabs. If you study the revolution in the hearts of the people from before until after they accepted him, you will notice huge societal changes, even global changes in the world. You are right in one thing however, God gives man to decide what he wills to follow, as he has given us this choice. Those who embraced the prophets' messages over time, did so of their own free will, and became enlightened human beings who gained understanding of God and their own nature.
By the way, your typing style is very confusing and hard to read.
The Breaker
03-23-09, 04:09 PM
The question is a fallacy to begin with.
Agreed. God did not stop sending messengers, god never sent any in the first place. There is no god.
Itseemstome
03-23-09, 06:14 PM
What leads you to believe that any of them are true prophets, and how do you determine which prophets are true?
Whatever gave you the impression that I thought any of them were true prophets? I merely wished to explain, as much to the fanatics as to anybody, how religions came into being and why none of them are telling the truth which they claim.
However the very fact that some information?, instruction?, form of knowledge, which appears to contain an element, however small, of truth, is being imparted is, in itself, fascinating. (how's that for punctuation?)
I, again, don't think, for a second, that it is from God; and no two people can agree on what that name means so it is of very little use in an unbiased discussion. At the very most its from a lesser intelligence than the all-encompassing G**.
We can't, however, get away from the fact that a very high percentage of new ideas have been 'revealed' in either dreams (Mendeleyev?) or under the influence of halucinogenics. (Crick's idea for the structure of DNA)
I fear, however, that there are far too many vested interests for a serious look at what may be the true nature of man and mind ever to be undertaken. But still, I'm well into my sixties so I won't have too long to wait to find out at least some of the truth.
Bishadi
03-23-09, 09:16 PM
To start with DH, i am not one to be bashful; you are going to read items your beliefs may clash with but that is not my fault.
I speak truth, and you either deal with it, or you don't!
What makes you assume mankind created words? Every word ever was put to stone, pen, paper or what have you by man/women. All cases!
Muhammed could not read or write so not one item of a book called quran even existed while Muhammed was alive.
Your parable is wasted on me. I don't believe in evolution. Nor do I believe dinosaurs turned into birds. then take lessons:
067.019
Do they not observe the birds above them, spreading their wings and folding them in? None can uphold them except (Allah) Most Gracious: Truly (Allah) Most Gracious: Truly it is He that watches over all things.
As for the Quran, I challenge you to provide evidence for your claims. I am well acquainted and your point about the Quran being vague about this is wrong. Read these four (Fatir, Ya Seen, Al ghafir, Al mulk) in total, and remember I said, the majority of the quran is about 'the coming truth'.
The Quran clearly mentions the Prophet Muhammad (peace be to him) as the last messenger of God. Except the 'promise' was not furnished. (maryam)
Most of the Quran is talking about the last chapter!
Now if you wish to be faithful, then have faith Allah will provide and be honest enough to realize the absolute has not been furnished or the 'end of days' and the judgment and Peace would already exist. (as promised)
If you want to discuss Quran, then open a thread and bring on your best of the best Iman.
Notice the whole issue is of the light:
057.013
One Day will the Hypocrites- men and women - say to the Believers: "Wait for us! Let us borrow (a Light) from your Light!" It will be said: "Turn ye back to your rear! then seek a Light (where ye can)!" So a wall will be put up betwixt them, with a gate therein. Within it will be Mercy throughout, and without it, all alongside, will be (Wrath and) Punishment!
the rules are to be honest and faithful to truth.....
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-23-09, 11:15 PM
if truth 'confuses' then be honest with yourself and check everything to remove the confusion.
i find, that many who state as you have, are not really confused but are becoming aware and choose not to face reality!
nothing being said is against common sense
it may be against beliefs and accepted paradigm but that is what using your mind, the internet and questions allows you to address
if you allow honesty to step in, then be humble and simply allow yourself to begin the new homework to be absolutely certain.
but to roll over and say "i don't wanna" is not my fault, but your own choice.
Either you want to know, or you don't!
That ain't my choice!
I didn't say I'm confused. I asked why you're being confusing.
You contradict yourself time & time again.
You wouldn't know truth if it was a matter of life & death.
You argue with another, each with no evidence, each of you trying to pass your beliefs as absolute truth. The other's, at least, are much more consistent than yours.
You obviously don't want to know. It is enough for you to fool yourself.
Your claims are certainly against sense. You are the 1 who doesn't face reality.
Bishadi
03-24-09, 08:12 PM
I didn't say I'm confused. I asked why you're being confusing.
You contradict yourself time & time again.
point out something 'contradicting' :bugeye:
i am not to proud to learn
DiamondHearts
03-25-09, 09:10 AM
To start with DH, i am not one to be bashful; you are going to read items your beliefs may clash with but that is not my fault.
I speak truth, and you either deal with it, or you don't!
I have no problem with you voicing your beliefs. I have never indicated anything otherwise. I am merely asking for some clarification of your statements.
Every word ever was put to stone, pen, paper or what have you by man/women. All cases!
Muhammed could not read or write so not one item of a book called quran even existed while Muhammed was alive.
The word is not written, it is spoken. Furthermore if we accept God as All-Knowing, then we would know, as the Quran tells us also, that the words were with God and God taught them to man through speech. Many societies exist without written words, oral tradition can much earlier than the written tradition.
Furthermore, though the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) could not write, yet he could speak. The Quran literally means (the recitation), the written word is not the Quran, it is the spoken word which is the Quran. The Quran was written down and organized during the Prophet's lifetime by his disciples, under his guidance.
then take lessons:
067.019
Do they not observe the birds above them, spreading their wings and folding them in? None can uphold them except (Allah) Most Gracious: Truly (Allah) Most Gracious: Truly it is He that watches over all things.
How does this prove that birds evolved from pre-existing creation? This is a verse related to convince man of the presence of God, due to the natural world He created for us.
The context of this verse in is the creation of heavens, creatures, and the earth. http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/67.htm
Read these four (Fatir, Ya Seen, Al ghafir, Al mulk) in total, and remember I said, the majority of the quran is about 'the coming truth'.
Surat Fatir http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/35.htm
Ya Seen http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/36.htm
Al Ghafir http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/40.htm
Al Mulk http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/67.htm
Now what do you want me to look at here. Provide the verses which you use to support your claim. I will explain it from my view.
Except the 'promise' was not furnished. (maryam)
Most of the Quran is talking about the last chapter!
The promise relating to what? Can you find this verse for me here? http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/19.htm
The Quran discusses the post-death coming of the Judgment day and its results (Paradise or Hellfire), that is the last chapter. The Quran touches briefly on events in our future only once, when mentioning the return of Prophet Jesus (peace be upon him). It is interesting to note that the Mahdi, nor the Anti-Christ are not mentioned in the Quran, but the Hadith. Thus your argument falls apart when analyzed from the Quranic perspective. The Quran is a book for all time, and cannot be isolated either to the past, present, nor the future.
Surah Al Ma'ida 5:3 "... This day have those who reject faith given up all hope of your religion: yet fear them not but fear Me. This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion... "
Now if you wish to be faithful, then have faith Allah will provide and be honest enough to realize the absolute has not been furnished or the 'end of days' and the judgment and Peace would already exist. (as promised)
If you want to discuss Quran, then open a thread and bring on your best of the best Iman.
We are discussing your claims that the Quran claims there to be another prophet. The Quran repeatedly denies this. Such an unfounded claim can be put to rest with only one verse:
Surah al-Ahzab 33:40 "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Apostle of God, and the Seal (End) of the Prophets: and God has full knowledge of all things."
Hadith: "In My Ummah (Islamic Nation), there shall be born Thirty Grand Liars (Dajjals), each of whom will claim to be a prophet, But I am the Last Prophet; there is No Prophet after Me. (Abu Dawood Vol 2 p. 228; Tirmidhi Vol 2 p.45)"
There are more: http://www.answering-christianity.com/last_prophet.htm
Notice the whole issue is of the light:
057.013
One Day will the Hypocrites- men and women - say to the Believers: "Wait for us! Let us borrow (a Light) from your Light!" It will be said: "Turn ye back to your rear! then seek a Light (where ye can)!" So a wall will be put up betwixt them, with a gate therein. Within it will be Mercy throughout, and without it, all alongside, will be (Wrath and) Punishment!
the rules are to be honest and faithful to truth.....
Surah Al-Hadeed http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/57.htm
57:7. "Believe in Allah and His apostle (Prophet Muhammad), and spend (in charity) out of the (substance) whereof He has made you heirs. For, those of you who believe and spend (in charity),- for them is a great Reward. "
It is not sufficient to accept Allah swt, according to the Quran, but one must also accept the Prophet Muhammad (as the final messenger) to earn the great reward (Paradise, Jannat).
You are correct, light does feature prominently in the Quran. I still don't see how this proves your point.
Context:
57:12. One Day shalt thou see the believing men and the believing women- how their Light runs forward before them and by their right hands: (their greeting will be): "Good News for you this Day! Gardens beneath which flow rivers! to dwell therein for aye! This is indeed the highest Achievement!"
13. One Day will the Hypocrites- men and women - say to the Believers: "Wait for us! Let us borrow (a Light) from your Light!" It will be said: "Turn ye back to your rear! then seek a Light (where ye can)!" So a wall will be put up betwixt them, with a gate therein. Within it will be Mercy throughout, and without it, all alongside, will be (Wrath and) Punishment!
14. (Those without) will call out, "Were we not with you?" (The others) will reply, "True! but ye led yourselves into temptation; ye looked forward (to our ruin); ye doubted ((Allah)'s Promise); and (your false) desires deceived you; until there issued the Command of Allah. And the Deceiver deceived you in respect of Allah.
15. "This Day shall no ransom be accepted of you, nor of those who rejected Allah." Your abode is the Fire: that is the proper place to claim you: and an evil refuge it is!"
16. Has not the Time arrived for the Believers that their hearts in all humility should engage in the remembrance of Allah and of the Truth which has been revealed (to them), and that they should not become like those to whom was given Revelation aforetime, but long ages passed over them and their hearts grew hard? For many among them are rebellious transgressors.
17. Know ye (all) that Allah giveth life to the earth after its death! already have We shown the Signs plainly to you, that ye may learn wisdom.
18. For those who give in Charity, men and women, and loan to Allah a Beautiful Loan, it shall be increased manifold (to their credit), and they shall have (besides) a liberal reward.
19. And those who believe in Allah and His apostles- they are the Sincere (lovers of Truth), and the witnesses (who testify), in the eyes of their Lord: They shall have their Reward and their Light. But those who reject Allah and deny Our Signs,- they are the Companions of Hell-Fire.
Finally, we end with the most important teaching of the Quran. Acceptance of the whole, without rejected any portion. This verse is addressed to the Children of Israel, but it is also applicable to us.
Surat al Baqara 2:85 "...Then is it only a part of the Book that ye believe in, and do ye reject the rest? ..."
Thus we see that, from the wisdom of the Quran. We must either fully accept the Quran if we are to attain its guidance. Taking pieces of verses from a whole chapter, and relating it out of the context of the Quran or the hadith (the words and actions of the Prophet), we are left with a shaky foundation, which is not only confusing to others, but also ourselves.
Allah swt guide us to the straight path. Ameen.
Bishadi
03-25-09, 11:24 AM
that last post is moved to new thread
StrangerInAStrangeLa
03-25-09, 08:31 PM
falsehood must exist for truth to exist. Just as for there to be light, there needs to be darkness.
Absurd.
not the intent
Most of the world has literature that the last chapter is yet to come.(and by a man)
see the kalki in hindu, the pahana of indigenous, the shaman, mahdi, great white brother........... the list is huge and can be found in most every religious belief system on earth............
:bugeye:
.
Kalki is not supposed to be a prophet, but next Incarnate of Vishnu. While other religions do not provide a firm date for their next prophet, Kalki is slated to descend 427,000 years in future. pucca time frame.
He SHALL not end the world too.
Bishadi
03-28-09, 03:08 PM
Kalki is not supposed to be a prophet, but next Incarnate of Vishnu. same thing another team suggests about Jesus. (i guess in both concepts, back 2k yrs ago and his purported return in revelations)
Then to look at the quran, they also say on the 'days of judgment' that the boss himself is supposed to show up.
In fact, most all of the religions believe the almighty himself is supposed to be the who, that be the he, often called messiah moshiah pahanna, kalki, adi buddha, christ........ the list is hugenormous.
While other religions do not provide a firm date for their next prophet, Kalki is slated to descend 427,000 years in future. pucca time frame.
each of the beliefs have their own clock too, as well none really know.
He SHALL not end the world too. i wouldn't think the boss would be intending anything of the such
if you look around and smell the air; god didn't make nuclear warheads and create the conflict in the middle east
nor did any single thing or beast.
mankind not only brings the fire from the sky, the doomsday mare (nuclear subs) but also judges their peers
all a man can do is share knowledge and in that reality, each can know God is everything you ever experienced and has never left or been separate from mankind since the very beginning.
'we the people' (mankind) are what do all the choosing/damage/judgment; the boss (existence) is experiencing everything we are doing to ourselves.
what the kalki does is reveal but he is not some blue guy (krishna/avatar) with monsters to kick some corrupt butts
same thing another team suggests about Jesus. (i guess in both concepts, back 2k yrs ago and his purported return in revelations)
Then to look at the quran, they also say on the 'days of judgment' that the boss himself is supposed to show up.
In fact, most all of the religions believe the almighty himself is supposed to be the who, that be the he, often called messiah moshiah pahanna, kalki, adi buddha, christ........ the list is hugenormous.
each of the beliefs have their own clock too, as well none really know.
i wouldn't think the boss would be intending anything of the such
if you look around and smell the air; god didn't make nuclear warheads and create the conflict in the middle east
nor did any single thing or beast.
mankind not only brings the fire from the sky, the doomsday mare (nuclear subs) but also judges their peers
all a man can do is share knowledge and in that reality, each can know God is everything you ever experienced and has never left or been separate from mankind since the very beginning.
'we the people' (mankind) are what do all the choosing/damage/judgment; the boss (existence) is experiencing everything we are doing to ourselves.
what the kalki does is reveal but he is not some blue guy (krishna/avatar) with monsters to kick some corrupt butts
Two differences. Kalki has a fixed trime frame, Jesus not.
Kalki will not destro the world, Jesus will.
Kalki concept is much older than the Jesus concept and might have inspired the latter.
Nothing like two religious people arguing about which fantasy is "true."
First of all Jesus never died and he is still alive living as a person which mean it could be anyone out of the 6 billion people. Jesus was and is the best person ever to live. He had a strong connection with God because he truly believed in God and thats what gave him his powers. Most people say they believe in God but In their actual conciousness they do not, so just because a person says they believe in God and maybe even pray in that actual conciousness where we manifest our everyday life does not believe in God you are pretty much lying to yourself and lying to your self will only take you and your self down. Jesus did not die for our sins thats a really stupid thing to say even worse to believe. The people that killed jesus are the ones that added that to the bible so they won't fill guilty for what they did to one of the most pure and godfilled person. When Judgment Day comes do you think God will say you are all forgiven because Jesus died for you, ridicoulous veryone has the power of choice and since you have been given that choice you will all be judged individually and when you die and have earned your right in God's eyes you will go to that place that you thought about on earth what paradise would be.
The people that killed jesus are the ones that added that to the bible so they won't fill guilty for what they did to one of the most pure and godfilled person.
Why should they feel guilty?
Surely by killing Jesus they were just fulfilling god's promised ending for Jesus?
:shrug:
They were doing god's work!
TheVisitor
03-31-09, 07:26 PM
First of all Jesus never died and he is still alive living as a person which mean it could be anyone out of the 6 billion people.
Jesus did not die for our sins that's a really stupid thing to say even worse to believe. The people that killed Jesus are the ones that added that to the bible so they won't fill guilty for what they did to one of the most pure and god filled person.
When Judgment Day comes do you think God will say you are all forgiven because Jesus died for you, ridiculous everyone has the power of choice and since you have been given that choice you will all be judged individually and when you die and have earned your right in God's eyes you will go to that place that you thought about on earth what paradise would be.
That's not a very rosy picture you're painting there friend.
Jesus did not die for our sins....you say?
OK, sins as in drinking, lying, etc, etc...maybe not.
He died to take away our "sin" singular, which is our unbelief.
It is that underlying unbelief which causes the other things to manifest in our lives.
It is a matter of a conversion of the heart.
It is a personal decision to follow that Spirit's leading or to reject it and go your own way.
"They that are led of the Spirit of God, they shall be called the sons of God".
Why should they feel guilty?
Surely by killing Jesus they were just fulfilling god's promised ending for Jesus?
:shrug:
They were doing god's work!
Killing Jesus is one thing lying to generations of people about something they know they have wronged major sin.
That's not a very rosy picture you're painting there friend.
I actually thank you for adding that maybe I did not make it clear enough some people might get the wrong idea, it is not what I meant. You are right.
Killing Jesus is one thing lying to generations of people about something they know they have wronged major sin.
So what "wrong" did they do?
same thing another team suggests about Jesus. (i guess in both concepts, back 2k yrs ago and his purported return in revelations)
each of the beliefs have their own clock too, as well none really know.
What are koranic and biblical time frames for the mehdi and second coming of Jesus?
Jesus promised to return before the generation of his time was dead. He did not come.
Coming has been postponed so many times that nobody can believe it like the the boy who cried WOLF!!
So what "wrong" did they do?
Lying about someone who is a prophet/Son Of God/Lord and why he has died by doing so they add thoughts into peoples head which manipulates their mind into believing something that is false about God. That is a sin I would guess you would go to hell for because the ultimate sin is to control free will and by adding that little sentence completely changes the whole reason for why jesus died.
What are koranic and biblical time frames for the mehdi and second coming of Jesus?
Jesus promised to return before the generation of his time was dead. He did not come.
Coming has been postponed so many times that nobody can believe it like the the boy who cried WOLF!!
2012- If the end of the world is then Thats 3 years. if Jesus died at the age of 23 or 24 (not exactly sure) someone who is around the ages of 20-22 could be the New Jesus unknowingly and Jesus will poses that body. Im not saying this is true its just another idea.
So Jesus basically lives In everyone that is a good person or thinks the way he did willing to sacrifice your self for others. I do believe that and If I ever get to reach that level I will be forever greatfull not that I am not already but Jesus must have had a very good conciousness or clear or set because in order to have a strong connection with god you must free your mind and surender your body.
So Jesus basically lives In everyone that is a good person or thinks the way he did willing to sacrifice your self for others. I do believe that and If I ever get to reach that level I will be forever greatfull not that I am not already but Jesus must have had a very good conciousness or clear or set because in order to have a strong connection with god you must free your mind and surender your body.
:bugeye:
I know there is meaning in there somewhere. Maybe.
Do you think you are capable of reaching a level where you will "live in everyone"? Is that like the secret cow level?
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-01-09, 03:00 AM
First of all Jesus never died and he is still alive living as a person which mean it could be anyone out of the 6 billion people. Jesus was and is the best person ever to live. He had a strong connection with God because he truly believed in God and thats what gave him his powers. Most people say they believe in God but In their actual conciousness they do not, so just because a person says they believe in God and maybe even pray in that actual conciousness where we manifest our everyday life does not believe in God you are pretty much lying to yourself and lying to your self will only take you and your self down. Jesus did not die for our sins thats a really stupid thing to say even worse to believe. The people that killed jesus are the ones that added that to the bible so they won't fill guilty for what they did to one of the most pure and godfilled person. When Judgment Day comes do you think God will say you are all forgiven because Jesus died for you, ridicoulous veryone has the power of choice and since you have been given that choice you will all be judged individually and when you die and have earned your right in God's eyes you will go to that place that you thought about on earth what paradise would be.
According to the Holy Babble (Have you read it?), Jesus was a nasty, arrogant immoral ass.
Jesus never died but people killed him? Maybe you should sleep on that.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-01-09, 03:08 AM
That's not a very rosy picture you're painting there friend.
The pot calls the kettle black.
He died to take away our "sin" singular, which is our unbelief.
It is that underlying unbelief which causes the other things to manifest in our lives.
You have a mouse in your pocket?
It is a matter of a conversion of the heart.
It is a personal decision to follow that Spirit's leading or to reject it and go your own way.
My heart certainly doesn't need converting.
I can't reject something I don't know exists.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-01-09, 03:23 AM
Killing Jesus is one thing lying to generations of people about something they know they have wronged major sin.
I nearly asked if anyone can translate this then I saw where you left out periods & capitals.
Lying about someone who is a prophet/Son Of God/Lord and why he has died by doing so they add thoughts into peoples head which manipulates their mind into believing something that is false about God. That is a sin I would guess you would go to hell for because the ultimate sin is to control free will and by adding that little sentence completely changes the whole reason for why jesus died.
FREE will can't be controled.
Before the generation which sees the "fig tree" put forth it's bud.
That fig tree was always Israel and that generation is still with us.
The "some" here who will live to see the kingdom are the ones who saw Jesus transfigured on the mount and they did see the kingdom, but that is not the same as the promise of His second coming.
You can "read" into it what you want but that's not what the KJV says.
So Jesus basically lives In everyone that is a good person or thinks the way he did willing to sacrifice your self for others. I do believe that and If I ever get to reach that level I will be forever greatfull not that I am not already but Jesus must have had a very good conciousness or clear or set because in order to have a strong connection with god you must free your mind and surender your body.
I am a good person. More so than Jesus was, according to the KJV.
Jesus did not sacrifice himself for me.
My mind IS free without absurd cruel fantasies. If MY body is MINE, there's no reason to surrender it to anyone.
:bugeye:
I know there is meaning in there somewhere. Maybe.
Do you think you are capable of reaching a level where you will "live in everyone"? Is that like the secret cow level?
If you do not believe in God I'm not going to waste my time explaining to you because you simply can't understand. (I didn't say won't or will you just can't)
According to the Holy Babble (Have you read it?), Jesus was a nasty, arrogant immoral ass.
Jesus never died but people killed him? Maybe you should sleep on that.
If someone dies and comes back to life that defeats the purpose of dying. Try sleeping now.
Challenger78
04-02-09, 05:09 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Messengers demanded better working conditions, since they were getting killed all the time.
I nearly asked if anyone can translate this then I saw where you left out periods & capitals.
FREE will can't be controled.
I am a good person. More so than Jesus was, according to the KJV.
Jesus did not sacrifice himself for me.
My mind IS free without absurd cruel fantasies. If MY body is MINE, there's no reason to surrender it to anyone.
Thanks for pointing out something that is not even a point.
Maybe free will can not be controlled fully but if you manipulate someones mind for your own benefit, even if that person is not very smart it is just as bad and you will burn in hell.
I do not know what KJV is. That is impossible because you have no belief in God and God is everything that is Good.
No he did not sacrifice himself for you. You have to earn your kudos in God's eyes and you will be judged on your thoughts and matter you have invested while you have lived your life on Earth.
Just because you don't believe in Evil does not mean it is not there. I don't think you understand what "surrendering your body" means, which is ok .
Bishadi
04-03-09, 09:35 AM
What are koranic and biblical time frames for the mehdi and second coming of Jesus? who knows? remember much of the old stuff is locked away in libraries.
Boy would i love to spend my life in them libraries!!!!!!!!
Jesus promised to return before the generation of his time was dead. He did not come. jesus said another would come (John 14:16)
Coming has been postponed so many times that nobody can believe it like the the boy who cried WOLF!!
that be a true representation
Bishadi
04-03-09, 09:42 AM
So Jesus basically lives In everyone that is a good person or thinks the way he did willing to sacrifice your self for others.
now step back and analyze that;
Darwin shared how species 'transmutated' and is the foundation of 'evolution'
are you aware of this? Then Darwin is alive in you!
That is what 'giving' is. He gave up his being accepted to pursue and define information as close to truth as possible; he submitted himself for the good of knowledge (for others).
Same with confucius, newton, jesus, moses, muhammad.... etc etc....
these contributers will live forever in the 'book of life' based on what they gave.............all grounded in THEIR CHOICE to "do" rather than follow
I do believe that and If I ever get to reach that level I will be forever greatfull not that I am not already but Jesus must have had a very good conciousness or clear or set because in order to have a strong connection with god you must free your mind and surender your body.
then be honest beyond belief
and then know truth as it reads upon your soul
then give to another, even if you are called a traitor; do what it right over being accepted!
that is good news........... (from a messenger)
Bishadi
04-03-09, 09:48 AM
According to the Holy Babble (Have you read it?), Jesus was a nasty, arrogant immoral ass.
sounds like my kind of guy...........
Jesus never died but people killed him? Maybe you should sleep on that.
i don't believe he was dead when taken down from the cross, personally.
2 items; first if he was dead and came back, why not go to the king and rabbi's and show them; 'hey guys, you can't kill me, listen and live"
but that didn't happen, instead he hid; even so much as he changed his appearance, as his own gang could not recognize him at first.
second item; be certin; he lives in our 'understanding'
such as you still talking about him............. after 2k yrs!
the life of someone is not just breathing; it is what we do and leave, while breathing that makes us special.
We have the choice to 'do'........ that lives beyond our period of being awake.
that is what the missing item is within pure understanding; the comprehension of what 'life' is....
now step back and analyze that;
Darwin shared how species 'transmutated' and is the foundation of 'evolution'
are you aware of this? Then Darwin is alive in you!
That is what 'giving' is. He gave up his being accepted to pursue and define information as close to truth as possible; he submitted himself for the good of knowledge (for others).
Same with confucius, newton, jesus, moses, muhammad.... etc etc....
these contributers will live forever in the 'book of life' based on what they gave.............all grounded in THEIR CHOICE to "do" rather than follow
then be honest beyond belief
and then know truth as it reads upon your soul
then give to another, even if you are called a traitor; do what it right over being accepted!
that is good news........... (from a messenger)
I agree, I just used Jesus because he is more known and an easier example.
Kind of like loving God is wrong than I don't want to be right.
Bishadi
04-03-09, 01:28 PM
I agree, I just used Jesus because he is more known and an easier example.
Kind of like loving God is wrong than I don't want to be right.
just be fair and honest with yourself and reality and screw what anyone thinks of you.
Jesus was a great teacher, but he sure wasn't the last one nor coming back.
them are beliefs and 'we the people' need to keep our feet flat on the ground so the next generation has the chance you and i did not
just be fair and honest with yourself and reality and screw what anyone thinks of you.
Jesus was a great teacher, but he sure wasn't the last one nor coming back.
them are beliefs and 'we the people' need to keep our feet flat on the ground so the next generation has the chance you and i did not
Hahaha very true. There is a reason why when a man loves a woman they have a child to devote their love and teachings to that child. That child can learn something that they learned at an older age and will have a head start in life and be someone that will be greater than... well thats for him to find out :)
lightgigantic
04-03-09, 06:48 PM
FREE will can't be controled.
but it's expression can certainly be curtailed to particular environments by implementing consequences
:D
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-04-09, 06:13 AM
According to the KJV, Jesus was obviously not a great teacher.
Bishadi
04-04-09, 06:45 AM
According to the KJV, Jesus was obviously not a great teacher.
then what was He?
apparently the KJV is quite strange in many respects, for example i remember a kid once asking;
"if Jesus dies for our sins, then what happens now; He didn't stay dead?"
Bishadi
04-04-09, 06:48 AM
Hahaha very true. There is a reason why when a man loves a woman they have a child to devote their love and teachings to that child. That child can learn something that they learned at an older age and will have a head start in life and be someone that will be greater than... well thats for him to find out :)
as well when you return to the soil, your life still continues in that child.
Making babies is making for a longer life, especially if you are giving knowledge and lessons for them to hopefully learn from.
:cool:
Its a little known fact that the rapture happened just as Jesus predicted, "with in a generation," but god had significantly goofed on his math. While he picked up 144,000 pure souls, Satan picked up everybody else.
Armageddon was short with Satan victorious this time almost immediately.
Satan went on to heaven and the earth was abandoned in limbo where it has been ever since.
Any way, except for occasional jokes like Mohammad, that's why no more messengers.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-05-09, 08:41 AM
“ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa
According to the KJV, Jesus was obviously not a great teacher. ”
then what was He?
For 1 thing, like you, he was quite an obfuscator.
Bishadi
04-05-09, 10:06 AM
“ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa
According to the KJV, Jesus was obviously not a great teacher. ”
For 1 thing, like you, he was quite an obfuscator.
standing on a corner is not my style
i can talk to more folk, address more questions and have more resources available to me than Jesus, moses, muhammad, confucius einstein newton and darwin combined; at my finger tips at any moment.
i know what combines mankind, enables each to know life, and the foundation of world Peace within a tangible frame of reality.
problem is, the ground floor is the toughest neighborhood as much of the crap from others rolls down hill. Whether it be the religious or the scientific arena; both camps are in for an awakening, and it is me imposing across the globe.
that be a ripley's :D
I was visited by the angel Gabriel last night whilst outside looking through my telescope. Apparently, god wants me to be the next messenger. The old covenants and the Quran are to be discarded entirely for a new message to all mankind and I will be it's deliverer.
Is there any reason whatsoever why you wouldn't believe me?
superstring01
04-05-09, 12:16 PM
Is there any reason whatsoever why you wouldn't believe me?
Well... ahem... there's that whole "you're an atheist" thingy. ;)
~String
Bishadi
04-05-09, 12:25 PM
I was visited by the angel Gabriel last night whilst outside looking through my telescope. Apparently, god wants me to be the next messenger. The old covenants and the Quran are to be discarded entirely for a new message to all mankind and I will be it's deliverer.
Is there any reason whatsoever why you wouldn't believe me?
can you define life?
meaning can you offer knowledge that is grounded in science, religions and philosophies that can assist each person to comprehend 'what life is' and what the choices of 'good and bad' are equal to all three disciplines?
i already know you can't walk on water; but if gabby was bending your ear, then you best know that material or you could not be a person to 'give life'....for the minds of mankind, equality and Peace.
eg......that is how you will know when the absolute is pure; it gives life.
p/s...... do you know the 'name'?
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-05-09, 12:29 PM
Well, there you have it!
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-05-09, 12:33 PM
The Great Obfuscator has spoken!
Well... ahem... there's that whole "you're an atheist" thingy. ;)
~String
Wouldn't my coming be all the more credible? An atheist turned gods messenger?
can you define life?
meaning can you offer knowledge that is grounded in science, religions and philosophies that can assist each person to comprehend 'what life is' and what the choices of 'good and bad' are equal to all three disciplines?
I offer gods message, that is all.
Bishadi
04-05-09, 01:45 PM
hey who pulled the post?
at least send me a copy so i have a reference
please
as now i can't even review the handy work
dadburnit
Kalki is not supposed to be a prophet, but next Incarnate of Vishnu. While other religions do not provide a firm date for their next prophet, Kalki is slated to descend 427,000 years in future. pucca time frame.
2012- If the end of the world is then Thats 3 years. if Jesus died at the age of 23 or 24 (not exactly sure) someone who is around the ages of 20-22 could be the New Jesus unknowingly and Jesus will poses that body. Im not saying this is true its just another idea.
2012 is not far. But it depends on the prmise that Jesus died at 23 or 24. Suppose he died at 120 years of age, as is a tradition in the east, then? Will it be 2112?
Come 2012 and beyond, there will be explanations, all lame, why Jesus did not appear.
In 1900 years there have been scores of scares of Jesus returning.
lightgigantic
04-05-09, 08:31 PM
I offer gods message, that is all.
well come on spill the beans then
Its not like any great messenger waited until they had a majority following before they laid it out on the table
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-05-09, 09:57 PM
As usual, you miss the point.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-05-09, 10:00 PM
“ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa
“ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa
According to the KJV, Jesus was obviously not a great teacher. ”
For 1 thing, like you, he was quite an obfuscator. ”
standing on a corner is not my style
i can talk to more folk, address more questions and have more resources available to me than Jesus, moses, muhammad, confucius einstein newton and darwin combined; at my finger tips at any moment.
i know what combines mankind, enables each to know life, and the foundation of world Peace within a tangible frame of reality.
problem is, the ground floor is the toughest neighborhood as much of the crap from others rolls down hill. Whether it be the religious or the scientific arena; both camps are in for an awakening, and it is me imposing across the globe.
that be a ripley's
WHO said anything about standing on a corner? WHAT the heck are you babbling on about now?
well come on spill the beans then
Its not like any great messenger waited until they had a majority following before they laid it out on the table
Jesus was visited by 3 kings when he was born who deemed him the messiah. Muhammad recited over 23 years with Gabriel.
These things clearly take time.
But, I assure you, the message I give comes directly from god. To this you cannot deny.
lightgigantic
04-06-09, 07:07 PM
Q
Jesus was visited by 3 kings when he was born who deemed him the messiah. Muhammad recited over 23 years with Gabriel.
These things clearly take time.
IOW you are still a “work in progress”, eh?
But, I assure you, the message I give comes directly from god. To this you cannot deny.
meh
big difference between having a message and anticipating that one will
lightgigantic
04-06-09, 07:09 PM
As usual, you miss the point.
golly
almost as criminal as missing an opportunity to establish what one thinks the point is ....
:D
Benny Hinn. Enough said really.
And people just lap it up and hand over their money. He flies in a private jet and they're struggling to figure out how to not lose the house and put food on the table. Have to love Christianity.
You give so they may grow while you lose the roof over your head and starve your children. When you tell them of your plight, they fill you with joy by telling you they will pray over you.. Enter praise Jeebus phrases and babbling in tongues.. So you give him more money you do not have.. And you are now poorer than you were before, but you gave because God asked you to give to show just how much you "beeelliiieeevveeeee". And you believe and fork it over.
At the end of the day, you're poorer, they're going home in a private jet and a limo. Who is the bigger fool?
Q is the annointed one!
Death to the unbelievers!
Q
IOW you are still a “work in progress”, eh?
meh
big difference between having a message and anticipating that one will
That is not for you to worry about, only that a message is forthcoming and I will deliver it.
To this, you have no reason not to believe as you are commanded by your god to accept my message.
Do you deny your god's commands?
Bishadi
04-07-09, 10:27 AM
That is not for you to worry about, only that a message is forthcoming and I will deliver it.
then what's the message?
is it for sale?
To this, you have no reason not to believe as you are commanded by your god to accept my message.
Do you deny your god's commands?
which god?
are you talking about the 'misfits' and all 613 of them?
the 10 from moses?
the four nobel truths of the fat man?
perhaps the injeel (6 commands of Jesus)?
what commands oh mighty salami? (abe...normel)
Bishadi
04-07-09, 10:34 AM
Q is the annointed one!
Death to the unbelievers!
i don't believe in anything annoited as rituals are for the ducks and quacks.
what is an unbeliever?
is it the Q-swarm of the abenormal brains in a jar? I thought most of them are in churches, synagogues and mosques; kissing the dirt, on their knees begging, and lying to keep up with the jones's.
i remember learning in church that with enough money, i can buy a better seat.
How much to get into the front row?
and why does the guy on the cross look like me?
Q is the annointed one!
And you just figured that out ? :spank:
You better start praying.. hard !
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 06:34 PM
That is not for you to worry about, only that a message is forthcoming and I will deliver it.
At this point you even stand distinct from a postman, what to speak of an enlightened messenger, due to your lack of goods
To this, you have no reason not to believe as you are commanded by your god to accept my message.
er .... problem is that you don't have a message
Do you deny your god's commands?
Not at all, but I could ask you the same thing
Plenty of god's demands deal specifically with those who claim to be knowledgeable of him
:D
Did God give anyone here a purpose on this earth?
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 07:23 PM
Did God give anyone here a purpose on this earth?
in as much as our purpose arises from our nature .... why yes. He gives it to everyone.
in as much as our purpose arises from our nature .... why yes. He gives it to everyone.
More as in for when the world will end.
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 07:36 PM
More as in for when the world will end.
Then I guess we can move on to understanding how the (eventual) end of the world (or at the very least, death visits everyone equally) plays a part in determining our purpose.
Then I guess we can move on to understanding how the (eventual) end of the world (or at the very least, death visits everyone equally) plays a part in determining our purpose.
I mean what is it that everyone feels in their heart that their purpose is here until that day comes. I happen to feel very intune with my purpose.
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 07:48 PM
I mean what is it that everyone feels in their heart that their purpose is here until that day comes.
since we are all conditioned in a variety of ways, it tends to indicate there are a variety of purposes
I happen to feel very intune with my purpose.
Generally we have problems with the value systems of others, as opposed to our own value systems.
This says nothing about whether our values are ethically sound or not.
since we are all conditioned in a variety of ways, it tends to indicate there are a variety of purposes
Generally we have problems with the value systems of others, as opposed to our own value systems.
This says nothing about whether our values are ethically sound or not.
Yes i agree with the variety. It could range from a person just living a regular life with no significant purpose to someone who will actually influence others after death. (examples)
Everyone seems to have their own value system but is that the right one. I follow the value system of doing just over anything meaning by truth.
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 07:59 PM
Yes i agree with the variety. It could range from a person just living a regular life with no significant purpose to someone who will actually influence others after death. (examples)
Everyone seems to have their own value system but is that the right one. I follow the value system of doing just over anything meaning by truth.
Generally our values bear a relationship to what we consider "true". IOW what ever goes down as being "true" will be a yardstick for determining action.
For instance many people think that it is true that after death there is nothing, so acting as if this life is the all in all becomes the standard of action.
Generally our values bear a relationship to what we consider "true". IOW what ever goes down as being "true" will be a yardstick for determining action.
For instance many people think that it is true that after death there is nothing, so acting as if this life is the all in all becomes the standard of action.
I feel like I have build up enough value not in anyones eyes except for God. That value does show on this earth but to a certain extent. The value that I feel that runs through me is as of a King. Any ideas on this type of value?
lightgigantic
04-07-09, 08:20 PM
I feel like I have build up enough value not in anyones eyes except for God. That value does show on this earth but to a certain extent. The value that I feel that runs through me is as of a King. Any ideas on this type of value?
regardless of whatever value system we are talking about, a good safety measure is to have some means to validate it in the public arena .....
TheVisitor
04-07-09, 08:53 PM
The pot calls the kettle black.
I'm probably guilty there, you got me.
But I had been thinking my general outlook on things was getting a little "dark".
I'm really trying to work on that.
So...back to the topic, "Is God still sending messengers"?
Yes. More than ever. Sure He is.
The more important question would be...is anyone still listening, or more to the point is anyone still looking for truth?
God is also the one sending "strong delusion" to those who "received not a love of the truth".
He is anointing with the genuine Holy Spirit false messingers to decieve the whole world.
His Spirit falls on the just and unjust alike.
The Spirit on them is genuine, but the messingers themselves are false.
II THESSALONIANS 2:11-12
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Maybe we better look those messingers over pretty good and learn to judge what they are saying.
What then are you going to judge them by? The church? Your feelings or your own ideas?
You should judge what they say by the Word of God.
It might be important first they speak the truth, not just dazzle you with signs and wonders.
That would be my opinion anyway, just for the record.
GALATIANS 1:8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
I'm probably guilty there, you got me.
But I had been thinking my general outlook on things was getting a little "dark".
I'm really trying to work on that.
So...back to the topic, "Is God still sending messengers"?
Yes. More than ever. Sure He is.
The more important question would be...is anyone still listening, or more to the point is anyone still looking for truth?
You've got to see the big picture.
This will cook your goose.
God is also the one sending "strong delusion" to those who "received not a love of the truth".
He is anointing with the genuine Holy Spirit false messingers to decieve the whole world.
You see His Spirit falls on the just and unjust alike.
II THESSALONIANS 2:11-12
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
I must disagree quite strongly here with you. The scriptures do not say that the decievers would be anointed by the Holy Spirit. What the scriptures are saying is that those who reject the love of the truth God would cause them to be deluded so that they would accept the the decption that the great deciever will bring.
To say that the great deciever or his agents are anointed by the Holy Spirit is a very grave thing to say.
Maybe we better look those messingers over pretty good and learn to judge what they are saying.
What then are you going to judge them by? The church? Your feelings or your own ideas?
You should judge what they say by the Word of God.
It might be important first they speak the truth, not just dazzle you with signs and wonders.
That would be my opinion anyway, just for the record.
GALATIANS 1:8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
I agree. Not only did scriptures say what you quoted but it also says this.
2 Corinthians 11
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder! For satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.
So satan has transformed himself into an angel of light and his workers have masquraded as followers of Jesus. Not only this but in the end His workers will dazzle those given over to deception with lying signs and wonders.
2 Thessalonians 2
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
Only those who have trully accepted the Love of the truth will be guarded from the coming deception all the rest of the world will be won over to it like cattle to the slaughter. So great will be the power of this deception and so deluded will be those who have rejected the love of the truth.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Generally we have problems with the value systems of others, as opposed to our own value systems.
This says nothing about whether our values are ethically sound or not.
Exactly. Disagreement or disapproval are not yet proof of superiority or soundness.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-08-09, 12:46 AM
Generally our values bear a relationship to what we consider "true". IOW what ever goes down as being "true" will be a yardstick for determining action.
For instance many people think that it is true that after death there is nothing, so acting as if this life is the all in all becomes the standard of action.
Generally your values bare a relationship to what you & your mouse consider true which was, of course, revealed to you in The Dream Your Mouse Had Last Night in which your god ate your yardstick. Then your mouse told you many people think that it is true that after death there is something, so you act as if this life means nothing.
Did God give anyone here a purpose on this earth?
Sure! Every one who sails the sea gets a porpoise or four from time to time.
At this point you even stand distinct from a postman, what to speak of an enlightened messenger, due to your lack of goods
er .... problem is that you don't have a message
I will have a message, which will be delivered to my disciples, and then after I'm dead, they will create a holy book, which will be the final word of god. You are in no position to question his word.
Not at all, but I could ask you the same thing
Plenty of god's demands deal specifically with those who claim to be knowledgeable of him
I have no direct knowledge of god, only of the angel who delivers his message. His message will be for all mankind, there will be no more religions in the world except one.
SkinWalker
04-08-09, 04:53 PM
Mod note: religious trolling and responses to religious trolling in this thread were deleted. The problem with hypothetical situations which demonstrate the faults and fallacy of theological positions is that the result is often the introduction of drive-by religionists looking to evangelize their superstitions.
Even if genuine messenger did pop up, they would throw him in the looney bin unless he started turning water into wine or some shit.
I totally agree--if Christ et. al. turns up today or whenever in future, he's either headed directly for the funny-farm and a lifetime of drug-treatment, or the alcohol companies will snaffle him and get the poor guy working for them 24/7.:D
lightgigantic
04-08-09, 06:29 PM
I will have a message, which will be delivered to my disciples, and then after I'm dead, they will create a holy book, which will be the final word of god. You are in no position to question his word.
I am in a position to either accept or reject your rain cheque.
I have no direct knowledge of god, only of the angel who delivers his message. His message will be for all mankind, there will be no more religions in the world except one.
nice
I guess such a non-effectual message will please even the atheists
Sure! Every one who sails the sea gets a porpoise or four from time to time.
What is so hard to believe that God gave me a purpose?
SkinWalker
04-08-09, 06:43 PM
What is so hard to believe that God gave me a purpose?
What good reason is there to believe such a singularly extraordinary claim? Not only is there no good reason to believe your particular god exists, let alone any other, there's the additional burden of demonstrating that you aren't simply delusional or lying.
What good reason is there to believe such a singularly extraordinary claim? Not only is there no good reason to believe your particular god exists, let alone any other, there's the additional burden of demonstrating that you aren't simply delusional or lying.
I know that you are not trying to offend anyone, but anyone that really believes in God should know that there is only one God and no other gods. Thats for the people that believe. The people that do not believe well I'm sure they believe in something else. Possibly Satan. I guess I do have to prove one of those things if I care enough about that. I was curious to see if anyone feels like I feel. If they feel like they are on this planet for a greater reason other than to have a good life. (nice house, nice car, wife/husband kids, so on)
This thread is called why did God stop sending messengers. I would assume people would talk about that rather than how God doesnt exist and there never was messangers.
SkinWalker
04-08-09, 08:50 PM
I know that you are not trying to offend anyone, Actually, I could be. But that's beside the point.
but anyone that really believes in God should know that there is only one God and no other gods. So, you're saying that believing in your god is a sufficient reason to discount other gods? Why couldn't the same be said for the believer in Quetzacoatl? Your creating a tautology and making a very fallacious argument. And you still haven't given any good reason to accept your god over any other.
The people that do not believe well I'm sure they believe in something else. Possibly Satan. This, too, is a fallacious assumption since a belief in the mythical god Satan is an implicit belief that the either the gods Yahweh or Allah exist. Therefore, not believing in your god (ostensibly Yahweh) implies that there is no reason to believe in that other Christian god, Satan.
This thread is called why did God stop sending messengers. I would assume people would talk about that rather than how God doesnt exist and there never was messangers.
The OP implies the reason, which is that the reason gods no longer send "messengers" is because humanity is enamored with mythology and appeals to the ancients -that the "messengers" of antiquity weren't messengers of gods at all, but, rather, messengers of cultural hegemonies, cult hierarchies, propagandists, or actualized and would-be rulers. Those who claim to be "messengers" of gods today are deemed crazies and loonies.
In order to defend the notion that messengers exist either today or in the past, one must first demonstrate that gods exist.
Actually, I could be. But that's beside the point.
So, you're saying that believing in your god is a sufficient reason to discount other gods? Why couldn't the same be said for the believer in Quetzacoatl? Your creating a tautology and making a very fallacious argument. And you still haven't given any good reason to accept your god over any other.
This, too, is a fallacious assumption since a belief in the mythical god Satan is an implicit belief that the either the gods Yahweh or Allah exist. Therefore, not believing in your god (ostensibly Yahweh) implies that there is no reason to believe in that other Christian god, Satan.
The OP implies the reason, which is that the reason gods no longer send "messengers" is because humanity is enamored with mythology and appeals to the ancients -that the "messengers" of antiquity weren't messengers of gods at all, but, rather, messengers of cultural hegemonies, cult hierarchies, propagandists, or actualized and would-be rulers. Those who claim to be "messengers" of gods today are deemed crazies and loonies.
In order to defend the notion that messengers exist either today or in the past, one must first demonstrate that gods exist.
Im only going to comment on your last sentence because I see you like to make things difficult.
Im going to forgive you, because you simply don't know.
SkinWalker
04-08-09, 10:03 PM
Where's the comment on my last sentence?
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
1. why did GOD stop sending messengers?!!
R: because He was done, on the cross Jesus said, "it is finished"
Jesus was the Beginning, Jesus will be the End
Alpha & Omega
if we need anything more, then we're lost
Revelation 1 (New International Version)
8"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation
I am in a position to either accept or reject your rain cheque.
You only think you have a choice.
I am in a position to either accept or reject your rain cheque.
Your refusal to accept would demonstrate that it is in fact you who chooses a false religion to follow as opposed to obeying gods direct commands. You are in no position to choose against god.
I guess such a non-effectual message will please even the atheists
You are now demonstrating your bias towards that which you still don't know. It demonstrates again your choice towards a religion as opposed to obeying gods commands.
The message will be for all mankind, atheists included.
Im only going to comment on your last sentence because I see you like to make things difficult.
Difficult because you are unable to answer or difficult because there is no reasonable answer for you to offer?
Are you unaware of the many religions in the world?
What is so hard to believe that God gave me a purpose?
Simple, the fact that you are unable to fulfill that purpose.
Where's the comment on my last sentence?
If you do not know than you are not ready to know.
Bishadi
04-09-09, 09:39 PM
If you do not know than you are not ready to know.
my kind of thinking.... :p
do you like other line items to think on too?
"if existence only operates ONE way, the math is the 'name' to know."
SkinWalker
04-09-09, 09:48 PM
If you do not know than you are not ready to know.
If you sent it "psychically," I hope you aren't surprised that it didn't arrive. Surely you aren't suggesting that this is the comment: Im going to forgive you, because you simply don't know.
That's not a comment, its a cop-out. Its saying, "I'm clueless and haven't a chance in a rational discussion."
Depends on what you consider a messenger.
EmptyForceOfChi
04-10-09, 06:14 PM
He did not stop sending messengers.
peace.
Remember when you see god's messengers to give them a buck.
And no its not your business if they use it to buy more sacrificial wine.
If you sent it "psychically," I hope you aren't surprised that it didn't arrive. Surely you aren't suggesting that this is the comment:
That's not a comment, its a cop-out. Its saying, "I'm clueless and haven't a chance in a rational discussion."
If you don't believe in God, I'm sorry you still don't know.
my kind of thinking.... :p
do you like other line items to think on too?
"if existence only operates ONE way, the math is the 'name' to know."
Lol. I never was too good at math :P.
SkinWalker
04-11-09, 04:07 PM
If you don't believe in God, I'm sorry you still don't know.
This is a cop out. A convenient way to avoid having to answer legitimate questions and inquiry.
Medicine*Woman
04-12-09, 09:41 AM
*************
M*W: God stopped sending messengers, because the message is, there is no god.
then what's the message?
is it for sale?
which god?
are you talking about the 'misfits' and all 613 of them?
the 10 from moses?
the four nobel truths of the fat man?
perhaps the injeel (6 commands of Jesus)?
what commands oh mighty salami? (abe...normel)
God has sent out 124,000 messengers and prophets. Why would you not believe I am one of them?
Bishadi
04-12-09, 10:54 AM
God has sent out 124,000 messengers and prophets. are you sure?
Why would you not believe I am one of them?
because the comment above is speculative in the sense, i bet you could not name a tenth of the number you posted and what their contributions were
and no messenger would be so lose with non-sense
i asked you to define 'life'
if you cannot enable us (mankind) to comprehend life, then you not much of a letter boy
to me, that is the only real importance left to be shared
but of course, i am always open to learn something
what can you teach us, oh mighty salami.................
Bishadi
04-12-09, 10:56 AM
Lol. I never was too good at math :P.
but i am and with the last word;
i will asure you; Peace has been born!
are you sure?
According to scriptures.
because the comment above is speculative in the sense, i bet you could not name a tenth of the number you posted and what their contributions were
and no messenger would be so lose with non-sense
i asked you to define 'life'
if you cannot enable us (mankind) to comprehend life, then you not much of a letter boy
That is completely irrelevant to the topic and the claim.
to me, that is the only real importance left to be shared
but of course, i am always open to learn something
what can you teach us, oh mighty salami.................
It would appear you're not interested in learning a single thing. Your mind is closed and you resort to insult.
However, the new message from god will see you get all you deserve.
CptBork
04-12-09, 05:29 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Oh, but there are many messengers today, far more than ever before in mankind's history! The difference is, these days we're knowledgeable enough to recognize their symptoms and have them sent to the phunny pharm right away, before they have a chance to harm themselves and others.
Bishadi
04-12-09, 08:15 PM
According to scriptures. thanks for sharing your 'source'
i asked you;
i asked you to define 'life'
if you cannot enable us (mankind) to comprehend life, then you not much of a letter boy
because you claim to be God's messenger and your answer was
That is completely irrelevant to the topic and the claim.
seems kind of insulting to just brush people off, oh letter boy
It would appear you're not interested in learning a single thing. Your mind is closed and you resort to insult.
when a person like you steps into a thread and says yu the messenger from God, then i have a right to expect answers
and when i ask the most important question, that every single human ever born has wanted to know; then either step up or go read another book (cuz you not ready, salami)
However, the new message from god will see you get all you deserve.
i live it; what i deserve
i live it; what i deserve
Ah, the irony.
thanks for sharing your 'source'
i asked you;
i asked you to define 'life'
if you cannot enable us (mankind) to comprehend life, then you not much of a letter boy
because you claim to be God's messenger and your answer was
seems kind of insulting to just brush people off, oh letter boy
I'm not here to answer your questions, I'm here to deliver gods message.
when a person like you steps into a thread and says yu the messenger from God, then i have a right to expect answers
No, you don't. You have only the right to obey gods commands.
and when i ask the most important question, that every single human ever born has wanted to know; then either step up or go read another book (cuz you not ready, salami)
That is not the reason I'm here. You may find your answers in gods message or you may not. It is irrelevant to the message offered.
i live it; what i deserve
For now.
Jan Ardena
04-13-09, 01:35 PM
Bishadi,
when a person like you steps into a thread and says yu the messenger from God, then i have a right to expect answers
No, you don't. You have only the right to obey gods commands.
Bishadi, can you see the complete lack of understanding on the part of (Q)?
jan.
Bishadi, can you see the complete lack of understanding on the part of (Q)?
Please explain? You have the floor. I am all ears to hear your explanation.
More unproductive bullshit, flaming theists
More unproductive bullshit, flaming theists
I'm sure you can explain why you chose one self-appointed messenger from god over another?
Please share?
Jan Ardena
04-13-09, 05:01 PM
Please explain? You have the floor. I am all ears to hear your explanation.
I directed my question to Bishadi, so his response is necessary.
We have discussed your lack of understanding a good number of
times, and see no need to go there in this thread.
jan.
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
Remember, in the Bible (KJV) there are gods and one of these is satan who also sends his messengers. If you are mentioning about the God who sent prophets as messengers, then He has sent one from the East. And he is now on the WEST preaching the everlasting Gospel of Christ.
Bishadi
04-14-09, 08:01 AM
Bishadi,
Bishadi, can you see the complete lack of understanding on the part of (Q)?
jan.
Jan, even you and i have differences but the Q is having his own fun.
The selfish are just that 'selfish'
you will know the 'good' ones by what they do, not what they believe.
remember the rules;
good: supports life to continue
bad: loss to the common
He be imposing bad, by choice.
Not my life dying on the vine!
Jan Ardena
04-14-09, 08:48 AM
Jan, even you and i have differences but the Q is having his own fun.
The selfish are just that 'selfish'
you will know the 'good' ones by what they do, not what they believe.
remember the rules;
good: supports life to continue
bad: loss to the common
He be imposing bad, by choice.
Not my life dying on the vine!
So you can then. :)
Just checking. ;)
jan.
Jan, even you and i have differences but the Q is having his own fun.
Yes, it is fun to watch the religiously deluded wriggle around uncomfortably trying to come up with explanations.
remember the rules;
good: supports life to continue
bad: loss to the common
He be imposing bad, by choice.
Did you make those rules up? :rolleyes:
What has been demonstrated in this thread is how theists are so indoctrinated into their cults, they not only would never acknowledge another messenger from their god, but would castigate that person in the same way their current messengers were treated.
They themselves have become that which they most despise.
Bishadi
04-14-09, 09:02 AM
Yes, it is fun to watch the religiously deluded wriggle around uncomfortably trying to come up with explanations.
Me not relgious as i need not use beliefs to over-ride truth
the only explanation that fits your cause is 'selfishness'
which is the same reason most every 'evil' or 'bad' even exists
Did you make those rules up? :rolleyes:
actually.................. yes
i just shared what is observed in my own words (contributing)
almost like what injeel is but even better; pure to all existence, nature, mankind and GOD!
as nothing is greater than the 'continuance of life'
where-as it is easy to see how the selfish 'lie' to sustain their beliefs
Me not relgious as i need not use beliefs to over-ride truth
the only explanation that fits your cause is 'selfishness'
which is the same reason most every 'evil' or 'bad' even exists
You've provided evidence for my assertion. I claim to be a messenger from god and you label me evil and bad.
actually.................. yes
Then, they are rather pointless rules relevant only to your opinion.
Bishadi
04-14-09, 12:21 PM
You've provided evidence for my assertion. I claim to be a messenger from god and you label me evil and bad.
actually, it is you who is doing what is bad/evil. Meaning, it is your choice, not mine.
You are stating you are the messenger but fail to convey the truth as what is the single most important question equal to ALL MANKIND (God's children)
And that question is; 'what is life?'
That is how anyone can see the truth behind your professing to be a messenger. You are focused on YOU, and not contributing to the knowledge of 'we the people' as a species.
Saying you are conveying God's word must be equal to ALL MANKIND; not just your mankind.
Then, they are rather pointless rules relevant only to your opinion.
my opinion is not the one that matters; it is 'we the people' (all of us)
what i shared was what i have learned; if it don't work for you, then that is your choice. (seems to me, anyone could recognize it is common sense; as soon as the words are comprehended)
but you missing the point all together; you said you were GOD's messenger, and i asked a question, to qualify you, that would allow any human being on earth to see for themselves if your statement is true.
Meaning; to be the true messenger, then you could define 'life' for all of us!
Otherwise; you creating another tangent, that is literally a 'loss to the common'..... such that to follow it, is a waste of resources based on your choice to impose 'selfishly.'
What i said, is simple reasoning anyone can use as food for thought!
What message do you have that is beyond what anyone can read anywhere left by others?
:shrug:
actually, it is you who is doing what is bad/evil. Meaning, it is your choice, not mine.
You are stating you are the messenger but fail to convey the truth as what is the single most important question equal to ALL MANKIND (God's children)
And that question is; 'what is life?'
That is how anyone can see the truth behind your professing to be a messenger. You are focused on YOU, and not contributing to the knowledge of 'we the people' as a species.
Complete nonsense. I am focusing on delivering gods message. Your personal questions are irrelevant. I don't know how many times I have to tell you that.
Saying you are conveying God's word must be equal to ALL MANKIND; not just your mankind.
That's what I said, all mankind.
my opinion is not the one that matters; it is 'we the people' (all of us)
The people will have the message delivered to them. That is all that is relevant.
but you missing the point all together; you said you were GOD's messenger, and i asked a question, to qualify you, that would allow any human being on earth to see for themselves if your statement is true.
No, you are missing point. Your inquiries are irrelevant to gods message. Please try to understand that.
Meaning; to be the true messenger, then you could define 'life' for all of us!
What you care to know or ask is irrelevant to the delivery of gods message. Please try to understand that.
What message do you have that is beyond what anyone can read anywhere left by others?
That will be determined in the message, and that is all you need to know.
Bishadi
04-14-09, 12:49 PM
Complete nonsense. I am focusing on delivering gods message. Your personal questions are irrelevant. I don't know how many times I have to tell you that.
because to you God is YOUR GOD, not everyone's God.
Meaning: you don't care about the souls and hearts of every person on earth, to you it is the picture you have in YOUR MIND.
That's what I said, all mankind.
well i am a man of the same kind..............
The people will have the message delivered to them. That is all that is relevant.
well that is not what the God of every religion on earth said to 'we the people'
From Rah, Thoth, Abram....thru to Jesus, Muhammed....all the buddha's, pahana and the remaining still upon the earth............ they all said a 'revealing' of some sort. 'Understanding' i believe is the most prevelant basis we can each apply to that can be enabled from that 'revealing'...
i remember a comment from some old movie, perhaps you remember it too?
'and the truth shall set you free'
That's what i am looking forward to! The foundation that will allow all of mankind the capability to think for themselves and it be true to God, existence, nature and all of us equally.
So i am a dreamer................
i only seek World Peace and believe that if each were aware of what life is, and what choices to make; i believe we as a species can know it, finally!
is there a line in this post that is wrong?
because to you God is YOUR GOD, not everyone's God.
It is everyone's god. Mine and yours.
Meaning: you don't care about the souls and hearts of every person on earth, to you it is the picture you have in YOUR MIND.
God has chosen me to deliver his message, hence my caring about souls and hearts is irrelevant.
is there a line in this post that is wrong?
Right or wrong, it is irrelevant to a message being delivered by god. Will you ever understand that?
I think you have it backwards (Q).
The prophets merely preached, it was upto the people whether they accepted or rejected them.
Many prophets were rejected in their lifetime. Perhaps you should write down your gospels for posterity. Your unfailing charm may work better in a posthumous state.
Diode-Man
04-14-09, 01:04 PM
Because God is using such advanced technology that it would blow your mind and you'd become an atheist like he is.
Bishadi
04-14-09, 01:07 PM
It is everyone's god. Mine and yours. OK... then giving of yourself for others, over yourself, is the greatest truth in every religion across the board. Kind of like what 'doing God's will' is all about.
Do you remember the commandments? if you read them, you will find not a one says it is OK to fib for God, no matter how much YOU love him.
Each of the Big 10 talks about being responsible for your actions. Kind of like what religions were started for; to super-impose an equal standard between all who submit.
So equality is huge in relevance to observing God.
That leads to 'that' question; EQUALLY, ever human born has wanted to know 'what life is,' and equally in most every religion, the message was stated a day would come that the 'revealing' would occur
so if you are representing the GOD of all mankind, then the only item left for God to enable is that "message of life"
hence, why i asked you the question! I was allowing you to be messiah!
The messenger everyone is awaiting is to 'give life' (see any revelation/prophecies) and that is what i am wishing for all. I would think you would too.
God has chosen me to deliver his message, hence my caring about souls and hearts is irrelevant.
and that tells me, you are not of the heart of God's children, but of your belief (what ever they may be)
Jan Ardena
04-14-09, 01:29 PM
What has been demonstrated in this thread is how theists are so indoctrinated into their cults, they not only would never acknowledge another messenger from their god, but would castigate that person in the same way their current messengers were treated.
They themselves have become that which they most despise.
Actually, what has been demonstrated is your complete lack of understanding
of anything which requires deep thought.
The funny thing is, you can't see it, but the sad thing is, it is an increasingly popular trend.
jan.
Saquist
04-14-09, 02:49 PM
Many messengers co existed in the past! and they lived in an empty earth compared to now!
Strange!
The Biblical Answer.
God's prophets had the specific purpose of serving the Nation of Israel. He knew the Kings that the jews wanted would eventually stray from the covenant the fore fathers agreed to and so the Prophets were the voice of God to sent to set them straight. Even by the time of John the Baptizer prophets were silent untill him and Jesus came on the seen. Why?
The Jews had become obstinate which is what got them in captivity with the Romans in the first place. Jesus was the prophet to deliver them just as they had been delievered before and they knew he was the foretold deliverer because the prophecies pointed precisely to that time, place and even what he would do. Jerusalem had come into the habit of stoning it's prophets. As a result the last prophet God sent to man, his son, was killed, while this was fortold it did not have to happend by the hand of the Jews.
This action broke the covenant between God and Israel.
Israel was to be an ambassador to the other nations for God.
What If The Jews Were Faithful?
If Israel would not have broken it's Covenant Israel would be litteraly be representing God to the nations of the Earth in a way like has never been seen. Likely we would have more than evident demostration that God not only exist but is irresistable. God's covenant with Israel was that he would protect them, as a nation. Most like Israel would be the most powerful nation on the Earth today IF God saw fit for man to continue down to this same time. That's 2000 more years, though it's likely God would not have waited but brought the end of wickedness on the Earth "shortly" after Israel defeated Rome. They would have preached the word of God to the Planet while exemplifying that word in the power and presence of the Nation of Israel.
But that didn't happen.
Israel Failed. God cursed the land there, saying, it would know no peace. And it hasn't for the last 2,000 years. Instead he allowed Israel to be destroyed and purposed a few to survive and bring forth a nationless group that would do the same job of taking the word to the nations of Earth.
So Christians were never meant to control other nations like America, England and Austrailia. But it was obvious that it would happen once the message was wide spread.
Corrected for Spelling and Grammar:
I think you have it backwards (Q).
The prophets merely preached, it was upto the people whether they accepted or rejected them.
I have nothing backwards, Sam. I am a messenger, not a prophet.
Yeah
Risala = message
Rasul= messenger
Rasullullah = messenger of God
Mohammad ul Rasullulah = Mohammad, messenger of God
The messenger everyone is awaiting is to 'give life' (see any revelation/prophecies) and that is what i am wishing for all. I would think you would too.
Again, whatever notions, questions or hypotheses you have are irrelevant to the message I will bring. Prepare yourself to accept gods commands.
Mohammad ul Rasullulah = Mohammad, messenger of God
So does "Mohammad, messenger of Dog" work in arabic?
Israel Failed.
So God failed. They are his chosen after all.
Also Jesus came for the Jews. Its Saul who said the gentiles could play too.
I would say if you go around dissing his chosen people god's gonna kick your ass.
So God failed. They are his chosen after all.
Also Jesus came for the Jews. Its Saul who said the gentiles could play too.
I would say if you go around dissing his chosen people god's gonna kick your ass.
God never fails for one. What you say is pure dog shit. No Jesus came for the jews to teach them some manners and not to manipulate people for money. The jews killed Jesus because they refused to do what he said. They wanted to make their own rules because they thought their shit don't stink. Well when Jesus does come back, hes coming back for vengence. Little tip for you my friend. Do you really think God is going to forgive them for what they did. God forgives, but he will not forgive them.
Mr. Hamtastic
04-18-09, 04:11 PM
Maybe God had other things to do. I mean, those heavenly quiches take forever!
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-18-09, 08:58 PM
God never fails for one.
That's your ridiculous claim.
What you say is pure dog shit. No Jesus came for the jews to teach them some manners and not to manipulate people for money. The jews killed Jesus because they refused to do what he said. They wanted to make their own rules because they thought their shit don't stink. Well when Jesus does come back, hes coming back for vengence. Little tip for you my friend. Do you really think God is going to forgive them for what they did. God forgives, but he will not forgive them.
You need a few lessons in manners. Your biASS is showing.
According to The Holy Babble, the Romans killed Jesus.
Big tip for you, Jesus wasn't the Messiah & he isn't coming back.
God never fails for one. What you say is pure dog shit. No Jesus came for the jews to teach them some manners and not to manipulate people for money. The jews killed Jesus because they refused to do what he said. They wanted to make their own rules because they thought their shit don't stink. Well when Jesus does come back, hes coming back for vengence. Little tip for you my friend. Do you really think God is going to forgive them for what they did. God forgives, but he will not forgive them.
Your god has failed you miserably. He's left you without the ability to think and only to follow blindly to regurgitate myths and superstitions.
Bishadi
04-19-09, 09:35 AM
Wow!
You post this
I have nothing backwards, Sam. I am a messenger, not a prophet.
then i personally ask you "what message" and can you assist mankind in understanding life
and all you do is rant with exactly what you are condemning others of
Your god has failed you miserably. He's left you without the ability to think and only to follow blindly to regurgitate myths and superstitions.
then i personally ask you "what message" and can you assist mankind in understanding life
You appear not to be reading my posts where I keep saying to you over and over that your personal inquiries to god are irrelevant to a message for all mankind.
and all you do is rant with exactly what you are condemning others of
And, you keep falling into the same trap, demonstrating time and again the very point I've been making that you've been oblivious.
:D
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-19-09, 10:08 AM
:roflmao:
:roflmao:
So does "Mohammad, messenger of Dog" work in arabic?
Sure. We try to be inclusive of lesser individuals.:p
Bishadi
04-19-09, 11:38 AM
You appear not to be reading my posts where I keep saying to you over and over that your personal inquiries to god are irrelevant to a message for all mankind.
then tell your ego; you've been fired!
If a messenger can't define its message, then we find YOU lied on your application.
And, you keep falling into the same trap, demonstrating time and again the very point I've been making that you've been oblivious.
:D
You have no point as demonstrated 'time and again'............
it's just a case of watching the 'go-go ego' of your ranting.
a bonafide 'troll'
(hvat's troll nema ₫at?)
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-19-09, 11:56 AM
Turnabout isn't fair play.
Saquist
04-19-09, 03:38 PM
So God failed. They are his chosen after all.
Also Jesus came for the Jews. Its Saul who said the gentiles could play too.
I would say if you go around dissing his chosen people god's gonna kick your ass.
Neither the Greek Scriptures or the Hebrew Aramaic make any sort of connection between being chosen and sucessful or perfect. In other words there is no cause and effect relationship implied implicitly or explicitly. This means it is merely perception that leads those to the conclusion that God failed.
The failure is proven to be in the hands of those that commit the offending actions.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-19-09, 03:42 PM
God committed the offending actions.
it didn't, ever and what the messengers brought is alive and well al lover the world
just because you don't live in a time when messengers from Above are revealing themselves does not mean it has stopped sending any
then tell your ego; you've been fired!
If a messenger can't define its message, then we find YOU lied on your application.
I'm not here to define anything for you, I'm to deliver a message from god. When will you get that through your head?
You have no point as demonstrated 'time and again'............
)
The point has been made quite clear, a message from god will be delivered. Surely, you must possess even the very limited remedial mental faculties to understand such a simple concept?
TheVisitor
04-19-09, 08:36 PM
I'm not here to define anything for you, I'm to deliver a message from god. When will you get that through your head?
The point has been made quite clear, a message from god will be delivered.
My, this all looks really familiar.
Where have I seen this before?
It's like that skateboard scene in the "Back to the Future" movies.
I don't know how this is going to end up but I'm all ears.
God never fails for one.
God fails all over the place.
No Jesus came for the Jews to teach them some manners and not to manipulate people for money. The Jews killed Jesus because they refused to do what he said. They wanted to make their own rules because they thought their shit don't stink. Well when Jesus does come back, hes coming back for vengeance.
Because Jesus taught an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, instead of forgiveness. Besides, the "Jews" didn't do anything to Jesus. At most, if he actually existed and the myths are the least accurate, a small subset of people in power did him in.
The Jews, not the gentiles, are god's chosen people and he's hardly going to abandon them. Jesus didn't come for the gentiles and until Saul started taking over the apostles required any gentiles to convert. That would be Peter. You remember him? The "rock" Jesus would build his church on? Well he sucked at church building and lost control to Saul who never met Jesus but decided all th stupid Jewish laws like whacking off your dick was slowing down recruitment of his chosen people - the gentiles like you.
Do you really think God is going to forgive them for what they did. God forgives, but he will not forgive them.
Don't be ridiculous. Don't you think he knew what would happen when he chose them in the beginning? He knew and chose them any way.
The only one who chose you was Saul. A note persecuter of true Jewish followers of Jesus.
to the conclusion that God failed.
Actually its the many failures which lead one to that conclusion.
It's like that skateboard scene in the "Back to the Future" movies.
I don't know how this is going to end up but I'm all ears.
Probably with a truckload of manure dumped all over you, Biff.
:D
Bishadi
04-20-09, 11:09 AM
I'm not here to define anything for you, I'm to deliver a message from god. When will you get that through your head?
so 'letter-boy'............ what's the message?
The point has been made quite clear, a message from god will be delivered.
then if you that person; spit it out
Surely, you must possess even the very limited remedial mental faculties to understand such a simple concept?
the remedy is you either have the conveyance or just a liar
not much to debate!
Bishadi
04-20-09, 11:23 AM
God fails all over the place. i was noting your response with that in mind
Because Jesus taught an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, instead of forgiveness.
Bull.............. the eye-eye item means; you are responsible. Take an eye, you should lose an eye; be responsible for your actions!
Forgiveness means; you get harmed by another; turn the utter cheek......that meant be a man, take the pain and DO NOT LET IT continue living in your actions. DO NOT react when harmed, forgive!
That is what Jesus was teaching on both fronts
The Jews, not the gentiles, are god's chosen people and he's hardly going to abandon them.
see this is where people get confused; the jews are not the chosen ones to do GOOD; they are the selfish who control babylon/babilu
they are who cause wwIII (just look around the world; just today, the West just hours ago walked out of the Iran talks; israel will pursue iran and kick off the first order)
perhaps understand what gentile means
The "rock" Jesus would build his church on? is supposed to be the 'mount' (meaning of word megiddo)
as many believed jesus was going to rebuild the temple on the mount
Well he sucked at church building and lost control to Saul who never met Jesus but decided all th stupid Jewish laws like whacking off your dick was slowing down recruitment of his chosen people - the gentiles like you. circumcision was started by moses who was clipped as an egyptian baby. (floated to pharoah's daughter as an infant; perhaps you forgot the story?)
clipped and dipped are rituals by mankind, not god
seems to me, you actually believe that dogma but have not actually read the literature
That's your ridiculous claim.
You need a few lessons in manners. Your biASS is showing.
According to The Holy Babble, the Romans killed Jesus.
Big tip for you, Jesus wasn't the Messiah & he isn't coming back.
Well you don't believe in God so why would he help you. (not a question)
Thanks but I have my 7 years from home. I actually have manners and morals of someone of highness.
Sorry the Romans did not kill Jesus the Jews did. That is why they will be punished...when the time comes.
When you will run out of answers trust me you will pray so hard that you wish you would have believed in God. If you get to live to see that day.
SnakeLord
04-20-09, 09:19 PM
When you will run out of answers trust me you will pray so hard that you wish you would have believed in God
1. Why is that? We're not talking about Zeus or some mean, nasty individual that would willingly and happily roast you on the barbecue but an all-loving, good entity. What is wrong with being wrong to such a degree that a person would "pray so hard" and make wishes? Out of interest, why would an apology for mortal mistakes not be enough for an all-loving being?
Of course I compare things with my own all-loving nature, (as far as my kids are concerned that is). The fact is, being an all-loving father, my kids don't even have to apologise and they certainly wouldn't be "praying so hard" for mortal crimes in an eternal existence.
2. Why should anyone "trust" you? Other than gleaning your beliefs concerning a god from the exact same place as everyone else, can you make claim to having any other specific knowledge that nobody else has? On what basis exactly do you demand trust?
God fails all over the place.
Because Jesus taught an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, instead of forgiveness. Besides, the "Jews" didn't do anything to Jesus. At most, if he actually existed and the myths are the least accurate, a small subset of people in power did him in.
The Jews, not the gentiles, are god's chosen people and he's hardly going to abandon them. Jesus didn't come for the gentiles and until Saul started taking over the apostles required any gentiles to convert. That would be Peter. You remember him? The "rock" Jesus would build his church on? Well he sucked at church building and lost control to Saul who never met Jesus but decided all th stupid Jewish laws like whacking off your dick was slowing down recruitment of his chosen people - the gentiles like you.
Don't be ridiculous. Don't you think he knew what would happen when he chose them in the beginning? He knew and chose them any way.
The only one who chose you was Saul. A note persecuter of true Jewish followers of Jesus.
God fails in your eyes because you can't understand anything above your capability to understand another humans position. You are too weak of a human with a very weak point of view. You only believe what you want to believe, even if it is a lie. You give into it.
That second paragraph you wrote is bs. I don't think you were thinking at all when you typed it. Wrong. The jews killed him and then rewrote the bible with stories, not the way Jesus said it.
Call it what you want to call it. I know they will burn in hell. You do not need to reassure me of this, but I appreciate your try.
He wanted to give them a chance I suppose, he is God. He is merciful, kind, and of hope. Was it wrong for God to send someone to teach some "manners" to the jews, so that maybe one day maybe they can redeem their souls and go to heaven. They did not learn from the mistake of killing a person like Jesus, what can change them in this world??? Nothing, they have no hope.
Actually God chose me to be here at this time on Earth because I have a certain function/purpose to perfrom. That person you speak of has nothing to do with me.
Saquist
04-20-09, 10:22 PM
Actually its the many failures which lead one to that conclusion.
Well swarm when one takes two premeises of information for syllogistic results it is expected that there is a direct line of logic.
You propose that 1. If God created man. and 2. That we are flawed then thus God created a flawed design. This is thus a logical fallacy. Firstly you're ignoring the scriptures which explicitly detail that man was blameless but even more shocking on a science forum you have just commited yourself to non sequitor.
Your source says the design was not flawed.
If you do not use that source you can not logically prove or propose that it started off flawed without a direct link or a point of origin.
I think you're just being hostile for hostilities sake.
So I'll leave you to it.
Saquist
04-20-09, 10:24 PM
1. Why is that? We're not talking about Zeus or some mean, nasty individual that would willingly and happily roast you on the barbecue but an all-loving, good entity. What is wrong with being wrong to such a degree that a person would "pray so hard" and make wishes? Out of interest, why would an apology for mortal mistakes not be enough for an all-loving being?
Of course I compare things with my own all-loving nature, (as far as my kids are concerned that is). The fact is, being an all-loving father, my kids don't even have to apologise and they certainly wouldn't be "praying so hard" for mortal crimes in an eternal existence.
2. Why should anyone "trust" you? Other than gleaning your beliefs concerning a god from the exact same place as everyone else, can you make claim to having any other specific knowledge that nobody else has? On what basis exactly do you demand trust?
Great Scott, I can't condone a single thing he said.
It was arrogant. Go get him.
SnakeLord
04-20-09, 10:46 PM
The jews killed him
With due respect but I can't quite work out where the hissy fit is coming from. We know that god himself came to forgive mankind for their sins. The only way to forgive mankind was the sacrifice of a perfect being, (jesus). Hence.. how could you blame jews or anyone else - it was a specific god willed event that had to happen. If the jews hadn't have said to the romans: kill this man, then jesus, (aka god), wouldn't have died and you'd still be unforgiven and of about the same value as dog scum. Frankly you should be either: A) thanking the jews or romans or B) accepting that it was god ordained and neither of those in A were actually responsible.
It was god's choice. He, in his infinite mercy, decided to come down and sacrifice himself so that you could be forgiven for all those nasty things you do - including that rather Nazi attitude of yours. Without the jews and romans, you'd be going to hell. Take a moment to think about it.
Bishadi
04-21-09, 01:39 PM
Without the jews and romans, you'd be going to hell. Take a moment to think about it.
heck i was thinking; "without the pharoahs daughter, judaism would not exist"
such as Moses was raised, clipped and taught as an egyptian.
The arc is an egyptian contraption to honor God(s)
Moses was born and within 2 months of birth raised egyptian.
He was who supposedly did the writing of the OT but not a single document exists of HIS hand (until the arc is found;then i bet it is in egyptian wording as he was taught as an egyptian child of the pharoahs house)
Moses talking to God was normal, because in egyptian times pharoahs were living gods and Moses lived in his house; talking to him all the time.
Judaism is a religion of Egypt, as with the root of their religion; 'the light' is the God of existence!
SnakeLord
04-21-09, 02:04 PM
I don't have any real quarrel with your post, (except perhaps to suggest that Moses was based upon Sargon), but I think it's getting somewhat beyond the purpose of my response and specifically who it was aimed at.
If this individual believes that god required a perfect sacrifice to forgive man for their sins, and that perfect sacrifice came in the form of jesus, then he has no basis with which to blame the jews or anyone else.
Bishadi
04-21-09, 02:54 PM
I don't have any real quarrel with your post, (except perhaps to suggest that Moses was based upon Sargon),
pharoahs of the time period: Rameses....... Perhaps look up the etymology (the son of Rah)
moses is the word derived from (the son of) without the Rah
If this individual believes that god required a perfect sacrifice to forgive man for their sins, and that perfect sacrifice came in the form of jesus, then he has no basis with which to blame the jews or anyone else.
God required no such thing!
As that line of beliefs was created. See the Aztecs as they believed the same thing and were considered monsters.
jesus did not die for your sins.
eg........ a kid once asked me: If Jesus was supposed to have died for our sins: what happens now? He didn't stay dead!
Jesus taught us the injeel (6 commands) and how TO forgive (turn the utter cheek)
but Ted Haggart and charles manson are perfect examples that nothing will undo a sin, no matter what you beg for or believe, because what you do lives in all of us. ( and God)
SnakeLord
04-21-09, 04:10 PM
pharoahs of the time period: Rameses....... Perhaps look up the etymology (the son of Rah)
moses is the word derived from (the son of) without the Rah
The Legend of Sargon dates 2279-2334 BC. In that, we see:
"... My changeling mother conceived me, in secret she bore me. She set me in a basket of rushes, with bitumen she sealed my lid. She cast me into the river, which rose not (over) me. The river bore me up and carried me to Akki, the drawer of water. Akki, the drawer of water lifted me out as he dipped his e[w]er. Akki the drawer of water, [took me] as his son (and) reared me."
In Exodus, (1250-1350), we see:
"... The woman conceived and gave birth to a son. She saw that he was good and she hid him for three months. She could not hide him any longer, so she took for him a wicker basket and smeared it with clay and pitch, she placed the child into it and placed it among the reeds at the bank of the river." Then Pharaoh's daughter saw the basket among the reeds. Later on the Bible says (Exodus 2:10), the boy grew up and she brought him to the daughter of Pharaoh and he was a son to her. She called his name Moses, as she said, " For I drew him from the water."
The name - although Egyptian in origin, comes from "[to] draw out" instead of 'son of' * (http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Moses.html)
The origin of the Moses story would most certainly seem to stem from Sargon. I was talking about the origin of the story, not the names used in later versions.
God required no such thing!
I never said that he did, indeed I don't even believe in gods. The guy I was responding to presumably does believe and does contend that the 'sacrifice' of jesus served as forgiveness for mankinds sins. In saying, he can't blame the jews.
With due respect but I can't quite work out where the hissy fit is coming from. We know that god himself came to forgive mankind for their sins. The only way to forgive mankind was the sacrifice of a perfect being, (jesus). Hence.. how could you blame jews or anyone else - it was a specific god willed event that had to happen. If the jews hadn't have said to the romans: kill this man, then jesus, (aka god), wouldn't have died and you'd still be unforgiven and of about the same value as dog scum. Frankly you should be either: A) thanking the jews or romans or B) accepting that it was god ordained and neither of those in A were actually responsible.
It was god's choice. He, in his infinite mercy, decided to come down and sacrifice himself so that you could be forgiven for all those nasty things you do - including that rather Nazi attitude of yours. Without the jews and romans, you'd be going to hell. Take a moment to think about it.
I don't think you realize that Jesus did not die for our sins. He died for a better cause. If you believe in God, what you have to understand is that you will be judged alone. These things include thoughts, actions, and faith. That is only if you believe. The jews were the ones that condemned him so it is their fault, not the roman soldier who stabed him with the spear in the end to make sure he was dead.
God does not take human form that is one. Second he did not want Jesus to be killed it just so happened that the jews wanted him dead because Jesus thaught them how to be a good person and they refused that. They denied (killed) one of the most important Prophets that has ever lived, for money. (profit) Nazi attitude lol. I do not give a f*** what you are. You do something wrong, bad, or evil it does not matter what color, race, or religion. You either burn in hell or you get to go to heaven in the end. In the end everything is ok, if it is not ok then it is not the end.
StrangerInAStrangeLa
04-22-09, 01:11 AM
As long as there is suffering, it is not OK.
turn the utter cheek......
Or as they say in Zen: Moo!
is supposed to be the 'mount'
Actually it was a pun on the word "Peter." Wow, you sure get points for just making shit up as you go.
God fails in your eyes because
He fails. Its just that simple. If he didn't there would be no hell.
The jews killed him and then rewrote the bible with stories, not the way Jesus said it.
Sure they did. Squeeze those eyes tighter shut.
I know they will burn in hell.
As you judge, so you have been judged. Welcome to hell.
Nothing, they have no hope.
Good, you have already abandoned all hope. You are ready to roll.
Actually God chose me to be here at this time on Earth because I have a certain function/purpose to perfrom.
Yes, you are what god calls the "cautionary tale." You are the bad example he sent to earth while on your way to hell to turn those who can be save from your chosen path.
Well swarm when one takes two premeises of information for syllogistic results it is expected that there is a direct line of logic.
You really should avoid words you don't understand.
You propose that 1. If God created man. and 2. That we are flawed then thus God created a flawed design. This is thus a logical fallacy.
God created man.
Man is flawed and he goes to hell because of it.
Creating something flawed requires either not succeeding because of a lack of skill or a lack of ability to impliment one's skill or purposefully choosing to fail.
Purposefully chosing to fail in a way that would send some one to hell is a mark of being evil.
So, ...
if god lacks skill then he is not omniscient
if god lacks the ability to impliment his skill he is not omnipotent.
if god purposefully chooses to fail to send man to hell he is evil
Any way you shake it God fails and hell is the mark of his failure.
SnakeLord
04-22-09, 08:41 AM
I don't think you realize that Jesus did not die for our sins.
Every individual christian and every sect of christianity has different versions of what's what. It is somewhat difficult for anyone to know in advance exactly what brand of christianity each specific christian adopts, (especially when their post is more of an anti-jew rant than a statement of belief). If you say this jesus guy didn't die for your sins, then ok - you can continue ranting against the jews. I'm uncertain why it would matter exactly but there you go.
He died for a better cause.
Apologies but this short statement has the implication the his death was intentional on his part. If it was his intention, why are you blaming the jews?
If you believe in God, what you have to understand is that you will be judged alone. These things include thoughts, actions, and faith
I don't but it isn't relevant to the point.
The jews were the ones that condemned him so it is their fault
Not if the death had a purpose that jesus intended to fulfill, (while you argued against my statement that the intention was to forgive mankind, you have since replaced it with another intention: 'for a better cause' [that would need some further explanation]). In both instances the outcome is that the death was a purposeful event on behalf of the victim. As such, one can't blame the jews - they were but a means to get to the intended result.
---
God does not take human form that is one
Second he did not want Jesus to be killed
it just so happened that the jews wanted him dead because Jesus thaught them how to be a good person and they refused that
I would be interested to see if you have any support for any of these statements.
Bishadi
04-22-09, 12:36 PM
The Legend of Sargon dates 2279-2334 BC. In that, we see: legends don't make fact
the boy grew up and she brought him to the daughter of Pharaoh and he was a son to her. She called his name Moses, as she said, " For I drew him from the water."
The name - although Egyptian in origin, comes from "[to] draw out" instead of 'son of' * (http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Moses.html) But since egypt was around before genesis, then i will observe reality over a belief.
Moses means 'son of' in egypt and moses was named by egyptians.
The origin of the Moses story would most certainly seem to stem from Sargon. I was talking about the origin of the story, not the names used in later versions. just as noah's story reflects Enil being mad at man for being too noisy (summerian tablets)
point being, you are using a story of well over 1000 yrs before Moses, as well since moses and 'rameses' are so close, it seems that neither of us can know for a fact, other than to understand that in ramesis period, they recorded the plagues.
so in name, in birth place, in historical accounts; i will bet on ramesis and moses being of the same stories recorded in history.
quid pro quo
Bishadi
04-22-09, 12:48 PM
Or as they say in Zen: Moo!
Actually it was a pun on the word "Peter." Wow, you sure get points for just making shit up as you go.
sorry charlie as you read less than you know
Go back and read the old prophecies of the temple mount. (it is why the reference to the 'rock' was used)
But i will say, in the context of matthew, that frame you share in founded in writings just as the other STATEMENT of jesus
20Then did he charge his disciples that they may say to no one that he is Jesus the Christ.
as jesus knew he was not the christ too
Bishadi
04-22-09, 12:50 PM
:roflmao:
Oli
Intimidatingly competent
:roflmao:
not even timidly competent
Oli
Intimidatingly competent
:roflmao:
not even timidly competent
Possibly not, but at least I know how to use "quid pro quo" in context.
Bishadi
04-22-09, 01:19 PM
Possibly not, but at least I know how to use "quid pro quo" in context.
it is when people are communicating each are responsible to account for equality of the dialogue with a 'capacity of intent' to honoring the duty (responsibly)
you have no duty to anything but yourself and why you have no idea what responsibility is within articulating with people of the same species. (equality)
to you everyone else is 'less than' while you hold onto your ignorance as the only truth of the land.
i consider you a bonafide troll of this website!
it is when people are communicating each are responsible to account for equality of the dialogue with a 'capacity of intent' to honoring the duty (responsibly)
you have no duty to anything but yourself and why you have no idea what responsibility is within articulating with people of the same species. (equality)
to you everyone else is 'less than' while you hold onto your ignorance as the only truth of the land.
i consider you a bonafide troll of this website!
None of which validates (or even excuses) your atrocious mangling and misuse of the English (or Latin) language.
Saquist
04-22-09, 02:40 PM
God committed the offending actions.
Inevident.
You really should avoid words you don't understand.
That advice isn't sound. It leads to ignorance.
syllogistic:
A form of deductive reasoning..
Thus, with syllogistic results, or based on reasonable deduction.
If I have still error you may feel free to explain if you know the propper usage.
God created man.
Man is flawed and he goes to hell because of it.
Litteral interpretation without the traditionally misleading noun:
God was created.
Man is flawed and thus dies.
This is a propper statement.
Creating something flawed requires either not succeeding because of a lack of skill or a lack of ability to impliment one's skill or purposefully choosing to fail.
[QUOTE]Purposefully chosing to fail in a way that would send some one to hell is a mark of being evil.
So, ...
if god lacks skill then he is not omniscient
if god lacks the ability to impliment his skill he is not omnipotent.
if god purposefully chooses to fail to send man to hell he is evil
Any way you shake it God fails and hell is the mark of his failure.
You lack a causal relationship between the creation and the current state of being of man. The logical fallacy still persist in your argument.
By way of example:
You propose that the World Trade Centers collasped because the engineers created a flawed design. This aswell as your statement fail to account for forces in action between the time of the collapse and the time creation that result in the failure. Thus this is not a logical line of reasoning.
This is also an example of uniformitarian thinking which propposes the no significant disturbances or changes in the enviroment has resulted in a current form, biological, geological or astronomical.
SnakeLord
04-22-09, 04:25 PM
legends don't make fact
I made no implication that they did - it was merely a suggestion that the Moses story probably has it's origins in the Sargon story.
Moses means 'son of' in egypt and moses was named by egyptians.
That explains it, I shall add it to my notes.
Oh, there is just one thing. Perhaps you could help me..
If the biblical story is factual then we know that Moses was named not because he was 'son of' anyone but because he was drawn from the water - as that story, which would be factual, explains, (yes - an Egyptian woman names him).
But what if the biblical story isn't factual? This author creates a fictional character and a fictional account of this characters life. He gives him the name Moses and goes on to explain why he was named Moses. Surely this would mean that the origin of this characters name is precisely because of the reason given that was decided upon by the author? It is after all a fictional account, surely you can't suggest the origin of the characters name isn't what the creator of that fictional character says it is?
If you could help with this problem, I'd be grateful.
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