Meditation

[Joeman]

Okay. I have a few questions about meditation.

1. What is the correct way to meditate? Basically you just sit down and probably with eye closed to minimize distraction. Your mind has to be absolutely free of any thoughts, correct? That is something I couldn't do. My mind is always either thinking or sometimes have random music playing in my head. Any tips? Fukushi talked to me about "moving meditation". I have no idea what that is about.

2. how frequently should I meditate? how long should I do it for?

3. What are the benefit?

I heard it re-energized you the very least, but so far I cannot get any benefit from it probably because I can't meditate the right way.

[Joeman]

Ah Crap.

I didn't realize there is another thread titled "Meditation Guide".

I am gonna read that thread first and see if it answers my questions.

[kmguru]

There is a lot of material in this section on Meditation. Please review them. Quickly...

One type of meditation lets the mind wonder but to observe them detached from the thought...then gradually the mind calms down...spurious thoughts become less frequent and do not run away to far.

Some focus on a specific thought, flame of a candle, an object and hold their thought in that area.

25 minutes with 5 minute fade out is a good time.

Music can help to meditate on

[Joeman]

Originally posted by kmguru
Music can help to meditate on

Kmguru, I know there are many different types of meditation. I think I should start with traditional hardcore buddhist type of meditation. Music is definitely a no no.

[kmguru]

That is OK too. It all depends where one is and where one wants to go...

Good Luck. Happy meditating...:D

[BLASTOFF]

joeman have you read the meditation guide and if so has it done you any good, and also would you like to know the basics as i will and i am sure there are others who would help let me know please.

[Rajagopals]

” What is the correct way to meditate?”

To avoid unpleasant thoughts and focus on receiving relaxed state of mind through concentrating in the breath could be called meditation. Like a man who has crossed the river who do not need the boat anymore, once you have reached the other end ( the reason behind meditation) meditation itself is not required.

“Probably with eye closed to minimize distraction.”

No, better is to keep the eyes opened, so that you practice from the beginning itself to focus on the light and not to get distracted by what you see. This also support you to receive positive energy (in the form of light) rather than the darkness.

“Your mind has to be absolutely free of any thoughts,”

This is not at all possible unless other wise you are practicing what is known as Sanchara Samadhy (practicing death while alive). But before that if you can focus the all your thought process to wards the breath then the energy derived can be channeled for more better results.

“My mind is always either thinking or sometimes have random music playing in my head.”

This itself is a good stage as you are able to focus and identify what your mind is doing. This definitely shows a better focusing capability.

“how frequently should I meditate?

As and when you feel like, like any other natural body tendencies.

“how long should I do it for? “

Depends on how fast you want to achieve the end results. But its better recommended to practice 10-15 minutes in the beginning.

”What are the benefit?”

If properly done, it first opens up the certain emotional boundaries, and might force you to take steps which you never did earlier. This could be a new out of order sexual desires and deeds, heroic acts, love for action and adventure, love for more foods ( specially non vegetarian) all together charges your vitality. Feel good. But sometimes could lead to bad end results too. This is why you need a Guru.

As you proceed further you will go through a lot of emotional and spiritual growth.

Wish you all the best !

[Nascere]

I was meditating not too long ago and I was questioning my faith in god. I thank god for helping me thru troubles in life and such but I was wondering why would he let me or anyone else go thru all that trouble and struggles if ther was a god, you know? But anyway my mind just kept on testing my faith and it was kinda wavering. I let it all slide and just think of nothing.
I like to think myself a temperate person, I havent gotten real angry in my whole life, yes I get mad at times but it aint real bad.
But today after I was done meditating I was just straight up angry. The kind of anger that makes your adrenaline pump like I can whoop anyones ass. I never felt like this before, especially just out of the blue.
So I decided to take a walk to try to calm myself down. I was going to the store to get a drink right, and I see this guy riding a bike and as he went by he was staring, and I hate that shit, especially when you say wats up or hi and they dont say anything, like they to good for you some bullshit like it. He went by and I'm holding myself in check from snatching this guy off the bike and stomping on his head. So I continue to walk and now my face all contorted from being mad, and I'm trying to relax myself. And my mind was like, I dont give a damn about anything or anyone even if it costs me my own, cuz they dont give a damn about you either, my mentality was like f the world for real. Anyway I get to the store buy a drink. I'm pretty calm now when I get out but not my normal self. I start walking back the way I came and I look over and this guy was staring at me hard and he was with his girl, they were probably 17 or 18 yrs old. So I look at him and said wassup how you doin and he looking at me like he all pissed off. He was close to me right off the side walk, I go up to him and I'm real pissed I can feel my chest thumping and I was like what the f you staring at b**** and he started cussing back talking shit, and right before he was even done saying what he was saying I reared my arm that was holding a 1 liter and slapped him across the temple hard as hell with it and I came in with a left hook followed by a combo 2 time jab and I finished it off with a right power hit that knocked him down but i couldnt stop and I was just jumpin on him kickin him and he was bleeding bad from his mouth, nose, face and his girl ran away into the house they just came from. So I ran and ran like I was on air cuz I was gone and over a couple walls in a few mins.
I've gotten into many fights in my time and gotten my share of ass whoopins, but I was never the one to ever ever start a fight. And even when I was in a fight I never truly was mad, like I was today. I'm a very honorable fighter calm fighter, Im the type to just fist fight it out and once your down I wont get all over you but today it seemed I was possessed.
For the past 2 nights I've had dreams of losing my temper and getting into it with someone. And I knew this was going to happen in real life cuz my dreams become uncannyinlgy true most of the time. And I would think I would watch myself from what I've seen.
I dont like the this feeling at all, I'm calmed down some now tho. I'm not sure if its from the experience of meditating or what. Maybe my higher self was wanting to experience it ? Cuz its not first time something like this happend, tho in a different way. Sometimes after meditating I feel real loving or happy or depressed all types of emotions just come. Most of the time I feel the same as I usually do but more relaxed state of mind and mellow after im done meditating.
Anyway that kind of anger is something I'll never forget and hope it will never happen again. And I do feel bad about the whole incident.
I have a feeling some retaliation is going to happen sometime and I'll probably just let it be, I'd fight if thats the way it is dont get me wrong cuz thats just instinct but if I loose, I wont be mad at em, not at all. And I know I'll see them again cuz I know the guy that the house they came from.
I wonder if my faith is still as strong as it is after all this is over heh.

[spookz]

i have experienced that. pure simple rage during meditation.
trick here is to control it. unfortunately, i am at a loss on how to explain it. exercise caution mr nacsere

[spookz]

hey i just remembered i even maintained an erection for over an hr i think!

edit: during deep meditation that is!

[Rick]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA......

All this advice from Km and Raj boils down to this Spookz?...ahahahahahahha...



bye!

[Rick]

Wait... this thread should be renamed as Meditation:Non Physical Viagra!...hahahahahaa...ahahahahahahahahhahahahaha hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahah... :D :D





BYE!

[spookz]

silly boy
maybe i will start a tantric yoga thread and get you really really hysterical

:D

[EvilPoet]

"This is something more marvelous if you come upon it. I can go into it, but the description is not the described. It's for you to learn all this by looking at yourself---no book, no teacher can teach you about this. Don't depend on anyone, don't join spiritual organizations; one has to learn all this out of oneself. And there the mind will discover things that are incredible. But for that, there must be no fragmentation and therefore immense stability, swiftness, mobility. To such a mind there is no time and therefore living has quite a different meaning."

[Rajagopals]

This is nothing but good jugglery of philosophical thoughts derived from depression of not able to reach the truth nor even its right path. Description is what is described provided the right candidate reads it with right method, based on right practice and belief. I believe unless otherwise taught no human on earth is going to self learn the process of meditation in which he focus on his own breath. How on earth this is going to fall in to his knowledge by itself ? I wonder ! “one has to learn all this out of oneself” this part is true provided one gets the basic training of what needs to be done, like Karate !

“To such a mind there is no time….blah blah blah ……….

Pathetic !!!

[EvilPoet]

"A meditative mind is silent. It is not the silence which thought can conceive of; it is not the silence of a still evening; it is the silence when thought---with all its images, its words, and perceptions---has entirely ceased. This meditative mind is the religious mind---the religion that is not touched by the church, the temples, or by chants. The religious mind is the explosion of love. It is this love that knows no separation. To it, far is near. It is not the one or the many, but rather that state of love in which all division ceases. Like beauty, it is not the measure of words. From this silence alone the meditative mind acts."
-J Krishnamurti, Meditations

[Rick]

Hey Spookz,I am all for it.Have you seen this movie called the Guru?...Its about an Indian guy who becomes a Sex Guru?...:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:


bye!

[spookz]

Originally posted by Rajagopals
This is nothing but good jugglery of philosophical thoughts derived from depression of not able to reach the truth nor even its right path

raj

i do not dispute the fact that there has to be a starting point. it maybe a book , a teacher. the effort however has to mainly come from you. a teacher can impart the method while you will be the one to actually practice and experience it. i look at jk in the particular context he was in. preaching to westerners and their craze over guru's. perhaps the speech was in reaction to that.

Originally posted by Rajagopals
Pathetic !!!

unduly harsh i think
take a deep breath..........exhaaaaaaaaaaale
there! better?

;)

[Rajagopals]

'unduly harsh i think '

You are correct, we need to be, unless otherwise these lines are going to make few peoples life miserable if they take it seriously and discard their search for the truth. The fellow says the truth will come to us, that will never happen, unless otherwise you search for it, unless otherwise we look out for that in many ways, unless we wander after that, unless we fall on the feet of the Guru, unless you become crazy about reaching it (the truth) that’s not going to come to you. And when you find it, you find yourself and you find that you yourself is the truth and the rest of what you feel is Maya, then again like great saint Narada we will search for the reason for Maya and found out that its nothing but the life within a human being which creates that. Its is that illusion of dimension which was captured by the body with its senses. We spend the whole life (if you are in search of the truth) to over come this false feeling of dimension and break out to the better state of universal tranquility and knowledge of Sivam.

And more over Spookz, if we are not going to raise our voice these messages are not going to be heard. It is very easy to misguide, but impossible to guide to the truth.

And when you are taking a long breath what happens is, your body gets more moisture because of which you get a lot of fatigue and this fatigue will stop the proper flow of blood circulation and which could make you lazy. Wake up, do not be like a girl who takes long breath on things which she can’t understand, but be a man, be a lion, and roar !

(This is what the great Vivekananda says !)

Roarrrrrrrrrrrrrrr……….rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr……………rrrr rrrr

Oh yah like that.

[spookz]

:D

The fellow says the truth will come to us, that will never happen, unless otherwise you search for it, unless otherwise we look out for that in many ways, unless we wander after that, unless we fall on the feet of the Guru, unless you become crazy about reaching it (the truth) that’s not going to come to you

perhaps. i always have an open mind. i also think there are many roads to......

f we are not going to raise our voice these messages are not going to be heard. It is very easy to misguide, but impossible to guide to the truth.

raj, perhaps it is frustrating at times, but make an effort to understand where
most of us come from. you seem at times to be proselytizing and i am not sure it whether it is entirely appropiate to this forum. around these parts we love pissing on gods and whatnot. ;) i still cant believe you dont think jk is misguided! cant you salvage something from the man's philosophy and call it viable?
the man was a childhood hero!

:(

[EvilPoet]

"If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation. If you set out to be good, goodness will never flower. If you cultivate humility, it ceases to be. Meditation is the breeze that comes in when you leave the window open; but if you deliberately keep it open, deliberately invite it to come, it will never appear." -J Krishnamurti

[Rajagopals]

Originally posted by spookz

but make an effort to understand where most of us come from
:(

I assume we all are expressing our thoughts about certain topics of common interest here. My opinion is mine and what you have to say is yours. Our posting will represent what we have to say that’s all. I was responding to certain posts in my way which may be sometimes a bit harsh, but never personal, its about the topic. May be I am more passionate about what I believe and I will stand for that. If ever our experience (in meditation) could help some one else at least for a moment for receiving better direction then I think it worth the effort to push it.

i still cant believe you dont think jk is misguided! cant you salvage something from the man's philosophy and call it viable?
the man was a childhood hero!:(

:o
And with the names what is used and people who are doing “Astral Projection” who am I to judge or understand those divine creatures ! I would like to bow before them and get their blessing, that’s all. I am not in to understanding some one with few posts which he makes unless otherwise I personally feel the need for the same. And more over who am I to judge a person with what he says about certain topics. Because an individuals opinions and what is says is based on his instinct at that moment and to whom is he saying! Lets assume if we are to explain certain security hole in an operating system we might use the correct terms to a hacker but to a beginner we might only say the logic ! So we can not judge a person with what he says about a topic !

And about JK I don’t know whether he is misguided or not ! No do I want to assess that, but if he makes a statement about things which he does not know or have not experienced then surely I will make my comment on the same in this forum where it’s a topic of discussion !

Originally posted by EvilPoet

"If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation. If you set out to be good, goodness will never flower. If you cultivate humility, it ceases to be. Meditation is the breeze that comes in when you leave the window open; but if you deliberately keep it open, deliberately invite it to come, it will never appear." -J Krishnamurti:(


“If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation” I will again say..pathetic…how I am I to understand this when we can very well do meditation and receive its results, achieve what is supposed to get from it. Meditation is nothing but the true science, like the name itself “Satya Vidya” (Science of truth) and when some one is speaking about it without the slightest knowledge of the same, ( I make this statement because if jk had some knowledge he would not made these statements which are so away from the truth!) how are we to keep quite about the blabbering ? I can’t !

Meditation, it is no window, nor the breeze, it has its own definitions in various authentic books like (I am not going to make my statements on that cause many divine entities are already riding with those wheels) Avadhotha Gita, Uttara Gita, Siva Swaroday, Kularnava etc. Most of these are available for reference too.

“no book, no teacher can teach you about this. Don't depend on anyone, don't join spiritual organizations; one has to learn all this out of oneself”

I agree on things like, no book, no organization, do not depend on some one, no teacher all that provided we are lucky to wake up one fine day morning with our sixth sense active !
Jk do not know that there is something like Satya Vidya where there is no Guru-Disciple relationship, were the Guru wishes the disciples in the same way the disciple wishes the Guru. The priority (respect) is given to the Vidya (science) rather than the Guru, because the Guru is only another disciple who got it from his Guru, and who is practicing it.

Some say, if we dream about something that happens, but that has meaning if we analyze it correctly. Dreams leads to thoughts of the same, and thoughts leads to feelings, feelings leads to action, actions leads to results which mostly might take you to the dream itself. But to convert those actions to results is where we fail, as far as meditation and truth is concerned you need a Guru to definitely convert those actions to results (final goal).

A Guru is a must, but he should be one who do not compromise, he should be someone who do not wish for anything material, Guru should be healthy, he should be a believer, one with a faith on God, one with a wife, one with Rajasam (king like character, behavior and conduct), good at music and with lots of love.

And Spooks, some times when we develop ourselves we find our childhood heroes becoming meaning less! And about pissing on Gods and the rest, its like a gift, when you are trying to give a gift to someone and he says he don’t want that, then with whom does the gift resides ?

:D

[EvilPoet]

Originally blabbered by Rajagopals
“If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation” I will again say..pathetic…how I am I to understand this when we can very well do meditation and receive its results, achieve what is supposed to get from it. Meditation is nothing but the true science, like the name itself “Satya Vidya” (Science of truth) and when some one is speaking about it without the slightest knowledge of the same, ( I make this statement because if jk had some knowledge he would not made these statements which are so away from the truth!) how are we to keep quite about the blabbering ? I can’t !
The Gift of Insults (http://www.rider.edu/users/suler/zenstory/insults.html)

[Persol]

If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation. I'm thinking that this was supposed to be figurative. If all you think about meditation while mediatating, you will not meditate (odd sentence:) ). You focus on something but not the meditation itself.

I think you are having the same problem as people have with the bible. You are taking it literarly when it is not meant that way.

Pathetic!!! Lol

P.S. Poet-I enjoyed that link, and the pages around it

[spookz]

raj
thanks. you certainly are making me reconsider a few things

:)

[Rajagopals]

“If you set out to meditate, it will not be meditation“

If I believed above words I would also like to make some statement, which I think is just figurative.

If you set out to do sex, it will not be sex !

Do not take it literally, it does not mean so ! I only intend to say when you are trying to do sex and when you focus on the act of sex, you will not be able to take the best out of sex. I assume this, that you will not able to take the best out of sex, because some one else says he/she is able to experience many better feelings from sex when they do not focus on it. They do sex with the right knowledge of the act to feel the comfort, feel the passion, feel the warmth, feel the confidence, feel the maturity, feel that pain of love, that conquering feeling, and what not.

Before I myself make any contradictory statement :D , let me point out,

We are born with the instinct of sex, even then you need an origin of erotic thoughts
To do sex, first your mind and body has to grow up to a certain stage
Once initiated our senses leads to the rest of the feelings of sex
To do better sex you need healthy body
Depending on the practitioner the results of sex also vary
And the more you evolve to a better human being the lesser your focus remains with the act of sex (You tend to call it love making)

But WHO SO EVER YOU ARE if you have to do sex you have to do it! There is no mental way to it, its pure physical with conscious activities that tend to lead our senses to many blissful stages. But if you say you have wet dreams, then remember its nothing but a dream. If you want to derive the best out of sex, do it deliberately but with the focus on things depending on how much of experience you have in sex. If you are born in June 1957 then its better you…;) just joking EvilPoet !

I assume all of what is said about sex (above), goes with meditation also.

Originally posted by Persol
I think you are having the same problem as people have with the bible. You are taking it literarly when it is not meant that way.


You used the right words “I think” but what you thought is not the truth, I did understood what jk meant but to me even that meaning stands wrong, so I made my comment.

:cool:

[Firefly]

Originally posted by Rajagopals
love for more foods ( specially non vegetarian)
Meditation makes you want to eat meat? :confused:

[Rajagopals]

Originally posted by Firefly
Meditation makes you want to eat meat? :confused:

Let me paste those lines to which you responded.

”What are the benefit?

If properly done, it first opens up the certain emotional boundaries, and might force you to take steps which you never did earlier. This could be a new out of order sexual desires and deeds, heroic acts, love for action and adventure, love for more foods ( specially non vegetarian) all together charges your vitality. Feel good. But sometimes could lead to bad end results too. This is why you need a Guru. “

If you are doing the mediation in the correct way, it basically enhances your feeling of the senses, be it taste, smell, sight, sound or sex, it makes you go for getting more. As far as food in concerned mostly non-vegetarian food is prepared with lot of spicy and hard flavors. So naturally a person who had previously tasted non-vegetarian tend to remember those tastes and would refer to have the same. This is just a possibility!

:rolleyes:

[UltiTruth]

Raj,
I don't think a guru is really essential. What we need is a depth, in which we can relate to the Supreme soul.
I for one, would prefer understanding the core and experiencing it by myself. I would not believe in these rituals you are mentioning- don't care about the garlic, oninon or non-veg. Go straight and experience it with the soul!

But I don't believe in a categorical dismissal of JK or any thinker for that matter. Isn't the beauty of the East in toying with an idea we don't subscribe to though?

And I felt you were disproving yourself in your last thread about deliberate Sex, though you tried the opposite?

[EvilPoet]

Rajagopals,

If you are born in June 1957 then its better you…just joking EvilPoet
Could you please clarify this unfinished statement? What does
my being born in 1957 have to do with anything? I have no clue
what you mean nor do I know what you are joking about.

[odin]

Scientists say they have found evidence that meditation has a biological effect on the body.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2725487.stm
:cool:

[Rajagopals]

Originally posted by UltiTruth
UltiTruth,

I don't think a guru is really essential. What we need is a depth, in which we can relate to the Supreme soul

There are many ways to achieve the final goal of reaching the Supreme, and many have also achieved that. Like, living our life for the Lord and having a conduct, which emanate lots of love for the fellow creatures and experiencing everyday life full of Lord, like Mother Theresa.Like Meera Bhai who could see Lord Krishna in everything. Like the great musician Tansen who worshipped the Lord with his music.

But for the majority none of these are achievable. Not everyone is born with that sense to reach the Supreme with his own knowledge. Not every one gets that focus by himself to find the Lord in things what he does, nor many are born with the talent to seek God in everything that is around us. But for the ordinary, for the majority, there is a predefined practically proven method to do meditation in a very human way to achieve that final goal. This has been proven through centuries. There are people who still achieve those results who are ardent believers, of themselves as well as the practice that they do. For them the truth is the Guru, for them the practice is the Guru, for them their experience is the Guru. Once you reach that level you do not need a Guru, but your sense. Like a boat required to reach the other side of the river, the same which is not required when you reach the other end.

I for one, would prefer understanding the core and experiencing it by myself. I would not believe in these rituals you are mentioning- don't care about the garlic, oninon or non-veg

The practice of Satya Vidya (Science of Truth) do not have any ritual, it do not have any restrictions, it do not pose a Guru figure on you, it just simply shows you the path, you are independent as you are ! Best suited for socialist from Russia! The restrictions on the diet, habits, and the rest of it is for the disciple’s (the practitioner’s) own benefit so that a practitioner gets the best out of meditation. Its like charging a battery, you can charge it when you are using (draining) it, you can do it when you are not draining it, the objective, how fast you want to charge it ? And not alone charging, a practitioner who achieves a stage when he can bless another person, that also is restricted, will make your battery drain out. But those who have reached the source they can very well bless! They can eat anything, they can behave like a mad man, those are called Avadhotha (One who has reached beyond).

Like Garlic and few other things reducing the effect of mediation there are medicines which increases the effect. Like Iratti Madhuram (wooden parts of a plant which when chewed slowly gives sugar like taste – I do not know the scientific name) and Pooneer (a salt, its collected by Yogis in a metallic plate (without touching the ground) when this liquid juts out from the earth) increases the effect of meditation many fold. These food habits have their own effect in our body, whether you believe it or not. Buts its surely up to you to practice or not !

Go straight and experience it with the soul!

Alas, if I also could do the same. I tried, even after these many years I still feel scary when I start to get that feeling of merging with the other side of the soul ! I hesitates to meditate after that, but my mind won’t keep me quite, so I will begin again after some time, may be days, weeks or months after I will get it again….that experience of the soul…then again I gets scared…I feel like things will go out of control, I feel as if I will lose my body…I feel like moving within the body, I feel like being the tip of the biggest and heavy mountain, at the same time being the whole of it. I could feel that void, I could feel that lightness at the same time heaviness, and the non-existence of self. But I am scared to explore more. This is my story, but I know there are people out there who are really brave to go beyond, and to come back. I fear because I still feel like I have things to finish in my material world, parents to take care, get married, have kids etc so I scare. But if we are to leave all these feelings then surely I think we will be brave enough to jump. Till such time, I will go to the backside of the queue. But those people in the front, please share your valuable feelings with us, or at least with me! I am a still a scared little boy !

But I don't believe in a categorical dismissal of JK or any thinker for that matter.

Neither do I, I was expressing my feelings, my thoughts and things from my own experience that stands against what he said. He may be a great human being, but that doesn’t make him a good practitioner of meditation, nor a yogi. And its better only a yogi talk about yoga.

please clarify this unfinished statement

This curiosity, this confusion, is what I wanted to generate , that’s all..and thats the joke ...sorry if that annoyed you too much!

:p

[UltiTruth]

Reminds me of a story when Narada, the Sage who always chants the name of Vishnu, and is considered the greatest devotee of Vishnu, asks Vishnu if he really the greates devotee.
Vishnu shows him a farmer on earth, an tells him the farmer is, since he does his duty/work right and also supports the family, a form of Dharma.
...just to say that going by book is not always necessary, if we have the spirit.
Thanks!

[firefighter]

Just trying to imagine what the outcome would be if a "Global Meditation" event took place - Say, one hour (or half hour) when everyone in the world (who is able) meditates at the same time as one.

No TVs, computers, planes, trains, automobiles, cell phones, etc... Block out any crying babies and make sure the toddlers understand that it's "quiet time" :)

Peace.