'Under God' in Pledge Ruled Unconstitutional in America

Check it out.

http://www.cnn.com/2002/LAW/06/26/pledge.allegiance/index.html

 

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Uh, cool. I'm sure we've all been pestered about it on the news.
What's next, ruling the presidential 'so help me God' or 'in god we trust' money being unconstitutional?? The Declaraton of Independence????? Any legal document or any oath containing the G word????????

I'm atheistic, but I'd say this is overreacting. I frankly don't care about what's in the pledge, I just say it every single dang day.

Any thoughts??

 

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The ruling is not about the two words under god appearing in the national anthem. The ruling is about the federal statue that compells the two words under god to be inserted into the national anthem.

I would imagine that if the original author can be persuaded to re-write the anthem's lyrics to voluntarily include the two words under god then the two words would instantly become constitutionally-protected free speech.

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well... i look at it this way... i am not christian. but in my religion, i have my own god(s). So when i say "blsh blah blah, UNDER GOD..." it doesn't have to mean the christain god. it can be my god. or whoevers god is saying the PoA. now.. for athiests.. i could see this beng a problem..but i really think it is something that you should just make to be your own. (i hope this makes sense). the whole world cannot conform to everyone. and if it tried, eventually breathing would be politacally incorrect because people with bad breath would offend other people. when one who does have a god says the PoA, they should be saying it to their own god.. not everyone elses. as for athiests.. well, just dont SAY it. create your own. dont let the government and its majority vote decide what you will say to the flag.

 

In the dark era of the 50's, 1954 to be exact, congress passed a law to insert "under god" to protect the nation from those evil atheistic communists.

The original author of the pledge, a Baptist minister, made no mention of god. Even a Baptist minister (in 1892 IIRC) had respect for separation of church and state.

From http://www.ffrf.org/fttoday/may99/lynn.html :
Bellamy, under the supervision of Upham, then authored the program for the celebration, including the flag salute or Pledge of Allegiance. His original version was, "I pledge allegiance to my flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." Bellamy considered putting the words "fraternity" and "equality" into the Pledge, but decided against it as equality for blacks and women was a controversial rather than patriotic issue of the time.

To whoever it was that suggested the ridiculous ideas of the word God being removed from every document, the fact of the matter is that none of those documents are pledges of subservience to God being directly dictated by the government as something all people are supposed to say. Money has a little text reading "in god we trust", but that does not mean that in order to get a business to accept this money you are required to chant a pledge of obedience to god.

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If such a pledge were required or even customary to use money, then there would be good reason to remove the text -- but it isn't so that's a nonissue. You'd have to be blind to not see the difference between the government having "god" on some documents and even the government using the word in private settings (as bad as it is that they use the christian god and bible in courts), and in contrast the government act (1954-present) of instructing all children in the entire nation to pledge their allegiance to god.

It's just another disgusting piece of McCarthy era politics... one which unfortunately will stick around since the decision is certain to be overruled by the christian conservatives of the supreme court (if not before).

 

So how often do you lie? Why say it every dang day, if ya don't believe it?
Now, I'm not saying I'm perfect, I have been known to spew out some half-truth's & fabrications, but I refuse to commit to christianity because my government says I should. Hell I don't even commit to my government. Oops! There's the door, probably the F.B.I. again. I'm sure our forefather's did think we would all fall in line with the whole christianity thing, but I don't think they were trying to force us to worship the same god or worship in the same way.

Anyway, in conclusion, the 9th circuit court judges are the smartest the USA has to offer.

 

I know tht if I was forced to say tht "prare" every morning I would have gone mad.
I would either
a) don't say anything
b) invent my own words in place

My personal freedom is the greatest value I have. I won't give it away to no government or whatever.

during the oppresion times over here (till the 1989 when everybody just started rioting) we were told what to do, what to sing, what to think. Thus Latvians are very sensitive to the cases like this. We even have our own anthem for this. It's really like a national anthem to me, I sing it now and then.
in english the words would be smth like->

Song, with what will you begin?
With what will you begin?
Begin with a silent word,
With a silent word.
Begin with a silent word,
Begin with a silent syllable-
Your people will understand,
Your people will understand,
That the song is a scream.

Sing about a low grass.
Abot a low grass,
Sing about a shiny ray,
About a shiny ray,
Sing about a shiny ray.
Add some cheap joke-
Your people will understand,
Your people will understand,
Your people will understand,
That the song is a scream.

Sing about pink dreams,
About pink dreams;
If you are ordered to sing,
If you are ordered to sing,
If you are ordered to sing,
Sing- if not then from fear-
Your people will understand,
Your people will understand,
That the song is a scream.

Laugh if you want,
Cry if you must,
Only very quiet,
Only very quiet-
You know, what will be,
If you'll scream!

(this is unique translation

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, I found it nowhere on i-net so had to do it for myself. Music by Imants Kalnins, words by V. Kalnins, band - Menuets)

to those who may not undertand.
our fight for freedom was called the singing revolution.
a lot of song masterpieces were created during tht time. if you told your opinion out loud you were sent to far north or put in the insane asylum. thus almost all of our gratest poets have sat in mad asylum some time.
Because of tht there was a lot of works you had to read through the lines, so the censorship would allow thm to be publiced.
because of all this I'm for a complete freedom of speech. and yes, I'm afraid tht the history may repeat,
we all are- those who remember...

 

I agree with nightfall as this seems to be just the next step in political correctness. Which is as disturbing as it gets. I'm actually surprised the cancelling of Bill Maher's Politically Incorrect never became a thread here. Bill basically got kicked off the air for stating that Bush was wrong and people willing to give their life for their cause are not cowards and that standing 200 miles away and pushing a button to launch a missile is much more cowardly.

Anyway, as Hoth said the 'under God' part added in because the American government basically saw Communism as evil and atheism as a key part to Communism. It should never have been put in and it's the people's choice on whether or not they want to honour this fact.

 

I say it because I love my country and I love what the flag stands for - my country. When the "under god" part comes up, I think of it as my own god. Even though I dont believe in any god, well I dont know, I just confused myself

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I have a god!!! Entropy forever!!!!!!!!!

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Zero, from the first time I saw your sig I became quite intrigued. Why do you hold entropy as your god. sorry, you don't like the word god. ok, how's about your only truth or the only important thing in the universe. Sure I know what is entropy, I know how it affects our universe, to what i will presumably lead, but why is it so important to you?
there are many more interesting reactions, phenomenons in physics, why entropy

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We seem to be in an era where image is everything. That there must be separatism between religion and political governing is ok in my book. This gets stretched a good bit when you have religious followers banding together to influence politics through electing one of their own to office.

If the words, "Under god" and "In god we trust" are a problem then what about religious folk and their political parties? Can't make an omelet without breaking the egg...

 

I don't vote for them

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Neither do I but that wasn't the point. The point was if one stands true then the other must also follow as being violate of the same line of thought...

 

wait wait - religious parties in the US??

I thought you had only democrats and confederats (sorry, were they called republicans now?)

 

confederates?

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That was a good one

I just plain say the words because I say it out of respect for the religious fervor of the makers of America. Not because I believe in a god. But out of respect, that I don't hate all religious people just because I'm an atheist. A sign of friendship, see?

And Entropy will devour ALL!!! Muwahahaah. It's just my little joke, came up during a discussion class when I brought up the notion of entropy and how the total entropy of the universe can never go down and...etc. Everyone got so upset, I honestly never thought I'd hear someone say "I don't believe in that theory".

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lol, so that's how it started.

 

Even though I don't care at all whether the words are there or not (besides: I'm inhabitant of Europe so it even doesn't affect me personally).

But I was shocked to see how all the children in the USA have to take the pledge every day... Aaaaahhhh
Horryfied is better description. In fact my thoughts were "no wonder that country is so f*cked up"

Land of the free? Becomes more and more difficult to sell: that pledge is straight indoctrination!
(and if you don't believe it is why else would it be that 'congress passed a law to insert "under god" to protect the nation from those evil atheistic communists.'???)

I am so happy I do not live in the USA. I don't really love my country, but I am very happy to be born in these strange lowlands. We do not leave the weak to rot, we don't indoctrinate people to be willing to die for a star and a stripe. ("een appel en een ei" for all the dutch speakers)

A friend typified the USA as "the land of personal freedom at the expence of life"

 

I fully agree with you Merlijn!

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The only prare I could be put to do everymoring is-
Thanx my luck I don't live in the USA

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cheers!

 

Who is the guy who brought the case, anyway? I heard he's getting death threats...lol the whole group of senators reciting the words 'under god' with such expressions of determination on their faces really cracked me up...

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And I can't help wondering what kind of grudge the guy bears toward the US to bring up such a case.

 

I can't help but wonder what kind of grudge his detractors bear toward those parts of the Constitution that make his opinion legally equal to their own.

The Constitution, and the Bill of Rights, exist precisely for the protection of minority opinion, because majority opinion never has needed protection from itself (in the same way).

The Constitution is more about protecting atheists from theists than the opposite.

Our founding fathers were even smarter than the majority opinion on this issue gives them credit.

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