Decorations are useless [Archive]

Squashbuckler

05-31-03, 01:44 PM

Why do people love decorations and other "pretty" things ?
Everything from christmas tree ornaments to bracelets to photographs.
I think that people who are roused with emotion over an inanimate object that is "pretty" are quite shallow.
Thoughts anyone ?

I know personally that order and cleanliness are a requirement. What freud said on those topics i believe to be true.
But "pretty things" ? come on.
I dont think "decorations" are a human requirement.

Then again, imagine the world with barren white walls, black tables and chairs, clean...yet very bold and without emotion?

Maybe its possible that colors actually invoke emotions in humans.
Much like a bull is instigated by a red piece of cloth .

sargentlard

05-31-03, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by Squashbuckler

Then again, imagine the world with barren white walls, black tables and chairs, clean...yet very bold and without emotion?

Maybe its possible that colors actually invoke emotions in humans.
Much like a bull is instigated by a red piece of cloth .

You answered your own question so why ask;)

Squashbuckler

06-01-03, 12:12 PM

then my next question is..

Why, and how do colors affect the mind...
how does a color stir a particular emotion in someone ?

What makes the bull hate red?
?

sargentlard

06-01-03, 04:04 PM

Originally posted by Squashbuckler
then my next question is..

Why, and how do colors affect the mind...
how does a color stir a particular emotion in someone ?

What makes the bull hate red?
?

I have read many things on how pure, staurated colors can evoke certain emotions in us. Colors which are pure such as RED, GREEN, and BLUE. Also for long now societies have tied in meanings with color. Also Certain color may represent some situations...since Red is also the color of the blood..(well blue really but it turns red when it is oxidized) it might evoke terrible memories of war or a event where violence and bloodshed took place. So colors also act as memory reminders. Colors such as green might remind some one of nature and peaceful serene landscapes so it could have a calming effect on you.

It's complex how it all works but humans thrive on color. It could also be that It helps us change our surrounding. Humans are novelty seeking creatures...we need change in our lives to keep us going...not change as in life change but change of surroundings...asthetic change if you will.

;) Hope that made sense

whitewolf

06-01-03, 04:39 PM

What makes the bull hate red?
Bull doesnt hate red, as a matter of fact. He is color blind, like the rest of animals. What gets him angry is that the thing is moving, the faster it moves the angrier he gets.
Colors? some say they affect not only our emotions, but also our physical state. Look into books that talk ab aura and like subjects.
"decorations are garbage" is a modern architectural style, which includes the exterior and interior of buildings. Now, if it's a style, it is a decoration in itself, eh?

DarkEyedBeauty

06-02-03, 04:56 PM

Yes, colours, like smells evoke memories. However, since we encounter the same colour so many times, the memories are larger and more generalized. Colours do have to do with culture. In some countries wear black to funerals, in others it's white, I believe.

I think decorations are part of human nature. We are a species that lack many survival resources (speed, claws, strength, flight). We have our brain, and that makes up for whatever we lack otherwise. Since our brian is our most powerful resource it makes sense that we use it to attract our mates. Now, intelligence is not necessarily something which would be initially attractive, although a mind is a very beautiful thing. To initially attract a mate, one must catch the attention of the opposite sex. Humans are very visual creatures. So the purpose of decorations seem to be to attract a mate. So maybe someone is wearing something that seems undesirable to me. Possibly their clothing/decorations are catered to a specific type of person. They are trying to find a mate that has similar interests/beliefs.

LKRaider

06-04-03, 02:03 AM

Originally posted by whitewolf
Bull doesnt hate red, as a matter of fact. He is color blind, like the rest of animals.

Yes, the bull is colorblind... but not all the animals are...

"decorations are garbage" is a modern architectural style, which includes the exterior and interior of buildings. Now, if it's a style, it is a decoration in itself, eh?
Yup... and no ;) It is a style preoccupied in pure functionality - like a machine - and believing that attaining perfect functionality equals in attaining ultimate beauty.

A decoration is the opposite of the modern 'functionality', since, in that view, it serves no purpouse on the 'building as a machine'.

- - -

I think decorations purpouses mainly are as symbols (to bring our mind to certain thoughs, inspired by them)
This can be acceptably useful or not
For ex., many times, on architecture, decorations were used to show-off the status of the person/owner of the building...
Other times, decorations can be used to set a desired mood on people (party decorations, etc)
It most certainly serves a purpouse.

thefountainhed

06-04-03, 08:25 PM

I know personally that order and cleanliness are a requirement. What freud said on those topics i believe to be true.

Consider that most decorations are ordered and clean.

Squashbuckler

06-04-03, 10:04 PM

Originally posted by thefountainhed
Consider that most decorations are ordered and clean.

considered. thats true. Thanks.:cool:

B_Rad

06-05-03, 01:04 AM

If a decoration is meaningful to at least one person, does that not validate its existence. Would not the only true judge of that be the person who finds meaning in it?

otheadp

06-06-03, 12:42 AM

decorations are art. art makes life interesting, evokes feelings, memories and the imagination. it gives ppl something to yap about too.

therefore, we need decorations and "pretty things" to make life colorful

Walker

06-06-03, 01:59 AM

Just as people have other senses beyond the physical, so too do we possess an aesthetic sense that tells us what we think is prefferable in terms of experience. This sense can appreciate art, music or simple decoration, and is developed through sensory experiences positive, negative and subjective in nature.

This "blanket sense" helps us to form a definitive opinion, perspective or perception of whatever we are judging aesthetically, drawing on whatever senses are used to percieve the thing we are judging...sight and touch (texture), for example, are used to form an aesthetic judgement of a piece of sculpture. According to our aesthetic sense, an object of a particular size, shape and color may lend itself to a certain variety of texture, or even a specific texture, and if it fails to possess the texture we deem appropriate to the object (be this judgement based on past experience with a similar object, personal opinion, etc.), we may reject the object, finding it unsettling to the eye, or unbalanced to the senses...thus ruining the "overall" aesthetic impression of the object.

Memory may play a large role in this...so too could a number of other elements, but more important is the purpose of this sense, of this overall impression. Aesthetics may in fact help us define ourselves, both to the world at large, and in our own perception. By forming a highly developed aesthetic sense with a consistent idea of what is "pleasing" or "appropriate" in art, decor, etc, one can organize one's general impressions so that they are recoginzed by both the individual and those who percive them, giving a general, and in some cases specific, impression of how the individual percieves the world, what pleases them and how they think.

I guess. It's also good to like stuff, or the world would get pretty boring. So like, decorating is cool.

sevenblu

06-06-03, 02:25 AM

ORANGE MAKES ME HUNGRY

that's why all the tables in pizza-joints are orange...

river-wind

06-06-03, 11:44 AM

while having a colorful computer box will not make me better at math, it may help slightly reduce my stress level, allowing me to do more bad math in a given day. maybe only 5 more second of math, but over a year that would amount to an additional 20 minutes of work.

form is useless until the point where function is reached. then form is integral to the improvment of function.

Walker

06-06-03, 06:05 PM

Tell that to Braque!

Squashbuckler

06-07-03, 07:53 PM

Originally posted by river-wind

form is useless until the point where function is reached. then form is integral to the improvment of function.

Good point river.
:cool:

whitewolf

06-08-03, 01:02 AM

form is useless until the point where function is reached. then form is integral to the improvment of function.

The purpose of a decoration is to please the eye; the more aesthetic it is (to the individual), the more functional it gets (back to where we started!) Naturally, the less pleasing things will be bought by smaller number of consumers, etc.

Now, musing on the idea i had before. Suppose the reduction (and functionality) is a style and this way becomes a decoration. How does one keep it strictly so that it is reduction and function in their purest sense, not a style, and, thus, not part of decor? What will one end up with?

Squashbuckler

06-08-03, 10:26 AM

I guess that would also relate to members of the opposite sex as well, with the most pleasing to the eye being taken off the shelf first. =)

Agent Smith

06-08-03, 11:05 AM

Well squash bucker i think you need a vacation desperatley.

whitewolf

06-09-03, 12:35 AM

I guess that would also relate to members of the opposite sex as well, with the most pleasing to the eye being taken off the shelf first. =)

lower head always leads, even if not related to subject, eh?

gendanken

06-09-03, 02:00 AM

I know personally that order and cleanliness are a requirement. What freud said on those topics i believe to be true.
But "pretty things" ? come on.
I dont think "decorations" are a human requirement.

So this grinds them down to their being useless. The question now is, are they really so?

Ever been to the zoo? Yours truly used to work there and I'll tell you that nothing draws crowds like peacocks, flamingoes, green herrings, lyre birds, bright lorikeets, mackaques in heat, and all the pretty varieties of tropical birds.

Furthermore, the eastern religions are the most intriguing globally and I dare say its becuase of creativity.

Personally, a bland peasent face with no lips and thin skin pales to the bronzed beauties of Brazil and Mexico.

Mephura

06-09-03, 04:33 AM

I would like to propose an idea.
Decorations actually are detrimental to the development of empathetic social skills and to understanding one's self.

Mind you the decorations I am speaking of are not just visual, but everything superfluous in society. They serve as a destraction from the mundane or the unwanted. In this way, decorations are not useless, but actually act as a defence system against unwanted thoughts and ideas. However, most of our lives are now inundated with so much 'noise', that many of us learn to simply turn to a decoration for distraction instead of learning to deal with both ourselves and others on a more emotional level.

A common senario would be, person X watches person Z going through a period of emotional distress. Person X feels uncomfortable by this situation, having never before dealt with it. Person X finds something (music, a book, a painting) to draw his/her attention from person Z until said situation is gone or person X is forced to deal with it.

Does that sound familiar at all. You get pissed off, and instead of thinking about the situation, you listen to loud music, and go for a drive, or play a video game, etc etc. While it is true that one may be thinking in part about the situation during any of these activities, it is true that you are not devoting all of your energies towards resolution of the issue.

So, in some way decorations, are a good thing, and can sidtract us from certain stresses to make us more productive for example, but on the other hand the constant sensory overload that modern society is giving us may, in the long run, be detrimental to our psychological development.

Just a random thought..:D

gendanken

06-09-03, 05:16 AM

serve as a destraction from the mundane

more like attratction to the mundane.........in most cases anyway

This idea that art plays the role of nymphs that romance away trouble is an idea propounded by Schopenhaur, who believed this world was degenerate, filled with disease, torture, sadness, and melancholy. The task then was to turn to the Beethovens and Michaelangelo's to numb the troubled spirt and sit on it.

Which ties back to this 'oneness' you'd spoke of earlier Mephura. Concerning what would the world be like if all men united in one mind and soul. I'm not sure you're acquainted with ol' Schopy, but the fact that you are saying *exactly* what he said verbatim without having read him proves that men at their base think the same exact things.

Think how odd it is that men seperated by oceans built pyramids just the same.

Mephura

06-09-03, 05:50 AM

Originally posted by gendanken
more like attratction to
This idea that art plays the role of nymphs that romance away trouble is an idea propounded by Schopenhaur, who believed this world was degenerate, filled with disease, torture, sadness, and melancholy. The task then was to turn to the Beethovens and Michaelangelo's to numb the troubled spirt and sit on it.

Not quite what I was saying. More to the point of too many Michaelangelos and Beethovens are what degenerate the world in the first place by distracting us from learnig how to deal with each other and overall, while increasing the amount of beauty (through art) there is in the world, decrease the civility level of the populatioin.

Which ties back to this 'oneness' you'd spoke of earlier Mephura. Concerning what would the world be like if all men united in one mind and soul. I'm not sure you're acquainted with ol' Schopy, but the fact that you are saying *exactly* what he said verbatim without having read him proves that men at their base think the same exact things.

Think how odd it is that men seperated by oceans built pyramids just the same.

If you are speaking of men in the sense of mankind, I would agree. If, however you are speaking about men as a sex, I would only add that the same holds true for women.

As for you who is (semmingly) amazingly well read, I would wager that you have problems dealingwith/ relating to others and seek solice in literature/art. Distracting yourself from your inability to deal with others while adding to your already over inflated ego. (i've read more, so I'm smarter and thus better in some way) It also has the side effect of making you so wonderfully hostile when other s disagree with your oh so learned oppinion.

;) love ya.

Squashbuckler

06-09-03, 11:55 AM

Thats a very unique and interesting thought mephura.
I will think about that.
Ive entereed it in my journal =)
I dont know how true this is.. but ill think about it.
I think you are relating to "alienation due to an alternative view of reality"

Dont all philisophers face that ?

gendanken

06-09-03, 01:23 PM

More to the point of too many Michaelangelos and Beethovens are what degenerate the world

Or more like too many palm pilots, lap tops, and CD players. If the world's degenaration is what's bedeviling you, blame it on MTV, Xboxes, PlayStations, and pop rock. NOT what Schopy meant by the arts. The role played by art in escapism so happens to have these hella big shoes the average petty trifle can't fill, if you follow.

I know myself personally that having heard a beatiful classic my heart (I swear it) spills over with torrential emotion and the FIRST thing I want to do is stop anyone and let them have a listen.

Having read a great book, or coming across some jewel of a quote or beautiful prose to put my eye out, the FIRST thing I want to do is share it. Communicate. Socialize. Not run and hide like a packrat and shut the world out.

What the modern man has is a pension of noise and the horrible pointless mess of "shock and awe". Remember that thing about silky ass wiping?

SO.....Schopy's ideas of escapism that says decorations indeed are usefully beautiful as I do and worth all the 'devoted energies' as you put it that men put into them does not apply in a watered down age such as this one.

Therefore- if your person 'x' is a louse who'd just as soon turn up the radio when his girly starts bitching, don't blame it on art. Blame it on noise. If 'x' furthermore turn his back to his child and takes to his reading, blame it on surrogate skimming. Not reading.

You've mistaken art with the back-up plan, and art being what it is when it truly *is* art .....then SURELY its not that

I didn't think I'd have to flesh out my two cents.......but anway.:rolleyes:

I would wager that you have problems dealingwith/ relating to others and seek solice in literature/art. Distracting yourself from your inability to deal with others while adding to your already over inflated ego.

That's the weirdest thing about me. I so totally don't!
Inflated ego is a bit harsh. I hope you don't really think that.

Mephura

06-09-03, 07:19 PM

Originally posted by gendanken
You've mistaken art with the back-up plan, and art being what it is when it truly *is* art .....then SURELY its not that
This is amazingly close to the heredity vs enviroment arguement that we haven't had yet. I am not confusing the two. Rather I am saying that an excess in the things which can distract us leads to a better chance of us being distracted. I will agree that most of the excess in this day and age is not and should not be considered 'art', but it is, and who am I to judge. I guess we could always go into the question of what is it that defines art as such, but then again you are pulling us away from the topic. The question at hand was decoration, not art. I had taken decoration ot be anything that is not purely utilitarian. While this would include your precious art, it also includes alot of other things.

I didn't think I'd have to flesh out my two cents.......but anway.:rolleyes:
What, I should just let you blather nonsense and stand blithely by? Or perhaps your words are art, and thus not ment to be qustioned?

That's the weirdest thing about me. I so totally don't!
Inflated ego is a bit harsh. I hope you don't really think that.
Of course I don't think your ego is overinflated. I'm so sorry if I offended you, XXX XXXXXX XXXX XXX.

gendanken

06-09-03, 08:12 PM

Why not bounce back to the beginning to freshen up a bit, sir:
stance 1:
Why do people love decorations and other "pretty" things ?

stance 2:
Everything from christmas tree ornaments to bracelets to photographs.

stance 3:
Then again, imagine the world with barren white walls, black tables and chairs, clean...yet very bold and without emotion?

The local grade schooler will recognize 'pretty things' and 'decorations' to mean art. This post was clearly aimed at quashing aesthetics.

What's mildly clear, and with you right about now the margins are quite blurry, is that you're wanting to either mince words or churn out a duel with semantics. What's eating me is how you plow through pet theories and forget what you say:

. Person X finds something (music, a book, a painting) to draw his/her attention from person Z until said situation is gone or person X is forced to deal with it.

This clearly refutes your claims of taking 'decorations or art to be anything but utilitarian'.

Want to beat about pragmatism? utilitatarianism? constructivism? heredity vs. environment? Gratuity never fails to rear its head in a man dying to see blood spilt. If so, start you a new thread and don't mow through at as you did here.

What, I should just let you blather nonsense and stand blithely by? Or perhaps your words are art, and thus not ment to be qustioned?

Why not just give me five minutes to get over the shock of actually meeting a live man on the rag?

Of course I don't think your ego is overinflated. I'm so sorry if I offended you, mon petite merde tete

A shit head? So cursing in French now makes this IXL777ish insult somehow more creative than calling me cunt?

gendanken

06-09-03, 08:32 PM

AHEM

Let it be known, ladies and gentlemen that the gendanken has still much love for the mephura in whatever mangled forms she doth showeth

A warm welcome to anyone else wanting to put their sixpence in.

one_raven

06-09-03, 08:39 PM

I think it is a combination of what mephura and gendanken are saying.

Art (and pretty things) serves as a distraction from the world and your personal problems with it.

By doing that it causes people to be more able and comfortable to ignore these things.

By doing that it facilitates making the situations worse and degenerating the state of things.

The worse it gets the more distractions we crave...
The more distactions we allow ourselves to indulge in, the worse things get.

It is a viscious cycle.

The irony of the situation is the artists are often outside society looking in and trying to show people what is wrong with the way things are. heh

Mephura

06-09-03, 08:42 PM

Originally posted by gendanken

The local grade schooler will recognize 'pretty things' and 'decorations' to mean art. This post was clearly aimed at quashing aesthetics.

Actually, sometimes functionality can be quite aestheticly pleasing. Sleek curves for aerodynamics for example. Also, I'm pretty sure your local grade schooler could tell the difference between a ribbon in someone's hair and the mona lisa. If not I feel bad for the school system in your parts.

you're wanting to either mince words or churn out a duel with semantics.

Well, semantics are rather important if you want to be understood clearly. Perhaps I should take a look at mine, since you aren't seeing what I was trying to present.

This clearly refutes your claims of taking 'decorations or art to be anything but utilitarian'.

By utilitarian I mean being designed with an intended use. Sure i can use a rock to drvie a nail, but was the rock designed with this purpose in mind? Decorations/art have a purpose, but most aren't made with the idea of "i think i will create something to distract men from their girlfriends whining".

Want to beat about pragmatism? utilitatarianism? constructivism? heredity vs. environment? Gratuity never fails to rear its head in a man dying to see blood spilt. If so, start you a new thread and don't mow through at as you did .

I don't want to see blood spilt, I was just trying to show an alternate view on things. Why is it that you woul try to sensor a different way of looking at things?

Why not just give me five minutes to get over the shock of actually meeting a live man on the rag?

Now that was rather cruel. I would love to hear the 'evidence' on that one.

A XXXX XXXX? So cursing in French now makes this IXL777ish insult somehow more creative than calling me cunt?
Actually, it was XX XXXXXX XXXX XXXX, and I meant not so much as an insult, but rather as a diminutive show of affection. See I rather do enjoy the discussions, when you make a point.:D

One Raven good call

gendanken

06-09-03, 09:42 PM

Now that was rather cruel. I would love to hear the 'evidence' on that one.

Nary a thing I've said you can call cruel with a post 2 steps up (the 'ahem' one) to cover my bases.

Actually, it was my little shit head, and I meant not so much as an insult, but rather as a diminutive show of affection

So on mummy's deathbed you're going to tell her how much you've always loved your little shit head, meaning hers?

Mephura

06-09-03, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by gendanken
Nary a thing I've said you can call cruel with a post 2 steps up (the 'ahem' one) to cover my bases.

Ok, I'll accept that.

So on mummy's deathbed you're going to tell her how much you've always loved your little xxxx xxxx, meaning hers?
Probably not. I never have gotten along that well with my mother.
Besides, the way it is phrased: xx xxxxxx xxxx xxxx'', shows possessiveness in the same way my friend, of my enemy. That kind of possessiveness is taken (generally) to show somekind of relationship or bond. Also little, in many forms and languages, is often used to show affection. LIke a parent to a child or a teacher to a student. (Its ok little one, I understand that you missunderstood me)

And, to tell the truth, the last person I used it on was one of my ex-girlfriends. I just thought it would be a nice way to end the post.

one_raven

06-09-03, 11:43 PM

Originally posted by Mephura
One Raven good call

Thank you

gendanken

06-09-03, 11:45 PM

Probably not. I never have gotten along that well with my mother.

Never have I. She can suck a fat one and so can my sibling.

Also little, in many forms and languages, is often used to show affection. LIke a parent to a child or a teacher to a student.

Not so. It only applies if you use the diminuitive term common in latin languages. Example being:

hermano - brother
hermanito- little brother

or

pobre- poor
pobresito- oh you poor, poor little thing!

World of difference. That's endearing.Far cry from your "litte shit", no?

And, to tell the truth, the last person I used it on was one of my ex-girlfriends. I just thought it would be a nice way to end the post.

So your permission in using it is granted if only you're nailing her. Or if she's so low in the rung that she's actually o.k. with you calling her, of all things, not only your shit but a small one.