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View Full Version : What is the Tesseract premise?
Saquist 12-09-07, 03:57 AM I'm up late watching a movie on a WB net work about a random selection of people trap in a Tesseract or HyperCube. I barely can grasp the concept of why a theoretical premise such as this even exist.
I've looked it up but the Wiki was not very helpfull in laymens terms...
What is the purpose of this theory? If a Tesseract is to a cube as a cube is to square but what the heck is the purpose of the Tesseract?
K.FLINT 12-09-07, 07:12 AM My daughter likes strange Days at Blake Holsey High, also. Here is a good place to start, have fun :) http://www.geom.uiuc.edu/docs/holt/tesseract/top.html
Saquist 12-09-07, 12:32 PM Hey thanks Flint. Appreciate that.
Fabio4all 12-14-07, 09:29 PM Is it called the Cube? Although I did that paper on the fourth dimension, I think it's total bullshit. Maybe we just can't comprehend it, but what people will usually say about fourth dimensional shapes is totally wrong. A cube is different from a square because it has a 3rd dimension, it's height (or z coordinate) isn't zero. What people will call a hypercube is just a couple cubes thrown together. A couple cubes put together just makes up a bigger shape, it doesn't add another dimension. What I think some people (who are overly self-righteous) don't understand, is that 6 squares don't make a cube, 6 squares makes 6 squares. 1 square with a height value not equal to one makes a cube. So, 8 cubes won't make a hypercube. You have to add another value, another way of measuring it, I think it's called the omega coordinate. But that is what we can't comprehend. A fourth dimensional hyperbeing would be able to see everything of a 3 dimensional object if it is in hyperspace, just as we are able to see everything of a two dimensional object from our 3-dimensional space. But, if we go into 2-d land, all we can see is a line that makes up the figure.
USS Exeter 12-14-07, 10:15 PM So basically the forth dimension is not simply x+x or y+y, the forth dimension seems to take on a Yz^x * x^z kind of complexity. As far as what the human mind is able to comprehend, there are only 3 physical dimensions. X,Y, and Z. What you are creating is an illusion, something that cannot geometrically or even physically exist.
By the way, I was told that the forth dimension was time. Have you ever heard this?
Pandaemoni 12-14-07, 11:29 PM Is it called the Cube? Although I did that paper on the fourth dimension, I think it's total bullshit. Maybe we just can't comprehend it, but what people will usually say about fourth dimensional shapes is totally wrong. A cube is different from a square because it has a 3rd dimension, it's height (or z coordinate) isn't zero. What people will call a hypercube is just a couple cubes thrown together. A couple cubes put together just makes up a bigger shape, it doesn't add another dimension. What I think some people (who are overly self-righteous) don't understand, is that 6 squares don't make a cube, 6 squares makes 6 squares. 1 square with a height value not equal to one makes a cube. So, 8 cubes won't make a hypercube. You have to add another value, another way of measuring it, I think it's called the omega coordinate. But that is what we can't comprehend. A fourth dimensional hyperbeing would be able to see everything of a 3 dimensional object if it is in hyperspace, just as we are able to see everything of a two dimensional object from our 3-dimensional space. But, if we go into 2-d land, all we can see is a line that makes up the figure.
The image that people show of a tesseract (the cube within a cube or the unfolded series of 8 cubes) are intended to be projections of an actual tesseract, not an actual tesseract itself.
Much like you can look at a 2-D drawing of a cube and imagine some salient features of an actual cube, the belief is that looking at a 3-D (or 2-D) representation of a tesseract can give you some insight into its structure, even though we can't imagine it physically existing.
As for its use, I am not sure that there is any practical use other than to serve as a relatively simple gateway shape to help get one's head around even more complicated multidimensional shapes. (That said, it's entirely possible someone has found a practical application for tesseracts, but if so I've never heard it).
Other multidimensional shapes do have interesting applications. The one that comes most readily to mind is that spacetime (which is also 4-dimensional) may may have a positively curved and, if so, might be likened to a giant 4-dimensional analog of a spheroid.
Read-Only 12-15-07, 01:06 AM So basically the forth dimension is not simply x+x or y+y, the forth dimension seems to take on a Yz^x * x^z kind of complexity. As far as what the human mind is able to comprehend, there are only 3 physical dimensions. X,Y, and Z. What you are creating is an illusion, something that cannot geometrically or even physically exist.
By the way, I was told that the forth dimension was time. Have you ever heard this?
Sure. And to be more specific, it's called space time.
Here's a simple little example to help you grasp the concept. In order to fully describe the location of something, you need to give the usual x,y and z cordinates AND when. Saying that Bill was in a building at the corner of Fourth and Main and on the 5th floor satisifies the first three. But you also need to say, for example, yesterday or last Tuesday to satisfy the last one.
Also consider trying to tell the location of a moving object. The ONLY way to do that is to also include the time when it was at, or will be, at a given location. It's impossible otherwise.
Fraggle Rocker 12-15-07, 08:17 AM The image that people show of a tesseract (the cube within a cube or the unfolded series of 8 cubes) are intended to be projections of an actual tesseract, not an actual tesseract itself.If the actors are moving around inside the boundaries of the eight cubes, they are not actually "inside" the tesseract. It is like ants crawling around on the six squares that make up a cubical box. They are only occupying its surface, they are not "inside" the box.
By working in teams, observing themselves walking around the right-angle corners, taking careful measurements, and noting when and from which direction they return to their starting points, the ants might be able to figure out that they are walking on the surface of a cube, but they are never inside it.
This is analogous to our ancestors taking careful measurements and calculating that they were on the surface of a sphere, and ultimately devising means for traveling the entire circumference and proving that it really is a sphere. Ignoring our trivial penetrations of a few thousand feet into a sphere 8,000 miles in diameter, humans have never actually been inside the sphere--which is just a tiny bit too hot for us anyway. We occupy the surface only.
USS Exeter 12-15-07, 12:04 PM Sure. And to be more specific, it's called space time.
Here's a simple little example to help you grasp the concept. In order to fully describe the location of something, you need to give the usual x,y and z cordinates AND when. Saying that Bill was in a building at the corner of Fourth and Main and on the 5th floor satisifies the first three. But you also need to say, for example, yesterday or last Tuesday to satisfy the last one.
Also consider trying to tell the location of a moving object. The ONLY way to do that is to also include the time when it was at, or will be, at a given location. It's impossible otherwise.
What I was saying is that there are 3 physical dimensions that you can see and feel. The forth dimension, space time, is what gives everything when and where. (Fabio4all was stating that the forth dimension did not exist and I was simply quoting him)
Read-Only 12-15-07, 12:14 PM What I was saying is that there are 3 physical dimensions that you can see and feel. The forth dimension, space time, is what gives everything when and where. (Fabio4all was stating that the forth dimension did not exist and I was simply quoting him)
Oh, really??? I just went back and looked at his post again and nowhere did I see where he said it didn't exist. Or are you bringing that in from some other thread?
USS Exeter 12-15-07, 12:16 PM I did some research on this tesseract you were talking about. The hypercube is what is known as a polychoron, which is described as being a four-dimensional polytope (3-d figure), thus meaning it is affected by time. The tesseract, has eight cubic cells, three around each edge. Each face in a tesseract must join exactly two cells.
What faboi4all was stating earlier, his omega coordinate actually does exist in geometry, it ususally referred to as being the "n" coordinate. Plotted into equations to turn squares into cubes, possibly cubes into tesseracts.
http://nodebox.net/code/data/shared/2007-05-31-00-23-43_tesseract.png
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