Having realized how abrasive and crude I really am and how this alienates me from others and drives them away or makes them pity me and mock me with a sense of deserved superiority, I want to ask:

Who will love me?
Who will be my internet buddy?
Who will like me for me?

I need help.
:(

This oughtta be good...

Not me, but I will laugh at you.
:p

For some reason you remind me of Ralph ('will you be my friend') Wiggum from The Simpsons... Well if it becomes that much of a problem for you, you could always ask your mummy to start chatting to you and 'wuving' you via the internet.

And yes you do need help. And I mean that nicely. Errr really...

Although why you're asking a bunch of would be psycho's on the internet to help you is beyond me...

Hey, just register again under a new name and pick a less sinister looking icon. It's not like we'll ever be able to tell...

Sucks so far.

Here, I'll start it off.

Satyr,

I know, deep down, you think you are lost. But there are good people here who will help you to be a 'normal' kind and caring person. If you just drop this mask of harshness and let the genuine "you" shine through, you will make plenty of friends. Although we are superior, you can better yourself. Just share your true feelings with us! We will listen and not judge you. We're here for you.

SL and Friends

Hey, just register again under a new name and pick a less sinister looking icon. It's not like we'll ever be able to tell...

Yeah. A new name. That would do it. Something that has to do with how much he's seen. How far he's travelled. How no one place is his home. No place to call his bed.

Hmm.
Traveler? Nah. We already have a CosmicTraveler. Plus, traveler has connotations of Irish travelers wandering the country bilking little old ladies out of their social security checks.

Hmm.
Wanderer? Nah. We got one of those too. A real douche bag if there ever was one.

Gypsy? Better, but that does have some of the same connotations as traveler.

Hobo? People would probably think you smelled.

NavStar? Nah. That seems too orderly when in fact I think you're more of a chaotic wanderer, aren't you? From what I've gathered here and there anyway.

Hmm. Footman? Nah. You seem to have problems with people thinking you might be an asskisser.

Toady? Same problem, eh?

Well. That's it, then. Gonna have to settle with douche bag.
Yup.
Douche bag it is then.
And then every stinky vagina will be your friend.

Or maybe enema bag.
Your pick.

invert,

Do you have no pity for a poor soul in need? Satyr cries out and you... you insensitive person you, call him names?

Satyr,

Ignore this nasty person. Tell us your story.

Whoa, a puppet asks us to be nice to him?

Well. That's it, then. Gonna have to settle with douche bag.
Yup.
Douche bag it is then.
And then every stinky vagina will be your friend.

Or maybe enema bag.
Your pick.
You left out d!ckhead and f*ck-knuckle. :p

Damnit people! You're ruining this!

Who will love me?
Who will be my internet buddy?
Who will like me for me?

I need help.
:(

i will love you. I will be yo internet vubby. I vill like yu for u. Cool?

Damnit people! You're ruining this!
Awwww Satyr knows we know. After all, Bob really did say it all...

Sigh.. Ah the good old days...

Having realized how abrasive and crude I really am and how this alienates me from others and drives them away or makes them pity me and mock me with a sense of deserved superiority, I want to ask:

Who will love me?
Who will be my internet buddy?
Who will like me for me?

I need help.

The tragic thing is that this is all true.

Indeed, the name "Satyr" isn't appealing, and "Mephistopheles" is neither.
A simple, regular name would do fine (like Lawrence, Henry, William, ...).


But then again, the real challenge would be to love Satyr while he is being a satyr.
I'm not sure satyrs want love though; they want it only inasmuch as they can then mock it.

Water,

I'm sure you were aware of this, but in Jungian psuchology, water is associated with sexuality.

With such avatar, you say a friendly "Hi", it would sound more sinister.

Water,

I'm sure you were aware of this, but in Jungian psuchology, water is associated with sexuality.

So what?
Didn't know that though.

Having realized how abrasive and crude I really am and how this alienates me from others and drives them away or makes them pity me and mock me with a sense of deserved superiority, I want to ask:

Who will love me?
Who will be my internet buddy?
Who will like me for me?

I need help.
:(


You put on a good front but who are you?

:(
Gosh darn it people, you brought an electronic tear to my web-cam eyes.

Hapsburg
Not me, but I will laugh at you.Thanks, kind sir.
And your laughter will echo like tinkling champagne glasses to my goat’s ears and it will seem like love.

Bells
And yes you do need help. And I mean that nicely. Errr really...I do my sweet…ding-a-ling.

Nasor
Hey, just register again under a new name and pick a less sinister looking icon. It's not like we'll ever be able to tell...Who says I haven’t?

Can’t you tell, yet?
I’m Bells.

superluminal
Satyr,

I know, deep down, you think you are lost.And I know that deep down inside, you think you are found.
That’s what makes us so perfect together: Me, a manic-depressive fool, you, a pompous, pretentious wannabe …. Sounds like a friendship.

Please like me. :eek:

But there are good people here who will help you to be a 'normal' kind and caring person.It’s that “normal” part that disgusts me.

If you just drop this mask of harshness and let the genuine "you" shine through, you will make plenty of friends.But my “real self” is so pathetic, and weak and bland and boring and perverted and needy.
So, unlike all of you good people and normal folk.
I drop the mask my ugliness will become a crucible and my inner beauty will never be appreciated.

Although we are superior, you can better yourself. It is this ‘superiority’ which frightens me the most.
How could I fit into a group of such well-adjusted, healthy, intelligent minds?

My act is all I have. My hate is what keeps me warm and relevant.

Just share your true feelings with us! We will listen and not judge you. We're here for you.Ok……here goes……:

I feel like tearing you limb from limb. I fantasize about showing you who and what you are by ripping you apart and showing you your parts, one by one.
I dream about laughing in your face as the last glimmer of life and hope is extinguished in your eyes.

Aaaaaah…that felt good.

Do you love me yet?

invert_flexus
Yeah. A new name. That would do it. Something that has to do with how much he's seen. How far he's travelled. How no one place is his home. No place to call his bed.Yeah, something heroic and dignified, yet not too pretentious or arrogant.
Something poetic.

Hmm.
Traveler? Nah. We already have a CosmicTraveler. Plus, traveler has connotations of Irish travelers wandering the country bilking little old ladies out of their social security checks.Traveler sounds good. But it’s sort of simple and doesn’t fully project my sophistication and worldliness.

Hmm.
Wanderer? Nah. We got one of those too. A real douche bag if there ever was one.No, no, no…I wouldn’t want to be associated with such filth.

Gypsy? Better, but that does have some of the same connotations as traveler.Yeah, but it has a certain mystic and exoticism to it.
But my racial attitudes exclude such degenerate labels.

I want something that fully captures my wisdom and breeding …like inverted_nexus does.
You know something that says, I’m smart but I don’t flaunt it and I'm well read but I don't brag about it.

Hobo? People would probably think you smelled. I do smell and the name Hobo has that added air of rebelliousness, of living under the grid, outside the matrix. A solitary being moving from place to place and feeling comfortable in the dirt…..I like it.

NavStar? Nah. That seems too orderly when in fact I think you're more of a chaotic wanderer, aren't you? From what I've gathered here and there anyway.Yes, order is certainly not something that can describe me.
But NavStar sounds like I’m a nerd that watches Star Trek all the time.
I am…but I don’t want that to be the façade I project outwardly.
I want something more macho and strong, both characteristics I lack.

What’s the point of being myself when I can pretend to be someone else?

Hmm. Footman? Nah. You seem to have problems with people thinking you might be an asskisser.Nah, Footman is my pet name for you.
I know how little problem you have with being a brown-noser and a sycophant, so forget that one.

I would go for Butler but that one I’ve reserved for Mephura.
Queen, is you know who, Warrior Princess is the one that shall remain unnamed and ……I’m working on some new ones.

Toady? Same problem, eh?Toady is good. Although I’d drop the ‘y’ and just be Toad.
But that one doesn’t denote any imagery of travel and chaotic wandering.

I considered Vagabond. That one is a nice one.
Or how about Chisler?
Or Retard?
Nah too obvious.

Well. That's it, then. Gonna have to settle with douche bag.
Yup.
Douche bag it is then.
And then every stinky vagina will be your friend.You’re the expert, man.

Or maybe enema bag.
Your pick.I think I’ll stick with Satyr.

Enema Bag has nothing to do with traveling or walking or carousing or being a dick.
It is more, placid, secretive, kowtowing, ass-licking….like you, for instance.

How about you changing your name to inverted _ rectum?

superluminal
Satyr,

Ignore this nasty person. Tell us your story.Well it all begun in the amniotic bag of a she-goat.
I was wallowing in the fluidic ignorance when a muscle spasm excreted me into a world of light and brashness……. Shall I go on?

Cottontop3000
i will love you. I will be yo internet vubby. I vill like yu for u. Cool?Thanks.
Will you be my swab?

water
The tragic thing is that this is all true.I know! Isn’t that, like, hilarious?
Like, here he is, like, saying things as if to jest and….like….it’s all, like true and shit. Which makes it, like, ironic or something.

Indeed, the name "Satyr" isn't appealing, and "Mephistopheles" is neither.
A simple, regular name would do fine (like Lawrence, Henry, William, ...).Or Bob

But then again, the real challenge would be to love Satyr while he is being a satyr.
I'm not sure satyrs want love though; they want it only inasmuch as they can then mock it.And they want mockery to love it.

cosmictraveler
You put on a good front but who are you?
Uuuuuh, a Satyr, I think?

I do my sweet…ding-a-ling.

Noooooo... God damn you! That song is stuck in my head now.. :(

You die! You go to hell and you die!!! :mad:


Can’t you tell, yet?
I’m Bells.
Ahem! Well it is nice to know I'm not schizophrenic after all huh B2...

In the real world, those who can pander to a particular mindset will always hold sway.
In order to hold power, one must appeal to the majority, whoever they might be. If one cannot appeal to the majority, then appeal to those who make themselves appear to be that majority.

Presence.
It has more to do with presence than actual influence.

What we have here is interesting. A small community made up of supposedly like minded members - ie, the disenfranchised. Those who make themselves the rulers of the disenrachised are merely making themselves the rulers of a subset. Some seek power. If they cannot obtain it within the majority, then a minority will suffice. Isn't it interesting, though? The means by which many seek power is individual - and in this medium, power goes to those who can stimulate the imagination.

We all seek.
Power goes to those who can fulfill the needs of the seekers, and in that satiation you will see what it is the powerful need themselves.

Cease advertising your need, Satyr. Watch, instead.
They're fascinating. Watch the needs of those who inveigle... watch the needs of those who accept them.
Watch.

Better to die alone than to compromise. Zip it.

In the real world, those who can pander to a particular mindset will always hold sway.

Not quite. In the real world, those who can pander to any particular mindset will usually hold sway.
You know. The kind that can lay claim to being a sort of chameleon. You can find this type gathering at the water cooler with the 'herd' and displaying himself as a perfect mirror reflecting to each what each wants or needs to see.

One does not make themselves appear to be anybody. Not in the perfect examples of this specimen. Instead, there is a distinct lack of presence. Only an emptiness can be that perfect mirror. The only work involved in this is when this person finds himself amongst a group that offer various reflections. He must be careful to then reflect only generic qualities which appeal to all or he must choose one subgroup over the other. In both cases, his influence is lessened.


But. There are more ways than one to worm your way into someone's mind, isn't there?
Rather than displaying what a person or group wants to see, you instead display what they fear to see. Or what you think they fear to see. This path might be said to more challenging than the other path. Because one must constantly use one's judgement to decide which doubt to play upon. One must come to know his prey quite well. One must watch and learn. And when one knows one's prey, one can insinuate nearly anything one wants to. One must merely coach the words in the proper way. A properly seeded doubt can grow quite the dessert for this parasite, can it not? A veritable feast for this new age vampire.


There are, of course, shortcuts to be taken in this process. Not all of these parasites need learn their prey so well. Instead, they can have several key stereotypes which they use as a net to try to hone closer and closer to a specific target. They cast their net of doubt and wait for the response. They wait for the sound of slapping flesh to know if they've struck. For these hunters are blind and can only depend upon their other senses to tell them when their multidinous casts have perhaps cornered a prey. Like bats they use sonar and echo location.

And as a consequence, they see the world as a mere echo. Only when they clamp onto their prey and draw blood do they get a taste of more. It's almost a pity that the net strikes home so rarely.
So very rarely.

And yet the blind hunters keep firing in the dark.
Because they must feed.
Must.


I think the difference between the latter two parasites is that the former finds a host and latches on. In this way it can learn all the nooks and crannies. The latter seeks a crowd. The more present, the more chance of supper.

And. Don't forget. That all these types intermingle. Parasites are creatures of opportunity, after all. Casting nets one moment. Latching on to its primary host the next. Reflecting from its perfect emptiness later. Combining these techniques is sure to provide a bounty for our would-be parasites.

I say would-be because these types are often quite delusional. They often feed on nothing at all. They sit in the dark devouring their own emptiness.

Who will love me?
...
Who will like me for me?


Perhaps your wife could help with that?

I would go for Butler but that one I’ve reserved for Mephura.


That is a problem then isn't it.
Hmmm... How about something like Constant Engineer.
You know, like you are always conducting the train of conversation towards some new horizon?
Or how about Alexander, after the guy that wandered the world conquering all he came across? That could be cool..

Or we could just drop it.

Oh what men do, what men will do to avoid love.

"Look at me, how proud I am that I don't care what others think of me! I am standing here with them, surrounded by them -- look, how I don't care what they think! The great big me!"

Then why do you need all those people around you, if you don't care about them or what they think?

You are indulging your own weakness, and you are wasting your time.

Oh what men do, what men will do to avoid love.

"Look at me, how proud I am that I don't care what others think of me! I am standing here with them, surrounded by them -- look, how I don't care what they think! The great big me!"


Sounds like a girl I know. Hmmm?

Sounds like a girl I know. Hmmm?

Ehehehe.. ouch.

Koyaanisqatsi
What we have here is interesting. A small community made up of supposedly like minded members - ie, the disenfranchised.Hardly.

We all seek.
Power goes to those who can fulfill the needs of the seekers, and in that satiation you will see what it is the powerful need themselves.Well done…proceed…..

Cease advertising your need, Satyr. Watch, instead.Ohhh, I’ve been watching for a while, my friend. Not only here but in the ‘real’ world.

Now it’s time to play.

But why so afraid of showing weakness and need?
Are you so weak as to require secrecy to maintain well-being?
Are you so vulnerable?

What you forget, or perhaps don’t know, is that those who say the least or are the more careful show themselves all the more through alternate ways.
Their very secrecy and care says a lot.

They're fascinating. Watch the needs of those who inveigle... watch the needs of those who accept them.
Watch.Their need, newcomer, is something I became aware of decades ago.
And yes, they are fascinating for a while. Then they become repetitive and you want to stir them into different directions.

Best way to know the dirt is to allow your self to be engulfed in it. Then you feel its powdery surfaces and you understand their texture.
Simply observing from afar can only offer you so much insight. Then you must fall to their level and sense what they do and feel what they do and know things as they do.
Being afraid of getting stuck in the mud is your fault.

Here you come, a youthful buck wanting to tell me what is and was and what will be.
Been there, done that.

You remind me of the Sci-Queen who thinks I’ve only recently become disillusioned and this is me lashing out, this is my bitterness.
She thinks I am a disheartened idealist, who just lost faith.
She thinks I had to come to Sciforum kingdom to know what humans were and are.

When I was discovering what humanity was, you were swimming in your father’s testicles, now shut the fuck up!!!!
You are ruining my fun.

Better to die alone than to compromise. Zip it.Ooooooooh the little monster has just had a whiff of tragedy, but he still cannot see the comedy, the sheer absurdity of it all.

What do you know of solitude and compromise?
Tell me.

invert_hexus
I say would-be because these types are often quite delusional. They often feed on nothing at all. They sit in the dark devouring their own emptiness.It’s always interesting when one finds a specimen that believes they are not empty but full of…something…..full of ….full of….you know….something……

It’s usually those, self-proclaimed “full ones” which have so little to offer from their “abundance” and must mingle with those they perceive as full to make themselves feel like they are one of them.

Usually they begin repeating those they secretly admire, or show deference to excuse their mediocrity or deal with information to make up for their lack of artistry.
They frequent the waterholes where those they want to be like hang out in and watch and listen and adapt and learn and imitate, until the imitation is indiscernible from the original and they become like what they admire through practice and repetition.

You see even the parasitical angle has been given to them. Now they use it as if it’s their own invention, as if their tiny minds thought this one up on its own.
He will not even admit to it. He is completely unaware about the source.

He forgets entire threads dedicated to parasitical social behaviour, in which a particular Fenris was guided into participation, and which he undoubtedly read very carefully and searched through for information, for ammunition, for weapons, for reasons to feel better about his mediocrity.

You see inverted has no balls to talk about anything personal, about something that matters, about him self. His topics are cold and abstract they are distant and removed, so as to not be traced back to him.

Like all cowards he prefers talking about nothing while pretending he’s discussing something. He exposes himself through redirection and subtlety.
This is why his every word is mundane and hollow. His every utterance stirs no inner emotion, no passion, no reality in the reader and why those like him enjoy discussing irrelevant abstractions with no real life significances and even less personal ramifications.

Did you watch him during those months after the Kingdom’s woes?
He scrambled to keep interested, to entice some people back, and to feel special again. But he showed how mediocre and mundane his mind is.
He exposed his inability to hold sway and to insight passions and to create a buzz.

Here is inverted, once more, trying to create smokescreens, wanting to redirect and confuse and spread misinformation.
Here he is taking what information he was freely given, and tuning it into his pride and joy, into his vengeance and threat.

Truth about inverted is that he usually talks about himself indirectly, more than even he realizes, and shows his anxiety through how he chooses the topics he wants to pretend do not matter or have no effect on him.

So, here he is now, buzzing around my every thread, my every post, wanting to get attention by becoming a focus, once more.

Mephura
Perhaps your wife could help with that?Perhaps, Dimitra...I mean...she can.

That is a problem then isn't it.
Hmmm... How about something like Constant Engineer.
You know, like you are always conducting the train of conversation towards some new horizon?
Or how about Alexander, after the guy that wandered the world conquering all he came across? That could be cool..

Or we could just drop it.Your masked threat is amusing.

How dare you sir, bring my family into this?!!!
Little Alex, my pride and joy, is none of your business.

If my wife hears about this, she’ll be mad.
God help me.

Little Butler, still doing those behind the scenes jobs, still snooping around and putting your nose where it doesn’t belong, still the same nitwit you always were.
You are a different version of inverted_colon, above.
Taking info readily available and twisting it into error and hypotheticals that suit your motives.

But why so touchy?

What was that name…Romani and that other one....?
Remember?!

Good times.

Think I don’t see you sending messages, still?
Think I didn’t know you would read this?
Think at all?

water
Oh what men do, what men will do to avoid love.

"Look at me, how proud I am that I don't care what others think of me! I am standing here with them, surrounded by them -- look, how I don't care what they think! The great big me!"

Then why do you need all those people around you, if you don't care about them or what they think?

You are indulging your own weakness, and you are wasting your time.Did I say such a thing?

Some people forget that the internet is not the entire universe.

Also, it is revealing that you use the word love.
Are you looking for love in this place?

I know I am.

Usually they begin repeating those they secretly admire, or show deference to excuse their mediocrity or deal with information to make up for their lack of artistry.
They frequent the waterholes where those they want to be like hang out in and watch and listen and adapt and learn and imitate, until the imitation is indiscernible from the original and they become like what they admire through practice and repetition.

No offense, but your posts could've been written by Nietzsche himself.

Although it isn't a secret that you admire him..

Satyr,

Buzz.
Try again.
Your game is really fucking lame.

The question is, of course, what the hell am I doing in here then?
Good question.

You, my friend, are somewhat... addicting. I must admit.
I don't know what it is about you that makes people want to attack you so.
I... really don't.

Hmmm.

I can tell you that your net was miscast once again. You seem bent on this queen thing and blah blah. You're so full of shit on that that you show how ridiculous your technique is. But, you seem to think you're on to something. You keep saying it over and over and over again...

Hmmm.
Anyway.
You know something?
I was actually going to go through this thing and talk about how your thing about parasitism being plagerized or whatever was fucking stupid. And I was going to go into more detail about how I view your game. And how I actually have gone into some detail about me personal life here and there. You just apparently missed it. And this and that and the other.

But.
The truth is.
The whole thing is fucking pointless.
I don't play these games.
So.
Why am I in here playing these games?

There's something about you, Wanderer. I don't know what it is. You draw people to attack you. Your one great gift, I suppose. A man is as strong as his enemies make him, yes?

Anyway.
Whatever.

Satyr is a fucking moron and this thread is inane.
Goodbye.
Enjoy your pasttimes.

superluminal

“ Satyr,

I know, deep down, you think you are lost. ”

And I know that deep down inside, you think you are found.
That’s what makes us so perfect together: Me, a manic-depressive fool, you, a pompous, pretentious wannabe …. Sounds like a friendship.

Please like me.


Oh I do!

“ But there are good people here who will help you to be a 'normal' kind and caring person. ”

It’s that “normal” part that disgusts me.

Yeah, me too.

“ If you just drop this mask of harshness and let the genuine "you" shine through, you will make plenty of friends. ”

But my “real self” is so pathetic, and weak and bland and boring and perverted and needy.
So, unlike all of you good people and normal folk.
I drop the mask my ugliness will become a crucible and my inner beauty will never be appreciated.

Aww, I don't think so!

“ Although we are superior, you can better yourself. ”

It is this ‘superiority’ which frightens me the most.
How could I fit into a group of such well-adjusted, healthy, intelligent minds?

My act is all I have. My hate is what keeps me warm and relevant.

Naw, I think it's cute and cuddly.

“ Just share your true feelings with us! We will listen and not judge you. We're here for you. ”

Ok……here goes……:

I feel like tearing you limb from limb. I fantasize about showing you who and what you are by ripping you apart and showing you your parts, one by one.
I dream about laughing in your face as the last glimmer of life and hope is extinguished in your eyes.

Aaaaaah…that felt good.

Do you love me yet?

Aaaaaah…that felt good.

Well, I won't be your friend. But I'll be your bitch! Whaddya say?

(now that's the good stuff!)

Cottontop,



Sounds like a girl I know. Hmmm?

And because she doesn't love *you*, you insist that she doesn't love and doesn't care for anyone.


* * *


Satyr,


Did I say such a thing?

You did act so.


Also, it is revealing that you use the word love.
Are you looking for love in this place?

I know I am.

Everyone is looking for love, in one way or another, in one form or another.

And because she doesn't love *you*, you insist that she doesn't love and doesn't care for anyone.


Cottontail doesn't want cyberlove.
Cottontail wants cybertail.
How long before he asked you for it? I know he did.
He's been chasing around every piece of trim on the forum.

Psst.
Cotton.
Check out her: HotSexyAngelPrincess!!! (http://phi.asmallorange.com/~porfiry/member.php?u=8195)
Don't let her avatar fool you. That's just a picture of Athelwulf who she cybers with all the time. Looking at him, you'll see that he's no competition and you'll be able to get in her cyber-panties toot-sweet.
Sweet?
You betcha.

superluminal

Well, I won't be your friend. But I'll be your bitch! Whaddya say? Welcome to my stable.

Now, shut up Bitch!!!!!!


invert_sexus
Satyr,

Buzz.
Try again.
Your game is really fucking lame.Why won’t anyone play with me?!
Life sucks!!!!

The question is, of course, what the hell am I doing in here then?
Good question.Ooh, ooh, ooh….I know…..I know!!!!

You, my friend, are somewhat... addicting. I must admit.
I don't know what it is about you that makes people want to attack you so.
I... really don't.Must be my personality.

Hmmm.

I can tell you that your net was miscast once again. You seem bent on this queen thing and blah blah. You're so full of shit on that that you show how ridiculous your technique is. But, you seem to think you're on to something. You keep saying it over and over and over again...It’s because my net is full of holes.
Damn dolphins!

Hmmm.
Anyway.
You know something?I know something….I just don’t know that something I know.

I was actually going to go through this thing and talk about how your thing about parasitism being plagerized or whatever was fucking stupid. You mean that thread called ‘Social Parasitism’ (I think), which that pathetic Wanderer once started and you used as the basis for your thesis?
Maybe next time you can wait for someone to say “I’m a jerk” so as to proclaim that you’ve discovered that he’s a jerk.

And I was going to go into more detail about how I view your game.What game do you want to play, then?

And how I actually have gone into some detail about me personal life here and there. You just apparently missed it. And this and that and the other.It must have been lost amongst your incessant dribble and fawning.
Plus my AADD prevents me from focusing on anything for over a minute.

Oh, I’m sure you talk about your life, but do you talk about your self, your fears, your anxieties, your weaknesses, your worries, your doubts, your miseries?

Do you talk about your self, or through your self?

Every mind worth anything has been one that spoke from the heart.
This is why we listen, even when we disagree.

“Write books only if you are going to say in them the things you would never dare confide to anyone.” – Emile Cioran

Of course this opens you up to attack and to ridicule and to psychoanalysis and to dismissal and to speculation. This is why writing anything worth reading, even here on an internet forum, takes some courage, some audacity, and some indifference.

You, bonehead, speak and write about things. Even your life is referred to as an external phenomenon. You present the details, you mention the talking points, and you offer superficial information always maintaining a balance between despair and joy, wanting to keep equal distances so as to not be labeled as either.

There's something about you, Wanderer. I don't know what it is. You draw people to attack you. Your one great gift, I suppose. A man is as strong as his enemies make him, yes?Don’t ever insinuate that I am the Wanderer again!!
I never insulted you in such a way.

But you can never be my enemy. Don’t flatter yourself.
You are my plaything. A specimen that requires goading to perform.

Satyr is a fucking moron and this thread is inane.
Goodbye.
Enjoy your pasttimes.So, I guess you will not be my friend then.

Xerxes
No offense, but your posts could've been written by Nietzsche himself.No Nietzsche would never stoop so low.
He had the benefit of a University stipend and an early retirement.

I, on the other hand, wallow in the filth and tolerate stupidity daily. I’ve grown accustomed to the smells and textures and I study the underneath in us all.

Although it isn't a secret that you admire him..I admire many writers and thinkers. He’s just one of them.


water

Everyone is looking for love, in one way or another, in one form or another. Inverted_sexus is so obviously aching for punany, so look there.

But I think he likes his women with some balls and a bite, to bring out his feminine, Knightly side.
You see, he’s a Footman dreaming of Knighthood.

Will the Queen honour him with such a gift?
Has she already?

It's so sad here.
We speak words at eachother, and they bounce off ...
Too much time and too little love.

You mean that thread called ‘Social Parasitism’ (I think), which that pathetic Wanderer once started and you used as the basis for your thesis?

What, exactly, does my diatribe on parasitism have to do with yours? Other than the name Parasite? I suppose it's parasite(tm)?

What about Blind Hunters. Got a trademark on that too?
Echolocation?
Empty mirrors?
What other little phrases and analogies are all yours, Wanderer?
Bob? Where did he get to anyway?

Oh, I’m sure you talk about your life, but do you talk about your self, your fears, your anxieties, your weaknesses, your worries, your doubts, your miseries?

Pretty much. Here and there.
(Why am I back? Because I just so happened to be responding to Water's quote up there and got caught by this addiction once more... Harder to quit you than smoking...)

Anyway. Yeah. I've said this and that. More than most, I think.
However, consider this.
Your topic of interest is you. You against the world. That's usually what it boils down to. Or at least how it comes across. You yourself seem to be saying that all your topics are extremely personal and poignant. And. Since most of your topics (that I"ve seen) seem to be centered around the individual vs. society, that must be the central theme in your life. Your main interest.

Mine is more abstract. Language and cognition. That's the way it goes. Don't be upset.

But you can never be my enemy. Don’t flatter yourself.

OF course, I'm not your enemy. Never said I was. I'm your friend, Wanderer. I wish you'd stop being this whiny brat that you've become. Doesn't it grate on you?

You are my plaything. A specimen that requires goading to perform.

Yes. Yes. Probably so. You are the puppet master. Pull the strings and watch as they dance. Whoopee.
Such petty things to thrill you.
Such delights show how empty you are. How you delight so in the actions of others.

So, I guess you will not be my friend then.

No, Satyr. I don't suppose I will be.



Alright.
I really have to quit you.
This really is lame.

invert_crapxus

Alright.
I really have to quit you.
This really is lame.You can’t, I’m too damn fascinating.

Especially in my Wanderer guise.

But Satyr has his own brand of charismatic/annoying merits.


water
Too much time and too little love.Hows abouts an on-line orgy?!

I'd like to add one more thing before I go.
It's been kinda bothering me.
About your method of digging into people.
The blind casting of nets.
I can see how it's so effective. There are times when everyone is weak. When events occur that soften one's defenses, one's self confidences, one's assurances in this that and the other thing.
There are times in everyone's life when they fall prey to these doubts which your always casting about.
Everyone.
And so. I can easily see how you throwing these doubts at people over and over and over again... how that actually does hit them from time to time when they're feeling weak.
But. Do you really view this as a victory for you? It's nothing special in your observational skills. As I said earlier, they're all generic and stereotyped. One size fits all. You try to make them seem unique and personal, but they're not. And I suspect you know it.

I will admit that there are times that this net casting of yours does tickle weak spots here and there. But, and I say again, this has nothing to do with you. A net cast one day is a complete miss. The very same net cast another day might touch something. The difference in those days has nothing to do with you. It merely has to do with human nature.

What you do is parasitic. You deal in the negative nature of man. The negative nature of every man.

Yes. It's effective. Especially when people don't understand that you're blind. That you are not really seeing them. That you're simply casting nets and waiting for a response. Echolocation.

But what does it say about you?

There's a saying, Wanderer. I wonder if you've heard it.

There's a danger to staring into the Abyss. The Abyss stares back into you.

Think about what you're doing and what gain you get from it.
Just think about it. Maybe it's not too late for you.

Anyway.
Just some thoughts.
And. I won't let you know which of your blindly cast nets rubbed. That would be telling, wouldn't it?
Such is the problems inherent in casting so many.


Note. I don't tell you this for you. I have doubts that you will be able to hear me. I say it for myself. I wonder if you can ever understand why? I bet you'll have a handy interpretation. But I bet it'll be full of the Abyss.


Best regards, Wanderer. I hope you come back to yourself someday.

-invert

invert_nexus,


I'd like to add one more thing before I go.
It's been kinda bothering me.
About your method of digging into people.
The blind casting of nets.
I can see how it's so effective. There are times when everyone is weak. When events occur that soften one's defenses, one's self confidences, one's assurances in this that and the other thing.
There are times in everyone's life when they fall prey to these doubts which your always casting about.
Everyone.
And so. I can easily see how you throwing these doubts at people over and over and over again... how that actually does hit them from time to time when they're feeling weak.
But. Do you really view this as a victory for you? It's nothing special in your observational skills. As I said earlier, they're all generic and stereotyped. One size fits all. You try to make them seem unique and personal, but they're not. And I suspect you know it.

I will admit that there are times that this net casting of yours does tickle weak spots here and there. But, and I say again, this has nothing to do with you. A net cast one day is a complete miss. The very same net cast another day might touch something. The difference in those days has nothing to do with you. It merely has to do with human nature.

What you do is parasitic. You deal in the negative nature of man. The negative nature of every man.

Yes. It's effective. Especially when people don't understand that you're blind. That you are not really seeing them. That you're simply casting nets and waiting for a response. Echolocation.

And? So what?
It is only if one is afraid or ashamed of one's own weaknesses that such "net casting" can bother one.


But what does it say about you?

There's a saying, Wanderer. I wonder if you've heard it.

There's a danger to staring into the Abyss. The Abyss stares back into you.

Think about what you're doing and what gain you get from it.
Just think about it. Maybe it's not too late for you.

Maybe he is a vampire. Maybe he doesn't care. Maybe this, maybe that.

Unless there is a personal relationship between the parties involved, all that Wanderer says here are writings on the wall, to be taken as such.
What they will mean depends on the reader.


Note. I don't tell you this for you. I have doubts that you will be able to hear me. I say it for myself. I wonder if you can ever understand why? I bet you'll have a handy interpretation. But I bet it'll be full of the Abyss.


Best regards, Wanderer. I hope you come back to yourself someday.

Maybe he is chasing an altogether different ghost than the one you think.

You are ruining my fun.
I must to that being a part of my intent.
I'm having a little fun myself, under the circumstances.

What you forget, or perhaps don’t know, is that those who say the least or are the more careful show themselves all the more through alternate ways.
Their very secrecy and care says a lot.
Of course it does. But what does it say?

Their need, newcomer, is something I became aware of decades ago.
And yes, they are fascinating for a while. Then they become repetitive and you want to stir them into different directions.
You might want to stir them. I don't feel any such desire. Usually.

Best way to know the dirt is to allow your self to be engulfed in it. Then you feel its powdery surfaces and you understand their texture.
Simply observing from afar can only offer you so much insight. Then you must fall to their level and sense what they do and feel what they do and know things as they do.
Being afraid of getting stuck in the mud is your fault.
Well put. Bear in mind, though, that earlier you were warning me against underestimating your own experience - and here you are doing the very same thing.
You seem far to ready to translate wariness and selectivity into fear. Or is rendering the partially realised into an absolute in order to provoke a reaction another of your gardening tools?

Ooooooooh the little monster has just had a whiff of tragedy, but he still cannot see the comedy, the sheer absurdity of it all.
I do in my lighter moments. To do so all of the time would be cause for concern though, don't you think? A little like a man closing his eyes and whistling a merry tune before walking off the edge off a cliff.

What do you know of solitude and compromise?
Tell me.Oh come now. I wouldn't want to spoil all of your fun.
Work it out for yourself, and be sure to let me in on your conclusions. Or are you the only one allowed to play?

And? So what?
It is only if one is afraid or ashamed of one's own weaknesses that such "net casting" can bother one.
Not necessarily so.
The flies here can be quite irksome in summer, and you'll see people swatting at them out of annoyance. Does this mean they are afraid that the flies will actually hurt them?

Has anyone besides me decided that Satyr is Wanderer? I am quite sure it is him because Wanderer has a very distinct writing style and I've read most of his postings on the Internet. Yeah, he's definitely Wanderer. Not that I am complaining. He's a pretty insightful/entertaining/sensitive guy. Good to have you back, Wanderer. :)

And? So what?
It is only if one is afraid or ashamed of one's own weaknesses that such "net casting" can bother one.

Not necessarily so.
The flies here can be quite irksome in summer, and you'll see people swatting at them out of annoyance. Does this mean they are afraid that the flies will actually hurt them?

The flies are there.

Here's an observation: Ever killed flies with your bare hand? Noticed how your hand stays just before you hit it? It's disgust. Disgust deterrs.
Same with psychological and human flies.


Ah, all those anemic royalties.

Has anyone besides me decided that Satyr is Wanderer?

Lies.

Seriously... Do you really think so? I wonder why no one saw this before?

He's a tricky devil.


Water,

It is only if one is afraid or ashamed of one's own weaknesses that such "net casting" can bother one.

Well.
Weaknesses are weaknesses.
One is supposed to work one's way past them somehow.

But. Being bothered by the net is a weakness as well. And perhaps the biggest weakness, is it not?


You know. Speaking of vampires... Isn't Vanderluk a name for a vampire? Too lazy to look it up right now. Kinda ironic.

And. While I've got your ear, Water. I have this Vampire encyclopedia that mentions this strange eastern European notion that if you leave pumpkins or watermelons out on your doorstep during a fool moon that they become a type of vampire. They grow some kind of soft teeth and roll around. I never understood how it is that they bite people with soft teeth, but there you go. What type of legends does Slovenia have on the subject? Any?

Actually, I was a bit reluctant to make that post thinking that I would only be stating the blatantly obvious.

I wonder why no one saw this before?
Now that's a good question.

Maybe it's because he had been wrongly accused of multiple aliases (philocrazy) in the past and that gave him some kind of immunity to suspicion.

Whether I'm right or wrong, the association has been made and your brains will fill in the gaps and realize how obvious it actually is.

As much as I'm tempted to laugh at you secretly, I'm much to in tune with the 'positive' life force of man at the moment to do so.

You're late for the party, bud. Most people realized this long ago. I've been overtly calling Wanderer for several posts now. I've actually known since he first started using this puppet.

It's ok though. We love you anyway, Timmy. *rubs head* (Kidding.)

superluminal


“ Well, I won't be your friend. But I'll be your bitch! Whaddya say? ”

Welcome to my stable.

Now, shut up Bitch!!!!!!

Yes Master!!!! :D

What can I do to make you beat me? Please? Wait...

Satyr, you are a poor lost soul who just needs love. I pity you. Everyone here knows you are just a lost little boy.

Poor Satyr.

Now please, please beat me and I'll shut up.

Cottontop,
And because she doesn't love *you*, you insist that she doesn't love and doesn't care for anyone.


Did I say that you don't love or care for anyone? If I did, I don't remember saying it. Oh well.

I'm over you K; are you over S? We could be friends if you like, but that is totally up to you. You do have redeeming qualities, though you appear not to think so. So, do you think I have redeeming qualities, that is the question? :)

Invert deigns to speak to me? My GAWD. What a pleasure.

Cottontail doesn't want cyberlove.
Cottontail wants cybertail. I'm open to either. Or neither.




How long before he asked you for it? I know he did. Did I water?

He's been chasing around every piece of trim on the forum.Sounds like someone has a problem with chasing "trim," as you call it..

Inverted_sexus is so obviously aching for punany.


Bring out the gimp!

It's so sad here.
We speak words at eachother, and they bounce off ...
Too much time and too little love.
Definitely lacking in love, but what is one to do? Join in the chivalrous joust? I'm afraid I am not always up to the challenge. So sad.


You're late for the party, bud. Most people realized this long ago. I've been overtly calling Wanderer for several posts now. I've actually known since he first started using this puppet.

Damn, invert. You so smart. You da man.

P.S. Do my multiple posts make you think of me as even less human than you already do?

diverted_rexus

I'd like to add one more thing before I go.Is this going to be the last one before the last one to come, followed by your final say, continued with a concluding remark, superimposed over a closing statement?

Typical.

It's been kinda bothering me.
About your method of digging into people.
The blind casting of nets.Hardly blind, albeit using limited information.
I mean people give themselves away in multiple ways. Unfortunately I only have access to a few.

I can see how it's so effective. There are times when everyone is weak. When events occur that soften one's defenses, one's self confidences, one's assurances in this that and the other thing.
There are times in everyone's life when they fall prey to these doubts which your always casting about.
Everyone.What you meant to say, my half-witted bootlicker, is that there are times when reality cannot be denied and the mind is left bear from any delusional ideals and imaginative hopes.

And so. I can easily see how you throwing these doubts at people over and over and over again... how that actually does hit them from time to time when they're feeling weak.Did you feel the sting then Footman, right before you rallied behind your defences and fell behind your illusions?

But. Do you really view this as a victory for you?Victory?!
See here is where you show your metal.

There is no victory, nothing to win and consequently nothing to lose.

All there is, is sensation and the slow, often quiet, deterioration into nothingness.

As I said earlier, they're all generic and stereotyped. One size fits all.You have accidentally stumbled upon a fact, my dear sir in waiting. Humans fall within a finite amount of character types.

Not only history but experiences and humans repeat themselves, over and over and over again.

I will admit that there are times that this net casting of yours does tickle weak spots here and there. But, and I say again, this has nothing to do with you. A net cast one day is a complete miss. Or sometimes denial is how we deflect definitions.

It merely has to do with human nature.But “human nature” is what I study and what we are talking about.

What you do is parasitic. You deal in the negative nature of man. The negative nature of every man. Yes! The nature we hide and pretend isn’t there, the nature we mask and cover with positive imagery and labelling and explanations, the nature we deny but lurks there under the surfaces, motivating, influencing, guiding, doing, effecting.

You want to talk about how wonderful life is and how lucky we are to be alive or how much potential and love we have, then talk to idiots or turn on the T.V. or a temple or a church, or speak with your mother.
You want to talk about how compassion and love will save the world and how death can’t be the end of things and about how wonderful humanity is and only falls into evil because of ignorance and error, then you are looking for a support group not a philosophy forum.

Here’s a news-flash for you: Reality isn’t all it appears to be and life isn’t as pleasant as we would like to believe and the world isn’t a universe of untapped potential and hedonistic ecstasy.

Yes. It's effective. Especially when people don't understand that you're blind. That you are not really seeing them. That you're simply casting nets and waiting for a response. EcholocationA “net”, simpleton, must be fashioned appropriately to capture specific prey.

Sure, a spear-gun is more precise, but under the circumstances and the electronic seas, the net will have to do.
Funny thing about the net is that it offers its most poignant information after something is captured.
Through the struggle, the force of the push and pull the size, direction and type can be known.
Look at you squirming now.

It’s mostly your need to prove your disassociation from my characterizations that displays you. It’s your inability to resist and the way you try to cast ink clouds that betray you.

But what does it say about you?That I’m incessantly curious?
I don’t know, why don’t you tell me.

There's a saying, Wanderer. I wonder if you've heard it.

There's a danger to staring into the Abyss. The Abyss stares back into you.Stop quoting Nietzsche to me.

What do you know about the abyss?

Think about what you're doing and what gain you get from it.
Just think about it. Maybe it's not too late for you.Too late for what?

What am I too late for, which you are not too late for?

Anyway.
Just some thoughts.
And. I won't let you know which of your blindly cast nets rubbed. That would be telling, wouldn't it?
Such is the problems inherent in casting so many.Do you think the process of elimination is a hard one?
All one has to do is sit and watch.

Note. I don't tell you this for you. I have doubts that you will be able to hear me. I say it for myself. I wonder if you can ever understand why? I bet you'll have a handy interpretation. But I bet it'll be full of the Abyss.Of course, of course, I understand.

Once you’ve stared into the abyss, retard, it’s difficult to get the thought out of your mind.
But you’ve never stared into it, so you hypothesize out of ignorance.

I doubt if you fully appreciate the quote.

Best regards, Wanderer. I hope you come back to yourself someday.Your insistence in referring to me as Wanderer, tells me you are not pleased with Satyr and his ways.
You dream of a return back to the good old days.

But from what I can remember you weren’t particularly fond of Wanderer either.
You kept trying to unravel him, discredit him.

Now you talk as if he were your best friend.


water
And? So what?
It is only if one is afraid or ashamed of one's own weaknesses that such "net casting" can bother one.Or when one has not fully apprehended self and/or not entirely accepted self.

Maybe he is chasing an altogether different ghost than the one you think.Like....


Koyaanisqatsi
Of course it does. But what does it say?It depends on what the secrecy is about or in relation to what.

But what do you think?

You seem far to ready to translate wariness and selectivity into fear. Or is rendering the partially realised into an absolute in order to provoke a reaction another of your gardening tools?There are all sorts of methods for exploring the unknown at a distance and under unfavourable circumstances.

Oh come now. I wouldn't want to spoil all of your fun.
Work it out for yourself, and be sure to let me in on your conclusions. Or are you the only one allowed to play?I like.

But you say so little, whereas I’ve written pages and pages to mull over; a fact the dimwitted use to their own advantage now.

But nothing about me is something I feel ashamed about.
There is nothing about me that is true and which I don’t already know or that is false and can affect me as if it were fact.

Liking yourself when you believe you are perfect or near-perfect or when you only admit to a few irrelevant flaws, is easy.
Every idiot that has ever walked the Earth has fallen in love with himself, and often with others, based on false premises, spotty comprehension and ignorance.

Liking yourself after you’ve seen yourself as others perceive you or as you really are, as close as this is possible, now that is difficult.

Every intellectual I appreciate and respect has had to struggle with keeping himself interested in life and with accepting self entirely.
Every moron I’ve ever known has only had accolades and joyous cheers and positive outlooks to share.

apendrapew
Has anyone besides me decided that Satyr is Wanderer? I am quite sure it is him because Wanderer has a very distinct writing style and I've read most of his postings on the Internet. Yeah, he's definitely Wanderer. Not that I am complaining. He's a pretty insightful/entertaining/sensitive guy. Good to have you back, Wanderer.You blasphemer!!!! How dare you insult me in this manner?

Haven’t you heard how pathetic and weak that Wanderer was?
To mistaken me for him or to associate me with him or to even mention my alias in the same sentence as his is, for me, the worse insult.

I will remember.


superluminal
Yes Master!!!!

What can I do to make you beat me? Please? Wait...

Satyr, you are a poor lost soul who just needs love. I pity you. Everyone here knows you are just a lost little boy.

Poor Satyr.

Now please, please beat me and I'll shut up.Better.

Is this going to be the last one before the last one to come, followed by your final say, continued with a concluding remark, superimposed over a closing statement?

Typical.

Maybe.

SATYR,

diverted_rexus

Is this going to be the last one before the last one to come, followed by your final say, continued with a concluding remark, superimposed over a closing statement?

LMFAO!!



All there is, is sensation and the slow, often quiet, deterioration into nothingness.
Sad, but true.

Not only history but experiences and humans repeat themselves, over and over and over again.
Again, sad, but true.

Yes! The nature we hide and pretend isn’t there, the nature we mask and cover with positive imagery and labelling and explanations, the nature we deny but lurks there under the surfaces, motivating, influencing, guiding, doing, effecting.
Can I be your bitch too?! I see battle lines being drawn.

It’s your inability to resist and the way you try to cast ink clouds that betray you. It's getting dark in here, oh so dark in here.


Liking yourself after you’ve seen yourself as others perceive you or as you really are, as close as this is possible, now that is difficult. How do you see me Satyr? I would welcome your opinion. Don't be nice, either. I like the pain.

Cotton,

Et tu, Brute?

Anyway. Is there something wrong with somebody not doing what one says? I says I was done in here and I came back. And then I left and then I came back.

There is a key point that Wanderer doesn't get though. I didn't think he would. But that's alright.

You see. My post where I spoke of Parasite(tm) is exactly what he says it is.
The next one is completely different.
The former was for him.
The latter was for me.

There is a difference.

And.
You know.
Hate to say it, but I'm tempted to say a few things about what he says about negativism. But. I'd only be cold and abstract. Not at all what Herr Wanderer likes to see in a poster. So. I think I'll refrain.

Don't hold me to that though.

Douche bag.

Douche bag.

lol

The soundtrack to the mental wanderings here:



When you were
here
before,
couldn't look you in the eye

You're just like an angel, your skin makes me cry

You float like a feather
In a beautiful world
I wish I was special

You're so fuckin' special

But I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo
What the hell am I doing here?
I don't belong here

I don't care if it hurts, I wanna have control
I want a perfect body, I want a perfect soul
I want you to notice, when I'm not around
You're so fuckin special
I wish I was special

But I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo
What the hell am I doing here?
When I don't belong here, ohhh ohhhh

She's running out again...
She's running out, she runs, runs, runs, runs....she runs....

Whatever makes you happy

Whatever you want

You're so fuckin' special
I wish I was special

But I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo
What the hell am I doing here?
I don't belong here



I don't belong here




Stop whispering. Stop shouting.

So. What did the singer of that song end up doing? Killing her and making a woman-suit out of her skin?

Then he'd be special too.

Who sang that? Is that the one from the Silence of the Lambs?

I want to be your friend Satyr, cos I`m a Satire too! Wanna fuck?

Radiohead. Creep. Haunting song. But what's it doing here?

Creep. *The* anthem of all the self-proclaimed losers, creeps, weirdos, wannabes, not-fit-ins.
If they value being so, they, when they grow older, become the philosophers who embarrass others into realization, they become bored vampires, quasi-messiahs. And they are just as unhappy as they were years ago when they first realized they aren't as special as they think they ought to be.

What's this song doing here? It reminds them of their sour youth, that turned into the acid in these posts here.

I want to be your friend Satyr, cos I`m a Satire too! Wanna fuck?
Sure...bend over and cough.

Your masked threat is amusing.

Masked threat?

Why is it that whenever someone shows you something, you take it as a threat? Are you really that defensive?
Fine then, I shall ask before I show more. Would you like to see what else it is that I think I know?
I accept that I could be completely wrong of course...

How dare you sir, bring my family into this?!!!
Little Alex, my pride and joy, is none of your business.

If my wife hears about this, she’ll be mad.
God help me.

Bring your family into this? Whatever are you talking about?
I mention that perhaps your wife would be your friend (as one would hope is the case) and I am bringing your family "into this"? And what exactly would "this" be?
Do tell. I'm currious.
Little Alex?
Oh, is that the name of you little boy? How old is he now? Three?
Really I was trying to help you out with a new handle. I figured greek. Spreads ideas to new lands. Conquers those who oppose him.
I thought you might like it.

I guess not.

Little Butler, still doing those behind the scenes jobs, still snooping around and putting your nose where it doesn’t belong, still the same nitwit you always were.

Nose where it doesn't belong? If one doesn't want things seen, they should be more carefull where they put them, don't you think? So tell me great sage, what behind the scenes jobs am I pulling, or is this just another of your aimless shots?

You are a different version of inverted_colon, above.
Taking info readily available and twisting it into error and hypotheticals that suit your motives.

Am I now?
Hmm... Perhaps I am. What would you suggest I do then?

But why so touchy?

Touchy? I've said nothing this long, and you've been on about the butler and queen and footman for how long? "Twisting it into error" sounds like it would fit you better than me.
But why so touchy, satyr? Did I strike too close to home with my "hypotheticals"?

You have my appologies in that case. I would surely hate to upset you.

What was that name…Romani and that other one....?
Remember?!

The other one? Now you've lost me. Perhaps your mind is slipping in your old age? Romani. Yes.
Pity I already took that one, eh? It would fit right in there with the whole wandering motif you were exploring, now wouldn't it.

Good times.

Not half as good as now.
But then again, you would know that already, wouldn't you.

Think I don’t see you sending messages, still?
Think I didn’t know you would read this?
Think at all?

Which messages would those be?
The ones to the footman towards the end of last month? Perhaps the ones to water? (you been lax in your corespondance btw) The one's to the queen?
Perhaps the occational message that I send to others on this forum?
Oh yes Satyr. I'm sure you keep a close eye on me. You'd hate to miss out on something I do, wouldn't you? A bit like your daily soaps, is it? Better though, I would imagine. You get to invent your own plot after all, and star in it as well.
So tell me Satyr, who is it I am plotting against this month? Clue me in and I might try to live up to your expectations.

But as for your last two lines. Actually, I've just been reading your posts as I see them for comedic value. This incarnation is more humerous than your last. Not half as tiresome either. Keep up the good work. Maybe we'll give you an award for it.

The last one though:
"think at all?"
Gosh no. Of course I don't think Satyr. That would be far too much work for me. Besides, bulters aren't paid to think, no are they. It is their station to serve their masters, not second guess them.

The flies are there.

Here's an observation: Ever killed flies with your bare hand? Noticed how your hand stays just before you hit it? It's disgust. Disgust deterrs.
Same with psychological and human flies.

Ah, all those anemic royalties.

Yes, but haven't you ever taken an absolute delight in swatting an insect with your bare hand? Don't you remember when, as a child, you'd find ways to fall in puddles when playing football?
I love getting dirty. I love the stink of my own sweat.
I also love showering afterwards.

It depends on what the secrecy is about or in relation to what.

But what do you think?
I think you can only guess as to motive until you know someone by their actions as well as their words. Often the actions show the words as being smoke and mirrors, or self delusion.
It might be fear. It might be selectivity. It might be selectivity resulting from fear, it might be selectivity resulting from confidence.
Knowing someone intimately from words alone requires a lot of stamina, and even then your knowledge is forever tainted by the fact that what they say is more accurately a reflection of what they think they are rather than what they actually are.

And then we have, as you mentioned, the view of that person as evinced by the words of others.

Unless you're on here 24 hours a day watching "who's online", watching the pm's, and reading every post, you're only ever going to end up with the Cliff's Notes version.

Liking yourself when you believe you are perfect or near-perfect or when you only admit to a few irrelevant flaws, is easy.
Every idiot that has ever walked the Earth has fallen in love with himself, and often with others, based on false premises, spotty comprehension and ignorance.

Liking yourself after you’ve seen yourself as others perceive you or as you really are, as close as this is possible, now that is difficult.
I go through phases where I dislike myself quite intensely, but I also realise that those times are when I'm thinking of something I've done or am doing which is a step away from who I believe I am.
Only rarely do the opinions of others wound at all, and then most often as a direct result of that very selectivity I'm speaking of.
If they're right, it cuts deep. If they're wrong, then we question ourselves more than them, because it means we've made a mistake in our choice of companions.

You would have noticed, of course, that those aware of themselves go through something approximating depression or self loathing when they are acting outside themselves as they percieve themselves to be, especially when it occurs over a lengthy period.

I'm also overly generous, especially with my co-workers.

So, Satyr. What are your faults?
Squid Pro Quo.

Every intellectual I appreciate and respect has had to struggle with keeping himself interested in life and with accepting self entirely.
Every moron I’ve ever known has only had accolades and joyous cheers and positive outlooks to share.
You know, I'm liking Satyr far more than I ever did Wanderer.
Wanderer's attacks were, in my opinion, a flawed experiment for which you're still paying.

Enough clues yet, or do you need more?
Still having fun? I am.

Cottontop3000
Bring out the gimp!And a whip!

Can I be your bitch too?! I see battle lines being drawn.Ah, sure.
That makes…. let me see….two bitches, so far, and a man-whore.

I might be able to make some money from this.

All we are missing is a bitch.

How do you see me Satyr? I would welcome your opinion. Don't be nice, either. I like the pain.I don’t know, yet.
You are a new one, with an old feel.
A reincarnation, so to speak, amongst so many.

But you say so little and you haven’t dropped your pants in public yet, which tells me you only serve as a distraction.
Also, I am losing interest and don’t have the time, these days.

Why don’t you start a thread and post an opinion, and I'll let you know?


water
Stop whispering. Stop shouting.Why don’t you first stop screaming for attention?
I see you, already.

But I am special. Don’t you see that yet?
Special in a creepy way.
But isn't everything which is different, creepy.

We all fall into this conformist thinking, effortlessly.
I was at the park yesterday and along comes this dude with long grey hair, tied in a ponytail, two female earrings and a long robe.

I turn to my friend and whisper:
“Here comes a freak”

“I’ve seen him before, he comes here often. He’s …different.” My friend answers.
I stop and admonish myself for being so crude.
I the self-proclaimed defender of uniqueness, casting a derogatory aspersion towards one that dares to not be common; I the insulter of conformity ands mediocrity speaking in the tongues of the average.
I privately apologize to him.
Then I realize that to be different, to dare speak and be your self, invites ridicule.

One must learn to hide those parts of him, if he wishes to function at all in this society. One must learn to pretend and to act and to lie.

The other wasn’t a freak because of what he was, but because he risked everything for that expression, he deemed it so relevant and central to his being that he showed a childlike naiveté concerning the ramifications.

It’s like those serial killers.
It’s not their actions that surprises us, for if we are honest we can relate to them on some level, it is their total indifference concerning the consequences, their, perhaps obliviousness or their inability to control these parts, that makes them freaks.


Mephura
Masked threat?

Why is it that whenever someone shows you something, you take it as a threat? Are you really that defensive? Duh...yeah-uh?

Would you like to see what else it is that I think I know?I am aching with anticipation.

You have that spookz quality about you, that underhandedness I can appreciate.

I mention that perhaps your wife would be your friend (as one would hope is the case) and I am bringing your family "into this"? And what exactly would "this" be?It’s ok. I keep her locked in the closet, anyways.

This is my public exposure, by the Forum detective, ladies and gentelmen.

Tell me how you got the Queen’s phone number? Did you get her address as well?

Little Alex?
Oh, is that the name of you little boy? How old is he now? Three? Ah, my son. Yes.
What a wonderful boy.

If ever you realize your folly, you will understand my indifferent mirth.
:D

I thought you might like it.I do, I do.
How ‘deeply’ you cut, dear … sir.
What a blade.

Nose where it doesn't belong? If one doesn't want things seen, they should be more carefull where they put them, don't you think?Most certainly.
Especially when there are nosy, detectives/butlers around, searching the internet for angles, to make up for their other deficiencies.

If only you knew how funny this is to me.
Me and little Alex, are having fun.
He's right here, next to me.

So tell me great sage, what behind the scenes jobs am I pulling, or is this just another of your aimless shots?I don’t know. We shall see.

Am I now?
Hmm... Perhaps I am. What would you suggest I do then? Nothing.
I like you just the way you are.
Please don't change.

Touchy? I've said nothing this long, and you've been on about the butler and queen and footman for how long? "Twisting it into error" sounds like it would fit you better than me.
But why so touchy, satyr? Did I strike too close to home with my "hypotheticals"?Very close to home.
Or homes.

It seems I have residence in both the USA and Canada….at the same time.

Not much of an eye for detail, have you Butler man.
Or did the excitement of discovery cloud your senses and you didn’t look closer?

Eureka!!!!
I mean it.

You have my appologies in that case. I would surely hate to upset you.But I am upset.
Thanks for ruining my day.
Now I’ll have to repair those planes with a preoccupied judgment. I’m afraid my engineering skills fail when I am so blatantly exposed in public.
The blood will be on your head.

The other one? Now you've lost me. Perhaps your mind is slipping in your old age? Romani. Yes.
Pity I already took that one, eh? It would fit right in there with the whole wandering motif you were exploring, now wouldn't it.Wanderer?!
That guy is dead to me.

This place needs folk like you.
So pure and genuine and noble and intelligent and fascinating and ….nosy, playing those games women play so well.

Not half as good as now.
But then again, you would know that already, wouldn't you.I can only imagine.

Which messages would those be?
The ones to the footman towards the end of last month? Perhaps the ones to water? (you been lax in your corespondance btw) The one's to the queen?You are unique in that your participation now only consists of PMing members about .....fascinating subject matter, I’m sure.
Nothing else to say, huh?
Nothing worth placing in front of many eyes.
Nothing which could be dissected and you found lurking there underneath.

Why so afraid of speaking your mind and opening it up to interpretations?
What are you so afraid about that you need private sessions and secret methods?

Perhaps the occational message that I send to others on this forum?Expanding upon a philosophical issue, I gather.
An expansion so breathtakingly genius that it can only be uttered with special care and secrecy.

Oh yes Satyr. I'm sure you keep a close eye on me. You'd hate to miss out on something I do, wouldn't you?Not really, but if it makes you feel special to think so, then do so.

I just happened upon one of your rare, behind the scenes, appearances a few times and I was curious, the way I am.
Coincidentally you were in the midst of the same action all three times.Perhaps not so coincidentally, since you are always performing the same actions.

Go figure.

A bit like your daily soaps, is it? Better though, I would imagine. You get to invent your own plot after all, and star in it as well. Actually you are but a bit player that makes such wonderful things happen on ‘As Sciforums Turns’.
Albeit, since our last encounter, you have squirmed deeper into the shadows and you say so little in public for me to de-bone when I’m feeling glum and bored and little Alex is beaten to sleep and the wife is druged and locked in her closet.

But as for your last two lines. Actually, I've just been reading your posts as I see them for comedic value. This incarnation is more humerous than your last. Not half as tiresome either. Keep up the good work. Maybe we'll give you an award for it.Thanks, I try.

I’m afraid, though, that the powers that be - namely James and his heavy censoring hand - have been rumbling warnings and cautions my way, concerning my conduct, unbecoming such a wonderful, insightful and respectful place.
The censoring board appears to be very selective in what insults it notices and which ones it turns a blind-eye to.
I gather there must be some complicated formula concerning, productivity, relevance, creativity, kindness and insults which goes into the evaluation about who shall be silenced and who allowed to roam free and frolic.

So, I suspect my banishment is imminent, if not certain.

Don’t be sad.
Just think what an open field for your smarts this place will become then.
And I’ll have to cope without this place to bring relevance and entertainment into my empty, miserable life.

The last one though:
"think at all?"
Gosh no. Of course I don't think Satyr. That would be far too much work for me. Besides, bulters aren't paid to think, no are they. It is their station to serve their masters, not second guess them.At least you know your place, clever one.

Alex says hello.
Keep digging.


Koyaanisqatsi
I think you can only guess as to motive until you know someone by their actions as well as their words. Often the actions show the words as being smoke and mirrors, or self delusion.Exactly.

And don’t you think actions have taken place here?

It might be fear. It might be selectivity. It might be selectivity resulting from fear, it might be selectivity resulting from confidence.
Knowing someone intimately from words alone requires a lot of stamina, and even then your knowledge is forever tainted by the fact that what they say is more accurately a reflection of what they think they are rather than what they actually are. I agree.
But the speculation and mystery is what’s fun.

If it were clear and easy then interest would wane.

Unless you're on here 24 hours a day watching "who's online", watching the pm's, and reading every post, you're only ever going to end up with the Cliff's Notes version.No, actually my interest is part-time and comes and goes.
I sense it going again.

The problem with such arenas is that words, as you’ve mentioned, are all you have to go on and whatever rare actions occur and you become aware of.
So, you are left with a bait and steal strategy, an indirectness which when it starts becoming accurate results in defensiveness and a verbal care which prevents further speculation.

As is happening currently.

The Heisenberg principle applies here also.

The alternate method is watching is silence, behind the screen of anonymity and allowing the growing trust and comfort levels to rise until people start dropping their guises, here and there. But that’s not fun at all.

I go through phases where I dislike myself quite intensely, but I also realise that those times are when I'm thinking of something I've done or am doing which is a step away from who I believe I am.
Only rarely do the opinions of others wound at all, and then most often as a direct result of that very selectivity I'm speaking of.If you actually like yourself this is possible.

If they're right, it cuts deep. If they're wrong, then we question ourselves more than them, because it means we've made a mistake in our choice of companions.It doesn’t cut deep when you already know it to be true and you’ve accepted it.
At least not for me.

If it stings, this can be a sign that you haven’t accepted that ‘truth’ about yourself completely and you forget yourself or allow yourself the illusion that you have changed.

As for choosing companions, being overly selective results in too much isolation.
Sometimes one compromises in the hope that you or time can alter the companion towards something more appropriate for ones self.

You would have noticed, of course, that those aware of themselves go through something approximating depression or self loathing when they are acting outside themselves as they percieve themselves to be, especially when it occurs over a lengthy period. Yes, this would explain the prevalence of depression in our times.

It would seem that others do not and cannot tolerate another being totally and completely himself/herself for long.

It is something I am thinking about these days.

We hear a lot about being genuine and yourself and honest, but the truth is too much personal ‘truth’ is intolerable to the other.

If the other were to know everything we think and believe, not only about them but about life and the world in general, they would ignore the parts they agree with or find innocuous and they would focus their attentions on the parts that contradict their own version of reality and self or which confront their inner sense of well-being or their selectively constructed image of themselves, and they would become disillusioned or resentful.

The other wants to know the ‘truth’ only as far as it participates in their own perception and only when it flatters them or results in their growth and creativity.

There is a level of self-censorship in every human relationship.
Animals are spared such necessities, since their interactions are based on sensual commonalities that are always shared, even in their imperfection.

Humans have that added level of abstraction which complicates things, particularly because many of these abstractions are incomplete or arbitrary definitions or delusional constructs or only words denoting nothing but impractical ideals

I have become aware about the foolishness of being completely honest and forthright with others.
This honesty can only result in opening yourself up to attack and to endless speculation.

Complete honesty, when it does not adhere to specific common ‘truths’ and acceptable realities can only result in group sanctions and censorship, and the individual that dares is forever tainted with the scarlet letter and punished for his indiscretions.

When a ‘truth’ is uttered which the other finds disturbing or insulting, what happens is that all other opinions, that might have been agreed upon or might have served as attractive forces, are pushed to the side or are reinterpreted and turned on their heads.
All the words of the one that dared speak honestly become tainted with that expression. All his/her actions are seen through the spectrum of those words.

Furthermore when one attempts to smooth over whatever differences or imperfection might exist, between the self and the other, and so approximate a desired level of intimacy and approach someone on a personal level, the subsequent self-censoring will inevitably result in a future self-contradiction, as the level of comfort allows for a more honest discourse. One keeps silent about what he perceives the other will find offensive, but prolonged proximity allows the possibility of slippage of error or of an honesty spoken out of anger or passion or inebriation that will forever taint the future.

One is seduced with the romantic possibility of complete intimacy of total disclosure, like a Siren singing from the island but do not fall for that chimera.

So, Satyr. What are your faults?
Squid Pro Quo.Given what I said before, my greatest social flaw is daring to speak the unspeakable and then being forced to fight a defensive battle of justifying ones self to others who try to destroy or defame or explain away what made them doubt or feel anxiety or feel misery or uncertainty or insecurity.

What we want most from others is for them to make us feel in the opposite way, even if this means their silence.

In fact, silence is the best strategy when lies cannot be said.
The other fills in the gaps of knowledge with his/her own values and beliefs and hopes, if they are positively inclined toward you. If they are negatively inclined or you have broken trust, no matter what you say and how ambiguous you become they will fill in the gaps with insults and derogatory characterizations to punish you for not going along with their façade or for not trying to adapt to their reality.
They find it intolerable that you didn’t even try, by remaining silent or telling them what they wanted to believe, to become a part of their world and so you must be an imposter pretending.
For how else can someone not want to fit in, right?

As for my many others flaws, public Forums are not the place for their expression, especially since others incessantly deconstruct and do not offer their own, readily.

You know, I'm liking Satyr far more than I ever did Wanderer.
Wanderer's attacks were, in my opinion, a flawed experiment for which you're still paying.What do you know about the Wanderer?

The Wanderer’s mistake was taking on an air of severity that came across as pretentiousness, and an argumentative stance that came across as patronizing and aggressive.
He actually believed that anyone interested in Philosophy and frequenting such Forum’s was of a particular quality, above and beyond the average.
He found very little evidence of this.

Satyr, on the other hand, now knows this place is a joke and a reflection of the actual world. Nothing more or less is expected, no higher motives sought, no insistence on remaining focused on relevant, interesting topics with no personalization and no instinctive preoccupations.
Satyr is indifferent to this Forums thrashings and pretences, where the Wanderer became frustrated.

Wanderer allowed himself to hope, once more, even though humanity had become plain to see for him. He allowed himself to dream, as a reaction to this new internet medium which was a novelty for him. He allowed himself the fantasy.

Satyr is the complete man. The man that plays and jokes and mocks and laughs in a world that deserves no severity or care.

Enough clues yet, or do you need more?
Still having fun? I am.Does it matter, really?

I am a reaction to your reaction.
What and who you were or pretended to be as opposed to whom and what you are and pretend to be are irrelevant.
If you wish to disclose, fine.
If not. No matter.

I can only relate to you through words and as such you take on the personality you write.

I am aching with anticipation.

You have that spookz quality about you, that underhandedness I can appreciate.


Well, wait is something that you will have to do a bit longer. I think you for your words of caution. Had you not given them, I would have charged out like a fool. As it is, I hung my ass out there enough, and have been stung a bit for it.
I will admit, you have beaten me before. You've taught me caution. Important lessons that I sometimes forget.

I've been too cocky with this one. The details are where the fun lies.
You've been tricky, K.
If I keep this up I will be at the end of my wick.
I am starting to think that perhaps, there is nothing but pain if I keep going down this road.

I think it's time I step back a bit. Don't you?
I'd hate to be hastey...

Cottontop3000
Ah, sure.
That makes…. let me see….two bitches, so far, and a man-whore.
Wait, I'd rather be either a man-whore or a lancer, or, even better, both. Though man-whore and lancer may be a contradiction of terms depending on how good of a lancer I am. Chivalric code and all, you see.

All we are missing is a bitch.
I've got a couple of non-bitches already. One nuttered, one not. Will they work, oh wise one?


You are a new one, with an old feel.Couldn't anyone here have an old feel though?
A reincarnation, so to speak, amongst so many. I like the concept of reincarnation, but its flaw, as I see it, is that one does not know from one carnation to the next whether reincarnation itself is a truth or not.

But you say so little and you haven’t dropped your pants in public yet, which tells me you only serve as a distraction.How may I drop my pants for you?

Also, I am losing interest and don’t have the time, these days. Sad, if true. I wish more had more time.

Why don’t you start a thread and post an opinion, and I'll let you know?I'll think about it, though in the short time that I have been here, I do have a relatively high average post count. This will probably change though. I respect, in a way, those of you that have consistently posted here and continue to have high averages. This says something about you, as well as something about me.


I have become aware about the foolishness of being completely honest and forthright with others.
This honesty can only result in opening yourself up to attack and to endless speculation.Yes, but surely you realize why people attack, and thus knowing, must conclude that it is acceptable. That regardless of what they say or do, you are at least being honest with yourself. I think that putting up a false front is more dangerous, to yourself and those around you, than letting it all hang out there and being able to take some hits now and then. Depends, I guess.

Complete honesty, when it does not adhere to specific common ‘truths’ and acceptable realities can only result in group sanctions and censorship, and the individual that dares is forever tainted with the scarlet letter and punished for his indiscretions.
This can be argued either way, imo. I have found some measure of peace and self-understanding, I think, in wearing that scarlet letter. Maybe I am just deluding myself, but I don't think so right now.


When a ‘truth’ is uttered which the other finds disturbing or insulting, what happens is that all other opinions, that might have been agreed upon or might have served as attractive forces, are pushed to the side or are reinterpreted and turned on their heads.
All the words of the one that dared speak honestly become tainted with that expression. All his/her actions are seen through the spectrum of those words.
Possibly, assuming that the person who might, or might not, be 'disturbed' is not able to accept the possibiliy, at least, that he or she may be wrong. If the person is not able to admit that he or she may be wrong, then, like Koyannisqatsi said, you may want to question whether you need to place much emphasis on that person's opinion of your honesty.

Also, I think that our own interpretations of our individual honesty changes from time to time, hopefully, so we must realize that our truths of today may not be our truths of tomorrow. I must needs remember that I am not infallible.

Furthermore when one attempts to smooth over whatever differences or imperfection might exist, between the self and the other, and so approximate a desired level of intimacy and approach someone on a personal level, the subsequent self-censoring will inevitably result in a future self-contradiction, as the level of comfort allows for a more honest discourse.I think this is acceptable, as long as you realize this aspect of yourself. That is why I think I prefer honesty as much as it is humanly possible. This only works though, imo, if you are willing to have nothing and noone for the rest of your life. Which may be too high a price for us, of course. Myself included.

One keeps silent about what he perceives the other will find offensive, but prolonged proximity allows the possibility of slippage of error or of an honesty spoken out of anger or passion or inebriation that will forever taint the future.Yes, but how do you know that your perception of what the other will find offensive is accurate or not until you actually be honest. You might be surprised to find that the other had the same perception about you that you had about him or her, and that you both actually agree on something that is of great value to both of you. Then again, you might not. If not, I guess, like Wesmorris says, it boils down to a matter of economy, and what you are willing to pay for something. Payment being something along the lines of self-betrayal or self-denial. The 'something' being something along the lines of intimacy, security, sex, whatever. Then the question becomes, what do you value most? Or what is more important to you? Any answer, I think, is okay. But I think it might make a big difference in my life if I can see this about myself.

One is seduced with the romantic possibility of complete intimacy of total disclosure, like a Siren singing from the island but do not fall for that chimera.Yes, that chimera may not exist. Then again, one can hope.

Given what I said before, my greatest social flaw is daring to speak the unspeakable and then being forced to fight a defensive battle of justifying ones self to others who try to destroy or defame or explain away what made them doubt or feel anxiety or feel misery or uncertainty or insecurity. I'm glad you said "social" flaw. :D Ah, but if they won't to destroy or defame you, that says something about them, I think. In such cases, I wonder if it is worth the effort of trying to convert them. Tell them to fuck off, or suck me, and let them go on their merry little way. Maybe somewhere down the road they will be more receptive. If not, oh well. If so, wonderful. I guess.

What we want most from others is for them to make us feel in the opposite way, even if this means their silence.This I don't understand. Can you expound, of great and mighty? :confused: Edit: I had to go back and re-read your last sentence. (Very Faulkner-ish you are, wise master.) I think I see most of it, but by "even if this means their silence" are you saying that you are "less than fully honest" with them and thus ensuring their silence?

In fact, silence is the best strategy when lies cannot be said.I think you are working from the position that you have something to lose, while I am coming from the position that I have nothing left to lose. Which, in my mind, is almost true. Hmmm. You may actually be right. However, the less you have to lose, I think, the more honest you can be. Kind of like a relativity scale.



The other fills in the gaps of knowledge with his/her own values and beliefs and hopes, if they are positively inclined toward you.Yes, but for me, personally, I don't like keeping quiet and letting this happen. It feels dishonest to me when I do it. "To thine own self be true." Even unto the great death.

If they are negatively inclined or you have broken trust, no matter what you say and how ambiguous you become they will fill in the gaps with insults and derogatory characterizations to punish you for not going along with their façade or for not trying to adapt to their reality.
They find it intolerable that you didn’t even try, by remaining silent or telling them what they wanted to believe, to become a part of their world and so you must be an imposter pretending.
For how else can someone not want to fit in, right?Are you really worried about it? I think I sense that you are not.

As for my many others flaws, public Forums are not the place for their expression, especially since others incessantly deconstruct and do not offer their own, readily.
Again, fuck em. I've found enough friends without em. I think you will always be better off with honesty. If you have a flaw, throw it out there. You may find a good answer from one other person that has been in your shoes and has found a way out. One answer is all you need.


He actually believed that anyone interested in Philosophy and frequenting such Forum’s was of a particular quality, above and beyond the average.
He found very little evidence of this. I can relate, though not with regards to forums. I understand the feelings that are associated with the sense of disillusionment that results.

Satyr, on the other hand, now knows this place is a joke and a reflection of the actual world. Nothing more or less is expected, no higher motives sought, no insistence on remaining focused on relevant, interesting topics with no personalization and no instinctive preoccupations.
Good. I hope.


Wanderer allowed himself to hope, once more, even though humanity had become plain to see for him. He allowed himself to dream, as a reaction to this new internet medium which was a novelty for him. He allowed himself the fantasy. Nothing wrong with a dream, as long as you recognize it for what it is. Hopefully in death we will see that dream realized. Or at least forgotten.

Satyr is the complete man. The man that plays and jokes and mocks and laughs in a world that deserves no severity or care.
Hopefully, but do you truly believe in a "complete man?"
Does it matter, really?Maybe.

I am a reaction to your reaction.
What and who you were or pretended to be as opposed to whom and what you are and pretend to be are irrelevant.
If you wish to disclose, fine.
If not. No matter.

I can only relate to you through words and as such you take on the personality you write.So true.

"But nothing about me is something I feel ashamed about.
There is nothing about me that is true and which I don’t already know or that is false and can affect me as if it were fact."

But this self-knowledge, does it fill you with dread? Or is it liberating? Does it make one 'feel' any better? Or make life easier? Looking around these days it seems ignorance is bliss.

"Liking yourself when you believe you are perfect or near-perfect or when you only admit to a few irrelevant flaws, is easy. Every idiot that has ever walked the Earth has fallen in love with himself, and often with others, based on false premises, spotty comprehension and ignorance."

Too True! What I find amusing and disturbing is how many turn a blind eye to what they see in themselves or others (especially lovers). Comprehension of another? Personally I think it takes a lot of time and contact in a variety of situations. One may seem charming and lovely under a set of circumstances and turn into a unconscionable (?) disappointing asshole under another. Most of us are simply layers upon layers of illusions, delusions, frailty and doubt. And what about this? What does one do when you reveal every flaw and secret only to have them dismissed anyway? And no I don't consider dismissal actual acceptance, the former is just putting ones head in the sand. People don't want to accept what they see so they deny, excuse or pervert it to suit themselves. To illustrate: in Eternal Sunshine of a Spotless Mind lovers who loved and then hated each other choose the same relationships after having the person and their history erased from their minds. When they discover the evil ex in each they still choose to remain in the relationship. Maybe that is acceptance.

Disclaimer: My responses are not a way of casting nets or undermine Satyr. I just happen to find those insights meaningful at this point in time.

"Liking yourself after you’ve seen yourself as others perceive you or as you really are, as close as this is possible, now that is difficult."

But not impossible. Question is whether one can live with the knowledge. Is it better to be hoisted by our illusions in order to 'get through it all'? I don't know if you have ever seen the Italian film Life Is Beautiful, where a father tries to shield his son from the reality of a concentration camp by building a web of fantasy, informing the boy it
is all an elaborate game. Which of course it wasn't.

"Every intellectual I appreciate and respect has had to struggle with keeping himself interested in life and with accepting self entirely.
Every moron I’ve ever known has only had accolades and joyous cheers and positive outlooks to share."

(smiles) Well having read that I will now go and do some work. Its such a relief knowing one is flawed.

I see it too, I mean the hypocrisy of showing all strength and good graces when in reality we have some strength and good graces under ideal conditions.

The Cambodia Daily ran a story about a former khmer rouge leader who is still living in the same village where he reportedly committed crimes against humanity (UN speak). A village where some 10,000 skulls were found after regime change. Now this man lives in peace (no one has turned on him in revenge), he heads town meetings and is considered a scholar in traditional customs so spends a lot of time in the Buddhist temples (how is that for a contradiction). He is too small fry to be tried in the upcoming KR tribunals (the UN only wants top leaders most of whom are dead or be inundated with trying an entire nation for crimes committed against themselves-autogenocide). Now I wonder, how is it that this man lives with all that's inside him? He isn't anymore guilty than anyone else since he would have been killed if he did not carry out orders but still he did have a choice. He claims he is the victim of a society gone awry (I can believe that). Murder and barbarism ran amok as it has in other parts of the world...our world. Its in all of us, we just exist in an atmosphere where those aspects of our character cannot display themselves...easily or full steam. Our civility is a luxury until tested. The thing is does knowing this about ourselves, having connection to primordial drives bring us any closer to conquering them? Do they need conquering? Or should we just chalk it up to human nature, forgive ourselves and move on?

"I have become aware about the foolishness of being completely honest and forthright with others.
This honesty can only result in opening yourself up to attack and to endless speculation."

Not always and anyway it depends on what truth is being disclosed. Disclosing a particular vulnerability, humilitation or flaw isn't the same as telling someone you killed 15 people on a whim and that isn't the same as saying you killed 15 people on a whim during the vietnam war.

"One is seduced with the romantic possibility of complete intimacy of total disclosure, like a Siren singing from the island but do not fall for that chimera."

Well not at first anyway but after some time I must disclose. Would you prefer if a friend or lover spared you information because they feared you couldn't assimilate it with what you already thought you knew and understood?

By the way did you receive my postcard from Prague?

Satyr,



One must learn to hide those parts of him, if he wishes to function at all in this society. One must learn to pretend and to act and to lie.

I can understand how this is so for some.

But to pretend and to act and to lie -- for the sake of what? What does it mean for you to "function in this society"?

Do you [beware: you who *is* special] actually care if you function in this society?
What is this society to you?
Can this society give you something that you value, something that is crucial for you?

All those things you get by pretending, acting and lying -- what do those things mean to you?

Lucysnow
Lucysnow!
Long time no see…hear….read…whatever.
How have you been?

But this self-knowledge, does it fill you with dread? Or is it liberating? Does it make one 'feel' any better? Or make life easier? Looking around these days it seems ignorance is bliss.It depends if this “self-knowledge” is culturally appropriate or offers some social advantage.

If, for instance, self-knowledge results in the realization that one enjoys killing, and one lives in a militant, aggressive age, that values fighters then this knowledge will make one feel good. If he lives in a passive, altruistic peace oriented, culture which values harmonious co-existence and compassion, then it can make him feel bad.

Too True! What I find amusing and disturbing is how many turn a blind eye to what they see in themselves or others (especially lovers). Comprehension of another? Personally I think it takes a lot of time and contact in a variety of situations. One may seem charming and lovely under a set of circumstances and turn into a unconscionable (?) disappointing asshole under another. Most of us are simply layers upon layers of illusions, delusions, frailty and doubt. And what about this?That’s the point. When one wants to have a lover or friend, for instance, and enjoy another’s physicality and companionship then a degree of fallacy is essential.
To enjoy the parts of another you desire and like and need you must turn a blind eye to the rest or, better still, to not know anything about it.
A certain amount of pretence is necessary to save the other the struggle to accept, despite of it, or to save facilitate their enjoyment of you, as a representation of an approximate ideal, without having to practice forgetfulness.

When something is known it can never be unknown.

What does one do when you reveal every flaw and secret only to have them dismissed anyway? Not only have them, your flaws, dismissed, but resulting in your overall dismissal.

We must keep in mind that self-knowledge and acceptance is only slightly less difficult than knowledge of another.
When we expose ourselves to another, we assume that they possess the correct self-knowledge and acceptance as to appreciate yours, when they could have an idealized self-knowledge which could result in them seeing themselves in you and disliking what they see.

To illustrate: in Eternal Sunshine of a Spotless Mind lovers who loved and then hated each other choose the same relationships after having the person and their history erased from their minds. When they discover the evil ex in each they still choose to remain in the relationship. Maybe that is acceptance.Or maybe after their memories were restored they realized they were attracted to one another despite their differences and flaws, which meant there was something in their ignorance of self that was found in the other.

Disclaimer: My responses are not a way of casting nets or undermine Satyr. I just happen to find those insights meaningful at this point in time.It’s okay even if you are.
Join the club.

But not impossible. Question is whether one can live with the knowledge. Is it better to be hoisted by our illusions in order to 'get through it all'? I don't know if you have ever seen the Italian film Life Is Beautiful, where a father tries to shield his son from the reality of a concentration camp by building a web of fantasy, informing the boy it
is all an elaborate game. Which of course it wasn't. But that was more a case of protecting the child from knowing the world, rather than the self.
I think the difficulty or ease in accepting ones self is also determined in how well we understand others and make comparisons.
If we know self but have an idealized version of others, this could result in feelings of inferiority and weirdness.
But if we realize that what others often present as self may not always correspond to the entirety or the truth, and that he/she is presenting a partial censored self, that he/she believes is appropriate or attractive or effective to achieve a particular goal or effect and is in accordance with whatever social and cultural ideals exist at the time, then whatever we know about self becomes less shameful.

I think the hardest thing about growing up is in realizing that what the world pretends to be is not what it is.
What feelings of insecurity and inferiority burden us at youth is related to this partial disclosure of self by others which makes one strive to reach an ideal