View Full Version : Indian Canadian Beheads 2 yr old daughter
shorty_37
02-06-09, 08:43 PM
I just heard this on the news. What the hell is wrong with these ppl.
Burning their daughters with acid, beheading toddlers....
It says he was depressed he had no sons. Does this mean this poor toddler was beheaded just because it was the wrong sex.:shrug:
Is it that important to Indians to have sons?
Indian Canadian admits to beheading two-year-old daughter
An Indian-Canadian father, who had strangled and then decapitated his two-year-old daughter in the Vancouver suburb of Delta last
year, has pleaded guilty to second-degree murder.
Forty-eight-year-old Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon had slit the throat of his toddler on the morning of Jan 18 last year at the family home when his wife, Manjit, was away to drop their two elder daughters to school.
When she returned home, the wife found the two-year-old Ravinder beheaded.
Full Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
Maybe he thinks abortion should be extended post partum.
Is Canada so bad to bring up daughters in?
shorty_37
02-06-09, 08:51 PM
Yeah Sam, it is so bad he was sparing her a hard life. :rolleyes:
Sounds like he just couldn't take the fact he was cursed with daughters instead of sons.
You have to be a real animal to behead your own child.
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 08:52 PM
What the effin?
He faces the mandatory life sentence to be announced Thursday, with the possibility of a parole after 10 years.
He can get out in ten years if he is lucky and a little longer if he isn't, That bastard shouldn't be breathing air.
He murdered his daughter because of his frustration, after his fights, with his wife over their financial situation.
And why were they have a financial problem?
After Ravinder's birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 08:54 PM
What the effin?
He can get out in ten years if he is lucky and a little longer if he isn't, That bastard shouldn't be breathing air.
He murdered his daughter because of his frustration, after his fights, with his wife over their financial situation.
And why were they have a financial problem?
After Ravinder's birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
No kidding he left his job because he couldn't handle the fact he had another daughter instead of a son.
Money is more important than collateral damages. Killing is good for the economy
A man who initially told police that gunmen kidnapped his two-year-old son was arrested Saturday, accused of committing an "extremely hideous" murder because he was ordered to pay child support.
Police Superintendent Warren Riley said Danny Platt confessed.
He told police where to find the child's body and will be booked with first-degree murder of Ja' Shawn Powell, Riley said at a news conference.
"He had said he would kill either his wife or his child before he paid child support," which he recently had been ordered to do, Riley said.
http://forum.canadianparents.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=873767
STEVE Clark thought, in his own words, that he'd "seen it all" – but yesterday was to bring the detective chief inspector a most shocking and unwelcome surprise.
A crime that has rocked a continent left the Melbourne officer struggling to put into words the almost unimaginable horror that confronted him after a local man, Arthur Freeman, pulled over on a highway bridge, took his four-year-old daughter, Darce
ADVERTISEMENT
y, out of the car and dropped her over the side to her death.
The tragedy shocked Australia, leading national news bulletins and prompting an outpouring of sympathy.
But however shocking the murder, it is only the latest in a catalogue of distressing episodes in which fathers have taken the lives of their children.
Ashok Kalyanjee, 46, was jailed for at least 21 years last week for stabbing his two sons to death before trying to set their bodies alight. Police found the blood-soaked corpses of the two boys in the car with their father slumped unconscious in the front seat of the vehicle, which was parked in a lay-by in the Campsie Fells near Lennoxtown, East Dunbartonshire.
A tape recording by Kalyanjee, recorded in Punjabi, contained the chilling message: "These children are mine and they go with me. This death is near."
The same day, Robert Thomson murdered his disabled daughter and young son, before turning the knife on himself.
A court heard the 50-year-old, from Buckhaven, Fife, was unable to give any explanation for repeatedly stabbing Michelle, 25, who had learning difficulties, and his son, Ryan, seven. At the time he and his wife, June, were going through a divorce.
Speaking after he was sentenced to a minimum of 17 years in October last year, Mrs Thomson condemned the "pure evil and badness" of her husband.
It is difficult to speculate about what was going on in the minds of these two men as they planned these most disturbing and despicable of crimes.
But there are similar features in these cases which experts say can help to explain why such filicides take place.
In Thomson's case, background reports suggested that he wanted to get back at his wife, whom he feared would leave him with nothing after their divorce.
Kalyanjee was also estranged from the mother of his children, although he was given access to them.
In both cases, questions were raised over the men's mental state – but neither was insane.
Dr Vince Egan, a senior lecturer in forensic psychology at Leicester University, divides the killing of children by their fathers into broadly two categories.
On the one hand, there are those fathers who do terrible things as a result of a lack of rational thought, linked perhaps to extreme mental illness.
On the other, there are "callous acts" where fathers will harm, and in some cases kill, their own children as a way to "get at" their former partner.
It's a phenomenon that is likely to continue as increasing numbers of families experience painful break-ups.
http://news.scotsman.com/comment/So-what-drives-a-father.4929697.jp
Apparenty its the in thing in Canada
http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:09UhCDu_51gJ:www.canadiancrc.com/Infanticide-Women_Who_Kill_Their_Babies.aspx+canadian+father+k ills+child&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=12&gl=us&client=firefox-a
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:00 PM
No kidding he left his job because he couldn't handle the fact he had another daughter instead of a son.
And now we have SAM going the moral relativism route again.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:06 PM
This possibility of parole after 10 yrs is BS. I think the Law in Canada is too lenient. From watching sentences that are passed down in the U.S. does it seem lenient compared?
Do you think this kind of crime get would get more then that in the US?
Pointing out that Canadians are routinely killing their own children is morally relative?
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:14 PM
Pointing out that Canadians are routinely killing their own children is morally relative?
SAM: Apparenty its the in thing in Canada
Not when you are on your normal anti west rant.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:16 PM
Routinely huh? How many in the past 10 yrs compared to other countries?
Also can you find out what nationalities all these murderers are for me, for interests sake.
New immigrants to Canada, the Kahlon family had settled in the Indian-dominant Delta-Surrey area in Vancouver's suburb.
How many of them are new immigrants to Canada? Just because he recently moved here doesn't in my mind make him "Typical Canadians". Sounds like he might be carrying around his own Indian beliefs.
So how important is it for Indian men to have sons instead of daughters?
Why didn't you post a thread on any of the other murders?
I know where your sudden concern for Indian children springs from.
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:20 PM
This possibility of parole after 10 yrs is BS. I think the Law in Canada is too lenient. From watching sentences that are passed down in the U.S. does it seem lenient compared?
Do you think this kind of crime get would get more then that in the US?
Depends on the State, some states it will get you the needle, some states life with out the possibility of parole, the U.S. has gotten very tough on those who commit crimes against children of late, and needs to get tougher.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:20 PM
Why didn't you post a thread on any of the other murders?
I know where your sudden concern for Indian children springs from.
What can't you read? We were just sitting down watching the news tonight , when the story came on. Both of us went WTF beheaded their own child. So I made a thread since it is such a barbaric crime.
Got a problem with that?
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:23 PM
Depends on the State, some states it will get you the needle, some states life with out the possibility of parole, the U.S. has gotten very tough on those who commit crimes against children of late, and needs to get tougher.
I think Canada should follow suit. Handing down this kind of sentence for this kind of crime is a joke in my opinion.
In that case, good for you. Although you should know that, since guns are difficult to get in India [even our cops don't have them], knives are more common as weapons. And everyone knows beheading is the least painful way to die. Its how all animals are sacrificed in India. Just fyi on the way he might have thought. Poor people commonly sell or kill their children because they have no options. Perhaps he thought it would be easier in Canada and its not.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:27 PM
In that case, good for you. Although you should know that, since guns are difficult to get in India [even our cops don't have them], knives are more common as weapons. And everyone knows beheading is the least painful way to die. Its how all animals are sacrificed in India. Just fyi.
So you think this toddler should have been sacrificed because she wasn't the son he wanted? Should we lighten up on the man because he did it in the least painful way? :bugeye:
So just because it was done with a knife you think it is less of a crime?
Are there grades of filicides? Is it better to abort, drop from a height, set on fire, microwave or shoot with a sniper rifle?
Killing a child is killing a child
I just heard this on the news. What the hell is wrong with these ppl.
Burning their daughters with acid, beheading toddlers....
It says he was depressed he had no sons. Does this mean this poor toddler was beheaded just because it was the wrong sex.:shrug:
Is it that important to Indians to have sons?
Indian Canadian admits to beheading two-year-old daughter
An Indian-Canadian father, who had strangled and then decapitated his two-year-old daughter in the Vancouver suburb of Delta last
year, has pleaded guilty to second-degree murder.
Forty-eight-year-old Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon had slit the throat of his toddler on the morning of Jan 18 last year at the family home when his wife, Manjit, was away to drop their two elder daughters to school.
When she returned home, the wife found the two-year-old Ravinder beheaded.
Full Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
What does his ethnicity have to do with anything?
You're telling me that Canadians of European descent never, ever commit terrible and criminal acts? That murder is only committed by "these people"?
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:30 PM
Are there grades of filicides? Is it better to abort, drop from a height, set on fire, microwave or shoot with a sniper rifle?
Killing a child is killing a child
Not according to this from you:
In that case, good for you. Although you should know that, since guns are difficult to get in India [even our cops don't have them], knives are more common as weapons. And everyone knows beheading is the least painful way to die. Its how all animals are sacrificed in India. Just fyi on the way he might have thought. Poor people commonly sell or kill their children because they have no options. Perhaps he thought it would be easier in Canada and its not.
Why? because poor people don't kill their children? Or sell them? They do, unfortunately.
shorty_37
02-06-09, 09:39 PM
Just to be clear here SAM (although I don't know why I bother) When we heard this on the news, it was just a snippet of what was to come later on the news. We did not know the nationality of the family in question. We were both shocked to hear in this day and age someone beheading their own child. When I looked on the computer I saw the full story. I would be just as
disgusted if they were German, Polish, Irish, Jewish, Italian whatever. I still would have posted the story here.
I do however find a trend in the way that the Indian crimes vary somewhat from other crimes. It seems like a lot of girls seem to take the brunt of these viscous crimes too.
That is why I asked which no one has answered yet....How important is it for an Indian father to have sons, or a son and not just daughters?
Just to be clear here SAM (although I don't know why I bother) When we heard this on the news, it was just a snippet of what was to come later on the news. We did not know the nationality of the family in question. We were both shocked to hear in this day and age someone beheading their own child. When I looked on the computer I saw the full story. I would be just as
disgusted if they were German, Polish, Irish, Jewish, Italian whatever. I still would have posted the story here.
Okay.
I do however find a trend in the way that the Indian crimes vary somewhat from other crimes. It seems like a lot of girls seem to take the brunt of these viscous crimes too.
They get more press. We have very active womens organisations some of which are like militant fundamentalists and they are very active in saving girls and women, sometimes even against their wishes.
Boys also suffer equally, but since they are usually seen as labour rather than burden, their plight, which can range from being amputated for begging to being sold for child sex slavery, to working long hours in sweat shops or as manual labourers is not less pitiful. But they will bring in the money, so they are considered as assets.
Girls are a problem. If you don't educate them, you have to get them married. This means dowry and costs a lot of money. If they get "spoiled" or pregnant, no one will marry them and parents will be "stuck" supporting them for life. If they get an education, parents have to pay for the education. This also means that they have to arrange a marriage with a more "suitable" boy, which can be even more expensive. Only thing you can do is to sell them, but this is shameful for the family. Plus, getting married or being sold off does nt guarantee the girl will be safe or well cared for. So many girls are killed after marriage so the husbands can marry again and get more dowry. So if you cannot afford them, easiest is to just kill them. He already had two daughters, and a third was probably more than he could afford.
That is why I asked which no one has answered yet....How important is it for an Indian father to have sons, or a son and not just daughters?
Ask me if you have any more questions.
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:55 PM
Just to be clear here SAM (although I don't know why I bother) When we heard this on the news, it was just a snippet of what was to come later on the news. We did not know the nationality of the family in question. We were both shocked to hear in this day and age someone beheading their own child. When I looked on the computer I saw the full story. I would be just as
disgusted if they were German, Polish, Irish, Jewish, Italian whatever. I still would have posted the story here.
I do however find a trend in the way that the Indian crimes vary somewhat from other crimes. It seems like a lot of girls seem to take the brunt of these viscous crimes too.
That is why I asked which no one has answered yet....How important is it for an Indian father to have sons, or a son and not just daughters?
Well, Shorty, I can answer that, it is very important, it is tied up with His virility, and macho standing among his friends, the more sons the more Virile, the higher the self esteem, and esteem he is held in by his male companions, and the fact that it cost money out of his pocket in dowry to marry off his daughters.
Well, Shorty, I can answer that, it is very important, it is tied up with His virility, and macho standing among his friends, the more sons the more Virile, the higher the self esteem, and the fact that it cost money out of his pocket in dowry to marry off his daughters.
No, its more about beliefs actually, only a son can perform the last rites for the father.
Cremation and its origin in Hinduism
It is an ancient custom among Hindus to cremate their dead. After a person dies, it is understood that the lighting of the funeral pyre will be led by the eldest son of the deceased. In this article, a number of issues dealing with cremation and its origins are discussed.
During early days of civilization, fire used to be started by rubbing sticks of special materials against each other. Lighting any fire afresh therefore used to be a difficult task that was time-consuming, laborious and required a lot of effort and energy. One of the prayers (Book 1: Hymn 94.3) in the Rig Veda, "O Agni, may we have power to kindle thee," indicates that the person lighting a flame had to be in good physical condition.
A ritual fire, such as in yajna (fire worship) or cremation (using a pyre of wood), was usually ignited afresh. This would also mean therefore that a healthy and strong person in the family had to light the fire on any special occasion. A physically fit and robust son would naturally be an ideal choice for this job. In this regard, a number of Vedic prayers were dedicated for obtaining a good, strong and healthy offspring (usually a male). It was expected that he would eventually be involved in fire starting duties. Moreover, by igniting the fire himself, he would spare his family from depending on others for lighting the ritual flame or borrowing it from outside.
The practice of a strong male (usually the son) lighting the funeral pyre slowly grew into a custom, which over time became quite rigid. It implied that a son had to perform the last rites for his parents. It also led to the unfortunate belief that the last rites for a parent would not be acceptable religiously unless the deceased's son had carried them out. This thinking put more pressure on the families to have sons while undermining the importance of daughters.
There were also several reasons for a daughter (or another woman) to not play an active part at her parent's funeral. A woman was generally not as strong as a man for lighting the funeral flame by rubbing sticks against each other. This was a strenuous and time-consuming task that had to be carried out usually in wet and cold conditions of crematorium near a river. Moreover, a woman's health during menstruation, pregnancy and child delivery could make it difficult for her to take any strenuous assignment. Women would also be prone to get emotionally more upset at funerals than men, and therefore not suited to undertake additional responsibility. Similarly, a daughter could be away at her in-laws when her parents died and therefore not able to attend the funeral in time. Note in this regard that there used to be no holding and refrigeration facilities to safely store a corpse, and therefore the funeral was held without delay -- usually within a day after the death of a person. To eliminate any uncertainty regarding women's participation at funerals for their family members, the cremation duties were assigned to their male kin in stead. This was basically to avoid any confusion at the last moment. Furthermore, in case of a deceased person having more than one son, job of lighting the pyre would go first to the eldest son. If he was unable to fulfil his duty, then his place would automatically be taken by the second son, and so on. This orderly division of labor was to complete the cremation reliably and without delay. Everyone understood his role in the family.
Traditionally, whenever there was a death in the community, a male person belonging to each household -- irrespective of the caste -- would attend the funeral to pay respects to the dead. Moreover, everyone going to the crematorium on such occasion would carry some wood with him to add to the pyre. This was to assist in gathering the necessary fuel for cremation.
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/cremation.html
Buffalo Roam
02-06-09, 09:59 PM
No, its more about beliefs actually, only a son can perform the last rites for the father.
[quuote]Cremation and its origin in Hinduism
It is an ancient custom among Hindus to cremate their dead. After a person dies, it is understood that the lighting of the funeral pyre will be led by the eldest son of the deceased. In this article, a number of issues dealing with cremation and its origins are discussed.
During early days of civilization, fire used to be started by rubbing sticks of special materials against each other. Lighting any fire afresh therefore used to be a difficult task that was time-consuming, laborious and required a lot of effort and energy. One of the prayers (Book 1: Hymn 94.3) in the Rig Veda, "O Agni, may we have power to kindle thee," indicates that the person lighting a flame had to be in good physical condition.
A ritual fire, such as in yajna (fire worship) or cremation (using a pyre of wood), was usually ignited afresh. This would also mean therefore that a healthy and strong person in the family had to light the fire on any special occasion. A physically fit and robust son would naturally be an ideal choice for this job. In this regard, a number of Vedic prayers were dedicated for obtaining a good, strong and healthy offspring (usually a male). It was expected that he would eventually be involved in fire starting duties. Moreover, by igniting the fire himself, he would spare his family from depending on others for lighting the ritual flame or borrowing it from outside.
The practice of a strong male (usually the son) lighting the funeral pyre slowly grew into a custom, which over time became quite rigid. It implied that a son had to perform the last rites for his parents. It also led to the unfortunate belief that the last rites for a parent would not be acceptable religiously unless the deceased's son had carried them out. This thinking put more pressure on the families to have sons while undermining the importance of daughters.
There were also several reasons for a daughter (or another woman) to not play an active part at her parent's funeral. A woman was generally not as strong as a man for lighting the funeral flame by rubbing sticks against each other. This was a strenuous and time-consuming task that had to be carried out usually in wet and cold conditions of crematorium near a river. Moreover, a woman's health during menstruation, pregnancy and child delivery could make it difficult for her to take any strenuous assignment. Women would also be prone to get emotionally more upset at funerals than men, and therefore not suited to undertake additional responsibility. Similarly, a daughter could be away at her in-laws when her parents died and therefore not able to attend the funeral in time. Note in this regard that there used to be no holding and refrigeration facilities to safely store a corpse, and therefore the funeral was held without delay -- usually within a day after the death of a person. To eliminate any uncertainty regarding women's participation at funerals for their family members, the cremation duties were assigned to their male kin in stead. This was basically to avoid any confusion at the last moment. Furthermore, in case of a deceased person having more than one son, job of lighting the pyre would go first to the eldest son. If he was unable to fulfil his duty, then his place would automatically be taken by the second son, and so on. This orderly division of labor was to complete the cremation reliably and without delay. Everyone understood his role in the family.
Traditionally, whenever there was a death in the community, a male person belonging to each household -- irrespective of the caste -- would attend the funeral to pay respects to the dead. Moreover, everyone going to the crematorium on such occasion would carry some wood with him to add to the pyre. This was to assist in gathering the necessary fuel for cremation.
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/cremation.html[/QUOTE]
And:
it is tied up with His virility, and macho standing among his friends, the more sons the more Virile, the higher the self esteem, and esteem he is held in by his male companions, and the fact that it cost money out of his pocket in dowry to marry off his daughters.
Jesus Christ! Would you shut up already Bells.
Stop trolling.... Do you actually have something to say about THE TOPIC?
As for being bizarre and taking sides, I have no clue who the hell this member is. But go ahead make up some conspiracy theory like you have in the past.
Heh. Show me where I have made conspiracy theories.. Links?
And I did say quite a bit about this topic. I asked what the man's ethnicity had to do with it when you referred to Indians as "these people" and then went on to make comments about honour crimes against the girls, etc. I also commented about the crime itself, a couple of times now. What else are we meant to discuss in this topic which details a horrible crime against a small child?
Should we discuss what led to this horrible crime? How about the fact that prosecutors decided to accept a guilty plea for second degree murder, instead of pushing for a first degree murder trial that would have had him sitting in jail for the rest of his life, instead of the possibility of parole in 10 years time?
What kind of man kills his baby daughter because of arguments about of financial issues with his wife? Is he mentally ill? What got me about this case is that international news reports give more details than even Canadian papers or news sites. I find that strange, personally, but there you go. But what of Lakvinder Singh Kahlon? How could he have been allowed to plea to guilty of second degree murder?
A psychiatrist, Dr. Shabehram Lohrasbe, testified that Kahlon was severely depressed before the slaying and was being treated with anti-depressants and anti-psychotic medication. Kahlon had seen his psychiatrist only two days before he killed his daughter, Lohrasbe said.
As the defendant sat with his head bowed, Silverman recognized Kahlon's mental instability, but said the father was criminally responsible for the crime.
The court was told Kahlon had no prior criminal record and no previous history of family violence.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2009/02/06/news/Canada-Decapitated-Daughter.php
Did he snap? Is he really mentally unstable as described by the psychiatrists? He was after all on anti-depressants. What caused the depression? Was it his daughter? There are so many questions about this case that can't be answered by what little has been reported of it. Which is sad really because that little girl deserves more than that. Her death should never have happened. Did his doctor fail to recognise that his patient was so close to snapping and therefore, posed a danger to his family?
No word at all from his trial whether the reason he committed this horrendous act was because he had no sons. Instead, it was his neighbours who made the comments to the media:
Neighbours have said Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.sympatico.msn.ca/Canada/ContentPosting?newsitemid=31668024&feedname=CP-NATIONAL&show=False&number=0&showbyline=True&subtitle=&detect=&abc=abc&date=True
The police have a different take on this motives or reasons for killing his own daughter..
The court also took into account the testimony of a police officer who posed as a prisoner and spoke with Kahlon.
The police officer told the court that Kahlon told him that the toddler became victim of his frustration after his fights with his wife over their financial situation.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
So which is it? Are the neighbours right? Or are the police right after they sent an officer undercover into the jail to try to figure out what his motive was?
Betrayer0fHope
02-07-09, 12:25 AM
I just heard this on the news. What the hell is wrong with these ppl.
Burning their daughters with acid, beheading toddlers....
It says he was depressed he had no sons. Does this mean this poor toddler was beheaded just because it was the wrong sex.:shrug:
Is it that important to Indians to have sons?
Indian Canadian admits to beheading two-year-old daughter
An Indian-Canadian father, who had strangled and then decapitated his two-year-old daughter in the Vancouver suburb of Delta last
year, has pleaded guilty to second-degree murder.
Forty-eight-year-old Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon had slit the throat of his toddler on the morning of Jan 18 last year at the family home when his wife, Manjit, was away to drop their two elder daughters to school.
When she returned home, the wife found the two-year-old Ravinder beheaded.
Full Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
Yes. If I have any daughters, my bitch and the kid are getting it.
Betrayer0fHope
02-07-09, 12:32 AM
By the way, it should tell you something Buffalo Roam is on your side and arguing with you.
madanthonywayne
02-07-09, 12:38 AM
Mod note: I've deleted every post that was off topic and/or insulting towards other members and some posts that were responding to those posts. Let this note serve as a blanket warning to everyone: PLEASE STICK TO THE TOPIC AND DISCUSS IT IN A RESPECTFUL MANNER.
Hey, it's the "Indian" lifestyle:
"Asking me why I need a son, instead of a daughter, is like asking me why I have two eyes and not one,? says one woman in the northern district of Haryana, who has just had an abortion after discovering that the baby she was carrying was female.
This woman is by no means alone in taking such shocking and drastic measures to avoid giving birth to a girl. In fact, such is the widespread determination to produce only sons that, since ultrasound scans became widely available in the Eighties, the number of abortions carried out on female foetuses in India has risen at a terrifying pace.
Even by the most conservative estimates, sex-selective abortion in India now accounts for the termination of some ten million female foetuses over the past 20 years. That means that each year a staggering half a million girls have been prevented from being born."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-393896/Genocide-Indias-daughters.html
Consider yourself very lucky, Sam.
Orleander
02-07-09, 10:01 AM
we have had a few fathers killing their whole families and themselves due to losing their jobs and being in debt. None were Canadians or Native Americans
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28907442/
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/29/us/29family.html?_r=1&ref=us
SAM, what the fuck are you doing ? :bugeye:
Hey, it's the "Indian" lifestyle:
"Asking me why I need a son, instead of a daughter, is like asking me why I have two eyes and not one,? says one woman in the northern district of Haryana, who has just had an abortion after discovering that the baby she was carrying was female.
This woman is by no means alone in taking such shocking and drastic measures to avoid giving birth to a girl. In fact, such is the widespread determination to produce only sons that, since ultrasound scans became widely available in the Eighties, the number of abortions carried out on female foetuses in India has risen at a terrifying pace.
Even by the most conservative estimates, sex-selective abortion in India now accounts for the termination of some ten million female foetuses over the past 20 years. That means that each year a staggering half a million girls have been prevented from being born."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-393896/Genocide-Indias-daughters.html
Consider yourself very lucky, Sam.
What exactly does this have to do with this thread topic or with Sam?:bugeye: What female about the abortion rate in China? North Korea?
The police claim that his motives were financial stress which led to severe depression after interviewing him and speaking to him. His neighbours have claimed that he killed her because he wanted a son. Which are we to believe?
But what is the Indian lifestyle? Are you saying that it is common practice in all families in India and part of the lifestyle in India to abort females? How many children in general are aborted in the US each year? Should we take those figures and then say that abortion is part of the lifestyle in the US? Yes? No?
we have had a few fathers killing their whole families and themselves due to losing their jobs and being in debt. None were Canadians or Native Americans
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28907442/
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/29/us/29family.html?_r=1&ref=us
I don't think Indian in this instance means 'Native American'.
What exactly does this have to do with this thread topic or with Sam?
It has to do with the obsession of Indians wanting only sons and the fact that females are being killed or aborted due to that fact. Sam is an Indian female, allegedly. She's lucky to be alive.
What female about the abortion rate in China? North Korea?
What about it?
The police claim that his motives were financial stress which led to severe depression after interviewing him and speaking to him. His neighbours have claimed that he killed her because he wanted a son. Which are we to believe?
The man was depressed about having another daughter and left work after the birth to stay home. The article I linked states that financial issues are not the reason, as many affluent Indians abort their daughters after observing ultrascans.
But what is the Indian lifestyle? Are you saying that it is common practice in all families in India and part of the lifestyle in India to abort females?
Read the article I linked.
How many children in general are aborted in the US each year?
How many are the result of families not wanting daughters?
Should we take those figures and then say that abortion is part of the lifestyle in the US? Yes? No?
Killing females in India is the lifestyle, abortion or otherwise.
Orleander
02-07-09, 01:52 PM
wasn't there a Chinese guy that decapitated another guy on a bus? Maybe its just that Canadians like chopping peoples heads off. Its not an ethnic group, its where they live.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/canada/2493715/Canada-bus-killer-ate-his-decapitated-victim.html
Orleander
02-07-09, 01:53 PM
I don't think Indian in this instance means 'Native American'.
Oh, :o I figured there was a chance it might not be, but I was going with the odds that there are more Native American Indians in Canada than ones from India.
Animals kill their young when the fitness cost of raising them is greater than abandoning or eating them.
Why is it surprising when people do it?
Orleander
02-07-09, 02:09 PM
Animals kill their young when the fitness cost of raising them is greater than abandoning or eating them.
Why is it surprising when people do it?
yeah, we have parents here that smother, beat, drown their kids. We have one court case now where a couple beat their daughter to death and put her body in a cooler in Galveston Bay.
Another man is on trial for raping his daughter for years. She had 4 kids by him, only 1 is still alive.
Susan Smith drowned her boys so her boyfriend would like her better.
Its just that decapitating is so extreme. He could have just smothered her.
nietzschefan
02-07-09, 02:17 PM
Oh, :o I figured there was a chance it might not be, but I was going with the odds that there are more Native American Indians in Canada than ones from India.
Calling Native Canadians "Indian" is pretty bad. Even the term "Native" is becoming Racist - and oh my gosh we'd sure hate to be called racist EEEK , especially by someone "of colour" it could mean our job to something more serious, like weird fucking white guilt or something. Don't try to control people by throwing around the racist moniker Bells. Get a grip.
Orleander did you even read any of it? New immigrants to Canada - does the guys name sound anything like you'd see in an American western? "born with a tooth pow" and his sister "two dogs fucking".
The official, currently, socially acceptable term for the people who can trace ancestry in Canada for more than 500 years is: "First Nations People". Enter Kennewick man stage left....
Indian Canadian, is pretty much understood to be south asians. Yes there is EASILY more south asians than Native or even Metis(card carrying) - FIRST Nations people.
Why is this incident so shocking? Because beheading is fucking shocking. Yeah like the bus incident in Winnipeg, if that was just a stabbing - the story would not have left Manitoba.
Who beheads people? Statistically going by just the breaking news stories - asians and south asians, tough shit it's not racist to point that out like it is not racist to point out white trash just like to put unwanted kids in the trash or dump them in a body of water. So ya asian trash like to cut peoples heads off sometimes, what's the big fucking "racist" deal with pointing that out. Yeah beheading your own 2 year is fucking shocking news - it's gonna be a big stink at least a few octaves higher than just strangling your kid. I am surprised we did not hear about the microwaving their own kid incident, that is pretty fucking sick.
Orleander
02-07-09, 02:20 PM
Calling Native Canadians "Indian" is pretty bad. Even the term "Native" is becoming Racist - and oh my gosh we'd sure hate to be called racist EEEK , especially by someone "of colour" it could mean our job to something more serious, like weird fucking white guilt or something. Don't try to control people by throwing around the racist moniker Bells. Get a grip.
The official, currently, socially acceptable term for the people who can trace ancestry in Canada for more than 500 years is: "First Nations People". Enter Kennewick man stage left.......
Hmmm, had not heard that. I wonder how long til Native American Indians call themselves that here. When did it start in Canada? Is it providence wide?
nietzschefan
02-07-09, 02:29 PM
It's what they (for the most part) wanted to be called from the stand point of the Canadian Government - Office of "Indian Affairs"(lol) , which is actually a medium profile Cabinet position in the Canadian Government. Is there a Cabinet position (equivalent would be a presidential Cabinet position) in America for that?
Canadian Media have adopted it - so of course the common people must as well...or you are branded a racist by someone like Bells. Immediately.
Orleander
02-07-09, 02:31 PM
It's what they (for the most part) wanted to be called from the stand point of the Canadian Government - Office of "Indian Affairs"(lol) , which is actually a medium profile Cabinet position in the Canadian Government. Is there a Cabinet position (equivalent would be a presidential Cabinet position) in America for that?
Canadian Media have adopted it - so of course the common people must as well...or you are branded a racist by someone like Bells. Immediately.
so I take it high school sports teams in Canada have already been renamed. No Chiefs, Indians, Braves, Redskins?
"First Nation" makes me think of a bank. Like First National.
Orleander
02-07-09, 02:34 PM
I wonder if they will argue amongst themselves as to which was First Nation. They were all nations, so which was first?
nietzschefan
02-07-09, 02:36 PM
Not sure...My high school teams were called "Titans" I do not recall playing against any teams named like that. In hockey , we had to play Natives from the "Enoch" reserve twice a year and I absolutely dreaded it. It was like playing a whole team of 15-20 Hansons. they were the best - dirtiest - meanest sons of bitches I ever played hockey against. I really do wonder why there are not more of them playing in the NHL...
Alaskan Natives are really good at basketball, because that's about the only sport they can play in their villages, especially farther north. When I say "only sport" I mean that it's a) culturally very popular and b) low maintenance. All you need is a medium sized indoor area, some hoops, and a ball. Hockey would likewise be popular, if hockey was as cool as basketball in America. They also have their Native Olympics, but that's different since no one outside of Alaska cares about it, I think only Natives can compete, and no one considers how far you can pull a rubber band with your ear a real sport, anyway.
However, when compared to everyone in America, not just residents of po-dunk Alaskan towns, blacks tend to be better equipped for basketball, since they're taller and leaner, and likewise come from an environment that predisposes them to basketball playing (cheap, low maintenance sport, requiring minimal space).
That aside, in highschool, the best football teams were the ones with Samoans, since they all hit puberty when they were 12 and weighed 300lbs. There's no way a bunch of scrawny white kids can get the ball from a defensive first string that weighs as much as your entire team.
Orleander
02-07-09, 03:07 PM
we got our asses kicked by the Winner SD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winner,_South_Dakota) football team every year. The Indians there were just so much bigger than us and they focused a lot on football. I'm surprised there aren't more in professional football.
But to go pro, you have to go to college. Most of the Native Americans I went to college with quit.
we got our asses kicked by the Winner SD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winner,_South_Dakota) football team every year. The Indians there were just so much bigger than us and they focused a lot on football. I'm surprised there aren't more in professional football.
But to go pro, you have to go to college. Most of the Native Americans I went to college with quit.
That's a really good point. Native Americans have the lowest college attendance rate in the country, I think. I could go look these statistics up on, say, wikipedia, but I don't care enough to back up my statement with any sources.
nietzschefan
02-07-09, 03:58 PM
It happens in Canada too, really odd considering they get University absolutely free. Completely paid for by the government.
nirakar
02-07-09, 04:40 PM
I found a few blogs saying that 3000 parents kill their children in the USA each year and 300 children kill their parents in the USA each year. Somebody named Paul Mones was given as the source for this information.
nirakar
02-07-09, 05:01 PM
No they are from every ethnicity.
shorty_37
02-07-09, 05:13 PM
Oh, :o I figured there was a chance it might not be, but I was going with the odds that there are more Native American Indians in Canada than ones from India.
Why the hell are you in this thread posting if you didn't even read the article in the OP?
Calling Native Canadians "Indian" is pretty bad. Even the term "Native" is becoming Racist - and oh my gosh we'd sure hate to be called racist EEEK , especially by someone "of colour" it could mean our job to something more serious, like weird fucking white guilt or something. Don't try to control people by throwing around the racist moniker Bells. Get a grip.
Are they all the same (http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2039782&postcount=73) to you as well? Do you consider all brown (http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2041917&postcount=116) people to be Indian or Muslim too?:)
White guilt should only exist if you have something to be guilty about. So why do you feel guilty? Is shorty feeling guilty?
She is a big girl niet and quite able to take care of herself. There really is no need for you to come riding in on your little pony to come and rescue her from the big bad Bells. Honestly. It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.:rolleyes:
Who beheads people? Statistically going by just the breaking news stories - asians and south asians, tough shit it's not racist to point that out like it is not racist to point out white trash just like to put unwanted kids in the trash or dump them in a body of water. So ya asian trash like to cut peoples heads off sometimes, what's the big fucking "racist" deal with pointing that out. Yeah beheading your own 2 year is fucking shocking news - it's gonna be a big stink at least a few octaves higher than just strangling your kid. I am surprised we did not hear about the microwaving their own kid incident, that is pretty fucking sick.
Who kills any child? Is it better to stab them? Shoot them? Beat them to death? Killing a child is still killing a child, regardless of the 'how'. A beheading is just as bad as a stabbing or a beating or any other way you could conceive to kill a child.
And you are naive. Beheading's as murders go is not that uncommon. There was a spate of beheading murders in Mexico (http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1839576,00.html) late last year. There was also the case of the killers who severed a teenager's head and then used it as a bowling bowl (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24094671-29277,00.html?from=public_rss). So no, to say that only Asians decapitate people shows that you are naive and prone to making stupid misinformed generalisations.
It has to do with the obsession of Indians wanting only sons and the fact that females are being killed or aborted due to that fact. Sam is an Indian female, allegedly. She's lucky to be alive.
Which again, has what to do with this thread?
Do you know for sure that is why he murdered his daughter? Do you believe the neighbours or the police who went undercover to befriend him and get him to open up who state that his motives were vastly different to the neighbour's gossip? It's easy to jump on that bandwagon, isn't it?
What about it?
Indeed. It has as much to do with this thread as your comments about Indians and needing and wanting son's to the point where they abort their daughters... Is abortion murder to you? Is abortion akin to a father beheading his 2 year old girl?
The man was depressed about having another daughter and left work after the birth to stay home. The article I linked states that financial issues are not the reason, as many affluent Indians abort their daughters after observing ultrascans.
Really? All the articles I read and linked stated his motives as being severe depression which led to arguments with his wife because of their financial situation and culminated in his murdering his daughter. There was one article that shorty linked which commented on his neighbours saying he was depressed at having another little girl. If her sex was the motive, why did he wait 2 years to kill her? If abortions is so common in the Indian community, why didn't his wife have one when the sex of the child was discovered? It is after all legal in Canada, but illegal in India.
But the article you linked has nothing to do with this case at all. So how exactly are you making the connection with what his neighbours told the media and what the police and his psychiatrists have stated in court as being his motive?
Read the article I linked.
I did. Do you think this is the norm in India within the whole population? Or is it more restricted to the people on the poorer end of the scale? Do you think abortions of females is a part of the "Indian lifestyle"?
At least in India, aborting a fetus because of it's sex could land you in jail.. yes that's right.. it has been illegal to abort based on sex selection in India since 1994. The same cannot be said for Canada. Why does Canada allow it of their migrants? Can we say it is part of the Canadian lifestyle to allow the abortion of females (http://www.lifecanada.org/html/newsletter/Vol5/no3/SexSelectionAbortions.html)?
How many are the result of families not wanting daughters?
Are you going to be naive and assume that no abortions in the US are done for sex selection?
Killing females in India is the lifestyle, abortion or otherwise.
If that were so, there would be no females left in India. So a gross exaggeration on your part.:rolleyes:
copernicus66
02-07-09, 06:17 PM
Isn't it funny how one can't even attempt to interpret the behaviour of an individual in the context of their cultural background without being accused of racism? Even postulating that perhaps a man may have killed his young daughter because his native culture tends to devalue girls (in relation to boys) is a big no-no, apparently.
White guilt should only exist if you have something to be guilty about. So why do you feel guilty? Is shorty feeling guilty?
Clearly Shorty doesn't feel guilty. But that doesn't stop ass kissing apologists from trying to push their white guilt on others. You've been attempting it on this very thread, harassing Shorty mercilessly over her 'racist' comments and trying to get her to admit with head hung that she's a shameless, uneducated dirty racist. (Oh my god, racism, call the thought police! Think of the children!)
There really is no need for you to come riding in on your little pony to come and rescue her from the big bad Bells.
And there's never any need for you to come riding to SAM's rescue, but you do it anyway. Really, for you of all people to belittle others for sticking up for their friends is a fucking laugh.
shorty_37
02-07-09, 06:19 PM
big bad Bells[/I]. Honestly. It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.:rolleyes:
Still at it Bells...:zzz:
Keep talking BS.....It seems 3/4 of what you posted yesterday has all been deleted. The pathetic thing here is that you just can't handle when anybody agrees with stupid ole me vs the Worldly High and Mighty Bells.
No they are from every ethnicity.
I agree. My impression is that the OP is showing that in some societies female babies are less desirable and treated very differently. There is no way to deny that this is not the case so i dont understand the tangents some posters have gone off on.
shorty_37
02-07-09, 06:23 PM
I agree. My impression is that the OP is showing that in some societies female babies are less desirable and treated very differently. There is no way to deny that this is not the case so i dont understand the tangents some posters have gone off on.
Pure and simple John, they are in denial. They don't want to face the facts or the truth about some things that are still going on.
Why do Indians prefer sons?
Men here are considered ‘superior’, ‘calmer’, ‘more sensible’, ‘dependable’, ‘bread-earners’ and even ‘better drivers!’ Naturally society prefers the male child as he is the ‘superior’ child. :o
Economics plays a large part here. The son is expected to earn and ‘pay back’ by looking after the parents in old age. Usually he does. And in many parts of India the male child grows up and commands a large dowry. A big economic bonanza for the parents, if they manage to sell their son to the highest bidder.
On the other hand, all the money spent on a girl’s education is considered a ‘waste’ as even if the girl earns it will go to the husband’s family. Worse, giving birth to a girl means that the parents will have to ‘buy’ a groom for her when the time comes.
Unless parents stop looking at their children from the economic perspective, the bias against women will never go.
http://nitawriter.wordpress.com/2006/10/19/why-do-indians-prefer-sons-2/
Indian Children
Birth celebrations for baby daughters are more muted than for sons and are sometimes absent altogether.
There is a strong cultural bias toward males. Girls are frequently victims of underfeeding, medical neglect, sex-selective abortion, and outright infanticide.
That girls are victims of fatal neglect and murder has been thoroughly discussed in the Indian press and in scholarly investigations. It has been noted that infant girls are killed with potions of opium in Rajasthan and pastes of poisonous oleander in Tamil Nadu--most especially girls preceded by the birth of several sisters. Clinics offering ultrasound and amniocentesis in order to detect and abort female fetuses have become popular in various parts of the country, and many thousands of female fetuses have been so destroyed.
In Maharashtra, Rajasthan, and Punjab such selective abortions have been outlawed because of pressure from feminist groups. More usually, girls are simply fed and cared for less well than their brothers.
http://www.indianchild.com/indian_children.htm
I agree. My impression is that the OP is showing that in some societies female babies are less desirable and treated very differently. There is no way to deny that this is not the case so i dont understand the tangents some posters have gone off on.
No one is denying that it happens. But what is the root cause? And what is the solution?
It is not solely an issue in India, but elsewhere as well. Probably more so in China where the male population now outweighs the female population by a fairly drastic amount.
So what is the solution?
And most importantly in this thread, is it connected with the murder of this little girl? Do you think it is connected? Do you think he spared his other two daughters and killed just their third daughter because he wanted a son?
Isn't it funny how one can't even attempt to interpret the behaviour of an individual in the context of their cultural background without being accused of racism? Even postulating that perhaps a man may have killed his young daughter because his native culture tends to devalue girls (in relation to boys) is a big no-no, apparently.
Interpret what? His psychiatrists and the police who interviewed and spoke to him at length have stated his motives. So what exactly are we interpreting? What his neighbour's think? Was the milkman and local butcher also consulted on his motives?
I am curious. If he really didn't want another girl, why didn't he force his wife to abort the child when they found out it was a girl? It is legal in Canada, you know. If he really hated her for being a girl, why wait two years to kill her?
Clearly Shorty doesn't feel guilty. But that doesn't stop ass kissing apologists from trying to push their white guilt on others. You've been attempting it on this very thread, harassing Shorty mercilessly over her 'racist' comments and trying to get her to admit with head hung that she's a shameless, uneducated dirty racist. (Oh my god, racism, call the thought police! Think of the children!)
I don't need to get her to admit anything.
And who has 'white guilt'? What does that have to do with a father murdering his daughter?
So we aren't allowed to ask shorty any questions because it would be construed as being harassment? Ah I get it, we need to treat her with kid gloves and pat her on the head condescendingly like she's a little girl. She's a grown woman posting in a forum that is mostly populated by adults. If she posts a thread like this and makes gross exaggerations that are, at their core, racist, then yes, should should be allowed to be questioned about her exaggerations and wild rants about Indians. Or are we to treat her differently for some reason? Are we meant to hold her to a lower standard?
And there's never any need for you to come riding to SAM's rescue, but you do it anyway. Really, for you of all people to belittle others for sticking up for their friends is a fucking laugh.
The day that Sam needs me or anyone to come to the rescue is the day that hell freezes over.
Michael
02-07-09, 06:52 PM
RE: OP
I just think some people are born a little f8cked up in the head. A combination of cultural expectation and misaligned DNA. Somewhere in this man's insanity was the desperate need to have male offspring. Add to this a complete break with reality. *poof* psycho killer.
M
Note: I just got series 1 & 2 of Dexter. Two comments - the fact that the entire series were each downloaded in HD onto one DVD is amazing technology. I play them using PS3 and I needed a program to decode the data but wow, that's amazing. Second comment - the Dexter character make me wonder if serial killers really think like this. Hopefully in the future we can DNA test for this sort of thing.
Buffalo Roam
02-07-09, 07:10 PM
That is a fact in the Middle East, across to Asia, male children are a sign of virility, and a status symbol among peers.
Face, self esteem, and the esteem of other males is all involved with being able to produce male offspring.
Females are seen as a drag on the family economy, and that is contributed to by the dowry.
Mail Offspring will bring wealth onto a family, and Female Child will cause loss of wealth because of the Dowry that has to accompany her in marriage in many cultures, especially in the Asian Cultures.
http://rupeenews.com/2008/04/15/indian-girl-infanticide-female-foeticide-1-million-girls-killed-before-or-after-birth-per-year/
According to a recent report by the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) up to 50 million girls and women are missing from India’ s population as a result of systematic gender discrimination in India. In most countries in the world, there are approximately 105 female births for every 100 males.
In India, there are less than 93 women for every 100 men in the population. The accepted reason for such a disparity is the practice of female infanticide in India, prompted by the existence of a dowry system which requires the family to pay out a great deal of money when a female child is married. For a poor family, the birth of a girl child can signal the beginning of financial ruin and extreme hardship.
However this anti-female bias is by no means limited to poor families. Much of the discrimination is to do with cultural beliefs and social norms. These norms themselves must be challenged if this practice is to stop.
Diagnostic teams with ultrasound scanners which detect the sex of a child advertise with catchlines such as spend 600 rupees now and save 50,000 rupees later.
The implication is that by avoiding a girl, a family will avoid paying a large dowry on the marriage of her daughter. According to UNICEF, the problem is getting worse as scientific methods of detecting the sex of a baby and of performing abortions are improving.
These methods are becoming increasing available in rural areas of India, fuelling fears that the trend towards the abortion of female foetuses is on the increase
from the February 09, 2005 edition More than a million girls are killed at birth or aborted
BBC News | TALKING POINT | How can female infanticide be sto...
Jul 17, 2000 ... In that case how can we blame the Indian woman for practising ... There is a strong belief that having a female child is expensive when it come to marriage and dowry. .... dowry murders, female circumcision, the Taleban's ban on women ... sections of society show a preference for male offspring's. ...
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/talking_point/828681.stm - 61k - Similar pages
Buffalo Roam
02-07-09, 07:13 PM
By Uma Girish | Contributor to The Christian Science Monitor
MADRAS, INDIA - The oleander plant yields a bright, pleasant flower, but also a milky sap that, if ingested, can be a deadly poison. It’s one of the methods families use to kill newborn girls in the Salem District of Tamil Nadu, a part of India notorious for female infanticide.
http://rupeenews.com/2008/04/15/indian-girl-infanticide-female-foeticide-1-million-girls-killed-before-or-after-birth-per-year/
In Salem district, for instance, signs posted in towns reinforce the societal message: “Pay 500 rupees and save 50,000 rupees later,” a suggestion that aborting a female fetus now could save a fortune in wedding expenses in the future.
Salem district, a mostly rural part of Tamil Nadu, has a longstanding reputation as a deathtrap for baby girls. The Vellala Gounder community, the dominant caste there, owns most of the land and is intent on retaining property rights within the family. Sons represent lineage; daughters marry and relocate to their husbands’ homes. As a result, local women, like Lakshmi, who gave birth to a girl early last year, may refuse to nurse their newborns. They leave it to midwives or mothers-in-law to administer the oleander sap, say anti-infanticide activists.
Nearly 60 percent of girls born in Salem District are killed within three days of birth, according to the local social welfare department. That doesn’t count the growing number of abortions there to ensure a girl baby won’t be carried to term.
*Sigh*
Which has what to do with a father murdering his daughter in Canada?
Can you prove that his motives were as you are ranting on and on about? Yes? No? The only proof you have is what his neighbours have said. Is he from communities in India where killing daughters is apparently common? Yes? No?
Why did he allow his other two daughters to survive or live? Why didn't his wife have an abortion when they found out it would have been a girl? Why did he wait two years to kill her if he didn't want to have another daughter? And what of the case itself? Should he be jailed? Should he be placed in a psychiatric institution? You know.. how about we discuss the topic itself instead of ranting about India while ignoring that killing baby girls also happen in other cultures and counties around the world?..
As yet, no one has even addressed the case of the OP, instead going on and on about what it is like in India.
If you are so outraged about what goes on in India, you'd be even more outraged about what goes on in other countries where boys are valued more over girls. Ah wait, they don't count, do they?
shorty_37
02-07-09, 07:50 PM
*Sigh*
how about we discuss the topic itself
HAHA! This coming from you? :rolleyes:
shorty_37
02-07-09, 08:05 PM
Ok so he claims the reason behind the murder was because of stress and the financial trouble they were having. If that is the case why did he quit his job voluntarily right after his new daughter was born, doesn't make sense. So if she was 2, he was out of work for 2 yrs? He moped around for all that time for what reason? It seems to have come about as a result of having another baby. So his financial stress was brought on himself by his own doing. So when it says that he was depressed about having another girl and no sons it kinda adds up, that this all started after her birth. It is very possible that he talked to the neighbors about his disappointment of not having sons. Or are we to assume that they were all just lying? They just pulled that out of their asses. Now from the article it says as new immigrants they moved into the "Indian" community in BC. So it is not that far fetched that he spoke of his disappointment with other Indians in his neighborhood, that might understand. So most likely these neighbors were Indian, are you saying that Indians are liars too and just made up what he said?
"New immigrants to Canada, the Kahlon family had settled in the Indian-dominant Delta-Surrey area"
nirakar
02-07-09, 08:55 PM
Pure and simple John, they are in denial. They don't want to face the facts or the truth about some things that are still going on.
Why do Indians prefer sons?
Men here are considered ‘superior’, ‘calmer’, ‘more sensible’, ‘dependable’, ‘bread-earners’ and even ‘better drivers!’ Naturally society prefers the male child as he is the ‘superior’ child. :o
Economics plays a large part here. The son is expected to earn and ‘pay back’ by looking after the parents in old age. Usually he does. And in many parts of India the male child grows up and commands a large dowry. A big economic bonanza for the parents, if they manage to sell their son to the highest bidder.
On the other hand, all the money spent on a girl’s education is considered a ‘waste’ as even if the girl earns it will go to the husband’s family. Worse, giving birth to a girl means that the parents will have to ‘buy’ a groom for her when the time comes.
Unless parents stop looking at their children from the economic perspective, the bias against women will never go.
http://nitawriter.wordpress.com/2006/10/19/why-do-indians-prefer-sons-2/
Indian Children
Birth celebrations for baby daughters are more muted than for sons and are sometimes absent altogether.
There is a strong cultural bias toward males. Girls are frequently victims of underfeeding, medical neglect, sex-selective abortion, and outright infanticide.
That girls are victims of fatal neglect and murder has been thoroughly discussed in the Indian press and in scholarly investigations. It has been noted that infant girls are killed with potions of opium in Rajasthan and pastes of poisonous oleander in Tamil Nadu--most especially girls preceded by the birth of several sisters. Clinics offering ultrasound and amniocentesis in order to detect and abort female fetuses have become popular in various parts of the country, and many thousands of female fetuses have been so destroyed.
In Maharashtra, Rajasthan, and Punjab such selective abortions have been outlawed because of pressure from feminist groups. More usually, girls are simply fed and cared for less well than their brothers.
http://www.indianchild.com/indian_children.htm
Why have so many cultures pretended women are inferior?
Why did it take so long for women to get the vote in the USA?
Why are women sluts if they like sex but men are virile when they like sex?
There are 3 things that I see that set women apart from men. Women are physically weaker and women tend to be less outwardly ambitious than men and women get more involved in the lives of their children than men do.
Men get obsessive in their ambitions and fascinations with all sorts of impractical endeavors. This single pointedness can help men rise to the top in their specialties and can make it seem that men are more capable than women.
We men may not comfortable with our women interacting with other men and we have the physical ability to enforce our will if our culture does not discourage that.
India is behind the USA on feminism. Fairness for women is increasing in India but it has a long way to go. We Americans should not be self righteous about our superiority to most of the world on the topic of fairness towards women because we have not yet finished making our society as fair to women as it could be.
You were right about the Indian preference for male children being economic.
I have no idea why the brides family should give a dowry. It must just be part of general male supremacy culture. In India dowry was outlawed in 1961 but the practice has not been wiped out.
More important than Dowry is that by tradition the brides go to live with the groom's families. In India and most of the world you depend on your children to take care of you in your old age.
A extended family raise a girl to young adulthood and then the family loses her efforts and skills to the groom's family. Family's are the economic unit. Why educate a girl when the benefits of that education go to the grooms family or worse, get wasted. A educated girl may not be submissive which could be a problem for family harmony. Women are sheltered from relatively strange men when possible which could make it difficult to apply her education in a career.
When I went to villages that had never seen a blond haired westerner all the boys would gather around to check out me (the equivalent of a circus freak) and try their English. I could see that the girls also wanted to come but they had to keep their distance.
15 years later the same villages had turned into suburbs and the girls there could talk to me if they wanted to but I was no longer much of a novelty. The old ways carry on in villages farther from the city.
I am so used to the posts of the hate mongers that the original post triggered aroused my suspicions that it might have racist undertones. Racism sucks. Xenophobia sucks. Sexism sucks.
What kind of criticism of Indian culture would make Indians want to abandon sexism and what kinds of criticisms would make them embrace sexism just to say Fuck You to the arrogant critics? The same puzzle comes up whenever outsiders feel to criticize anything about other people's cultures regardless which cultures we are talking about.
The guy who killed his child in this story is sick and his behavior is not acceptable in India.
copernicus66
02-07-09, 09:16 PM
Interpret what?
I wasn't aware that the statement "Isn't it funny how one can't even attempt to interpret the behaviour of an individual in the context of their cultural background without being accused of racism?" is vague and ambiguous.
Very well, allow me to elaborate. Hinduism, a religion holds women in low regard, permeates Indian culture. As a result, there is a tendency for girls and women in the Indian culture to be regarded as inferior to their male counter-parts, which is why phenonemon such as wife burning and aborting female fetuses are known to occur in India.
Now, some particular individuals on this thread have been postulating whether it might be possible that such cultural values could have played a role in regards to the original post.
You have levelled accusations of racism against individuals who dare consider such things, despite such considerations being decidedly non-racist.
I am curious. If he really didn't want another girl, why didn't he force his wife to abort the child when they found out it was a girl?
Perhaps his wife would have told him to go fuck himself. Perhaps at that time he did not feel strongly enough to act. His shaky mental state may have exacerbated his resentment about having yet another daughter.
And who has 'white guilt'? What does that have to do with a father murdering his daughter?
Stop feigning ignorance, it doesn't become you.
So we aren't allowed to ask shorty any questions because it would be construed as being harassment?
You shouldn't be allowed to level false accusations of racism against individuals. You shouldn't be allowed to brand particular individuals as racist and/or uneducated, as that constitutes a personal attack. As a moderator, you should know that personal attacks are against the Code of Conduct.
Ah I get it, we need to treat her with kid gloves and pat her on the head condescendingly like she's a little girl.
There are more alternatives that 'Treat like a child' and 'Make bullshit accusations against'.
She's a grown woman posting in a forum that is mostly populated by adults. If she posts a thread like this and makes gross exaggerations that are, at their core, racist,
Except that her 'gross exaggerations' aren't racist. At worst she is stereotyping individuals who belong to a particular culture. But then, she isn't totally off the mark, is she? The Indian culture has an atrocious history in regards to treatment of women, and there is a tendency for Indians to treat their women as second class citizens. Granted not all Indians are like this, but a trend exists.
The day that Sam needs me or anyone to come to the rescue is the day that hell freezes over.
But that has never stopped you from sticking your bib in to defend her against the 'bigots' and naysayers, has it? Perhaps you should think of that the next time you criticise another poster for standing up for a friend.
Ok so he claims the reason behind the murder was because of stress and the financial trouble they were having.
Actually, if you had read your own links properly, the reason given by psychiatrists and police, is that he suffered a severe mental breakdown. He'd been receiving psychiatric help and on anti-depressants for a while before he snapped.
If that is the case why did he quit his job voluntarily right after his new daughter was born, doesn't make sense.
You're trying to make sense out of a father decapitating his daughter?
So if she was 2, he was out of work for 2 yrs?
Doesn't really say. All it says is that he was home after the birth of the baby "most of the time". From your own link:
A construction worker, Kahlon had already had two daughters and was not happy about the birth of Ravinder. After her birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
Now, reading that. Can we say for certain that he was unhappy that she was a girl? Is it even remotely possible that he might have been depressed even if it had been a boy because of the fact that they were in financial straights? Is it possible that the birth of another child did place further financial stress, leading to depression upon him?
He moped around for all that time for what reason?
Do you know anything about depression and what it can do to people?
It seems to have come about as a result of having another baby.
Most probably yes.
So his financial stress was brought on himself by his own doing.
Interesting.
Tell me, as an example. Would you tell a woman suffering from post-natal depression that she brought the depression upon herself because she had a baby?
You do know that men can also suffer from post-natal depression after the birth of a baby, don't you?
But here we have a man, severely depressed and being medicated for severe depression after the birth of a 3rd child and about their financial situation... is unable to go to work as a result of said depression.. And you're saying he bought it upon himself because he didn't go to work?
So when it says that he was depressed about having another girl and no sons it kinda adds up, that this all started after her birth.
What adds up? His neighbour's comments?
It is very possible that he talked to the neighbors about his disappointment of not having sons. Or are we to assume that they were all just lying? They just pulled that out of their asses.
What about all the others who interviewed him at length? What of his doctors who had been treating his severe depression for a while? Are they lying? Or should we only believe the neighbours?
Now from the article it says as new immigrants they moved into the "Indian" community in BC. So it is not that far fetched that he spoke of his disappointment with other Indians in his neighborhood, that might understand.
And? From what I read, they appeared as horrified about the crime as you are. Have there to date been any protest from the "Indian community" saying that he should be released because it is apparently, according to you and your merry band of followers, the norm to kill little girls in India?
So most likely these neighbors were Indian, are you saying that Indians are liars too and just made up what he said?
Hang on. Let me get this straight.
You are basing your opinions of his motives on the assumption that his neighbours were Indian and that he'd have shared his disappointment of not having a son with them? Right. We'll just ignore all the psychiatrists and police officers who investigated this case and his medical and psychiatric history, we'll also ignore the psychiatrist who had been treating him, and we'll just go off the wild assumption that his neighbours are probably Indian and so are right in what they said to the media after the murder. Yeah.. that sounds good..
In her judgment, B.C. Supreme Court Justice Arne Silverman said Kahlon is mentally ill and the killing had nothing to do with the fact that he had no sons.
There had been speculation earlier that Kahlon was depressed because he had only daughters.
But court heard the drywall worker was depressed because he was unemployed and worried about supporting his family.
http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090207/BC_911_beheading_090207/20090207?hub=BritishColumbia
No. Bugger that. That doesn't fit into the profile of "these people" does it?
"New immigrants to Canada, the Kahlon family had settled in the Indian-dominant Delta-Surrey area"
And? Are you telling me there is no chance in hell his neighbours were not Indian? I live in a predominantly Anglo-Saxon suburb. One of our neighbours is Chinese. Hmmm..
shorty_37
02-07-09, 09:31 PM
If abortions is so common in the Indian community, why didn't his wife have one when the sex of the child was discovered?
Surely you know that the sex of the child is not always discovered before birth. I know quite a few women including myself where the sex of the baby could not accurately be told, because of the position of the baby at the time of the test. I wanted to know the sex of mine, but they couldn't tell me. They even waited a bit to see if he would move and they would be able to see better. He was positioned in such a way they couldn't tell me the sex.
They will not do any further testing just to find out the sex of your baby unless they detect an abnormality.
So the sex of the baby might have been a surprise, an unwelcome one.
shorty_37
02-07-09, 09:39 PM
But court heard the drywall worker was depressed because he was unemployed and worried about supporting his family.[/FONT]
Why was he unemployed? This is a contradiction isn't it, to this statement;
A construction worker, Kahlon had already had two daughters and was not happy about the birth of Ravinder. After her birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
So he was depressed and worried about supporting his family so he left his job. :bugeye:
What adds up? His neighbour's comments?
And? From what I read, they appeared as horrified about the crime as you are. Have there to date been any protest from the "Indian community" saying that he should be released because it is apparently, according to you and your merry band of followers, the norm to kill little girls in India?
I never said that the Indian Community wasn't outraged about the murder he committed and how barbaric it was. Where have I said that?
I said that there is a good chance his neighbors were Indian ( Where did I say there is no chance in hell they weren't Indian ? ) and maybe he did talk to some of them about his desire for sons.
You are basically saying that isn't true. This had nothing to do with that. So you are saying that they made up that story and or just liars. Why shouldn't we take into consideration that what they are saying is true, and that is what led him to this deep depression. You take things out of the story just because you don't like what they are implying.
I wasn't aware that the statement "Isn't it funny how one can't even attempt to interpret the behaviour of an individual in the context of their cultural background without being accused of racism?" is vague and ambiguous.
Very well, allow me to elaborate. Hinduism, a religion holds women in low regard, permeates Indian culture. As a result, there is a tendency for girls and women in the Indian culture to be regarded as inferior to their male counter-parts, which is why phenonemon such as wife burning and aborting female fetuses are known to occur in India.
Now, some particular individuals on this thread have been postulating whether it might be possible that such cultural values could have played a role in regards to the original post.
You have levelled accusations of racism against individuals who dare consider such things, despite such considerations being decidedly non-racist.
I think you need to delve a bit deeper than that and actually look at where the accusations of racism stems from.
Perhaps his wife would have told him to go fuck himself. Perhaps at that time he did not feel strongly enough to act. His shaky mental state may have exacerbated his resentment about having yet another daughter.
Perhaps.. Perhaps.. Perhaps..
All we have to go on are the words spoken by the neighbours. To counter that are the doctors and psychiatrists who have been treating him, as well as those who conducted the psychiatric evaluations, and on top of that, the police, who stay differently. But we'll just speculate on the real reasons because he's Indian and that's what "these people" do, isn't it? Chop off their daughter's heads?
You shouldn't be allowed to level false accusations of racism against individuals. You shouldn't be allowed to brand particular individuals as racist and/or uneducated, as that constitutes a personal attack. As a moderator, you should know that personal attacks are against the Code of Conduct.
I don't view my saying this is racially motivated is false. I said some Canadians are probably insulated and uneducated, you automatically assumed I meant shorty.
And as a moderator, I also advised the moderator of this particular forum that a warning should be given to me. I await the words of this site's owners in that regard.
There are more alternatives that 'Treat like a child' and 'Make bullshit accusations against'.
So we can't question her at all about what she posts? That's what you're saying? She's to be given free reign to insult and abuse others on this site, make racially motivated comments, make wild and unfounded insinuations and extreme generalisations, but when it's done back to her, well that's just bad. I didn't realise she was so sensitive as to require you and others to stick up for her so. I shall be sure to treat her with kid gloves in the future. I'll do my best to see that she's treated like she's 'spesh'.
Except that her 'gross exaggerations' aren't racist. At worst she is stereotyping individuals who belong to a particular culture. But then, she isn't totally off the mark, is she? The Indian culture has an atrocious history in regards to treatment of women, and there is a tendency for Indians to treat their women as second class citizens. Granted not all Indians are like this, but a trend exists.
I am not even going to bother to point out the irony of your statement.
Her gross exaggerations were racist. Stereotyping people based on ethnicity is racist. Or did that little fact escape you somewhat?
But that has never stopped you from sticking your bib in to defend her against the 'bigots' and naysayers, has it? Perhaps you should think of that the next time you criticise another poster for standing up for a friend.
I don't wear a bib! I carry a towel around to mop up the drool thank you very much.
Heh.. again, Sam does not need anyone to come to her aid. Especially against the bigots in this thread.
Ah, so you're her friend? I guess that explains her quick and prompt edit where she denied even knowing you.:)
------------------------------------------------------
Surely you know that the sex of the child is not always discovered before birth. I know quite a few women including myself where the sex of the baby could not accurately be told, because of the position of the baby at the time of the test. I wanted to know the sex of mine, but they couldn't tell me. They even waited a bit to see if he would move and they would be able to see better. He was positioned in such a way they couldn't tell me the sex.
So he waited two years before he killed her?
Ermm ok.
That makes sense.:rolleyes:
So the sex of the baby might have been a surprise, an unwelcome one.
I would imagine that after two years, he'd have figured out it was a girl.
He quit his job right after the birth and became depressed.
I believe he became depressed and then became unemployed by means which are as yet, a tad confusing to you.
Why? Isn't that usually a joyous occasion for a family?
Again, would you tell a woman suffering from post-natal depression that she shouldn't be depressed because having a baby is a "joyous occasion for a family"?
Why would it bother him so much that he would put his family in financial jeopardy by quitting his job?
Not to point out the obvious, but did you miss the parts where they were in financial straights anyway?
Why was he unemployed? This is a contradiction isn't it, to this statement;
A construction worker, Kahlon had already had two daughters and was not happy about the birth of Ravinder. After her birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
Umm ok.
Shorty.
I can't believe I even have to define this.
When someone does not work, they are referred to as unemployed. Why? Because they are not currently employed. Get it now?
One does not become unemployed only when fired from work. You can quit your job and be referred to as being unemployed.
Do. You. Get. It. Now?
So he was depressed and worried about supporting his family so he left his job.
/facepalm
No shorty. He left his job because he was depressed. Depressed people often are unemployed because they are unable to work or hold down a job. Now if he was severely depressed about their financial situation (as stated by his psychiatrist, court psychiatrist, the police, the judge, etc) and a third child caused that financial strain.. he gets depressed and stops working as a result of said depression.... Does it need to be spelled out for you?:bugeye:
I said that there is a good chance his neighbors were Indian ( Where did I say there is no chance in hell they weren't Indian ? ) and maybe he did talk to some of them about why he was depressed. Maybe it was the whole issue of having no sons, like they said he told them. You are basically saying that isn't true. This had nothing to do with that. So you are saying that they made up that story and or just liars. Why shouldn't we take into consideration that what they are saying is true, and that is what led him to this deep depression. You take things out of the story just because you don't like what they are implying.
Or maybe, it was as his psychiatrists, court appointed psychiatrists, the police and others have said.. he snapped after suffering from severe depression caused by financial difficulties since the birth of his third child.
You based your whole assumption about his motives solely on what his neighbours said the media.. then you say that because he lives in a predominately Indian community, his neighbours are probably Indian and he might have opened up to them. So far, the only people who have said it was because he had no son's have been his neighbours. His family, doctors, police, court, have stated a completely different reason. My comments, since things need to be spelled out to you, is that you appear to be disregarding everything else and concentrating solely on the 'he had no son's' angle based only on your wild assumptions and exaggerations about their culture. You disregard everything else because it doesn't fit in with what you are trying to argue in this thread..
I'm not taking things out of the story. You are in the manner in which you completely ignored and disregarded experts because it doesn't fit in with what you are trying to portray about "these people".
shorty_37
02-07-09, 10:18 PM
Ah, so you're her friend? I guess that explains her quick and prompt edit where she denied even knowing you.:)
------------------------------------------------------
Ok I don't need to take your BS accusations anymore, and I am reporting you. I denied knowing them because I don't know them, understand? What the fuck editing are you talking about. :confused: I don't know if this member is male/female...where they are from....why they are defending my posts. I am so sick and tired of you and Sam accusing me of some kind of gang up with other members. You are fucking paranoid do you know that. Is that the only defense you have against me...making up bullshit and trying to make me out to be a liar..... and you call me pathetic. The point the poster was making if you could actually get over yourself was, your comments about Nietzsche (that was the friend) riding in to defend me. You seem to think that you intimidate me that I need to call in for back up. Really you should try and get over your over inflated ego, it isn't very becoming.
Challenger78
02-07-09, 10:30 PM
I just heard this on the news. What the hell is wrong with these ppl.
Burning their daughters with acid, beheading toddlers....
It says he was depressed he had no sons. Does this mean this poor toddler was beheaded just because it was the wrong sex.:shrug:
Is it that important to Indians to have sons?
Indian Canadian admits to beheading two-year-old daughter
An Indian-Canadian father, who had strangled and then decapitated his two-year-old daughter in the Vancouver suburb of Delta last
year, has pleaded guilty to second-degree murder.
Forty-eight-year-old Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon had slit the throat of his toddler on the morning of Jan 18 last year at the family home when his wife, Manjit, was away to drop their two elder daughters to school.
When she returned home, the wife found the two-year-old Ravinder beheaded.
Full Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
Horrible. Simply horrible.
Even after India had a woman prime minister. This is still going on?
Ok I don't need to take your BS accusations anymore, and I am reporting you. I denied knowing them because I don't know them, understand? What the fuck editing are you talking about. :confused: I don't know if this member is male/female...where they are from....why they are defending my posts. I am so sick and tired of you and Sam accusing me of some kind of gang up with other members. You are fucking paranoid do you know that. Is that the only defense you have against me...making up bullshit and trying to make me out to be a liar..... and you call me pathetic.
Oh calm down. And the report function is there for a reason. Please do use it if you feel the need.
I don't care if you are friends with him or not. Damn you're over sensitive. You are so hung up about what I think of you that you freely throw wild accusations about me throwing accusations about you. The irony.:rolleyes: I was commenting about what I was directly observing in this thread from your words and his.
Horrible. Simply horrible.
Even after India had a woman prime minister. This is still going on?
It happened in Canada.
Buffalo Roam
02-07-09, 10:58 PM
It happened in Canada.
Yes, and these stories are from India and we have a lucky one, She survived:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6275770.stm
Baby survives being buried alive
The practice of female infanticide still occurs in rural areas
A two-day-old baby girl in India has survived after being buried alive in a field by her maternal grandfather in the south of the country.
The baby, who had apparently never been fed, was discovered by a farmer near a village some 150km south of Hyderabad.
He said he only spotted her because her tiny hand was sticking out of the soil.
Police say they have arrested the baby's grandfather, 52-year-old Abdul Rahman, after he confessed to trying to kill the newborn by burying her alive.
"I am yet to marry off four daughters and cannot take responsibility for a fifth one, even when she is only a granddaughter," Mr Rahman was quoted as telling police.
Or how about sending them back to India to have abortions?
British Asians aborting unwanted girls - Times Onl...
Dec 3, 2007 ... Cultural pressure to give birth to sons is causing some pregnant Indian-born women living in Britain to return to India to abort their ...
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/art... - Similar pages
One British-born mother, who has three daughters, tells the programme that she terminated a pregnancy intentionally last year. “Meena”, an office worker in her 30s, said that she had no difficulty in finding a gynaecologist in Delhi willing to do a scan to determine the sex of the baby, and then to perform the abortion.
“Me and my husband decided to go to India and try and find out what we were having and unfortunately it was another girl,” she said. “My husband and I thought the burden would probably be too much. So we decided to terminate.”
And this baby wasn't so lucky:
http://www.mumbaimirror.com/index.aspx?page=article§id=15&contentid=20090125200901252336514169f55d722
Mom smashes newborn’s head, dumps her in bin
Woman, who already has a daughter born out of wedlock, says family refused to let her keep baby
Shefali Sheth, 28, of Pratik Building, Navghar Road, Bhayandar (E) delivered the baby girl at home on January 15 with the help of her mother, sister and brother who had hidden the pregnancy to avoid social censure, a senior officer of the Mira Road police said.
Shefali told the cops that the delivery was conducted in the bathroom of the Sheths’s ground-floor flat at night when she went into labour. The baby girl had barely taken her first breath when, in a horrifying moment of desperation, Shefali said, she banged the infant’s head against the bathroom wall resulting in instant death. The family then wrapped the baby’s corpse in a plastic bag before throwing the package from the bathroom window into a garbage bin located outside. The umbilical cord was still attached to the baby, said police
shorty_37
02-07-09, 11:04 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6275770.stm
Baby survives being buried alive
Government figures suggest that around 10 million girls have been killed by their parents - either in the womb or immediately after birth - over the past two decades.
Holy Crap... If I had my way all these murderers would suffer the exact same death as their children did.
Challenger78
02-07-09, 11:06 PM
Are there grades of filicides? Is it better to abort, drop from a height, set on fire, microwave or shoot with a sniper rifle?
Killing a child is killing a child
It happened in Canada.
Even so, I was speaking culturally.
Dr Lou Natic
02-08-09, 12:50 AM
Indians and middle easterners do decapitate and set eachother on fire and etc way more readily and for more obscurely ridiculous reasons than westerners. Denying this is laughable, don't bother, we're all intelligent adults and it won't wash.
Often you'll hear these stories coming out of canada or australia or britain and it's like "father sets daughter on fire for twisting her ankle" and you'll be like "what the fucking hell?! huh? I don't understand how anyone..." and then inevitably you find out they're indian or pakistani or something and it's like "ahhh, ofcourse, whatever" and everyone just forgets about it. Always. It doesn't matter if the story is coming from india, pakistan, united arab emirates, usa, canada, australia, whatever, these crazy crimes always wind up being commited by someone named "Changladesh Sedulker" or something along those lines. Fact.
Yes, and these stories are from India and we have a lucky one, She survived:
Tragic indeed. But again, what does the deaths of baby girls in India have to do with one isolated incident in Canada? Is there a spate of Indians killing their baby girls in Canada? Are there a lot of depressed Canadian fathers slicing their daughter's throats open? No. The last similar gruesome crime in Canada where a parent did such a thing to a child was back in 2002 (http://www.primetimecrime.com/Recent/murder_Kyla_%20Aune.htm).
A Nanaimo woman slit her two-year-old daughter's throat before cutting up the body, cooking it with other ingredients and eating the soup.
http://www.primetimecrime.com/Recent/murder_Kyla_%20Aune.htm
And guess what, she's not Indian.
But she is mentally ill. Just like this guy is mentally ill. But we'll just ignore everything that his doctors and the police have said about his motives and just stick to the fact that he is Indian, and his killing his daughter is therefore, a foregone conclusion that it was because he did not have a son.
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 09:36 AM
Tragic indeed. But again, what does the deaths of baby girls in India have to do with one isolated incident in Canada? Is there a spate of Indians killing their baby girls in Canada? Are there a lot of depressed Canadian fathers slicing their daughter's throats open? No. The last similar gruesome crime in Canada where a parent did such a thing to a child was back in 2002 (http://www.primetimecrime.com/Recent/murder_Kyla_%20Aune.htm).
And guess what, she's not Indian.
But she is mentally ill. Just like this guy is mentally ill. But we'll just ignore everything that his doctors and the police have said about his motives and just stick to the fact that he is Indian, and his killing his daughter is therefore, a foregone conclusion that it was because he did not have a son.
Bells,your the one who keeps wanting to isolate this incident to Canada, and ignore the broader implications of the cultural and social norms of India and the rest of the Asia's in these acts.
Yes, it happens in the west, but it is not condoned by these societies, and it is not a accepted cultural or social norm.
“ Originally Posted by Challenger78
Horrible. Simply horrible.
Even after India had a woman prime minister. This is still going on? ”
It happened in Canada.
Is not a accepted cultural or social norm, in Canada, but it is a accepted cultural and social norm, in India, and a large part of the rest of Asia and the East.
The last similar gruesome crime in Canada where a parent did such a thing to a child was back in 2002 (http://www.primetimecrime.com/Recent/murder_Kyla_%20Aune.htm).
Yes, and you just proved Shorty's point, and my point, the Last time something this gruesome happened in Canada was 2002, the last time something like this was committed in India was this morining, today , yesterday, last week, last year, and it will happen tomorrow, in the next week and through out the coming year in India and Asia where it is accepted and practiced as a accepted cultural and social norm.
shorty_37
02-08-09, 11:48 AM
I find it strange that Bells keeps trying to tear strips off me for making this thread in the first place. She went so off topic with ranting and insults that most of her posts got deleted.
Then you see a post like Dr Lou and she says nothing. :rolleyes: Doesn't make sense does it?
It only shows how this is just a personal attack against me personally.
What is Bells scared of the Big Bad Dr Lou?
StrawDog
02-08-09, 02:51 PM
I just heard this on the news. What the hell is wrong with these ppl.
Burning their daughters with acid, beheading toddlers....
It says he was depressed he had no sons. Does this mean this poor toddler was beheaded just because it was the wrong sex.:shrug:
Is it that important to Indians to have sons?
Indian Canadian admits to beheading two-year-old daughter
An Indian-Canadian father, who had strangled and then decapitated his two-year-old daughter in the Vancouver suburb of Delta last
year, has pleaded guilty to second-degree murder.
Forty-eight-year-old Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon had slit the throat of his toddler on the morning of Jan 18 last year at the family home when his wife, Manjit, was away to drop their two elder daughters to school.
When she returned home, the wife found the two-year-old Ravinder beheaded.
Full Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons.
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
This is just so sad. :(
shorty_37
02-08-09, 06:09 PM
Yes very....
Considering there are waiting lists a mile long to adopt any sex babies the whole idea of killing an infant because of their sex, makes me sick to my stomach. It angers me so much that jail time wouldn't even be an option if it was up to me.
Indians and middle easterners do decapitate and set eachother on fire and etc way more readily and for more obscurely ridiculous reasons than westerners. Denying this is laughable, don't bother, we're all intelligent adults and it won't wash.
Often you'll hear these stories coming out of canada or australia or britain and it's like "father sets daughter on fire for twisting her ankle" and you'll be like "what the fucking hell?! huh? I don't understand how anyone..." and then inevitably you find out they're indian or pakistani or something and it's like "ahhh, ofcourse, whatever" and everyone just forgets about it. Always. It doesn't matter if the story is coming from india, pakistan, united arab emirates, usa, canada, australia, whatever, these crazy crimes always wind up being commited by someone named "Changladesh Sedulker" or something along those lines. Fact.
You often hear of fathers decapitating their children, do you? Lets see, last one we had in Australia was when a teenager was decapitated by his two friends who then used his head as a bowling bowl. And no, they weren't Indian or Muslim. In Canada, the last one before this sad incident when a woman sliced her daughter's throat open and then chopped up said daughter and cooked her in a soup, that she then had for dinner. And again, she was not Indian.
Bells,your the one who keeps wanting to isolate this incident to Canada, and ignore the broader implications of the cultural and social norms of India and the rest of the Asia's in these acts.
Yes, it happens in the west, but it is not condoned by these societies, and it is not a accepted cultural or social norm.
Let me try to make it clear for you, since it would appear you have a problem understanding big words.
If this mentally ill man had not been Indian, this thread would never have even been started. If he had not been Indian, you wouldn't even bother to even look or glance at it.
You are in a rabid froth simply because he is Indian. So the only reason you are harping on and on about events in a different country, in no way related to this particular story, is because you can't seem to get your brain around the simple fact that his ethnicity aside, this man is mentally ill..
You prefer to ignore the reports from his doctors who have been treating his mental illness for years, the police who spoke to him at length, even the court appointed psychiatrists. Why? Because he is Indian. And because he is Indian, you prefer to jump to stupid stereotyping.. No Buffalo, not every Indian slices their daughter's heads off because she happens to be a girl.
And yes Buffalo, there are some Indians who are mentally ill who will commit atrocious crimes. And those crimes aren't committed because they are Indian. They committed them because they are mentally ill.
Now, had reports been stated from his doctors, the police, his family that said the reason he did it was because she was a little girl and he wanted a boy, then yes, then we could go into the crimes in India where little girls are murdered. But all the evidence points to the very simple fact that he is mentally ill and his depression stemmed from financial stress. But noooo.. what do you argue? He did it because he's from India.
shorty_37
02-08-09, 07:16 PM
If this mentally ill man had not been Indian, this thread would never have even been started.
Uhhhh I think is you who can't read. I stated numerous times why I started the thread.
Just to be clear here SAM (although I don't know why I bother) When we heard this on the news, it was just a snippet of what was to come later on the news. We did not know the nationality of the family in question. We were both shocked to hear in this day and age someone beheading their own child. When I looked on the computer I saw the full story. I would be just as
disgusted if they were German, Polish, Irish, Jewish, Italian whatever. I still would have posted the story here.
Maybe you are used to it, but hearing someone decapitated thier own daughter is still a bit shocking to me.
You just get off talking down to people, and listening to yourself talk.
Why the hell does it bother you so much that I started this thread? It seems to me you would have been fine if I had started this thread if it was about a family of any other nationality but Indian. There is a trend in their culture towards females, and trying to pretend their isn't just make you look like an idiot.
I don't really care if you think it had nothing to do with this particular murder, I do. It seems there are others here who seem to think so too.
Let me try to make it clear for you, since it would appear you have a problem understanding big words.
Just because the Almighty Bells has spoken in a demeaning way from her high horse doesn't change the facts.
Uhhhh I think is you who can't read. I stated numerous times why I started the thread.
Maybe you are used to it, but hearing someone decapitated thier own daughter is still a bit shocking to me.
You just get off talking down to people, and listening to yourself talk.
Why the hell does it bother you so much that I started this thread? It seems to me you would have been fine if I had started this thread if it was about a family of any other nationality but Indian. There is a trend in their culture towards females, and trying to pretend their isn't just make you look like an idiot.
I don't really care if you think it had nothing to do with this particular murder, I do. It seems there are others here who seem to think so too.
Just because the Almighty Bells has spoken in a demeaning way from her high horse doesn't change the facts.
As they say, you can tell more about a person about the company they keep.:)
Again, why do you think the reason he decapitated his daughter is because it has happened in India? Why do you completely disregard the psychiatrists, his own psychiatrists who has been treating him for a couple of years now, the police who investigated this, the court.. why do you completely ignore all of what they have said and instead concentrate only on the fact the killing and abortion of girls happens in India, and so this must be connected because he is Indian? Why have you completely disregarded and ignored all of the testimony, court testimony, and rely solely on what a few of his neighbours have claimed to the media? Don't you think they would have investigated all of that?
This case involves a mentally ill man who killed his daughter... And yet, you completely disregard everything that the people who have been treating him for years for his illness and you concentrate only on the fact that he is Indian. As you said in your OP, "these people".. Do you think he killed his daughter because he is one of "these people"? Or are you more of an expert than his doctors and psychiatrists who have been treating him for years and have stated the cause of his depression?
How can I put this any simpler. You prefer to jump to stereotyping and gross over-exaggerations and ignore all the evidence and testimony of experts because it doesn't fit into the little box you have in your head. I choose not to. Is that simple enough for you?
shorty_37
02-08-09, 10:05 PM
As they say, you can tell more about a person about the company they keep.:)
Oh please do elaborate. What about the company I keep?
Not up to your high standards? Not educated enough? Not enough self inflated ego for you? Aren't politically correct enough for you? Don't share the same opinions as the High and Mighty Bells? Don't worship your every word? ................................................:y awn:
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 10:28 PM
Bells since it seems that you are the one who doesn't understand, that the social and cultural norms of a recent immigrat are still the social and cultural norms of the home country.
Treating him for years? what years, he was a receant immagrant,
can't your read and understand simple words?
New immigrants to Canada, the Kahlon family had settled in the Indian-dominant Delta-Surrey area in Vancouver's suburb.
Now here is another News Story that you conviently keep ignoring:
Dad strangled, then beheaded 2-year-old daughter: Crown
http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/475816
The Canadian Press
NEW WESTMINSTER, B.C.
A B.C. court has heard horrific details about the murder of a two-year-old girl who was allegedly beheaded by her father. The Crown alleges Lakvinder Kahlon tried to strangle his daughter while she was drinking milk and watching TV before he carried her to the kitchen where he severed her head with a knife. Crown evidence includes a 911 call in which Kahlon says he killed his daughter. The mother found the girl after coming home from walking her two older daughters to school. Kahlon was an out-of-work drywaller who was depressed because he had no sons
And why was he out of work?
From the first News Story:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indo-Canadian_admits_beheading_daughter/rssarticleshow/4078687.cms
A construction worker, Kahlon had already had two daughters and was not happy about the birth of Ravinder. After her birth, he had left his work and stayed at home most of the time.
And as to your story about
Lets see, last one we had in Australia was when a teenager was decapitated by his two friends who then used his head as a bowling bowl.
Is this a social and cultural practice in Austrilia?
The murder of baby girls in India is, and Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon, is still a product of His Social up bringing and Cultural norms, at 47 he was fully conditioned to the Social and Cultural norms of His home country,
Here are some more News stories on this Murder:
http://www.nriinternet.com/NRI_Murdered/CANADA/BC/A_Z/K/Lakhvinder_Kahlon/index.htm
NRI Lakhvinder Kahlon killed baby daughter Because He Wanted Son
Delta, B.C., Canada, Jan 21, 2008
Lachman Singh
NRI Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon, 47, was arrested on suspicion of murder and accused of killing his 18 months old daughter in Delta City near Vancouver because he wanted a son instead of a daughter, the source said. He was unhappy having a third daughter over two daughters age 9 and 12.
According to media, on Friday about 9 a.m., Delta police Const. Paul Eisenzimmer said the child, Rajwinder (Ravi) Kahlon whom he described as a "toddler," was dead. Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon in the house at 7888 116 St. was arrested.
A family friend said Lakhvinder's wife Manjit had taken her two elementary-school daughters to school on Friday morning and when she returned home minutes later, she discovered that her youngest daughter had been killed.
It did not confirmed by the police how Kahlon killed the daughter, but the neighbours said his wife told them that he had slit her throat. They also told that he treated her rudely. Another neighbour saod that the baby girl had been stabbed multiple times with a kitchen knife
"Murder is a brutal crime," authorities said. "Detectives worked to ensure this murderer never has the chance to harm anyone else. He killed his own child because she was the wrong gender."
Records from the Land Titles Office show that the family home, with an assessed value of $404,200, had two mortgages registered against the property.
On Monday, the devastated family said, "the media to refrain from all speculations about the tragedy and the girl's mother Manjit is extremely and understandably distraught at what has taken place with her family. Her little girl was vibrant and precious. Please respect that we are grieving."
The Court will now decide whether Kahlon is fit to stand trial when he appears before it again February 15, 2008. He faces first-degree murder charge. He looked deeply pressed when he appeared in court on Monday. Looking Kahlon distraught, the judge ordered that Kahlon should undergo psychiatric assessment.
The defence lawyer said he would demand leniency for his client because of his mental state at the time of the crime.
Ujjal Dosanjh, MP and former Canadian health minister said: "I wonder how long South Asian women and girls will have to suffer at the hands of men. It is time for a drastic change."
Balwant Sanghera, a retired school psychologist and community leader, said he would propose stopping celebrations of boys' birth at religious places as a mark of respect for the murdered girl.
Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon was working in construction as a drywaller but had not been working recently. He is clean-shaven and does not drink. Manjit Kahlon, had worked as a seamstress
Lakhvinder Singh Kahlon belongs to Punia village near Nakodar in Jalandhar district.
http://everything2.com/e2node/Female%2520infanticide%2520in%2520India
Effects
In October of 1992 the Indian state Tamil Nadu sought to eliminate all female infanticides by the year 2000 with a program called "Jayalalitha Protection Scheme for the Girl Child" which gives monetary compensation to poor families in exchange for sterilization, gives money in the name of the female infants not to be accessed until they turn 21, and awards grants for educational expenses of female students (which has not been very effective, as giving women money at 21, or around the time of marriage, in essence legitimizes the illegal dowry practice). In August 1997 the Indian Prime Minister adopted this plan for all of India which became known as the "Cradle Baby Scheme." However, the practice still continues.
In the early years of the 21st century, in India's southern Salem district, an estimated 4,500 female infants were killed. The continued female infanticide and gender-specific abortions has caused the gender birth ratio of 880 females for every 1,000 males. This lopsided figure is not unlike birth gender ratios in the other areas of the world where sons are preferred. In some areas of India there are very few women and girls left.
Dying for the Male Child
Indian Express >. Most Read Articles; Most Emailed Articles ... What is shocking , however, is the co-relation between literacy rates and female foeticide/ infanticide. ... Jalandhar city, for instance has a sex ratio of 786:1000, ...
www.indianexpress.com/oldstory.php?storyid=16090 - 33k - Similar pages
shorty_37
02-08-09, 10:38 PM
http://www.nriinternet.com/NRI_Murdered/CANADA/BC/A_Z/K/Lakhvinder_Kahlon/index.htm
So according to this article, Kahlon's friends told media that he was depressed about not having a male heir.
What reason would his FRIENDS have to lie? :shrug:
"Murder is a brutal crime," authorities said. "Detectives worked to ensure this murderer never has the chance to harm anyone else. He killed his own child because she was the wrong gender."
Ujjal Dosanjh, MP and former Canadian health minister said: "I wonder how long South Asian women and girls will have to suffer at the hands of men. It is time for a drastic change."
Hmmmm even an MP believes that this crime was because of the child's gender, or he wouldn't have made such a statement.
Balwant Sanghera, a retired school psychologist and community leader, said he would propose stopping celebrations of boys' birth at religious places as a mark of respect for the murdered girl.
hmmmmmmm an Indian psychologist too......
Buffalo these ppl are just as stupid as us to think the way we do. :rolleyes:
Maybe Bells should speak to them in simple words they might understand too.
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 10:46 PM
Bells
How can I put this any simpler. You prefer to jump to stereotyping and gross over-exaggerations and ignore all the evidence and testimony of experts because it doesn't fit into the little box you have in your head. I choose not to. Is that simple enough for you?
Just Google India and Infanticide and tell us that we:
are stereotyping and gross over-exaggerations
Consider Muktsar. The district has a literacy rate of only 58.67 per cent, and 886 girls to 1000 boys. Roopnagar, with 78.49 literacy, has only 791 girls to 1000 boys in the same age group. The conclusion is unavoidable. As Pramod Kumar, director of the Institute of Development Communication, Chandigarh, says, ‘‘Literacy increases awareness about pre-natal diagnostic techniques.’’ It is a theory confirmed by Census 2001: The more prosperous and literate a state, the worse is its child-sex ratio. The BIMARU states — Bihar, Madhya Pradesh, Rajasthan and UP — came up tops in the gender count, while Punjab, the most prosperous state, brought up the rear, preceded marginally by Haryana, Gujarat and Maharashtra.
Natural ratio
The natural sex ratio at birth is estimated close to 1.05 males/female. Due to the generally higher life expectancy of females, sex ratio tends to even out in adult population, and result in an excess of females among the elderly (e.g., the male to female ratio falls from 1.05 for the group aged 15 to 65 to 0.70 for the group over 65 in Germany, from 1.00 to 0.72 in the USA, from 1.06 to 0.91 in mainland China and from 1.07 to 1.02 in India). This article is about the measure of remaining life. ...
In India it is 1.886 male/females. That is almost two to one, and far from the normal or natural ratio.
nietzschefan
02-08-09, 10:50 PM
For all of India? That's worse than China?
Pretty soon there will be nearly a billion disgruntled young men with no chance for a partner. They are either gonna get real liberal, or get real pissed.
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 10:51 PM
Bells
How can I put this any simpler. You prefer to jump to stereotyping and gross over-exaggerations and ignore all the evidence and testimony of experts because it doesn't fit into the little box you have in your head. I choose not to. Is that simple enough for you?
Just Google India and Infanticide and tell us that we:
are stereotyping and gross over-exaggerations
Consider Muktsar. The district has a literacy rate of only 58.67 per cent, and 886 girls to 1000 boys. Roopnagar, with 78.49 literacy, has only 791 girls to 1000 boys in the same age group. The conclusion is unavoidable. As Pramod Kumar, director of the Institute of Development Communication, Chandigarh, says, ‘‘Literacy increases awareness about pre-natal diagnostic techniques.’’ It is a theory confirmed by Census 2001: The more prosperous and literate a state, the worse is its child-sex ratio. The BIMARU states — Bihar, Madhya Pradesh, Rajasthan and UP — came up tops in the gender count, while Punjab, the most prosperous state, brought up the rear, preceded marginally by Haryana, Gujarat and Maharashtra.
Natural ratio
The natural sex ratio at birth is estimated close to 1.05 males/female. Due to the generally higher life expectancy of females, sex ratio tends to even out in adult population, and result in an excess of females among the elderly (e.g., the male to female ratio falls from 1.05 for the group aged 15 to 65 to 0.70 for the group over 65 in Germany, from 1.00 to 0.72 in the USA, from 1.06 to 0.91 in mainland China and from 1.07 to 1.02 in India). This article is about the measure of remaining life. ...
In India it is 1male/.886females at best, and at its worst it is 1male/.791female, those are far from natural numbers.
I give up.
Keep on with your stereotyping. Forget the hard evidence that were gathered in this case and presented to the court. God forbid it is something outside of your prejudiced stereotyping.
I have enough things to turn my stomach today without you adding to it. In short, you're just not even worth a minute of effort anymore.
Ladicius
02-08-09, 10:52 PM
Sorry if this sounds barbaric but, people are killed everyday for whatever reason, and it's good crowd control.
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 10:56 PM
Sorry if this sounds barbaric but, people are killed everyday for whatever reason, and it's good crowd control.
Have you read the thread, that is not what we are discussing.
We are discussing the murder of female infants because the Father want Male children, and doesn't want to be burdened with the raising of a Female child.
shorty_37
02-08-09, 11:03 PM
I give up.
Yeah, it is kind of hard to defend something that is written down in black and white right in front of you. The pathetic thing is you are trying to make us out to be the bad guys. It is very strange that you are a mother and you aren't outraged that this sort of thing is still going on. You are more concerned with pinning a racist badge on everyone who is outraged and disgusted by it. :bugeye:
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 11:06 PM
I give up.
Keep on with your stereotyping. Forget the hard evidence that were gathered in this case and presented to the court. God forbid it is something outside of your prejudiced stereotyping.
I have enough things to turn my stomach today without you adding to it. In short, you're just not even worth a minute of effort anymore.
Bells:
Have you read the thread, that is not what we are discussing.
We are discussing the murder of female infants because the Father wants Male children, and doesn't want to be burdened with the raising of a Female child.
Here we consider that kind of act out of the norm, murdering your baby girl.
In India, were the Father grew up, and was socilized into the cultural norms, it isn't considered a mental problem, to murder female children.
Again do the research ,the Father is a 47/48 year old man who just reacently moved to Canada, so what are His ingrained social, cultural, and moral norms?
Indian, from the village of Nakodar in Jalandhar district, where it is the norm to murder daughters born into the family, because they cost to much in dowery and care.
nietzschefan
02-08-09, 11:07 PM
Bell will defend her race(or whatever the fuck she is arguing about) before her own sex!
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 11:09 PM
Yeah, it is kind of hard to defend something that is written down in black and white right in front of you. The pathetic thing is you are trying to make us out to be the bad guys. It is very strange that you are a mother and you aren't outraged that this sort of thing is still going on. You are more concerned with pinning a racist badge on everyone who is outraged and disgusted by it. :bugeye:
The last defense of a Liberal Politically Correct Raciest, accuse every one else of being raciest when you are loosing the debate.
Yeah, it is kind of hard to defend something that is written down in black and white right in front of you. The pathetic thing is you are trying to make us out to be the bad guys. It is very strange that you are a mother and you aren't outraged that this sort of thing is still going on. You are more concerned with pinning a racist badge on everyone who is outraged and disgusted by it. :bugeye:
Outraged? Very much so.
But my outrage does not stretch to the point where I would jump to conclusions, ignoring all evidence of this particular case in and of itself, ignoring the psychiatrists who have treated him and the police who questioned him. I am not the kind of person who would ignore all evidence because it does not fit into a racist little box I pigeonhole all "brown people" into. I don't jump to conclusions that because he killed his daughter, it's because he's Indian and killing daughters is something that India is trying to overcome. I don't make huge leaps and exaggerate and take my own wild imaginings and try to make it so that it fits the fact, because I think that is what "these people" do.
I other words, I am not you.
And that is all from me in this thread. You can keep frothing at the mouth now.
Ladicius
02-08-09, 11:10 PM
Have you read the thread, that is not what we are discussing.
We are discussing the murder of female infants because the Father want Male children, and doesn't want to be burdened with the raising of a Female child.
Yes I did read mostly everyones posts. The shorter ones at least. I made that comment cause to get strung up on these types of murders being committed by a continent is kinda pointless. Arguing over it now wont change much. There's a reason it hasn't stopped
Buffalo Roam
02-08-09, 11:20 PM
Outraged? Very much so.
But my outrage does not stretch to the point where I would jump to conclusions, ignoring all evidence of this particular case in and of itself, ignoring the psychiatrists who have treated him and the police who questioned him. I am not the kind of person who would ignore all evidence because it does not fit into a racist little box I pigeonhole all "brown people" into. I don't jump to conclusions that because he killed his daughter, it's because he's Indian and killing daughters is something that India is trying to overcome. I don't make huge leaps and exaggerate and take my own wild imaginings and try to make it so that it fits the fact, because I think that is what "these people" do.
I other words, I am not you.
Bells you have ignored a Univers of evidence, as to the actual state of mind of the Slug who murdered his own daughter.
You have missed His Cultural, Social, and Moral conditions, under which he was raised, in favor of the PC if you murder you must be psychologically unstable.
He acted to his cultural norms, and it doesn't matter if he was residing in Canada or India, he would have done the same thing, because those are his Cultural, Social, and Moral, at 48 he is set in his life style, and moral conditioning.
Bleeding heart liberals like you who make every excuse in the book for him are why he isn't getting exactly what he deserves, a long drop and a very short rope.
I would feel the same if he did this in India, were this is part of the Cultural, Social, and Moral norms.
StrawDog
02-09-09, 09:27 PM
This is such a despicable act. I hope justice prevails. The poor child. :(
No, its more about beliefs actually, only a son can perform the last rites for the father.
Though the eldest son does it, traditionally, in case of contingencies, others too can do it. Younger son, a nephew, grandson [through daughter too] too can do it.
Funerals, in every culture, have traditionally been handled by males. Females are generally excluded.
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