Will the U.S. be humane in the Event of War? I really don't think so. (They are advertising the Mother of All bombs. ) Traditionaly the United Stated Army have been viewed as Rape and pilagers. So is there any possibility that this time will be different?

It will all look fine on CNN. We'll only have to shoot the al-Jhazeerah viewers- their ratings will go down anyway, once we kill 30,000 or so of them.

Joy...

Like with Afghanistan and dozens of other examples. It will be after the storm that we will be able to measure USA’s level if inhumanity!!
:rolleyes:

This is the time to be Humane. In the event of war, it's too late to be humane.

Agreed but it seems that the U.S. Gov is hell bent on going to war. Whether they are right or not. Can't you guys impeach Bush or something? Can there be anything done to prevent war.

I have even come across an article on Scifroums from the Times webs site where the governent admited to using econmic pressure as well as other pressure points to sway the votes of other nations. I mean that is insane, how is Bush any differnet then Saddam or Osama for that matter?

Seriously in Canada we have problems with our polticians getting in trouble for calling the U.S. governments idiots. This is painfully obvious and it can be proven. Why is the U.S. sad human rights record not brough into the debate. It is a factor.

Theres talk of impeaching bush but it wont be in time to stop this war.
And afterwards hey america will have the oil so the powers that be wont care about ol dubbbya anymore.
At the end of the day Dubbya is as much a puppet as the regiems America supports.
You think a man with an IQ as low as Dubbya can run the US of A...granted no he cant and its falling apart at the seems and still he tears more holes in it ^_^ but ya think they would let him stay, or that those speaches are his..the guy who cant even speak engl...sorry..american...when he learnt a new word *Hispanic* i was pissing myself laughing at how often he threw it into conversations despite how inapropriate or irrelevant it is just to show hes smart and learnt a new word lol.
If he is empeached after the war...what good does it do...America has the oil rights and the money from its contracts and is now tied to Iraq, the one to replace him will simply say im sorry for his actions...and carry on milking his cow as it were.
The whole system needs to change.

I mean in a country where Business runs the government and an environment where they keep apealing to their millitary to solve problems, one where they can assasinate their own president or rig elections to get who they want in the white house....you cant just keep changing its face and expect it to be a different system.

America needs to wake up and stop plowing all its economy into weapons, stop encouraging violence around the globe to secure its "interests" and help real sollutions, stop undermining international bodies like the UN and ICC and co-operate totally to make them efficient, just as the bodies like the UN need to grow a freaking backbone and stop playing hostage to bullies like the US.
It needs to stop using its economy to hurt countries it "doesnt like" and make a real effort to improving not only its own citizens lives, the health and education system in america is a joke imho.
It also needs to make REAL! contributions to world health, not selling off countries to big business or tying their promises of aid into finance packages or to profit.
Even Britain seems to be slipping back down the road of fixing its problems by War and that needs to be niped in the bud.
Also they really need to stop the draconian death penalty, especially as they have the system so well and truely screwed up and corrupted even if they slap down any critisicm the statistics speak for themselves.

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/apr2002/illi-a27.shtml
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/mar2002/exec-m14.shtml

And there are many worse stories than that.
With so many of the "Democracies" going so badly wrong you have to wonder, has the world really gone to shit.
*me looks for the emergency glass to push the button that ends the world*, tis for the good of us all.

Dragon, In true American fashion, I expect leaks of internal policies undermining the rights of American citizens will cause an impeachment crisis, unless the occupation goes badly and re-election looks impossible. In that case, all 3 visible branches of the government will quietly agree to attempt to let it slide. But with world opinion heading where it is, it probably won't.

If the problem is business, then there is a simple solution. Make it no longer profitable to be well evil. More and more of the general population support green technologies, less child labor and equality amoung all nations. So the smart business man would appeal to these growing trends. It would be wise to feed them because you can make allot of money and enter a virgin market. That seems fairly profitable. The slow die fast in the business world. The business world is easy to munipulate because we have a direct say in what happends (We buy there stuff). This society is a consumer culture, just show them what they want it they will buy it. The same can work for peace. Make it unprofitable. Seriously do you think wise international corporation would rely on a country that black mails them every time they go to war? It is not profitable.

Each time you buy something you are casting a vote.

Yes.

After the occupation is complete the war of attrition wil continue much like an extended Viet Nam war.

The hope of financing the war with Iraqi oil will fall short of all expectaions from sanctions by Europe Russia and China as well as sabotage and impedence of delivering the oil EVERY step of the way.

We will claim victory yet be financially ruined.

As for It becoming a Viet Nam type atrition situation, I think not.
We now have the capability of turning the jungles of Iraq into a desert.
No one is going to sanction us (US). Get real!
Besides, we can finance the war with tax cuts.

Hi everyone,

What a time is now!! UN is considering a military action against US & UK; US is planning a genocide against humanity!!
Let's read - it is quite interesting:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0303/S00206.htm

regards

Chris

What is humane about war?

The daisy cutter is about as humane as the USA will be. There are no humane methods or weapons in war. We will treat POW's in a more humane manner than Iraq.

http://cndyorks.gn.apc.org/news/articles/fuelairbombs.htm

http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/dumb/

We will be extremely humane. We will not drop nukes or daisycutters or Moabs in the middle of Baghdad. We will not have any concentration camps where we gass prisoners. We will not, ahem, torture anyone and then rape their loved ones in front of them and then cut out their eyes and drag them through the street on a meathook.

If we want to be really cruel we will just repair their city infrastructure, give them a democratic government, and free protection from their neighbors once we get in.

Kinda hard when Iraqi soldiers will have women & children. Before you spin me the yarn about the rules of engagement blah blah about civilians turning to combatants as soon as they fire on troops the fact remains that a lot of "grey area" stuff will go on that we'll never hear cause it's hard to get these situations right everytime a kid walks up to a soldier whose been in combat & scared he'll blow up like his buddy before him. You really reckon it will be humane out there? Kill 'em - but humanely

Originally posted by Empty Dragon
Will the U.S. be humane in the Event of War? I really don't think so. (They are advertising the Mother of All bombs. ) Traditionaly the United Stated Army have been viewed as Rape and pilagers. So is there any possibility that this time will be different?

There is no tradition of rape and pilllaging in the US army.

There have been a number of things listed here that "we will not do". Are any of you aware of the things that "we will do"? The daisycutter is a terrible weapon. Even experienced Marines were shocked by looking at the bodies of Iraqi soldiers who were killed by daiseycutters in GW1.

The aftermath of a daisycutter can leave behaind a vacuum that can actully make a persons eyes pop out of their head while they are at the same time suffocating. cheers

The aftermath of a daisycutter can leave behaind a vacuum that can actully make a persons eyes pop out of their head while they are at the same time suffocating.

NEATO! Can we blanket the country in nerve gas like Saddam did? Huh huh can we can we????

Gees I finally understand.
Sadddam took the nerve gas that we gave him and dropped it on some Kurd villages in the 1980's, when you were six years old. So now, "we" must pay pennance for giving him the nerve agents, by dropping daisycutters on Iraqi children. Oh my! Oh my! It is all so simple isn't it.

The us has no history of being humane in war or in peace for that matter. This country was founded on genocide and nutured with slavery. We'll no doubt attack with a genocidal, xenophobic rage fueled by this governments isolationism and images of revenge for 9/11. Manifest destiny for oil.

here is no tradition of rape and pilllaging in the US army.
Vietname.....

I think I will stay here in America anyway. How many of you plan to leave?

Originally posted by Empty Dragon
Will the U.S. be humane in the Event of War? I really don't think so. (They are advertising the Mother of All bombs. ) Traditionaly the United Stated Army have been viewed as Rape and pilagers. So is there any possibility that this time will be different?

You have been reading/watching too much left wing anti war propaganda. Of course the troops will be humane; it is part of their brief to take prisoners and to care for the populace.

left wing anti war propaganda

As oppossed to right wing pro war propaganda?

What is said and what is done can be too different things. Actions speak louder then words.

Originally posted by Empty Dragon
Vietname.....

That's bullshit. I served two tours in Vietnam. There was My Lai, of course, but i would point out the army prosecuted Lt. Calley and a sergeant (whose name escapes me) for that. There were other isolated cases of rape and cruelty as well, I'm sure; that happens in any war with ANY army, but the military command in Vietnam did not turn a blind eye and allow the army to wreak havoc on the populace. You're going to have to do better than that. Hey. I'll give you some help. You would have been better suited using the Filipino guerilla war from 1899-1902. There were a lot of documented reports of cruelty during that conflict, unfortunately, because that was during the height of Social Darwinism, and Americans considered Filipinos on the same level as they had African slaves and treated them as such. But you can find accounts of rape in any war of the 20th century that the US was involved in, no doubt, but those incidents were rare and were exceptions to the rule. I would be willing to bet that you can't show proof of any nation involved in war that doesn't have accounts of rape in its records. If you've experienced war then you know that all types of men make up an army, and the sometimes chaotic nature of war allows some men to act outside the boundaries of normalcy. But Americans certainly don't have a monopoly on it.

great post

The voice of experience.

My girlfriends father fought on the Vietnamese side. So I am basing some of my opinion, on the stories he told his daughter. I may be mistaken, but then again I may not. I am not so arrogant as to think I know for sure.

In August 1964, the United States began air strikes against North Vietnam. Nine years later, a cease fire was called in Paris by the U.S., North Vietnam and South Vietnam but never carried out.

Before the war ended in May 1975, the conflict claimed almost 58,000 American lives 47,000 from hostile action and 11,000 from other causes, according to the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. More than 300,000 were wounded, 75,000 received severe disabilities. Vietnam civilian casualties top one million, while displaced war refugees number 6.5 million.

During the Korean War, terror bombing of civilians was the policy of the US Air Force's Far East Command, which was instructed to pulverise anything that moved within enemy territory. So successful was this policy that in the summer of 1951, the commander was able to report that 'there is no structure left to be targeted' (Dickson 1995, p.34).

Agent Orange.

According to unofficial reports, between 1961 and 1971, US aircraft sprayed 72 million litres of toxic chemicals, including 44 million litres of Agent Orange, containing 170 kilograms of dioxin, on Vietnam. Dioxin is an extremely poisonous chemical that causes cancer, immune system deficiency and inborn defects.


There was My Lai, of course, but i would point out the army prosecuted Lt. Calley and a sergeant (whose name escapes me) for that. Wasn't it Capt. Ernest Medina? My Lai was a sick slaugher. Prosecuting the commanding officers? Is that it?

My Lai......*sigh so much suffering.

Chief Warrant Officer Hugh Thompson.

When Thompson and his crew saw what was happening on the ground, they couldn’t believe it at first. Then they were sickened. Then they became enraged. Thompson said some very, very evil stuff was going on down there. They repeatedly saw young boys and girls being shot at point-blank range. As often happened in Vietnam, they saw American soldiers sodomizing and raping girls and women before murdering them.

The rape cases in Okinawa...... There is has been much documented evidence, to support this. Though how could one accurately draw figures on rape commited by the U.S. army. Who is going to know? Who is going to speak?

Do not make the mistake that I am anti-american. Because I know that there are true men in America. Men like Hugh Thompson. I do not think that every U.S. soldier will rape and pillage.
I would be willing to bet that you can't show proof of any nation involved in war that doesn't have accounts of rape in its records. If you've experienced war then you know that all types of men make up an army, and the sometimes chaotic nature of war allows some men to act outside the boundaries of normalcy. But Americans certainly don't have a monopoly on it. I tend to agree with you. My issue is the consistency and the severity. The actions of the United States have shown a trend to only breed more war, more pain, more suffering...... Seriously enough is enough. The United States has never been the home of the free and just. That is the original concept it was founded upon. There is much work to be done. I realize that there is good intention at the heart of the United States. Good intentions pave the road to hell.

America is a great society. It has amazing potential, but it has fallen far from being the voice of liberty and justice. The star spangled banner has been disgraced with the blood of the innocent. If one looks at history it is easy to see that the United Stated have never been a nation of virtue. What I find so tragic is that so many great men have died, to uphold justice and liberty. Do not let there deaths be in vain.

What is justice? Who can decide what is just? Just and un-just is merly a matter of perspective. So how can you be sure that your perspective is correct?

What is libery? What man can say that they are truly free?

"My girlfriends father fought on the Vietnamese side. "

Which Vietnamese side??

I believe it was the north.

<i>My girlfriends father fought on the Vietnamese side. So I am basing some of my opinion, on the stories he told his daughter. I may be mistaken, but then again I may not. I am not so arrogant as to think I know for sure.</i>

The things I saw the NVA and Viet Cong do to the Vietnamese people would have made your blood curdle. They truly believed in the concept of 'total' war to achieve an objective. I saw grown men heaving their guts out in the aftermath of some of the slaughters in villages we entered.

<i>Before the war ended in May 1975, the conflict claimed almost 58,000 American lives 47,000 from hostile action and 11,000 from other causes, according to the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. More than 300,000 were wounded, 75,000 received severe disabilities. Vietnam civilian casualties top one million, while displaced war refugees number 6.5 million.

During the Korean War, terror bombing of civilians was the policy of the US Air Force's Far East Command, which was instructed to pulverise anything that moved within enemy territory. So successful was this policy that in the summer of 1951, the commander was able to report that 'there is no structure left to be targeted' (Dickson 1995, p.34).</i>

Nobody's ever made the claim that war was clean.

<i>Agent Orange.

According to unofficial reports, between 1961 and 1971, US aircraft sprayed 72 million litres of toxic chemicals, including 44 million litres of Agent Orange, containing 170 kilograms of dioxin, on Vietnam. Dioxin is an extremely poisonous chemical that causes cancer, immune system deficiency and inborn defects.</i>

AO was was intended to be used to destroy foliage, helping to eliminate ambushes along routes. It was not intended to poison the populace. I lost two good buddies to cancer from AO, and two more childhood friends from my hometown.

<i>Wasn't it Capt. Ernest Medina? My Lai was a sick slaugher. Prosecuting the commanding officers? Is that it?</i>

No, Medina was the sergeant I was think of; Calley was the Loo.
Yes, they ordered the slaughter. <i>Is that it?</i> Well, I could get in to a long diatribe about what it's like to be 19 and half a world away embroiled in a savage guerilla war with a deadly enemy, and the frustrations that go with it, but unless you've experienced it first hand, it would be pointless. Not condoning what happened; just saying I understood the rage that apparently built in those men. Unfortunately, they didn't have capable officers that either recognized their growing rage or either didn't have the will to hold that rage in check.

<i>The rape cases in Okinawa...... There is has been much documented evidence, to support this. Though how could one accurately draw figures on rape commited by the U.S. army. Who is going to know? Who is going to speak?</i>

What? The US has had thousands of troops stationed at that base for 50+ years and there has been what? A handful of documented cases. <i>Who is going to speak?</i> Well, so far, the parents of the raped women have spoken and the US military has reacted by prosecuting and convicting the guilty. And I believe those cases involved Marines.

<i>I tend to agree with you. My issue is the consistency and the severity.</i>

Not sure what you mean by consistency. If you mean something has happened in every war, then sure. As I noted before, armies are made up of all kinds of men, and some men will take whatever becomes available. We have social laws against that, and there are rules of conduct in the military as well. When it does happen, someone will usually be there to condemn it. I saw a hell of a lot more Hugh Thompsons in Vietnam than Ernest Medinas. The latter were rare.

<i>The actions of the United States have shown a trend to only breed more war, more pain, more suffering......</i>

Not sure what that has to do with the subject of rape and pillaging. As I said, cases of breakdowns in decency are a reality in warfare, regardless of the nations involved. But civilized nations will keep them to a minimum. If we had a tendency towards war, I suppose we could stay in a perpetual stae of it, but obviously we don't. But yes, war does tend to cause pain and suffering.

<i>Seriously enough is enough. The United States has never been the home of the free and just.</i>

???

<i>There is much work to be done. I realize that there is good intention at the heart of the United States. Good intentions pave the road to hell.

America is a great society. It has amazing potential, but it has fallen far from being the voice of liberty and justice. The star spangled banner has been disgraced with the blood of the innocent. If one looks at history it is easy to see that the United Stated have never been a nation of virtue. What I find so tragic is that so many great men have died, to uphold justice and liberty. Do not let there deaths be in vain.</i>

Again, you're going off on another tangent completely. I don't know what any of that has to do with the original pretext of the thread. I'm sure you mean well, but you're losing me.

<i>What is justice? Who can decide what is just? Just and un-just is merly a matter of perspective. So how can you be sure that your perspective is correct?</i>

What perspective? That I don't think the US military has a tradition of rape and pillage? I don't, and to be honest, I've seen nothing that you posted that proved otherwise to me.

<i>What is libery? What man can say that they are truly free?</i>

Nobody in any society is truly free. We accept that when we agree to abide by societal laws. I like what I've got though.

The things I saw the NVA and Viet Cong do to the Vietnamese people would have made your blood curdle. They truly believed in the concept of 'total' war to achieve an objective. I saw grown men heaving their guts out in the aftermath of some of the slaughters in villages we entered.

I would agree. I have read documentation that those tactics where used less by the NVA and Viet Cong. I may very well be mistaken, but they had some documentation (What ever that is worth) that it was those kinds of terrorist acts where done less frequently by the NVA and Viet Cong. Ther reason that the documents gave was that it jsut isn't an intellegent move, it would help lose the support of the masses.

Nobody's ever made the claim that war was clean.
Nobody did. It is tragic and pointless. It is rare that anything but a perpetual cycle of suffering.

AO was was intended to be used to destroy foliage, helping to eliminate ambushes along routes. It was not intended to poison the populace. I lost two good buddies to cancer from AO, and two more childhood friends from my hometown.

I understand the tactical significance of using AO, though some of the information I have came across claims that it was used on crops as well. Even it it wasn't intented to poison the populace, it did. Like I said before often good intentions pave the road to hell.

What? The US has had thousands of troops stationed at that base for 50+ years and there has been what? A handful of documented cases. Who is going to speak? Well, so far, the parents of the raped women have spoken and the US military has reacted by prosecuting and convicting the guilty. And I believe those cases involved Marines.

I had came across a figure that was 304 recorded cases (I could be wrong I will keep searching). Though rape is a tricky thing, it is something that is easy for the military to concel. Usually there is only two people involved so it is on word agains another.

Lets face it the offical stament of the military have little relevance to truth. They are merly political tools.

I saw a hell of a lot more Hugh Thompsons in Vietnam than Ernest Medinas. The latter were rare.
I can no say I know, and I cannot trust your word (No offence but your are a service man so it is essentialy biast). I hope that what you are telling me is the truth.Not sure what that has to do with the subject of rape and pillaging. As I said, cases of breakdowns in decency are a reality in warfare, regardless of the nations involved. But civilized nations will keep them to a minimum. If we had a tendency towards war, I suppose we could stay in a perpetual stae of it, but obviously we don't. But yes, war does tend to cause pain and suffering.

This is mostly my debate with U.S. foreign policy. The United States seem to needlessly go to war. What was the reson to be in vietnam?

Not sure what that has to do with the subject of rape and pillaging. As I said, cases of breakdowns in decency are a reality in warfare, regardless of the nations involved. But civilized nations will keep them to a minimum. If we had a tendency towards war, I suppose we could stay in a perpetual stae of it, but obviously we don't. But yes, war does tend to cause pain and suffering. I realize now that I should have worded the title of this thread with more consideration. The basic idea that I was coming from was will this elivate suffering or only cause more in the end. To me that seems to be the case for American these American excursions. They seem to be essential fruitless, in the long term.
What perspective? That I don't think the US military has a tradition of rape and pillage? I don't, and to be honest, I've seen nothing that you posted that proved otherwise to me. I has happened many times, and it will happen many times again. I see that as a tradition. Even if it is a minority they are disgracing the majority.
America is a great society. It has amazing potential, but it has fallen far from being the voice of liberty and justice. The star spangled banner has been disgraced with the blood of the innocent. If one looks at history it is easy to see that the United Stated have never been a nation of virtue. What I find so tragic is that so many great men have died, to uphold justice and liberty. Do not let there deaths be in vain.
Just hope that's all.Nobody in any society is truly free What is freer then an open mind and open heart?

It must be apparent that I am not a big fan of combat. Anyone who glorifies it obviously has no undestanding of it. I hope you would agree with me. My Shaolin teacher has seen combat all over the world, the more he teaches me about combat the sicker I get. Hell I can't even watch and action movie with out getting ill. Before I did not realize the implications.

I really hope that one day we can put this part of humanity behind us. But it is just that a dream.....

I would agree. I have read documentation that those tactics where used less by the NVA and Viet Cong. I may very well be mistaken, but they had some documentation (What ever that is worth) that it was those kinds of terrorist acts where done less frequently by the NVA and Viet Cong. Ther reason that the documents gave was that it jsut isn't an intellegent move, it would help lose the support of the masses.

I don't know about what documents say, I can only comment on what I saw. If their acts became less frequent, I don't know. I was in country as late as summer of '72 and I didn't see it lessen. They weren't worried about losing support of the masses; they used such tactics to intimidate the people from aiding us, and with good results.

I understand the tactical significance of using AO, though some of the information I have came across claims that it was used on crops as well. Even it it wasn't intented to poison the populace, it did. Like I said before often good intentions pave the road to hell.

No doubt, but still, AO was a herbicide, that turned out to be very harmful to humans, but it was not calculated to be a killer.

I had came across a figure that was 304 recorded cases (I could be wrong I will keep searching). Though rape is a tricky thing, it is something that is easy for the military to concel. Usually there is only two people involved so it is on word agains another.

I'm sure the number is higher than a handful if you count cases that were covered up over the years, and I'm sure there were a number of them. But I question the 304 recorded cases, unless you give me data from a reliabe source. 1 case is obviously 1 too many, but again, when you are talking about occupying a base for 50+ years, it is inevitable to have some criminal acts. We're seeing more and more cases of rape within the military now unfortunately, with women now being admitted to the services. The military is no different than civilian society, where rape is a regular occurence. Except in the military the male to female ratio is extremely skewed, which is dangerous.

Lets face it the offical stament of the military have little relevance to truth. They are merly political tools.

Well, no, in situations like this I would say it is more a matter of CYA. Certainly, the services don't like to admit to problems, but the fact that some of these cases are prosecuted means that it isn't always swept away.

I can no say I know, and I cannot trust your word (No offence but your are a service man so it is essentialy biast). I hope that what you are telling me is the truth.

That's OK. You don't know me; I wouldn't expect you to take what I say at face value, but actually I'm ex-service. I'm telling you the facts as I know them. It is up to you to decide if it is truth.

I realize now that I should have worded the title of this thread with more consideration. The basic idea that I was coming from was will this elivate suffering or only cause more in the end. To me that seems to be the case for American these American excursions. They seem to be essential fruitless, in the long term.

You probably should have titled it otherwise. If it means anything, I'm not a pro-war person. Not to say I'm anti-war. I believe that war is evil, but sometimes a necessary evil. But like most men that I know that served in Vietnam, I am very loathe to see this nation go to war without good reason.

I has happened many times, and it will happen many times again. I see that as a tradition. Even if it is a minority they are disgracing the majority.

I disagree. The fact that it has happened in previous wars and will undoubtedly happen in the future doesn't make it a tradition. It means bad shit happens sometimes and bad shit will likely happen again.

What is freer then an open mind and open heart?

Well, I believe I have an open mind. I don't have complete faith in any construct. My beliefs aren't rigidly set in stone. An open heart? As open as it can be, although the realities of years gone by have probably jaded my heart more than yours seems to be.

Well we seem to agree on the key points, save the semantics. Though that is rather irrelevant. My view on the American millitary has evolved from our conversation. Though I still must say that one is two many. Once a mistake, second time a habit, thirds if the fault of the idiot how let you do it again.

Allot of people forget that the effects of war will last for many generations to come. It is not over when the blood shed stops, the effects will last for generations. Like my girlfriend suffers has almost all the reported side effects from AO (Luckly not cancer..yet) I could still lose her over a miscalculated strategy. I personally think that is pretty harsh but that is life. These wars seem to do nothing in the end but continue the cycle. I agree that htere is times where conflict is un-avoidable, that is reality(Reality to the extent of my understanding) and that is sad. It really all comes down the honor and valor of the men/women of the war. The is a real difference between showing honor/valor and living it. The problem is see with is that too many simply try and show it. You are honor/valor with you appear to be it or not. The problem is as I see it in the hearts of the courageous. It takes a certain amount of clarity to have courage, but it takes honor to question your clarity. That is the only way to guess if you are taking the road to hell. Every man is the hero of his own story, but unfortunatly that usually mean they think they are right.
That is dangerous.

Well, I believe I have an open mind. I don't have complete faith in any construct. My beliefs aren't rigidly set in stone. An open heart? As open as it can be, although the realities of years gone by have probably jaded my heart more than yours seems to be. I once heard a good metapor for consciousness. A glass of water with with red dust floating in it. Anything outside of consiousness is only red dust. They are only external events, there is no need for them to pollute your internal world. Even if it does get in...its only red dust.