View Full Version : Why are people afraid of dying?


geekzilla
08-31-07, 04:03 AM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

DanceAndExplode
08-31-07, 04:13 AM
i think its because they're afraid of whats after death. So many people are afraid of what they cant physically see, or what they know for a fact is there. they're afraid of the unknown.
im personally, not afraid of dying at all.

geekzilla
08-31-07, 04:21 AM
Are people with a faith more or less afraid of dying?

DanceAndExplode
08-31-07, 04:47 AM
i think religious people could possibly be less afraid of dying, maybe coz to them there is the excitment and curiosity of an after life. i think people with no religion might be more afraid, coz they dont know what is after death for them. i dunno but im only generalising right now.. i mean, im agnostic, not religious, and im not afraid of dying at all.

another reason people might be afraid of dying, could be that theyre afraid to leave behind people they love. that would probably be the only reason i'd be a bit afraid, but it still wouldn't make me heaps scared.

one_raven
08-31-07, 05:12 AM
I think, in most cases, "faith" = fear of dying.

EmptyForceOfChi
08-31-07, 05:37 AM
people are afraid of dying for different reasons. but mostly because they dont want to lose everything they have here on earth. they dont want to lose loved ones and people they care about. it makes them sad that the universe might be a cold place, where you just die and fade into nothing. people dont like the idea of losing consciousness for eternity. the ego is at the center and root of the fear.


peace.

one_raven
08-31-07, 05:49 AM
Material attachment?
I thought you weren't a Buddhist, Chi.

fo3
08-31-07, 06:33 AM
I would expect religious people be a lot more afraid of dying than agnostic or atheist people. I, as an atheist, can say that I have no fear whatsoever of dying.

Sarkus
08-31-07, 06:36 AM
I am an atheist and I am afraid of dying (the process of going from relatively to healthy to the instant prior to death) - but not of death itself.
To me there is the fear of pain associated with many methods of dying.

But I do not, at present, have a fear of death.

Baron Max
08-31-07, 07:02 AM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

I think it's perfectly natural for people to be afraid of most any drastic changes in their lives. People are often afraid of moving from one locale to another. It's changes in their normal lives; fear of the unknown.

Am I afraid of dying? No, but then I'm an old, old fart, and have lived through a lot of changes. It gets easier over time and with experiences.

Baron Max

cosmictraveler
08-31-07, 07:16 AM
I'd say that because of religious teachings all about going to hell, living in a pergatory world, being tortured while there forever. Those types of teachings, if you don't go along with the religions, will put a scare in the youngsters anytime. If people were taught that dying is just a part of living, actually the price we all pay in order to be alive, there wouldn't be as much fear as there is.

What interests me is what the fuck are we supposed to be doing here while we are alive? Everyone has their own ideas but as yet there really isn't any one real meaning to life itself. Just think in just 50 years no one will ever remember who you were or what you did unless it was something really worthwhile or something really bad.

Yorda
08-31-07, 07:51 AM
people are afraid of death (non-existence) because they are stupid. let me explain what i mean:


people are afraid of dying for different reasons. but mostly because they dont want to lose everything they have here on earth. they dont want to lose loved ones and people they care about. it makes them sad that the universe might be a cold place, where you just die and fade into nothing. people dont like the idea of losing consciousness for eternity.

if you lose everything you also lose the fear of losing everything, so what is there to fear? stupidity.

Wisdom_Seeker
08-31-07, 08:33 AM
Being afraid of dying is just a consequence of not fully living while you could. Besides, our reptialian brain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reptilian_brain) is programmed to be afraid of death for basic survival of life; but humans can be over that if we want to, just by realizing the stupidity of the fear of death.

Enmos
08-31-07, 09:54 AM
I am not afraid of dying in itself, but I am afraid of it being a painful process.
Also, dying and being dead are to different things.
Dying is the process that leads to death, in others words you're still alive. You are dead when the process is completed.
There is no reason to be afraid of being dead.

geekzilla
08-31-07, 10:46 AM
Why do you think religious people are afraid of dying when they believe there is something (god) looking over them and caring for them? When you know that something is there looking after you then why are you still afraid?

Is it because people are afraid of going to hell?

Enmos
08-31-07, 10:56 AM
Why do you think religious people are afraid of dying when they believe there is something (god) looking over them and caring for them? When you know that something is there looking after you then why are you still afraid?

Is it because people are afraid of going to hell?

In the first place, i think people confuse being dead with the process of dying. Probably they are afraid of dying and not of being dead. Not wanting to die and being fearful of dying is only natural and STRONGLY selected upon by evolutionary mechanisms ;)

I don't think truly religious people can be afraid of being dead since they believe in an afterlife.
If religious people are afraid of 'being dead' (read: 'their afterlife') they are either sinful and fear hell or they have serious doubts about the existence of an afterlife (which makes them not truly religious) and are irrationally afraid of not being. These two reasons are the only ones I can come up with.

shichimenshyo
08-31-07, 11:50 AM
Im not afraid of death but rather the manner in which I die. Old age, in my sleep, cancer, I dont mind those. Gun to face, falling out of a plane, burning to death those I mind.

Enmos
08-31-07, 11:56 AM
Im not afraid of death but rather the manner in which I die. Old age, in my sleep, cancer, I dont mind those. Gun to face, falling out of a plane, burning to death those I mind.

Yep
Although cancer is generally not exactly a nice way to die.

nietzschefan
08-31-07, 12:13 PM
People are scared of all kinds of shit nowdays. Dying is just one of many.

lucifers angel
08-31-07, 12:27 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

i'm not affraid! why be affraid of somthing that is going to happen even if you want it or not? and why spend the years you have worrieing about death!

nietzschefan
08-31-07, 12:30 PM
Why do you worry so much about flying, or even more dangerous activites Luci?

shichimenshyo
08-31-07, 12:31 PM
Yep
Although cancer is generally not exactly a nice way to die.


Yea but its slow and doesnt scare me, Im more afriad of dying in a violent manner than anything. But after your dead your dead so I dont think ill mind much :D

Enmos
08-31-07, 12:33 PM
Yea but its slow and doesnt scare me, Im more afriad of dying in a violent manner than anything. But after your dead your dead so I dont think ill mind much :D

I'm not so much afraid of dying violently as dying a painful death. Not that I think about it on a daily basis lol

Why?
08-31-07, 01:39 PM
I afraid of not being allowed to live anymore.

one_raven
08-31-07, 02:37 PM
Why do you think religious people are afraid of dying when they believe there is something (god) looking over them and caring for them? When you know that something is there looking after you then why are you still afraid?

Is it because people are afraid of going to hell?

I think, for the most part, it's because they don't beleieve as stronglt as they profess to believe and they have convinced themselves to "believe" directly because of this fear.

shichimenshyo
08-31-07, 02:40 PM
I afraid of not being allowed to live anymore.

brilliantly put

John99
08-31-07, 03:04 PM
Only a ******* does not have concern of dying, i would even go so far as say fear.

What i cannot grasp is the shortness of life. Just whan you begin to understand things and can actually live a smooth, relaxing existance that is when you begin to have medical problems or their occurance\probability intensifies. Makes no sense to me.

Oli
08-31-07, 03:05 PM
Only a ******* does not have concern of dying, i would even go so far as say fear.
Then I'm a ******. :D
Why should I have a fear of dying?

John99
08-31-07, 03:14 PM
Then I'm a ******. :D
Why should I have a fear of dying?

That is why i put the asterisks there:D

I think there is certainly fear involved in the prospect of no longer existing. Of course i believe there is more than what we see right before us, my own beliefs are simple but very specific.

Oli
08-31-07, 03:15 PM
I think there is certainly fear involved in the prospect of no longer existing.
No fear at all of that.

Yorda
08-31-07, 03:41 PM
I fear death because it does not exist. Death results in reincarnation, so death = life. When we are born we start dying, when we die we start living.

Why do I fear life? Because fear is a part of life, I have no choice.


I afraid of not being allowed to live anymore.

Wouldn't it be great if you never existed, then you wouldn't have to be there and be afraid of things like that?

fadingCaptain
08-31-07, 04:17 PM
people are afraid of dying because they like being alive.

Tnerb
08-31-07, 06:09 PM
People that feel forced to die, are afraid of the thought. They don't want to die but are afraid of the thoughts of death.

Oniw17
08-31-07, 06:44 PM
Isn't it obvious why people are afraid of death? It's the one thing that you can never be sure of. Nobody knows anything about death(people believe they know, but no living person has experienced death to actually know), just that it's very common. I fear death, immensely. However, it's not something I usually spend time worrying about; time is precious. Also, I have no fears whatsoever of dieing, I know exactly how that works. Seriously, what's so bad about dieing? It seems like the most invigorating event you could ever experience...unless you die slow or in your sleep, which is pretty lame.

shorty_37
08-31-07, 07:20 PM
Im not afraid of death but rather the manner in which I die. Old age, in my sleep, cancer, I dont mind those. Gun to face, falling out of a plane, burning to death those I mind.

EXACTLY.......I am more worried about long prolonged agony....like
cancer, ( I witnessed my mom ) or some other awful disease.

I hope I go fast....

Orleander
08-31-07, 07:23 PM
By the time I die, if my life hasn't meant anything, then my death damn well better or I am gonna be so pissed off at myself.

Enmos
08-31-07, 07:23 PM
By the time I die, if my life hasn't meant anything, then my death damn well better or I am gonna be do pissed off at myself.

LOL

Kumar
09-01-07, 04:02 AM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

Probably due to; ultimate goal indicated for humans not achieved..salvation, nirvana, moksha, liberation etc. So one still remain bonded without achieving it.

Grantywanty
09-01-07, 04:30 AM
i'm not affraid! why be affraid of somthing that is going to happen even if you want it or not? and why spend the years you have worrieing about death!

Most people cannot logically talk themselves out of certain feelings. This is, in fact a good thing. Emotions have a different role than logical thinking. If my girlfriend breaks up with me I can tell myself logical things like there being other women, she wouldn't want to leave me if it would work between us, etc. etc. But the human fact is there is a grieving process. I always found it strange that some people would put forward some syllogism to explain why they did not feel or no longer felt something human and natural, like all one has to do is map it out in a Boolean diagram and poof it's gone. I've since realized that 1) some of these people are not connected enough with their feelings to realize they are just talking about their thoughts and not their feelings 2) some people don't feel very much so they are mostly thoughts and can change these thoughts via deductive reasoning. It might be good for you to know that there are many people who this will not work on and who also have many strengths you do not have. And vice versa. Neither set of strenghts is better.

Grantywanty
09-01-07, 04:31 AM
people are afraid of dying because they like being alive.

Here, here. It's sad how posturing about a lack of fear of death is presented as logical, brave, enlightened, cool, etc. when it really is none of these things.

lucifers angel
09-01-07, 09:11 AM
Why do you worry so much about flying, or even more dangerous activites Luci?

because Nietzschefan death isnt avoidable when tis your time then its your time! if you do dangerous activites then that can cause death.
and anyway having thought about it, your quite right, i think people are affraid to live, some people like to worry about things and dieing is one of those things!

Norsefire
09-01-07, 11:04 AM
Because of what is after.

I am not afraid to die. Death is death, nothing more nothing less

Cyperium
09-02-07, 03:41 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?I think it is fear of the unknown, and the loss of everything you know about (the world, reality). Also it is the fear of going somewhere where you can't return.

Also, when we look at death from the outside, where people die and even those close to you, it seems smaller than when looking at death from your own view, that You are going to die - then it becomes gigantic (if you have good imagination), by all rights, it IS gigantic, I can't imagine a greater change of state other than being born.

one_raven
09-03-07, 09:54 PM
I wish I could remember who said it, but it was a member here a while back - and I thought it was a brilliant observation. paraphrased...
"Show me a Christian who is not afraid of death, and I will believe he is a true believer."

People turn to religion, more often than not, because they are scared of death or the unknown.
These people, rather than finding true relief from this fear, find rhetoric that they repeat and repeat trying to convince themselves as much as they are trying to convince others.
I find this more in Christianity more than any other religion - I think based mainly on their message.
If you truly and honestly believe that the heavenly father has a perfect paradise awaiting you - one in which you have no pain, no fear, no strife, nothing but pure and simple happiness - then you would not fear death - you COULD not fear death.
If you claim to truly believe in the message of Christianity, and you still fear death, you are lying to yourself.
Religion, at that point, is nothing more than a placebo, and somewhere inside, you know this.
This, is why I believe that the loudest supporters of any religion are the ones with the most doubt.

Everyone has heard the expression, "There are no atheists in foxholes".
In times of great desperation, people will grasp at straws and hope (not believe, but HOPE) in anything that may get them through.
True believers who are afraid of death, do not truly believe the message, they are desperately hoping, because they are scared.


Most people cannot logically talk themselves out of certain feelings. This is, in fact a good thing. Emotions have a different role than logical thinking. If my girlfriend breaks up with me I can tell myself logical things like there being other women, she wouldn't want to leave me if it would work between us, etc. etc. But the human fact is there is a grieving process. I always found it strange that some people would put forward some syllogism to explain why they did not feel or no longer felt something human and natural, like all one has to do is map it out in a Boolean diagram and poof it's gone. I've since realized that 1) some of these people are not connected enough with their feelings to realize they are just talking about their thoughts and not their feelings 2) some people don't feel very much so they are mostly thoughts and can change these thoughts via deductive reasoning. It might be good for you to know that there are many people who this will not work on and who also have many strengths you do not have. And vice versa. Neither set of strenghts is better.

This, however, assumes that fear of death is a natural, human experience and somehow beneficial.
It is easy to take this position if YOU have a fear of death, because it qualifies your position.
From the perspective of someone who does not fear death, it sounds like YOU are the one justifying your emotions, not the other way around.

one_raven
09-04-07, 01:47 AM
Here, here. It's sad how posturing about a lack of fear of death is presented as logical, brave, enlightened, cool, etc. when it really is none of these things.

So, because you fear death, that means anyone who claims to not fear death is "posturing"? :rolleyes:
Whatever makes you feel better about your own fears and insecurities.

tormented
09-04-07, 04:13 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?


I'm afraid of dying.

There was a time in my life I welcomed it, when my life meant nothing and was going nowhere. I didn't care if I lived or died.
Now my life has changed, things have gotten better and I like life and want to stick around as long as I can.
I think death is just another dimension, like walking thru a doorway to another place, and you can't go back. I don't want to die and leave my loved ones behind, although it will happen someday.
I'd like to live to be ole, and die quick and painless.

I think if left to the christians, I'll probly go to hell.

If left to god, I might make it to heaven.

I don't know if heaven or hell is real, something in me makes me believe in reincarnation.

Life is a journey, death a doorway along the way.

Avatar
09-04-07, 05:06 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

People are afraid of change.
And people tend to associate themselves with their body.
So when their body undergoes the ultimate change at death... That's what they are afraid of.
One way to overcome the fear of change of the body is to associate your self with something that does not undergo that change.

Why are people afraid of change? Because the change may affect themselves.
Everything that can affect you may be a concern.
And concern leads to worry.
Worry leads to fear.
Fear leads to stress.
Stress leads to wrongful thinking.
Wrongful thinking leads to wrongful action.
Wrongful action leads to bad consequences.
Bad consequences lead to changes.

Cyperium
09-07-07, 09:12 AM
I wish I could remember who said it, but it was a member here a while back - and I thought it was a brilliant observation. paraphrased...
"Show me a Christian who is not afraid of death, and I will believe he is a true believer."

People turn to religion, more often than not, because they are scared of death or the unknown.
These people, rather than finding true relief from this fear, find rhetoric that they repeat and repeat trying to convince themselves as much as they are trying to convince others.
I find this more in Christianity more than any other religion - I think based mainly on their message.
If you truly and honestly believe that the heavenly father has a perfect paradise awaiting you - one in which you have no pain, no fear, no strife, nothing but pure and simple happiness - then you would not fear death - you COULD not fear death.
If you claim to truly believe in the message of Christianity, and you still fear death, you are lying to yourself.
Religion, at that point, is nothing more than a placebo, and somewhere inside, you know this.
This, is why I believe that the loudest supporters of any religion are the ones with the most doubt.

Everyone has heard the expression, "There are no atheists in foxholes".
In times of great desperation, people will grasp at straws and hope (not believe, but HOPE) in anything that may get them through.
True believers who are afraid of death, do not truly believe the message, they are desperately hoping, because they are scared.



This, however, assumes that fear of death is a natural, human experience and somehow beneficial.
It is easy to take this position if YOU have a fear of death, because it qualifies your position.
From the perspective of someone who does not fear death, it sounds like YOU are the one justifying your emotions, not the other way around.Why do you think we are so different? I can tell you straight out that if we were in a fox-hole we would hope too, belief would not be such a great issue if only to give substance to our hope.

Belief is not based on fear of death, it is that kind of short-mindedness that gets on our nerves.

ilumination
05-19-09, 06:02 AM
it's called conditioning- we are not born to fear but are taught to do so.
when it comes to the fear of dying, people in religious circles are more, (and most likely in silence) afraid of death. reason is that we are taught that only if u do good all ur life u have a chance to go to heaven- but (and in realety most likely,cause we r called humans for a reason) we dont, we most likely go to hell and burn, suffer ect......!:eek:
it is neccesary for leaders in any form to keep us in fear of one thing or another to control us, so we do not think 4 ourselfs, but do nicely as we r told. thank goodness that more and more people come to their sences and do start thinking, and if u pay attention u see that the more we think for ourselfs, the less we r afraid, including death.:cool:

cosmictraveler
05-19-09, 06:03 AM
Dying is easy, its the living that's a bitch! :eek:

Arch_Rival
05-19-09, 10:15 AM
Fear of dying is an evolutionary effect. An organism afraid of dying will take steps to prevent that, hence surviving and reproducing.

-ND-
05-19-09, 09:20 PM
Because in the end, you always think about the beginning. When it is your end, everything should be ok, in a way that you wanted it to be. If it is not ok, then it is not the end.

jmpet
05-19-09, 09:31 PM
I found out I had cancer last week. I am 39 and mostly pissed- for having cancer at 39 and not 80. I am not afraid of dying and I have not become any more religious from this news. I go to surgery in two weeks. Either I will wake up from it, or I will not. And if I do, either I will still have cancer or it will be gone. I mostly feel bad for people around me when they find out more than actually worrying about it myself.

-ND-
05-19-09, 09:33 PM
If you believe in God/Heaven after death, why would someone be afraid to go to heaven? This person has beliefs and feels a connection with God, why would that person be scared? A person that does not believe in God, is a person with no belief. No belief means doubt. Doubt means questioning; How will I die? When Will I die? What will happen when I die? See the difference.

This comment was specific towards the people that said, people who believe in God are more afraid to die than those who do not believe in God.

Happy?

justwonderingjoe
05-19-09, 10:18 PM
I found out I had cancer last week. I am 39 and mostly pissed- for having cancer at 39 and not 80. I am not afraid of dying and I have not become any more religious from this news. I go to surgery in two weeks. Either I will wake up from it, or I will not. And if I do, either I will still have cancer or it will be gone. I mostly feel bad for people around me when they find out more than actually worrying about it myself.

Dear jmpet, you are most brave and caring to think of the feelings of those around you at this difficult time. I hope EVERYTHING turns out perfect for you. I don't know you, you don't know me, but I will be thinking of you, desiring that everyone involved in your treatment and recovery will be skillful, knowledgeable and caring. I hope you can keep the Sci community posted on your recovery. I will be looking for updates! I am sorry you are going through this. Peace and Strength!

lightgigantic
05-20-09, 08:56 PM
In short, we experience misery when something we value is lost or disappears.
And we experience fear at the prospect of something with value disappearing.

To say that there are no pending emotional issues for one's imminent disappearance tends to indicate a contingency plan or a sense of value that is practically nil.

lightgigantic
05-20-09, 09:27 PM
BTW here's a hint (http://vimeo.com/4155700) what you can expect

(kind of like "value analysis" I guess )

:o

pandorica
03-24-11, 09:19 PM
I wish I could remember who said it, but it was a member here a while back - and I thought it was a brilliant observation. paraphrased...
"Show me a Christian who is not afraid of death, and I will believe he is a true believer."

People turn to religion, more often than not, because they are scared of death or the unknown.
These people, rather than finding true relief from this fear, find rhetoric that they repeat and repeat trying to convince themselves as much as they are trying to convince others.
I find this more in Christianity more than any other religion - I think based mainly on their message.
If you truly and honestly believe that the heavenly father has a perfect paradise awaiting you - one in which you have no pain, no fear, no strife, nothing but pure and simple happiness - then you would not fear death - you COULD not fear death.
If you claim to truly believe in the message of Christianity, and you still fear death, you are lying to yourself.
Religion, at that point, is nothing more than a placebo, and somewhere inside, you know this.
This, is why I believe that the loudest supporters of any religion are the ones with the most doubt.

Everyone has heard the expression, "There are no atheists in foxholes".
In times of great desperation, people will grasp at straws and hope (not believe, but HOPE) in anything that may get them through.
True believers who are afraid of death, do not truly believe the message, they are desperately hoping, because they are scared.

Why is it that many of you are pushing perfection on christian? You act as though christains are an entirely different species? When in fact they are no different than you. They to are human and like all human they make mistakes. Fear does wander in the minds of all human. Its only natural to wonder what comes after death and with wonder comes fear of the unknown. So why do you say that they are lying to themselfs?:confused: you can believe and fear, in fact your suppose to fear god in that same way (fear the lord, its in the bible). A healthy wonder of him, and whats to be. They know that they fear, they know that they judge, AND they know that they're not perfect but sinful. btw they are desperately hoping, because they are scared AND thats called faith.

drumbeat
03-24-11, 09:25 PM
Why are people afraid of dying?

Could be any of the following:

Fear of not completing what they wanted to do.
They want a purpose for their existence.
Don't like the idea of not existing.

glaucon
03-24-11, 09:25 PM
...
btw they are desperately hoping, because they are scared AND thats called faith.

Hope and faith are antithetical to reason.
That is what was being explained, and not some sort of attempt to 'push for perfection'.

BTW, in future, do try to refrain from more thread necromancy.
Thanks.

pandorica
03-25-11, 01:39 AM
Hope and faith are antithetical to reason.
That is what was being explained, and not some sort of attempt to 'push for perfection'.

BTW, in future, do try to refrain from more thread necromancy.
Thanks.

Necromancy and Christianity are two entirely different religons. :)
Your welcome.

glaucon
03-25-11, 07:09 PM
Necromancy and Christianity are two entirely different religons. :)
Your welcome.

lol

Not remotely what I meant.. but... nice.

:-)

Sly
03-26-11, 09:16 AM
Being afraid of dying is just a consequence of not fully living while you could.

First I ask, what does it mean to live a full life? To live until one dies? Second, do you suppose it is possible to live a full life, what ever that maybe, given a finite amount of time?

scheherazade
08-19-11, 01:57 AM
Geekzilla
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

Before the cavalry comes rushing over the horizon to cries of 'thread necromancy', I would point out that this thread was given a 'kick-start' not so long ago, and that the original poster has recently returned to the forum.

While I logically comprehend death and have witnessed same in animals and humans at their moment of passing, I do have some apprehension pertaining to a passing that might include prolonged pain.

I am inclined to agree with the poster who suggested that fear of death is an evolutionary mechanism that induces us to choose life over other options and encourages us to reproduce, that we achieve potential immortality through our genetics.

Anti-Flag
08-19-11, 04:33 AM
I am inclined to agree with the poster who suggested that fear of death is an evolutionary mechanism that induces us to choose life over other options and encourages us to reproduce, that we achieve potential immortality through our genetics.

I'd say that's true. Although it can be suppressed.

Pinwheel
08-19-11, 04:35 AM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?
I'm not afraid of death, just the few minutes before that could be painful...

sonychan
08-19-11, 07:46 AM
I didn't read through the whole thread so sorry if this was said before.

This question bothers me alot. It assumes that majority of people has a fear of death and I don't know any normal functioning person who has a fear of dying. The reason why we avoid death is because we fear pain. It is our instinct to live so we can reproduce and keep the population going.

As for the religon aspect. I think religon is mostly used as a tool to enjoy life. To give oneself purpose and fulfillment.

Pinwheel
08-19-11, 08:15 AM
I think religon is mostly used as a tool to enjoy life. To give oneself purpose and fulfillment.
Personally I think religon is mostly used as a tool to control other peoples behaviour.

kx000
08-19-11, 10:46 AM
Im not afraid to die. I will be back here eventually if God wills it.

wlminex
08-19-11, 12:16 PM
. . . I'm not afraid of dying . . . I just don't wanna' (sic, die)!

wlminex

universaldistress
08-19-11, 03:48 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

Afraid of dying as in I don't want to, so I'll fight to avoid it. However, once it is certain I imagine a calm descending over me. I don't want to slip away in a hospital kicking and screaming. But in the grips of a murderer I foresee a struggle.

Maybe the nature of death has an effect on one's willingness to go, when it comes?

People who have no fear of dying could have a propensity to live dangerously.

But of course we are really talking about something a bit more abstract? As in the idea of dying and the feeling it gives one, in the gut? I think everyone puts it out of their mind . . .

universaldistress
08-19-11, 03:51 PM
Not so much afraid of death. More afraid of life ending. Though do want to see whether there is something on the other side. Very curious.

kx000
08-19-11, 05:55 PM
You'll have to fight to the death to take my life, but when my time is up I think I will be ok.

KilljoyKlown
08-19-11, 06:44 PM
Why are people afraid of dying and are you? Can you answer this question..?

Because it hurts to die.

1000 Ways to Die "Mercury In Uranus" #599 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TS66JPg7wpA)

chimpkin
08-20-11, 12:23 AM
I dunno, but the thing I had that sounds like a near-death-experience was really frigging scary, like I was being shredded.

It was very similar to an experience I read of a woman who was choked into convulsions and unconsciousness...her attackers thought she was dead and so disposed of her. She came to in an ambulance.

Another friend had the more typical "silver cord type" near death experience.
That's the one where you look at yourself, maybe or maybe not seeming to be attached with a silver cord.

If I had had that one maybe I'd be perfectly OK with dying.

:shrug:

Meh, probably all in the DNA.


Universal Distress:
Afraid of dying as in I don't want to, so I'll fight to avoid it. However, once it is certain I imagine a calm descending over me. I don't want to slip away in a hospital kicking and screaming. But in the grips of a murderer I foresee a struggle.


Actually...
There's the adrenaline response and the noradrenaline response.
In an attack situation, if you get the adrenaline response, you get this strength rush, you could practically bench a pickup truck.

If you get the noradrenaline response, you freeze and/or go numb.

The catch? You don't pick. A switch is autonomically flipped and off you go. I've had both, and to go all frozen and shaky when you don't want to...oh, it's beyond frustrating!

(Reference:I Can't Get Over It! A Handbook for Trauma Survivors By Aphrodite Matsakis)

scheherazade
08-20-11, 12:42 AM
Because it hurts to die.

1000 Ways to Die "Mercury In Uranus" #599 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TS66JPg7wpA)

Informative.

Would have been better posted as a 'summary' without the graphic video, IMO. :(

No. I did not report the post, though I won't be surprised if someone does, less for the content than the mocking tone. :(

scheherazade
08-20-11, 01:05 AM
Death is unavoidable, to this point in our history at least.

Fear of the unknown is logical, as it is a learned behavior and most of us experience some occasions for fear in a lifetime, making conditioning difficult to avoid. While one can logically address the known cause of their fear, or that of another, our emotional response would seem to be hardwired into our biology. People 'manually over-ride' their fear on a regular basis, yet it takes considerable application of will to accomplish and not all can master this feat, nor does it necessarily become easier with practice, unlike many other conditioned responses.

While logically, the majority will come to accept this fate, not everyone will be ready to embrace it. In actual fact, the statistics would indicate that for a many cases, the moment of truth may come with such speed as to give no time for either discomfort or reflection.

From past experiences I can remark that despite being one who exercises due diligence, the number of factors beyond one's control are astronomical. There have been several 'close calls', and nothing to indicate that they were about to transpire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z42avv3KBCU

johnrichard
08-22-11, 01:43 AM
I'm not. Its an universal truth that no one will remain alive forever. Then whats the point to fear on a fact.

Just live happy till the day comes and not make the days gloomy by thinking worse. Thats my policy.

Enmos
08-22-11, 03:58 AM
I'm not. Its an universal truth that no one will remain alive forever. Then whats the point to fear on a fact.

Just live happy till the day comes and not make the days gloomy by thinking worse. Thats my policy.

That policy doesn't work. Fear is not a rational decision.
Besides, it would mean that you cannot be afraid of anything. I don't buy it. Are you a human?

Pinwheel
08-22-11, 08:35 AM
Death is unavoidable, to this point in our history at least
I'm immortal.....so far.

KilljoyKlown
08-22-11, 10:04 AM
I'm not. Its an universal truth that no one will remain alive forever. Then whats the point to fear on a fact.

Just live happy till the day comes and not make the days gloomy by thinking worse. Thats my policy.

So tell me, if you were with a group of say 100 people in a large room with a door on each side, and a tiger entered to room through one of those doors.

a) You are going to fear for you life and panic for the opposite door like the other 99 people in the room.

or

b) Because you don't fear death you will let the other 99 people panic for the door while you remain unconcerned about the tiger heading your way.

When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.

scheherazade
08-22-11, 10:58 AM
So tell me, if you were with a group of say 100 people in a large room with a door on each side, and a tiger entered to room through one of those doors.

a) You are going to fear for you life and panic for the opposite door like the other 99 people in the room.

or

b) Because you don't fear death you will let the other 99 people panic for the door while you remain unconcerned about the tiger heading your way.

When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.

I agree that while one may have no fear when contemplating the logic that death is inevitable, that it may well prove different when the time comes to test the theory from the personal perspective.

wynn
08-22-11, 11:07 AM
When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.

That would depend on what preparations one has taken.

In some cultures, the moment of death is considered of crucial importance, and people spend their whole life preparing for it.

Enmos
08-22-11, 11:14 AM
When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.
And a very healthy response at that.

KilljoyKlown
08-22-11, 11:58 AM
That would depend on what preparations one has taken.

In some cultures, the moment of death is considered of crucial importance, and people spend their whole life preparing for it.

Being prepared for death is one thing. Not doing your best to avoid it is another.

KilljoyKlown
08-22-11, 12:00 PM
And a very healthy response at that.

I hope you were smiling when you said that.:D

KilljoyKlown
08-22-11, 12:04 PM
I'm immortal.....so far.

......so far (you've been lucky):D

Enmos
08-22-11, 12:23 PM
I hope you were smiling when you said that.:D

I'm afraid not, I was being dead-serious..

scheherazade
08-22-11, 12:45 PM
I'm afraid not, I was being dead-serious..

I find it interesting that the will to live is such a driving force, even when we logically can observe that life, as far as the individual is concerned, is a one way path to a 'dead end'. :bugeye:

From that observation, I would hypothesize that the will to live is an inherent force that has little to do with our thought processes in regard to logic.

To embrace the potential struggle that is life is not logical otherwise, IMO.

kx000
08-22-11, 03:11 PM
So tell me, if you were with a group of say 100 people in a large room with a door on each side, and a tiger entered to room through one of those doors.

a) You are going to fear for you life and panic for the opposite door like the other 99 people in the room.

or

b) Because you don't fear death you will let the other 99 people panic for the door while you remain unconcerned about the tiger heading your way.

When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.

Wrong answer. Staying calm in this situation will give a far greater chance of survival. The tiger will react to the idiots running around like headless chickens. Fear is not a necessary emotion. Yes, I fear getting mauled by a tiger, but I won't let it show.

kx000
08-22-11, 03:21 PM
The other night at a party 5 hispanic gang members enter. How do I know they were gang members? because they were hispanic. Thats racist. Really, because one had a identical scar under each eye lid, meaning he was a jail house snitch, and I could tell they were looking for a fight as they entered a party. Anyways, 3 of them were slapping my friends ass. What do I do? I contemplate the situation. There are 5 of them, and one of me. I have a dilemma. I can't fight 5 gang members, but at the same time I can't let them treat this girl like this. So I look the head dude in the eye and tell him stop slapping my friends ass, and say if you want to talk to her go ahead, but don't slap her in the ass again. Then what do I do? I say, "Tori, lets go time to go," and I slap her in the ass. I remained calm, I showed I wasn't afraid by looking him in the eye, and also showed that im not a punk. I had to fear for my life because I didn't know what these guys were packing, but I could tell what they were capable of, but being afraid is no reason to act in such a manner. I got out of the house with all my limbs in tact.

Anti-Flag
08-22-11, 07:33 PM
So tell me, if you were with a group of say 100 people in a large room with a door on each side, and a tiger entered to room through one of those doors.

a) You are going to fear for you life and panic for the opposite door like the other 99 people in the room.

or

b) Because you don't fear death you will let the other 99 people panic for the door while you remain unconcerned about the tiger heading your way.

When the threat of death gets close, fear is not a choice, it is a response that you have zero control over.

I'm not sure survival instinct and fear are the same thing. I'm not scared of something I can't prevent, but I'd still like to live as long as possible!

chimpkin
08-22-11, 09:42 PM
The other night at a party 5 hispanic gang members enter. How do I know they were gang members? because they were hispanic. Thats racist. Really, because one had a identical scar under each eye lid, meaning he was a jail house snitch, and I could tell they were looking for a fight as they entered a party. Anyways, 3 of them were slapping my friends ass. What do I do? I contemplate the situation. There are 5 of them, and one of me. I have a dilemma. I can't fight 5 gang members, but at the same time I can't let them treat this girl like this. So I look the head dude in the eye and tell him stop slapping my friends ass, and say if you want to talk to her go ahead, but don't slap her in the ass again. Then what do I do? I say, "Tori, lets go time to go," and I slap her in the ass. I remained calm, I showed I wasn't afraid by looking him in the eye, and also showed that im not a punk. I had to fear for my life because I didn't know what these guys were packing, but I could tell what they were capable of, but being afraid is no reason to act in such a manner. I got out of the house with all my limbs in tact.

I dunno about totally assuming those guys are gang members. Probably, though, yeah...gangbangers regardless of race all start to act like each other...not a population as a whole so much at their close gangmates...they move and gesture and talk and dress just so, and it gets really obvious.

Either way, I know trouble when it walks in the room, apparently you do too.

You got yourself and your friend out of a nasty situation. Good job.

Enmos
08-23-11, 02:56 AM
I find it interesting that the will to live is such a driving force, even when we logically can observe that life, as far as the individual is concerned, is a one way path to a 'dead end'.

From that observation, I would hypothesize that the will to live is an inherent force that has little to do with our thought processes in regard to logic.

To embrace the potential struggle that is life is not logical otherwise, IMO.
Agreed, the will to live is just an instinctive force within us. There is little we can do to counter it.
Although, our thought processes (read rationality and intelligence) can also help us a great deal with regard to survival. They can also work against us however.


Wrong answer. Staying calm in this situation will give a far greater chance of survival. The tiger will react to the idiots running around like headless chickens. Fear is not a necessary emotion. Yes, I fear getting mauled by a tiger, but I won't let it show.

Tigers go for the easy picking. It might get excited because of all the running and screaming people but it will go for the one that appears less able to flee.


I'm not sure survival instinct and fear are the same thing. I'm not scared of something I can't prevent, but I'd still like to live as long as possible!
Fear is a very important component of survival instinct. People that have no fear will die young.

Anti-Flag
08-23-11, 07:04 AM
Fear is a very important component of survival instinct. People that have no fear will die young.

It is a component, and it's true many would die young and the chances for this are increased, but fearlessness is not the same as recklessness. Whilst you could not be afraid of an action without awareness of the consequences, you can be aware of the consequences, without being afraid.
In my opinion it is not always those without fear that die young, but those without sense. ;)
It also does not necessarily mean fear is still present amongst all that survive.

Captain Kremmen
08-23-11, 07:31 AM
People in richer countries are less afraid of dying now than they used to be.
Without painkillers, death must have been a frightening thing to watch, and to anticipate.

Old people are not usually afraid of physical extinction, they are usually more worried about their surviving relatives.

Stryder
08-23-11, 08:27 AM
Death is inevitable to all, we put up with the conditioning of it's arrival through knowing people or having loved ones that die over time. Death itself to my knowledge doesn't have to exist, it only does so because of Human Conditioning and because we are slaves to tradition.

If there was no death, what purpose would any Religion serve?

Of course the absence of death would express why there are so many stars in the sky, after all if no one died, it would get awfully crowded here on this bluey-green rock, we'd obviously have to look at some way of dealing with over population which would likely involve populating elsewhere in the universe.

In essence though death is an abstract, since everybody that has properly died has never come back with the necessary corrections to make it anything else.

From the moment of our first breath, we are slowly dieing. In some respects it's similar to portion of Schroedingers Cat in the sense that we aren't "Alive" unless we are in a pendulum state of dieing, so should you fear what's around the next bend, I wouldn't it would likely just drive you into madness, constantly guessing what unknown's are in-store for you.

Enmos
08-23-11, 09:22 AM
It is a component, and it's true many would die young and the chances for this are increased, but fearlessness is not the same as recklessness.
Absolute fearlessness is not the same as recklessness because while being reckless one usually knows that ones life is at risk. Being reckless also does not rule out being afraid.
Fearlessness, though, is a trait that is very heavily selected against by nature. So much so, that I don't think real (absolute) fearlessness even exists.
Anyone that claims to be fearless hasn't really had a chance to be fearful yet. Either that or there is something horribly wrong with them.


Whilst you could not be afraid of an action without awareness of the consequences, you can be aware of the consequences, without being afraid.
I contest that you cannot be afraid of an action without being aware of the consequences if you are not aware of the consequences (of an action) you cannot be afraid of it. In fact, not knowing what the consequences are could be a very good reason to be afraid.


In my opinion it is not always those without fear that die young, but those without sense. ;)
I can't disagree with that, but then there is not a whole lot of difference between the two in this context :p


It also does not necessarily mean fear is still present amongst all that survive.
Well, there's always such a thing as chance I guess ;)

Captain Kremmen
08-23-11, 02:39 PM
They say a hero is someone who is afraid, but acts as though they were not afraid. The person without fear is a fool.
Can't remember who said it.
Probably heard it in a John Wayne film.
Or it could have been Hoss in Bonanza.
Anyway, it's true.

scheherazade
08-23-11, 03:37 PM
They say a hero is someone who is afraid, but acts as though they were not afraid. The person without fear is a fool.
Can't remember who said it.
Probably heard it in a John Wayne film.

Bravery is not an absence of fear. It is the ability to function, despite having full awareness of your fear. Fear is a useful tool in assessment and decision making if one learns how to use it appropriately, IMO.

KilljoyKlown
08-23-11, 08:11 PM
Maybe it's not always a fear of death. Sometimes it can be a fear of not dying. An example of this would be coming out of an accident and finding out you are now a quadriplegic cripple for the rest of your life. Give me death over that anytime.

Misty155
08-23-11, 08:15 PM
Hi, I can't imagine the situation. Everyone will die.

universaldistress
08-23-11, 08:15 PM
Maybe it's not always a fear of death. Sometimes it can be a fear of not dying. An example of this would be coming out of an accident and finding out you are now a quadriplegic cripple for the rest of your life. Give me death over that anytime.

I would still wish to go on. Fear of not being alive is my issue.

scheherazade
08-23-11, 09:32 PM
Hi, I can't imagine the situation. Everyone will die.

Hello Misty, and welcome to the discussion. While logically we can observe that everyone dies, we are examining why many people have a fear of death, since it seems unavoidable.

It is not logical to fear the inevitable and so we are examining this phenomenon from all angles.

scheherazade
08-23-11, 09:39 PM
I would still wish to go on. Fear of not being alive is my issue.

Certainly you are not alone in having this particular issue and I remember one New Year's Eve discussion long into the night at a table evenly divided over 'pull the plug if I am on life support' and 'keep me pumping. Where there is life, there remains hope.'

Interesting that you do not claim to be afraid of 'death', rather you fear 'not being alive'.

Your choice of phrase intrigues me.

The experience of 'being alive' is unique unto each of us, and the concept of death may also mean different things to each of us.

OnlyMe
08-23-11, 10:54 PM
Being afraid of dying is just a consequence of not fully living while you could. Besides, our reptialian brain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reptilian_brain) is programmed to be afraid of death for basic survival of life; but humans can be over that if we want to, just by realizing the stupidity of the fear of death.

I don't think the survival instinct has anything to do with a fear of dying. The fear of death itself is more likely a learned, fear. Fear of injury and even pain are also learned. But fear of death may be more of a cultural thing.


Im not afraid of death but rather the manner in which I die. Old age, in my sleep, cancer, I don't mind those. Gun to face, falling out of a plane, burning to death those I mind.

Age can have something to do with this. It brought to mind two situations.

When I was about 22 and married, a neighbor, drunk, came to my door at night. When I answered the door he was pointing a 38 at my chest. My wife was in a chair right next to the door. I put my hand out palm on his chest and walked out the door closing it behind me. Then told him pull the trigger or go home. He went home. I was not affraid during or after the incident, but I was 22. My only thought at the time was to put more distance and the wall of the house between the gun and my wife.

The second occurred when my mother died and my sister and I were informing family members and her friends around the country. She was 91 and went easily... I had called her half sister who was I think 95 at the time and in another state. She from the sound of my voice probably could tell it was difficult for me to be making the call. She said, and I paraphrase, "OnlyMe" (and no that is not my real name), when you get to your mother's and my age these things are not the same as for you. It is not always a bad thing."

The fear of death is I believe something we learn. When we are young we don't generally think of such things. We are after all immortal. When we get old, perhaps we just remember our youth or perhaps we or some of us are just ready.


Tigers go for the easy picking. It might get excited because of all the running and screaming people but it will go for the one that appears less able to flee.

If you are cowering in a corner that is likely true. If you are facing the tiger perhaps not. They prefer the ambush rather than a fight.

This also reminded me of a scene from the book, "The Old Way: A Story Of The First People", an account of a first encounter with the San Bushmen of the Kalahari in the early fifties. One evening, the author then in her teens was drawn to the entry of her tent by the sound of one of the San men talking, somewhere outside. What she saw was a Bushman perhaps all of 100 lbs. facing three lionesses each at least 150 lbs. and telling them to leave, that they did not belong there and that he did not want to hurt them but would if they came closer. He had no weapon in hand and the rest of his group were around their camp as if paying no attention. The lions left.

I think that sometimes we confuse a fight or flight response which is a survival mechanism with fear, where fear is likely to involve some of the same physiological conditions and yet have no immediate release.

Still generally I believe the fear of death is something we learn. Personally I don't think I fear death as much as I sometimes might fear injury and pain. And that seems unreasonable because I have a very high tolerance for pain and I almost always take injury as just another event, after the fact.

kx000
08-23-11, 11:02 PM
Agreed, the will to live is just an instinctive force within us. There is little we can do to counter it.
Although, our thought processes (read rationality and intelligence) can also help us a great deal with regard to survival. They can also work against us however.



Tigers go for the easy picking. It might get excited because of all the running and screaming people but it will go for the one that appears less able to flee.


Fear is a very important component of survival instinct. People that have no fear will die young.

Thats why you look the tiger in the eye like "I will fucking kill you."

scheherazade
08-23-11, 11:09 PM
Originally posted by OnlyMe
Still generally I believe the fear of death is something we learn. Personally I don't think I fear death as much as I sometimes might fear injury and pain.

The experiencing of injury and pain teaches us to be fearful of these occurrences, hence they are learned responses.

As personally we have not experienced death, it does make sense that our fear is acquired by the response of others to their observation of death, or our own observation of the death experience in others.

Death of self is an unknown, and will remain unknown until experienced. Most of us learn to regard the unknown with mixed emotions during the course of our lives as some unknowns bring pleasure, while others bring pain.

Death.....the final frontier.....at least from our current perspective.

KilljoyKlown
08-23-11, 11:39 PM
Thats why you look the tiger in the eye like "I will fucking kill you."

That might be easier said than done. I remember being at the Tucson, AZ zoo a few years ago standing in front of the panther cage. There wasn't anyone else around and that black panther had his full attention focused on me with the end of his tail twitching like cats do when they are stalking dinner. I absolutely knew he couldn't get out of the cage, but I still felt a twinge of fear that I couldn't shake. I stared hard into that cats eyes and knew that if not for the cage I was dead meat. I have to say I don't believe their is any human alive that could have backed that cat down.

It's a much different experience when you are alone with the cat. If your up for it get to the zoo and be first in line when it opens in the morning and make your way to the cat cage before anyone else gets there and you should have a few minutes alone there.

kx000
08-24-11, 01:38 AM
That might be easier said than done. I remember being at the Tucson, AZ zoo a few years ago standing in front of the panther cage. There wasn't anyone else around and that black panther had his full attention focused on me with the end of his tail twitching like cats do when they are stalking dinner. I absolutely knew he couldn't get out of the cage, but I still felt a twinge of fear that I couldn't shake. I stared hard into that cats eyes and knew that if not for the cage I was dead meat. I have to say I don't believe their is any human alive that could have backed that cat down.

It's a much different experience when you are alone with the cat. If your up for it get to the zoo and be first in line when it opens in the morning and make your way to the cat cage before anyone else gets there and you should have a few minutes alone there.

Hell yea man. All you have to do is know your top of the food chain. The beast is probably more physical, but the human has the ability to out think. Thinking works best when calm. Analyze the situation and be ready to use your surroundings. Pick up a rock and put that pussy down with a shot to the dome.

How I see it is the cat can kill me weather im afraid or not, so there is no need for the nerves. My chances of survival go through the roof if I stay calm and out think the animal. Remember the beast goes off pure instinct. Instinct 1. Survive. Instinct 2. Eat. Instinct 3. Reproduce. Hopefully number 3 doesn't happen. If you can show you are the dominant being the animal will instinctually flee unless it is retarded.

Durring your stare down with the animal notice its weakness'. Off the top of my head im thinking the panther has short limbs so do what you can to grab its front legs when it jumps towards you and hold it off you. Don't let it scratch you, that will hurt like a bitch. Try to get it on its back. Its best sense has to be its smell, so get a rock and hit in the nose. It will back down. I can't out run the animal, I can't out climb it. So I have to options, 1. jump in a river.. 2. Kill it/make it flee.

Don't go jump in the panther cage, I have no idea what im talking about im just going off my instincts.

If you find your self up against a grizzly bear I hope you have your 12 gage, or you have made your peace with G.O.D.

kx000
08-24-11, 01:40 AM
You gotta look death in the eye. Thats all you can do.

Enmos
08-24-11, 01:43 AM
If you are cowering in a corner that is likely true. If you are facing the tiger perhaps not. They prefer the ambush rather than a fight.


Thats why you look the tiger in the eye like "I will fucking kill you."

I think that is a very dangerous strategy. If the tiger is already agitated and ready to pounce I don't think it will discourage it very much.
By staring it down you are basically challenging it to fight you. If the tiger isn't being aggressive you might succeed, but otherwise..

kx000
08-24-11, 02:00 AM
I think that is a very dangerous strategy. If the tiger is already agitated and ready to pounce I don't think it will discourage it very much.
By staring it down you are basically challenging it to fight you. If the tiger isn't being aggressive you might succeed, but otherwise..

Good luck out running a tiger. If im one on one with a tiger I don't see it being agitated unless its children are around. And again, stay calm and access the situation. Use your surroundings.

KilljoyKlown
08-24-11, 02:01 AM
Hell yea man. All you have to do is know your top of the food chain. The beast is probably more physical, but the human has the ability to out think. Thinking works best when calm. Analyze the situation and be ready to use your surroundings. Pick up a rock and put that pussy down with a shot to the dome.

How I see it is the cat can kill me weather im afraid or not, so there is no need for the nerves. My chances of survival go through the roof if I stay calm and out think the animal. Remember the beast goes off pure instinct. Instinct 1. Survive. Instinct 2. Eat. Instinct 3. Reproduce. Hopefully number 3 doesn't happen. If you can show you are the dominant being the animal will instinctually flee unless it is retarded.

Durring your stare down with the animal notice its weakness'. Off the top of my head im thinking the panther has short limbs so do what you can to grab its front legs when it jumps towards you and hold it off you. Don't let it scratch you, that will hurt like a bitch. Try to get it on its back. Its best sense has to be its smell, so get a rock and hit in the nose. It will back down. I can't out run the animal, I can't out climb it. So I have to options, 1. jump in a river.. 2. Kill it/make it flee.

Don't go jump in the panther cage, I have no idea what im talking about im just going off my instincts.

If you find your self up against a grizzly bear I hope you have your 12 gage, or you have made your peace with G.O.D.

That black panther is the only carnivore I've ever spent some alone time with and I have to tell you no other carnivores ever affected me like that. It was hungry and I was there alone with it. Believe me when I say it stared me down and I was just food (nothing personal). There was no convincing it I was a dominant being. At least with a bear a little pepper spray will save your life. I would not want to bet my life that it would also work with the cat.

KilljoyKlown
08-24-11, 02:05 AM
Good luck out running a tiger. If im one on one with a tiger I don't see it being agitated unless its children are around.

I'd do my best to make sure there were other people between me and the tigar.

kx000
08-24-11, 02:05 AM
That black panther is the only carnivore I've ever spent some alone time with and I have to tell you no other carnivores ever affected me like that. It was hungry and I was there alone with it. Believe me when I say it stared me down and I was just food (nothing personal). There was no convincing it I was a dominant being. At least with a bear a little pepper spray will save your life. I would not want to bet my life that it would also work with the cat.

Instinct 2. Eat. If you can't show that you are the dominant being.. then...

kx000
08-24-11, 02:08 AM
I'd do my best to make sure there were other people between me and the tigar.

Haha now a person is easy to take down. Easily scared into a fetal position, and most are un knowledgable on survival techniques due living in a soft environment.

Enmos
08-24-11, 03:17 AM
Good luck out running a tiger. If im one on one with a tiger I don't see it being agitated unless its children are around. And again, stay calm and access the situation. Use your surroundings.

Well, good luck to you too. Remember the circumstances we're discussing.
You are in a room...

..if you were with a group of say 100 people in a large room with a door on each side, and a tiger entered to room through one of those doors.
Are you going to take your chances, relying on your staring abilities, being alone in a room with an agitated tiger?

Also, about using your surroundings, tigers can climb trees.
The best thing is to back off slowly, appear to be as nonthreatening as humanly possible, not look it in the eye, and hope for the best.
But if it's already out to get you and you don't have any weapons to defend yourself with you're most likely going to end up as lunch.

The following account is just to show that you don't mess with a tiger:
I once saw a documentary in which a tiger was shot in the belly by a tiger-hunter. It managed to get away and a deer-hunter came across it some time later. The tiger attacked out of pure fury (the experts in the documentary thought the tiger recognized the image of a man with a rifle as a 'baddie', so it was really just protecting itself the best way it knew how). The deer-hunter managed to shoot the tiger in the head a couple of times, while it was still some distance away, before fleeing into a tree. The tiger didn't even appear to notice that it was shot in the head. I think he got a few shots in from the tree but the tiger still managed to wound him. Eventually the tiger collapsed from blood-loss.
It could easily have turned out badly for the deer-hunter though and he had a rifle against an already weakened tiger.

Enmos
08-24-11, 03:24 AM
Instinct 2. Eat. If you can't show that you are the dominant being.. then...

Alas, you aren't :D

kx000
08-24-11, 12:13 PM
Well, good luck to you too. Remember the circumstances we're discussing.
You are in a room...

Are you going to take your chances, relying on your staring abilities, being alone in a room with an agitated tiger?

Also, about using your surroundings, tigers can climb trees.
The best thing is to back off slowly, appear to be as nonthreatening as humanly possible, not look it in the eye, and hope for the best.
But if it's already out to get you and you don't have any weapons to defend yourself with you're most likely going to end up as lunch.

The following account is just to show that you don't mess with a tiger:
I once saw a documentary in which a tiger was shot in the belly by a tiger-hunter. It managed to get away and a deer-hunter came across it some time later. The tiger attacked out of pure fury (the experts in the documentary thought the tiger recognized the image of a man with a rifle as a 'baddie', so it was really just protecting itself the best way it knew how). The deer-hunter managed to shoot the tiger in the head a couple of times, while it was still some distance away, before fleeing into a tree. The tiger didn't even appear to notice that it was shot in the head. I think he got a few shots in from the tree but the tiger still managed to wound him. Eventually the tiger collapsed from blood-loss.
It could easily have turned out badly for the deer-hunter though and he had a rifle against an already weakened tiger.

Oh. Yea. You don't have to out run the tiger, just the fat guy.

captbilly
01-24-12, 02:59 PM
I have not seen any science based answers on this topic so I figured I give it a try. Human evolution is all about surviving long enough to reproduce and then live long enough to insure the survival of our children so that they can reproduce and so on. If humans were not genetically predisposed to be afraid of death we would not live our lives in a way that was conducive to survival. Of course life is not so simple as to simply favor those who are most careful. There are competing evolutionary characteristics that provide other improved reproduction chances. Agression, problem solving skills, attachment to ones partner, etc., all are needed to more or less degrees to provide the greatest chance of passing on ones genetic code to another generation.

The bottom line is that we are probably afraid of death because our ancestors that did not have this fear were less likely to pass on their genetic code to another generation. We rationalize this fear, because making up answers to questions is another evolutionary trait (humans seem to have an inherent desire to find solutions even if they don't really have the information necessary to find correct solutions). I am as afraid of death as the next guy, but logically I realize that death is both inevitable and essentially meaningless. When I die I will cease to exist so I obviously won't care one way or another. It is also true that people are genetically predisposed to avoid pain, since pain is our bodies warning system that we are doing something harmful to our chances of survival (humans who disregard this warning oftened died prior to ensuring the survival of their ofspring). Sometimes we mistake fear of pain with fear of death, but I suspect that both are distinct, and both are important for humans. For some creatures that do much less thinking than humans, fear of pain may be sufficient for survival.

CptBork
01-24-12, 05:17 PM
I think you summed it up nicely. It's an evolutionary thing- if most members of a species were pretty much indifferent to death, how long do you think that species would last? Then there's the obvious pain aspect, which is especially a factor in today's world where fascists and religious whackjobs run the show and dying with dignity at a time of one's own choosing is basically outlawed (I've heard plentiful stories of suicidal people ending up tossed out to basically die in the cold, instead of the warm places where they could have done it in the first place but failed or got caught).

For me it's mostly about the pain factor (most of the easy ways to die are strictly controlled, and many other "easy" ways aren't nearly so easy as advertised by people who wouldn't be advertising them if they themselves had actually managed to successfully employ them). Also I wouldn't want a sociopathic doctor to lock me up somewhere for trying anything, and I personally still care enough about the well-being of my friends and family to stick around for their sakes, even though I think they've got some pretty nutty delusions about the importance of life in the big scheme.

CptBork
01-24-12, 05:18 PM
A related question for me is why so many suffering idiots choose to have children, when if they had an IQ over 100 they ought to know that those children are even more likely to suffer than the parents did. I consider it criminal to do that, tossing their kids out into nature's meatgrinder and hoping they win the lottery.

KilljoyKlown
01-24-12, 07:36 PM
I think you summed it up nicely. It's an evolutionary thing- if most members of a species were pretty much indifferent to death, how long do you think that species would last? Then there's the obvious pain aspect, which is especially a factor in today's world where fascists and religious whackjobs run the show and dying with dignity at a time of one's own choosing is basically outlawed (I've heard plentiful stories of suicidal people ending up tossed out to basically die in the cold, instead of the warm places where they could have done it in the first place but failed or got caught).

For me it's mostly about the pain factor (most of the easy ways to die are strictly controlled, and many other "easy" ways aren't nearly so easy as advertised by people who wouldn't be advertising them if they themselves had actually managed to successfully employ them). Also I wouldn't want a sociopathic doctor to lock me up somewhere for trying anything, and I personally still care enough about the well-being of my friends and family to stick around for their sakes, even though I think they've got some pretty nutty delusions about the importance of life in the big scheme.

If you really want to kill yourself, I don't think any outlawed drugs are going to be of much concern to you. Also, it shouldn't be much of a problem paying someone else to do it for you. If only it wasn't for all that socialized pressure on you not to do it. Now how many times have you heard that you really shouldn't care about what others think? Oh! I meant only those others that don't care about you.

KilljoyKlown
01-24-12, 07:43 PM
A related question for me is why so many suffering idiots choose to have children, when if they had an IQ over 100 they ought to know that those children are even more likely to suffer than the parents did. I consider it criminal to do that, tossing their kids out into nature's meatgrinder and hoping they win the lottery.

Yep! Being responsible for caring about keeping the species going is a dirty job, but someones got to do it and if that's not you, have a few kids that will.:D

CptBork
01-24-12, 07:55 PM
If you really want to kill yourself, I don't think any outlawed drugs are going to be of much concern to you.

Why not? You think it's as easy as going to the park and buying yourself a lethal dose of heroin? You'd have to have very trusted connections in order to make sure you were actually getting what's being advertised, which is very rarely the case when you buy it on the street. Most likely if you buy off an untrusted source, you'll get an inferior product with all kinds of junk added in to dilute it, and the result will be messing yourself up and not dying, a trip to the hospital from an unexpected side effect, and a punishment from the mental health system to top it off while trying to the cope with the fact you've now got HIV on top of all the things that made you suicidal in the first place. Plus you're more likely to get mugged by the dealer, and they won't want to sell you a lethal dose because they're not interested in being investigated as part of someone's suicide on top of all the other issues they're dealing with on a daily basis.


Also, it shouldn't be much of a problem paying someone else to do it for you.

Hahaha, are you kidding me? No one wants to spend the rest of their lives under criminal suspicion and forensic analysis for helping someone else end their life, again they have enough to worry about as is. And they don't need the extra guilt trip either, not like they don't have plenty of those hanging over their heads as is. If I went to a Hell's Angels bar and asked them to shoot me, they'd probably just jack my stuff, hold a knife to my balls while they take all my bank and credit card info, and then toss me out somewhere where I can't bother them anymore. Maybe in the US where practically any loony can get their hands on a handgun it would be different, but that ain't how it works in most of the civilized world.


If only it wasn't for all that socialized pressure on you not to do it. Now how many times have you heard that you really shouldn't care about what others think? Oh! I meant only those others that don't care about you.

Well their opinions do matter in fact, because they like to make people suffer all kinds of unspeakable mental and physical traumas in order to discourage it. We don't live in a libertarian hands off society, and even the people who don't give a shit about you will assert an ownership stake on your body. One of my closest friends had a friend who mangled their body in about 100 ways trying to die. The cops and ambulances kicked their door down, brought them into surgery, "saved their life" and turned them back out into the world like a handicapped Frankenstein monster. The guy made another attempt and now their family wants to toss them out into the cold, like this is somehow going to reduce their overall suffering and give them a real quality of life. Sorry mate, we live in a very fucked and very non-libertarian society. Your freedom to live and die on your own terms is only as effective as what 2 or 3 doctors and a court system which considers their testimony 100X more important than yours agrees it to be. The Church still controls our lives in more ways than you could ever imagine if you haven't seen what happens to people who try what you suggest.

RichW9090
01-24-12, 09:20 PM
I do not fear dying - it will be, I suspect, no different than going to sleep at night; you just never wake up. I don't particularly want to die a long, painful death, and I'd appreciate another couple of years to finish publishing all my research. But if I learned tomorrow that I had one week to live, I'm ready.

One a famous Buddhist monk lay dying in the monastery. One of his students, overcome with grief, baked him his favorite cake, knowing that the monk was close to death, and that it could well be his last meal. The monk, with a great deal of difficulty, turned on his side, took up his fork and began to eat very tiny bites of the cake - just a few. It was all he could manage. Seeing that his master wished to say a few last words, the student bent down and put his ear close to the Master's mouth, so as to not miss a single word.

The monk said, in a low, careful voice "My, this cake is delicious". Then he died.

That is how I hope to be able to go - savouring the cake of the moment, whatever it might be.

Rich

Trooper
01-24-12, 11:24 PM
We just had an incident here a few days ago. A woman attempted suicide by shooting herself in the chest with a colt python. A man found her covered in blood standing outside of her car in total disbelief. She got back into her car and said she was going to try to crash into another vehicle so he blocked the entrance with his vehicle. Most of her back was missing but she’s still alive. Some people have no fear of death. My biggest fear is leaving behind loved ones, but I think it all boils down to the fear of losing control. I was just watching this yesterday. It's sad.

Tony Nicklinson wants to die part 1 (http://youtu.be/6gqSYIDsKjs)

Part 2 (http://youtu.be/sx7vZvukhxw)

universaldistress
01-25-12, 06:09 PM
Certainly you are not alone in having this particular issue and I remember one New Year's Eve discussion long into the night at a table evenly divided over 'pull the plug if I am on life support' and 'keep me pumping. Where there is life, there remains hope.'

Interesting that you do not claim to be afraid of 'death', rather you fear 'not being alive'.

Your choice of phrase intrigues me.

The experience of 'being alive' is unique unto each of us, and the concept of death may also mean different things to each of us.

I suppose the fear of not being alive stems from, I have more to do, I want to see my children grow up, and their children's children ad infinitum, I want to see where this is all going, I want to carry on. The act of dying however INTRIGUES me. I am a curious soul; probably a factor in mine inevitably meeting death sooner than I could have. Nevertheless, I am excited about what will happen after the act. I want to live as many years as possible, but when I die I want to go out conscious, no matter the affliction/cause. When I go I want to feel it for all its worth. If something follows then great, I want to feel the full transition. If nothing follows but a slowdown of experience and a hallucinatory shutdown of the mind I want to be experiencing. Whatever the way, I want to be there. So in that regard I'm looking forward to it. Not to say I won't go out kicking and screaming if someone else seeks to make the choice. If it comes to me well, I will take it . . . well.