View Full Version : We don't want your stinking Qurans!
mikenostic
10-24-07, 05:07 PM
Wow, talk about a public slap in the face...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21455714/
Who donated them to who? Its not clear.
Read-Only
10-24-07, 05:13 PM
Who donated them to who? Its not clear.
The Governor's Ethnic American Advisory Council ( a comittee reporting to the state governor) donated them to members of the state lawmakers (the legislature).
MacGyver1968
10-24-07, 05:13 PM
quick question Sam, is the proper spelling of your Holy book "Koran" or "Quran"?
mikenostic
10-24-07, 05:15 PM
Who donated them to who? Its not clear.
I'll have to concur. It isn't very clear, especially towards who donated them. But the recipients seem to be the Oklahoma state legislation (maybe state Senate and House?).
I'd also like to know who donated the books, but then again, why would it be that important where they came from?
quick question Sam, is the proper spelling of your Holy book "Koran" or "Quran"?
Good question. I posted Quran because that's the way the article spelled it. I've seen it spelled both ways myself.
mikenostic
10-24-07, 05:19 PM
Here's a bit more information on it:
http://right-mind.us/blogs/blog_0/archive/2007/10/24/55483.aspx
Read-Only
10-24-07, 05:21 PM
I'll have to concur. It isn't very clear, especially towards who donated them. But the recipients seem to be the Oklahoma state legislation (maybe state Senate and House?).
I'd also like to know who donated the books, but then again, why would it be that important where they came from?
I don't follow the confusion. :shrug:
As I said in my post, it was the Governor's Ethnic American Advisory Council - obviously a committee formed by the governor's office and given the duty of trying to promote tolerance across ethnic lines. (That's what it's title says to me.)
quick question Sam, is the proper spelling of your Holy book "Koran" or "Quran"?
If you must be picky, it should ideally be al-Qur’ān (Arabic: القرآن ) or "The Recital" from Qira'at (silent t), recitation.
MacGyver1968
10-24-07, 05:31 PM
thanks sam
but then again, why would it be that important where they came from?
I just wondered who would actually donate Qurans in the US. The reaction is totally expected however, I would be greatly surprised if it had been any other.
Nikelodeon
10-24-07, 05:35 PM
They should have put the cover of the Bible over them.
thanks sam
You're welcome.
The Q is a hard sound which the K does not replicate, you should feel the back of your throat hitting the uvula.
They should have put the cover of the Bible over them.
is that legal? heads would surely roll.
<ba dum dum>
nova900
10-24-07, 05:39 PM
Wow, talk about a public slap in the face...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21455714/
The irony being that some of those lawmakers and probably many in the public in Oklahoma have a literal belief in the idealogy of the Old Testament which has numerous acts of violence against innocents. Although not considered "innocent" by believers.
Of course when looking down upon another religion;Islam in this case,the innocent are indeed ...innocent.
Hypocrisy rules.
spidergoat
10-24-07, 05:50 PM
Right decision but for the wrong reasons. A secular state doesn't need any holy books.
I got excited for a nanosecond...I thought it read 'we don't want your stinking Queen!
..not enough important words begin with Q.
:-/
Read-Only
10-24-07, 06:23 PM
I just wondered who would actually donate Qurans in the US. The reaction is totally expected however, I would be greatly surprised if it had been any other.
Sam, would you or someone with very deep intimate knowledge address the question that is actually at the heart of this issue? Does the Quran in fact advocate the killing of non-believers and others who ignore it's basic teachings? The impression that most of the Western world has is that it does.
iceaura
10-24-07, 07:21 PM
Sam, would you or someone with very deep intimate knowledge address the question that is actually at the heart of this issue? Does the Quran in fact advocate the killing of non-believers and others who ignore it's basic teachings? The impression that most of the Western world has is that it does. If enough people who read it and believe in it think it does, it does.
Just as the Bible mandates the testing of prophets by snake handling.
mikenostic
10-24-07, 07:39 PM
I got excited for a nanosecond...I thought it read 'we don't want your stinking Queen!
..not enough important words begin with Q.
:-/
I tell you what; if I find an article that is dissin' a queen somewhere, even an ant or hornet kind, I will ensure the thread title is that.
Yes, because I'm cool like that, I will do that for you, Atom. :thumbup:
lol
Read-Only
10-24-07, 07:45 PM
If enough people who read it and believe in it think it does, it does.
Just as the Bible mandates the testing of prophets by snake handling.
That does not address my question. I want to know specifically if it contains direct commandments to do that. Not beliefs or interpretations.
Michael
10-24-07, 08:39 PM
They should have put the cover of the Bible over them.Pfff that's too funny. And sent them in Arabic.
Anyone know if it's possible to get a (insert any foreign language) translation of the Satanic Bible? We could put a very nice Bible Cover on it and mail it to some conservative representatives in the Republican Party :p
They should accept them since like the bible (can be easy collected from most hotel rooms for free) they are great for log fires.
I tell you what; if I find an article that is dissin' a queen somewhere, even an ant or hornet kind, I will ensure the thread title is that.
Yes, because I'm cool like that, I will do that for you, Atom. :thumbup:
lol
ty
I'm now going to vote for you as the forums most helpful member.
:)
iceaura
10-25-07, 07:55 PM
That does not address my question. I want to know specifically if it contains direct commandments to do that. Not beliefs or interpretations. Well, that will depend on which expert you ask. Some say it does, some say it doesn't.
Does the Bible contain specific commandments to beat your children? Specific commandments to handle snakes? Specific commandments to not eat pork? Specific commandments against lending money at interest? Does it mandate killing witches? Remaining idle on Sunday - or Saturday? Does it prohibit killing, or only murder?
All such texts are matters of interpretation and belief.
As far as I know (this comes from owning and reading a Qur'an myself), there are various verses advocating forcing conversion through violence, but never directed at non-combatants (so blowing up civilian busses is a no-no). Also, remember that Christians and Jewish people have historically always been treated in a special way by Muslims (being "people of the book") and, apart from paying special taxes, have lived better lives under Muslim rule (like the Jews who left Europe with the Muslims when they were defeated by the French, since living under Islam was much better than living under Christianity).
If Christians and Muslims simply believed what the Qur'an claims Jesus said ("and Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship him, this is the Straight Path.") then there would be less conflict since ultimately both RELIGIONS do not like strife, but the POLITICS of their believers have totally different ideas.
As far as I know (this comes from owning and reading a Qur'an myself), there are various verses advocating forcing conversion through violence, but never directed at non-combatants (so blowing up civilian busses is a no-no). Also, remember that Christians and Jewish people have historically always been treated in a special way by Muslims (being "people of the book") and, apart from paying special taxes, have lived better lives under Muslim rule (like the Jews who left Europe with the Muslims when they were defeated by the French, since living under Islam was much better than living under Christianity).
If Christians and Muslims simply believed what the Qur'an claims Jesus said ("and Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship him, this is the Straight Path.") then there would be less conflict since ultimately both RELIGIONS do not like strife, but the POLITICS of their believers have totally different ideas. who said religion was right?
charles brough
10-27-07, 07:57 AM
The irony being that some of those lawmakers and probably many in the public in Oklahoma have a literal belief in the idealogy of the Old Testament which has numerous acts of violence against innocents. Although not considered "innocent" by believers.
Of course when looking down upon another religion;Islam in this case,the innocent are indeed ...innocent.
Hypocrisy rules.
Exactly! Even the New Testament has the same thing. Look at Luke 19-26,27 where he expects disbelievers to be brought to him and slain. Or what about "I come not to bring peace but a sword!" Indeed, his followers did carry swords and even sliced off an ear of one of the centurions who came to arrest Jesus for starting a riot in the Temple.
To vega (why doesn't quoting on this forum work under Opera Mini?):
Let us, as rationalists and atheists, not forget what the real problem is. Gods, being non-existent, are not inherently evil. The problem lies with the mentally unstable psychos who adopt the man-made religions and exercise their innate depravity using religion as an excuse.
Yes, so Islam was what motivated the Arabs to get off the back sides and try to conquer the whole world 1400 years ago, but it was the PEOPLE who did that, not the inanimate belief system.
There has always been tribalism in Ireland, the adoption of Catholicism and Protestantism only helped to make their grievances seem more acceptable. The same's true about the "Middle East conflict"; as one of the Jewish characters in the movie Munich says (I'm paraphrasing): "Everyone thinks we can solve this by being nice. But how do you think we got that land in the first place? We didn't get it by being 'nice'" and that's how all the trouble starts...
broadandbeaver
10-29-07, 11:49 AM
I find it funny that people will talk ill about a thing they have no knowledge about. There is no worse ingnorance that one who talks about something yet has no idea from first hand knowledge what he speaks on.
SkinWalker
10-29-07, 12:28 PM
That comment relies on the premise that those you are referring to truly do not have "knowledge about" that which they are discussing. It also assumes that there is a level of knowledge, which you are keeping secret, that one might attain in order to speak ill about something.
If one is not careful, one might think that you are implying that unless you accept a given religious superstition as true, one cannot be "knowledgeable" about it and, therefore, cannot speak ill of it.
I have, for instance, far more knowledge of Islam and Christianity than I do of pedophilia, but if I were to speak ill of pedophilia, would you criticize me for it?
phlogistician
10-30-07, 11:50 AM
I find it funny that people will talk ill about a thing they have no knowledge about. There is no worse ingnorance that one who talks about something yet has no idea from first hand knowledge what he speaks on.
So you 'know' God? Does he talk to you? Do you hear a voice in your head?
Go to skepticsannotatedbible site and click on Quran (Koran) then check out the categories on the right side. The Quran says that unbelievers are; ugly, ignorant and perverted and that muslims should not make friends with them (or even talk to them) but make war on them. Muslims who do not do that are condemned to hell too along with unbelievers (the Quran in HUNDREDS of places tells how unbelievers will burn forever in hell.)
The Quran is an evil book which Islamic terrorists use to justify their war on unbelievers.
phlogistician
11-01-07, 06:00 AM
The Quran is an evil book which Islamic terrorists use to justify their war on unbelievers.
And of course xtians have the Old Testament to provide their hate.
Devildriver_rocks
11-02-07, 10:39 PM
qu'oran or koran can be spelled either way but their is nothhing wrong with and who ever mad this thread is an idiot for not showing tolerance for others beliefs i mean i don't ostracize you for probably being a christian as i am an atheist no so don't don't do that its wrong and degenerative
phlogistician
11-03-07, 08:44 AM
qu'oran or koran can be spelled either way but their is nothhing wrong with and who ever mad this thread is an idiot for not showing tolerance for others beliefs i mean i don't ostracize you for probably being a christian as i am an atheist no so don't don't do that its wrong and degenerative
Here's where you are wrong. Nobody has to tolerate other people's beliefs. All we have to do is not discriminate against people for their beliefs, but we are free to criticise them all we want. If people don't want to get into a discussion, dissection or criticism of their religion, they are free to keep quiet about it. If they choose to talk about it, openly, we are free to criticise, openly. Proselytism is a two way street.
Sometimes the language used here may seem inflammatory, but then if you go read the Old Testament, it's hardly full of love and tolerance either.
vBulletin® v3.6.8, Copyright ©2000-2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.