Hi, guys. I was pondering this "phenomenon" all day yesterday. We humans tend to be fond of things that we grow up with, for example. We may have a deep love for hearing a certain type of accent or be drawn to certain types of flowers (flowers that would have had some significance in childhood). This is different than other forms of fondness that have involved intellectual scrutiny. Maybe I am fond of Apple Mac computers because I have critically thought about the advantages and disadvantages. Maybe I am fond of driving electric cars because I know about the environmental benefits, etc. These are things we have actively thought out. With fondness created through childhood memory only - well - this intrigues me. It means even in adult life, you may still be fond of something that, upon careful consideration find that fondness for x is an inferior position to occupy, you cannot actively change how you feel about x. This bugs me all the time in public when interacting with friends and strangers. Many of their likes, which are also things they constantly talk up to others, are just involuntarily-formed products of one's environment. Essentially, they mean very little in an objective world. I find that a lot of communication involves speaking about these things. I constantly become aware of my own childhood-formed fondnesses and try to subdue their influence on my tastes by self-critical analysis. Is there any point in this if one's aim is to be a more objective person? Can this natural tendency be counteracted or assuaged? What do you guys think about these subjective likes and dislikes?
There could be different reasons, maybe your subjective like for objectivity has been caused by a sense of wanting to blend in. Otherwise I think individual likes and dislikes are formed to make us stand out from the crowd and enhance our uniqueness and attractiveness to the opposite gender and to the general population to impress them and raise our status in the group.
I agree. I grew up hoping we would map the planets and we have, I grew up wanting to understand the nature of the Universe better and we really have in the past 30 years. We grew up hoping movies could be more and they are- from IMax to the digital precision of, say LOTR: ROTK. However, some things come and go. Like the Yugo. It's all subjective but ultimately it's all good.
Emotions are said to be shortcuts to avoid the need to dissect, examine and logically work through the correct interaction/reaction to a given situation. They allow us to 'cut to the chase' in our coping behaviors. They can indeed be changed and/or altered consciously. That is one of the goals of entering therapy - changing your emotional relationship with someone, or reaction to a stimulus or memory.
what each of us consider 'fond' is subjective to the emotional attachment to said item.. IOW we remember the feeling we were experiencing during the times we played with said item (or situation) (association) as we get older we tend to forget all but the emotional content.. (w/exceptions)
The one that hits me is the act of loving certain foods. All of us have certain foods we were given in childhood that we like now. Indians and curry. Americans and apple pie. British and dumplings. Me and roast lamb. I see no problem with this effect in its wider effect. If we want to be truly objective in our understanding of the world, we can accomplish that also. It is a case of the old adage : "know thyself". There is no need to suppress the emotional effects of early conditioning. Just understand them.
I think that the key to this is being sufficiently self-aware to know the difference between a fondness that is purely a habit developed in childhood and one that is the result of reasoning. Then you can examine the unreasoned ones and decide whether they're causing you any trouble. Preferring spaghetti to chow mein or enchiladas as your pasta of choice isn't going to be much of a problem (if you live in America). But preferring dark skin to light skin or vice versa will be a very large problem. If you realize that, then you can think about whether you're so comfortable with the preference that you're willing to endure the problem, or that you'd rather look for a way to get past it or around it.
This makes me wonder if it's even possible, in some cases, to contemplate the extent of one's delusions due to early childhood conditioning. Take a Muslim woman who might be fond of her culture, her inferior role in society and of her burqa. She may well go out and advocate these things because she "likes" them. But these fondnesses are, undoubtedly, a result of her childhood conditioning and environment. The question is, does she have the ability to become lucidly aware of her state of being? Can she switch to a more objective mode of thought and make some sort of realisation as to why she is fond of the things she is?
mercaptan That is the difference between a person who is trained and practised at critical thinking versus someone who has no mental discipline and uses emotional logic. I would like to think that the contributors to this forum (most at least) have learned from their science training to think in a more rational way, and avoid the emotional thought entanglements that lead so many astray. If you have good mental discipline, then you can look at your own conditioning in a more objective way. By understanding your own desires and where they come from, you break free of being enslaved by them. You are still free to enjoy them, of course. Just as I enjoy my roast lamb with mint sauce and gravy, even though I fully understand the conditioning that came from its use in celebratory meals when I was a child. There are muslim women who are devout but resist the subjugation of women, because they understand that this part of the Muslim way comes from the emotional desires of men, and not from something higher. Any person with mental strength and discipline can rise above such demeaning conditioning. At the end, I say : enjoy your emotions and your conditioned desires, but understand them so that you are not their slave.
Oh, another time, another place Another smile on another face When you see me- walking up beside you You get the feeling that all my love's inside of you. 100 points to who names it.
Iron Maiden - purgatory lyrics. Of course, I cheated, and used google. http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Purgatory-lyrics-Iron-Maiden/53B79BA4867C77BF482568D1002676A2 Oh, and it is supposed to say "floating up beside you."
You both failed because you Googled it. Sorry guys. (Just glad I could type from memory accurately.) The point of the lyrics is the point of the song- which is an analogy for the point of this thread.
