With 15 days to spare place your bets on who will win. I am very confident Bush will win, I don't think its going to be like last time, we should likely know his assured victory by the day after elections. I don’t think he will win the popular vote though, but defiantly he will win the college.

What is it with you wankers?

Of course the popular vote doesn't elect Presidents. States elect presidents.

Strike for a tuition refund, now!

I think it will be a dark day for america if bush wins.

Only for the less than half to which you relate.

Then there's the other half, and many of the rest of us.

Funny there are more Democrats then Republicans in the US.

This is what we should be watching. Kerry seems to be winning Florida as of Oct 19. Kerry has the edge today 284 to 247: (http://www.electoral-vote.com/) ( bush=red, Kerry= blue)

http://www.electoral-vote.com/oct/oct19.png

dsdsds,

Electoral college predictions are very sketchy, for example if (when) Bush wins Florida, where Kerry has a less then statistical error of 1% lead, Bush will win the election.

Here is a better prejection:
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/Electoral%20College%20Projection.htm

I heard last night on CNN that it is feasible that this time around Bush could win the popular vote, and Kerry the electoral. What a sweet irony.

With the election this close anything possible including something as fucked up as last time. But be assured Bush will win :p

And maybe we will have a few more Wars, which will make the world more unsafe with the intent of richening Bushes oil mates and creating false security.

Where is the undecided opinion or who the hell cares??
If i had to pick then Kerry all the way.

Proof that Even God doesn't want Bush to win.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blbushgodvsbush.htm

I going to enjoy it when Bush wins, watching many of your hopes crushed will remind me of the joy of being a pessimist :D

I don't think anyone in here has seen Channel One news, but there's a thing at ChannelOne.com for people not old enough to vote. They wanted to take a poll on who the nation's teenagers want to be president. The polls are open now and will close at 10:00PM Eastern Time on the 20th of October. So if ye'r not old enough to vote and ye'r an American citizen (or not, I dunno), go there and vote. http://www.channelone.com

69 posts to go!

As long as we're on electoral counts, the Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/elections/2004/electoral-college/electoral-college.html) presently marks the score:

Bush: 208
Kerry: 179
Undetermined: 151

Pennsylvania is an interesting story, as rumors abounded last week that the GOP was preparing to concede the state, though even to me, who would hope for such a development, it seems unthinkable; the polls were still within the margin of error, and beyond rumormongering, the story hasn't played out quite that way.

Voting has already begun in Florida.

How could it have? I thought everyone voted on November 2nd.

63 posts to go!

Absentee ballots.

from what i hear from the democrats, bush is the president without having won the election 4 years ago anyways.

i see no reason why a trivial thing like an election would impede bush from becoming president again.

Kerry WILL win Pennysylvania. We shall mobilize so many in Philadelphia and the urban areas in the state than never before.

I'm waiting for election day, and the days thereafter, for my news.

I'm not finding the local, hairy-palmed prognosticators terribly convincing of anything beyond the scope of their own personal fancies.

I'm not finding the local, hairy-palmed prognosticators terribly convincing of anything beyond the scope of their own personal fancies.
Really? That's fantastic, as that's how I've always thought of conservatives. Isn't it amazing that we can both independently reach like conclusions on our fellow republicans?
:m:

I’m really surprised at how delusions most of the people here on sciforums are to think Kerry is going to win. :(

Well, WCF: This is the year when we all find out once and for all, if America's really like what we see of ourselves on TV. You think it is, and I think it isn't.

Events are accelerating. They will continue to do so. It's going to be a hell of a race, and all future American generations are riding on the outcome. Buckle up, everybody here we go!

cue The Times, They Are A-Changin' Zimmerman

Even when Bush wins that does not mean all use americans are for everything he did, there is still the ~50% of us that disagreed with Bush. The sad truth though is that ~50% of americans do, and that you can't disargee with.

I agree with WCF. The American electorate has never elected the antiwar (or less prowar) candidate in time of war. I don't think they're going to start now. Kerry will go down big, and this time it won't be close enough for his lawyers to try to steal the election the way Gore tried in Y2K. Finally, here's a link to a video I'm sure you'll all enjoy. Perhaps even as much as I enjoyed the "Satan endorses Bush" link that's been floating around this forem:

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/bommer/When_The_Man_Comes_Around.html

Source: Pew Research Center (http://people-press.org/)
Link: http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=229
Title: "Race Tightens Again, Kerry's Image Improves"
Date: October 20, 2004

A nod of appreciation to the Washington Post's Dan Froomkin (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A51332-2004Oct21) for pointing to survey data released by the Pew Research Center.

Kerry's gains in the horse race are tied more to an improving personal image than to growing strength on the issues. In particular, the Democratic challenger has virtually erased Bush's advantage for honesty and having good judgment in a crisis. Kerry is again seen as the more empathetic candidate, an advantage he held earlier in the campaign but lost after the Republican convention. Bush continues to lead by significant but narrowing margins as the stronger leader and as the candidate more willing to take an unpopular stand on the issues.

There has been little movement in how voters assess the candidates on the issues. But a separate Pew Research Center poll of 803 adults shows that Bush's own approval measures have weakened appreciably. Bush's overall job approval stands at 44%, while solid majorities disapprove of his handling of the situation in Iraq (56% disapprove) and the economy (55%). Even on terrorism, the president's strongest issue, his approval rating stands at 49% * the lowest level since the Sept. 11 attacks.

Despite this erosion, however, most voters continue to believe that Bush, not Kerry, would do a better job of defending the country from future terrorist attacks (by 53%-35%). Bush also holds a 47%-41% advantage over Kerry as the candidate best able to handle Iraq. As in the past, more voters express confidence in Kerry than Bush to deal with the economy and improve the nation's health care system.

Pew Research Center (http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=229)

The results seem to encourage Kerry and perch at the edge of nightmare for the Bush team. Survey results for registered voters suggested a dead heat (45% each) over the period of October 15 - 19, which erases a seven-point Bush lead determined over the period of October 1 - 3. Nader support has declined to one percent over the same span, and the Undecided vote remained at 9%, although that number stretching to the beginning of October was a 1% decline from the September 22 - 26 polling period. Kerry gained that point.

Among likely voters, the Pew results show a dead heat at 47% each, with 1% to Nader and 5% to the Undecided column. The prior period held Bush in the lead 49 - 44%, with Nader at 2% and the Undecided at 5%.

That Undecided count is vastly important, as we all recognize. But chilling undercurrents stir the tide.

http://people-press.org/reports/images/229-4.gif (http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=229)
On the Issues: Pew results suggest Kerry voters are closer to the Swing camps.

Compared to Bush voters, it would appear that the swing voters might find more to like--or less to dislike--about John Kerry.

If anyone wonders why the likes of Michael Moore and MoveOn are so focused on getting people to the polls, this is the survey to answer the question. Everything points toward voter turnout and also new voters.

There's more to the survey than simply this, however. Voter confidence numbers are interesting as well. Take a look. It's surprisingly not boring.
______________________

• Pew Research Center for the People and the Press. "Race Tightens Again, Kerry's Image Improves". October 20, 2004. See http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=229

See Also -

• Froomkin, Dan. "Whose Reality is Yours?" WashingtonPost.com, October 21, 2004. See http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A51332-2004Oct21

Election Prediction: Kerry > '1' Bush > '0'.................

Atta Boy

We should be discussing the more likely outcome - an election in which the results in several swing states is close enough to generate challenges and litigation over the counts. Consider the scenario where fighting over allegations of vote tampering, voter intimidation, discarding of ballots and voter registration cards, improper voter registration in the first place, electronic voting snafus, hanging chads - the whole steaming pile that hasn't been cleaned up from 2000 - renders a decision impossible. Any attempt at resolution brings immediate suits and countersuits.

What then? A stalemate? Does Bush continue as president beyond January, and for as long as it takes to resolve the issues? And for how long - shit, litigation could drag on for years. There's no constitutional provision for such a thing. Nor is there provision for any kind of runoff or revote. Could the Democrats resist the pressure to fold like they did in 2000 "in the interests of national unity", or some such crap? And if Kerry ulitmately takes power after six months or a year, does he get a full four years or only what's left before 2008? Would everything Bush did in the interim be null and void? Would Bush have any legal right to do anything between January 20 and an ultimate resolution? If things start to really get ugly in the streets, could Bush declare some sort of national security emergency and call the whole thing off?

There's probably a hundred more questions I haven't thought of, but I just can't believe how the U.S. is careening towards the worst constitutional crisis since the Civil War, and nobody seems to be aware or give a shit.

The only thing that could happen that would be worse would be fifty uncontestable state counts that nonetheless results in a tie vote among electors.

Further reading of what legal scholars have to say indicates that in a truly intractable election cock-up, one possible compromise would be to have the Secretary of State serve as interim president until a resolution can be had.

That would be a hell of a note, and one way to get the nation's first black president. Look out, now...

I think Arnold S. or even Jesse Ventura would make a good president..........To bad Arnold can't run for president due to the consititution (he was born in Austria) and Jesse doesn't want it bad enough to run for president! How about Barry Bonds for president? Someone give him a call......

Atta Boy

There are several tracking polls out there that give the two candidates virtually meaningless "leads". The latest Zogby shows Bush ahead by 3, which is within the 3% margin of error. The WP poll shows Kerry ahead by one, which is meaningless.

Rasmussen shows a 2% point lead for Kerry today. Your point indeed.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/Presidential_Tracking_Poll.htm

According to this site, http://election.princeton.edu/#probabilities


estimation is 0,4% lead for Bush,
but then the undecideds are difficult to evaluate.
Nevertheless the US citizens living abroad are not counted in this analysis.

According to this site, http://election.princeton.edu/#probabilities


estimation is 0,4% lead for Bush,
but then the undecideds are difficult to evaluate.
Nevertheless the US citizens living abroad are not counted in this analysis.

Forget Bush! After Nov. 2nd. Bush will be history and a sad history at that. Kerry is going to WIN!

Atta Boy :)

I have a sneaking suspicion and growing confidence that Kerry will win:
• Some pundits note that when the undecided voters break late in the election cycle, they tend to break for the challenger and fall against the incumbent. However, even I'm giving into the Lewis Black sentiments wondering, much like the question of an OJ Simpson or Ollie North juror, who's left. I do, however, respectfully disagree with President Bush, who compares the undecided voter to an insect. Nonetheless, I think the tight polls at this point spell bad news for W.

• Voter turnout is expected to be higher than usual; this tends to favor the left side of the aisle.

• New voters, voters returning after a hiatus--"unexpected" voters--promise to be a wildcard; so far the Democrats have outpaced the Republicans.

• 18 - 29 vote: While many of these are included in the prior category, it should be noted that they're approximately forty-million strong, and tend to run more liberal than conservative. Michael Moore and his guest Rep. McDermott both appealed to this age group during the filmmaker's recent stop in Seattle; I would imagine the refrain is the same nationwide.

It's well enough to point out national polls, but I do wonder what the purpose actually is. The nationwide result has no bearing on the outcome. The real mystery is whether unexpected voters and what's left of the undecided crowd will turn out in the appropriate locations to carry Kerry.

I know nothing about this, but it seems like kerry is gonna win...

Hmmm Bush is gonna win by the looks of the polls... like that's a good thing haha

Hmmm Bush is gonna win by the looks of the polls... like that's a good thing haha

If Bush wins, YOU and everyone else loses. Bush with his staff of idiots will lose this election becasue the american don't want to re-elect an idiot for president!

Atta Boy :)

~1/2 of Americans do in fact want to re-elect (err re-appoint) an idiot for president.

I don't see Bush winning the election Kerry wins Florida. It seems that Republicans have decided that they must stop many Democrats from voting in order to win Florida.

Watch for three hour long lines to Vote in Jacksonville. A replaceable worker can not be two hours late for work because they wanted to vote.

I think the media is responsible for the majority of public opinion.

Because there are tax cuts, the powerful like George W. a lot, so they change their policy to pro-bush and diss-Kerry, thereby the average unthinking Joe thinks George Bush is Lord TM.

my advice is just get drunk and pass out until january... 2009

I'm more afraid of Ohio then Florida, Pen. is basically in Kerry's column imo.

I know nothing about this, but it seems like kerry is gonna win...
It seems that way looking at sciforums.
If sciforums was responsible for the decision kerry would piss it in.
Sciforums isn't an accurate microcosm of america though.
Sciforums is to kerry what a stadium packed with evangelists is to bush.

Sciforums is to kerry what a stadium packed with evangelists is to bush

It's worth pointing out that you're wrong. Nobody has to sign a loyalty oath to Kerry in order to attend Sciforums, and nobody is being arrested for supporting Bush.

The devil's in the detail.

Dionne Jr., E. J. "The Intensity Gap". Washington Post, October 26, 2004; page A25. See http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A62794-2004Oct25.html

Campbell, Lynn. "Campaign event security spurs arrests, removals". Des Moines Register, October 16, 2004. See http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2004410160329

Nobody has to sign a loyalty oath to Kerry in order to attend Sciforums
No, but obviously the percentage of sciforum citizens who are liberals is far greater than the percentage of american citizens who are liberals.
Sciforums attracts a certain type of person and not the diverse variation of types one will find in a country. Just like a disproportionately large percentage of male fashion designers are effeminate.
For example, I don't think there is one evangelist in the thousands of posters here, obviously more than 0% of americans are evangelists.

I think Bush will win, unfortunately.

No, but obviously the percentage of sciforum citizens who are liberals is far greater than the percentage of american citizens who are liberals.

You do realize that Kerry is a concession for most of Sciforums' leftists?

We don't have that starry-eyed devotion to our candidate that sycophantic evangelical Republicans do. We aren't naîve enough to think our candidate is all that. We aren't willing to elect our man at all costs, including our integrity.

Kerry, coming into Sciforums, would get ripped by our leftists. That is, so long as the conservative simpletons just sat back and enjoyed the show and didn't make a point out of mucking up the discussion with hyperbole and lies.

I mean, think about it:
• Mr. Kerry, why do you not oppose the war?
• Mr. Kerry, why do you and your vice-president--both lawyers--not make a stand on behalf of the Fourteenth Amendment?
• Mr. Kerry, why have the Democrats conceded to the cutthroats on fundamental economic issues?
• Mr. Kerry, how long do you expect the economy to bear the burdens of our unaccounted obligations exceeding fifty-trillion dollars?
And it goes on, and on, and on ....

Oh I know you guys are settling for kerry, I'm just saying as unlikely as bush winning might seem to some people who have been inundated with sciforums opinion, it's not out of the question.
I remember thinking there is no way bush would beat gore, everything I saw about the topic was joking about how dumb george bush was and I envisioned an america laughing at bush in unison.
Then he just won anyway. Even though it seemed like everyone knew he was a moron. My sources were comedy shows like conan o'brien, the whole crowd would laugh at the bush jokes, no one would boo, so I just assumed it was unanimous.
But conan is (or certainly was) only really popular with liberals so i wasn't getting an accurate reading of public opinion.

I'm just saying as unlikely as bush winning might seem to some people who have been inundated with sciforums opinion, it's not out of the question.

One of the curious things about this election is the number of Democrats and Democratic supporters who expect their candidate to lose.

Although I believe I do see the problem you're describing. Maybe we ought to take a poll of how many people use Sciforums for their news.

Note on Edit: Conan will have better appeal among conservatives in the 2012 election; he will be older, wiser, and three seasons at the helm of the Tonight show.

Like me, fairly confident Bush will win, despite the fact I’m voting for Kerry :)

I can only fathom of two reasons why anybody would vote for Bush: you're either very rich or very religious.

We don't have that starry-eyed devotion to our candidate that sycophantic evangelical Republicans do. We aren't naîve enough to think our candidate is all that.

Kerry, coming into Sciforums, would get ripped by our leftists. That is, so long as the conservative simpletons just sat back and enjoyed the show

Please, have some respect for your opponents. Bush is way too liberal on domestic issues (mainly, spending) for my liking. It's just that he's running against the most liberal member of the Senate. Also, he is a more likeable person.

I can only fathom of two reasons why anybody would vote for Bush: you're either very rich or very religious.

By that criteria, Kerry should vote for Bush. He's spent a lot of time at church lately, and as far as rich goes......

Anyway, got to hit the sack so I can get up bright and early to cast my vote for BUSH!

Anyway, got to hit the sack so I can get up bright and early to cast my vote for BUSH!

Ugh!

. . . :rolleyes: . . . Fine.

Please, have some respect for your opponents. Bush is way too liberal on domestic issues (mainly, spending) for my liking.

Well, the first quote you noted applies specifically to the analogy made by Dr. Lou to a roomful of evangelicals.

And I do think they're starry-eyed. Grumblings about being slighted at the convention are by the wayside. The evils of war are a price worth paying. Bush is the man on abortion, the Pledge, and gay-bashing.

As to the second, I suppose I could split the hair of why you include yourself with the GOP simpletons, but let's just stop and think about this for a moment: Is it insulting? I find insulting the GOP's contempt for the voter, their willingness to escalate political hostility and to lower the bar for integrity in pursuit of power. Part of that contempt is manifest in the party line. Now, in theory, being able to line up the rank-and-file like that should be a plus. However, the whole of society loses when such a stunted thought process wins the day. The conservative agenda relies on a troika of fear, greed, and superstition. Jingoistic slogans, escalated political vice, and a new standard in lies represent a simple platform:
• There's nothing wrong
• (Even if there is, Bush isn't to blame)
• Osama is bad
• That's why we need to win Iraq
• John Kerry is Evil
• John Kerry will let the terrorists murder your children
• That's why we need to win in Iraq
• John Kerry is Bad
• There's nothing wrong
• (Even if there is, don't blame Bush)
• John Kerry thinks too much
• Always stick to your principles, even if your principles are wrong
• (But this is George Bush so his principles are right)

It really is simplistic. And it's set a tone. While the pundits have noticed that Bush has been "on message", so, do they now recognize, has Kerry. As was pointed out of the first debate, and to paraphrase, "This may be the first time being on message has hurt a candidate".

The reasons Bush has seemed so "on message", and Kerry has eluded the press until recently requires some attention throughout the campaign, but is relatively simple in itself: As I've said many times, and as Bill Clinton noted on The Daily Show, liberalism requires more thought than conservatism: the press has finally figured out that Kerry's message is broader than Bush's, and thus can't be recycled several times in ninety minutes.

The GOP, in my opinion, has long come down on the narrow side of issues; this is a necessary symptom of their strategy.

History becomes unimportant; many conservatives I've encountered during the post-9/11 phase seem incapable of understanding the idea of an historical cycle or process. Irony abounds, and actually bookends the most immediate prologue to the Iraqi Bush Adventure. From Schwarzkopf to Schwarzkopf. Trying to explain to conservatives that the policies and principles we claim to be defending are actually what got us into this mess is a bit difficult. In fact, it requires absurd analogy. I'm sure, for instance, that it's probably possible to "shit a brick", but I, for one, ain't going to try. Sometimes people wonder what's up when liberals shit bricks. Well, it's easier than getting conservatives to see the obvious, and a generally more satisfying than persuading conservatives to stop being demeaning of what they're incapable of seeing.

Seriously: start with Mossadegh and try to explain to a conservative how our meddling for petroleum brought us this cycle of violence and duplicity. Hell, there's even a slightly-less-than-apocryphal quote from the aftermath of World War II in which the Americans and British reached an agreement between themselves: The Saud to the US, Iraq to Britain, and they'll work together on Iran. (All to stop the commies, to boot ....)

By the time you get to Khomeni, you've lost them. It becomes especially difficult to explain to them how Iraq ties into the situation.

And all of it symptomatic of the Cold War.

This way of doing things is running out of gas. The problem with Kerry is that he's still a continuation of the American imperium of old. That continuation, however, gives our American society better breathing room than becoming paranoid, belligerent, and ready to invade for no real reason. It's still a better option for the country and the world than the Bush Doctrine.

To the conservative platform, these things don't matter because they're too complex. All that matters is the bank balance, perpetuating violence, and the moral authority to oppress one's neighbors.

What? Tax cuts, war doctrine, gay-bashing. Or we could try another slant: Cronyism, abuse of the Second Amendment, the Pledge of Allegiance. Either way, greed, fear, superstition.

So perhaps the word "simpleton" might seem offensive. But there's not enough dope in the world right now to kill enough brain cells to make the conservative way seem anything other than brutish, exploitative, and spiteful. So, frankly, I feel I'm being rather quite nice about it in merely addressing the simplifications required, the lowering of the intellectual bar demanded, in order to accommodate conservatism.

By that criteria, Kerry should vote for Bush. He's spent a lot of time at church lately, and as far as rich goes......

Right, but Kerry is smarter than that, which is a good thing.

Besides, our friend Tano may have missed one reason: Irrational fear.

My Prediction:
I predict Kerry will be the winner by much more than other people are predicting.
I think he will take the Electoral votes by 10 - 20 points at least.

There is a HUGE amount of newly registered Democratic voters.
Although there are more Democrats in the country, Republicans traditionally are reliable voters. Democrats are generally less likely to vote.
The one positive result of Bush's presidency was that he pissed off so many people that do not vote, they have decided to put aside their objections to voting. They have decided that maybe they ARE disenfranchised, and maybe their vote will NOT count, but it is worth the effort - JUST IN CASE.

So the Republicans can't get more people to the polss, because there simply aren't enough of them.
The more people who vote, the more likely Kerry will win.
Both sides know that.
Republicans only hoipe is to keep people out of the polls, or make their votes not count.
Doesn't look like that is going to happen this time around.
People are going to make their voices heard.
There are also a lot of Nader voters that gave Bush New Hampshire, for example, to Bush last time around, and realize that not only was Nader wrong about there being no difference between the parties, but getting Bush out is more important than making a point by sticking their tongues out at the machine.
(Not to mention the plethora of Republicans that are voting for Kerry this time around)

The completely unreliable polls have been putting them a a dead heat, and that also will get people out to try and tip the scales.

I think Kerry will win by a fairly wide marguin, and Bush's Administration, of course, will try to protest and take it to the courts, but it will be so obviously hopeless he will not even garner the support of his party.
Democrats AND Republicans are going to turn their backs and finally wash their hands of him.

That's what I think will happen.

Or maybe it's all just wishful thinking.

We'll see.

The modern republican party is a parity of itself, it now immulates all the things that democrats used to stand for. Internationalist American ethics, and big spending. The GOP of today resembles nothing of the GOP of yesterday, I don't understand personally how "paleo-conservatives" can still support the neo-con Bush, neo-con is really a bunch of American liberals (predominently Zionist), who mascarade around as conservatives. The modern GOP is a mix of the worst of both liberalism, and conservativism. Deficit spending, Jingoism, anti-intellectual collective nationalism, scapegoating, villianization, dumbing down the political process (as Tiassa showed in his post), and by making America in the long run fundamentally so weak that she can only hope she will have an economy. If you so called "conservatives" want to see what your "conservative" president did to your country look at this:

http://sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=42069

Why do we expect 4 more years of Bush will be any different? About Kerry, I would vote for a republican should he be liberal on social, and international issues, and conservative on fiscal issues...sounds like Kerry don't it? If anything liberals have a great reason to be angry at the DNC, and Kerry. They sold out the priniciples of the party to counter the weight of the elephant. Kerry should he be elected will imo have to stop the rightward shift of America, and then moderate it back to the middle or even a little left (should he have 2 terms). If Bush is re-elected I fear that America will make that irreversable trip to the proto-fascist right. So to all you schzoid Bush voters, why vote for a man who doesn't embody the ethics of your party? I find it sad that ppl like Mad vote for Bush not based on policy but because beside Bush's name is a (R).

I'm just saying as unlikely as bush winning might seem to some people who have been inundated with sciforums opinion, it's not out of the question.
Wow, I didn't actually believe this.
This time might have been even more shocking than the first time.
I mean I love it, but I also love car crashes and torture chambers.
I have to wonder how many who voted for bush voted for that reason, not many I would think. More importantly one has to wonder what goes on inside the heads of those who voted bush for any other reason. :confused:

I want to laugh but it feels like that would be cruel.

You know what I think happened, all this "vote or die" and kerry the war hero documentaries scared the millions of bush backers hidden away in the ozarks(and wherever), who previously wouldn't have bothered voting, into thinking kerry might actually win.
Everyone that seriously cared about getting bush out of office would have been voting anyway, P. Diddy and co just alerted the dorment bush supporters.
Well done, haha.
*eagerly rubbing hands in anticipation of carnage*

It's a sad day for America if Bush wins....and it looks like it's going to be a sad day for America. Bush if he wins, will have to be held accountable for his stupidy when Iraq really turns into 'shit' and it will!

Atta Boy

You know what I think happened, all this "vote or die" and kerry the war hero documentaries scared the millions of bush backers hidden away in the ozarks(and wherever), who previously wouldn't have bothered voting, into thinking kerry might actually win.
Everyone that seriously cared about getting bush out of office would have been voting anyway, P. Diddy and co just alerted the dorment bush supporters.
Well done, haha

My good man, I think you've got it. It's the old "silent majority". Now, Bush also did quite a bit of "get out the vote" stuff of his own, but all the anti-Bush stuff also served to scare us conservatives into voting in unprecedented numbers. Even in my home state of Indiana, where Bush's victory was never in question, almost everyone I know voted. The turnout among conservatives was great enough to oust a sitting Democratic Governor and give the Republicans control of the house and Senate while greatly increasing Bush's margin of victory over that in Bush v Gore.

One theory is that a lot of conservative voters turned out mainly to support the bans on gay marriage, and, as a side effect, voted for Bush at the same time. That may have even swung Ohio.

aaah ya this thread is over, you can continue the same arguments on many other threads right now, but we all know who won. :p