help me out guys

[codanblad]

CHRISTIANS ONLY!!!

IF YOU ARE NON-CHRISTIAN, AND BELIEVE THAT ONE OPTION FITS WITH THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY OF CHRISTIANS YOU SPEAK WITH, PICK THAT BOX.

just trying to get a better idea of what people think. some christians told me i can be a rapist so long as i believe in jesus, and still go to heaven. i wondered what other christians might think of that.

[Zakariya04]

even though i am not a christain, any normal christain would say that is a load of fuckin bullshit


Being a muslim (ok a bloomin crap one) then the same rules apply, a rapist is a rapist in other words an evil fucking prick!!! (literally)

[CutsieMarie89]

I'm not a Christian anymore but I would like to think that if God is as loving as many believe him to be then it should be choice 5. However I went to Christian schools for all of my elementary thru jr high years and according to my teachers (from different schools) all you have to do is accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and truly believe it and mean it. That's it. Your works should reflect your belief... It's kind of unfair in some respect because you could be a devout Christian your entire life always doing the right thing and never giving into temptation and then you are rewarded by getting into heaven, but then someone else who has done nothing but wrong their whole life never even felt remorse for giving into worldly temptations...etc can repent on their death bed and still get into heaven. But yeah I believe that's all there is to it. Different sects my disagree, but that's what I was taught.

[clusteringflux]

I'm not a Christian anymore but I would like to think that if God is as loving as many believe him to be then it should be choice 5. However I went to Christian schools for all of my elementary thru jr high years and according to my teachers (from different schools) all you have to do is accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and truly believe it and mean it. That's it. Your works should reflect your belief... It's kind of unfair in some respect because you could be a devout Christian your entire life always doing the right thing and never giving into temptation and then you are rewarded by getting into heaven, but then someone else who has done nothing but wrong their whole life never even felt remorse for giving into worldly temptations...etc can repent on their death bed and still get into heaven. But yeah I believe that's all there is to it. Different sects my disagree, but that's what I was taught.

I'm not the best christian example but I think that most people would say that you have the repentance has to be real also.
I mean if you repent on your death bed, is it because you really feel bad about your actions or because you're going to die and are suddenly afraid for your own (spiritual) well being? The second is still a selfish move, IMO.

I tend so say that if I don't make it into heaven, oh well. Even if I'm not one of the "elect", there is piece of mind in simply fighting the good fight, regardless of what happens when I die.

[Michael]

I'm non Xian but I think the formula is accept Jesus as the son of God and repent for your sins.

[Adstar]

CHRISTIANS ONLY!!!

IF YOU ARE NON-CHRISTIAN, AND BELIEVE THAT ONE OPTION FITS WITH THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY OF CHRISTIANS YOU SPEAK WITH, PICK THAT BOX.

just trying to get a better idea of what people think. some christians told me i can be a rapist so long as i believe in jesus, and still go to heaven. i wondered what other christians might think of that.

Believe Jesus and follow His teachings to the best of ones ability

If a person did that then they would do all in their power to resist the urge to rape. To the extent of turning themselves into the authorities and allowing themselves to be imprisoned.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[audible]

Believe Jesus and follow His teachings to the best of ones ability

If a person did that then they would do all in their power to resist the urge to rape. To the extent of turning themselves into the authorities and allowing themselves to be imprisoned.


All Praise The Ancient Of DaysSo it's a case of do as I say, not as I do. Or do you mean, follow all that which Jesus does and says.

[Adstar]

So it's a case of do as I say, not as I do. Or do you mean, follow all that which Jesus does and says.

It is a case of believe what I have said and do your best to live up to what I have said, but don't worry when you fail to live up to what I said.
I know full well that you will fail to live up to what I said. I will forgive you the times when you fail. Not because of the times you succeeded to live up to what I said, but because you believed and accepted what I said was and is right.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[codanblad]

even though i am not a christain, any normal christain would say that is a load of fuckin bullshit


Being a muslim (ok a bloomin crap one) then the same rules apply, a rapist is a rapist in other words an evil fucking prick!!! (literally)

why is it? can't jesus forgive anything? everyone has reasons for what they do, maybe jesus understands rapists better than you and i.

i'd hope jesus would be considering that this person has to burn in eternity for something they might have done once. what crime is big enough for that?

[Adstar]

Originally Posted by Zakariya04
even though i am not a christain, any normal christain would say that is a load of fuckin bullshit


Being a muslim (ok a bloomin crap one) then the same rules apply, a rapist is a rapist in other words an evil fucking prick!!! (literally)



why is it? can't jesus forgive anything? everyone has reasons for what they do, maybe jesus understands rapists better than you and i.

i'd hope jesus would be considering that this person has to burn in eternity for something they might have done once. what crime is big enough for that?

Why ask these questions to a mulsim that does not believe in Atomenent for ones sins through believing Jesus?



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[CutsieMarie89]

why is it? can't jesus forgive anything? everyone has reasons for what they do, maybe jesus understands rapists better than you and i.

i'd hope jesus would be considering that this person has to burn in eternity for something they might have done once. what crime is big enough for that?

Of course Jesus would forgive anything, one would like to think. Jesus reminds me of a hippie. He was all about Peace and Love (with the exception of free love).

[SkinWalker]

It will depend upon which Chrisitian cult you belong to. Many have the same superstitions regarding mythical afterlife and heaven. Most Christian cults have similar superstitions regarding heaven.

If you're an adherent and you're asking to satisfy your own beliefs, it may, perhaps, be better to inquire with an official or authority figure from your own cult.

[audible]

It is a case of believe what I have said and do your best to live up to what I have said, but don't worry when you fail to live up to what I said.
I know full well that you will fail to live up to what I said. I will forgive you the times when you fail. Not because of the times you succeeded to live up to what I said, but because you believed and accepted what I said was and is right.


All Praise The Ancient Of DaysAre you sure anybody should. I don't think it would be wise, considering how he has lied and thieved, etc..
But then again it is no wonder Christians lies so much, if thats the example they follow.

[JDawg]

Personally, I think the best bet is to simply be a good person. But no religion is going to make you do that. If you're a good person, you will be a good person regardless of what, if anything, you worship. Conversely, if you're not a good person, no amount of worship will change that.

But the people that don't bother me are the ones who have a personal relationship with their god and don't adhere to the stupid rules like not eating meat of Fridays or hating people simply because of the way they are. I also think the Catholic institution is as progressive a religious sect as there is in the Western world, at least as far as the Abrahamic religions go. They seem to understand, accept, and even thirst for science and scientific advancement, and they don't pretend that the Bible is literal, nor is it a history book. They see it for what it can be to a person; a good guideline for living a decent life as a decent human being.

[Quigly]

being a christian, i think the idea of christianity and baptism is the idea of associating with how Christ lived his life and believing that he is the way to the God. Jesus' life was his message and that was for the people around him and those to come. I think the idea of christianity has been so muddied in the water for so long that people miss the fundamentals about it. It is about loving others and treating them better. It is about helping those in need. It is about faith. It is about belief. It is about life.

[JDawg]

being a christian, i think the idea of christianity and baptism is the idea of associating with how Christ lived his life and believing that he is the way to the God. Jesus' life was his message and that was for the people around him and those to come. I think the idea of christianity has been so muddied in the water for so long that people miss the fundamentals about it. It is about loving others and treating them better. It is about helping those in need. It is about faith. It is about belief. It is about life.

It's about more than that, and you know it. Just because you reject aspects of Christianity does not mean that those ugly parts aren't real.

[Quigly]

It's about more than that, and you know it. Just because you reject aspects of Christianity does not mean that those ugly parts aren't real.

What else is it about? Why complicate a simple matter? The Church has overcomplicated a simple message for long enough no?

[epiman]

I cannot say anything seeing as I believe that no single option defines the "requirements."

[JDawg]

What else is it about? Why complicate a simple matter? The Church has overcomplicated a simple message for long enough no?

Simple message? Have you even read your Bible?

[Quigly]

Seems pretty simple to me. Maybe im an elitist...and yes, i have quite thoroughly studied the bible.

[JDawg]

Seems pretty simple to me. Maybe im an elitist...and yes, i have quite thoroughly studied the bible.

If you have thoroughly studied the Bible, how have you dealt with the inconsistencies and contradictions?

[audible]

being a christian, i think the idea of christianity and baptism is the idea of associating with how Christ lived his life and believing that he is the way to the God. Jesus' life was his message and that was for the people around him and those to come. I think the idea of christianity has been so muddied in the water for so long that people miss the fundamentals about it. It is about loving others and treating them better. It is about helping those in need. It is about faith. It is about belief. It is about life.Is this the same jesus that steals and lies, etc... If so then he is not a good example to follow.
and yes, i have quite thoroughly studied the bible.Then you need to take another look, you missed quite a few lines, or are you just being intellectually dishonest, it's a christian trait, they follow by example.

[Quigly]

If you have thoroughly studied the Bible, how have you dealt with the inconsistencies and contradictions?

I am honestly of the belief that even with no bible, God would still reveal salvation to men...and though not a popular notion, have my concerns with the Bible and how the books of the bible were picked and others weren't. For instance, Jude quotes the book of enoch, of which Jude made it and the Book of Enoch didn't. Maybe I haven't scrutinized looking for errors, but do understand how text being translated can cause microerrors. Other than that, some books were written as poetry, others were written as metaphor, and others literal. This can also be dangerous when the only thing people try to do is prove it wrong instead of take into consideration the writing styles of the day, the superstitions of the day, the themes of a day (in Pauls day, woman had a minor role and it comes through in some teaching)

[nova900]

Other than that, some books were written as poetry, others were written as metaphor, and others literal.

What is the criteria to determine which books are literal,poetry or metaphor?
What is literal to many conservative Christians is metaphorical to liberals,etc,etc...purely subjective.
Is there a source outside the bible to determine what is and what is not literal?

[Quigly]

What is the criteria to determine which books are literal,poetry or metaphor?
What is literal to many conservative Christians is metaphorical to liberals,etc,etc...purely subjective.
Is there a source outside the bible to determine what is and what is not literal?

Thats the thing you know, smarter men than I, theologians and Historians, have debated this for years. For instance, Noahs flood is considered to by some historians to be a local flood only and not a global flood, while others feel that based on a variety of people from different religions and parts of the world have a similar story in their sect, so they feel it was on a larger scale. gotta run...be back later

[codanblad]

Originally Posted by Zakariya04
even though i am not a christain, any normal christain would say that is a load of fuckin bullshit. Being a muslim (ok a bloomin crap one) then the same rules apply, a rapist is a rapist in other words an evil fucking prick!!! (literally)

Originally Posted by codanblad
why is it? can't jesus forgive anything? everyone has reasons for what they do, maybe jesus understands rapists better than you and i.
i'd hope jesus would be considering that this person has to burn in eternity for something they might have done once. what crime is big enough for that?

<b>Originally posted by Adstar
Why ask these questions to a mulsim that does not believe in Atomenent for ones sins through believing Jesus?</b>


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Mathew 7:12
all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them

i think you're a religious nut, but i'd ask you questions. some people have smart things to say, regardless of what they believe in. he might have the best understanding of christianity of everyone in sciforums. just like a creationist can understand evolution, though disagree with it.

side note: i think you're just taking a shot at the infidel. is that what the bible teaches? how will he bask in the glory of christ if you don't even talk to him. doesn't jesus want you to love your neighbour? how are you looking after god's flock if you're not helping people find god? bad christian!

[Orleander]

I was raised that you had to ask God to become your saviour and beg him to forgive your sins. You could be Hitler and do it 1 second before you die and get into heaven.

[MacGyver1968]

I was raised Southern Baptist...and their belief is that we are all stained with sin, and you have to accept Christ so that his blood with wash away the stain of sin, and allow you to be in the presence of God...because apparently God is allergic to sin. :)

[John99]

I was raised that you had to ask God to become your saviour and beg him to forgive your sins. You could be Hitler and do it 1 second before you die and get into heaven.

i dont think that is true for murder or similar crimes.

[Orleander]

i dont think that is true for murder or similar crimes.

I don't think its true for anything. LOL
BUT its what I was taught.

[MacGyver1968]

Under SB rules...if Hitler would have prayed and accepted Christ before he died, he would have made it to Heaven.

[Enmos]

Voted +2, but I imagine Christians are not the same all over.

[Orleander]

Under SB rules...if Hitler would have prayed and accepted Christ before he died, he would have made it to Heaven.

yep, Southern Baptist rules. Its what I was rasied. We had all kinds of rules which were broken Mon-Sat and forgiven on Sun.

[jayleew]

i dont think that is true for murder or similar crimes.

Now you are going to judge who will go to heaven, and who will not? This is rich!

Scriptures say that not even angels know whose names are written in the book of life.

Making it to Christian heaven is easy to conceptualize, but nearly impossible to do:

Believe in Jesus, that he is the son of God, the truth, the life, and the way.

Love God with all your heart, all your mind, and all your soul. Love your neighbor as yourself.

According to Jesus, he said this fulfills all the commandments, and he also said that he is the way. Period.

John, Jesus made it clear that all sin was equal when he said that not only doing the sin, but just thinking about the sin is like doing the sin.

There is also more scripture that reads that his blood is sufficient to cover all sins. And also, Jesus was asked how many times would they be forgiven, and he stated 7 times 70. So, if you have faith in Jesus, you are covered, you just have to take care of the commandments.

[Cris]

None of the options list the only valid method.

The first and only essential part of being a Christian is to accept that you are a sinner and to sincerely ask Jesus for forgiveness. The bible aserts that the only way to heaven is through Jesus by this method.

That you will continue to live a sinful life is assumed and that there is little you can do about it, it is your essential nature. But having asked for forgiveness you will be helped through the Holy Spirit to live a better life. You are considered too weak to do it by yourself. But none of that is critical to gaining access to heaven - that you will have achieved by the sincerity of your request to Jesus for forgiveness.

[leopold99]

CHRISTIANS ONLY!!!

IF YOU ARE NON-CHRISTIAN, AND BELIEVE THAT ONE OPTION FITS WITH THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY OF CHRISTIANS YOU SPEAK WITH, PICK THAT BOX.

just trying to get a better idea of what people think. some christians told me i can be a rapist so long as i believe in jesus, and still go to heaven. i wondered what other christians might think of that.
it's true. you could have been the worst serial killer in history and still go to heaven provided that you give your soul to christ and spread the faith.
you cannot simply say you gave your soul to christ, you actually have to believe you have.
this implies that you believe christ is the savior.

[codanblad]

it's true. you could have been the worst serial killer in history and still go to heaven provided that you give your soul to christ and spread the faith.
you cannot simply say you gave your soul to christ, you actually have to believe you have.
this implies that you believe christ is the savior.

i don't get that part, why does jesus let you into heaven just because you believe in him? what purpose does that serve? cos ur gullible i'll spare you from eternal damnation? your beliefs depend on what kind of person you are, and god determined what kind of person you are.

[swarm]

God really likes keeping a close eye on the boring, prudish, irrational and gullible types. Can you blame him?

[Adstar]

Originally Posted by Zakariya04
even though i am not a christain, any normal christain would say that is a load of fuckin bullshit. Being a muslim (ok a bloomin crap one) then the same rules apply, a rapist is a rapist in other words an evil fucking prick!!! (literally)

Originally Posted by codanblad
why is it? can't jesus forgive anything? everyone has reasons for what they do, maybe jesus understands rapists better than you and i.
i'd hope jesus would be considering that this person has to burn in eternity for something they might have done once. what crime is big enough for that?

<b>Originally posted by Adstar
Why ask these questions to a mulsim that does not believe in Atomenent for ones sins through believing Jesus?</b>


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Mathew 7:12
all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them

i think you're a religious nut, but i'd ask you questions. some people have smart things to say, regardless of what they believe in. he might have the best understanding of christianity of everyone in sciforums. just like a creationist can understand evolution, though disagree with it.

side note: i think you're just taking a shot at the infidel. is that what the bible teaches? how will he bask in the glory of christ if you don't even talk to him. doesn't jesus want you to love your neighbour? how are you looking after god's flock if you're not helping people find god? bad christian!

Where did i take a shot at the infidel? Actually i am a Christian and as such i am an unbeliever in the quran so i myself am an infidel, Maybe you would have been more correct in your speech if you had said i was taking a shot as a heretic. But even then you would have been wrong because i was just genuinely puzzled at why anyone would seek deep insight into the one faith from a person who's quran calls my faith blasphemy.

He and every other muslim that comes to this site can read what i have said. I don't need to address an answer to any particular person all people can read. And another thing Only people who believe Jesus are of His flock, no unbeliever is of His flock.

So please before you go judging me a bad Christian try and get your facts right.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

i don't get that part, why does jesus let you into heaven just because you believe in him? what purpose does that serve? cos ur gullible i'll spare you from eternal damnation? your beliefs depend on what kind of person you are, and god determined what kind of person you are.

Believing Jesus takes one to come to acknowledge they are sinners needing saving. And that is the truth of our situation. Believing Jesus takes believing in the truth of Gods will as given through the prophets that what God calls sin is sin and what God calls good is good. It is salvation by agreement with God, and that is the only way we could ever have salvation because no person has ever gone through life being perfect or even becoming perfect. As has already been stated those who resist sin in the flesh never succeed and many of those who are struggling under the bondage of false religions to be sinless are full of sinful thoughts. As Jesus said a thought is the same as an act. to even look at a woman and think of committing adultery with her is the same as having done it and to hate another person is to be a murderer.

There is no way to God but by accepting the truth. The fullness of that truth came to us through the Messiah Jesus.

It is not gullible to have an accurate measurement of yourself, it is gullible to think your something better than you are and try for the rest of your life to brain wash yourself into maintaining that delusion.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Pete]

CHRISTIANS ONLY!!!

IF YOU ARE NON-CHRISTIAN, AND BELIEVE THAT ONE OPTION FITS WITH THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY OF CHRISTIANS YOU SPEAK WITH, PICK THAT BOX.

just trying to get a better idea of what people think. some christians told me i can be a rapist so long as i believe in jesus, and still go to heaven. i wondered what other christians might think of that.
According to Paul, it's deadset simple:
Romans 10:9-10
...if you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and if you believe with your heart that God raised him from the dead, then you will be saved.
It is by believing with the heart that you are justified, and by making the declaration with your lips that you are saved.

According to Jesus, it's a little more difficult:
Matthew 19:17
...If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.

Who do you think is more authoritative?

[codanblad]

Believing Jesus takes one to come to acknowledge they are sinners needing saving. And that is the truth of our situation. Believing Jesus takes believing in the truth of Gods will as given through the prophets that what God calls sin is sin and what God calls good is good. It is salvation by agreement with God, and that is the only way we could ever have salvation because no person has ever gone through life being perfect or even becoming perfect. As has already been stated those who resist sin in the flesh never succeed and many of those who are struggling under the bondage of false religions to be sinless are full of sinful thoughts. As Jesus said a thought is the same as an act. to even look at a woman and think of committing adultery with her is the same as having done it and to hate another person is to be a murderer.

There is no way to God but by accepting the truth. The fullness of that truth came to us through the Messiah Jesus.

It is not gullible to have an accurate measurement of yourself, it is gullible to think your something better than you are and try for the rest of your life to brain wash yourself into maintaining that delusion.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

just looking at these quotes Romans 10:9-10
...if you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and if you believe with your heart that God raised him from the dead, then you will be saved.
It is by believing with the heart that you are justified, and by making the declaration with your lips that you are saved.
Matthew 19:17
...If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.

does the bible specify that believing in jesus means agreeing with and observing everything he said? i mean i believe in my brother, that he exists, that my father is his father, that he was born on a certain date etc. doesn't mean i like him lol.

i mean i could believe in jesus but not like god. do i have to believe that jesus is infallible? what if i believe in jesus but think the bible was wrong about him, if despite my best efforts i went around robbing people thinking that's what jesus expected of me?

[swarm]

Take adstar for example. It wouldn't do to have him wandering about free.

[Adstar]

just looking at these quotes Romans 10:9-10
...if you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and if you believe with your heart that God raised him from the dead, then you will be saved.
It is by believing with the heart that you are justified, and by making the declaration with your lips that you are saved.
Matthew 19:17
...If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.

does the bible specify that believing in jesus means agreeing with and observing everything he said? i mean i believe in my brother, that he exists, that my father is his father, that he was born on a certain date etc. doesn't mean i like him lol.


But Believing in Jesus and Believing Jesus are two different things. If one does not believe Jesus (His teachings/His Word) but proclaims to believe in Jesus. Then it must be asked of them, Who is the Jesus you believe in? Is it the true Jesus or another jesus invented by tradition.

2 Corrinthians 11
3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!

Jesus said “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?" i can add to that why do people call Him Lord and not even believe what he said?


Believing in Jesus is of no effect if you Do not believe Jesus, all you believe in then is just a twisted construct of the traditions of men.


i mean i could believe in jesus but not like god. do i have to believe that jesus is infallible?

Yes Jesus is infallible.


what if i believe in jesus but think the bible was wrong about him,

Then you are only believing in a jesus of your own construct. Your not believing Jesus but believing in a jesus cut down to a point where he is acceptable to your biases and opinions. You will then not believe in Jesus but you will believe in a cut down and altered jesus of your own making.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[swarm]

some christians told me i can be a rapist so long as i believe in jesus, and still go to heaven. i wondered what other christians might think of that.

Universalists believe that everyone goes to heaven eventually. Rapists, Hitler, fundies, doesn't matter.

They hooked up with the Unitarians a while back and formed the UUs (unitarian universalists). A while back there was a schism where the majority of UUs decided that they weren't really xtians any more, but some UUs wanted to still be xtians.

There are various sects of xtian who more or less hold the universalist position. Usually there is a caveat that you have to repent and be saved, but not always.

[swarm]

Then you are only believing in a jesus of your own construct.

So believing some one else's construct is ok, but believing your own is a no-no?

[codanblad]

i mean i could believe in jesus but not like god. do i have to believe that jesus is infallible?
Then you are only believing in a jesus of your own construct. Your not believing Jesus but believing in a jesus cut down to a point where he is acceptable to your biases and opinions. You will then not believe in Jesus but you will believe in a cut down and altered jesus of your own making.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

are you also saying the bible is infallible? i haven't felt any divine presence, and the bible is a bunch of letters written by men, i found what i read of it ridiculously boring and repetitive. how am i supposed to know/believe jesus? i prayed and believed as a child, i got nothing out of that.

[jayleew]

are you also saying the bible is infallible? i haven't felt any divine presence, and the bible is a bunch of letters written by men, i found what i read of it ridiculously boring and repetitive. how am i supposed to know/believe jesus? i prayed and believed as a child, i got nothing out of that.

Let go of trying if you haven't already. (not necessarily talking to you codanblad) Take the peaceful sanity of not trying to believe anymore, and just fess up and say, "I don't believe. I have been lyling to myself and others for the sake of myself and others." if you don't believe. That marks your road for recovery, whether it be into theism or atheism in the future. I am fully prepared to reenter theism now that I have accepted the facts, but I will not without a good reason to. And I am just fine with that. If I become a Christian again, it will be because of my own choice, not my parents choice to indoctrinate me.

[Adstar]

are you also saying the bible is infallible? i haven't felt any divine presence, and the bible is a bunch of letters written by men, i found what i read of it ridiculously boring and repetitive. how am i supposed to know/believe jesus? i prayed and believed as a child, i got nothing out of that.

But what did you believe in? Who or what where you believing in?

Look at it this way. If God wants people to know His will and there are people around who think they know Him but in reality have got a very wrong picture of Him, what is God to do? Leave them there happy and content in a false belief or do something to take away that contentment to cause them to lose faith in that false view of Him,

There are a lot of people who have left a false belief in Jesus believing that their false view was the only view. Then later in life they re-visit thoughts on God and Seek anew. Then God moves to lead them to come to a correct view.

Another thing, most people i know who have read one of the Gospels have not found the story and words of Jesus boring, irrespective of their final decision on the matter. The Gospel message is in the Gospels and they are a very short part of the bible.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[leopold99]

i don't get that part, why does jesus let you into heaven just because you believe in him? what purpose does that serve? cos ur gullible i'll spare you from eternal damnation? your beliefs depend on what kind of person you are, and god determined what kind of person you are.
don't feel alone, i don't get it either.

[codanblad]

But what did you believe in? Who or what where you believing in?

Look at it this way. If God wants people to know His will and there are people around who think they know Him but in reality have got a very wrong picture of Him, what is God to do? Leave them there happy and content in a false belief or do something to take away that contentment to cause them to lose faith in that false view of Him,

There are a lot of people who have left a false belief in Jesus believing that their false view was the only view. Then later in life they re-visit thoughts on God and Seek anew. Then God moves to lead them to come to a correct view.

Another thing, most people i know who have read one of the Gospels have not found the story and words of Jesus boring, irrespective of their final decision on the matter. The Gospel message is in the Gospels and they are a very short part of the bible.


so whilst seeking god as a child, he thought it a better idea to ignore me completely rather than just push me in the right direction? i was a child, i didn't have the higher reasoning to question what i was being told and find the 'true' god. doesn't that make all children godless, unless they happen to be born into the right family?

another issue i have is if i didn't or don't 'truly' believe, why did god make me so skeptical? Considering he's the greatest power in the universe, he makes very little effort to convince people to follow him. 2000 years after sending A SINGLE PERSON he's gathered a very small percentage of people that we could call true devoted followers.

i'll try out the gospels, i can't recall ever reading from them.

[Adstar]

so whilst seeking god as a child, he thought it a better idea to ignore me completely rather than just push me in the right direction?

You may have not been ready to be shown the right direction.

i was a child, i didn't have the higher reasoning to question what i was being told and find the 'true' god.

And thus you may not have been ready to take on the message of God.


doesn't that make all children godless, unless they happen to be born into the right family?

Well depends on what age child your talking about? But yes as children leave the age of innocence they become Godless. Not sure how being born into the right family has anything to do with it. Each and every person irrespective of what family they are born into become sinners.


another issue i have is if i didn't or don't 'truly' believe, why did god make me so skeptical? Considering he's the greatest power in the universe, he makes very little effort to convince people to follow him. 2000 years after sending A SINGLE PERSON he's gathered a very small percentage of people that we could call true devoted followers.

Yes but after Sending that "SINGLE PERSON" He has guarded that message in the Bible all those centuries and not a day has not passed where he has had a people on earth who believe in Him.

In a way it is like what i said before God does not need us But God wants us. I say this God could use His great power to come and pay each individual a personal visit. But he wants to use the Message of Jesus to be the thing that attracts. It's not what God can do but it is what God Has chosen to do.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days


i'll try out the gospels, i can't recall ever reading from them.

[codanblad]

Not sure how being born into the right family has anything to do with it. Each and every person irrespective of what family they are born into become sinners.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

i was saying the right family might teach you all the right things about god, that's how a child could truly believe in god.

i still feel god has neglected mankind, a lot of people are in hell because of the methods he has chosen, and the way he created the world. i can't respect a god who does such a poor job unless i embrace the notion of 'all part of his plan', and that seems like blind faith to me.

can you recommend a part of the gospels or just all of it?

[Adstar]

i was saying the right family might teach you all the right things about god, that's how a child could truly believe in god.

The family might give you an early start in seeking. But no i do not believe the right family can make their children saved. Salvation comes when a person reacts personally to the message of Jesus with conviction and agreement and trust. A lot of kids just want to please their parents and say they believe and accept only for the positive affirmations they receive for doing so. Also many of them have an incomplete understanding of what they are agreeing to because it is coming to the second hand. In fact i believe it can be a disadvantage to have the right parents because it is harder to come to the truth the closer you where to the truth before you rebel.


i still feel god has neglected mankind, a lot of people are in hell because of the methods he has chosen, and the way he created the world.

Well firstly we don't know who is in hell. and as the final judgement has not yet happened no one is yet in the lake of fire.

i can't respect a god who does such a poor job unless i embrace the notion of 'all part of his plan', and that seems like blind faith to me.

Well try to consider the simple message of Jesus and go from there. Also until the end comes and we can see for ourselves the end result, we cannot judge the quality of His Work, can we?



can you recommend a part of the gospels or just all of it?

The Gospel/book of Matthew is probably the most detailed. Many believers love the Gospel/book of John because it is deeper.

If you’re looking for a significant part within a Gospel read Matthew starting in chapter 5 to the end of Chapter 7. Here is a link to the chapters if you want to read it:


http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=47&chapter=5&version=50


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Lebo]

God knows you the best, if you are chosing wrong or right is up to you. Only God knows your heart, I don't so I can't tell you where you will end up but the more you learn about what good and bad is and if you deny the good than I say again, only God knows your heart.

[swarm]

God knows you the best, if you are chosing wrong or right is up to you. Only God knows your heart, I don't so I can't tell you where you will end up but the more you learn about what good and bad is and if you deny the good than I say again, only God knows your heart.

Which god?