A Must see for all Christians

[UncleChrist]

All the Christians especially need to watch this Movie


:bugeye:

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/


If you don't watch it all the way to part three ...its everyones loss


:cool:

[Medicine*Woman]

All the Christians especially need to watch this Movie

:bugeye:

zeitgeistmovie.com

If you don't watch it all the way to part three ...its everyones loss

:cool:
*************
M*W: Excellent references!

[UncleChrist]

If one of you pro posters can add a link
It Might Help :shrug:

I'm still three posts away from being able to add a ULR link
:mad:

Thank You

[mikenostic]

Here you go.

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

I had to pause it at 6 and 1/2 minutes because I'm at work but it is pretty intense so far.

*runs and grabs popcorn and awaits Christians/theists to post their various apologies/explanations*

[UncleChrist]

zeitgeist

Zeit·geist [ zt gst, tst gst ] or
zeit·geist [ zt gst, tst gst ]


noun

Definition:

ideas and spirit of time: the ideas prevalent in a period and place, particularly as expressed in literature, philosophy, and religion


[Mid-19th century. < German, "spirit of the time"]

[UncleChrist]

Thanks for the link Mikenostic :D

I doubt most will make it past the 911 part
it's a shame to :(

part three is really a must see

[mikenostic]

I just got past the George Carlin monologue. He's hilarious. I may have to finish watching this at home.

[mikenostic]

I had to take a screen shot of the movie:

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f32/mike240z/Horus.jpg

http://www.orlyowl.com/osnap.jpg

Wasn't someone else of historical importance supposedly born on December
25th, of a virgin, with a star in the East...about 3000 years after Horus?

Hmmmmm

EDIT: It appears I posted this a bit too soon because they go on to say that Horus was crucified, dead for three days and rose from the dead. Horus also had 12 disciples, among other BC figures with eerily similar traits/backgrounds.

[Dark520]

After the first minute, I feel like I'm being brainwashed, lol.

[Orleander]

Is this anything like Jesus Camp? I mean, is it a horror movie?

[John J. Bannan]

No one knows Jesus' birthday. It's common knowledge that December 25th was choosen to coincide with the Winter Solistice. This is no revelation.

[mikenostic]

No one knows Jesus' birthday. It's common knowledge that December 25th was choosen to coincide with the Winter Solistice. This is no revelation.

Which would mean that even LESS is known about Jesus, and would thus require even MORE blind faith to assume he existed. tsk tsk tsk.

EDIT: Oh, and congrats: You are the first one to make an apology/excuse, as flimsy as it is though. Although I did expect one sooner.

[UncleChrist]

I have to admit
I thought the way the movie opens is really not going to do it any justice
it's really an awful beginning

But you have to see the rest
also this is nothing like jesus cramp
this movie is a must see ;)

[GhostofMaxwell.]

Is it funny?

[John99]

i will have to download my sound card drivers to watch this piece of shit movies. Everyone wants to be a film maker, everyone want to have a web site, no one can accept that they really are just average.

oh, maybe this guy did not exist - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato - And mikenostic when was his birthday?

I will make up a list later for you guys of people who could not have existed...LOL...fucking fools.

AND REMEMBER- all you geniuses were getting hard for that titanic guys crap 'documentary and i was the first to make any kind of argument (you can search it) as to how it was bullshit...i was the first anywhere as a matter of fact to point out specifics...before i even watched it. That would makeme superior, at least in some ways...ha ha ha.

[Dark520]

So far I have only watched the religion part and part of the WTC part, I'll watch the Federal reserve in a minute...

Religion - I don't see how anyone could possibly explain all these 'coincidences' that occur within all religions; the proof is right there, religion is a device created to control the masses, period.

WTC - If you seriously believe that 9/11 was a conspiracy, go watch Screw Lose Change and have all your questions answered.

Federal Reserve - Allegations with no actual proof...

[John99]

I don't see how anyone could possibly explain all these 'coincidences' that occur within all religions; the proof is right there, religion is a device created to control the masses, period.

er....um yeah, oh and maybe it is because these are aspects that are actually accurate...ok, but your controlled, arent we controlled from our first breaths? you guy just dont think. Sorry, this stuff HAS got to come out.

i will be gone for a few hours, when i get back the gloves are coming off.

[Just_Not_There]

This film is also available at http://stage6.divx.com with much better resolution

[mikenostic]

er....um yeah, oh and maybe it is because these are aspects that are actually accurate...ok, but your controlled, arent we controlled from our first breaths? you guy just dont think. Sorry, this stuff HAS got to come out.

i will be gone for a few hours, when i get back the gloves are coming off.
Do us a favor, watch the film before you make any more comments. If I can watch it with an unbiased p.o.v., then I'm sure you can too.
My gloves are already off. We'll have the octagon ready for you, knuckles cracked and all.

[logicpolice]

This is a very interesting piece of work. It seems to be a great mixture of historical fact, modern conspiracy theory and socialist propaganda all rolled into one neat package.
The third chapter is most interesting of all. The drive towards one world government and cashless society. Ironically the main climax of the most popular book in the bible “revelations” is all about an impending one world government and cashless society where no man can trade lest he have the mark of the beast. It begs the question –Do the authors of this film who bash religion at the beginning of it know that they are giving credence to that religion at the end of it? Or do they blame religion for creating a distasteful reality?:shrug:

[Dark520]

er....um yeah, oh and maybe it is because these are aspects that are actually accurate...ok

Explain to me what a bird-man and Jesus have in common, please. I think that the 'saviour' being half-bird is a pretty big difference; one that couldn't be lost in translation.

[Orleander]

aren't bird men called angels??

[Dark520]

I meant Horus...

[SnakeLord]

i will have to download my sound card drivers to watch this piece of shit movies. Everyone wants to be a film maker, everyone want to have a web site, no one can accept that they really are just average.

oh, maybe this guy did not exist - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato - And mikenostic when was his birthday?

I will make up a list later for you guys of people who could not have existed...LOL...fucking fools.

AND REMEMBER- all you geniuses were getting hard for that titanic guys crap 'documentary and i was the first to make any kind of argument (you can search it) as to how it was bullshit...i was the first anywhere as a matter of fact to point out specifics...before i even watched it. That would makeme superior, at least in some ways...ha ha ha.

Well, there's a clear example of someone on this thread that has watched the first part and realises it knocks his life long beliefs to shit.

"my fucking sound card, this fucking shit movie, you're all fucking fools......"

Lol, that's fucking funny.

[JetPilot]

this is not only for christians, this should be viewed by eveyone

[logicpolice]

What am I, the invisable man here? Everyone seems reved up and ready to go here. Anyone care to take a swing at explaining this amazing coincidence?


The third chapter is most interesting of all. The drive towards one world government and cashless society. Ironically the main climax of the most popular book in the bible “revelations” is all about an impending one world government and cashless society where no man can trade lest he have the mark of the beast. It begs the question –Do the authors of this film who bash religion at the beginning of it know that they are giving credence to that religion at the end of it? Or do they blame religion for creating a distasteful reality?

[UncleChrist]

Anyone care to take a swing at explaining this amazing coincidence


Ya how about ....We Create our own reality ...

like...... thoughts .......become things

or ......are we helpless :rolleyes:

[logicpolice]

I think I would have to side with the “we are helpless” option.
I truly believe that a one-world government is inevitable and that cashless society is going to be part of the mix. But just like the authors of your movie I didn’t arrive at that conclusion because of some ancient text. It’s easier to just look around you and recognize that global problems will only be solved with global cooperation.
As for thoughts becoming things I’ve never been able to conjure up a pizza when I needed one. All kidding aside creating our own reality really is a misnomer. Every wildebeest in Africa may very well have it’s own quirky personality but ever year he will migrate across the Serengeti with the rest of them because the herd mentality of survival always takes precedence over his limited free will. Humans build cities, nations and governing systems. All of which evolve over time just like every other biological thing on this entire planet.
So the mystery remains, while it’s easy for us now to see where where’re going and why, how did someone six thousand years ago manage to see the same thing?

[UncleChrist]

I truly believe that a one-world government is inevitable

And their you have it .....:rolleyes:

[logicpolice]

Is that the best you got?
What a pity:poke:

[Medicine*Woman]

aren't bird men called angels??
*************
M*W: Stars are called angels.

[Medicine*Woman]

Ya how about ....We Create our own reality ...

like...... thoughts .......become things

or ......are we helpless :rolleyes:
*************
M*W: So true. We do create our own reality, our own life, and our own destiny. No gods need apply.

[Repo Man]

Curious to know what Skinwalker thinks of this.

Edit: Oh hell, they started out interesting with the religious stuff, but then it went straight into the crapper Loose Change style.

[UncleChrist]

This movie doesn't really get started till about ten minutes into it
the beginning needs a little editing for sure


It's to bad most will stop watching at about the 911 conspiracy

when Part three is what sheeple need to see

"Repo Man"

sounds like you never got to part three


the last forty minutes are worth seeing
;)

[John99]

My gloves are already off. We'll have the octagon ready for you, knuckles cracked and all.

h ha m just kidding.

Explain to me what a bird-man and Jesus have in common, please. I think that the 'saviour' being half-bird is a pretty big difference; one that couldn't be lost in translation.

I am screwed i messed up USB sound on my system (edited registry:rolleyes: ) now my m-audio usb wont work.

Can someone explain this to me, about bird-man. M*W is it true? what is this bird-man stuff about...i need to know:p ...QUICK.

,,,,, fixed my souncard. - the hand of fate is on me now. he he he.

So far the CGI is gratuitous = george carlin has not been funny for 18 years. there goes the sun again *damn* -there was no t.v, people watched the stars?

First thing that comes to my mind is @ 11.51 - how does anyone know these figures were worshipped? how could one know that these objects were not entertainment\characters? THIS is very different than mapping constellations and trying to 'see' further. You may be seeing things meant to entertain children.

Well thats as far as i got...for now/ looks interesting but in many ways sad.

after being told about everyone telling us what the truth is i have to listen to someone tell me what the truthuth is:shrug:

[Crunchy Cat]

Wow, that was some movie. Under the assumption that all the information presented is accurate (skepticism momentarily put aside), doesn't it seem like the movie is trying to show that the Christian 'Elite' are purposefully manipulating people into making Revelations reality (i.e. the ultimate push towards an event predicted by the ultimate delusion)?

[logicpolice]

*************
M*W: So true. We do create our own reality, our own life, and our own destiny. No gods need apply.
That is a nice sentiment M*W and I can appreciate your nurturing style there. The fact is your right to some degree. WE can make our own choices, you can choose to buy the hybrid Honda or the rumbling H3 hummer, you could choose to become a ballerina or a world-class pole-vaulter. Hell the sky is the limit…(but only because once you get beyond the sky you would suffocate in the vacuum of space).
And yes you could live your life free from the dominance of any theoretical God. Unless of course God turned out to be just a metaphor for the realities of Nature. Everyone knows that when nature calls you gotta answer because being too full of shit can cause real health problems. It’s kind of sad that once nature created us it put all those heavy restrictions and demands on us, like breathing and sleeping and eating and pro creation and then prohibits the right to fly, walk through walls or shape-shift into a fuzzy bunny. And then demanding our respect by creating hurricanes and forest fires, what’s up with that huh?
The fact is that there is something out there that is bigger than us. It did create us and it does control us as I’ve said before through herd mentality. And try as we might one person can’t start a fire that burns the whole world because there’s always some group of environment wacko’s rushing over to stomp it out. We are trapped here on this planet together and as a group our destiny is to do whatever nature has planned from the beginning.
The world is alive and it owns you!

[logicpolice]

Wow, that was some movie. Under the assumption that all the information presented is accurate (skepticism momentarily put aside), doesn't it seem like the movie is trying to show that the Christian 'Elite' are purposefully manipulating people into making Revelations reality (i.e. the ultimate push towards an event predicted by the ultimate delusion)?
If such is the case you really couldn't call it a delusion anymore could you, we wouldn't want that would we? :eek:
Did you ever consider that it might not be just a Christian terrorist plot but maybe it's a naturally occurring pattern of development that plays it self out through out the cosmos? After all the whole world seems to be participating.

[Dark520]

h ha m just kidding.



I am screwed i messed up USB sound on my system (edited registry:rolleyes: ) now my m-audio usb wont work.

Can someone explain this to me, about bird-man. M*W is it true? what is this bird-man stuff about...i need to know:p ...QUICK.

,,,,, fixed my souncard. - the hand of fate is on me now. he he he.

So far the CGI is gratuitous = george carlin has not been funny for 18 years. there goes the sun again *damn* -there was no t.v, people watched the stars?

First thing that comes to my mind is @ 11.51 - how does anyone know these figures were worshipped? how could one know that these objects were not entertainment\characters? THIS is very different than mapping constellations and trying to 'see' further. You may be seeing things meant to entertain children.

Well thats as far as i got...for now/ looks interesting but in many ways sad.

after being told about everyone telling us what the truth is i have to listen to someone tell me what the truthuth is:shrug:

Well, I won't start to say anything until you've watched it all (or at least the religion part), so hurry up!

[Crunchy Cat]

If such is the case you really couldn't call it a delusion anymore could you, we wouldn't want that would we? :eek:

You mean 'God'? Human action is not evidence of an omnipotent life form.


Did you ever consider that it might not be just a Christian terrorist plot but maybe it's a naturally occurring pattern of development that plays it self out through out the cosmos? After all the whole world seems to be participating.

My first consideration is skepticism of the information presented above anything else.

[logicpolice]

You mean 'God'? Human action is not evidence of an omnipotent life form.
omnipotent life form? :rolleyes: No -I was refering to this- "the ultimate push towards an event predicted by the ultimate delusion" (i.e. making Revelations reality)

My first consideration is skepticism of the information presented above anything else.
I wouldn’t consider that a bad approach. Unless of course it morphed itself into a closed minded ideology rendering it’s occupant incapable of exploring new ideals or gaining new knowledge and leading to a life of hostility and intolerance for anyone standing outside it’s confinement. But surely that’s not you, is it? :jason:

[shorty_37]

I watched the whole thing last night.......and found it QUITE interesting!

Btw I am not Christian or Religious at all.

[Crunchy Cat]

omnipotent life form? :rolleyes: No -I was refering to this- "the ultimate push towards an event predicted by the ultimate delusion" (i.e. making Revelations reality)

Then you'll have to clarify what your original statement meant because it's not clear how it applies to the statement quoted above.



I wouldn’t consider that a bad approach. Unless of course it morphed itself into a closed minded ideology rendering it’s occupant incapable of exploring new ideals or gaining new knowledge and leading to a life of hostility and intolerance for anyone standing outside it’s confinement. But surely that’s not you, is it? :jason:

It's interesting that nowhere in that 'judgement' was truth an implied value.

[Jeff 152]

Its too bad about the last two thirds of the video. I really enjoyed the religion part and i agreed with it.

the 9/11 part, im not too sure. I generally think conspiracy theories are crap, and i havent researched 9/11 enough to really know. I mean for starters why should i listen to them saying that the government made up and skewed facts, when im sure the government said the same about their facts. why should i trust them any more? I can't really draw a conclusion since i don't personally know the facts, and although it seems a little suspicious, i find it a little hard to swallow.

the federal reserve part, complete crap. the federal reserve is a vital and necessary tool in the economy. Now maybe it has been abused sometimes, but its function is vital in the economy. Their argument about debt is stupid because the money they loan creates more money in the form of investment via the multiplier effect. If gold was the only value in society, yes, the system would be awful. But value can be created, and is created, daily, in greater quantities than the debt, which is why our gdp grows faster than teh debt or inflation, so that teh actual value of our country, adjusted for inflation and all that, is growing.

[logicpolice]

Ok-one more time just for you
If such is the case you really couldn't call it a delusion anymore could you, we wouldn't want that would we?
Meaning~if John’s revelation about a one world government and a cashless society actually came to pass, as you suggested with "making Revelations reality" then it would not be a delusion it would be reality!:D
The " we wouldn't want that" part was sarcasm aimed at your distaste for the “Christian elite” simple enough right?

It's interesting that nowhere in that 'judgement' was truth an implied value.
You’re absolutely right it was purely an intimidation tactic designed to get you to come back and possibly engage in a debate about the subject matter at hand.
Allow me to ask again~ Is it possible in your opinion that on any other planet out there that produced intelligent life, that a computerized cashless society and a single planet wide governing system would likely come to pass? If not, why?

[Crunchy Cat]

Ok-one more time just for you

Meaning~if John’s revelation about a one world government and a cashless society actually came to pass, as you suggested with "making Revelations reality" then it would not be a delusion it would be reality!:D

I see. That wasn't the delusion I was referring to. Christianity was the implied delusion and the one world government with all the trimmings is a prediction of the delusion (vs. the delusion itself).

I don't know enough about human psychology and its relationship with economics to know if that kind of behavior naturally occurs, is some kind of self-fufilling prohphecy, or something else.


The " we wouldn't want that" part was sarcasm aimed at your distaste for the “Christian elite” simple enough right?

I didn't realize I had stated I held distate for the Christian 'Elite':

"...it seem like the movie is trying to show that the Christian 'Elite' are purposefully manipulating people into making Revelations reality..."


You’re absolutely right it was purely an intimidation tactic designed to get you to come back and possibly engage in a debate about the subject matter at hand.

I see. It might be hard as I don't hold any positions on the film.


Allow me to ask again~ Is it possible in your opinion that on any other planet out there that produced intelligent life, that a computerized cashless society and a single planet wide governing system would likely come to pass? If not, why?

I don't know.

[UncleChrist]

the federal reserve part, complete crap.

Yep Jeff 152
everything is just peachy keen
I'm rolling in dough $ ... you must be too :rolleyes:

even if you didn't believe any of the conspericy theory of 911 or the world bank fraud
was anybody paying attention to the speech that kennedy gave over 45 years ago
jee I can't imagine why I never heard that speech before

[Lord_Phoenix]

yeah i loved the speech it was great. i kept hearing it 3 times

[UncleChrist]

"...it seems like the movie is trying to show that the Christian 'Elite' are purposefully manipulating people into making Revelations reality..."



The perfect sinister plan
convince them to kill each other with
I don't know ...Maybe like ......a holy war in the middle east
Cha-Ching$$$

[John99]

Allow me to ask again~ Is it possible in your opinion that on any other planet out there that produced intelligent life, that a computerized cashless society and a single planet wide governing system would likely come to pass? If not, why?

It is the only way, may be the best way. its worth a shot.

[Adstar]

"...it seem like the movie is trying to show that the Christian 'Elite' are purposefully manipulating people into making Revelations reality..."

Interesting statement.

Now the book of Revelations clearly states that the movement to a cashless society and the mark of the beast would be moved by forces of the anti-christ.

So the above statement cannot by definition be true. Because no true Christian would take part in implementing this system because doing so would make them out as working for satan.

Of course false christians would have no trouble doing such a thing. But as i already know false christians are not Christians.

Now we come to the fact that the world is moving exactly the right way to fulfilling the prophecies of the Book of Revelation. One day people will be given two options. Worship the image of the beast and receive the Mark of the beast to buy and sell and live. Or refuse to worship the beast and be beheaded.

Now when that day comes just remember. Upon the moment you worship and receive the mark of the beast you will have lost any chance of eternity with God.

The prophecy is coming true and it does not matter who is working to fulfil it. All those working to bring about the day of the Lord are doomed to be consumed in the terror of the day of the Lord.

Amos 5
18 Woe to you who desire the day of the LORD! For what good is the day of the LORD to you? It will be darkness, and not light.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[SnakeLord]

Because no true Christian would take part in implementing this system because doing so would make them out as working for satan.


I don't get it. Why would satan or god give two shits over how people buy and sell groceries? Does it honestly piss god off if I use a credit card instead of £5 notes? Is using a credit card "worship of the beast"?

Should I be trembling because I purchased a pack of smokes using a cheque book?

Honestly, it's such idiocy I can't help but laugh.

You know, a cashless society isn't specifically a bad thing:

1) Money is probably the largest bacteria carrier on the face of the earth. The amount of hands it goes through, the amount of testicles it has sat next to, the amount of people that pick their noses or scratch their bums and then hand over a note to someone else that does exactly the same thing.

2) The amount of paper, (trees) and ink that would be saved is incredible.

3) In England alone they estimate that there are several million pounds worth of pennies sitting on the floor - discarded or dropped.

4) It saves pissing around looking for correct change.

Tell me adstar, why would satan or god care whether we use coins or thumbprints or retina scans or body tags?

How would a cashless society equal "worship of the beast"?

I'm going to be "consumed in terror" because I buy my loaf of bread in a more convenient, hygienic, resource saving manner?

Ok adstar, ok.

[Adstar]

I don't get it. Why would satan or god give two shits over how people buy and sell groceries? Does it honestly piss god off if I use a credit card instead of £5 notes? Is using a credit card "worship of the beast"?

Should I be trembling because I purchased a pack of smokes using a cheque book?

Honestly, it's such idiocy I can't help but laugh.

You know, a cashless society isn't specifically a bad thing:

1) Money is probably the largest bacteria carrier on the face of the earth. The amount of hands it goes through, the amount of testicles it has sat next to, the amount of people that pick their noses or scratch their bums and then hand over a note to someone else that does exactly the same thing.

2) The amount of paper, (trees) and ink that would be saved is incredible.

3) In England alone they estimate that there are several million pounds worth of pennies sitting on the floor - discarded or dropped.

4) It saves pissing around looking for correct change.

Tell me adstar, why would satan or god care whether we use coins or thumbprints or retina scans or body tags?

How would a cashless society equal "worship of the beast"?

I'm going to be "consumed in terror" because I buy my loaf of bread in a more convenient, hygienic, resource saving manner?

Ok adstar, ok.

Now i am going to quote myself and i want you to read it again verrry carefully. This time i will bold and underline what i said, before i said, receive the mark of the beast.

Now we come to the fact that the world is moving exactly the right way to fulfilling the prophecies of the Book of Revelation. One day people will be given two options. Worship the image of the beast and receive the Mark of the beast to buy and sell and live. Or refuse to worship the beast and be beheaded.

Now scripture says that all whom worship the image of the beast will receive the Mark. So i believe that receiving the Mark of the beast will be a reward for those who worship the image of the beast. I believe that it is worshiping the image of the beast that will condemn one to eternity in the lake of fire.

So one will either agree to worship the image and Get the Mark.
Or they will refuse to worship the image and get the chop.

Both options will come from ones decision about worshipping the image of the beast.

Now you might say, "hey i am an athiest i don't believe in gods and stuff so i will never worship anything" But i say to you that the forces of the anti-christ will have the power to preform great signs and wonders, Miracles that will see to it that atheists will cease to exist. All the atheists who keep on demanding undeniable miracles will get them one day and they will believe that Jesus has returned. There will be no atheists in the days of the Anti-christ. Because that is the goal of satan. To be accepted as the returned Messiah and to be worshipped as God on earth.

A great deception indeed.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

1) Money is probably the largest bacteria carrier on the face of the earth. The amount of hands it goes through, the amount of testicles it has sat next to, the amount of people that pick their noses or scratch their bums and then hand over a note to someone else that does exactly the same thing.

2) The amount of paper, (trees) and ink that would be saved is incredible.

3) In England alone they estimate that there are several million pounds worth of pennies sitting on the floor - discarded or dropped.

4) It saves pissing around looking for correct change.

Oh there are more advantages than these.

You forgot that a chip imbedded into the skull on the forehead or imbedded in the hand is something that is very hard to steal. Not like credit cards today.

This cashless system is so superior to the wasteful and expensive to run cash system that it is inevitable that the powers that be will step by step move people into the cashless system which is the digital infrastructure ready for the final touch. And that is the implantable Mark of the beast.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Medicine*Woman]

Oh there are more advantages than these.

You forgot that a chip imbedded into the skull on the forehead or imbedded in the hand is something that is very hard to steal. Not like credit cards today.

This cashless system is so superior to the wasteful and expensive to run cash system that it is inevitable that the powers that be will step by step move people into the cashless system which is the digital infrastructure ready for the final touch. And that is the implantable Mark of the beast.
*************
M*W: Just so we will be sure not to worship this Beast you speak of, could you please post an image of said Beast?

[SnakeLord]

This time i will bold and underline what i said, before i said, receive the mark of the beast.


Yeah, I got that.

Which means that anyone going into a cashless system - which will invariably be everyone, will receive the 'mark of the beast', (an implant). The whole thing to me seems daft. Can't this beast just possess people, (as it has apparently always done), or get them to worship it in an easier manner than waiting until society becomes cashless?

So one will either agree to worship the image and Get the Mark.

There's the thing though, nobody is worshipping anything, they would simply be making life easier. It's just groceries ffs, calm down.


Now you might say, "hey i am an athiest i don't believe in gods and stuff so i will never worship anything"

Hey, I'm an atheist - I don't worship fictional beings.

But i say to you that the forces of the anti-christ will have the power to preform great signs and wonders

OOOoooooh... Out of interest I can only wonder where it got that power from.

All the atheists who keep on demanding undeniable miracles will get them one day and they will believe that Jesus has returned.

Why jesus? Why not gilgamesh?

There will be no atheists in the days of the Anti-christ.

And the world shall then descend into utter stupidity.

Because that is the goal of satan. To be accepted as the returned Messiah and to be worshipped as God on earth.

You know, out of all the beings that seem self centered, this satan guy has got nothing on god.

Still, whatever drivelling horseshit you believe is fine I guess. Just after satan takes over the universe, mary the fairy will throw a party with cupcakes and balloons and everyone is invited including santa claus, the tooth fairy and the little mermaid. Fuck I'm too tired to listen to idiocy come out of the mouths of apparent grown ups. Grow up.

[Oli]

This cashless system is so superior to the wasteful and expensive to run cash system that it is inevitable that the powers that be will step by step move people into the cashless system which is the digital infrastructure ready for the final touch. And that is the implantable Mark of the beast.
According to whom?
Can you prove (or even demonstrate) that this implant (which has not even been mooted so far here) actually IS the "mark of the beast"?

[Repo Man]

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/9655/childbeliefswv0.gif

[John99]

Is your problem that you feel people lied to you about them? don't hold a grudge. Did you really ever think Casper was real?

[Repo Man]

There is as much evidence of the existence of Casper as there is for the god of Christianity.

[logicpolice]

I think that the original point I was trying to make is that it is real easy to see from where we are sitting now that a cashless society and a one world governing system are both things that are very likely to come to pass. And while those ancient manuscripts do seem to fore- tell those very things, jumping on the bandwagon of religious hocus-pocus probably isn’t warranted.

If they do harbor any validity in foretelling the future it would most likely be in the form of simple pattern recognition. So leaving out the hocus-pocus of antichrists and the chopping off of heads for a moment, lets assume that the natural flow of a developing planet with sentient life does usually lead to a one world cashless society.

If the system that gets us there, in this case the “every man for himself capitalistic system” is in the end going to fail, what would be the next logical step for human kind?
And an even more pertinent question may be how and who already knows this pattern?
I don’t think God is the right answer.

http://home.earthlink.net/~hurfordlh1/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/sig.jpg

[Adstar]

*************
M*W: Just so we will be sure not to worship this Beast you speak of, could you please post an image of said Beast?


No come on MW you know that i do not know who the beast is. I have my favourites but that is speculation untill the beast reveals Himself by his acts.

I will give you my two current faviourites.

http://www.indybay.org/uploads/2003/02/09/charles_01.jpg

Prince Charles



http://www.zimbio.com/img/8a20/MemberAction/2293c.jpg/1181533163

Javier Solana



But once again i do not KNOW who the beast is or even if he has been born yet.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

Yeah, I got that.

Which means that anyone going into a cashless system - which will invariably be everyone, will receive the 'mark of the beast', (an implant). The whole thing to me seems daft. Can't this beast just possess people, (as it has apparently always done), or get them to worship it in an easier manner than waiting until society becomes cashless?

No some people will refuse to worship the image of the beast and also refuse the Mark of the beast. They will either be in hiding or they will be beheaded.

And for many the world is already cashless. It is possible in some parts of the world to live without touching cash at all. The system is already in place all that is needed is the dropping of the old system and the finishing touches to the new system namely the Mark of The Beast.



Hey, I'm an atheist - I don't worship fictional beings.

This being will not be fictional at all. He will be alive and do wonders before your very eyes.



OOOoooooh... Out of interest I can only wonder where it got that power from.

Power granted by God.



Why jesus? Why not gilgamesh?

Because satan wants to deceive the people who believe in the God of Abraham and the Messiah. People who believe in other religions are already deceived so he does not have to work on them.



And the world shall then descend into utter stupidity.

The world has been in that state for a long time.



Still, whatever drivelling horseshit you believe is fine I guess. Just after satan takes over the universe, mary the fairy will throw a party with cupcakes and balloons and everyone is invited including santa claus, the tooth fairy and the little mermaid. Fuck I'm too tired to listen to idiocy come out of the mouths of apparent grown ups. Grow up.

Yeah yeah yeah. But you do listen don't you. Your obsessed with this stuff arn't you. Your little tantrum does not hide your real motives.

LOL I am grown up. :) Believe what you wish to believe, accept what you wish to accept, reject what you wish to reject.

But remember all decisions have consequences.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Medicine*Woman]

No come on MW you know that i do not know who the beast is. I have my favourites but that is speculation untill the beast reveals Himself by his acts.

I will give you my two current faviourites.

http://www.indybay.org/uploads/2003/02/09/charles_01.jpg

Prince Charles

http://www.zimbio.com/img/8a20/MemberAction/2293c.jpg/1181533163

Javier Solana

But once again i do not KNOW who the beast is or even if he has been born yet.
*************
M*W: Oh, come on now, Adstar. Prince Charlie is a beast of another kind. In fact, he married a beast, but he's no real threat to anyone beside his Momarchy (new word, just created another name for QEII-but not the ship).

Solana is just a phonyvangelist (new word, just created it to categorize all evangelists)and probably a rich one at that, since a lot of poor idiots worship him.

BTW, according to some bookvangelists (new word, just created it for evangelists who write), wasn't the antichrist supposed to have been born in the 1960s? That would put him in his 40s and in his prime.

My guess is the antichrist as we will know him is Osama bin Laden.

[SnakeLord]

And for many the world is already cashless. It is possible in some parts of the world to live without touching cash at all. The system is already in place all that is needed is the dropping of the old system and the finishing touches to the new system namely the Mark of The Beast.

I am asking you how having a cashless system in any way reflects beasts, or any implants reflect beasts or demons or invisible crocodiles.

He will be alive and do wonders before your very eyes.

What's he gonna do, conjure up an intelligent theist?

Anyway, yes.. I'm crapping my pants.

Power granted by God.

Who's the bastard in this story?

Because satan wants to deceive the people who believe in the God of Abraham and the Messiah.

And a cashless system helps him accomplish this... how? Can't he just deceive people? If he was apparently doing just that several thousand years ago, couldn't he have just done it to everyone and got it over with?

People who believe in other religions are already deceived so he does not have to work on them.

Hey dude, that's between you and them. They'll say the same about you, you'lll say it about them and I'll just sit by noting what a pair of idiots you are.

The world has been in that state for a long time.

Since the dawn of religion.

But you do listen don't you. Your obsessed with this stuff arn't you. Your little tantrum does not hide your real motives.

Obsessed with what stuff?

But remember all decisions have consequences.

ZzZzZzZz...

[Adstar]

*************
M*W: Oh, come on now, Adstar. Prince Charlie is a beast of another kind. In fact, he married a beast, but he's no real threat to anyone beside his Momarchy (new word, just created another name for QEII-but not the ship)

Charles image has been a usefull cover for him. But he has far more influence behind the scenes that you realise.

Solana is just a phonyvangelist (new word, just created it to categorize all evangelists)and probably a rich one at that, since a lot of poor idiots worship him.

Do you know who Solana is?

He is not an evangelist he is the EEC's Top Forign relations represantative. He is the guy who is expanding the EEC's influance to the east and to the south and towards the Holy Land.



BTW, according to some bookvangelists (new word, just created it for evangelists who write), wasn't the antichrist supposed to have been born in the 1960s? That would put him in his 40s and in his prime.

I never heard of such theories. I have heard a theory that the Anti-Christ would come when the Jews returned to Israel. The modern state of Israel was declared on May 14, 1948. The same year that prince Charles was born. lol

My guess is the antichrist as we will know him is Osama bin Laden.

No. Osama is not the anti-christ for the same reason George bush is not the anti-christ. Both men are hated by too many people, they are both focal points of division and conflict, not unity and coexistence. The true Anti-christ will be a person who will work to bring the world together. The true Anti-christ will be respected and will come to be loved by the vast majority of the worlds population.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

I am asking you how having a cashless system in any way reflects beasts, or any implants reflect beasts or demons or invisible crocodiles.

Now i have answered your question but your not satisfied with the answer. You can ask the same question 10 times but your still going to get the same answer.



And a cashless system helps him accomplish this... how?

Who said the cashless system will help him accomplish this? The cashless system with the mark of the beast is a marker. A sign for us.



Can't he just deceive people? If he was apparently doing just that several thousand years ago, couldn't he have just done it to everyone and got it over with?

He has got most of the world deceived already and it's been that way for quite some time. But he is a perfectionist and most is not good enough for him. He wants everyone. But he will not get everyone but that does not stop him doing his best.



Hey dude, that's between you and them. They'll say the same about you, you'lll say it about them and I'll just sit by noting what a pair of idiots you are.

Are you that scared? Is that why you are reacting like this?



Obsessed with what stuff?



ZzZzZzZz...

LOL your in denial buddy. Your emotional response reveals more than your words seek to cover.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[SnakeLord]

The cashless system with the mark of the beast is a marker. A sign for us.

I see. A sign for you to do what exactly?

He has got most of the world deceived already

If only a being existed that could stop him deceiving mankind.. lol.

Are you that scared? Is that why you are reacting like this?

C'mon, I can't honestly believe you are that naive.

LOL your in denial buddy. Your emotional response reveals more than your words seek to cover.

Same as above.

[Medicine*Woman]

Charles image has been a usefull cover for him. But he has far more influence behind the scenes that you realise.
*************
M*W: Naw, I just can't see it. He's such a wimp and will never be king, thanks to his sexual addictions. He's weak. He'll never be strong or any authority figure. He's the black sheep of the royals (there were many). His sons are decent lads. I adored their mother. I think the momarchy had her murdered. But, then, I'm just a commoner, although my grandfather's uncle was PM William Ewart Gladstone during Queen Victoria. He was actually suspected to be a Jack the Ripper, but apparently had an alibi. Interestingly, the medical case those Jacks used was called a "Gladstone bag!"

Do you know who Solana is?
*************
M*W: No, I think not. I thought I heard about him on TV calling himself Jesus Christo or something. Maybe that was some other televangelist. I believe he may have been right here in Texas.

He is not an evangelist he is the EEC's Top Forign relations represantative. He is the guy who is expanding the EEC's influance to the east and to the south and towards the Holy Land.
*************
M*W: But is that really a bad thing? I don't think the antichrist was supposed to be Hispanic. I'm sure I've read christian material that said their antichrist would be born in Israel or Mideast.

I never heard of such theories. I have heard a theory that the Anti-Christ would come when the Jews returned to Israel. The modern state of Israel was declared on May 14, 1948. The same year that prince Charles was born. lol
*************
M*W: Prince Charles has more German Nazi Aryan blood than Semite blood. He may be a bumbling idiot, but he's no antichrist.

No. Osama is not the anti-christ for the same reason George bush is not the anti-christ. Both men are hated by too many people, they are both focal points of division and conflict, not unity and coexistence. The true Anti-christ will be a person who will work to bring the world together. The true Anti-christ will be respected and will come to be loved by the vast majority of the worlds population.
*************
M*W: Well, I guess that let's both Bush and Osama off the hook. But Prince Charles isn't doing anything for world peace. Princess Di did more of that! Look what they did to her! I bet they thought Dodi was the antichrist. Yeah, that's the ticket!

I'm not anti-Semitic, but I think the USA's connection to Israel might not be a good thing, politically speaking. I know why we support them, it's because of the Jewish vote in America. Not that that's a bad thing. I wish everyone would vote. I just don't agree with political affiliation, even if it is a necessary evil.

Can you recommend anything to read that might implicate Charles as the antichrist? I really don't have to worry, because I'm not waiting for an antichrist, since I profess to be one myself. You know.

[SnakeLord]

I have heard a theory that the Anti-Christ would come when the Jews returned to Israel. The modern state of Israel was declared on May 14, 1948. The same year that prince Charles was born. lol

And that's certainly just cause to accuse Prince Charles. I mean c'mon, we all know nobody else was born in 1948. :bugeye:

[Medicine*Woman]

And that's certainly just cause to accuse Prince Charles. I mean c'mon, we all know nobody else was born in 1948. :bugeye:
*************
M*W: My gawd, that was even before my time! Does that mean that I'm really, really not the antichrist after all? Rats!

[Adstar]

*************
M*W: But is that really a bad thing? I don't think the antichrist was supposed to be Hispanic. I'm sure I've read christian material that said their antichrist would be born in Israel or Mideast.

The anti-christ known as the little horn will rise up amongst 10 kings/Kingdoms and subdue 3 of them and use those the power of those kingdoms. Solana comes from Spain a nation that is a part of the central military organization that is exclusive to the EEC it is called the WEU and it has 10 members. These members include:

Belgium
France
Luxembourg
Netherlands
United Kingdom
Germany
Italy
Portugal
Spain
Greece

You may say that NATO is the prime military organisation. That would change very quickly with the destruction of the USA. It is also interesting to note that Prince charles is the sole remaining ligitimate claimant to the thrones of England France and Germany. 3 of the nations. The big 3 in fact.


*************
M*W: Prince Charles has more German Nazi Aryan blood than Semite blood. He may be a bumbling idiot, but he's no antichrist.

Prince Charles and the English royal family claim to be decendants of king David and therefore he has a claim t0 the throne of David. Think this is a joke? Nope here is the detailed family history that the english royal family lays claim too.

JUDAH begat Phares,

Phares begat Esrom,

Esrom begat Aram,

Aram begat Aminadab,

Aminadab begat Nashon,

Nashon begat Salmon,

Salmon begat Boaz,

Boaz begat Obed,

Obed begat Jesse,

Jesse begat DAVID,

DAVID begat SOLOMON,

SOLOMON begat Rehoboam,

Rehboam begat Abijah,

Abijah begat Asa,

Asa begat Jehosaphat,

Jehosaphat begat Jehoram,

Jehoram begat Ahaziah,

Ahaziah begat Joash,

Joash begat Amaziah,

Amaziah begat Uzziah,

Uzziah begat Jotham,

Jotham begat Ahaz,

Ahaz begat Hezekiah,

Hezekiah begat Manasseh,

Manasseh begat Amon,

Amon begat Josiah,

Josiah begat ZEDEKIAH, (Blinded & Captive in Babylon, who was released)

ZEDEKIAH begat TEA TEPHI, (Ancestor of Irish & Scottish Kings)

TEA TEPHI begat Ugaine the Great,

Ugaine the Great begat Argus the Prolific,

Argus the Prolific begat Ferchard,

Ferchard begat Fergus I,

Fergus I begat Maine,

Maine begat Dornadil,

Dornadil begat Reuther,

Reuther begat Eders,

Eders begat Conaire the Great,

Conaire the Great begat Corbred I,

Corbred I begat Corbred II,

Corbred II begat Modha Lamha,

Modha Lamha begat Saraid Conaire II,

Saraid Conaire II begat Corbred Dalriada,

Corbred Dalraida begat Eochaidh,

Eochaidh begat Athirco,

Athirco begat Findachar,

Findachar begat Thrinklind,

Thrinklind begat Fincormach,

Fincormach begat Romaich,

Romaich begat Angus,

Angua begat Eochaidh,

Eochaidh begat Erch,

Erch begat Fergus the Great,

Fergus the Great begat Dongard,

Dongard begat Govran,

Govran begat Aydan,

Aydan begat Eugene,

Eugene begat Donald,

Donald begat Ethach,

Ethach begat Ethdre,

Ethdre begat Ethafind,

Ethafind begat Ethas,

Ethas begat Alpin,

Alpin begat Kenneth,

Kenneth begat Constantine,

Constantine begat Donald IV,

Donald IV begat Malcolm,

Malcolm begat Kenneth II,

Kenneth II begat Malcolm II,

Malcolm II begat Beatrix,

Beatrix begat Duncan,

Duncan begat Malcolm,

Malcolm begat David,

David begat Henry,

Henry begat David,

David begat Isobel,

Isobel begat Robert,

Robert begat Robert,

Robert begat Robert the Bruce,

Robert the Bruce begat Marjory,

Marjory begat Robert II,

Robert II begat Robert III,

Robert III begat James I,

James I begat James II,

James II begat James III,

James III begat James IV,

James IV begat James V,

James V begat Mary Queen of Scotts,

Mary Queen of Scotts begat James VI,

James VI begat Elizabeth,

Elizabeth begat Sophia,

Sophia begat George I,

George I begat George II,

George II begat Fredrick Prince of Wales,

Fredrick Prince of Wales begat George III,

George III begat Queen Victoria,

Queen Victoria begat King Edward VII,

King Edward VII begat King George V,

King George V begat King George VI,

King George VI begat Queen Elizabeth II,

Queen Elizabeth II begat Prince Charles of Wales


*************
M*W: Well, I guess that let's both Bush and Osama off the hook. But Prince Charles isn't doing anything for world peace. .

Of course he is doing things for world peace. He is one of the prime movers in the dialogue for the bringing together of world cultures and understanding between world faiths.

I'm not anti-Semitic, but I think the USA's connection to Israel might not be a good thing, politically speaking. I know why we support them, it's because of the Jewish vote in America. Not that that's a bad thing. I wish everyone would vote. I just don't agree with political affiliation, even if it is a necessary evil.

No it is not because of the Jewish vote nor Jewish money. The USA is being used by the secret societies that run it to be the body guard of the deception that is modern Israel. Modern Israel has been set up as the final concentration camp for the Jewish people. satan must be seen as a friend of the jews a protector of the Jews to gain the trust of the Jews to put forward his false messiah for the Jews to bow down too. The USA is a Masonic run nation in service of satan playing its part in the biggest deception upon the descendants of Abraham ever carried out.
Oh and guess who is the leader of world masonry is? Prince Charles and 24 knights make up the Order of the Garter, which is head over Freemasonry

Can you recommend anything to read that might implicate Charles as the antichrist? I really don't have to worry, because I'm not waiting for an antichrist, since I profess to be one myself. You know.

Your estimation of yourself is far too high MW. An interesting book to read is "the antichrist and a cup of tea" by Tim Cohen.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

I see. A sign for you to do what exactly?



What? It is one of the signs that acts as a indicator that the Messiah's return is near. For me it will not change a thing i will continue to do what i am doing as long as i am alive.

What is it you think it would cause us to do?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Medicine*Woman]

The anti-christ known as the little horn will rise up amongst 10 kings/Kingdoms and subdue 3 of them and use those the power of those kingdoms. Solana comes from Spain a nation that is a part of the central military organization that is exclusive to the EEC it is called the WEU and it has 10 members. These members include:

Belgium
France
Luxembourg
Netherlands
United Kingdom
Germany
Italy
Portugal
Spain
Greece

You may say that NATO is the prime military organisation. That would change very quickly with the destruction of the USA. It is also interesting to note that Prince charles is the sole remaining ligitimate claimant to the thrones of England France and Germany. 3 of the nations. The big 3 in fact.

*************
M*W: Prince Charles has more German Nazi Aryan blood than Semite blood. He may be a bumbling idiot, but he's no antichrist.

Prince Charles and the English royal family claim to be decendants of king David and therefore he has a claim t0 the throne of David. Think this is a joke? Nope here is the detailed family history that the english royal family lays claim too.

JUDAH begat Phares,

Phares begat Esrom,

Esrom begat Aram,

Aram begat Aminadab,

Aminadab begat Nashon,

Nashon begat Salmon,

Salmon begat Boaz,

Boaz begat Obed,

Obed begat Jesse,

Jesse begat DAVID,

DAVID begat SOLOMON,

SOLOMON begat Rehoboam,

Rehboam begat Abijah,

Abijah begat Asa,

Asa begat Jehosaphat,

Jehosaphat begat Jehoram,

Jehoram begat Ahaziah,

Ahaziah begat Joash,

Joash begat Amaziah,

Amaziah begat Uzziah,

Uzziah begat Jotham,

Jotham begat Ahaz,

Ahaz begat Hezekiah,

Hezekiah begat Manasseh,

Manasseh begat Amon,

Amon begat Josiah,

Josiah begat ZEDEKIAH, (Blinded & Captive in Babylon, who was released)

ZEDEKIAH begat TEA TEPHI, (Ancestor of Irish & Scottish Kings)

TEA TEPHI begat Ugaine the Great,

Ugaine the Great begat Argus the Prolific,

Argus the Prolific begat Ferchard,

Ferchard begat Fergus I,

Fergus I begat Maine,

Maine begat Dornadil,

Dornadil begat Reuther,

Reuther begat Eders,

Eders begat Conaire the Great,

Conaire the Great begat Corbred I,

Corbred I begat Corbred II,

Corbred II begat Modha Lamha,

Modha Lamha begat Saraid Conaire II,

Saraid Conaire II begat Corbred Dalriada,

Corbred Dalraida begat Eochaidh,

Eochaidh begat Athirco,

Athirco begat Findachar,

Findachar begat Thrinklind,

Thrinklind begat Fincormach,

Fincormach begat Romaich,

Romaich begat Angus,

Angua begat Eochaidh,

Eochaidh begat Erch,

Erch begat Fergus the Great,

Fergus the Great begat Dongard,

Dongard begat Govran,

Govran begat Aydan,

Aydan begat Eugene,

Eugene begat Donald,

Donald begat Ethach,

Ethach begat Ethdre,

Ethdre begat Ethafind,

Ethafind begat Ethas,

Ethas begat Alpin,

Alpin begat Kenneth,

Kenneth begat Constantine,

Constantine begat Donald IV,

Donald IV begat Malcolm,

Malcolm begat Kenneth II,

Kenneth II begat Malcolm II,

Malcolm II begat Beatrix,

Beatrix begat Duncan,

Duncan begat Malcolm,

Malcolm begat David,

David begat Henry,

Henry begat David,

David begat Isobel,

Isobel begat Robert,

Robert begat Robert,

Robert begat Robert the Bruce,

Robert the Bruce begat Marjory,

Marjory begat Robert II,

Robert II begat Robert III,

Robert III begat James I,

James I begat James II,

James II begat James III,

James III begat James IV,

James IV begat James V,

James V begat Mary Queen of Scotts,

Mary Queen of Scotts begat James VI,

James VI begat Elizabeth,

Elizabeth begat Sophia,

Sophia begat George I,

George I begat George II,

George II begat Fredrick Prince of Wales,

Fredrick Prince of Wales begat George III,

George III begat Queen Victoria,

Queen Victoria begat King Edward VII,

King Edward VII begat King George V,

King George V begat King George VI,

King George VI begat Queen Elizabeth II,

Queen Elizabeth II begat Prince Charles of Wales

Of course he is doing things for world peace. He is one of the prime movers in the dialogue for the bringing together of world cultures and understanding between world faiths.

No it is not because of the Jewish vote nor Jewish money. The USA is being used by the secret societies that run it to be the body guard of the deception that is modern Israel. Modern Israel has been set up as the final concentration camp for the Jewish people. satan must be seen as a friend of the jews a protector of the Jews to gain the trust of the Jews to put forward his false messiah for the Jews to bow down too. The USA is a Masonic run nation in service of satan playing its part in the biggest deception upon the descendants of Abraham ever carried out. Oh and guess who is the leader of world masonry is? Prince Charles and 24 knights make up the Order of the Garter, which is head over Freemasonry

Your estimation of yourself is far too high MW. An interesting book to read is "the antichrist and a cup of tea" by Tim Cohen.

*************
M*W: I don't agree with the royal genealogy you listed. I believe Elizabeth I was begat by Henry VIII and Anne Boleyn. Elizabeth I never married nor had children. They called her the "Virgin Queen," but she had many lovers but never any children.

Aminadab was also the birth name his mother gave Moses. He was renamed Moses after being pulled out of the river Nile by pharaoh's daughter. These people have many names and titles. The royals can say all they want to, but this list has been around a lot longer than the biblical scholars and archeologists who have confirmed the errors of the list.

Why do you believe I think too highly of myself? That was an odd thing to say. I was born a commoner, just like you, and I don't have much hope for being knighted or whatever it is they do to title women. However, I am the Queen of my own Universe, if that makes any difference, and I have 11 subjects who worship the ground I walk on, and another one is on the way. So I'm cool.

[SnakeLord]

What is it you think it would cause us to do?

I dunno... change the face on the banknotes? Oh wait, can't - there wont be any. Poor old jesus. :D

Btw, what does "return is near" mean? "soon" is apparently thousands of years, so what timeframe are we looking at with near?

[Adstar]

I dunno... change the face on the banknotes? Oh wait, can't - there wont be any. Poor old jesus. :D

lol Jesus was never big on money in any case. I just don't understand your thinking on this issue? Do you?

Btw, what does "return is near" mean? "soon" is apparently thousands of years, so what timeframe are we looking at with near?

Oh a good point. Something i can reply to. :)

I personally think that The Messiah Jesus will return within the next 30 years. But like my speculation on the candidates for the anti-christ i do not know when Jesus will return.

Point that lead me to think Jesus return is soon.

* Technology: The technology has become available to fulfil the prophecies relating to the end times. The Mark of the beast and instantaneous international communications are both technologies that have been achieved.

*Politcs: The globalisation of the World economy leading to the pressure from the elites for international unity leading to the need for an international philosophy for unity that suppresses anything that is a cause for disunity. The suppression of beliefs that are not modified to make them acceptable to the entire world will increase leading to the persecution of religion. This push is also causing an opposite reaction especially from the islamic world who interpret this movement as an assault upon islam and will resist it with great violence. Of cause true Christians will likewise resist to the death calls to modify their beliefs. But we differ from muslims in that we are not called upon to bring terror to unbeliever until all the world submits to the will of Jesus.

*Signs in the heavens: It will soon be the 2000 anniversary of the execution of the Messiah Jesus a pivotal moment in history. This will happen around the late 2020's and into the mid 2030's the exact date of the execution of the Messiah Jesus is still a hotly debated topic amongst believers. But the dates that i have mentioned covers most speculations as to this date. This also coincided with the arrival of meteor Apophis that will arrive in the year 2028 and will again arrive in the year 2036 ( from memory i believe that is the year of its second coming) Anyway initial reports that apophis would impact earth in 2028 are now hotly disputed by the authorities but as far as i know they are still very worried about its second visit in 2036. From the book of revelations i believe that a meteor impact will cause most of the great destruction that will befall planet earth just before the second coming of the Messiah Jesus. Aphophis (which is oddly named after an Egyptian god of darkness and destruction) fits into this very neatly. So from what i have said Jesus will return either sometime soon after 2028 or sometime soon after 2036. I will have to check again as to the correct date of Apophis second coming.

That’s just a few points. There are others. This is my favourite topic it is amazing to see the world heading in the direction just as it has been prophesised to head.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

PS: Correction The first arrival of Apophis is on Friday April 13, 2029. So that would leave 7 years between the first and the second visit of the meteor. 7 is a very biblical number don't you think. Also its arival of Friday the 13th is also intertesting isn't it LOL

[UncleChrist]

Thank you for your interest in Zeitgeist. http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/
Zeitgeist was created as a not for profit expression to inspire people to start looking at the world
from a more critical perspective and to understand that very often things are not what the
population at large think they are. The information in Zeitgeist was established over a year long period
of research and the current Source page on this site http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/statement.htm
lists the sources used / referenced.
Soon, an interactive transcript will be online with detailed footnotes and links.

It's important to point out that there is a tendency to simply disbelieve things that are
counter to our understanding, without the necessary research performed.
For example, some information contained in Part 1 and Part 3, specifically, is not obtained
by simple keyword searches on the Internet. You have to dig deeper. For instance,
very often people who look up "Horus" or "The Federal Reserve" on the Internet
draw their conclusions from very general or biased sources. Online encyclopedias or text book
Encyclopedias often do not contain the information contained in Zeitgeist. However, if one takes
the time to read the sources provided, they will find that what is being presented is
based on documented evidence. Any corrections, clarifications & further points regarding the film
are found on the Clarifications page. Downloadable formats are also now available, along with DVDs
by request.http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/dvdorder.htm

That being said, It is my hope that people will not take what is said
in the film as the truth, but find out for themselves, for truth is not told, it is realized.

[mybreathyourlung]

Here you go.

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

I had to pause it at 6 and 1/2 minutes because I'm at work but it is pretty intense so far.

*runs and grabs popcorn and awaits Christians/theists to post their various apologies/explanations*

Before watching this movie I understood that there wasn't much of a case for the existence of Jesus Christ, but I continued to believe anyway as I had yet to see a convincing argument against it. But after watching, I now have a solid doubt.

The movie seemed too conspiracy theory-ish/crazy, so I have to do some of my own investigating as obviously, until then, I won't take this movie as 100%truth, and see what the other viewpoints are, but at this point I'm pretty much in agreement as the coinscidences are pretty neat, but I can't cross Jesus off yet (no pun intended!)

[SnakeLord]

You know, I don't see how anyone could want to or be expected to worship or love a being that intends to destroy the universe.

I remember the old Superman comics etc - meteorite heading to earth, Superman flies into space and knocks it off course, mankind saved. It's a noble story and one that I could be expected to appreciate. On the other hand we have jesus.. A dude that intends to let the meteorite crash land and kill most people, (indeed he pushed the meteorite in this direction), and then declare himself the man in charge.

I guess we just have a different notion of what constitutes a cool fictional hero.

I personally think that The Messiah Jesus will return within the next 30 years.

So, I should advise my children not to have children of their own?

[UncleChrist]

Please allow me to introduce myself
I’m a man of wealth and taste
I’ve been around for a long, long year
Stole many a man’s soul and faith
And I was round when jesus christ
Had his moment of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that pilate
Washed his hands and sealed his fate
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name
But what’s puzzling you
Is the nature of my game
I stuck around st. petersburg
When I saw it was a time for a change
Killed the czar and his ministers
Anastasia screamed in vain
I rode a tank
Held a general’s rank
When the blitzkrieg raged
And the bodies stank
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
Ah, whats puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah
I watched with glee
While your kings and queens
Fought for ten decades
For the gods they made
I shouted out,
Who killed the kennedys?
When after all
It was you and me
Let me please introduce myself
I’m a man of wealth and taste
And I laid traps for troubadours
Who get killed before they reached bombay
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what’s puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah, get down, baby
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what’s confusing you
Is just the nature of my game
Just as every cop is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me lucifer
cause I’m in need of some restraint
So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy, and some taste
Use all your well-learned politesse
Or I’ll lay your soul to waste, um yeah
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, um yeah :bugeye:

[UncleChrist]

A glimmer of hope after all

I just watched a show on the history channel
about the Mayan calender......

The most accurate calender in human history ....
it ends on Dec 21st 2012.............
of course many sheeple fear the worse ..:eek:

The maya believed that this was just the end of a long cycle

They said their study showed that the maya believed this to be

"" The end of the time of the word of God ""

hallaluya

Im keeping my fingers crossed :D



http://www.levity.com/eschaton/Why2012.html

[John99]

A glimmer of hope after all

I just watched a show on the history channel
about the Mayan calender......

The most accurate calender in human history ....
it ends on Dec 21st 2012.............
of course many sheeple fear the worse ..

The maya believed that this was just the end of a long cycle

They said their study showed that the maya believed this to be

"" The end of the time of the word of God ""

hallaluya

Im keeping my fingers crossed :D



http://www.levity.com/eschaton/Why2012.html

:scratchin:...and uh, where are the Mayans NOW?:D

[UncleChrist]

...and uh, where are the Mayans NOW?

Well Duh.....

Of course they're all in the boiling bowels of hell
being poked and prodded for all of eternity

All created and approved of by yours truely

The great sky fairy
:cool:

[John99]

Well Duh.....

Of course they're all in the boiling bowels of hell
being poked and prodded for all of eternity

All created and approved of by yours truely

The great sky fairy
:cool:

it would be best to put your faith in civilizations that have actually survived don't you think?

Well whatever happened i guess they should not have said this:

They said their study showed that the maya believed this to be

"" The end of the time of the word of God ""

hallaluya

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_civilization

The Maya "collapse"

Main article: Maya collapse

For reasons that are still debated, the Maya centers of the southern lowlands went into decline during the 8th and 9th centuries and were abandoned shortly thereafter. This decline was coupled with a cessation of monumental inscriptions and large-scale architectural construction.[8] Although there is no universally accepted theory to explain this “collapse,” current theories fall into two categories: non-ecological and ecological.

Non-ecological theories of Maya decline are divided into several subcategories, such as foreign invasion, peasant revolt, and the collapse of key trade routes. Ecological hypotheses include environmental disaster, epidemic disease, and climate change.

:shrug:

[mattgeist]

this film is outstanding.
and i just want to thank Uncle christ for making it available here.
i watched it "for the first time" late at night and ended up laying awake for the rest of the night un-able to sleep..
i wish they would air it on P.B.S. or something so that it could be seen
by more people...but i'm sure there are forces at work,that will not let that happen......
i for one believe it.
we all have been, and are being played.
and the sooner enough of us realize it.
the sooner we can do something to change it......

thanks again Unclechrist...
sincerely..
george bush...lol...jk..
i will be passing this film along..
mattgeist.

[John99]

Here is what it says about Horace:

@ TC= 13:51



3000BC

From hieroglyphics we know.

Broadly speaking the story of Horace is as follows-

Born on Dec. 25th
Born of a virgin
Star in the East
Adorned by 3 kings
Teacher at 12
Baptised/Ministry at 30
12 disciples
performed miracles
Dead for 3 days
Resurrected




Does anyone know specifically where this information comes from. If only from hieroglyphics are there any links?

Horace .vs Set :D, that's funny.

How about Attis? 1200BC, same as above. Where does this information come from?

@ TC 18:25 i feel as though my intelligence is being mainpulated, at this point i am being transformed into childlike state. The EVIL darkness....woooo

[John99]

If proof is not given (post #86) in a timely manner then this thread should be locked for being obsolete.

[SkinWalker]

Curious to know what Skinwalker thinks of this.

Edit: Oh hell, they started out interesting with the religious stuff, but then it went straight into the crapper Loose Change style.

I agree with you about the conspiracy nutter angle. Even the religious part in the beginning was based on misinformation. Many of the things that were mentioned about Mithras, Horus, and Dionysus are repeated on many sites around the internet, but I've yet to see the citations to primary research that reveals the actual texts that demonstrate each of the specific things mentioned.

Some of the information regarding these earlier gods is accurate, but some of it seems to be simply filled in by anti-Christian apologists that seek to present hard arguments to the Christian claim that Jesus is an original character.

Its a pity because there's enough real data that exists to do this without having to repeat unsupported claims. I'll have to dig a little to find the actual criticisms of the Horus/Mythras/Dionysus comparisons which show some of the similarities to be unfounded.

[UncleChrist]

Is believing this film reveals any valid information really that out of the question
considering everything that is going on around us all right now :bugeye:

please watch this clip
http://onedollardvdproject.com/DVD/Home.html


just incase you haven't checked this out

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/sources.htm

It's important to point out that there is a tendency to simply disbelieve things that are
counter to our understanding, without the necessary research performed.
For example, some information contained in Part 1 and Part 3, specifically, is not obtained
by simple keyword searches on the Internet. You have to dig deeper. For instance,
very often people who look up "Horus" or "The Federal Reserve" on the Internet
draw their conclusions from very general or biased sources. Online encyclopedias or text book
Encyclopedias often do not contain the information contained in Zeitgeist. However, if one takes
the time to read the sources provided, they will find that what is being presented is
based on documented evidence.

That being said, It is my hope that people will not take what is said
in the film as the truth, but find out for themselves, for truth is not told, it is realized.

[mattgeist]

this is a well documented case of the government using less than honest tactics to manipule our way of seeing things...they do it because they know that it works..i would like to add that this practice is a verry old one and the U.S government is not its inventor by any stretch...any way..
it is curiouse to me that a huge portion of the population can allow themselves to believe in things they have never seen ,ie.jesus,angels,gods,heaven,.hell,these things millions find no difficulty in believing,but they some how can't see or won't see things that are going on right in front of their eyes....does no one else find this somewhat disturbing?

"There was the sinking of the Lusitania, which America blamed on Germany and used as justification for entering WWI. There was the alleged sinking of the U.S. naval ship in the Bay of Tomkin, an incident which is now proven never to have occurred, but was announced by Lyndon Johnson nonetheless, as it provided America with justification to go to war in Vietnam. In addition, there is the Northwoods Memorandum a top-secret document, which I have managed to acquire as a result of access of information laws. This document, issued by the Joint Chiefs of Staff, recommended the shooting down of a mockup of a passenger airliner in order to justify America going to war on Cuba. Thankfully, the strategy was never implemented. The strategy of attacking your own civilian targets to justify a reprisal against any imagined enemy is an ancient technique practiced at least since Roman times and may have been implemented once again on September 11th."
every thing mentioned in the above quote can be easily researched.and is proven to be true...for me, it is enough to know that our government does not seem shy when it comes to manipulation.
it is simple..when they have decided that they want to accomplish something,and they perceive that we won't want to do it..then work begins on ways to sway our opinions....thank you
mattgeist

[SkinWalker]

Is believing this film reveals any valid information really that out of the question considering everything that is going on around us all right now

It does reveal valid information. But it also creates disinformation as well. The 9/11 nonsense has been thoroughly refuted. There is no need to introduce "explosive devices" and question whether or not these planes actually existed or impacted the buildings or the Pentagon. The evidence, if nothing else, is the missing passengers, whose families are morning their loss. Moreover, the physics behind the impacts checks out. Other sources have treated this fairly well, so I'll not get into it here, but the very existence of the thoroughly debunked 9/11 conspiracy nutter nonsense in the "documentary" calls into question the veracity of the remainder.

My expertise is in ancient civilizations and belief systems, so I'll comment more on the 1st part of the movie later. I recognize some truthful elements, and I think the person(s) who produced the movie were genuine in what they perceive, but I also think they haven't done a very good job fact-checking and vetting the truth vs. fabrication. If I get the chance, I'll post on this more and list references.

just incase you haven't checked this out

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/sources.htm[/QUOTE]

The problem, of course, is that, while these are decent sources (the ones I recognize), there isn't any effort to assign a source to individual facts within the movie. Which source provides the Mithras information? Which provides the Horus? Where is the original translations of the texts on the walls and columns of Luxor? Etc.

[UncleChrist]

I can appreciate your position Skinwalker
I have my doubts aswell regarding the many different ideas

But !

thoroughly debunked 9/11 conspiracy nutter nonsense

when you say thoroughly debunked

You are not referring to the 911/commision report ...Are you ?
or that piece of crap article in popular mechanics by any chance ?

I have heard people say this has been debunked many times ......

But I have yet to see this vital information that debunks all these unanswered questions

They didn't even mention tower 7 in the 911/report
at the very least... this was an insurance scam .....
....business as usaul ......right

I have yet to see these answers
Skinwalker could you please
provide some links or references for me

thanks

;)

[SkinWalker]

I'm talking about conspiracy nutters like the proponents of Loose Change. But since this is a Religion subforum, perhaps that would be a thread best started in Pseudoscience.

[UncleChrist]

If proof is not given (post #86) in a timely manner then this thread should be locked for being obsolete.

John99

I bet your own beliefs don't even hold up to this scrutiny

[UncleChrist]

I'm talking about conspiracy nutters like the proponents of Loose Change. But since this is a Religion subforum, perhaps that would be a thread best started in Pseudoscience.

Well I think the religous part 1 is the real gem in this film

I came across another film that shares the same view
http://www.thegodmovie.com/

unfortunately they are a little to harsh on their delivery
for the people who have had a life long relationship with JC :(


SkinWalker
What part of the film are you referring to here ?
but the very existence of the thoroughly debunked 9/11 conspiracy nutter nonsense in the "documentary"

and what information lead you to this conclusion ?
the physics behind the impacts checks out. Other sources have treated this fairly well

Thanks ;)

[SkinWalker]

SkinWalker
What part of the film are you referring to here ?

The part that goes on about how there was no plane that hit the Pentagon, suggesting that the government confiscated all video footage so no one would be able to prove there wasn't, etc; the part where they go on and on about how there were "devices" planted in the building rather than airliners hitting them; etc.

I actually stopped watching and kept jumping ahead in the movie to see if there was anything else worth watching and found nothing. Near the end they were going on about the conspiracy behind RFID chips and such and the pain from my eyes rolling into the back of my head forced a mouse click to stop it.

[UncleChrist]

The part that goes on about how there was no plane that hit the Pentagon

Ya their are some far out theories out there
but still some missing facts that should have been addressed

the pain from my eyes rolling into the back of my head forced a mouse click to stop it.

LOL :D

So the old...... things are crazy wrong on all fronts obviously
but nobody seems to be accountable stance I take it ???:rolleyes:

"devices" planted in the building rather than airliners hitting them;

and you just pulled that one right out of your arss ;) good one

[John99]

John99

I bet your own beliefs don't even hold up to this scrutiny

I believe whatever i want to, remember what that was like?

I made a valid on topic post. No one responded to it, except with an insult, and now all of a sudden the whole movie is BS?

[UncleChrist]

I believe whatever i want to, remember what that was like?

Ya I remember :confused:

John99 (Quote)
it would be best to put your faith in civilizations that have actually survived

Well whatever happened i guess they should not have said this:


If proof is not given (post #86) in a timely manner then this thread should be locked for being obsolete.

:rolleyes:

[John99]

Ya I remember :confused:

John99 (Quote)


:rolleyes:

Just respond to post #86....please. As it relates to the movie. You asked for this.

[UncleChrist]

I did respond with post #89

You asked for this


I asked for what ?

[John99]

Edit: misread your post.

You didn't respond to it directly. I don't think you can, i do think it is odd to take this stuff at face value.

[shmoodevil]

Now i am going to quote myself and i want you to read it again verrry carefully. This time i will bold and underline what i said, before i said, receive the mark of the beast.



Now scripture says that all whom worship the image of the beast will receive the Mark. So i believe that receiving the Mark of the beast will be a reward for those who worship the image of the beast. I believe that it is worshiping the image of the beast that will condemn one to eternity in the lake of fire.

So one will either agree to worship the image and Get the Mark.
Or they will refuse to worship the image and get the chop.

Both options will come from ones decision about worshipping the image of the beast.

Now you might say, "hey i am an athiest i don't believe in gods and stuff so i will never worship anything" But i say to you that the forces of the anti-christ will have the power to preform great signs and wonders, Miracles that will see to it that atheists will cease to exist. All the atheists who keep on demanding undeniable miracles will get them one day and they will believe that Jesus has returned. There will be no atheists in the days of the Anti-christ. Because that is the goal of satan. To be accepted as the returned Messiah and to be worshipped as God on earth.

A great deception indeed.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
hey didnt the romans do that already?..the inqisition...lets just get rid of all who oppose us...."fear" a nother powerfull tool... Are there Biblical precedents for Inquisitions designed to root out heresy?
There certainly are:

Ex 32:1-35, This is the story of Moses and the Golden Calf incident. I will paraphrase instead of recounting this lengthy story. Moses came down from the mountain with the stone tablets (15) and found that his people had made for themselves a Golden Calf and they were worshiping it (19). They had become Heretics. Moses asked who was still loyal to the Lord and the Levites responded (26). Then Moses commanded the Levites to slay the ones who were not loyal to the Lord, and they did (27-29). This chapter is a clear message to ferret out Heretics from the midst of believers.

[shmoodevil]

After the first minute, I feel like I'm being brainwashed, lol.
only becuase u r seeing this for the first time, and in truth u have been, being brainwashed your entire life. now we all must wake, up and open our eyes to the truth.. here is also somthing to take into concideration (Occam's Razor) which is: All things being equal, the simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

[UncleChrist]

You didn't respond to it directly. I don't think you can, i do think it is odd to take this stuff at face value.


John99

I did respond directly by giving you the sources list
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/sources.htm

And a nice little spew from the movies producer
regarding most peoples lack of proper research

Do you want me to do the research for you to.....:bawl:

I am investigating it the best I can
And I just keep coming up with lemons for your team
the debunkies


Late early morning sunday night of course
when most sheeple are fast asleep
C-Span2 booktv.org had a great program on

"Michael Weinstein"s

New book
" With God On Our Side "

He is a Christian that is in quite a panic about our countries
current situation

Their is a very nice video clip of it here
http://www.booktv.org/program.aspx?ProgramId=8493&SectionName=&PlayMedia=No

Please watch .....jump ahead about 50 minutes in
and listen to what this christain is saying about our government

You might need to download RealPlayer to watch it
I downloaded it and it works great

After listening to this guy Michael Weinstein

and Seeing way to much garbage like this in my lifetime
please watch
http://www.atheistnation.net/video/?video/00118/atheist/jesus-camp/


We better start connecting the dots here people

:bugeye:

[John99]

no, i want the actual evidence that should be freely available. not a list of credits.

[UncleChrist]

no, i want the actual evidence that should be freely available. not a list of credits.

Freely available like right here where you demand it now :cool:

do the research yourself :bugeye:
maybe read a book

you can start here
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/clarifications.htm

It is my hope that people will not take what is said
in the film as the truth, but find out for themselves, for truth is not told, it is realized.

[John99]

Freely available like right here where you demand it now :cool:

do the research yourself :bugeye:
maybe read a book

you can start here
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/clarifications.htm

You make a thread saying you would like to hear what other have to say THEN when questions are asked you say 'do your own research' or 'go read a book'

NOW while doing your own resesrch you found this:

It is my hope that people will not take what is said
in the film as the truth, but find out for themselves, for truth is not told, it is realized.

I dont need a lesson on the truth by people trying to deceive and when i see a legitimate documentary it does not require me to read the fine print.

That quote can only appeal to a child. The truth is not told so i will make a movie with lies in it?:bugeye: This movie IS 'big brother' just not to me.

[SnakeLord]

when i see a legitimate documentary

How do you tell it's "legitimate" without doing research by yourself? As such the comment quoted and indeed unclechrists comments were valid.

[Adstar]

hey didnt the romans do that already?..the inqisition...lets just get rid of all who oppose us...."fear" a nother powerfull tool... Are there Biblical precedents for Inquisitions designed to root out heresy?
There certainly are:

Ex 32:1-35, This is the story of Moses and the Golden Calf incident. I will paraphrase instead of recounting this lengthy story. Moses came down from the mountain with the stone tablets (15) and found that his people had made for themselves a Golden Calf and they were worshiping it (19). They had become Heretics. Moses asked who was still loyal to the Lord and the Levites responded (26). Then Moses commanded the Levites to slay the ones who were not loyal to the Lord, and they did (27-29). This chapter is a clear message to ferret out Heretics from the midst of believers.

The inquisition does not fully cover the prophecy of the mark of the beast. While the catholics did persecute Christians they never had a system where one needed a mark to be able to buy and sell anything.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Medicine*Woman]

The inquisition does not fully cover the prophecy of the mark of the beast. While the catholics did persecute Christians they never had a system where one needed a mark to be able to buy and sell anything.
*************
M*W: No prophecies from the blibel have yet been fulfilled.

It was the Romans (not catholics) who allegedly persecuted the early christians, but this is just a myth anyway. This myth arose when Jesus/God=the Sun was in the Sign of Leo=Lions. Everything can be explained simply by astro-theology.

Christianity is just a myth.

[mikenostic]

*************
M*W: No prophecies from the blibel have yet been fulfilled.

It was the Romans (not catholics) who allegedly persecuted the early christians, but this is just a myth anyway. This myth arose when Jesus/God=the Sun was in the Sign of Leo=Lions. Everything can be explained simply by astro-theology.

Christianity is just a myth.
MW, you seem to be pretty versed in astro-theology. An earlier post mentioned something about finding real, actual sources for some of the assertions. Example, Helios, Krishna and the other enlightened figures all have the same b-day as Jesus. They all died for three days and were resurrected. They all had 12 followers/brothers, etc. Do you know of or have access to bonafide sources to back up those assertions the film made? It seems to me that if all the attributes of those historical figures can be proven, then it's easy to dismiss Christianity as a myth.

[John99]

*************
This myth arose when Jesus/God=the Sun was in the Sign of Leo=Lions. Everything can be explained simply by astro-theology.



How did you come to this conclusion? I used google to find anything to support that assertion but the most compelling support was at ********** forum post by some dude calling himself slimJim.

Jesus=Sun...and thats it M*W? Give us something profound.

[John99]

An earlier post mentioned something about finding real, actual sources for some of the assertions. Example, Helios, Krishna and the other enlightened figures all have the same b-day as Jesus. They all died for three days and were resurrected. They all had 12 followers/brothers, etc. Do you know of or have access to bonafide sources to back up those assertions the film made? It seems to me that if all the attributes of those historical figures can be proven, then it's easy to dismiss Christianity as a myth.

AND i am still waiting for that. The best the apologists can come up with is that NOW the Zeigeist movie is fraudulent.

[mikenostic]

AND i am still waiting for that. The best the apologists can come up with is that NOW the Zeigeist movie is fraudulent.

Here's a source that I found on Mithra, another one of the ancient figures with Dec 25th as a birthday.
I mean, if the civilizations that worshipped these figures way back in the day designated their(Helios, Krishna, Mithra) birthdays on Dec 25, centuries before Christ was born, you'd have to be a fool to not realize what's going on.

http://www.truthbeknown.com/mithra.htm

CN: Mithra, the Light of the World, is an ancient sun god born on December 25th who resembled Jesus Christ in many ways.


Mithra or Mitra is even worshipped as Itu (Mitra-Mitu-Itu) in every house of the Hindus in India. Itu (derivative of Mitu or Mitra) is considered as the Vegetation-deity. This Mithra or Mitra (Sun-God) is believed to be a Mediator between God and man, between the Sky and the Earth. It is said that Mithra or [the] Sun took birth in the Cave on December 25th. It is also the belief of the Christian world that Mithra or the Sun-God was born of [a] Virgin. He travelled far and wide. He has twelve satellites, which are taken as the Sun's disciples....

Any Christian apology for this would be just like Baghdad Bob on TV telling reporters that Americans had not invaded Iraq when you could see the convoy of American trucks rolling right behind where he was standing.
:roflmao:

[John99]

Apology for what exactly? Your link is a like reading National Enquirer.

When giving proof use good sources.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithra

[John99]

We need to research this point further:

http://www.tektonics.org/copycat/mithra.html

It is a big mistake to assume those who came before us were just simple yokels.

[peta9]

I see the point about religion and pagan symbolism but the one-world government negative spin is thier interpretation.

As long as their is division between countries there will always be war, death and suffering.

I see the one world government represented by different unions as the lesser of two evils. The chip itself is good for accountability. Why would anyone in society think they are not accountable in the society they live in amongst others. Why would they be afraid to be tracked? No one deserves or has total freedom and even without chips we still don't and are monitored.

Actually this could be revolutionary as this has never happened before, possibly a leap in human evolution instead of repeating and using the same old ideas of the past.

[peta9]

That hurt to watch that and I think of all those broken hearts dead, in the past and today. I really think the bottomline is a one-world government is better because division and xenophobia through history has always ended up in wars and countless suffering based on religion, race, class etc.

Stupid people are as much capable of supporting evil and therefore can't be trusted either so a one-world government is best. I hope the world gets better and on a better track.

[UncleChrist]

so a one-world government is best

Absolute power corrupts absolutely

One world government = Slavery



:splat:

Heres a good one to watch

http://www.911blogger.com/node/10025


,

[UncleChrist]

http://www.whydoesgodhateamputees.com/video7.htm

:itold:

[Alabaster]

Funny that the opener states, "You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

It's from the bible. Jesus' words. John 8:32...
"And you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

By the way, Jesus wasn't born in December.

After all the Christian denunciation, I watched the rest of the link, and what emerges for me is the slow evolution of the age nearly upon us which is actually prophesied in the bible. These politicians aren't as crafty as made out to be. They are dupes, pawns and puppets of the one who rules this realm--Satan. He is bringing forth the end, and the Antichrist.

Weird, eh? I know. But it is foretold, even to the detail of the chip.

[UncleChrist]

They are dupes, pawns and puppets of the one who rules this realm--Satan. He is bringing forth the end, and the Antichrist.



Really ?

It's all just the Boogyman ?

:eek:

Oooooo

[Adstar]

Funny that the opener states, "You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

It's from the bible. Jesus' words. John 8:32...
"And you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

By the way, Jesus wasn't born in December.

After all the Christian denunciation, I watched the rest of the link, and what emerges for me is the slow evolution of the age nearly upon us which is actually prophesied in the bible. These politicians aren't as crafty as made out to be. They are dupes, pawns and puppets of the one who rules this realm--Satan. He is bringing forth the end, and the Antichrist.

Weird, eh? I know. But it is foretold, even to the detail of the chip.

Pretty much right.

I think some of these leaders actually know that they are working for satan, But for some strange reason they either think that satan is going to win or satan is a god and more powerful than The God Of Abraham.

But your right a lot of them are just greedy and power hungry megalomaniacs who are easy to use, all satan needs to do is given them wealth and power on earth and he can get them to do anything to anyone at anytime.

Matthew 16:26
For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul? Or what will a man give in exchange for his soul?



All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[UncleChrist]

It's all just the Boogyman ?

Pretty much right.


" The Ultimate Denial "

:puke:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qmglGWMsdk


.

[John99]

UncleChrist,

I honestly think you are in no position to render judgement on who is deluded. Unless you are really Chirst's uncle, THEN i would believe what you say. As it stands now i believe NONE of it.

[UncleChrist]

Your just itching to go eh... "John99"

I was just getting ready to reply to your other post
regarding my take on things wishing we could have a civil exchange
here in this topic would be fine

;)

[John99]

ok, it is mostly exaggeration. I will see if i can put a strikethrough on that last part. Dont be discouraged to respond to my thread.

[UncleChrist]

I honestly think you are in no position to render judgement on who is deluded

For starters

I'm in exactly the position to argue anyone
who carries on with this kind of mindless dribble
that has plagued all of our lives
all based on absolutely nothing

Just sheeple pretending to know crap they do not know

:argue:

[Alabaster]

For starters

I'm in exactly the position to argue anyone
who carries on with this kind of mindless dribble
that has plagued all of our lives
all based on absolutely nothing

Just sheeple pretending to know crap they do not know

:argue:


That's what YOU think! Haha!

[SkinWalker]

Where is the evidence that this assertion is wrong? Removing hyperboles like "mindless dribble", "plagued", "sheeple" and "crap," replacing them with "delusion," "afflicted," "followers," and "things," gives a valid criticism of religious belief.

Those that don't believe, and are willing to question religion are the ones most in a position to argue the notion that religion is a grand delusion.

[UncleChrist]

you could just give me your cash :)
I'll make sure the Boogyman doesn't get it



All Puke on The Ancient Ways

.

[UncleChrist]

thanks Skinwalker
I'll try to curb the attitude

;)

All Piss on The Ancient Ways
.

[UncleChrist]

http://www.atheistnation.net/video/?video/00590/atheist/real-times-rapture-forecast/



All Paid For The Ancient Ways

[UncleChrist]

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/GMappendix.htm

[UncleChrist]

So many nuts ..... and so little time ;)

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Lone Nut Makes DVDs Available For Those Who
Question the 9/11 Commission Report
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[brights]

RE: http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

I've watched it all the way. But, I'm most interested in the first part. If you are looking for accuracy, I don't think this video serves the purpose. I've found many errors and speculations and I would like to point out MANY:

1. There is no record in the Bible that December 25 is the actual and accurate birth date of Jesus.

2. There is no archaeological evidence at all which truly and accurately depicts Jesus' real image.

3. Christ was a Jew and it's shameful for a Jew to wear long hair.

"1 Corinthians 11:14 - Does not the very nature of things teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a disgrace to him,"

4. The facial feature of Jesus doesn't match those living in the middle east. His current Roman Catholic depictions most describes people in Northern Europe, of Nordic origin or the Arian race.

5. It is forbidden for Christians to represent God in anyway and in any form, whether it be in symbols, statues, paintings, anything formed by human hands as this seriously constitutes idol worshiping.

"Romans 1:22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles."

6. It is forbidden for Christians to look in the stars, the sun, and the moon for superstitious practices.

"Isaiah 47: 12 Stand fast in your enchantments and your many sorceries, with which you have labored from your youth; perhaps you may be able to succeed, perhaps you may inspire terror. 13 You are wearied with your many counsels; let them stand forth and save you, those who divide the heavens, who gaze at the stars, who at the new moons predict what shall befall you."

7. All of the images, symbols, icons in the video doesn't belong to Christianity. It belongs to the Roman Catholic Church.

8. As the video suggest, "I am the Christ" :

Matthew 24:4-31

4 Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many.

..

Indeed, many will come claiming "I am the Christ" like Horus, Krishna, Quezcacoatl, Attis, Dionysus, Mithra, etc.

Key features:

- Born of a Virgin
- Star in the East
- Adorned by 3 Kings
- 12 Disciples
- Baptised/Ministry at 30
- Performed Miracles
- Lamb of god
- The Light
- Crucified
- Dead for 3 days
- Resurrected

Clearly caught red handed. Indeed many will actually believe in this deception as clearly spoken by Jesus.

9. Nothing was mentioned about the Genealogy of Jesus, all in the video was a "false Christ" in many racial attributes, but nothing was mentioned about their respective origins.

"Luke 3

23 Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry. He was the son, so it was thought, of Joseph, 24 the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melki, the son of Jannai, the son of Joseph, 25 the son of Mattathias, the son of Amos, the son of Nahum, the son of Esli, the son of Naggai, 26 the son of Maath, the son of Mattathias, the son of Semein, the son of Josech, the son of Joda, 27 the son of Joanan, the son of Rhesa, the son of Zerubbabel, the son of Shealtiel, the son of Neri, 28 the son of Melki, the son of Addi, the son of Cosam, the son of Elmadam, the son of Er, 29 the son of Joshua, the son of Eliezer, the son of Jorim, the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, 30 the son of Simeon, the son of Judah, the son of Joseph, the son of Jonam, the son of Eliakim, 31 the son of Melea, the son of Menna, the son of Mattatha, the son of Nathan, the son of David, 32 the son of Jesse, the son of Obed, the son of Boaz, the son of Salmon, the son of Nahshon, 33 the son of Amminadab, the son of Ram, the son of Hezron, the son of Perez, the son of Judah, 34 the son of Jacob, the son of Isaac, the son of Abraham, the son of Terah, the son of Nahor, 35 the son of Serug, the son of Reu, the son of Peleg, the son of Eber, the son of Shelah, 36 the son of Cainan, the son of Arphaxad, the son of Shem, the son of Noah, the son of Lamech, 37 the son of Methuselah, the son of Enoch, the son of Jared, the son of Mahalalel, the son of Kenan, 38 the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God."

10. Nothing was mentioned after their so called resurrection and then what, what happens next?

But the REAL CHRIST:

Hebrew 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Did the so called gods - Horus, Krishna, and company sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high?

...

I can carry on match for match, but all I can say is, it doesn't hold water. The video should be titled instead, "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus".

When we you look at two 100 dollar bills (one is fake), at first instance you wouldn't know which one is counterfeit until you look very closely and then you'll know which one is fake.

If someone wants to really discount Jesus, he must show a 100% match for match with all these ancient religions, not just cherry pick the ones he likes in order to disprove Christianity, but everything, chapter by chapter, from Genesis to Revelation.

Let him match it 100% positive, like fingerprint matching.

[John99]

For me the saddest part of the video is that George Carlin is just not funny anymore.

[UncleChrist]

For me the saddest part of the video is that George Carlin is just not funny anymore.

Good to see you have your priorities in order:rolleyes:

[UncleChrist]

1. There is no record in the Bible that December 25 is the actual and accurate birth date of Jesus.

So you know for a fact when he wasn't born
but do not know when he was born .... ?
How scientific
2. There is no archaeological evidence at all which truly and accurately depicts Jesus' real image.


Or anything else for that matter

3. Christ was a Jew and it's shameful for a Jew to wear long hair.

and just think ...that same mysterious hippy guys picture has been scetched
and painted throughout history ....all based on absolutely nothing


"1 Corinthians 11:14 - Does not the very nature of things teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a disgrace to him,"


personally I think long hair looks better on some men ...
it hardly defines a persons character...this quote is just more proof of the prejudice and how short sighted these false truths really are

7. All of the images, symbols, icons in the video doesn't belong to Christianity. It belongs to the Roman Catholic Church.


why are all the christians always calling all the other christians wrong

Indeed, many will come claiming "I am the Christ" like Horus, Krishna, Quezcacoatl, Attis, Dionysus, Mithra, etc.


So he said they would come... 2500 years before he was here to say it ?

"Luke 3

23 Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry. He was the son, so it was thought, of Joseph

Wrong
Son of joseph or son of God make up your mind some day soon please

Did the so called gods - Horus, Krishna, and company sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high?


I'm sure some deluded followers would claim it so ...based on nothing
like you
When we you look at two 100 dollar bills (one is fake), at first instance you wouldn't know which one is counterfeit until you look very closely and then you'll know which one is fake.


But we are not looking at anything close to a real 100 dollar bill are we now
just the idea of a 100 dollar bill :rolleyes:

If someone wants to really discount Jesus, he must show a 100% match for match with all these ancient religions,

How about anybody at all showing anything at all that proves JC was real
:cool:

[UncleChrist]

http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/ZGcover.jpg

[UncleChrist]

Zeitgeist II Oct 2008

Debunked /Refuted
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_9ZyddjaM4

Live Chat with the producer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xC86eSzvLY&feature=related
2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcgZWirku5g&feature=related
3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jx5_ZGoJE84&NR=1
4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3T-PtgAjts&feature=related

Zeitgeist II movie Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5r6-o1lpJHU&feature=related

Why doesn't Utube want you to see this Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpG9_5pRbks&feature=related

:peace:

[UncleChrist]

The New Zeitgeist 2 Is Out


It's a beautiful Thing
:D

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

Addendum

:peace:

[Adstar]

I can carry on match for match, but all I can say is, it doesn't hold water. The video should be titled instead, "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus".

When we you look at two 100 dollar bills (one is fake), at first instance you wouldn't know which one is counterfeit until you look very closely and then you'll know which one is fake.

If someone wants to really discount Jesus, he must show a 100% match for match with all these ancient religions, not just cherry pick the ones he likes in order to disprove Christianity, but everything, chapter by chapter, from Genesis to Revelation.

Let him match it 100% positive, like fingerprint matching.

Ahh but if someone wants desperately not to believe in Jesus. Promoting the "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus". as true Christianity would make their goal that much easier.

It would be the objective of satan himself to have everyone believe that "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus" was true Christianity.

So take a pack of spiritual Harlots who value their lives over the Love of the Truth and give them power and influence in this world. Make the masses believe the twisted version is the real version and make a religious fall guy with inbuilt design faults ready to be destroyed at the desired time. Let the harlot dominate until the beast turns on her and rips her apart.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[StrangerInAStrangeLa]

Ahh but if someone wants desperately not to believe in Jesus. Promoting the "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus". as true Christianity would make their goal that much easier.
It would be the objective of satan himself to have everyone believe that "The Babylonian Religions of the World and the counterfeit Jesus" was true Christianity.
So take a pack of spiritual Harlots who value their lives over the Love of the Truth and give them power and influence in this world. Make the masses believe the twisted version is the real version and make a religious fall guy with inbuilt design faults ready to be destroyed at the desired time. Let the harlot dominate until the beast turns on her and rips her apart.


That's exactly what's happened & you fell for it.

[Adstar]

That's exactly what's happened & you fell for it.

Then you believe in Jesus? If you believe there is a twisted version of the Jesus then you must believe there is a true version of Jesus. Therefore you must believe in Jesus.

Oh and how is it possable for me to fall for something that i have declared to be false? Weird logic you have there.


All Praise The Ancient of Days

[UncleChrist]

For anyone who might have missed it

Their is a new Zeitgeist 2 movie called :: Addendum
at the top of the page on the original site

Click on the big eyeball at the top
for the link to the new movie
or go here
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7065205277695921912

[Carico]

All the Christians especially need to watch this Movie


:bugeye:

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/


If you don't watch it all the way to part three ...its everyones loss


:cool:

It was a mess. But all I can say is that if humans lived according to the Ten Commandments, there would be no problems in the world. Nevertheless, humans think they know better than God does and our demise will be the result. :o

[spidergoat]

Perhaps, you should stop bearing false witness.

[SkinWalker]

Nevertheless, humans think they know better than God does and our demise will be the result.

Which god? And if you mean Yahweh/El/Elohim, why that one? Why not one of the thousands upon thousands of other gods that have been created by people, just like yours, or the thousands upon thousands that will likely come after your god is long forgotten.

Oh. Because you were raised in a Christian culture. Not an ancient Greek, an Islamic, a Andean, or a Mesoamerican one.

[swarm]

Carico: all I can say is that if humans lived according to the Ten Commandments, there would be no problems in the world.

Because it sure has worked wonders for the jews, xtians and muslims

[StrangerInAStrangeLa]

It was a mess. But all I can say is that if humans lived according to the Ten Commandments, there would be no problems in the world. Nevertheless, humans think they know better than God does and our demise will be the result. :o

What 10 commandments???

BTW, do you preach to animals?

[Carico]

Which god? And if you mean Yahweh/El/Elohim, why that one? Why not one of the thousands upon thousands of other gods that have been created by people, just like yours, or the thousands upon thousands that will likely come after your god is long forgotten.

Oh. Because you were raised in a Christian culture. Not an ancient Greek, an Islamic, a Andean, or a Mesoamerican one.

Sounds like you're confused about how many gods there are. I'm not. ;)

[Carico]

Carico: all I can say is that if humans lived according to the Ten Commandments, there would be no problems in the world.

Because it sure has worked wonders for the jews, xtians and muslims

And which Jews and Muslims have lived by the Ten Commandments? :bugeye:

[Medicine*Woman]

Sounds like you're confused about how many gods there are. I'm not. ;)
*************
M*W: It's all in your imagination, because you are the one who is confused. You just don't know that you are.

[Medicine*Woman]

And which Jews and Muslims have lived by the Ten Commandments? :bugeye:
*************
M*W: The question is, where did the Ten Commandments originate from?

[StrangerInAStrangeLa]

There's no such thing as THE 10 Commandments.

[Medicine*Woman]

There's no such thing as THE 10 Commandments.
*************
M*W: That was a rhetorical queston for Carico's benefit.

[StrangerInAStrangeLa]

I wasn't criticizing your post. I was trying to get him to specify.

[Medicine*Woman]

I wasn't criticizing your post. I was trying to get him to specify.
*************
M*W: Oh, I know that. That was what I was trying to get him to do!