The transformation of language:Hajji to Hadji

[S.A.M.]

The term "hadji" (also sometimes spelled "haji" or "hajji") is the Arabic word for someone who has made the pilgrimage to Mecca.

In Iraq and Afghanistan, it has become a common slang term used to describe the locals.

According to a dictionary of war slang compiled by GlobalSecurity.org, the term is "used by the American military for an Iraqi, anyone of Arab decent, or even of a brownish skin tone, be they Afghanis, or even Bangladeshis" and is also "the word many soldiers use derogatorily for the enemy."

Related terms include "haji mart" (a small store operated by Iraqis) or "haji patrol" (Iraqi soldiers).

"Hadji Girl" tells the story of a soldier "out in the sands of Iraq / And we were under attack". Adding to the tenderness of this song, which, according to Marine Times, the high command has apparently forbidden Belile to record, is the fact that “hadji” is a racist term, the new slur for Arabs and Muslims, Iraq war vet Aiden Delgado explained on blackcommentator.com. “It is used extensively in the military,” he said, “. . . with the same kind of connotation as ‘gook,’ ‘Charlie’ or the n-word. Official Army documents now use it in reference to Iraqis or Arabs. It’s real common.” He also said of his Army training: “We sang in cadences. And the chants had anti-Arab themes. Like burning turbans, killing ragheads.”

Are there any other instances of words that were transformed from their original harmless or respectful meanings and converted to derogatory terms?

Source (http://edstrong.blog-city.com/iraq_the_rape_of_a_nation.htm)

[Roman]

Are there any other instances of words that were transformed from their original harmless or respectful meanings and converted to derogatory terms?

Source (http://edstrong.blog-city.com/iraq_the_rape_of_a_nation.htm)

No.

[S.A.M.]

What about nigger? Whats the origin of that word? Or redneck?

[spidergoat]

*igger derives from the French word for black.

[kevinalm]

SAM,
This may interest you. If you say Hadji to most Americans, this is what will most likely come to mind. Scroll down to the "cast of characters".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Quest

Using Hadji to refer brown skinned locals might not be, least in origin, quite as insulting as you might think.

[Fraggle Rocker]

Are there any other instances of words that were transformed from their original harmless or respectful meanings and converted to derogatory terms?Well sure. Guk is the Korean word for country, derived from ancient Chinese gwok, which is now Mandarin guo. Han guk is "Korea," so guk is used as an adjective or noun (Korean doesn't have the same parts of speech as English) for "countryman" or "national." During the Korean War, American soldiers became accustomed to hearing Koreans refer to each other as guk, and picked up the term. I don't know when it became derogatory because I was a little too young to pick up on it when the G.I.'s came back from Korea. But by the time of the Vietnam War, it had become a derogatory term for any East Asian ethnic group that was divided by a civil war in which we were participating, so that we couldn't tell friend from foe. Eventually it came to be a derogatory term for all East Asians.

"Wop" is derived from the Italian word guapo, which means "handsome." (Spanish has the same word.) I'm not sure if it's Sicilian dialect or just a mangled American pronunciation.

There's disagreement over the origin of the term "Redneck," but one faction traces it back to the era of the recolonization of Northern Ireland by Scots, who themselves are descendants of 7th-8th century Irish colonists. (Scoti was the Latin word for "Irishmen.") After the Reformation, the English occupied Ireland and imposed the Church of England as the official religion. Scottish Presbyterian immigrants formed an unlikely alliance with Irish Catholics to fight against the occupation, and the resulting Celtic Melting Pot became the Scots-Irish community, the source of a major wave of immigrants to America. In battles against the English army, the insurgents had identified themselves with red neckerchiefs, and that's one hypothesis for the origin of the term Redneck. (There are others.)

In any case, "Redneck" is not uniformly pejorative in American speech. Many Southern people use the name with pride, as in Gretchen Wilson's immensely popular song, "Redneck Woman." It's like "Yankee": people to whom the name applies regard it as descriptive and inoffensive, while their enemies use it as an insult.

[S.A.M.]

SAM,
This may interest you. If you say Hadji to most Americans, this is what will most likely come to mind. Scroll down to the "cast of characters".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Quest

Using Hadji to refer brown skinned locals might not be, least in origin, not quite as insulting as you might think.

So what do you suppose was that author's inspiration for using the word for a Muslim pilgrim to Mecca as the name of an Indian boy? It would be like using the word rabbi as a name.

In any case, "Redneck" is not uniformly pejorative in American speech. Many Southern people use the name with pride, as in Gretchen Wilson's immensely popular song, "Redneck Woman." It's like "Yankee": .

Muslim pilgrims still call themselves Hajjis too, and I am sure the Koreans call themselves guk as well. :p

people to whom the name applies regard it as descriptive and inoffensive, while their enemies use it as an insult

Yes, its quite amusing. Muslims would be flattered to be referred to as Hajji, since it is a term of veneration applied to elders [on the assumption that by this time they must have surely been to Mecca at least once].

[Medicine*Woman]

*igger derives from the French word for black.
*************
M*W: I was always under the impression that "n*gger" came from "Negro" and/or "Niger" meaning someone from Africa. I don't think it originally started out as a bad word any more than "redneck" started out as a bad connotation. "Redneck" was slang for a farmer who was out in the sun all day, therefore, someone having a red neck.

The same goes for the word "bitch." Back in the day when anyone called a woman a "bitch," they were referring to her as a dog in heat; a woman who was more than just sexually active. Today, when you hear the word "bitch," it is far more tame. To say a woman is a "bitch" is like saying she's hard to get along with or that she's self-serving.
Words and their definitions change over time depending on the evolution of their usages.

What I don't understand is the use of the word "n*gger." Blacks call each other that epithet all the time, but if we refer to a Black person as a "n*gger," all hell breaks loose. I would think it is just as insulting for a Black to call another Black a "n*gger." If we're going to get that word out of our vocabulary, that should apply to Blacks, too.

[greenberg]

Some examples off the top of my head, but they are not necessarily universally pejorative:

mentality
relativist/relative/ relativism
cripple
idiot, cretin
concentration camp


Also, here's an interesting article in Wikipedia about euphemisms and other words and how they can work their way into having a negative meaning:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euphemism_treadmill#The_.22euphemism_treadmill.22

[Kadark]

The transformation of language:Hajji to Hadji

Are the two words pronounced the same way?


Kadark

[greenberg]

What I don't understand is the use of the word "n*gger." Blacks call each other that epithet all the time, but if we refer to a Black person as a "n*gger," all hell breaks loose. I would think it is just as insulting for a Black to call another Black a "n*gger." If we're going to get that word out of our vocabulary, that should apply to Blacks, too.

It's similar as when a person calls themselves "silly" or "stupid" or some such (and the person themselves sees nothing wrong with that) as opposed to when someone else calls that person that way, and this someone does not have the trust of that person.

Negative criticism within the ingroup tends to be seen as normal, not viewed negatively. But negative criticism coming from the outgroup tends to be seen as offensive.

[MacGyver1968]

SAM,
This may interest you. If you say Hadji to most Americans, this is what will most likely come to mind. Scroll down to the "cast of characters".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Quest

Using Hadji to refer brown skinned locals might not be, least in origin, quite as insulting as you might think.

That's the first thing I thought of when the word Hadji was mentioned.

I thought the US soldiers used the word "Jawa's" for a slang term for Iraqis?

[MacGyver1968]

So what do you suppose was that author's inspiration for using the word for a Muslim pilgrim to Mecca as the name of an Indian boy? It would be like using the word rabbi as a name.




That show is from the 70's. I bet the authors didn't even know that Haji is term for a Mecca pilgrim. I didn't know that until I read your OP. I would bet they just made up a name that sounded "Indian".

[S.A.M.]

So you think US troops are using the word because it reminds them of a 70s show?

[MacGyver1968]

I was just referring to where the term for Americans came from. They are just borrowing the name from the show as a negative derogatory for Iraqs or others.

[S.A.M.]

Ah, so they are borrowing the name of an Indian kid in a 70s show because this will be insulting to Iraqis?

But its not insulting to Iraqis, they will be happy to be called Hajis.

[MacGyver1968]

No..because Hadji in the show wore a turbine. And we Americans are too dumb to know the difference between an Iraqi and an Indian. :) Soldiers always come up with names for who they are fighting.

Edit: Hadji did not wear a turbine engine on his head :) me and my spelling :)

[S.A.M.]

Are there other examples of soldiers coming up with such names? Fraggle has given some examples of US soldiers in other wars. I think Germans were called Jerries? What was the origin of that one?

[MacGyver1968]

Not just US soldiers....pretty much all soldiers.

Surely, Sam you are familiar with some of these terms. Why are you playing coy? :)

[S.A.M.]

So what is the term Iraqi soldiers use for Americans?

[MacGyver1968]

I don't know..but I bet they got some good ones. What's "baby killer" in Arabic?

[S.A.M.]

I don't know..but I bet they got some good ones. What's "baby killer" in Arabic?

Here, I found it:

I was speaking the other day with Scott Pelley of CBS News's "60 Minutes" about the mood in Iraq. He had just returned from filming a piece there and he told me something disturbing. Scott had gone around and asked Iraqis on the streets what they called American troops - wondering if they had nicknames for us in the way we used to call the Nazis "Krauts" or the Vietcong "Charlie." And what did he find? "Many Iraqis have so much distrust for U.S. forces we found they've come up with a nickname for our troops," Scott said. "They call American soldiers 'The Jews,' as in, 'Don't go down that street, the Jews set up a roadblock.' "

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/opinion/24friedman.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

[kevinalm]

>>edit This is in response to post #16. You guys got way ahead of me. ;)

You misunderstand. Hadji in the show was well liked. Jonny and Hadji were adoptive brothers and best friends. Hadji was Jonny's equal. They would find themselves in perilous situations and Hadji was as likely as Jonny to be the one to find the way out, or they would solve the difficulty together.

My point was that the term 'Hadji' as American's use it went through a period where it had no negative conotations at all. If anything, it would be complimentary, albeit perhaps slightly patronizing and mildly humorous.

I'm not trying to justify any sort of namecalling, but the op was about how the word came to be used currently, and I thought this was relevent.

[S.A.M.]

Thanks :)

It was insightful, I haven't heard about that show before.

[MacGyver1968]

It rocked! It was my favorite show as a kid.

[Fraggle Rocker]

*************
M*W: I was always under the impression that "n*gger" came from "Negro" and/or "Niger" meaning someone from Africa.The first slaves in North America were brought by the Spaniards, who called them negro, which is simply the Spanish word for "black person." The word was borrowed into English, normalized to our pronunciation of the long E. In Southern dialect the pronunciation was warped into "nigger," but I'm fairly sure it was not originally a derogatory word, at least no more derogatory than any word for someone you keep as a slave. When I was a kid in the 1950s, "niggrah" was sometimes used as the plural of "nigger" by Southerners.

Niger is the Latin word for "black," from which Spanish negro and French noir are descended. The colonial powers named some of their African territories after the tribes who lived there, but in a few cases they came up with some colossally unimaginative names. The French named one of their colonies Niger, and the Brits named one of theirs Nigeria, based on that Latin word for "black." Today Niger is an independent country, but it's wrestling with the reality that when most anglophones read their name aloud it comes out sounding like "nigger," when in fact it's supposed to have a French pronunciation: nee-ZHAIR. There's a bird seed mix that is traditionally called "Niger seed," and I notice that pet and garden shops now spell it "Nyjer."

The Jews have the same problem with the Yiddish word that literally means "black person: shvartze, from German schwarz. Somehow African-Americans got the idea that it is a derogatory term and demanded that they stop using it. I don't know what they picked to replace it; there aren't many people in America (or anywhere else) who speak Yiddish any more."Redneck" was slang for a farmer who was out in the sun all day, therefore, someone having a red neck.That's another hypothesis for the origin of the word. As I mentioned, none of them has been definitively established.The same goes for the word "bitch." Back in the day when anyone called a woman a "bitch," they were referring to her as a dog in heat; a woman who was more than just sexually active. Today, when you hear the word "bitch," it is far more tame. To say a woman is a "bitch" is like saying she's hard to get along with or that she's self-serving.All the sources say that "bitch" has been an offensive term for women since the 15th century, and that the original sense was "spiteful or malicious," and had nothing to do with sexual activity.

This is certainly counterintuitive, since the promiscuity of female dogs is legendary. They deliberately mate with every male they can, with the result that they all think the puppies might be theirs and will protect them. (In my experience as a dog breeder, they need to be protected from the other females, who really are "bitches" in both senses of the word.) The expression "son of a bitch" reinforces the supposition that "bitch" means "prostitute," and the current rap-thug-street slang of "bitches" for lowly women just adds to it. In other languages the term is "son of a whore."What I don't understand is the use of the word "n*gger." Blacks call each other that epithet all the time, but if we refer to a Black person as a "n*gger," all hell breaks loose. I would think it is just as insulting for a Black to call another Black a "n*gger." If we're going to get that word out of our vocabulary, that should apply to Blacks, too.There is indeed certainly something strange going on with that word. I never write it except in this forum where any word is fair for linguistic analysis, but African-Americans get to shout it about five times per minute in rap lyrics--which are then dutifully bleeped from the radio as if it were profanity. I enjoyed one (African-American) comedian's suggestion: Euro-Americans should start using the word to refer to each other. It would vanish from the African-American vocabulary within 24 hours. I actually hear that occasionally across the river in Virginia. Euro-Americans call each other "nigger," with a similar meaning to the old term "white trash."That show is from the 70's. I bet the authors didn't even know that Haji is term for a Mecca pilgrim. I didn't know that until I read your OP. I would bet they just made up a name that sounded "Indian".Haji must be a given name in some Asian culture. There was a restaurant named Haji Baba in Los Angeles forty years ago.

[MacGyver1968]

Oh...off topic...Johnny Quest had a really bad ass theme. Here's a native rockabilly band from Dallas..Reverend Horton Heat..with their version of the theme.

The band commented it was one of the hardest songs they ever recorded as it changes keys so many times .:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3glXpU_q3d8

[S.A.M.]

Haji must be a given name in some Asian culture. There was a restaurant named Haji Baba in Los Angeles forty years ago.

Haji Baba means Father Haji, its the name of a famous Muslim saint in India though Baba is also a name [besides being the word for Dad] so it would be possible to have people called Baba who were respectfully called Haji Baba

Haji is attached as a prefix like Mister.