Jewishness and the right of return

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by S.A.M., May 22, 2008.

  1. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    According to genetic studies, Palestinians are genetically similar to Israeli Jews and the Lebanese.

    According to the "democratic" state of Israel, Jewishness is an ethnicity, not a religion. Hence, Jews who are atheist or secular are also Jews and have the right of return to Israel, regardless of a 2000 year hiatus. Palestinians who share this "ethnicity" are not permitted, however, even though until 1948, they have been continuously inhabiting Palestine-Israel, even during the 2000 year hiatus that the pre-1948 ancestors of current "Jews" were prevailed upon to.

    So what, besides religious discrimination, is the basis of denying Palestinians a right of return? Or is Jewish ethnicity nullified in other religious groups?
     
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  3. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Their history of trying to destroy Israel.
     
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  5. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    The Israel that destroyed their homes? And considers them a "demographic" threat (imagine being a demographic threat where you have a history of thousands of years)

    Or is this allusion to some 2000 year old historical incident?
     
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  7. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    The Arabs that tried to prevent Jewish self-determination in opposition to the UN mandate?
     
  8. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    they aren't trying to destroy israel they just want to either move back to there homes or be compensated for them.

    And sam jesus fucking christ i am not overly fond of israel but you rabid anti jewdom is begining to get on my nerves
     
  9. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Hmm so you're saying that if a similar UN mandate was made today about Palestinian refugees, the Israelis would not be opposed to Palestinian self determination in a one state solution in Israel?
     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Its "rabid anti-jewdom" to point out active and violent discrimination?

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    I would like to hear how people view this ethnic Jewishness, especially atheists (being free from the delusions that beset theists and all)

    If its based on genetics, the Palestinians should be included, if religion, "atheist Jews" do not qualify. So what is it?
     
  11. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    your failing to see the one major difference between the jews "self-determination" and other peoples. the jewish people were not the majority until after the creation. and secondly every other single group had been living on said land for years in addition to be in the majority. The land had already been promised to the people already living there who were fucked over so the land could go to the jews and the main reason for that was not people thought they deserved a country of there own but they felt guilty for not doing anything about the holocaust.
     
  12. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    you have shown a repeated negative comments and failing to recognize the point of view of the jewish people. that is what your rabid anti jewdom is.
     
  13. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Actually, most of the land was sold to the Jews by Arabs, who benefitted greatly from the capital. There was no intention to exclude the Arabs from what they knew would be a Jewish homeland.

    It was the mufti's concern with solidifying his political position that largely underlay the 1929 carnage in which 133 Jews were massacred and hundreds more were wounded -- just as it was the struggle for political preeminence that triggered the most protracted outbreak of Palestinian Arab violence in 1936-39. This was widely portrayed as a nationalist revolt against both the ruling British and the Jewish refugees then streaming into Palestine to escape Nazi persecution. In fact, it was a massive exercise in violence that saw far more Arabs than Jews or Englishmen murdered by Arab gangs, that repressed and abused the general Arab population, and that impelled thousands of Arabs to flee the country in a foretaste of the 1947-48 exodus.​


    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121019679929074973.html?mod=opinion_journal_federation
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    I have yet to receive any explanation which adequately explains why the Jewish people have any rights to a land after 2000 years. You could start for example by giving me an example of a country that accepts the right of the UN to establish a country for immigrants on their land based on historical rights
     
  15. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    A one-state proposal is equivalent to disbanding the state of Israel, and no politician is seriously considering it, except Palestinian ones.
     
  16. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Explain that please.
     
  17. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Jews had been living there as long as Arabs have. WWII made the establishment of a state for Jews a compelling political movement. They did not intent to take any land that did not belong to them. That result was forced by Arab violence.
     
  18. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    and why does it not suprise me that you ignore that the under the self-determination rules the UN laid out the people who should have gotten to create the nation were the palestinians and that the land was already promised to them.
     
  19. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Given the animosity of present day Arabs towards Israel, combining the opposing parties is a recipe for civil war. The idea is to prevent war, not cause one.
     
  20. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    so basically what your saying is the Palestinians should continue to be fucked over.
     
  21. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    The very fucking creation of the nation of israel had required taking land that didn't fucking belong to them. So yeah they very well did fucking intend to.
     
  22. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    You have to ask yourself why the majority Arab population did not rise up and defeat the minority Jews. The answer is that they did not object to the Jewish state. They would have been a part of it if not for the violence of a few.
     
  23. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Incorrect.
     

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