Learning to do without

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by oscar, Jan 25, 2006.

  1. oscar confusoid Registered Senior Member

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    315
    Yes, just plain doing without.

    Living without asking for anything, as if you feel like you have enough and don't wish to make room for more at the moment.

    It's something like content, but it's also about not letting the things you know/think you're missing out on sting you. A better job, material posessions, companies and friends, things of that sort.

    When I've taught myself to do without all that stuff, it's been the time when all the things I could've asked for were within my reach. As of late, I get a strange feeling that they're slipping out of reach and again I find myself struggling to learn yet again to do without, which is also weird 'cos at the time when I finally started enjoying the things I had put aside, I found out that it didn't have to be that way.

    What I learned is that I didn't really have to do without them once they were in my reach and I was able to enjoy them, but now that some of those things are going away or changing all that I've left to do is once again learn to...do without. Or do I?

    I mean, I have learned the lesson in past times...and I can seriously say that I still get it now...so, why is "life" trying to reinforce the lesson? Does "life" feel like I've forgotten...?

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    Disclaimer: I'm not a 13 year old with an existential crisis hoping for some people in a chat room or message board to help me out with my life instead of going to a therapist.

    I'm merely trying to get your own personal opinions on the issue, and yes, feel like sharing your own experience should you relate in any way to this post.
     
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  3. Varda The Bug Lady Valued Senior Member

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    learning to do without is basically what epicureanism is about, and i think you made a good description of what and epicureanist thinks like. you should not desire the things that you don't have though, and you should not get used to things that you cannot sustain... that causes dissatisfaction. think about the things that will always be at your reach, such as friendship and knowledge and find your satisfaction with that.
    i dont know if you are fond of epic poetry, but i think you'd like to read "on the nature of things" by lucretius. you can probably find it online.

    also i congratulate you, i think that is a very virtuous way of living... it's not for me though, i'm too much into pleasure

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  5. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    I think many people tend toward a point of balance where they discover a few things that are really important to them--wants, needs, or tastes that define a key part of who they are. If they can achieve, acquire, or possess those things then everything else is optional. It can be a mix of the noble, the ambitious, and the prosaic. Being a teacher, climbing Mt. Whitney, and listening to Bon Jovi.

    People who reach this point in their life may stop asking for anything because they can "do without" everything else in the world. But their lives are already rich in the ways that matter to them.

    People who "do without" things that they really want, or who don't know what they want, or who resign themselves to not getting what they want, this is self-imposed asceticism. These people usually are punishing themselves or think they're not worthy.

    Be cautious about denying yourself things. Particularly the friends. There's no good reason for even a yogi or a nun, who deny themselves much of what we take for granted, to deliberately miss out on friendship. It's free and it benefits both parties.

    Homo sapiens is a social species. It's our natural instinct to like each other and to enjoy each other's company. Don't "do without" that.

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  7. Varda The Bug Lady Valued Senior Member

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    well, the willingness to abstain from certain pleasures in epicurianism is not quite asceticism, because it doesnt originate from the necessity of punishing the body to purify the soul.

    it just tells you to avoid pleasures that you cannot sustain. if you eat a delicious food for example, you might feel unhappy in the future for not having delicious food, so maybe it's better to avoid the delicious food and learn to love the everyday food.
     
  8. oscar confusoid Registered Senior Member

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    Can you sustain anything at all? "Life" gives, "life" takes.

    "Semper habui comitis" (or something like that, I'll look it up tonight) - I always have company. Some are companions, some are mere witnesses. Some are uninvited yet welcome guests - which at the end of the day walk out the door anyway - and some others are (for the sake of rhyme) unwelcome pests.

    Yes, and also people may learn to do without some things because they've already had them, and already enjoyed them. However, I'm under the impression that perhaps not everything in life can be attained, which would easily justify why people would shift their priorities as you've already mentioned.

    On the other hand...people may just, again, learn to do without those things they may be missing out on. To quote Krishnamurthi (U.G., not Jiddu): "...the hunger must consume itself and disappear without ever knowing satisfaction".

    For the record, I think he actually meant it for religious and philosophical fanatics in their search for the so called "ultimate truth" which, according to Krishnamurthi, was not there and they had to settle for that. Again the lesson being to learn to "do without".

    The fuller version of that quote goes something like: "The question is not solved when an answer is found but when the question itself ceases to exist. The hunger must consume itself and disappear without ever knowing satisfaction". I also would like to point out that I'm quoting the guy off the top of my head, however what I'm quoting is quite accurate.


    Additionally, I was not only talking about "doing without" in the long run (ascetism, epicureanism and what not...) but also in the short run, though I can't think of a good example right now but hopefully you will know what I mean.

    so...

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    Caption: How do YOU do without?
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2006
  9. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    To quote U.G. Krishnamurti further:

    "Money matters most in life.

    One who worships the money god will be amply rewarded. One who worships the other God will be stripped naked and left in the streets.

    Money is the only thing that works.

    Denying yourself money is the root of all misery."

    http://ugmoneymaxims.blogspot.com/
     
  10. oscar confusoid Registered Senior Member

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    315
    Errata:

    "Habui semper sodales" - I always had company, Cicero said that.

    I didn't really mean doing without friendship itself, rather a specific friend or set of friends.

    That too. He is known to be a materialist in that sense, though I did find it interesting what he had to say about religious and spiritual issues. However, I think he may have been over the top at times like claiming he could disprove Einstein and stuff...I was like "...okay, and what will you do next, come up with a country of your own?"

    P.S. Man, he looks so old now

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  11. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member

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    What are you going to learn to do without, when you are in iraq cotton.
     
  12. oscar confusoid Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    315
    who's cotton?

    Anywho, life has just taught me a lesson today. As I ran into a girl I used to go out with, at the end of the encounter I felt the urge to ask her out again considering that I haven't gone out with another girl since I last went out with her. This was a year ago and though I'm over her, I still felt like asking her out only for the sake of going out with a girl.

    I resisted. And I feel better now. So what I get from this is that another trick to learning to "do without" is not giving in to the so called "horror vacui" (or fear of nothing).

    Note that I did not deny myself going out with a girl, I denied myself going out with HER. Trust me, I have my reasons. Nope, not excuses...reasons.

    So then another question comes out of this: does nature really abhor a void? Or is it we've been conditioned to think that way?
     

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