Castration!

[ElectricFetus]

Should Pedophiles and Rapist be castrated? How severe does the crime have to be?

[Norsefire]

Why castrate? Rapists and peadophiles are worthy of execution.

[Tnerb]

Should Pedophiles and Rapist be castrated? How severe does the crime have to be?

I believe this thing of "castration" is foolish as they do not deserve such a penalty. Do women rapists deserve to be mutilated in their private parts?

Oh let me guess there is some reason why they should not (there are fewer).
When the crime is the same.

Foolish logic.

[chris4355]

Should Pedophiles and Rapist be castrated? How severe does the crime have to be?

no, too many innocents get charged in the first place.

[ElectricFetus]

I believe this thing of "castration" is foolish as they do not deserve such a penalty. Do women rapists deserve to be mutilated in their private parts?

Oh let me guess there is some reason why they should not (there are fewer).
When the crime is the same.

Foolish logic.

I'm asking the question not stipulating the answer, so don't blame me!

Wait, how does castrating a women mutilate their private parts? A hysterectomy is not visible externally, unlike like removing a guys balls.

What about chemical castration? The goal may not be to make them infertile rather just reduce the sex drive, considering woman's average testosterone levels I don't think chemical or physical castration would have much effect on a female rapist or pedophile sex drive.

[Tnerb]

bla bla bla.. hope u get good answer ;)

[Norsefire]

Rapists and peadophiles chose their own fate. They need to be held accountable for their actions and suffer the consequences.

[Tnerb]

Rapists and peadophiles chose their own fate. They need to be held accountable for their actions and suffer the consequences.

What nonsense.
They go to prison, they get out rape again, what's the difference??

Rapists deserve prison time, and then more and more prison time. Idiots should be able to notice SOME of their own fate.

Castrating them is simply cruel. Can anyone explain to me what someone thinks about when considering it? I didn't think so.

[Asguard]

ElectricFetus, there is no scientific evidence that castration works period.

[ElectricFetus]

Is prison effective than? I rather we find away to make criminals functional for our society so that my tax dollars aren't wasted keeping them alive. We need chain gangs, slave labor of criminals, re-education of criminals so when they get out they make functional citizens, and hey lets see if sex offenders can be rendered safe for society by cutting out their sex drive.

[Asguard]

as i said it doesnt work, try PROPER (not the limited that apears in the prision system) clincial mental health treatment. Your much more likly to get a better result

[ElectricFetus]

ElectricFetus, there is no scientific evidence that castration works period.

Is it a lack of evidence or is there a study that shows post castration, sex offender recidivism rates were not effected?

[Tnerb]

Is prison effective than? I rather we find away to make criminals functional for our society so that my tax dollars aren't wasted keeping them alive. We need chain gangs, slave labor of criminals, re-education of criminals so when they get out they make functional citizens, and hey lets see if sex offenders can be rendered safe for society by cutting out their sex drive.

I hope you apply that to the women who raped me as well :mad:

[Asguard]

as far as i know there have been studies done which show the reoffence rates are the same. For rape this is because its more to do with power than sex, pediophilia is more complicated again.

I dont have the studies on hand and i dont have the time to try to find them im sorry to say

[ElectricFetus]

I hope you apply that to the women who raped me as well :mad:
Sure, why the fuck not?

as far as i know there have been studies done which show the reoffence rates are the same. For rape this is because its more to do with power than sex, pediophilia is more complicated again.

I don't have the studies on hand and i don't have the time to try to find them im sorry to say

Well I would like to see the studies! Because "as far as I know" castation is far to rare of a punishment to actually test if it works, but I don't know that for sure now do I?

[Medicine*Woman]

I'm asking the question not stipulating the answer, so don't blame me!

Wait, how does castrating a women mutilate their private parts? A hysterectomy is not visible externally, unlike like removing a guys balls.

What about chemical castration? The goal may not be to make them infertile rather just reduce the sex drive, considering woman's average testosterone levels I don't think chemical or physical castration would have much effect on a female rapist or pedophile sex drive.
*************
M*W: You are right. Sex drive is in the brain. Surgical castration does not prevent an erection, and pedophiles and rapists will continue their perversion.

Chemical castration, as in the case of prostate cancer, used to be used by administering estrogen to suppress the high testerone levels in cancer patients.

[Medicine*Woman]

ElectricFetus, there is no scientific evidence that castration works period.
*************
M*W: Correctamente!

[ElectricFetus]

Medicine*Woman,

No, I asking for a study that shows castration to be ineffective, no argumentative logic, just hard facts. No proof that castration does work is not proof that it does not work!

[StrangerInAStrangeLa]

Is prison effective than? I rather we find away to make criminals functional for our society so that my tax dollars aren't wasted keeping them alive. We need chain gangs, slave labor of criminals, re-education of criminals so when they get out they make functional citizens, and hey lets see if sex offenders can be rendered safe for society by cutting out their sex drive.

Tax dollars! Tax dollars! All the money the government takes in is less than 3% of what they spend. WHY are you so concerned about where YOUR tax dollars are going??? Income tax doesn't even go to the government.

as far as i know there have been studies done which show the reoffence rates are the same. For rape this is because its more to do with power than sex, pediophilia is more complicated again. I dont have the studies on hand and i dont have the time to try to find them im sorry to say

That is an unfortunate myth. Rape is mostly due to not being sexually satisfied.
It's like saying bank robbery really isn't about the money.

[ElectricFetus]

Tax dollars! Tax dollars! All the money the government takes in is less than 3% of what they spend. WHY are you so concerned about where YOUR tax dollars are going??? Income tax doesn't even go to the government.

If you want to be frugal with money, you have the be frugal with ALL money.

[Norsefire]

Castration alone won't do anything.

What we need, especially for sexual predators, is intel. Tag 'em, and watch them, after you release them.

Maybe make it so that they are "brain dead"

[Medicine*Woman]

Medicine*Woman,

No, I asking for a study that shows castration to be ineffective, no argumentative logic, just hard facts. No proof that castration does work is not proof that it does not work!
*************
M*W: From my long-term memory, the article was in The Journal of Urology, but that was many moons ago. I learned that from my urological surgery professor. Sorry, but I really don't have the time to provide you with a link at this time.

[Medicine*Woman]

Rape is mostly due to not being sexually satisfied.

*************
M*W: It goes much deeper than that. A normal person can be sexually satisfied. A rapist has the desire for power and control over a weaker person. It builds up their perverted ego.

[Tiassa]

Is prison effective than? I rather we find away to make criminals functional for our society so that my tax dollars aren't wasted keeping them alive. We need chain gangs, slave labor of criminals, re-education of criminals so when they get out they make functional citizens ....

A local radio show, The Conversation (http://www.kuow.org/program.php?id=15957), recently considered the issue of civil commitment:

Ross Reynolds (host): How many people are being committed right now as sexual predators.

Brooke Burbank (Sexually Violent Predator Unit): .... Right now, there are roughly two-hundred individuals who are committed; there are approximately seventy-five additional individuals who are pre-trial detainees.

RR: How is someone civilly committed?

BB: It's a lengthy process; it begins when they are about to be released from the Department of Corrections on their criminal sentence. The state reviews pretty much every document pertaining to their life: their criminal history record, court documents, any mental health evaluations, any sex offender treatment records. And all of that information is given to a forensic psychologist for review to make a determination if they suffer from a mental disorder. And in addition to the mental disorder, they must be determined to be more likely than not to re-offend in a sexually-violent manner if not confined to a secure facility.

• • •

RR: How many people have gone through the civil commitment procedure and eventually been let out?

BB: There are apparently about twenty-nine individuals who have been outright discharged. There are an additional fourteen individuals who have made it through the treatment program at the special commitment center and are currently on what is called a less-restrictive alternative placement. And that entails a treatment regime and careful monitoring by either Department of Corrections or other approved escorts.

RR: I guess one way to evaluate its success would be to look at those twenty-nine people who've gone through it and the fourteen who are in less-restrictive environments, and ask have any of them re-offended?

BB: And to my knowledge, none of them have. There have been a few individuals who were released and then committed what's called a recent overt act, and were subsequently sent back to the special commitment center. So, for example, if an individual who has a history of committing offenses against children is found in a daycare center or looking at children in the library, something like that, that may qualify as a recent overt act. So there have been some individuals who have been sent back after being found committing recent overt acts.

(The Conversation (.mp3) (http://128.208.34.88/podcast/Conversation20081001.mp3))

The segment starts about 80% of the way through the program; listen for the Crowded House riff marking the transition between segments.

In general, slave labor won't help; prisoners have in the past been paid a sub-minimum wage, so that they have some funds upon leaving prison. While this in and of itself is an insufficient barrier against recidivism, we would only exacerbate the situation by returning to slavery.

Re-education is a controversial subject. Ninety years ago, Emma Goldman (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_archives/goldman/aando/prisons.html) wrote of how prison labor was undermining the free labor market normally reserved for women and the disabled (shirt-making and broom-making respectively). Of course, as an Anarchist, she found her complaints brushed aside. Thus, it was ironic when I heard, on the local FOX affiliate, a news story in which a technology-related business owner lamented that he had to compete with prison labor. Whether it's "giving prisoners what law-abiding folks don't get", or interfering with local market competition, there have, at least during my lifetime, always been complaints about educating prisoners. Perhaps in the 21st century, people are more willing to look at the social investment, the hope of lowering recidivism. But, in truth, the first decade has been so dominated by wars and rumors of wars that I've lost track of the issue.

And we must remember that in many cases, sex offenders suffer certifiable mental illnesses. This is the point of civil commitment; they are too dangerous to be released into the public, yet the applicable sentencing scheme is found insufficient. We cannot arbitrarily extend the sentences, so the criminal danger is transformed into a mental health issue. Indeed, Washington state has altered its sentencing schedules in order to keep offenders locked up for longer periods, but, in the end, we must at least acknowledge that this solution simply throws mental illness into prison.
____________________

Notes:

"How Will You Vote on the Sound Transit Light Rail Proposal?" The Conversation. KUOW.org. October 1, 2008. http://www.kuow.org/program.php?id=15957

Goldman, Emma. "Prisons: A Social Crime and Failure". Anarchism and Other Essays. New York & London: Mother Earth Publishing Association, 1911. http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_archives/goldman/aando/prisons.html

[shorty_37]

Is prison effective than? I rather we find away to make criminals functional for our society so that my tax dollars aren't wasted keeping them alive. We need chain gangs, slave labor of criminals

It seems like a lot of ppl who go to prison just get out and commit a crime again, land back in jail and the cycle just continues. I think that some of the jail time they serve is a joke, esp here in Canada. They are wayyyyy to lenient in some cases. They also treat them too well, in a lot of institutions. Hard criminals are able to take courses and get degrees that the average person couldn't afford to do. They get special treatment sometimes because they are afraid to throw them into the general population. Remember Karla Holmolka and Paul Bernardo?
They killed young highschool girls, tortured, raped and then cut them into pieces and buried them in cement.. I remember seeing on the news that they set up a special cell for her because they were afraid she would get beaten up or killed by the other inmates. Her hubby Paul has the same treatment. I say who gives a shit! After what they did to those poor innocent girls and their families, let them fend for themselves in the general population. Karla's cell looked pretty cosy in fact and made me sick to my stomache that they cater to criminals like that. She also came out with some kind of degree.........Who paid for all that????? Yeah WE DID! :mad:

I don't know if castration works or not. From what I have read, it looks like it doesn't.

I agree with fetus they should have to do HARD labor while in jail. You see the size of a lot of those guys. Instead of letting them workout in the gym
for a few hours a day, put their muscles to some real work.

[ElectricFetus]

I'm not saying castration works I asking where are the study that show it does, doesn't, or only works on conditions??? If there is no study many should be done, if castration works, use it! If not move on, but we can't just put people behind bars forever, they are a drain on society behind bars almost as much as outside, we must find more effective solutions one in which criminals can be made useful for society even if it deem that some can never return to it.

[lucifers angel]

Should Pedophiles and Rapist be castrated? How severe does the crime have to be?

no they shouldnt be, thats a awful suggestion

[Challenger78]

Nope.

If they repeat offend. Just lobotomize them.

[shorty_37]

I am guessing to the parents of the children that have been molested by these perverts, castration is being too lenient. Think of how you would react if it was one of your own children and these bastards come out of jail and just keep re offending.

[Challenger78]

Lobotomization goes towards science and makes them brain dead. Combine that with euthanasia, and you should be fine.

[ElectricFetus]

Lobotomies have their own problems, the subjects usually can no long manage them selves and must be continuously cared for by others. Lobotomy is too ineffective, to hit or miss, and down right outdated technique, advancements should be made in cybersurgery towards the ability to render even the most fiendish psychopath into all caring and giving individuals, I believe it should be possible to manipulate the brain in such a way but it would require decades of study and testing. Here the rub, what if we make high lever criminals into test subjects for such technology? If they die or are horribly brain damage in the process what ever they were on death row anyways.

[Cellar_Door]

The death penalty is more humane than a lobotomy - far more humane.

I once saw an interesting documentary on chemical castration, it can be a bit hit and miss but many subjects lost pretty much all sexual desire and drive.

[visceral_instinct]

Rape is mostly due to not being sexually satisfied.

Bullshit.

If it were purely about lack of sexual satisfaction, they could simply go to the bathroom and masturbate, like normal men do when they need their 'release'.

[Baron Max]

If it were purely about lack of sexual satisfaction, they could simply go to the bathroom and masturbate, like normal men do when they need their 'release'.

Does masturbation actually satisfy you sexually? If so, you're a very small minority of men in the world. It's almost a proven fact that the more a male masturbates, the more he "needs" to do it.

Baron Max

[ElectricFetus]

Does masturbation actually satisfy you sexually? If so, you're a very small minority of men in the world. It's almost a proven fact that the more a male masturbates, the more he "needs" to do it.

Baron Max

I would disagree :D

[Orleander]

Does masturbation actually satisfy you sexually? If so, you're a very small minority of men in the world. It's almost a proven fact that the more a male masturbates, the more he "needs" to do it.

Baron Max

I think the more he does it the more its the only way he can get off.

[Tiassa]

Does masturbation actually satisfy you sexually? If so, you're a very small minority of men in the world.

(chortle!)

Awesome.

I'll let someone else explain what's wrong with that statement. After all, I might have my facts wrong on this.

[ElectricFetus]

I think the more he does it the more its the only way he can get off.

I agree :D :D

[visceral_instinct]

Does masturbation actually satisfy you sexually? If so, you're a very small minority of men in the world. It's almost a proven fact that the more a male masturbates, the more he "needs" to do it.

Baron Max

I'm a female.

[ElectricFetus]

I'm a female.

We are all sexless on the internet, although it usually assumed we are male, this is because those the claim they are female are sometimes just men with really small dicks. But if you want to prove your female then please do :D , if not then don't care if someone says your not.

[visceral_instinct]

But if you want to prove your female then please do :D

*takes picture with mobile phone*

Oh wait...I got ambiguous hermaphrodite genitalia....sorry about that. :D

[shorty_37]

Oh wait...I got ambiguous hermaphrodite genitalia....sorry about that. :D

You stole that from the last episode of CSI :p

[ElectricFetus]

You stole that from the last episode of CSI :p

I hate that show!

[shorty_37]

I hate that show!

Me too, but I happen to see a commercial for it the other night.
I am a fan of Prison Break myself.

[visceral_instinct]

You stole that from the last episode of CSI :p

No, I got it from the first incarnation of the picture thread when Dr Lou Natic accused me of having ambiguous hermaphrodite genitalia :D

Though I am not averse to CSI.

[Asguard]

why would you watch that crap:p

Watch a good show like NCIS or the hollowmen or L&O:)

[shorty_37]

No, I got it from the first incarnation of the picture thread when Dr Lou Natic accused me of having ambiguous hermaphrodite genitalia :D



Oh yeah! That Pitcher thread gave me quite a few good laughs...:D

[visceral_instinct]

Me too. I like those threads, I wish they didn't keep getting locked.

[Tiassa]

Mod Hat — Just a question

So is this one done, then?

[shorty_37]

Pretty much

[Asguard]

Tiassa the inital propersition of the thread is false, there is no scientific evidence that castration works to lower rape reoffence rates or pedophila.

There for we might as well talk about NCIS and VI's sex life or whatever everyone is discussing

[ElectricFetus]

Tiassa the inital propersition of the thread is false, there is no scientific evidence that castration works to lower rape reoffence rates or pedophila.

There for we might as well talk about NCIS and VI's sex life or whatever everyone is discussing

The thread is not proposing it, rather its asking for such evidence for or against castration to be presented, if there is evidence it works then I'm for it, if there evidence it doesn't work them I'm against it, if there is neither evidence I think it should be scientifically tested.

[Cellar_Door]

Bullshit.

If it were purely about lack of sexual satisfaction, they could simply go to the bathroom and masturbate, like normal men do when they need their 'release'.

If masturbation satisfies all sexual urges, why does sex itself exist? Personally, I feel a LOT more satiated after actual intercourse than masturbation - is it so different for men?

[ElectricFetus]

Mod Hat — Just a question

So is this one done, then?

if no one is going to throw up any evidence then chuck it

[Challenger78]

I'm a female.

You probably are going to have to repeat that over and over and over again..

Just, so you know, It sinks in.. I think a lot of people still have preconcieved notions about things.

@Asguard: Why is there no token black guy in NCIS ?

[visceral_instinct]

You probably are going to have to repeat that over and over and over again..

Just, so you know, It sinks in.. I think a lot of people still have preconcieved notions about things.

@Asguard: Why is there no token black guy in NCIS ?

Well my tag line now says 'Short legged wolverine girl'...Hopefully people will notice the word 'girl'. :D I think I'll keep that tag line a while, maybe people will stop assuming I'm male. :D

[Asguard]

Challenger78 well the new director is black:p