There is a few posts in another thread on children and lying, and I am wondering what people believe about lying. Is it a defense mechanism that is biologically inherent to humans, or is it learned behaviour based on the responses recieved when we are young? Do we lie because of example, or because of shame? What makes a person lie, and what makes a good liar? Are some people born to be better liars, and is that hereditary? It also begs the question as to whether or not children feel shame out of instinct or out of learned behaviours. I'm not convinced that children lie as part of "growing up" and I think it has more to do with how people react to them and how they see people react to others when they lie or are lied to. I also think that you can raise children to not lie to cover up incidents. In addition, some people lie to be kind. Is this also hereditary?
I believe that we should not lie if at all possible. There are circumstances where a lie is a necessary thing to do. An example would be if you saw your best friends husband with another woman one night and he didn't see you. The next day your best friend asks what you did the night before, you wouldn't tell her about what you saw would you? Or would you?:shrug:
My best friend? Oh hell yeah! I'd be calling her the second I saw him. I'd be driving to her house to help her pack up his crap. But if it were my best friend I saw cheating on her husband, I wouldn't tell him.
I would, in hopes that she could work it out. And I'd be there for her whatever she chose to do. Do you think it's instinctual though, or is it a learned behaviour. Do we subconsiously lie sometimes? And are those lies more of a flight instinct, or just from being trained to taking the path of least resistance? If your significant other buys a nice new outfit, and they try it on to show you and beam with pride at their new purchase, but it doesn't flatter their figure... do you tell them that it makes them look bad or do you not?
What if the woman he was with was someone that he just met and was just chatting with her and really didn't know her at all? If you told his wife you could get him into a very big problem for doing nothing wrong.
LOL, you act like I wouldn't be saying hi to them. He is the husband of my best friend after all. It would be rude to ignore him. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
how do instincts fall in to this? Lies are choices. Maybe your example of not telling someone that their new outfit doesn't make their big fat ass look like the big fat ass that it is. Certainly if it's a woman and your a man ... it's a survival mechanism Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! but it's a choice a wise one at that
I think it's learned. Little children are often brutally honest. That's one of the reasons I like working with them. They almost always tell the truth. Once they learn that they can alter their story to keep them out of trouble or make themselves seem high and mighty, they lie just to see what they can lie about and get away with. They learn the more credible the story they make up the more likely that they won't get caught. Definitely learned. But what motivates one to start lying is perhaps instinctual. Do children really learn it from parents or other children? Where do other animals learn it from?
Humans developed so many facial muscles because they mutually benefit tricksters and liars. The more information I know about you, the easier it is to steal your woman.
the problem with lieing is, you have to be damn good at it to not get caught! and not a lot of people are, a little lie turns into a big lie to cover up the original lie so its best not to lie at all. however i do think that lieing is a part of growing up, kids lie to not get into trouble and keep they're friends out of trouble, i have caught my daughter lieing on a few occassions and even faced with the truth she is still admamnt that she isnt lieing,
Children don't learn the ability to lie until they learn the difference between what they know and what someone else knows. E.g., I am thinking of a number, I know what it is and I know that you don't know what it is. This kind of thinking isn't learned until the age of about 3-6 (can't remember the age but it somewhere around there.) (Incidentally if anyone else has read the article and knows where I can locate it please PM me as I would quite like to read it again) I also remember reading about an experiment wherein deceptive behavior was observed in chimps which suggests, to me at least, that lying is at least partly instinctive.
Children learn to lie by themselves when they figure out it they can benefit from it. This behavior starts when they develop a self as distinct from their surroundings, when they are around 3 of 4 years old.
I disagree with the conclusion. Humans in general and children in particular are fabulous at imagining things that do not exist, make-believe scenarios, and playing out the consequence of those scenarios under various conditions. Lying is just that, it is a specific application of the human ability to abstract information and imagine situations that are contra-factual. Lying is just a subset of that far more inclusive activity because the nature of the lie requires that it be shared with another person with some intent that the other person believe it to be true. I distinctly recall a friend of mine trying to convince me (successfully) that his father was an astronaut back in kindergarten. That was a lie, I later learned, but it falls into the same pattern as two children playing "cops and robbers" save that his goal was to make me believe it.
Kindergarten is a bit older than the children I was speaking of. One can have an imagination and still be an honest person. Since children don't start lying as soon as they can speak. The two year olds I was speaking of don't lie (not that I know of) even if they might get in trouble or hurt someone's feelings. They just say "oops" and "uh-oh" a lot. That can get real annoying real fast.
