Referring to http://www.clinical-depression.co.uk/Understanding_Depression/understanding.htm

At first glance this article, or rather series, offers unique insight into the nature of this finely debated and heated topic. Many arguments have come to be given regarding if depression truly exists or is a fantasy in the minds of those suffering from it. The better question may well be "is depression" a real phenomena or is it created only by our surroundings?

I myself find I do sleep much longer than most people, and when I wasn't taking Zoloft I'd sleep almost always in free time, only waking when work was needed. This would seemingly support the assertion that those suffering with depression dream more than those who are well. I can't ever recall feeling rested or relaxed when I would wake up from sleep, this seems to suggest R.E.M. is not occuring just as the article states.

It begins speaking of ruminations being the beginning of this cycle, and how they carry over into arousal which is never fully released. The idea emotional excitement is a cause of depression later is very different than anything we've seen before. Here it's suggested if you don't have a release mechanism for the underlying feelings they'll come back to interrupt your sleeping, then make you depressed.

Also stated is that depressive-thinking styles will bring upon more negative emotions, thereby increasing the amount of sleep you do. I myself find this to be accurate, the more depressed I am the longer I'll sleep, or the more I feel I must... even if it doesn't help.

When looking at the Cycle Of Depression chart we see a truth that's very difficult to ignore, forever linked are depressive thinking & anxiety which cause emotional aggitation / anger which has noplace to be expressed except in dreams. This will however effect your system for quit abit longer than just the moment it happens, this throws your entire system into chaos later-on.

At this point I still have impaired functioning, I can barely handle this job let alone a higher position (even though I may take one). The question is whether or not depression can ever be cured, and these cycles stopped.

I find Zoloft helps, but the information presented here seems to explain why. So now all I must ask is whether I can impliment something which will effectively rid me of the depression I might still have, and maybe free me to meet friends, socialize, and work more efficently without weirding people out.

If you are born like a slave than depression can not be cured, otherwise there is a chance.

Make a list of all the positive things that have happened in your life.
This will not be easy to do well and you may need a therapist to help.
Write each item out in as much detail as you can.
By focussing of the positive that is already there, you help defeat the voice inside that is telling you everything is hopeless, no good, negative and will always be that way. Not true !!

Next make a list of things you do now or could be doing now that you enjoy.
Try to think of ways to add to this list and have the courage to do them .... like a walk twice a week in that beautiful park nearby; or a conversation with that sweet secretary who is so much fun to be around.

Go see the movie Mask with Cher about a boy with a terrible disease.
Learn to "Make yourself well".

I was fortunate to have wonderful parents and a happy childhood. But I still got depressed now and then. i discovered the rule that if I got myself out of the house I invariably felt much better and forgot my troubles quickly.

It is a battle between the optimist and pessimist inside you.
When and if you decide to help the optimist stay well ahead, you will begin to get better.

ITS ALL IN YOUR HEAD.

THEY WANT YOU SMALL... FEEBLE... WORKING FOR THEM.

THEY DONT WANT FREE MINDS.... FREE MEN.......


THEY WANT GOOD SERVENTS....


JOIN A UNION.

-mt

Referring to http://www.clinical-depression.co.uk/Understanding_Depression/understanding.htm
So now all I must ask is whether I can impliment something which will effectively rid me of the depression I might still have, and maybe free me to meet friends, socialize, and work more efficently without weirding people out.

Hardcore depression could be due to lack of Serotonin and other neurotransmitter as a result of chemical imbalance which could be caused by brain trauma and genetic defect.

Mild to moderate depression is caused by underlying life style and security issues (Maslow's heirarchy of needs). This can be managed initially through medication and then resolving those issues that aggravate the symptoms. Sometimes meditation can help with proper nutrition regimen that includes foods high in DHA, Omega-3, Choline etc.

The reason guided meditation can help is that the brain could unnecessarily put high weight to certain data (in a neural net framework) which results in the depletion of the neurotransmitters. By consciously readjusting neural gains for specific stimuli - one can balance the brain computations. That is why sometimes going to a shrink helps...but not always.

SOMETIMES.... ALOT ACTUALLY... i get depressed..

so... i take drugs,.... Ginsing... and ginko biloba... works great.

before i started useing the drugs...


i used to make myself think happy thoughts... id try to imagine how i felt when i was happy.... in a good mood...

i remmeber it... and i focus on feeling that way.

i sing little songs... and do a little dance..

after about 10 minutes.... my brain has forgotten it was depressed and switched over to happy mode... and i dont have to try anymore.


if you get sad..... feel sad... and accept it... your brain chemistry will adjust to fit your mental state.... you get more depressed... and it can become permanent.


so... i have found... in my own testing... that if i make myself feel happy... and act happy....

my brain... changes its chemistry to fit my belief.

i.e... i believe i am happy... and after 10 minutes. my brain adjusts... and it switches to happy mode.


try it..

sing a song.. do a dance... act as if you are so happy.... for 10 minutes..

try... and change your mental chemistry.

it works for me.


and if that fails... try ginsing.

-MT

Read a book by Jean Carper "Your Miracle Brain"...that may give you some ideas in the nutrition department....like taking Omega-3, eating fish, cooking with peanut and olive oil etc....

omega 3.. is great.... BUT NOT FOR DEPRESSION...

i know... i take 30 grams of omega 3 concentrate everyday.
thats 30 large pills.

i still feel depressed sometimes... and only ginsing and ginko seem to actually fight it off... for me anyway..

but then again... so does meth-amphedemine... or coffee.. so.

-MT

How about Chocolate and St. Johns Wort?

ive never tried.... & chocolate does nothing..
i try to limit my experimentation... i read the bottles...ginsing... works by adding ginsiniods to brain chemistry... thus increases nueral transmitter activity....

i find that large does clears the minds, and works like octane booster, bring up my mental performance by some small percentage... but just enough to keep my mind ingaged... and interested.

without the side effects of other drugs.

ginsing kicks ass.... AND I WOULD RECOMMEND IT FOR ANYONE WHO FEELS DEPRESSED... OR EVEN JUST OLD.


-MT

I'll be sad if they ban me :(

dude... seriously.... if your feeling weak and small and pathetic.

try some ginsing, and 12 mg of dhea a day...

and then dare to say you are feeling old tired, and incapable.


the dhea, becomes testosterone in your body... which boost adrenal gland output, and makes one feel..... strong.. confident... able.

its amazing stuff....

Dont allow depression to destroy yourlife... you must dedicate yourself to fighting... and using all at your disposal... like drugs.


but, as ive noted... dhea... is naturally occuring... and has been tested for over 70 years......... and is avalible over the counter.. anywhere.
and ginsing... has been used for 2000 years.

IF YOUR NOT WILLING TO TRY IT..... THEN SUFFER.

you must try everything... until you win.... and can keep winning.

-MT

The Virginia Tech Gunman was on antidepressants...

yes... most anti-depressants... are not as effective as coffee for getting a human into a good mood.

i myself... have suffered from depression... for most of my life...

and i have learned this much... Depressed people.. dont need depressants, or things that reduce mental activity...

they need STIMULANTS... I DO ANYWAY.... coffee work good..

ginsing is better...

vitamin b's... are fantastic.

ginko biloba.. kicks ass to fight fatigue.

DHEA.. can take 20 years off your life...

Anything with a potential side effect like suicide.. (anti-depressants.) should be avioded at all times....

-MT

(MOST OLDER HUMANS... dont want to work.. or even try... thats why america is addicted to coffee....!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Has anyone tried Omega-3....the brain supposed to need it the most?

i know... i take 30 grams of omega 3 concentrate everyday.
thats 30 large pills.

I take fish oil every day, along with a multivitamin/multimineral. But 30 grams?! Damn, isn't that toxic?

30 GRAMS?? 30 x 1,000mg capsules? Isnt there a danger of mercury poisoning? Unless its not fish oil....

How is the bowel? :D How is your mental and emotional well being between using and not using?

Back on topic I read this interesting article on existential depression in gifted individuals:

t has been my experience that gifted and talented persons are more likely to experience a type of depression referred to as existential depression. Although an episode of existential depression may be precipitated in anyone by a major loss or the threat of a loss which highlights the transient nature of life, persons of higher intellectual ability are more prone to experience existential depression spontaneously. Sometimes this existential depression is tied into the positive disintegration experience referred to by Dabrowski (1996).

Existential depression is a depression that arises when an individual confronts certain basic issues of existence. Yalom (1980) describes four such issues (or "ultimate concerns")--death, freedom, isolation and meaninglessness. Death is an inevitable occurrence. Freedom, in an existential sense, refers to the absence of external structure. That is, humans do not enter a world which is inherently structured. We must give the world a structure which we ourselves create. Isolation recognizes that no matter how close we become to another person, a gap always remains, and we are nonetheless alone. Meaninglessness stems from the first three. If we must die, if we construct our own world, and if each of us is ultimately alone, then what meaning does life have?

Because gifted children are able to consider the possibilities of how things might be, they tend to be idealists. However, they are simultaneously able to see that the world is falling short of how it might be. Because they are intense, gifted children feel keenly the disappointment and frustration which occurs when ideals are not reached. Similarly, these youngsters quickly spot the inconsistencies, arbitrariness and absurdities in society and in the behaviors of those around them. Traditions are questioned or challenged. For example, why do we put such tight sex-role or age-role restrictions on people? Why do people engage in hypocritical behaviors in which they say one thing and then do another? Why do people say things they really do not mean at all? Why are so many people so unthinking and uncaring in their dealings with others? How much difference in the world can one person's life make?

When gifted children try to share these concerns with others, they are usually met with reactions ranging from puzzlement to hostility. They discover that others, particularly of their age, clearly do not share these concerns, but instead are focused on more concrete issues and on fitting in with others' expectations. Often by even first grade, these youngsters, particularly the more highly gifted ones, feel isolated from their peers and perhaps from their families as they find that others are not prepared to discuss such weighty concerns.


Anyone have these experiences?

I do. I have very high highs and very low lows and am taking meds to keep me from going up or down to far. I'm very glad these drugs i'm taking are available and wouldn't be here if it weren't for them. I stopped once for just a day and found myself in a really bad way but got back on the meds ASAP.Just don't stop taking the meds or else there's going to be problems that you can't handle without some type of help. People who stop taking their meds can go really off the wall and could kill.

Back on topic I read this interesting article on existential depression in gifted individuals:
Anyone have these experiences?

My whole family does. The lowest IQ (based on school tests) in the family is 160. So this may have something to do with.

My whole family does. The lowest IQ (based on school tests) in the family is 160. So this may have something to do with.

Where the good begins.-- Where the poor power of the eye can no longer see the evil impulse as such because it has become too subtle, man posits the realm of goodness; and the feeling that we have now entered the realm of goodness excites all those impulses which had been threatened and limited by the evil impulses, like the feeling of security, of comfort, of benevolence. Hence, the duller the eye, the more extensive the good. Hence the eternal cheerfulness of the common people and of children. Hence the gloominess and grief - akin to a bad conscience - of the great thinkers.

from Nietzsche's The Gay Science, s. 53, Walter Kaufmann transl.

I don't feel so good. I am sad, I got no friends, do you know why? I wonder what'll happen to me in the future... I got Asperger's Syndrome, or a slight case of that... unfortunately for me I got the worst aspects, I go no real education, no future, no social group... god I want Zoloft and somethin to make me normal :p

beat something up, it does wonders.

peace.

I don't feel so good. I am sad, I got no friends, do you know why? I wonder what'll happen to me in the future... I got Asperger's Syndrome, or a slight case of that... unfortunately for me I got the worst aspects, I go no real education, no future, no social group... god I want Zoloft and somethin to make me normal :p
Zoloft, huh? Can't you get a prescription?

I was on Zoloft, I got kinda tied up at work here and before I knew it I'd discontinued using it. Honestly I can't tell much difference, except now when I'm awake I realize I want more out of life, like sex. The Zoloft was good for 1 thing though, it kept me from worrying to much about getting some, I would go back to my psychiatrist but he's retired now and someone else took his place, lol That's around the time I was outted cuz work was getting busy. You see I sit on my ass all day, it's easy, but there's nobody else left to do the same thing, thus I am stuck here and basically control the entire center operations. It seems cool but really it's lonely, gives me time to hear females laughing together, and I wonder if they're doing more... lol

God... I'm not so much depressed as just kinda isolated, and isolation is not cool, even the forum here is boring now when once I found it fun.

For me the following helped:
cognitive-behavioral therapy
good nutrition
talking with friends and family (a lot)
exercise
reading

You know, the forum is the same, it is your emotions that are differrent. Experiment with different things to find out what makes you happier. I promise you you will find something. Best of luck

Most people can not grasp the simple concept that "depression" and "sadness" are not the same thing.
Being sad is not being depressed.
When you are depressed, you don't feel sad - you don't feel anything.

Sad people should NOT be on anti-depressants - this is why they don't work for them - this is why they are unhealthy for them - this is why they commit suicide on them.
Sad people don't need drugs - it is a situational or mental problem that should be dealt with, and being on shit like Prozac, makes it worse.

Most people can not grasp the simple concept that "depression" and "sadness" are not the same thing.
Being sad is not being depressed.
When you are depressed, you don't feel sad - you don't feel anything.

Sad people should NOT be on anti-depressants - this is why they don't work for them - this is why they are unhealthy for them - this is why they commit suicide on them.
Sad people don't need drugs - it is a situational or mental problem that should be dealt with, and being on shit like Prozac, makes it worse.

this is my exact problem at the moment.
i have been ill for about 11 months now,it kinda started out of the blue.i just have a fuzzy head all the time.ive been going to a shit load of doctors and a few of them mentioned depression but because i didnt actually feel sad and because they didnt press it,i ignored them.
recently i went to see a doctor who explained it fully to me,that there is a chemical imbalance and i cant either take drugs to solve it or commit to a regular exercise regime (i stopped going to the gym after i got ill because it made me feel like i was going to die)
after a particularly bad week i picked up the meds but after looking at the side affects,decided not to take them.

this is my exact problem at the moment.
i have been ill for about 11 months now,it kinda started out of the blue.i just have a fuzzy head all the time.ive been going to a shit load of doctors and a few of them mentioned depression but because i didnt actually feel sad and because they didnt press it,i ignored them.
recently i went to see a doctor who explained it fully to me,that there is a chemical imbalance and i cant either take drugs to solve it or commit to a regular exercise regime (i stopped going to the gym after i got ill because it made me feel like i was going to die)
after a particularly bad week i picked up the meds but after looking at the side affects,decided not to take them.


What kind of chemical imbalance disorder did doc say you had?

About a year ago I started having real trouble focusing at work. I was fidgety and very irritable. My doc diagnosed me with ADHD (which is also a chemical imbalance). The shitty thing about ADHD is not only do you have to deal with the ADHD symptoms, if it goes untreated for long enough, it can also cause anxiety and depression. Which it has, especially after this girl I'd been talking to for six months online brushed me off after our first date.
But anyway, after Strattera and Wellbutrin(which is an anti depressant)) failed, she put me on Daytrana (which has pretty much the same shit in it as ritalyn in a patch). It seems to work well.
I know how you feel about the meds and side effects. That's why Strattera didnt' work for me. I'd recommend going back to the doc and trying different meds until you find one that works for you. Different people can react quite differently to medications.

What kind of chemical imbalance disorder did doc say you had?

About a year ago I started having real trouble focusing at work. I was fidgety and very irritable. My doc diagnosed me with ADHD (which is also a chemical imbalance). The shitty thing about ADHD is not only do you have to deal with the ADHD symptoms, if it goes untreated for long enough, it can also cause anxiety and depression. Which it has, especially after this girl I'd been talking to for six months online brushed me off after our first date.
But anyway, after Strattera and Wellbutrin(which is an anti depressant)) failed, she put me on Daytrana (which has pretty much the same shit in it as ritalyn in a patch). It seems to work well.
I know how you feel about the meds and side effects. That's why Strattera didnt' work for me. I'd recommend going back to the doc and trying different meds until you find one that works for you. Different people can react quite differently to medications.

i honestly cant remember the name of the chemical.the on that controls brain function?
the drug he gave me was paxil,the literature i found on the internet about it was super scary.stuff like...permenant libido loss...
i am very fond of my mind and really dont want to risk it to medication.
one night when i was drunk i took one of the paxil (i know,really stupid).and i was fucked up,i was blubbing like a baby (i havent cried since i was 14-15) and for the next couple of days i had no libido and my mind was a fog.
i think i am going to try the exercise thing,the only problem with this is i recently fucked my ankle up quite badly playing basketball so i cant go running or anything...

I spent YEARS of going to doctors who kept telling me I was depressed and trying LOTS of meds for that.
They were ALL treating the symptoms, not the problem (which is what is wrong with most shrinks today).
I finally did a lot of research and diagnosed myself with ADHD.
I spoke with a doctor and he agreed (the ADHD effects caused my depression - among other mental/emotional reasons that I had to find myself through introspection and meditation).
Ritalin worked wonders for me, but I have since stopped - replacing it with a healthier diet, meditation, introspection, more exercise (though still not enough) and, most importantly, no smoking.
In my research I found a lot of evidence that smoking greatly exascerbates ADHD symptoms (not to mention making depression worse, because cigarettes drain you of emotions, partly by ramping up dopamine production in your brain).
I have been hyperactive and had difficulty concentrating since I was a child, but the cigarettes made the situation SO MUCH worse.

Do you smoke, mike? kenworth?

yeah i do.,
what are some of the symptoms of ADHD?
my symptoms started fairly suddenly.

Just google for ADHD or Adult ADHD.
There's TONS of information available.

Essentially it is an inability to focus on one thing and keep your focus there(or finding great difficulty in it).
Your mind jumps tracks easily - to the point of detriment.
You always have many things on your mind at once - you can't turn your mind off nor can you focus on any one thing.

I highly recommend you quit smoking.
Smoking a cigarette ramps up your brains production of Dopamine, which feels good and drains all "negative" emotions.
The Dopamine production drops off suddenly once you finish the cigarette, so you are left depressed.
That, on top of the fact that nicotine is a stimulant and the smoke robs your body of oxygen and makes you feel tired all combine in causing depression and hyperactvity of your mind.
The nicotine forcing your brain to manufacture Dopamine throws off your brains normal Dopamine production, so that also adds to the depression and leads to the nicotine addiction.
It's all a nasty downward spiral.

pretty much my only symptom at the moment is that i feel like ive just woken up at 5pm all the time.ie.fuzzy head,numbness,bad memory

yeah i do.,
what are some of the symptoms of ADHD?
my symptoms started fairly suddenly.

Actually once she diagnosed me, a lot of things that had happened in my life had become clear as to why I reacted the way I did in certain situations.

I give mom the credit for taking the initiative to catch my behavior when I -was younter, and take me to the doctor to get it treated. :rolleyes:


Anyway, from the CDC website:


Inattention

-Often does not give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes in schoolwork, work, or other activities.

-Often has trouble keeping attention on tasks or play activities.

-Often does not seem to listen when spoken to directly.

-Often does not follow instructions and fails to finish schoolwork, chores, or duties in the workplace (not due to oppositional behavior or failure to understand instructions).

-Often has trouble organizing activities.

-Often avoids, dislikes, or doesn't want to do things that take a lot of mental effort for a long period of time (such as schoolwork or homework).

-Often loses things needed for tasks and activities (e.g. toys, school assignments, pencils, books, or tools).

-Is often easily distracted.

-Is often forgetful in daily activities.

-Six or more of the following symptoms of hyperactivity-impulsivity have been present for at least 6 months to an extent that is disruptive and inappropriate for developmental level:

Hyperactivity

-Often fidgets with hands or feet or squirms in seat.

-Often gets up from seat when remaining in seat is expected.

-Often runs about or climbs when and where it is not appropriate (adolescents or adults may feel very restless).

-Often has trouble playing or enjoying leisure activities quietly.

-Is often "on the go" or often acts as if "driven by a motor".

-Often talks excessively.

Impulsivity

-Often blurts out answers before questions have been finished.

-Often has trouble waiting one's turn.

-Often interrupts or intrudes on others (e.g., butts into conversations or games).

-Some symptoms that cause impairment were present before age 7 years.

-Some impairment from the symptoms is present in two or more settings (e.g. at school/work and at home).

-There must be clear evidence of significant impairment in social, school, or work functioning.

The symptoms do not happen only during the course of a Pervasive Developmental Disorder, Schizophrenia, or other Psychotic Disorder. The symptoms are not better accounted for by another mental disorder (e.g. Mood Disorder, Anxiety Disorder, Dissociative Disorder, or a Personality Disorder).

Raven, do you take any meds?
As for stimulants, that is one of the most popular types of meds given to ADD/ADHD patients.
Believe it or not, aside from this stuff that I'm taking now, pot does a good job of slowing my mind down so I can relax a bit. The only downside to that is it also takes away my ambition and motivation to do anything other than sit on the couch and laugh at Comedy Central programs!

By the way, I have yet to have any doctor or scientist show me evidence that chemical imbalance in the brain necessarily causes depression, as opposed to depression causing a chemical imbalance in the brain.

Somebody mentioned Welbutrin in a previous post. Did it make your ears ring all the time? Some days my ears ring like I've been to a rock concert the night before, and it's not my allergy medicine.

I take it for smoking, but it's not really helping. There's something new out for quitting smoking that's supposedly the best thing ever marketed for that purpose, but the name escapes me at the moment.

Somebody mentioned Welbutrin in a previous post. Did it make your ears ring all the time? Some days my ears ring like I've been to a rock concert the night before, and it's not my allergy medicine.

I take it for smoking, but it's not really helping. There's something new out for quitting smoking that's supposedly the best thing ever marketed for that purpose, but the name escapes me at the moment.


That was me. And it actually didn't do a damn thing for me, no effects or side effects. My supervisor Mark has anxiety and takes Cymbalta but he was on Wellbutrin first. He said it made him constantly pissed off.

Raven, do you take any meds?
Not anymore.
The normal dosage for Ritalin in adults with ADHD is about 20mg a day.
At one point I was on 130mg a day!
I don't need it anymore.

Believe it or not, aside from this stuff that I'm taking now, pot does a good job of slowing my mind down so I can relax a bit. The only downside to that is it also takes away my ambition and motivation to do anything other than sit on the couch and laugh at Comedy Central programs!
I completely relate to that!! :D

That was me. And it actually didn't do a damn thing for me, no effects or side effects. My supervisor Mark has anxiety and takes Cymbalta but he was on Wellbutrin first. He said it made him constantly pissed off.

One of my doctors put me on Welbutrin before anyone knew that it helped with smoking.
I was down to 3 - 4 cigarettes a day, and I wasn't even trying to quit.
This was one of the things that helped me determine that smoking was my biggest problem.
The Welburtin seemed to work pretty well, but then when I started smoking more again, while still on it, it wasn't helping anymore.

mike,
Do you smoke cigarettes?

Not anymore.
The normal dosage for Ritalin in adults with ADHD is about 20mg a day.
At one point I was on 130mg a day!
I don't need it anymore.


I wish I didn't need it. I hate my brain being on fast forward all the time. I can't stay focused on what I need to and when I do, I always tend to dwell on the bad shit that has happened.
Daytrana seems to be working. Although doc said if this doesn't, Concerta is next, then Ritalyn. I don't know why because the methylphelidine or whatever the hell is in the Daytrana patches is the same shit that is in Concerta and Ritalyn.
She also mentioned Adderall but also said that it's very potent and that would be a last resort for stimulants.

Your ADHD is obvious...

mike,
Do you smoke cigarettes?

Your ADHD is obvious...

Oops. Sorry. No I don't. Never have. Just pot.
It's not that it's obvious, it's just that I have six IE windows open along with other work related software. If you're multi tasking, you're bound to miss some things sometimes! :)

Do you have a therapist as well, or just a Psychiatrist?

Do you have a therapist as well, or just a Psychiatrist?

Neither. Just a normal medical doctor. I would hope that if I was that bad in need of therapy, that she would pass me off to a therapist or such. I'll trust her judgement though. I honestly feel that talking to someone about this would just be wasting my time. Plus, I'm not too keen on paying someone to listen to me.
I'm not crazy, I just get really really bored. As long as I keep busy with something, I'm fine.

Neither. Just a normal medical doctor.

The problem with that is that regular medical doctors simply don't know enough about this to properly diagnose and treat this.
They don't specialize in it.
Just as cardiologists specialize in hearts.
If you had a heart problem, you would (hopefully) see a heart specialist who knows more about this, is on top of the latest advances and follows the latest case studies.

ADHD is a symptom, if you continue to simply treat the symptoms, you can never address the cause.

GP's shouldn't even be allowed to prescribe anti-depressants and other psychiatric meds.
The VAST majority of deaths and other complications from psychiatric meds were related to meds prescribed by GP's.

The problem with that is that regular medical doctors simply don't know enough about this to properly diagnose and treat this.
They don't specialize in it.
Just as cardiologists specialize in hearts.
If you had a heart problem, you would (hopefully) see a heart specialist who knows more about this, is on top of the latest advances and follows the latest case studies.

ADHD is a symptom, if you continue to simply treat the symptoms, you can never address the cause.


Uhhh, isn't the cause of ADHD a chemical imbalance? I remember being fidgety and impulsive ever since I was a kid. I just thought all kids acted like that.
If you had ADHD, then you know that ADHD patients will adamantly devote themselves to something that they find fun/stimulating, but will put off and procrastinate with stuff they find boring or disinteresting. Most of the external stimuli in my life is boring and uninteresting and not near enough fun and interesting stuff. I don't know about you but when I get bored and can't find or am unable to participate in stimulating activities, I tend to get a bit irritable. I mean, who enjoys being bored? Nobody, but it's exponentially worse for ADD/ADHD because we lose interest in something so fast or can't focus on one thing to keep us busy.

Uhhh, isn't the cause of ADHD a chemical imbalance?
I don't necessarily think it does, no.
I think ADHD causes a chemical imbalance in the brain.

Regardless, that's exactly what Psychiatrists specialize in - brain chemistry and biology.
Do you understand the difference between a Psychologist and a Phsychiatrist?
If you are talking about chemical imbalance, who better than someone who specializes in chemical imbalances?
GP's don't know nearly as much about brain chemistry as Psychiatrists.

Is it the stigma that gets to you?

Most of the external stimuli in my life is boring and uninteresting and not near enough fun and interesting stuff. I don't know about you but when I get bored and can't find or am unable to participate in stimulating activities, I tend to get a bit irritable. I mean, who enjoys being bored? Nobody, but it's exponentially worse for ADD/ADHD because we lose interest in something so fast or can't focus on one thing to keep us busy.
I know this all too well - believe me - and I got past it.
So can you - if you decide to.

Conclusions from my own experience (anxiety driven depression):

My cardiologist (many years ago) did not have a clue about depression-he told me everything is fine go to work tommorow morning!

A psychologist is not a doctor. Maybe they can help (I haven't gone to one) but I definitely trust psychiatrists more.

Medicine can treat the symptoms but it is not enough IMO. Cognitive-behavioral therapy helped me a lot. I should note that all my life I could talk to others about anything except the things that really mattered to me.

Smoking and esp. pot is really bad for depression

Good nutrition is important

Don't waste time not going to a psychiatrist because of unquestioned beliefs- I did.

I agree with all that, but to be fair...

A psychologist is not a doctor.

...some are.

You are right, I should have been more precise. :)
What I meant was that in Greece, where I live, to be a psychiatrist you go to med school, whereas to be a psychologist you study in a university but you are not a doctor, at best you do some biology. Now if you mean they can have both degrees, well of course (and that would be so much better for the patients).
I want to clarify I am not undermining psychology in any way(nor do I admire doctors), it is a fascinating subject and science and proved very helpful for me. Want I meant to say was that for a situation where medication is involved, a doctor is more suitable (but not any kind of doctor)

Right.
I understand.

What I meant was that you could, and some do, earn a PhD in Psychology (though that doesn't make them an MD PhD).

Uhhh, isn't the cause of ADHD a chemical imbalance? I remember being fidgety and impulsive ever since I was a kid. I just thought all kids acted like that.
If you had ADHD, then you know that ADHD patients will adamantly devote themselves to something that they find fun/stimulating, but will put off and procrastinate with stuff they find boring or disinteresting. Most of the external stimuli in my life is boring and uninteresting and not near enough fun and interesting stuff. I don't know about you but when I get bored and can't find or am unable to participate in stimulating activities, I tend to get a bit irritable. I mean, who enjoys being bored? Nobody, but it's exponentially worse for ADD/ADHD because we lose interest in something so fast or can't focus on one thing to keep us busy.


yes ADHD/ADD/ADH are chemical imbalnces of the brain, it is a very hard illness to deal with, and many people have great ideas about how to combat it, but most people do not know what they are talking about, i have 2 children with sever ADHD and they can be exceedingly active and hard to deal with, and my one son has also got to take PROZAC for his bi polar disorder, and however hard we think it is on the perants of children ,like mine it is worse for the children themselfs.

unfortunalty depression has been in my family and my husbands family for many years, i was prescribed PROZAC and took it for about 2 years now i am happy to say that i am over it all and am happier and able to cope with whatever life throws at me.

my husbands mum, had very severe depression and died unhappy!

http://www.alwaysinallwayswellness.com/scinfo.htm
i don't know if anyone has mentioned this one but it really works
so does aroma therapy

I am sad, I wish I could go somewhere to rest.

I am sad, I wish I could go somewhere to rest.

So go somewhere and rest.
Nothing is stopping you but you.

To understand depression, you have to understand the chemical synthesis going on in your body. For one thing, drink plenty of water, drink it like a fish, even after food. Sodas with sugar will cause false euphoria. Remember, a high always follows a low, especially a false high. Thats my own little thought.

I don't necessarily think it does, no.
I think ADHD causes a chemical imbalance in the brain.

Regardless, that's exactly what Psychiatrists specialize in - brain chemistry and biology.
Do you understand the difference between a Psychologist and a Phsychiatrist?
If you are talking about chemical imbalance, who better than someone who specializes in chemical imbalances?
GP's don't know nearly as much about brain chemistry as Psychiatrists.

Is it the stigma that gets to you?


I know this all too well - believe me - and I got past it.
So can you - if you decide to.


are you saying that you had ADHD and you got "through" it, because i would honestly like to know how, because i dont think it's has easy has some people may think to combat ADHD/ADD.

has i have said a few times my kids have ADHD (severe) and the stigma doesnt actually get to them and when people look at us in the street because they have done or said somthing i just smile and think to myself your just jealous because you havent got gorgeous kids like mine, either that or i shout at them. :o

I don't know where the word "depression" came from, it just cropped up overnight. It started in the 90's by the drug driven media industry, it was a replacement for "sad". They noticed "sad" was too regular a word so they invented "depression". Now, stupid people everywhere are running to the doctors to treat their depression. Tell me, if you are happy forever, does that do anybody any good? Yes, we feel pain, thats part of the life. Pain is a result of our ultra sensitive nervous system, which tells us when something is going on, like when your 2 year old little brother stabs you on the feet with a sharp pencil. Without this mechanism, we wouldn't be able to feel, which would be a lot worse than...(chuckes)...being sad. Ever seen the movie "equilibrium"? My advice? Shit happens!

I don't know where the word "depression" came from, it just cropped up overnight. It started in the 90's by the drug driven media industry, it was a replacement for "sad". They noticed "sad" was too regular a word so they invented "depression". Now, stupid people everywhere are running to the doctors to treat their depression. Tell me, if you are happy forever, does that do anybody any good? Yes, we feel pain, thats part of the life. Pain is a result of our ultra sensitive nervous system, which tells us when something is going on, like when your 2 year old little brother stabs you on the feet with a sharp pencil. Without this mechanism, we wouldn't be able to feel, which would be a lot worse than...(chuckes)...being sad. Ever seen the movie "equilibrium"? My advice? Shit happens!


but hey lucky for us, we dont live in the world of that film!! and depressed people are not stupid, far from it in fact!! my husband isnt stupid!! and neither is my son!!! and i have been so DEPRESSED that i cant feal anything. i ahvent been able to cry and i ahvent been able to manage with daily routines, but after taking medication i am now ok

but hey lucky for us, we dont live in the world of that film!! and depressed people are not stupid, far from it in fact!! my husband isnt stupid!! and neither is my son!!! and i have been so DEPRESSED that i cant feal anything. i ahvent been able to cry and i ahvent been able to manage with daily routines, but after taking medication i am now ok

My advice? I read your bio and it says you like tattoos. I hope you don't have any because it can cause...and I cant believe I am saying this...depression. Erase your tattoo, having a permanent mark on your skin is not healthy. I don't know what esle to tell you, if medication works, then go ahead but try not to abuse it.

My advice? I read your bio and it says you like tattoos. I hope you don't have any because it can cause...and I cant believe I am saying this...depression. Erase your tattoo, having a permanent mark on your skin is not healthy. I don't know what esle to tell you, if medication works, then go ahead but try not to abuse it.

yes i have 6 tattoos!! and i dont regret any one of them, no i dont abuse the medication and i only ever take it when my Dr says perhaps its for the best.

At first glance this article, or rather series, offers unique insight into the nature of this finely debated and heated topic. Many arguments have come to be given regarding if depression truly exists or is a fantasy in the minds of those suffering from it. The better question may well be "is depression" a real phenomena or is it created only by our surroundings?
I believe it is mostly biochemical with some psychological influences.

On the biological side, a great book on the subject is 'The Way Up From Down' by Dr. Priscilla Slagle.

The whole book is available for download on her site:
http://www.thewayup.com/upfrmdwn.htm

This is another good summary:
http://www.thenutritionreporter.com/Sunshine_for_the_Mind.html

I finally understand depression, it's caused by other people!!!

depression is the same thing as sadness. if you want to be sad, just think about sad things, try to understand sad things like depression, and write about sad things on a sad thread like this.

but if you want to be happy, think happy thoughts and ignore bad thoughts. it's so simple. feelings are just thoughts we think for a long time. we can reprogram our feelings, beliefs, reality, everything, by changing our thoughts.

depression is the same thing as sadness. if you want to be sad, just think about sad things, try to understand sad things like depression, and write about sad things on a sad thread like this.

but if you want to be happy, think happy thoughts and ignore bad thoughts. it's so simple. feelings are just thoughts we think for a long time. we can reprogram our feelings, beliefs, reality, everything, by changing our thoughts.


that is so wrong!! sadness can come and go, depression (and people who suffer from it) cannot just think happy thoughts and be happy, they are not %100 sure why certain people get depression but the treat it well, it is thought of to be a chemical inbalance in the brain, and there is nothing the person can do about it.

depression is more prone in people who have had mothers who had depression and who have had a very bad upbringing

sadness can come and go,

wrong!! stronger forms of sadness like depression can't come and go.

they are not %100 sure why certain people get depression but the treat it well,

psychiatrists/therapists are stupid. they don't know that people are sad because something bad happened to them, and then they make people sick by creating new diseases/words like depression which is actually just a feeling.

it is thought of to be a chemical inbalance in the brain,

feelings are never caused by chemicals, chemicals are just the effects of thoughts and feelings.

and there is nothing the person can do about it.

keep thinking that you can't do anything and you can't do anything.

wrong!! stronger forms of sadness like depression can't come and go.



psychiatrists/.therapists are stupid they don't know that people are sad because something bad happened to them, and then they make people sick by creating new diseases/words like depression which is actually just a feeling.



feelings are never caused by chemicals, chemicals are just the effects of thoughts and feelings.



keep thinking that you can't do anything and you can't do anything.

they are not stupid people at all my sons see a psychiatrists on a regular basis, my son has bi polar disorder mixxed with otehr illness's and he has to take a high dose of Prazac just to keep the depression at bay for a day, i ask you if they are not caused by chemicals then why can prazoac and other forms of anti depression tablets help those people with the condition, it is a very VERY difficult condition to live with and you can even get a benefit for the condition if yu have it severely aswell.

my son has bi polar disorder

bipolar disorder is just another word for sadness.

i ask you if they are not caused by chemicals then why can prazoac and other forms of anti depression tablets help those people with the condition,

drugs like lsd, heroin, peyote and antidepressants can free people from their sadness only temporarily because the negative thoughts keep recreating the sadness.

drugs can have a negative effect on people if they take them for a long time, so it's better to fight the sadness with thoughts until you realize that you have no reason to be sad. you only imagined that you had a reason.

feelings like sadness and happiness are imaginary.

and who have had a very bad upbringing

Just like me :( I feel better at work than at home now, I would stay here all night if I could just to not go home, how sad is that my friendz :C

bipolar disorder is just another word for sadness.

You couldn't be more wrong.

bipolar disorder is just another word for sadness.



drugs like lsd, heroin, peyote and antidepressants can free people from their sadness only temporarily because the negative thoughts keep recreating the sadness.

drugs can have a negative effect on people if they take them for a long time, so it's better to fight the sadness with thoughts until you realize that you have no reason to be sad. you only imagined that you had a reason.

feelings like sadness and happiness are imaginary.


---------

What Causes Bipolar Disorder?
Scientists are learning about the possible causes of bipolar disorder through several kinds of studies. Most scientists now agree that there is no single cause for bipolar disorder—rather, many factors act together to produce the illness.

Because bipolar disorder tends to run in families, researchers have been searching for specific genes—the microscopic "building blocks" of DNA inside all cells that influence how the body and mind work and grow—passed down through generations that may increase a person's chance of developing the illness. But genes are not the whole story. Studies of identical twins, who share all the same genes, indicate that both genes and other factors play a role in bipolar disorder. If bipolar disorder were caused entirely by genes, then the identical twin of someone with the illness would always develop the illness, and research has shown that this is not the case. But if one twin has bipolar disorder, the other twin is more likely to develop the illness than is another sibling.6

In addition, findings from gene research suggest that bipolar disorder, like other mental illnesses, does not occur because of a single gene.7 It appears likely that many different genes act together, and in combination with other factors of the person or the person's environment, to cause bipolar disorder. Finding these genes, each of which contributes only a small amount toward the vulnerability to bipolar disorder, has been extremely difficult. But scientists expect that the advanced research tools now being used will lead to these discoveries and to new and better treatments for bipolar disorder.

Brain-imaging studies are helping scientists learn what goes wrong in the brain to produce bipolar disorder and other mental illnesses.8,9 New brain-imaging techniques allow researchers to take pictures of the living brain at work, to examine its structure and activity, without the need for surgery or other invasive procedures. These techniques include magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), positron emission tomography (PET), and functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI). There is evidence from imaging studies that the brains of people with bipolar disorder may differ from the brains of healthy individuals. As the differences are more clearly identified and defined through research, scientists will gain a better understanding of the underlying causes of the illness, and eventually may be able to predict which types of treatment will work most effectively.

--------------


Treatment of Bipolar Depression
Research has shown that people with bipolar disorder are at risk of switching into mania or hypomania, or of developing rapid cycling, during treatment with antidepressant medication.15 Therefore, "mood-stabilizing" medications generally are required, alone or in combination with antidepressants, to protect people with bipolar disorder from this switch. Lithium and valproate are the most commonly used mood-stabilizing drugs today. However, research studies continue to evaluate the potential mood-stabilizing effects of newer medications.

Atypical antipsychotic medications, including clozapine (Clozaril®), olanzapine (Zyprexa®), risperidone (Risperdal®), quetiapine (Seroquel®), and ziprasidone (Geodon®), are being studied as possible treatments for bipolar disorder. Evidence suggests clozapine may be helpful as a mood stabilizer for people who do not respond to lithium or anticonvulsants.16 Other research has supported the efficacy of olanzapine for acute mania, an indication that has recently received FDA approval.17 Olanzapine may also help relieve psychotic depression.18
If insomnia is a problem, a high-potency benzodiazepine medication such as clonazepam (Klonopin®) or lorazepam (Ativan®) may be helpful to promote better sleep. However, since these medications may be habit-forming, they are best prescribed on a short-term basis. Other types of sedative medications, such as zolpidem (Ambien®), are sometimes used instead.
Changes to the treatment plan may be needed at various times during the course of bipolar disorder to manage the illness most effectively. A psychiatrist should guide any changes in type or dose of medication.
Be sure to tell the psychiatrist about all other prescription drugs, over-the-counter medications, or natural supplements you may be taking. This is important because certain medications and supplements taken together may cause adverse reactions.
To reduce the chance of relapse or of developing a new episode, it is important to stick to the treatment plan. Talk to your doctor if you have any concerns about the medications.


--------------------------

no i dont think its just anouther form of sadness!

my son has bi polar disorder and he comes from loving and warm family,he is now mostly happy because of these medications that according to most people are a total waste of time, they are not a waste of time when the person taking them can now work well with school work, and do well in jobs, no one understands the condition until you have had it or got it, i had depression for years and still take medication for it now, and so does my husband, but my son did not get his bi polar from me or his father, depression and bi polar disorder are yes on the same spectrum but miles apart from each other.

Just like me :( I feel better at work than at home now, I would stay here all night if I could just to not go home, how sad is that my friendz :C

i felt like that for a long time and then i get my children sorted out properly by a decent doctor and now we are really happy, i am so happy at home now i cant belive that i felt so awful for such a long time

no i dont think its just anouther form of sadness!

2 bad

my son has bi polar disorder and he comes from loving and warm family,

family is not everything

no one understands the condition until you have had it or got it,

if i was you i would understand you perfectly, and if you were me you would understand me perfectly.

2 bad



family is not everything



if i was you i would understand you perfectly, and if you were me you would understand me perfectly.

you cannot denie somthing when there is loads of documented proof about the condition!!

and no i know family isnt everything but trust me it is a big part of someones life!!

have you ever even been diagnosed with depression or are you just spouting about things you know nothing at all about and have had no dealing with?

you cannot denie somthing when there is loads of documented proof about the condition!!

don't believe everything you read.

have you ever even been diagnosed with depression or are you just spouting about things you know nothing at all about and have had no dealing with?

when a psychologist diagnoses you with a disorder, they actually give you the disorder. but they can't make you sick unless you're brainwashed by them.

if a healthy person like me would go to a psychologists i would be diagnosed with all kinds of "disorders".

http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Attention_deficit_hyperactivity_disorder

don't believe everything you read.



when a psychologist diagnoses you with a disorder, they actually give you the disorder. but they can't make you sick unless you're brainwashed by them.

if a healthy person like me would go to a psychologists i would be diagnosed with all kinds of "disorders".

http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Attention_deficit_hyperactivity_disorder

[edit] ADD & Parents
Most parents these days are fucking retarded and don't know how to discipline their children. This is because the liberal media tells them that spanking is wrong and drug corporations tell them that the reason their kids are so fucked up is not because of bad parenting, but because of, you guessed it, a disorder called ADD. The parents then spend money on Ritalin and Aderol and feed it to their kids fucking them up even more. Here's an example:

i'm not fucking retarded, and i recent what that uneducated clot said about ADD, first thing being ADD mostely effects boys, has soon does ADHD!!

or are you goinf to say they done excist either? because if you are read this:

The person most likely to be diagnosed with ADD is a boy in grade school. If you are the parent of such a child, you would do well to consider whether your child’s behavior is actually within the normal range of behaviors for boys, especially if his problem is mostly at school.

------------------------------------

Does ADHD Exist?
But, hold on, here’s Gregory K. Fritz, MD, Bradley Hospital medical director and Hasbro Children’s Hospital child and family psychiatry director, making an equally emphatic statement to the contrary in his article ‘ADHD Is No Myth’.

“Myth: ADHD does not exist as a real psychiatric disorder; rather, it is an unfortunate labeling of normal childhood behavior promulgated by ineffectual parents, incompetent teachers and the pharmaceutical industry.

ADHD has received more scientific scrutiny than any other childhood psychiatric disorder since Charles Bradley’s initial 1937 report of effective treatment with stimulants of children at the Emma Pendleton Bradley Hospital in East Providence. ADHD has met the same standards as other major psychiatric disorders included in the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 4th Edition. Studies have shown that experts can reliably agree on the diagnosis of individual patients with ADHD and can do so consistently. Better genetic evidence exists for ADHD than most other psychiatric disorders.”

http://www.adhd-report.com/adhd/13_exist.html

-----------------------------------------------------------

ADHD and parenting

It's a common misconception that ADHD is caused by 'bad' parenting. People who don't know anything about ADHD can be quick to blame the parents. But many experts think the causes of ADHD are largely genetic.

Research shows it's far more likely that good parents trying to cope with the behaviour of a child with ADHD sometimes seem like 'bad' parents, because they can appear short-tempered, stressed, depressed and poor at disciplining their child.

----------------------

it is so wring of that uneducated idiot to blame the perants of ADHD/ADD children, my sons take Equasym, and Strattera every day and before those medications they could not concentrate on school work and they were always in trouble, my youngest couldnt even go out to play in the playgroud with the other kids, but now he can and it is all down to the medication and good teaching, if ADHD/ADD does not exsist then how can special schools exsist to help such children? are we just jumping on a fashion thing with our kids and giving them medications?

If you are the parent of such a child, you would do well to consider whether your child’s behavior is actually within the normal range of behaviors for boys, especially if his problem is mostly at school.

being different is not the same thing as being sick. it's absolutely normal to be abnormal.

before those medications they could not concentrate on school work and they were always in trouble,

of course because most things in school are boring, stupid, wrong and pointless. who could concentrate on something they don't even like?

being different is not the same thing as being sick. it's absolutely normal to be abnormal.



of course because most things in school are boring, stupid, wrong and pointless. who could concentrate on something they don't even like?

you didnt even answer the questions, and most things in school are not boring and stupid, since when is reading stupid? they use computers which both my boys love to do. they were not only very very active at school but also at home, when my youngest child was just 4yrs old he smashed a wide screen TV, he has smashed windows, he has attacked me with a knife, he will run out in the middle of the road, i have been banned from using buses with him because he keeps ringing the emergency bell, i had to have special transport for him to go to and fro school. all that was before the medication, and you didnt even answer the question do you think ADHD/ADD doesnt exsist? and why are you so quick along with the uneducated moron to blame the perants of these children?

unless you live with children that are ADHD/ADD then you ahve no idea what it is like, you cannot just punish them and smack them they do not respond to that

and you didnt even answer the question do you think ADHD/ADD doesnt exsist? and why are you so quick along with the uneducated moron to blame the perants of these children?

I have no choice but to do what I do because not only do I have the disorder... I AM the disorder called life. The universe is the disorder and death is the order/cure which does not exist (because it means nonexistence)

Nobody has a choice because the disorder (life) makes them do what they do.

I have no choice but to do what I do because not only do I have the disorder... I AM the disorder called life. The universe is the disorder and death is the order/cure which does not exist (because it means nonexistence)

Nobody has a choice because the disorder (life) makes them do what they do.

your a fool!! i dont normaly call people names but you have just pushed it, are you honestly telling me that the only cure for ADHD/ADD/Depression is death?

your a fool!! i dont normaly call people names but you have just pushed it, are you honestly telling me that the only cure for ADHD/ADD/Depression is death?

the only cure for life is death, but it doesn't exist.

-- immortal being

the only cure for life is death, but it doesn't exist.

-- immortal being

of course death exist's otherwise no one will die!!