He says its going to cover everyone and its going to reduce the deficit at the same time. How can you not be in favor of both of those results?
A joke? Or naivete? Just because Obama says ANYTHING doesn't mean it's truthful. You DO know that right? Plenty of people would say those are outright lies. I would probably agree with those people. How does creating universal healthcare reduce the deficit? I mean, really... I have nothing against healthcare reform. I'm sure there's a few good things in there. I haven't read the 2000 page behemoth. I don't need to. Nothing that large should EVER EVER EVER be voted on. Especially when things are being added to it in closed-door meetings. But at least it's not as blatantly stupid as the OXYMORON Act. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! People who put together sweeping, Constitution-destroying legislation are dumb. People who expect others to vote on said legislation without providing written copies of the actual bill are dumb. People who would vote for said bill without having read the damn thing don't deserve to be in office and probably should be tried for treason. I cheerfully invite anyone who actually thinks the above behavior of voting for radically transformative laws without even reading them is a good thing, to please do voice your opinion. I will state up front that you are... to put it lightly... :crazy:
The guy won the Nobel Peace Prize right before he continued the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. What makes you think he won't reduce government spending by providing the best healthcare money can buy for everyone in America? Obama can do it. You will see! Obama will pay for all our bills! We won't have to worry! All you have to do is believe. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P36x8rTb3jI&feature=related Or is it? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiM7NHcRY58
The sarcasm is not obvious! Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Black lady... remember that... absolutely crazy. White girl... kinda cute... kinda funny... let's run the lights all night...
Well to be perfectly honest the main reason most people are against healthcare reform in the US is because the democrats are pushing for it, therefor it must be wrong and evil. Some are even inclined to believe that healthcare reform is in fact being pushed by just one man, and evil communist/fascist Kenyan national who as taken control of the US via voodoo magic. Who to blame for this kind of paranoia? The republicans, the insurance lobby, etc, take your pick. We can't have a honest discussion in this country about the need to reduce health care prices and improve health care quality to that of other first world nations without having to resort to ad hominems. Obama is this, Obama is that, I don't care I just want to get affordable healthcare!
You are right on ElectricFetus! And the people against it get into the weird shit like not being consitutional. You cannot make big changes. You cannot do this and you cannot do that completely ignoring what many others have done - like the rest of the world which has a more efficient and cost effective system of healthcare. I think the US is certianly as capable of doing anything thing else that our allies and other industrial countries have done. I think the answer boils down to fear. Republicans and their industry allies have been exceptional at keeping Americans scared - wittness the posts by Giamattista. Frankly, it is time for Americans to wake up and stop falling victim to the politics of fear.
But if we interpret our founding fathers, who were infallible, in a specific manner interpreting what they did not say was a right as meaning we can't have that right. So because are founding fathers did not say women could vote, therefor women do not have a right to vote, and because are founding fathers did not say we should have the right to medical care, we don't have the right and should never have that right. Haha, fat chance.
I'm afraid of not responding to the politics of fear. As for the OP: it's figured it will be "too expensive". And, given how things work, it probably will be. More or perhaps fewer people will not be helped by the plan, when it is or is not done, if it is indeed completely done and not partially.
First, a correction: It's NOT Obama's plan! It would have been IF he had taken a leadership role (like he should have) instead of leaving it up to congress to muddle around, make backdoor deals and create the monstrosity that they have. In my opinion, he completely dropped the ball on his promise and did so with purpose - after all, he's just another politician. This way, he can win, no matter what happens. If congress fails to pass it, he can blame congress. If congress DOES pass it and it turns out to be the eight-legged monster that half the country believes it will, he can STILL blame congress for the mess. That's what a politician does for a living - make someone else responsible if a mess-up happens. But claim responsibility if things work out right. :shrug:
You may be right about the fat chance. But I figure if our military has the balls to put their life on the line for the benefit of the country, our politicians and voters should be brave enough to do the things needed to keep the country well. Strangely these consitutional whackos have a dreadful lack of understanding in regards to the consitution. For instance they fail too recognize or understand that the reason the document came to be was to form a more powerful central government. And even the founding fathers would not lay claim to the infalibility to which the whackos would lay at their feet. That is the very reason they left us with a change process....it is called the amendment process whereby the founding documents can be changed as needed. It is a sad state when some people can listen to limbabugh, beck, levin, et al for a few hours, perhaps read a few whacko books, and walk away thinking that they are consitutional experts. And they really don't even know the basics about the history of this country or the founding fathers or their documents.
Is Giamattista related to Giambattista? Industry allies? Lobbyists never attach themselves to Democrats, do they? They's perfect little angels! AU CONTRAIRE! But let me guess, it was only Republicans responsible for that? Democrats are never beholden to special interests! I guess you also missed the little sentence in my previous post about the fact that I'm not against healthcare reform. I'm not an expert on healthcare, but from what I know of this package, I wouldn't vote for it. I wouldn't vote for it simply because of its length.
Wrong. We're against it because we don't want the government taking over any more of our lives--especially something so valuable/precious as our healthcare. ANYTHING the government touches turns to sh*t. EVERYTHING. We don't want to pay for babies to be killed, criminal aliens' coverage, death panels, long lines, rationed care etc. And that is EXACTLY what you will get. Blame the people who commit fraud against the insurance companies. They are hiking costs for everyone. Anyone can find money for insurance. Most people would rather have their addictions. I agree prices should be reduced. I should not pay high premiums because my company is too stupid to find all the fraud. I will NEVER need cancer, heart problem, AIDS, pregnancy, STD or any other coverage. Mine is catastrophic-only and I still pay out the nose because of all the sick people I am grouped-in with. Hospitals are going broke because people refuse to pay. That hikes costs for everyone. If we had more self-responsibility we would all be better off. Not more government intervention.
I never said Democrats were not without fault. The discussion was about the politics of fear which is the Republican trump card. Dems have stayed away from fear poltics. Republicans have perfected it. And if the only reason you are against healthcare is because of its length, I think that is a pretty poor reason. Most legislation is rather lengthy. Are there better processes for creation of legislation, probably. But that is not the system we have.
It's not about fear. It's about the filth that the bill allows--killing babies, death panels, covering criminal aliens etc. The bill should scare the crap out of anyone who reads it.
I consider length to be a good indicator of pork and excess. And the principle that you accept all or nothing. I would never vote for anything over a thousand pages. Period. Because the chances of things I don't agree with in it would be extremely high. Unless it was an absolutely perfect bill. I would say, Cut this down into important 100-200 page sections, and we can vote on the individual pieces. That just feels sensible to me.
more untruths from the land of rhe ivory tower. the government does a reasonablely good job. and the history of government run health care shows it has always out performed the private sector. fraud is minor. the prices are high so they can rake in the money. yeah food,clothing, and shelter are addictions? most people can't afford it. most of the fraud is the insurance company not paying out and dropping people. So tell than whose going to win the super bowl this year? So your complaint is that insurance is well being insurance. That's right I guess sick people should just fucking die. People can't pay. when the average hospital bill is greater than the median income of the country. the government needs to get involved it the only way prices will go down. We pay the most because we rely on the private sector. their is a reason we pay more and get less than other countries.
Or maybe some people simply believe it's inappropriate for the government to involve itself in this matter?
