Humane

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Lykan, Nov 10, 2002.

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Which is more humane -- life imprisonment without parole, or lethal injection?

  1. Life imprisonment without parole

    5 vote(s)
    41.7%
  2. Lethal injection

    7 vote(s)
    58.3%
  1. Lykan Golden Sparkler Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    763
    To add more specifications, the prison is your average run-of-the-mill prison in America or Britain (as opposed to one in a "third world" country). And for the lethal injection, first they are injected with something that puts them to sleep, and then they are injected with something that kills them -- totally painless.
     
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  3. Halo Full Time Nerd-Bomber Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    587
    Lethal Injection. The agony of rotting in prison for eternity would drive a man mad.
     
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  5. CounslerCoffee Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,997
    Lethal Injection

    Im all for it. Think of those poor prison people that have to sit in their cell day in and day out with nothing to do. Always worrying about prison rape, no good food, no sex, etc. Your family wouldnt probably even visit you, theyd probably just consider you dead if there never going to see you again.

    Its just the right thing to do... plus it cost like $30,000.00 a year just for one prisoner... imagine if we killed ALL of them, my taxes would go down so much!

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  7. Clockwood You Forgot Poland Registered Senior Member

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    4,467
    50 years in prison + eternity in hell or just eternity in hell. Take the latter id say.
     
  8. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    Hell?

    Some would say that death is a way to escape hell.
    The Bible says there is no hell,the wicked will be left on the earth to kill one another off,it kinda looks like that's what is going on here.
    Thou Shalt Not Kill,The governments of the world are playing god,god will punish those who violate the commandments,,it is not a mans place to kill someone,unless he wants to get revenge for anothers actions,double whammy.
    It's all just wrong.I really don't understand what is going on in the world,It's just WRONG.
     
  9. Gifted World Wanderer Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,113
    Leave the needle on the nightstand?
     
  10. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    A Godless Society

    It seems that governments throughout the world are trying to take the place of god.Powermongers,warmongers,all at the expense of the taxpayers,we support and pay for the governments mistakes,while they play god ,we suffer and die.
     
  11. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,331
    Except that we can't know for sure that it is painless.

    Prison is a punishment. The death penalty provides an escape from what I consider justice. Put 'em in a box.

    Peace.
     
  12. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    Punishment by death?

    If one was immortal,punishment by death would be good,that is if you could make absolutely certainly for sure without a doubt that that person is who committed the crime.Did you know that good legal representation in the US is a complete myth,the lawyers are servants of the court,they are there for the system's benefit,not the accused,did you know that innocent until proven guilty is a myth too,it's absolutely true,just accept it.
    And how can someone pay legal fees to a lawyer regardless of whether he wins the case or not,and a rediculous amount at that.
    And it is legal for a lawyer to represent someone for free by the way,but they won't.
    And there is no such thing as a license to practice law either.
    ----But back to the string----
    If someone is going to die anyway,what is really being accomplished when you sentence this person to death?,life is a death sentence isn't it?,the only thing that is accomplished is that the executioners and everyone involved has just violated a rule.
    !!!!!!!!! Thou Shalt Not Kill !!!!!!!!!!!!!1
     
  13. Clockwood You Forgot Poland Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,467
    the commandment "Thou shalt not kill" was originally written in hebrew. It was mistranslated. It really means "Thou shalt not murder"
     
  14. spookz Banned Banned

    Messages:
    6,390
    Torah Perspective On Incaceration

    Every civilization throughout history has promulgated rules providing for the punishment of those who offend society’s norms. The history of criminal justice is replete with societies that have included the practice of "incarceration" as one form of such punishment with—arguably—various degrees of success as a deterrent to crime or as a form of retribution for it.

    In 1996, under America’s criminal justice system, we have incarcerated over 1,100,000 of our fellow citizens in federal, state and county facilities. Prison building has been described as one of the "growth" industries for the 1990s—and beyond.

    American society is often said to be built on "Judeo-Christian" values. Yet, the concept of prison nowhere appears in the "Judeo" part of that equation. Indeed, while sentencing options as diverse as financial penalties, atonement offerings, corporeal punishment, capital punishment and even death directly by the hand of G-d are found in the Torah, the punishment of "incarceration" as we know it is nowhere to be found in traditional Torah-based Jewish law


    Another form of restrictive liberty—often misunderstood as "prisons" by readers of the Bible—were the "Cities of Refuge," three of which were established by Moses just prior to the Jews’ entry into the Holy Land after wandering though the desert for forty years and three others established by Joshua after the Jews settled in the Land of Israel. Those cities were, in effect, the earliest known form of "protective custody." Persons found guilty of unpremeditated murder were given the option of moving into one of what eventually were six cities, thereby escaping the lawful revenge of the victim’s surviving relatives.

    But the Cities of Refuge cannot—under any stretch of the imagination—be deemed to have functioned in any way similar to today’s prisons. For one thing, the offender was not isolated from contact with his loved ones and outside contacts. These environments were penal colonies that had all functions of a community, including productive work. Indeed, once the offender chose to flee to one of the cities, the court would order the inmate’s wife, children and teacher to accommodate him. The underlying purpose of the Cities of Refuge was atonement, not isolation


    A clear indication that the Torah does not advocate the use of prisons is the fact that, while the Scriptures deal in minutest detail with all punishments, giving the precise method of their infliction, types of instruments used, amount of fines, etc., there is absolutely no guidance to be found with respect to punitive incarceration


    For the criminal, the consequential punishment of crime brings penance, atonement, rehabilitation and ultimate purging. After being punished, one starts with a fresh slate; Jewish law dictates that the community must accept the wrongdoer as before and he regains a place in the World to Come. For the victim and society, punishment must serve goals such as restitution, deterrence, retribution and protection.

    Imprisonment does not serve these functions. It certainly brings no benefit (short or long term) to the victim. It appears to offer only temporary benefit to society (taking into account the high percentage of recidivism and the increasing numbers of people being sent "away"). And it obviously does no good for the inmate. On the contrary, prison inhibits and limits man’s potential, destroys families and breeds bitterness, anger, insensitivity and eventual recidivism


    PrisonerRights
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2002
  15. spookz Banned Banned

    Messages:
    6,390
    philosophy and goals of incaceration today

    Incarceration of prisoners under conditions consistent with human dignity;
    Rehabilitation and reintegration programmes,

    Proper supervision of persons under community corrections

    Procurement and acquisition of adequate resources which enable effective response to challenges through progressive management, trained personnel, sound work ethics, performance management and good governance.


    To keep offenders in safe custody

    To supervise and control probationers and parolees

    To maintain control, discipline and a safe environment in prison

    To provide humane conditions for offenders

    To provide rehabilitation programmes which help offenders to address their offending behaviour and allow them to live and lead responsible lives

    To assist offenders with re-integration into the community

    To deliver correctional services using the resources provided by with maximum efficiency


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  16. Adriatic Registered Member

    Messages:
    25
    Being dead or being "dead alive" ?

    I am against "Life imprisonment without parole" & capital penalty.
    You should ask yourself why is USA "prison state" having more prisoners than farmers.

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  17. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    Wisconsin

    I am from Wisconsin,here there are some pretty stupid laws,just one example are the many drunk driving laws,now a drunk driving ticket stays on your record for life,gee,I wonder who benefits from that law?,what if you get pulled over for nothing,which is within the cop's rights now?and the cop just decides to give you a sobriety test? if you refuse you still get a drunk driving ticket,that's how the law is now,and if someone wearing all black step out in front of a car on the highway at night say,maybe the pedestrian is shitfaced,and he dies when he gets hit by the car,the driver of the car is charged with MURDER,,even if the drunk ped has a suicide note in his pocket,and the driver has a minimum of alcohol in his system,this is rediculous,dont you think?.Laws like this are what began to turn me against the government of this country,they are just growing a whole prison society here.The fact that the legal system will only help if you can afford it is also an outrage,even if you can afford it.you still have to pay the bloodsucking lawyer,even if he/she loses the case for you,we're in a downward spiral here.
     
  18. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,331
    Re: Wisconsin

    And why shouldn't it? Driving drunk is pretty stupid.
    Please provide support of this statement.
    Why would you refuse, unless you had been drinking and driving, I mean.
    Please provide support of this statement.
    There is a difference between driving under the influence of alcohol, and driving while intoxicated, at least in Maryland laws. What are they in your state? Even if not legally intoxicated, being under the influence of alcohol impairs your reaction time. You might reasonably expect to be charged with manslaughter, but I highly doubt it would be murder.

    Peace.

    __________________
    Youth is the first victim of war - the first fruit of peace.
    It takes 20 years or more of peace to make a man;
    it takes only 20 seconds of war to destroy him.
    • -- King Boudewijn I, King of Belgium (1934-1993)
     
  19. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    Erlcohurl

    Well ,the fact that it stays on your record for life is really good for the insurance companies to bleed you forever,and I really can't think of any other reason,REALLY!,that this would be the case.
    I got pulled over for nothing,my dome light was burned out so I had to fumble around to find my license and the cop wanted to do sobriety tests,he said he pulled me over because a spark flew off my car,it is well maintained,maybe I ran over a piece of debris in the road.
    I refused to do the sobriety test because it is within my right to do so,and I had a stroke a year before and would have failed it any way,because I have somewhat of a stagger and balance problems,he asked me to do a breathalizer also,we were within 1 mile of a cell tower,which emits radio interference making it inaccurate,I refused that too.
    In wisconsin,if there is a death from any kind of a car accident,even if the person who has had a drink,and registers below the legal limit,is not at fault,that person is charged with murder,if they were obviously NOT at fault,sound right to you?,this is the law in wisconsin.
    And the most amusing thing about all of this is there are people out there,including you,who have some kind of a problem with something because the establishment has you brainwashed into thinking something is wrong,when it is not.
    Check the statistics,alcohol and driving are not such a big deal that we all should have to pay for the mistakes of the few,the whole thing is about money,don't you understand that?,how is anything being done to the establishment or government if you drive drunk,get pulled over,for nothing,for weaving,for a light out,the government takes no damage,so what are you paying them for,if anyone takes damage,I could see paying them,not the cops though.
    These laws are to take your wealth only,if the man really wants to mess with you,he will whip out a law so he can,it is all about control,and that is all,take your money,and take away your priviledges.
    Did you know that in the constitution there is mentioned the RIGHT of movement,which is supposed to be the final word on that,but you have to pay to get a drivers license to drive a car,when everything is too distant to walk or ride a bicycle,and the license is just a way to take just a little piece of your freedom away,don't tell me you haven't noticed how this is happening please,if you haven't ,wake up.
    That is pretty much why I mentioned those rediculous laws,and they get worse all the time,pretty soon all our rights will be gone,then what will you do?.
     
  20. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,331
    How about to know if you are a repeat offender? When should it stop counting against you that you endangered the general public?
    This could have easily been substantiated by a doctor's certification; where is the problem?
    Please substantiate this statement.
    Can you provide us with an example of this happening?
    As I stated in my earlier post, you can be below the "legal limit" and still be impaired. It should certainly have a bearing on determining fault. Perhaps a driver is under the legal limit, but impairment prevented them from reacting quickly enough to avoid an accident. In this case, they become at fault as they should not have been there in the first place.
    You certainly have not read any meaningful sample of posts if you think that of me. I let it go at that.
    Here's a novel idea. Why don't you present facts to support your statements for a change. Or will this end like the supposed FBI/Federal Reserve connection you espouse, where you just lose interest because you continue to be challenged to provide factual information?
    Sorry to be rude, but yadda yadda yadda...
    Come on. You know what I'm gonna say: just a wee bit of proof?

    Please?

    __________________
    Youth is the first victim of war - the first fruit of peace.
    It takes 20 years or more of peace to make a man;
    it takes only 20 seconds of war to destroy him.
    • -- King Boudewijn I, King of Belgium (1934-1993)
     
  21. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    goody goody

    get a life,this is not worth my time.
     
  22. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,331
    "goody goody"

    Just about the response I expected, but
    the number of syllables did surprise me.
     
  23. unbalanced Banned Banned

    Messages:
    137
    Ok

    The fact that you even responded puts it on you
     

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