Do you love or hate the US ?

[terrafutan]

Originally posted by heflores
...how could we turn so quickly from being a nation loved by all (Days of JFK) to a nation hated by all.
Very interesting question by heflores.

My question would be why ? Why is it that there is a growing anti-us feeling in the world ?

Has this something to do with the US fingers in so many 'pies' ?

What can the US do to counter the anti-us sentiment that is rising ?

What do you that live in the US feel about this ?

Are the following quotes representitive of a general US 'feeling of superiority' ?

Originally posted by Clockwood
We are, self appointed or not, the worlds policeman. Some say its not our business.
Originally posted by Dinosaur
You bastards who hate Americans are jealous because you know in your hearts that we are smarter, more competent, and have better ethics than you do.

So do you love or hate the US ?

[Americano]

Black and white again? with us or with them again?

:eek: :bugeye:

[Talon GrimSpire]

This was written about six months ago.

No matter what your views on President Bush's statement of upcoming war, this, from an English journalist, is very interesting. Just a word of background, for those of you who aren't familiar with the UK's Daily Mirror. This is a notoriously left-wing daily that is normally not supportive of the Colonials across the Atlantic.

Tony Parsons
Daily Mirror
September 11, 2002

ONE year ago, the world witnessed a unique kind of broadcasting --the mass murder of thousands, live on television. As a lesson in the pitiless cruelty of the human race, September 11 was up there with Pol Pot's mountain of Skulls in Cambodia, or the skeletal bodies stacked like garbage in the Nazi concentration camps. An unspeakable act so cruel, so calculated and so utterly merciless that surely the world could agree on one thing -nobody deserves this fate. Surely there could be consensus: the victims were truly innocent, the perpetrators truly evil. But to the world's eternal shame, 9/11 is increasingly seen as America's comeuppance.

Incredibly, anti-Americanism has increased over the last year. There has always been a simmering resentment to the USA in this country - too loud, too rich, too full of themselves and so much happier than Europeans- but it has become an epidemic. And it seems incredible to me. More than that, it turns my stomach.

America is this country's greatest friend and our staunchest ally. We are bonded to the US by culture, language and blood. A little over half a century ago, around half a million Americans died for our freedoms, as well as their own. Have we forgotten so soon? And exactly a year ago, thousands of ordinary men, women and children - not just Americans, but from dozens of countries - were butchered by a small group of religious fanatics.

Are we so quick to betray them?

What touched the heart about those who died in the twin towers and on the planes was that we recognized them. Young fathers and mothers, somebody's son and somebody's daughter, husbands and wives, and children, some unborn. And these people brought it on themselves? And their nation is to blame or their meticulously planned slaughter?

These days you don't have to be some dust-encrusted nut job in Kabul or Karachi or Finsbury Park to see America as the Great Satan.

The anti-American alliance is made up of self-loathing liberals who blame the Americans for every ill in the Third World, and conservatives suffering from power-envy, bitter that the world's only superpower can do what it likes without having to ask permission.

The truth is that America has behaved with enormous restraint since September 11.
Remember, remember.
Remember the gut-wrenching tapes of weeping men phoning their wives to say, "I love you," before they were burned alive.
Remember those people leaping to their deaths from the top of burning skyscrapers.
Remember the hundreds of firemen buried alive.
Remember the smiling face of that beautiful little girl who was on one of the planes with her mum.
Remember, - and realize that America has never retaliated for 9/11 in anything like the way it could have.

So a al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex...
So some Afghan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes? A shame, but maybe next time they should stick to confetti.

AMERICA could have turned a large chunk of the world into a parking lot. That it didn't is a sign of strength. American voices are already being raised against attacking Iraq - that's what a democracy is for.

How many in the Islamic world will have a minute's silence for the slaughtered innocents of 9/11?
How many Islamic leaders will have the guts to say that the mass murder of 9/11 was an abomination?
When the news of 9/11 broke on the West Bank, those freedom-loving Palestinians were dancing in the street.
America watched all of that - and didn't push the button.

We should thank the stars that America is the most powerful nation in the world. I still find it incredible that 9/11 did not provoke all-out war. Not a "war on terrorism." A real war.

The fundamentalist dudes are talking about "opening the gates of hell," if America attacks Iraq.
Well, America could have opened the gates of hell like you wouldn't believe. The US is the most militarily powerful nation that ever strode the face of the earth. The campaign in Afghanistan may have been less than perfect and the planned war on Iraq may be misconceived. But don't blame America for not bringing peace and light to these wretched countries. How many democracies are there in the Middle East, or in the Muslim world? You can count them on the fingers of one hand assuming you haven't had any chopped off for minor shoplifting.

I love America, yet America is hated. I guess that makes me Bush's poodle.

But I would rather be a dog in New York City than a Prince in Riyadh.

Above all, America is hated because it is what every country wants to be - rich, free, strong, open, optimistic. Not ground down by the past, or religion, or some caste system. America is the best friend this country ever had and we should start remembering that. Or do you really think the USA is the root of all evil?
Tell it to the loved ones of the men and women who leaped to their death from the burning towers.
Tell it to the nursing mothers whose husbands died on one of the hijacked planes, or were ripped apart in a collapsing skyscraper.
And tell it to the hundreds of young widows whose husbands worked for the New York Fire Department.

To our shame, George Bush gets a worse press than Saddam Hussein. Once we were told that Saddam gassed the Kurds, tortured his own people and set up rape-camps in Kuwait. Now we are told he likes Quality Street. Save me the orange center, oh mighty one!

Remember, remember, September 11. One of the greatest atrocities in human history was committed against America.

No, do more than remember. Never forget!!!

[heflores]

I don't think that people hate America because of jealously of our style of life. They hate America's arrogance, America's hypocracy, ect. I'm not going to say that America used to be a white lamb, but we did a better job hiding our dirty laundry from the world. The face of America is changing, and our face have undergone plastic surgery. We have went from diplomats, good atheletes, professionals, doers of good -----to war mongers and cowboys with disregard to all others.

America needs a good strong politician bad, or our picture will keep detriorating.

[dkb218]

How many in the Islamic world will have a minute's silence for the slaughtered innocents of 9/11?
How many Islamic leaders will have the guts to say that the mass murder of 9/11 was an abomination?
When the news of 9/11 broke on the West Bank, those freedom-loving Palestinians were dancing in the street.
America watched all of that - and didn't push the button.

I wonder did the writer of this article give a seconds silence to the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF IRAQI CHILDERN murdered because of UN {USA} sactions? It's really phucked up in my view when we want the whole world to love us as a country yet we are the cause of most of the worlds problems. Americans are for the most part arrogant to the point of stupid. Yes 9/11 was bad but the crimes that go on by this country on a daily basis is worst. I marvel at the fact that we haven't been nuked yet. Evil only begets evil.

[Joeman]

Saddam is the cause of UN sanction. No Saddam no sanction.

[heflores]

I hate those circle pointing fingers debates. If America needs to have a moment of silence for the Iraqi peope, they shouldn't be requesting in return a moment of silence for the 911 vicitims. Plus, we have had so many moments of silence for 911 victims, it's enough. Americans that think that they can ignore the whole world just because they're hiding behind an ocean are wrong and short sighted. There is nothing patriotic about destroying relatioship with other countries that we need.

[dkb218]

Originally posted by Joeman
Saddam is the cause of UN sanction. No Saddam no sanction.

The USA is the reason behind the sanctions. No USA, no sanctions. Works both ways.

[heflores]

I'm supposed to go visit my sister in Turkey, and I'm being told that my government does not recommend travel.....For how long I ask...I'm not given an answer. What do I do?

I have duel citizenships, so I can use my Egyptian passport to travel and hide my US passport.

What are US citizens supposed to do if they have to travel to the middle east to visit family or for business or to Europe?
I don't think that our arrogant government considers US safety overseas.

As far as to the question of whether people hate or love US. I'd say, international people all hate the US. and it's sad.

[Joeman]

It amazes me how many people are so quick to blame their own country like other countries can do no wrong.

[heflores]

Originally posted by Joeman
It amazes me how many people are so quick to blame their own country like other countries can do no wrong.

What are you so amazed about? Can US citizens do something to make other countries better? No....But we can sure do a lot to make sure we're better. We have only control regarding ourselves and our actions. Believe me, US foreign policy sucks and is completely wrong and will drive US down far down......If you got any patriotic bone in your body, I'd say, you have to join the right team and speak in corrective terms about it, or stay wtih the current team and rally US on to more problems.

[Kunax]

heflores first post sums most of it up pretty good, also terrafutan second quote in varius form is a good reason for it.

i dont hate the usa, but i most defintly dont respect them eather.

[dkb218]

Originally posted by Joeman
It amazes me how many people are so quick to blame their own country like other countries can do no wrong.

You must be one of those "Either your with me or against me" people. No one said other countries can do no wrong. We are not closed minded.

Because we see things that this country does on the name of Globalization and we are willing to call attention to it, does not mean that we either love or hate the US. If anything, I feel that people who are willing to call the monster a monster are the real Americans. Those who listen and believe everything the monster says are mere sheep ready to be lead to the slaughter. You've got to open up that beautiful brain in your head and see the world as it is not as people wanna make it look.

[Kunax]

this is the first forum(i been on every thing from games to linux tech forums) i have been on where US people is actually critical about there goverment, wierd at first but most refreashing.

[terrafutan]

It isnt supposed to be a 'either your with me or against me' scenario, and it has little to do with current events in Iraq. This anti stuff has been around for as long as I've been alive.

I was looking for the reasons why ?

Someone mentioned the foreign policy sucks, but this is not a new policy, this has been ongoing.

So my question is; was there a point that was reached to 'turn the tide' so to speak ? or was it something like 40 years of policy that caused it.

[Aldah]

I wonder did the writer of this article give a seconds silence to the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF IRAQI CHILDERN murdered because of UN {USA} sactions? Yes 9/11 was bad but the crimes that go on by this country on a daily basis is worst. I marvel at the fact that we haven't been nuked yet..

You don't understand nuclear deterrence then?

I didn't know the US kills 3 thousands people everyday... could you back this up with some statistics?

So, in your mind the gunmaker is the murderer, and not the one who used the gun?

[dkb218]

I'm not sure if it was a certain point reached {if so, it was during the Clinton Administration}. I think its a few million people saying enough is enough. Maybe they saw the way the west has been forcing "reforms" on South American countries and would just perfer to go a different route.

Maybe it was the Palenstian issue. Maybe the habit of the USA to support dictator type regimes. Someone did a study and found that countries with the worst human rights violations recieve the highest amounts of US Aid. People like Suddam, Suharto, whoever is in charge in Columbia, are friends of the USA. It's been US policy for many years to put dictators in office in order to keep the people in line. You want a union, you die. You want programs to help the poor, you die. You want healthcare, you die. The idea is to remove all the profits for a country. Damn the people. Dictators are paid very well to kill and oppress there people in order for big business to maximize profit. Can't have the people getting in the way.

The policies of this country are not thought up by our elected officials and are surely not meant to ensure the happiness of the people. Policy is made an the whim of Big Business. George Bush and the US military are nothing more than an enforcement arm of big global business. Nothing more. If looked at in that context, you may discover why things in this world happen as they do.

[dsdsds]

Originally posted by Aldah
You don't understand nuclear deterrence then?

I didn't know the US kills 3 thousands people everyday... could you back this up with some statistics?

So, in your mind the gunmaker is the murderer, and not the one who used the gun?

killed not by guns or swords, but by pen.

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19483

[Coldrake]

I love my nation, but that doesn't mean I can't or won't recognize significant problems. As a Vietnam veteran I'm well aware of the perception that an unpopular war leaves on both the domestic populace and the world at large. And since the collapse of the USSR the US has become the sole hegemony, and as a believer in the realist theory of politics I'm aware of the dangers of unchecked power. I'm waiting to see what alliance comes about in this era to create the balance to check US hegemony. Political need makes strange bedfellows and I'm curious to see what kind of an alliance emerges.

[dkb218]

Originally posted by Aldah
You don't understand nuclear deterrence then?

I didn't know the US kills 3 thousands people everyday... could you back this up with some statistics?

So, in your mind the gunmaker is the murderer, and not the one who used the gun?

I understand nuclear deterrence better it seems than you. I say give every country on the planet one nuke. That's deterrence for yo' ass!

Understand this. This country {let me revise my "this country" rhetoric - the USA as the leader in Globalization} has a way of making other peoples in other countries feel they have nothing to lose. That is very dangerous. The cold war is over. We have made a whole new bunch of people who hate this country. Who have no national boundries they care about. Sooner or later someone is gonna come up with the bright idea that in order to stop america, america has to be destroyed. I live in NYC and got to watch the 9/11 events happen 5 blocks away. This is gonna be ground zero for real if this country doesn't stop messing with people and the only way that's gonna happen is to bring to light the things we do in the dark. Gotta start questioning those folks we put in office.

On 9/12/01, people should've been asking themselves "why do so many people hate the USA. What did the USA do to these people to make them go such madness." Instead in out arrogance, we said "Those motherphuckers, how dare they do this! We'll get them for messing with us!" A nation of cowboys...


So, in your mind the gunmaker is the murderer, and not the one who used the gun?

If I believed this, I'd be a fool and a fool is not something I am. What the hell does it mean? You came up with the question. I see nothing I posted as giving you this impression. {must lobby for the NRA}

[567]

For all the morons who think that msulims hates US because they have all the freedom and money and etc etc. WHY THEY HATE US ALONE???? CANADA, Australia, England, Germany, France, and many other european nations have the same as well, but they dont' them.

How, do you explain that?

Because they don't phuck with other countries. Adopt a Live and Let Live policy. Rather then Live and Kill others who don't agree with you.

[Coldrake]

They do hate those other western nations. They hate all infidels. The US is merely the "Greatest Satan."

[terrafutan]

The problem with this is that it is broader than the Middle East.

Think Far East, Africa and South America.

Now Im a bit dim on the subject of past Presidents, but have the past few not all had some war or other to 'take care of' ?

Dkb do you have a little more info on this quote...
'Someone did a study and found that countries with the worst human rights violations recieve the highest amounts of US Aid'

thanks

[Voodoo Child]

In their defence though, they do shell out a reasonable bit of foreign aid, even if it does have strings attached.

[pillowtalk]

heflores;

you can go turkey anytime- as a turkish citizen i never met anybody who hates americans in turkey.. there are thousands of americans who lives happily in turkey..

according to almanac-modern terorism, only 2 americans killed in turkey (by arap terorists not turkish) in the last 40 years.. and 30.000 turkish killed by kurdish terorists- which US welcomes and gives citizienship immediately if you say you are kurdish who lives in turkey- again an example of US do not give shit and opens its arms to some terorists as long as these terorists works for its own benefit and kills other countries people..

anyway, there is a big difference between US-citizens and nonUS-citizens.. as a US citizen, its very easy to label all palestanians or afgans as terrorists just because there were some terorist in that countries.. in other countries, people may not like your governments actions but that does not mean neither people label you as terorist nor hate you. today, although many turkish people lost their friends, relatives at terorist actions, they still do NOT hate kurds for example.. and many of them try to understand the reasons which pushed them to be terorist. do you imagine an american who does not hate Osama Bin Laden and sympatize him because of the reasons which pushed him to be a terorist? since people over there got used to not to see things as black and white, they are much more open-minded, believe me ..

and Coldrake, you should read some Amin Maalouf if you really want to learn what Araps feel towards other nations..he is a brilliant historian with Arap- Catholic and european background..

[Helen]

Originally posted by terrafutan
Very interesting question by heflores.

My question would be why ? Why is it that there is a growing anti-us feeling in the world ?

Has this something to do with the US fingers in so many 'pies' ?

What can the US do to counter the anti-us sentiment that is rising ?

What do you that live in the US feel about this ?

Are the following quotes representitive of a general US 'feeling of superiority' ?

So do you love or hate the US ?


I HATE YOU TO DEATH, I HAT EVERYTHING AMERICA STAND FOR, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU SUPPORT TERRORISM ( ISRAEL ).

BEING CHRISTIAN ARAB, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU SUPPORT OUR DICTATORS, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU KILL MY MUSLIM BROTHERS AND SISTERS EVERYWHERE.

I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE ARROGANT, PATHETIC AND FILLED WITH SELF-ILLUSION.

WAKE UP.............THE WORLD NOT ONLY THE ARABS HATE YOU.

IT IS THE TIME TO ASK YOURSELF: WHY ?? DONT WAIT ANSWERS FROM OTHERS, SEARCH WITHIN YOURSELF.

[Helen]

Originally posted by Coldrake
They do hate those other western nations. They hate all infidels. The US is merely the "Greatest Satan."

UTTER BULLSHITE, I am christian arab, I live with Muslims, they DONT HATE THE WEST as such, they hate America TO DEATH and me included.

MOST CHRISTIAN ARABS HATE AMERICA TOO, so it is not only muslims, it is christians too.

the hate of america is not unique to muslims, go anywhere in the world and you will see how much america is hated.

[Asguard]

why do people in the WEST hate the US?

not just musliams, not cominists, WESTERNERS

fortunatly for you MOST westerners seperate the goverment from the people but if bush is relected then quite frankly you have shown the world that this is what you WANT and you cant hide behind that anymore

things like breaches of international trade laws in regard to unfair tarifs

surport of child exploitation

surport of ridiculassly low wages paid to workers in other countrys

dont fool yourselves that this is companys
the goverment could put a stop to it with ONE act saying that all companys paying US taxes, all companys on the US stock exchange or all products sold in the US must conform to US labor laws even if they are in other countys

will they?

then there are things like the US stock piling Nukes, chemical weapons, bio weapons while being the "gardian of justice" to everyone else

the US not surporting the ICC unless it is excempt from US citizens (the HIGHT of hipocrasy)

list goes on

[Helen]

Originally posted by Coldrake
They do hate those other western nations. They hate all infidels. The US is merely the "Greatest Satan."

AMERICAN FLAG BURNING ALL OVER THE WORLD:

http://www.immigration-usa.com/flags/new8/flag_burning_1.html

[Psycho-Cannon]

The list of why America is hated is so long i can't be bothered with the essay it would take.

The most obvious are:

Government - The policy of the government to support dictatorships and interfere with other countries in order to gain for America at the cost of the world.
American policy full of Hypocracy and Ignorance in Dictating to the world what is and isn't wrong, what they can and can't do but making itself expempt from those rules, the ICC, WMD.
Their horrendous state of living in the country that is getting worse, the massive attacks on Social welfare etc.
Their support or at least refusing to deal with so many issues like child labour / slavery and the such like becase it would interfere the proposed sollutions interfere with American policy, underage subscription to the millitary etc.

The Death penalty and the corruption in that system.
The Corruption in american big business that seems to be so well rewarded, even looks good on a CV when going for a job in the White house.

American Society - A lot of Americans laugh at how "other countries" have propganda to brain wash its "Stupid people".
Many of you have no idea how isolationist and narrow minded the "news" you get in America is.
Its no wonder so many Americans are sterotyped as being ignorant, arrogant, and "holier than thou" which really rubs people off all over the world.
Not because "you are better than us" but because you seem to belive it so much and like it seems rubbing it in peoples faces :bugeye:.
I mean ask most brits what an American is like when you meet one visting the UK and "Loud" and "Arrogant" pop up a hell of a lot.
Its a shame because i know a lot of damn nice Americans but a any group in the world gets sterotyped and thats the one Americans have and many seem determened to enforce.

The "Lawsuit culture" is a joke around the world.
Those that laugh at how the "world hates them because they are smarter"....should realise that whilst they have a lot of the worlds greatest minds, a lot of these are "imported" drawn by the wealth and benefits of America, America in general has such a poor rate of litteracy and higher employment that it makes this claim a sick joke by an ignorant mind.

Of course again so many dont seem to be willing to open their eyes to the rest of the world, they seem so isolationist, Everything that happens to them has no historical or even current context it happens "because" like terrorists in the East hate America because they are so powerful..it has nothing to do with the interfernace, betrayaly and death inflicted on them in years of US policy....
The West that hate them do so for the same reasons...so its nothign to do with the way America constantly undermines International and even independant countries efforts to do..pretty much anything...the way it acts so arrogantly threatining anyone they want....
The American reputation in Britain of managing to inflict more Freindly Fire Casualties on us in any war we enter with them than the Enemy and Ourselves put together is well earned and still going strong....

I dont hate America, but the American policies, and the arrogance of a lot of people i've met but then you get that anywhere in the world, but this is all reaching a head now.
With this war on Iraq and promising to move onto the rest of the world, soon all the other nations are going to have to face upto the fact that leaving America as the only super power to wallow in its own superiority complexs has been a mistake.
The world needs balance thats how it works.
Soon the world is going to have to face this, and America will have to face itself and the world and lets pray we all come out of this for the better.

[heflores]

Originally posted by Helen
AMERICAN FLAG BURNING ALL OVER THE WORLD:

http://www.immigration-usa.com/flags/new8/flag_burning_1.html

Why don't you send us a picture of yourself burning the flag bitch....I also need your address... You better not be living in the US you hypocrite, wearing any American cloth, typing on an american computer, driving an american car, reading an American text book, ect......

Ms Hypocrite must have not gotten a good old spanking from her arabic dad to understand real life.

[heflores]

Originally posted by 567
For all the morons who think that msulims hates US because they have all the freedom and money and etc etc. WHY THEY HATE US ALONE???? CANADA, Australia, England, Germany, France, and many other european nations have the same as well, but they dont' them.

How, do you explain that?

Because they don't phuck with other countries. Adopt a Live and Let Live policy. Rather then Live and Kill others who don't agree with you.

Where have you been my friend. Germany???? wanting to invade the whole world? Don't you know that US never occupied a country, while your England and France occupied the whole WORLD, sucked the resources, treated homeland citizens as slaves.....what....England and France are lambs now. You must not have studied arabic history, because all our revolutions and wars are againest europe. Also, England was the one who gave Palestine to Israel.

US is the best superpower that the world have ever experienced. When China or an arab state is in control, we'll guage the performance of the US then.

[~The_Chosen~]

America is the best and most talked about country on this forum. It the #1 country to bash.

The thing with humans are they tend to recognize the flaws immediately first.

No country can compare to America, the ideal nation. :D

[Kunax]

America is the best and most talked about country on this forum. It the #1 country to bash.

The thing with humans are they tend to recognize the flaws immediately first.

No country can compare to America, the ideal nation.

aaah yes i see the light now, we must all bow down to the suprem nation United States of America, how can i have been so wrong, how can i have over look the true and rightious power of the US.

i bow down, then turn 180° and moon ya. :)

[dkb218]

Originally posted by heflores
Why don't you send us a picture of yourself burning the flag bitch....I also need your address... You better not be living in the US you hypocrite, wearing any American cloth, typing on an american computer, driving an american car, reading an American text book, ect......

Ms Hypocrite must have not gotten a good old spanking from her arabic dad to understand real life.

Wow! That was kinda harsh!

[dkb218]

[i]US is the best superpower that the world have ever experienced. When China or an arab state is in control, we'll guage the performance of the US then. [/B]


What, to you, makes the USA the "Best superpower that the world have ever experienced"?

[heflores]

Originally posted by dkb218
What, to you, makes the USA the "Best superpower that the world have ever experienced"?

I think so.....Here's your choices of other superpowers in competition with USA performance.

1- Great Britain
2- France
3- Ottoman Empire
4- The mongols under Ghigis Khan
5- The germans under Hitler.

I pronounce USA the winner by far. They never occupied any countries or acted in anyway like the countries above.

[heflores]

Originally posted by Helen
I HATE YOU TO DEATH, I HAT EVERYTHING AMERICA STAND FOR, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU SUPPORT TERRORISM ( ISRAEL ).

IT IS THE TIME TO ASK YOURSELF: WHY ?? DONT WAIT ANSWERS FROM OTHERS, SEARCH WITHIN YOURSELF.

I forgot to mention this to Ms. Hypocrite, beside throwing off your amrican computer, American cloth, ect.

Stop talking and typing in English....English is the language of United States and Britain.....Although, it seems that the arabs try to look cool and speak English.

So Helen Hypocrite, refrain from using the language of your enemy. Start speaking arabic or Ordo....We don't want you using our language.

[Kunax]

1- Great Britain
2- France
3- Ottoman Empire
4- The mongols under Ghigis Khan
5- The germans under Hitler.

how about

6- Romance
7- Vikings
8- The Empire of Alexander The great
9- the ancient egyptians
10- acteck
11-the varies chinece dynasties

[heflores]

good ones Kunax,

Now do you all see how beautifull is the US and how humble is the US acting as the superpower?

US is truly a kind giant that the world have never seen or will ever see it's likes.

[heflores]

Originally posted by Kunax
aaah yes i see the light now, we must all bow down to the suprem nation United States of America, how can i have been so wrong, how can i have over look the true and rightious power of the US.

i bow down, then turn 180° and moon ya. :)

Kunax, I understand your peacefull jesture of mooning a supporter to US. Afterall, you propably tried to get a visa so many times and got turned down because the FBI have pictures of your ass from all traffic cameras.

[Coldrake]

Originally posted by Helen
I HATE YOU TO DEATH, I HAT EVERYTHING AMERICA STAND FOR, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU SUPPORT TERRORISM ( ISRAEL ).

BEING CHRISTIAN ARAB, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU SUPPORT OUR DICTATORS, I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU KILL MY MUSLIM BROTHERS AND SISTERS EVERYWHERE.

I HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE ARROGANT, PATHETIC AND FILLED WITH SELF-ILLUSION.

WAKE UP.............THE WORLD NOT ONLY THE ARABS HATE YOU.

IT IS THE TIME TO ASK YOURSELF: WHY ?? DONT WAIT ANSWERS FROM OTHERS, SEARCH WITHIN YOURSELF.

And to think that I was considering buying you a puppy. Well, no way now, Sista!:p

[dkb218]

Originally posted by heflores
good ones Kunax,

Now do you all see how beautifull is the US and how humble is the US acting as the superpower?

US is truly a kind giant that the world have never seen or will ever see it's likes.

I see a different US. A US that creates, backs and supports brutal dictator regimes [Iran, Iraqi, Turkey, Columbia, Israel, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Indonesia, etc]. One that has vetoed every chance of the Palestinian people getting a state.

Yes, people say that we are the best country in the world and to tell you the truth, I really can't say I believe it. Looking at the suface, one would have to agree with that statement but once you get inside the heart of the beast, I think - I know you'll find a very different USA.

[heflores]

Dear dkb218,
USA is the best superpower that the world has experienced. I didn't say they are god and all perfect and will solve all the problems of the world. You have to understand that concept that US is not perfect and no nation is ever....Politics and people relations are extremely difficult games. Afterall, the Egyptians were the one who killed Saddat after he gave them their land back. The indians were the ones who killed Ghandy. The Americans were the ones who killed Martin Luther and Malcolm X. So if life is so damn complicated, why do you expect US to solve all the world problems.

Life is a test and it's short. It's not meant to be a walk in the park.

[dkb218]

Originally posted by heflores
Now do you all see how beautifull is the US and how humble is the US acting as the superpower?

US is truly a kind giant that the world have never seen or will ever see it's likes.

You know, sometimes I really think you live in a magical frairy land full of pixies and elfs. Orange sherbet waterfalls. Rainbows that rain Starbrust fruit chews. I would love to live there myself but for some reason, I was made to wake up!

[heflores]

well, somehow, I think you're a neat person from your posts, but then I also wake up when I read your responces to me.

What did I say in my last post exactly that was rosy pixies? I'm very realistic person, and people around me say that I'm extremelly efficient. Maybe, it's not me with the pink veil, and that you are the one with gloomy doomsday prespective.

From your shoes dkb218, you will never make a step forward, because you insist on trapping the arguments in historical problems, that you become unable to launch yourself forward. The future is untaped territory that may be hopefull, so don't go dwelling on past crimes or in convicting people of crimes that have not been commited yet

[Kunax]

Kunax, I understand your peacefull jesture of mooning a supporter to US. Afterall, you propably tried to get a visa so many times and got turned down because the FBI have pictures of your ass from all traffic cameras.

lol, i can get a visa if i want to(i have another card), i have free helth care, free education, we have less censure then the US and even more free speach, if i was to lose my job i can get financial support until i find a new one.

actually when thinking about it like that, i find my contry superior to the US, on many points.
yet i dont need to tell everybody how much they suck compare to us.

also i find it scary that the FBI should have picture of my ass, but perhaps they are converting to a gay website.... i want my pictures back NOW:)

the Roman Empire was a far better empire the US. Then they invented backstabing, whcih the US has taking to them as there own.

[heflores]

Not the roman empire. They were really bad. When those guys occupied Egypt, they didn't even bother pay the Egyptians for the wheat, they just put it all on the ships and there they go.

Then as far as religion, they first ordered the death of Jesus, then later tortured the world in becoming catholics. Comeon Now....US doing much better than that.

[dkb218]

Originally posted by heflores
well, somehow, I think you're a neat person from your posts, but then I also wake up when I read your responces to me.

What did I say in my last post exactly that was rosy pixies? I'm very realistic person, and people around me say that I'm extremelly efficient. Maybe, it's not me with the pink veil, and that you are the one with gloomy doomsday prespective.

From your shoes dkb218, you will never make a step forward, because you insist on trapping the arguments in historical problems, that you become unable to launch yourself forward. The future is untaped territory that may be hopefull, so don't go dwelling on past crimes or in convicting people of crimes that have not been commited yet

I would love to move into the future and just forget the past. Just act like everything is A-O-K and enjoy my 3 BMW's and 16 bedroom mansion but for some reason I'm just too stupid to let it be.

I've been told before that I have a gloomy doomsday type of thinking happening with me. Thats cool - somebodies gotta do it. But let me ask you this what future crimes did I speak of? The crimes that did take place are very recent - some still going on today as we speak.

[heflores]

Tomorrow, I'm a government employee that doesn't touch computers past 4:00pm....Not to imply that I work before 4:00pm.:D

[Kunax]

i dont know how much contact the romance had with jesus, except from movie and bible stories(reliable source ! :) ), imo they should have wacked him sooner.
still they managed to make a huge empire, before crumbling to the mighty fists of greed and stupidity.

get this, i also find the Mongol Horde better, ok there are many horror stories about them, but that has proberly has somthing to do with there join or die policy.
they did manage to unit asia, and kick the ass's of som of the elite europea armys.

[Kunax]

wierd double post, delete if possible

[pillowtalk]

''US is the best superpower that the world have ever experienced. When China or an arab state is in control, we'll guage the performance of the US then.''

its for sure, as an american US is the best superpower..but believe me for a palestanian, for a iraqi (who maybe just now crying in front of his kids dead bodies), for a vietnamiese, for a irani ,for a russian, for a kuwaiti,for chinese, for a Lebanesse, argentine etc..(-the list is really long ) US is no good at all- you should see ''bowling for columbine'' just a get a little bit taste of it..

as a jew, who lost grandparents at german camps, i appreciate US , BUT.. today, if the EXACT SAME THING HAPPENING TO PALESTANIANS and US is supporting this, thats erasing all my appreciation..

you guys should be more open-minded.. you can not evaluate the world as black and white..

[biblthmp]

Because envy/jealousy can produce stron emotions. We are a very prosperous nation, because of Capitalism, and Democracy, and rather than change their systems to match ours, they would rather try to destroy ours.

If the whole world switched to Capitalism and Democracy, it would bw a much more prosperous place for all involved.

Also, many muslims are realizing that Islam is a failed religious system, but they would rather fight, than switch.

[biblthmp]

Because envy/jealousy can produce stron emotions. We are a very prosperous nation, because of Capitalism, and Democracy, and rather than change their systems to match ours, they would rather try to destroy ours.

If the whole world switched to Capitalism and Democracy, it would bw a much more prosperous place for all involved.

Also, many muslims are realizing that Islam is a failed religious system, but they would rather fight, than switch.

[567]

Originally posted by biblthmp
.

Also, many muslims are realizing that Islam is a failed religious system, but they would rather fight, than switch. \\\



Ahhh.. finally you said it.........you couldn't waste a moment ..........LOL haha. So the world should become christian and bow to to St.Peter Not Jesus BUT PETER. If you can only understand me. lol. Be a christian and don't follow the evil religions of the world. LOL

Peacefull christian like hitler, or trueamn who happened to killed 200000 civilian or a true peacefull christians who started all the world wars and vietnam and korea. So, i see what true peacefull religion stand for. How, about true christian who killed many in the medevil wars of christians vs christians? or Crusades? LOL.. so much for sucessful religion.
:bugeye:

[biblthmp]

Originally posted by 567
\\\



Ahhh.. finally you said it.........you couldn't waste a moment ..........LOL haha. So the world should become christian and bow to to St.Peter Not Jesus BUT PETER. If you can only understand me. lol. Be a christian and don't follow the evil religions of the world. LOL

Peacefull christian like hitler, or trueamn who happened to killed 200000 civilian or a true peacefull christians who started all the world wars and vietnam and korea. So, i see what true peacefull religion stand for. How, about true christian who killed many in the medevil wars of christians vs christians? or Crusades? LOL.. so much for sucessful religion.
:bugeye:

I have no idea what you are talking about, concering fighting for Peter, not Jesus?

Hitler was a worshipper of Nichtze nihilism, and just used Luther, where it proved convienient.
Viet Nam was a war of Atheistic communism overthrowing Christianity, not the other way around.
The crusades were just plain ignorance on the part of the participants.
Truman nuked Japan to save the lives of thousands of American soldiers, who would have died in a land battle for Japan.

So are you saying that Islam is more peaceful than Christianity. If you are, you are way off base.

[biblthmp]

Originally posted by dkb218
I see a different US. A US that creates, backs and supports brutal dictator regimes [Iran, Iraqi, Turkey, Columbia, Israel, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Indonesia, etc]. One that has vetoed every chance of the Palestinian people getting a state.

Yes, people say that we are the best country in the world and to tell you the truth, I really can't say I believe it. Looking at the suface, one would have to agree with that statement but once you get inside the heart of the beast, I think - I know you'll find a very different USA.

I am afraid, that you are quite deluded. Israel is a democratic government, with an elected prime minister, that answers to his parliment. You must have confused Palestine, with Israel, when it comes to dictators.

[You Killed Jesus]

The USA is a nation that promotes judeo-christian egalitarian beleifs. Why would I like it?

[SuperFudd]

Because it is currently the best way to go.

[You Killed Jesus]

Originally posted by SuperFudd
Because it is currently the best way to go.

I'd say otherwise.

[biblthmp]

Originally posted by You Killed Jesus
I'd say otherwise.

So what is the best way to go? Oh brilliant one? (note severe sarcasm)

[You Killed Jesus]

Originally posted by biblthmp
So what is the best way to go? Oh brilliant one? (note severe sarcasm)

Fascism, obviously. A cascading meritocratic hierarchy would be put in place so that people with actual cognitive abilities have more political power while those who don't get, well, none. As well, seperate nationalities & races since things tend to work more smoothly in a culturally and genetically homogenous area. I would also have industry & business semi-privatized so that the governing body would be able to keep out degenerate or unintelligent or Judeo-Christian media, as well as to keep people from doing stupid things with toxic chemicals.

[biblthmp]

Originally posted by You Killed Jesus
Fascism, obviously. A cascading meritocratic hierarchy would be put in place so that people with actual cognitive abilities have more political power while those who don't get, well, none. As well, seperate nationalities & races since things tend to work more smoothly in a culturally and genetically homogenous area. I would also have industry & business semi-privatized so that the governing body would be able to keep out degenerate or unintelligent or Judeo-Christian media, as well as to keep people from doing stupid things with toxic chemicals.

Shall we call it the forth reich? little mr. Hitler?

[Helen]

Originally posted by heflores
Why don't you send us a picture of yourself burning the flag bitch....I also need your address... You better not be living in the US you hypocrite, wearing any American cloth, typing on an american computer, driving an american car, reading an American text book, ect......

Ms Hypocrite must have not gotten a good old spanking from her arabic dad to understand real life.

I am not living in the United Snakes of shite and terrorism nor I am using any filthy american products.

In fact, since the war started, I cut off my American express card and threw it in the pin.

P.S: dont forget to sign the pledge:

http://www.adbusters.org/campaigns/boycott_america/pledge.php

[Helen]

Originally posted by ~The_Chosen~
America is the best and most talked about country on this forum. It the #1 country to bash.

The thing with humans are they tend to recognize the flaws immediately first.

No country can compare to America, the ideal nation. :D

Oh yeah, this is why you have Americans who are hungry and starving just like in Africa :

http://www.hungerinamerica.org/

[spuriousmonkey]

Originally posted by Helen
I am not living in the United Snakes of shite and terrorism nor I am using any filthy american products.

In fact, since the war started, I cut off my American express card and threw it in the pin.

P.S: dont forget to sign the pledge:

http://www.adbusters.org/campaigns/boycott_america/pledge.php

was the internet invented in the US??? I hpe so, because then you have to stop using it.

[Helen]

Originally posted by spuriousmonkey
was the internet invented in the US??? I hpe so, because then you have to stop using it.

No, the Internet inventer was BRITISH. the americans then stole the idea and develop it.

Please, join our campaign, thousands already signed the pledge:

http://www.adbusters.org/campaigns/boycott_america/pledge.php

[Helen]

Originally posted by heflores
I pronounce USA the winner by far. They never occupied any countries or acted in anyway like the countries above.

Oh yeah, I think you need to read little more about the American crimes against humanity and the colorful record of American state terrorism:

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/graphics1/AmericaNaziFlag.gif

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com

[Helen]

Originally posted by heflores
I forgot to mention this to Ms. Hypocrite, beside throwing off your amrican computer, American cloth, ect.

Stop talking and typing in English....English is the language of United States and Britain.....Although, it seems that the arabs try to look cool and speak English.

So Helen Hypocrite, refrain from using the language of your enemy. Start speaking arabic or Ordo....We don't want you using our language.

I am using ENGLISH( from England ) I am not using American.

STOP USING THE ARABIC NUMBERS ( 1, 2, 3, ETC...) these are our numbers, stop using the 0, the arabs are the ones who invented the concept of Zero, without it, you wont be able to use your PC.

So, Mr. self-illusioned lost american, stop using the ARABIC NUMBERS.

[Helen]

Jubilation turns to hate as aid arrives

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,922723,00.html

[the E.M.T]

i dont know why ppl hate the US i live in it and it is not a bad life all we are doing is saving the earth from being takin over by terrisom:m:

[heflores]

Originally posted by Helen
I am using ENGLISH( from England ) I am not using American.

STOP USING THE ARABIC NUMBERS ( 1, 2, 3, ETC...) these are our numbers, stop using the 0, the arabs are the ones who invented the concept of Zero, without it, you wont be able to use your PC.

So, Mr. self-illusioned lost american, stop using the ARABIC NUMBERS.

1, 2, 3 are arabic. Are you nuts or something.....I thought Waahed Etnen Talata are arabic, and your calendar is lunar and confusing as hell and changes yearly, and for your information the zero was invented by the myans in central america. I hear Tony blair is here today like every other day, so I don't understand your love for England and using their language and hate for US. I have a suggestion, instead of bothering the hell out of us, Just go suck Saddam, Assad, Khomeiny, Mubarak, and the other corrupt filthy idiots balls. For the dead idiots, you may suck the balls on the status. I heard they're itching for a good Helen treat.....go go, and you can burn a US flag while you at it, just make sure your ovaries don't fry from the constant heat of being around fire.

[Helen]

Originally posted by Deepuz
Helen, the feeling's mutual, darling. LOL you are NUTS!

indeed: The Flag of the United snakes of shite and terrorism:

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/graphics1/AmericaNaziFlag.gif

[Helen]

Originally posted by heflores
1, 2, 3 are arabic. Are you nuts or something.....I thought Waahed Etnen Talata are arabic, and your calendar is lunar and confusing as hell and changes yearly, and for your information the zero was invented by the myans in central america.

I really pity your sheer ignorance, go and read more facts about the arab history before I burn more shitty american flags.

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/graphics1/AmericaNaziFlag.gif

[Deepuz]

I can't help but wonder who's gonna come out on top in this Arab/USA - love/hate thing. LOL the Arabs are still pretty much living in the stone age. MAybe its time to get over your hatred and try to suceed at something in the world. Stop blaming others for your own inadequacies and try to EVOLVE a little. Tee Hee.

[heflores]

Originally posted by Helen
I really pity your sheer ignorance, go and read more facts about the arab history before I burn more shitty american flags.

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/graphics1/AmericaNaziFlag.gif

I like your new flag that you are parading around. Is this the new arabic flag?

Keep burning them flag....I'm sure the stupid arabs are paying so much money to get their hand on a flag, just to burn it, and contributing to our economy and they have no clue. Go right ahead.....$5.99 a flag. How many you need??. I'll supply them....See how emotions are stupid...and the only ones that benefit from you is the Americans. You are a great American little soldier Helen. Contributing to our economy and stirring our patriotic feelings....If it wasn't for you, I'd be critizicing US.

[WasiGermany]

Originally posted by terrafutan


So do you love or hate the US ? [/B]



Kill them all ,Kill them all ,Kill them all
for every soldier there is a bullet :)

[heflores]

Originally posted by Helen
STOP USING THE ARABIC NUMBERS ( 1, 2, 3, ETC...) these are our numbers, stop using the 0, the arabs are the ones who invented the concept of Zero, without it, you wont be able to use your PC.
So, Mr. self-illusioned lost american, stop using the ARABIC NUMBERS.

Arabs didn't event the zero , you lieing sack of potatoes.. read and weep.....and I was right about the latins (The mayans) even before doing the research...so I accept my apology from you in the form of you getting the hell out of our sight.

http://www.saxakali.com/color_asp/discoverof0.htm

Although in recorded history the place-value number systems have been developed four times (by the Babylonians, Mayans, Chinese, and Hindus), and the zero concept has been evolved three times (by the Babylonians, Mayans, and Hindus), none outside of the Hindus have devised such a complete system of numerical operation. Furthermore, none outside of the Hindus evolved the zero concept to the degree that it is used as the null-value in all facets of calculation.

[heflores]

and our best friends the communist china are the ones who invented the numbers Ms. Helen...The arabs must have stole the idea 1000 years later during the time they were migrating for trade with India and china during the early Islam era....Sorry to bust your bubble, but beside the pyramids and mummies, and a whole lot of political headache, the arabs didn't contribute anything to the world....No wonder how they don't know how to use their oil.

A saudi prince, minister of transportation, was visiting the US six years ago in a technical confrence. I attended the conference and watched the idiot point to famous American bridges and say I want this one and this one......that was the extent of his knowledge, to point to the picture and say I want that one....

[xelius00]

Originally posted by terrafutan
So do you love or hate the US ?

Neither. It's just another country, full of people who love their country and themselves, just like every other country.

[dkb218]

I am afraid, that you are quite deluded. Israel is a democratic government, with an elected prime minister, that answers to his parliment. You must have confused Palestine, with Israel, when it comes to dictators.

Israel is the 2nd coming of Nazi Germany! You, Oh blind one are deluded. Wake the fuck up and see the world for what it is.

Arabs didn't event the zero , you lieing sack of potatoes.. read and weep.....and I was right about the latins (The mayans) even before doing the research...so I accept my apology from you in the form of you getting the hell out of our sight

...and you heflores! You really sicken me! I understand that you have a problem with Helen but anyone who denies her own race is less than the pile of shit you once called TAC. Your Arab? And a Muslim? Please, stop telling people you are Muslim and then talking to people the way you do. You really don't know nor do you understand Islam. And Please- Do me the favor - Never ever respond to another post I submit! :mad: Are you sure your not Jewish?!?!

I have no idea what you are talking about, concering fighting for Peter, not Jesus?

Idiot, Christians do not follow the teachings of Jesus [PBUH]. In the present form of your religion, you follow Peter. The writings of Peter. Jesus was not a Christian. Peter was a Christian. Jesus was a jew who was sent unto a lost tribe of Israel.

So are you saying that Islam is more peaceful than Christianity. If you are, you are way off base.

Are you for real? Then again, I guess you really believe all this shit you've been saying.


{now, how did I let these two idiots piss me off?}

[heflores]

Originally posted by dkb218
...and you heflores! You really sicken me! I understand that you have a problem with Helen but anyone who denies her own race is less than the pile of shit you once called TAC. Your Arab? And a Muslim? Please, stop telling people you are Muslim and then talking to people the way you do. You really don't know nor do you understand Islam. And Please- Do me the favor - Never ever respond to another post I submit! :mad: Are you sure your not Jewish?!?!


dkb218,
I'm sorry you feel that way. You have no prespective and understand no subtelty. You rush into judegement and like to play god too much for your own worth. You got it my muslim friend, I'll show restrain and refrain from attacking you on this post, and I'll make this my lost post responce to you unless you solicit my responce like you did here.

[norad]

Hooligans, all of ya! Gotta love it!

[CHRISCUNNINGHAM]

You know, Helen, you talk so much, but say so little.

Your hate for Americans may never change. But I will tell you this, if we really didn't like Iraqi people, and we really were terrorists, we would Nuke that SOB and trun it into a parking lot.

We wouldn't send you food, and we wouldn't spare civilians, YET once again, we are not terrorists raging a Holy War against the infidels. We do not use hospitals as military bases, and we don't live in mud houses..... yes there are some that are poor in our country, but that exists in ALL countries. If you think otherwise then you are clinically insane.(which wouldn't suprise me).

In your little article about "Jubilation turns to hate", I think it should be better subtitles, "Rationality turns to idiocy"

"How can we bomb and then give food and water?" the hoodlum asked.

I think a more suiting question is why we bombed military installations and not destory the entire country in one foul swoop.

I can even use the same answer for both questions....because we have morals unlike some of the people in poverty-STRICKEN countries with no way out but corruption and thoughtlessness, and weak hopes for the destruction of the infidels manifested out of disillusionment and new aspirations for self-betterment.

[Helen]

Originally posted by CHRISCUNNINGHAM
You know, Helen, you talk so much, but say so little.

Your hate for Americans may never change. But I will tell you this, if we really didn't like Iraqi people, and we really were terrorists, we would Nuke that SOB and trun it into a parking lot.



'It was an outrage, an obscenity'

http://argument.independent.co.uk/commentators/story.jsp?story=391165

[Helen]

Originally posted by norad
Hooligans, all of ya! Gotta love it!

The United snakes of crimes and terrorism:

www.americanstateterrorism.com

Enjoy the reading.

[riverline]

i dont know why ppl hate the US i live in it and it is not a bad life all we are doing is saving the earth from being takin over by terrisom

completely brain washed!!!!!!!!!!!

[Stoney.Hobbittess]

Riverline... uh, nice argument. Ha ha. Can't you say anything more or are you just going to throw out childish remarks like "I'm rubber and your glue."

[marjo]

I see a healthy discussion here. It seems to be a very civilized and fair way of airing our most important thoughts and frustrations. We all need this opportunity to vent and be heard. Thank you all.

Allow me to contribute by saying this. If all of the citizens of this earth were to treat each other as a dear and loving family would, then, maybe we could get further along. By that, I mean everyone gets a piece of the pie in as fair a way as possible. There will always be challenges and sometimes some of us will pout. I believe, though, that decisions made like this with the bigger picture in mind, will take us a long way toward healing and fairness.

I am a proud American. However, I am also ashamed at how our country handles things sometimes - my apologies to all. I hope and pray that we, the people of the world, will gain a bigger voice on these issues and not be controlled by the powerful big bullies and the extremists of the world.

Yes, I believe there is hope for all. And may "God" bless us ALL!

-your brother

[Mr. G]

Do you love or hate the US ?
Yet another instance when the US is supposed to be convinced that it must care what the little people of the planet think -- as if their self-esteem is the most important thing in all the Universe...

[darksidZz]

You see people do not like the USA because it's purely capitalist in nature now. Before in the good ole days you had manufacturers here that you'd work for and so the money thing was not so terrible, you could go into a job and not be broke. Now people see that capitalism is failing the masses and causing society in general a downturn, that's why they hate it.

The only real solution is to get some sort of new system in palce that is not purely capitalist then the world won't hate us so much and the American dream will possibly come back. Right now all moving from India to the USA gets anyone is a job at McDonalds that goes nowhere...

[Mr. G]

You see people do not like the USA because it's purely capitalist in nature now.
So, what?

You, et alia, have no natural talent for creating capitalistic wealth?

You probably have no natural talent for competing with bears for Salmon dieing at the headwaters.

Americans don't give a flying f'ck what non-Americans think of us. We're not immigrating to their homelands en masse.
...capitalism is failing the masses...
I've been self-employed for 15 years.

I am capitalism.

Capitalism fails you only because I have no reason to hire your sorry ass.

And you have no reason to hire your own sorry ass.

Not my problem.

I'm not your mommy.
The only real solution is to get some sort of new system in palce that is not purely capitalist then the world won't hate us so much and the American dream will possibly come back. Right now all moving from India to the USA gets anyone is a job at McDonalds that goes nowhere...
The world better not want us to hate it.

You're mommy put you up for adoption.

Give her credit.

[darksidZz]

Your own business ehh? Well anyway these are the words of a capitalist, they care for nothing but themselves and are ignorant of suffering around them. They truly have no compassion. That's why people hate the US

[darksidZz]

Capitalism will fail everyone in the end wise guy!

[hypewaders]

Wow, I miss some people, reading back in this thread. Some of them USAmericans, even.

I love my fucked-up country, and I realize it's made of the same know-better, know-worse stuff as any other country (it's made of PEOPLE!). We've just caught a nasty little virus. I also know that if more Americans understood and respected the meaning and spirit of our Constitution, we would be immune to our present problems, and would be leading the world by respected example, by any reasonable standard. We are the world. Bear with us/Pardon our DUst- we've just got a temporary lit...

A little case... of

of th..., of th..

of the NATZSCEEEEEEEEEZH!!!!

gak. (whew, that's better)

Now say something nice in German.

[Jozen-Bo]

I Love the US...just the 2 of us....la la la!!!

But I think you mean to ask...do you Love or hate the USA?

In that case...I Love the USA too!

[Challenger78]

It's a love/hate relationship people, Love the TV, hate the foreign policy.

[cosmictraveler]

Originally posted by heflores
...how could we turn so quickly from being a nation loved by all (Days of JFK) to a nation hated by all.

Strange that Russia didn't like the USA neither did North Vietnam and China as well as many other countries. The USA wasn't in a beauty pagent then and it isn't in one now. It wants to have as much control over other nations just as China, Russia and other countries do also. The USA is in a world of terrorists, arms dealers, cheaters, liars and frauds as is every other country on earth.

[spacemansteve]

Lets see...

I thank the USA for the following

The Submarine, Steamboat, Bifocal Lenses, Cotton Gin, Screw Propellor, Typewriter, Platform Scales, Phosphorus Match, Reaper, Electric Street Car, Telegraph, Morse Code, Vulcanized rubber, Pneumatic tire, Rotary printing press, Ether, Safety pin, Water Turbine, Refrigerator (in partner with an aussie), Elevator (with brake), Harvester, Web-fed newspaper printing press, Kinematoscope, Paper (from wood pulp, sulfite process), Air brake, Celluloid, Quadruplex telegraph, Telephone, Talking machine (phonograph), Microphone, Electric welding, Refrigerator car, Cash register, Light Bulb
(Incandescent filament), Arc lamp, Linotype, Fountain pen, Graphophone (dictating machine), AC transformer, Gramophone (disk records), Mimeograph, Monotype, Automated Electric Elevator, Adding machine (recording), Kodak camera, AC motor, Three-color camera, Gasoline automobile, Experimental airplane, Sensitized photographic paper, Airplanes, Windshield wipers, Triode amplifier tube (radio), Plastic synthesized (Bakelite), Gyroscopic compass and stabilizer, Air conditioning, Mercury-vapor lamp, Multigrid electron tube, Cracked gasoline, Heterodyne radio receiver, Automobile self-starter, Gas-filled incandescent lamp, X-ray tube, Television iconoscope, Three-way Traffic Signal, Television image dissector tube, Liquid-fuel rocket, Paints & Stains from soybeans, Bathysphere, Freon (low-boiling fluorine compounds), Neoprene (synthetic rubber), Cyclotron, Differential analyzer (analogue computer), Van de Graaff generator, Frequency modulation (FM), Nylon, Helicopter, Betatron, Xerography, Streptomycin, Digital computer electronic, Chlormycetin, Polaroid Land camera, Aureomycin, Transistor, Color television, NMR (Nuclear Magnetic Resonance), Bubble chamber (nuclear particle detector), Maser, Structure of DNA described (With the help of a pom), Solar battery, Polio vaccine, Synthetic diamonds, Carbon dating, Communications satellite, Integrated circuit, Laser, Chlorophyll synthesized, Light-emitting diode (LED), Liquid-crystal display, Artificial heart (left ventricle), Tunable dye laser, Internet (initially "ARPAnet"), First full synthesis of a gene, Microprocessor, Nuclear magnetic resonance imaging, Electronic pocket calculator, Ethernet, Recombinant DNA (genetic engineering), Fiberoptics, Computer (personal), Supercomputer, MRI (Magnetic Resonance Imaging) , Synthesis of human insulin genes, Mammal to mammal gene transplants, Space transportation system (space shuttle), Artificial heart....

Just to name a few

*Note: I do not take any responsibility for any inventions claimed to be american in error... simple cut and paste job here people...

No country is perfect the world over... Quit your whinging and think of something productive to do

[Jozen-Bo]

You forgot to thank the USA for being the place where I was born!!!

[spacemansteve]

How selfish of me... Thanks USA :D

I was born in Australia.. so i'm thankful for that country

[pharaohmoan]

It's not that everyone hates America it's just we hate what America has become. This is most evident in the way high streets around the world have changed and become sterile and boring. Sure Americans themselves are easily indoctrinated into thinking whatever the media wants them to think but they still have power to sway the way the world is which we must give them credit for. The trouble is that now that same power is in the wrong hands why because the bottom line is America needs to make a profit and it will quite happilly do this at the cost of other 3rd world nations which are propping up America but not receiving they salt's worth. This is wrong and the rest of the world is starting to realise this along with the destructive nature of capitalism which has reared its head especially so in the last 20 years.

America is lost and they look to one person in power who is powerless to make the changes needed in the short term.

[Orleander]

I love it. I feel very lucky to have been born here

[Myles]

I love it. I feel very lucky to have been born here

How would you feel if you had been born elsewhere ?

[Myles]

Dare I quote Rudyard Kipling on this topic ?

God gave men all the world to love
But, because their hearts are small,
He each just one tiny piece
To be loved over all.

[hypewaders]

Myles: "Dare I quote Rudyard Kipling on this topic?"

You've got a lot of nerve, bub :DTake up the White Man's Burden--
Send forth the best ye breed--
Go bind your sons to exile
To serve your captives' need;
To wait in heavy harness,
On fluttered folk and wild--
Your new-caught, sullen peoples,
Half-devil and half-child.

etc (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_Man's_Burden)

[Myles]

Myles: "Dare I quote Rudyard Kipling on this topic?"

You've got a lot of nerve, bub :D

What are you complaining about. He was talking about America.

[cosmictraveler]

I try to improve where I live, if it is America or Asia. Any place can use improvements and to make them is important to evolution as well as peace of mind.

[Myles]

I try to improve where I live, if it is America or Asia. Any place can use improvements and to make them is important to evolution as well as peace of mind.

So. when you have painted the house and blown up McDonald's , what next ?

[Norsefire]

I hate no one.
I only disagree with people
But I do not hate them
Unless they are criminals

[shichimenshyo]

http://www.leftybrown.com/alex-ross_bush-liberty.jpg

:eek:

[Myles]

I hate no one.
I only disagree with people
But I do not hate them
Unless they are criminals

I seem to remember that crimnals are people

[Myles]

http://www.leftybrown.com/alex-ross_bush-liberty.jpg

:eek:

Who's the guy with the grey hair ?

[shichimenshyo]

thats the founder of America duh

[Norsefire]

I seem to remember that crimnals are people

To you, perhaps

[shichimenshyo]

To you, perhaps

What crimes in your view would render a person no longer a person?

[Norsefire]

What crimes in your view would render a person no longer a person?

Murder
Rape
Torture
Lack of respect



Theft........MAYBE.........

[shichimenshyo]

Murder
Rape
Torture
Lack of respect



Theft........MAYBE.........

really lack of respect is grounds for dehumanizing someone?

[Norsefire]

really lack of respect is grounds for dehumanizing someone?

Not necessarily dehumanizing, but I find a lack of respect for anyone to be a sign that that person themself do not deserve respect.

[shichimenshyo]

Not necessarily dehumanizing, but I find a lack of respect for anyone to be a sign that that person themself do not deserve respect.

Some people are undeserving of respect no matter how much they demand it. ;)

[Norsefire]

Some people are undeserving of respect no matter how much they demand it. ;)

Are you talking about me? Personally, I show respect to all unless they give me a reason not to.

[shichimenshyo]

Are you talking about me? Personally, I show respect to all unless they give me a reason not to.

No, of course not. I am talking about in general not everyoje deserves respect.

[Michael]

I think part of it is a bit of jealousy but it's more than that. It's also this notion that America is getting rich at their expense. The fact is the USA even today produces >80% of what it consumes. Minus the oil and Chinese made trinkets we are almost totally self sufficient.

CHina is poor because of Chinese.
India is poor because of Indians.

But I've heard both Chinese and Indians blather on about how "America" is only rich because they are poor.

Anyway, I would also like to note that a lot of people around Singapore have a similar beef with Singaporeans. This extends even as far as Thailand. I've heard the exact same things said about Singapore as people say about America. It's like a mini USA.

I can not tell you how many time I heard academics blab on that America was "buying up Australia". I know it sounds idiotic but even full professors. They used to bitch and bitch and bitch to me about how the USA was changing Australia - as in trying to take the place over. I used to tell them good tomorrow stop watching TV, stop using the phone, stop wearing jeans, don't drive a ford, don't eat Kraft vegemite, but it didn't matter. A big waste of breath.

The same with this thread.

It's no matter that the USA has been a serious military force for less than 70 years, talk to someone from the ME and ALL their problems as the fault of the USA (or the Joos) never mind they have been at war for 7000 years.... that's the USA's fault too.

[Norsefire]

No, of course not. I am talking about in general not everyoje deserves respect.

Of course; but they bring that upon themselves.

[shichimenshyo]

So who decides who deserves and eosnt deserve respect?...I guess this is off topic.

[Norsefire]

So who decides who deserves and eosnt deserve respect?...I guess this is off topic.

Nobody, respect is decided by itself; if one shows respect, he should get respect. If not, no.

[shichimenshyo]

Nobody, respect is decided by itself; if one shows respect, he should get respect. If not, no.

That doesnt make any sense.

[Exhumed]

It's a love/hate relationship people, Love the TV, hate the foreign policy.

That's surprising. I'm hugely embarrassed by the TV and movies America has been representing itself with to the world lately. Maybe they still show Bay Watch in Australia (I heard this was the most popular TV show in Iran :p).

It is a love/hate thing for me too. Also hate the foreign policy, but I additionally hate the domestic policy, the TV, and the movies.

[Engulfed_Door]

As much as I hate the U.S. it's nice to know my nieghbours to the south have the #1 army in the world and aren't scared to lay the boots every few years just to say "yeah, #1 baby"

[Exhumed]

As much as I hate the U.S. it's nice to know my nieghbours to the south have the #1 army in the world and aren't scared to lay the boots every few years just to say "yeah, #1 baby"

What is so nice about that?

[Engulfed_Door]

What is so nice about that?

nobody comes around this neighbourhood. It's nice.

[nirakar]

Do you hate the big dog? The USA is not a particularly bad dog, but it is the big dog. I am glad the meaner crazier dogs are not the big dog. If the USA decides to chew on you, you will be in trouble. It is not the USA's fault; the USA does not know any better than a dog would.

[cosmictraveler]

So. when you have painted the house and blown up McDonald's , what next ?


Try to help my neighbors and friends for that is all I can really do.

[Engulfed_Door]

Do you hate the big dog? The USA is not a particularly bad dog, but it is the big dog. I am glad the meaner crazier dogs are not the big dog. If the USA decides to chew on you, you will be in trouble. It is not the USA's fault; the USA does not know any better than a dog would.

EXACTLY!!!

[Kadark]

Fuck the U.S.

The country was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire.

[Mr. G]

Oderint dum metuant; whether it floats your boat, or not.

[Kadark]

What do I have to fear? My people will never stop fighting.

[Challenger78]

That's surprising. I'm hugely embarrassed by the TV and movies America has been representing itself with to the world lately. Maybe they still show Bay Watch in Australia (I heard this was the most popular TV show in Iran :p).

It is a love/hate thing for me too. Also hate the foreign policy, but I additionally hate the domestic policy, the TV, and the movies.

Ok, I'll add domestic policy to the list, although it's not hate, it's just mostly us Aussies sitting here looking at Sicko and Fox going..."Dumbasses. ..."

The TV, other than a lot of B grade movies, do have some good actors (who happen to be brit/aussie), Russell Crowe and Hugh Laurie etc, wouldn't be propelled to fandom without hollywood. o, and Morgan Freeman is an awesome actor too.


People wise, The American's I've seen (mostly tourists) live up to some of the stereotypes we see on the web. (Constantly talking about America, for one thing, not wrong but put offing...)

[Mr. G]

What do I have to fear? My people will never stop fighting.
And my people will never stop being better at fighting.

Which is why you hide behind your people...in Canada.

Here we are. South of you.

Feeling lucky, punk?

[nirakar]

We're number 1. Growl dogs growl. (Mr. G, and Kadark)

[darksidZz]

USAucks

[Neildo]

Do I love or hate the US? Neither. I'm content with it. I love Western society, so I wouldn't have cared which Western country I was born and grew up in. Right now I'm highly disappointed in our current state of affairs though. The only thing I hate with the US are our crooked politicians and criminal Bush/Clinton drug cartel and our populace being too friggin' stupid right now having blinders on. Like having to spank a child to teach them a lesson, I hope shit hits the fan to wake everyone's ass up, although it wouldn't surprise me if everyone went into a brainwashed frenzy like WWII Germany.

- N

[pjdude1219]

America is the best and most talked about country on this forum. It the #1 country to bash.

The thing with humans are they tend to recognize the flaws immediately first.

No country can compare to America, the ideal nation. :D

as an american i would like to respond by saying ideal my ass you want ideal norway now that fucking ideal

[pjdude1219]

I really pity your sheer ignorance, go and read more facts about the arab history before I burn more shitty american flags.

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/graphics1/AmericaNaziFlag.gif

look i am not all that supportive of my country's policies but you do strike me as someone who quite frankly is fucking nuts and a closed minded person who wants to hate the us just because

[pjdude1219]

Yet another instance when the US is supposed to be convinced that it must care what the little people of the planet think -- as if their self-esteem is the most important thing in all the Universe...

are you honestly that stupid that you can't see what other peoples think of us is important

[pjdude1219]

So, what?

You, et alia, have no natural talent for creating capitalistic wealth?

You probably have no natural talent for competing with bears for Salmon dieing at the headwaters.

Americans don't give a flying f'ck what non-Americans think of us. We're not immigrating to their homelands en masse.

I've been self-employed for 15 years.

I am capitalism.

Capitalism fails you only because I have no reason to hire your sorry ass.

And you have no reason to hire your own sorry ass.

Not my problem.

I'm not your mommy.

The world better not want us to hate it.

You're mommy put you up for adoption.

Give her credit.

pure capitism failed remember 1929 what we have now is a solcialist captilism

[pjdude1219]

Are you talking about me? Personally, I show respect to all unless they give me a reason not to.

um gay peole

[pjdude1219]

Fuck the U.S.

The country was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire.

sorry it was based on rich white men not wanting to pay taxes

[Myles]

thats the founder of America duh

Does founder have the same meaning here as when one tal;ks of a ship which founders ?

[Myles]

Fuck the U.S.

The country was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire.

That's what I call eloquence.

[Myles]

What do I have to fear? My people will never stop fighting.

Thayt's why they will remain backward

[Reiku]

I don't hate US. I dislike the government.

[laladopi]

well i think at the moment we suck, fuck george dubya he's a self centered bastard.
as for all the advantages i have and access to almost everything i love it
i just wish law enforcement was here to keep the peace rather than to control people.
smoke pot*

[Michael]

Fuck the U.S.

The country was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire.
Three questions Kadark.
1) Was Canada built on the ethnocide, theft and genocide of native Americans?
2) Do you live on stolen land?
3) Feel guilty about that or more of a *meh* f*ckem I'm not leaving Canada it's my land now.

[Kadark]

And my people will never stop being better at fighting.

So much better that their state-of-the-art military cannot control shirtless men with Cold War kalashnikovs?

Which is why you hide behind your people...in Canada.

I had no choice but to be here. If you want to argue that, I suggest you discuss it with my mother's vagina. That is the reason I'm here, after all.

Sorry for the crudeness, but I've got a point to make.

[Kadark]

Three questions Kadark.
1) Was Canada built on the ethnocide, theft and genocide of native Americans?
2) Do you live on stolen land?
3) Feel guilty about that or more of a *meh* f*ckem I'm not leaving Canada it's my land now.

Of course Canada was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Canada has a fucking horrendous history. Everyone here knows it.

However, there's a little detail you left out:

"Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire."

Does Canada fit that bill?

[Kadark]

That's what I call eloquence.

Thanks. It's nice to see a little appreciation once in a while. You're officially on my "good" list.

Thayt's why they will remain backward

Yeah, it's so normal to simply roll over and take it up the ass from your enemies. :rolleyes:

[Michael]

Of course Canada was built on theft, ethnocide, and genocide. Canada has a fucking horrendous history. Everyone here knows it.

However, there's a little detail you left out:

"Today, it's a militarily expansionist empire."

Does Canada fit that bill?you missed my other two questions. So?

2) Do you live on stolen land?
3) Do you feel guilty about that?

To be an expansionist empire we need at the very least an emperor. I would say that the present government of the USA is trying to steal Iraqi oil but they have no intention on extending statehood and Citizenship to Iraqis.

[Roman]

Extension of statehood or citizenship isn't necessary for an empire to count as an empire.

[Michael]

Doesn't an empire need a ruling family with an emperor? The USA seems more like a thief then an empire. Anyway, I think every single country present and past has tried to coerce countries around them to their benefit both militarily and otherwise. Is Pakistan an Empire? They seem to be using their army and intelligence agencys to trip up neighbors and subdue parts of the country that other people (people living there) think are not a part of Pakistan.

[Roman]

Didn't imperial rome have a series of dictators, and even a senate?
I think an empire is one nation unilaterally redirecting resources from surrounding countries into itself at the detriment to others.

[Michael]

Yes but imperial rome was only called an empire AFTER Augustus - wasn't it? Before everything was for the Glory of the city State Roma, after if was for the glory of the Roman Emperor.

But, I suppose you are right in that what's important is how we are acting. We are a rich nation with a plethora of resources - we do not need to steal. As soon as we get off oil the sooner we can get back to doing what we do best - everything :D

[Michael]

Kadark I'm still waiting on questions #2 & #3

Michael

note: 36 hours into Okami - is there an end in sight?

[Roman]

Oh man, now I feel like talking to foreign students about how America is number one and getting them to high five me.

[S.A.M.]

I think the changes in the economy will soon show what Americans can or cannot do. Seeing as they are ruled by fear and ignorance, lets hope its not too expensive an ordeal for the rest of the world.

you missed my other two questions. So?

2) Do you live on stolen land?
3) Do you feel guilty about that?

To be an expansionist empire we need at the very least an emperor. I would say that the present government of the USA is trying to steal Iraqi oil but they have no intention on extending statehood and Citizenship to Iraqis.

I think the difference is that the US never stopped. The regime changes, the school for torture, the death squads and the unilateral invasions and utter indifference of most Americans to mass genocide (Japan, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan) committed by their representatives.

The favorite US foreign policy move is "bomb them back to the stone age (http://hnn.us/articles/30347.html)". That defines the US policy better than anything else.

[joepistole]

I am a United States Citizen, and I love my country and the noble ideals upon which it was founded. However, I am very disappointed in our leadership for the past several decades. We unfortunately no longer have a government of the people and for the people. Our leaders have sold the government to the highest bidder. That is why it appears we have no coherent policy. That is why our schools are in decline. That is why our infrastructure is in decline. Our bridges our falling for lack of repair and investment.
I sincerely hope that in this election we will see the American citizens reclaim their government...time will tell. There are a lot of special interests with a lot of money who are accustomed at getting what they want from our government by hook or crook.

I cried when I saw the flag that was the inspiration for our national anthem, and I am not a man acustomed to crying. I cried at all those who have scarficed their lives for the noble cause of human freedom and dignity. And I cry about what we have become over the last few decades, especially that last decade.

[Yorda]

people in my country don't like USA, but i like it. i wish i lived there. it's the best country. i live in sweden which is the worst country in the world. god bless america. in sweden nobody even believes in god and everybody is brainwashed by science in school. dunno, maybe it's a good thing... but science ("reality") seems to make ordinarypeople so depressed.

"we're just animals."
"there is no meaning in life. you just live, reproduce and die. and when you're dead you're dead."
"harassment in school is natural, it separates the weak people from the strong. survival of the fittest".
"i'm just a bunch of molecules. a biological machine."
"love is just chemicals".
"i have no free will. everything that happens in my brain is controlled by natural laws. i react in response to the environment."

[oreodont]

I'd say 90% of friends and fellow workers see the USA as a Bubba family member. They are family so you care about your bubba Uncle but he isn't the sharpest kife in the drawer. Every so often he gives you a bit of money or his old junker car. You laugh at his bad jokes and don't comment on his funny haircut. He talks a lot about how great things were in the past but he's not one to take care of himself today and has a big beer gut. When the family all gets together and bubba Uncle starts to spout off the rest of the family look at eachother and role their eyes.

[Kadark]

you missed my other two questions. So?

2) Do you live on stolen land?
3) Do you feel guilty about that?

2) I think I answered this when I said Canada has a horrendous history of ethnocide, genocide, and theft. In other words, yes.

3) Why should I? I never chose to be born here. Nor did my ancestors travel here to kill a few million Natives.

Kadark I'm still waiting on questions #2 & #3

Yeah, Michael, some of us have a life outside of Sciforums. Believe it or not, I've been out all day.

note: 36 hours into Okami - is there an end in sight?

I finished at about 46 or so hours. Incredibly long yet incredibly fun. Game boss is a lil weird, though.

[shichimenshyo]

Ya I got to about the 40 hour mark and lost interest...fun game though.

[Michael]

2) I think I answered this when I said Canada has a horrendous history of ethnocide, genocide, and theft. In other words, yes.

3) Why should I? I never chose to be born here. Nor did my ancestors travel here to kill a few million Natives.Well that's the case for everyone. You seemed to be separating yourself from everyone else. Even that dick head George Bush's parents parents migrated here at some point.

Ethnocide, genocide, and theft have been the name of the game since forever. If you've even seen the tv show called The Tribe which follows a British SAS officer into Africa where he lives in tribes you'll see it's still very much the norm from that level all the way up to the USA taking over Iraq. Basically someone gave the primates just enough knowledge to be dangerous and here we are.

Do you think of Japan as being based on ethnocide, genocide, and theft? The entire islands were settled by Ainu thousands of years beforethe people who are the present day Japanese came a colonized the place?

In short - what exactly was your point?

Michael

Okami bosses seem too easy. That's a big drawback for me.

[Kadark]

Well that's the case for everyone. You seemed to be separating yourself from everyone else. Even that dick head George Bush's parents parents migrated here at some point.

Ethnocide, genocide, and theft have been the name of the game since forever. If you've even seen the tv show called The Tribe which follows a British SAS officer into Africa where he lives in tribes you'll see it's still very much the norm from that level all the way up to the USA taking over Iraq. Basically someone gave the primates just enough knowledge to be dangerous and here we are.

Do you think of Japan as being based on ethnocide, genocide, and theft? The entire islands were settled by Ainu thousands of years beforethe people who are the present day Japanese came a colonized the place?

In short - what exactly was your point?

Michael

Okami bosses seem too easy. That's a big drawback for me.

My point is that not only does the United States have an atrocious history (admittedly, like most other nations), but it is an active aggressor and occupier in many countries, from direct military settlements and occupations to permanent bases and strategically stationed weapons worldwide. That's what differentiates the U.S. from other nations who share a similarly shameful history - the here and now.

[Michael]

I agree and disagree.

Are the Turkish going to give the Kurdish a "home land"? No. Are the Chinese going to release Tibet? No. etc... etc... etc... It's not anything at all particular to the USA or to this time in history - this is history. It's always been like this. I'd like to think that maybe this will be near one of the last generations of this sort of thing - BUT probably not.

Michael

[Mr. G]

are you honestly that stupid that you can't see what other peoples think of us is important
It's only important to us when what we think of them is equally important to them.

[Mr. G]

pure capitism failed remember 1929 what we have now is a solcialist captilism
Not. True capitalism works for me every day. It feeds me, pays my bills, and insures that my future will be comfortable.

What you have is a socialist education that paralyzes your own natural abilities to exchange your talents, abilities and a little hard work for capital given to you by people willing to exchange it for what you have to offer them.

[S.A.M.]

I agree and disagree.

Are the Turkish going to give the Kurdish a "home land"? No. Are the Chinese going to release Tibet? No. etc... etc... etc... It's not anything at all particular to the USA or to this time in history - this is history. It's always been like this. I'd like to think that maybe this will be near one of the last generations of this sort of thing - BUT probably not.

Michael

Do you think the situation of the Kurds is equivalent to the occupation of Iraq?

Or the Chinese occupation of Tibet?

[iceaura]

Do you think the situation of the Kurds is equivalent to the occupation of Iraq?

Or the Chinese occupation of Tibet? Many general similarities, especially if a little historical context is mixed in (Armenia, etc).

It only confuses, to fail to distinguish between principle and scale. The US operates on a much larger scale than most countries, in evil as well as good, is most of the unusual problem it poses.

To those of us who expect better from the US, because it was set up to work differently and we wish to avoid the future inevitable if it doesn't, that's not much of an excuse. But in simple comparison with other countries, it probably is.

[Mr. G]

My point is...
http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=1806438&postcount=175

[Mr. G]

I think the changes in the economy will soon show what Americans can or cannot do. Seeing as they are ruled by fear and ignorance, lets hope its not too expensive an ordeal for the rest of the world.

I think the difference is that the US never stopped. The regime changes, the school for torture, the death squads and the unilateral invasions and utter indifference of most Americans to mass genocide (Japan, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan) committed by their representatives.

The favorite US foreign policy move is "bomb them back to the stone age (http://hnn.us/articles/30347.html)". That defines the US policy better than anything else.
I think you over-rate your thinking.

[S.A.M.]

Many general similarities, especially if a little historical context is mixed in (Armenia, etc).

It only confuses, to fail to distinguish between principle and scale. The US operates on a much larger scale than most countries, in evil as well as good, is most of the unusual problem it poses.

To those of us who expect better from the US, because it was set up to work differently and we wish to avoid the future inevitable if it doesn't, that's not much of an excuse. But in simple comparison with other countries, it probably is.

I don't see too many Iraqis in the US, do you?

[Mr. G]

I don't see too many Iraqis in the US, do you?

http://www.answers.com/topic/iraqi-american?cat=travel

[superstring01]

I don't see too many Iraqis in the US, do you?

There's a huge Chaldean community in Detroit. As a marketing manager for Costco, I traveled to the community and got to know many. ;)

~String

[S.A.M.]

There's a huge Chaldean community in Detroit. As a marketing manager for Costco, I traveled to the community and got to know many. ;)

~String

Refugees from the Iraq war?

[superstring01]

Refugees from the Iraq war?

Well, seeing as how (a) I think GW is a douche and that (b) the war in Iraq was pointless, I find it hard to muster the energy to debate the counterpoint. But your geometric ignorance and vacuous comments are powerful motivating factors.

I know this is a bitter pill for someone of your geometric bigotry to swallow, but the Chaldeans were militantly opposed to Saddam and were either for, or lukewarm on, the idea of an Iraqi invasion. If you knew enough to Google the word, you'd realize that Chaldeans, by definition, are a horrifically oppressed Iraqi Christian minority with a history of bloody pogroms carried out against them. Saddam tolerated Christians, but the Chaldeans didn't suffer Saddam lightly-- thus he made them suffer. The USA slaughtering him and their bloody Muslim oppressors didn't force too many tears out of their eyes.

I'm sure you'll find a way to paint them as evil. You have a knack for that

~String