I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

What definition of racism is being used?

Let's use:

racism 1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.

A prejudice against the uncommon experience?

A prejudice against the uncommon experience?

Sorry, I don't understand what you are asking.

Let's use:

racism 1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.

Well I guess we would have to define 'superior' as well, but regardless any evidence I've seen is inconclusive simply because there isn't a good way to make different races have identical cultural, nutritional, etc. influence.

Oh -- I thought you were using racism as an analogy. You know, to be prejudiced against the uncommon experience generally pigeonholed as stuff like "God", "telepathy", "ghosts", etc.

Well I guess we would have to define 'superior' as well, but regardless any evidence I've seen is inconclusive simply because there isn't a good way to make different races have identical cultural, nutritional, etc. influence.

The question isn't whether racism is valid, it is about whther or not it exists at all.

racism is an action...an energy exerted in a wrong way.

Is energy materialistic? no

racism is an action...an energy exerted in a wrong way.
Does racism exist?

Is energy materialistic? no

Wrong.

I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

Sounds like the dialog in Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, about not believing in ghosts or science.

I'll give it a shot - "racism" is a term denoting a human attitude, and an attitude can be measured and has a physical cause. So yes, racism exists.

Sounds like the dialog in Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, about not believing in ghosts or science.
I keep starting that book, and life keeps interrupting.
I intend on finishing it this year.

I'll give it a shot - "racism" is a term denoting a human attitude, and an attitude can be measured and has a physical cause. So yes, racism exists.
How can an attitude be measured and empirical evidence be objectively verified? Please explain this meter and scale to me. I'm sure politicians would love to be able to use it - you could be a billionaire.

Suggesting a physical cause for something which has no physical manifestation does not prove existence. I could very well claim that psychic energy has a "phsical cause" of firing neurons - yet that doesn't prove the existence of telepathy.

The question isn't whether racism is valid, it is about whther or not it exists at all.

I see, then if you're asking whether the belief exists then yes. There are people who believe that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

I see, then if you're asking whether the belief exists then yes. There are people who believe that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

Can you prove it exists with any evidence, other than anecdotal?

I keep starting that book, and life keeps interrupting.
I intend on finishing it this year

I borrowed it, got busy with other books, and eventually returned it without finishing it.

How can an attitude be measured and empirical evidence be objectively verified?

You could subjectively measure an attitude by polling people, or you could hook a self-proclaimed racist up to a blood pressure monitor and show him pictures of black people.

Goes to Crunchy Cat's post - does belief exist?
There's a thread around here asking whether emotion exists, or how it exists. I like the question.

Certainly belief has physical manifestations - I am typing, causing patterns of electrons to do some shit that I don't understand so that you and I can read what I am typing, and therefore you can infer the presence of my belief. But that doesn't prove that my belief exists in the same way that a bottle of beer exists.

I borrowed it, got busy with other books, and eventually returned it without finishing it.
I've loved what I have read so far.


You could subjectively measure an attitude by polling people, or you could hook a self-proclaimed racist up to a blood pressure monitor and show him pictures of black people.
But I am looking for objective measurments and proof.
His blood pressure could be rising due to sexual attraction - or any other number of reasons.

Goes to Crunchy Cat's post - does belief exist?
There's a thread around here asking whether emotion exists, or how it exists. I like the question.
I haven't read either.

Certainly belief has physical manifestations - I am typing, causing patterns of electrons to do some shit that I don't understand so that you and I can read what I am typing, and therefore you can infer the presence of my belief. But that doesn't prove that my belief exists in the same way that a bottle of beer exists.
Many will say that "beliefs" do not exist, as we are nothing but mechanical machines reacting to stimuli - free will, abstract thought, emotion and belief are all simply illusions.
My mother had a dream about a place that I once visited, and told me about it the next day in detail.
Does that prove the existnce of telepathy?
Certainly not in any skeptic's eyes.


To be honest, though, upon starting this thread, I was referring to racism more as a cultural phenomena, with influence on the masses, as opposed to a personally held belief.

But I am looking for objective measurments and proof.
His blood pressure could be rising due to sexual attraction - or any other number of reasons.

Then it would be a matter of refining down.

Many will say that "beliefs" do not exist, as we are nothing but mechanical machines reacting to stimuli - free will, abstract thought, emotion and belief are all simply illusions.

What is illusion, and what is a dream?

My mother had a dream about a place that I once visited, and told me about it the next day in detail.
Does that prove the existnce of telepathy?
Certainly not in any skeptic's eyes.

And it shouldn't - perhaps your mother was dreaming of a place that you had discussed visiting, perhaps your own hearing of her dream was influenced by your experience. I've been to places that seemed shockingly familiar, I've dreamed things and later experienced them, and there are rational explanations for all of it. Materialism, as I am a materialist, does not preclude what we think of as supernatural: we certainly do not understand everything about how matter works.
I'm rambling, though.

What is illusion, and what is a dream?
You're obfuscating - is that intentional?

And it shouldn't

I agree - I am just wondering how a Materialist choses what to believe and what not to believe with similar bodies of evidence.

What of racism as a cultural phenomena?
Are memes, such as racism, extant - regardless of individual beliefs?
Can they self-propagate?
Can they change/influence an individual's beliefs even if all other individuals stopped believing it - in other words, can they be seen as distinct, discrete entities?
Once you share an idea, you no longer own it, because it takes a life of its own in the minds, cultures and collective consciousness of us all - it becomes a meme - it becomes a Chinese whisper.
Do Chinese whispers have lives of their own?

Then it would be a matter of refining down.


Still it is nothing more than inference.

Can you prove it exists with any evidence, other than anecdotal?

What do you consider anecdotal? It's a human behavior to invest work into things cared about. There are people on this forum whom invest work to assert that black people are stupid / more violent. There are people in the USA whom invest effort in creating media about how white people are superior. Germans invested work in judging people according to arian charactistics.

The work becomes evidence that the belief exists.

Goes to Crunchy Cat's post - does belief exist?


What definition of 'belief' is being used?

Crunchy,
Before I respond to that, please take a look at post #18 above and respond to that.

What definition of 'belief' is being used?

To be honest, though, upon starting this thread, I was referring to racism more as a cultural phenomena, with influence on the masses, as opposed to a personally held belief.

An interdependent cultural meme.

I'm beginning to think of racism as an inferior relative to the will to power. It would serve as a proxy to it; figuratively speaking, the poor man's submit. While the will to power is intellectually emotive, racism is emotionally intellectual. ?

I keep starting that book, and life keeps interrupting.
I intend on finishing it this year.

I have it gathering dust on my mountain.



Suggesting a physical cause for something which has no physical manifestation does not prove existence. I could very well claim that psychic energy has a "phsical cause" of firing neurons - yet that doesn't prove the existence of telepathy.

Racists don't (generally) believe they are racist; so the label is applied based on what a nonracist defines as racism.

As per request...

You're obfuscating - is that intentional?

I think only Xev can answer this question.


I agree - I am just wondering how a Materialist choses what to believe and what not to believe with similar bodies of evidence.

No matter how 'materialist' (I've never been quite clear what that meant) someone is, they cannot escape believing things are true with lack-of, inadequate, inconclusive, etc. evidence. Basically to apply hard critical evidence-based thinking to every assertion confronted with takes way to much energy and a 'materialist' likely applies it to information that potentially has alot of importance to them.

Keep in mind that such people tend to understand some basics about human behavior. Imagination and pride are often valued more than truth. People are more inclined to accept assertions as true if the assertions are attractive. People are more inclined to accept assertions as true if they want the assertions to be true. People are more inclined to accept assertions as true if they can emotionally relate to the assertions. People anthropmorphize everything. People have difficulty distinguishing between hallucination and reality. People have difficulty interpreting objective events.

These same people likely understand some basics of logic. If an objective claim is made then it is the claimers responsibility to provide objective evidence. If an objective claim is repeatedly made for very long periods of time and there is zero objective evidence then the claim is false due to one or more factors from the previous paragraph.



What of racism as a cultural phenomena?

Like southern culture or Nazi culture? What of it?


Are memes, such as racism, extant - regardless of individual beliefs?

Don't know. What I can say is that humans are wired to be hierarchical, quick judgers, and difference detectors. The belief of racial difference and superiority might be a naturally emergent phenomena because of this.


Can they self-propagate?

Can a racial supremist raise their children to believe the same thing? Very likely so.


Can they change/influence an individual's beliefs even if all other individuals stopped believing it - in other words, can they be seen as distinct, discrete entities?

To that individual, does it 'feel' true? Is it attractive? Can they relate to it? Do they want it to be true? Is it satisfying? Do they value truth above how the information emotionally / psychologically affects them? My answer would be you bet.


Once you share an idea, you no longer own it, because it takes a life of its own in the minds, cultures and collective consciousness of us all - it becomes a meme - it becomes a Chinese whisper.
Do Chinese whispers have lives of their own?

Good question. I dont have an answer.

What do you consider anecdotal? It's a human behavior to invest work into things cared about. There are people on this forum whom invest work to assert that black people are stupid / more violent. There are people in the USA whom invest effort in creating media about how white people are superior. Germans invested work in judging people according to arian charactistics.

The work becomes evidence that the belief exists.

Yeah, that's what I was about to get at:
anecdote

noun
short account of an incident (especially a biographical one)

Ummm, how else is anyone going to prove racism exists on a website w/o anecdotes?

Here's my proof (anecdotal or not):
http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/images/1151.jpg
We all know the KKK exists. Sooooo, what was their sole reason for existing?

http://blogs.britannica.com/blog/main/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/image9.jpg
Hitler wanted one race, the Aryan race; a race that did not include black people.

Why wouldn't you accept that as proof, Raven?

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

Usually when people talk about "anecdotal evidence" they are referring to isolated examples of things. Anecdotal evidence isn't good for establishing trends. For example, I shouldn't assume that all (or even most) landlords hate cats just because my current landlord hates cats. But it's fine to use anecdotal evidence to prove the existence of something. If I just want to prove that there are some landlords who hate cats, the one example of my own landlord is all that I need.

Now, if by "anecdotal evidence" you are referring to evidence based on people's subjective perceptions, I would say that there is plenty of physical proof that racism exists. For example, we have video of people engaging in racist acts, recordings of people claiming to be racist, racist literature, etc.

Does racism exist?

No, racism is a belief ...it's not a tangible something that you can hold in your hand.

Acts, based on that belief, are what many term "racism" ...but they're mistaken. Racism is a belief and can do no harm to anyone, including the person(s) who happen to hold those beliefs.

Baron Max

No, racism is a belief ...it's not a tangible something that you can hold in your hand.

Acts, based on that belief, are what many term "racism" ...but they're mistaken. Racism is a belief and can do no harm to anyone, including the person(s) who happen to hold those beliefs.

Baron Max
Yes, but what are the rewards for such beliefs? How does it make one feel?

Yes, but what are the rewards for such beliefs? How does it make one feel?

...LOL! Well, Chewing Gum, I'd say, just offhand, that for the racists believing in racism it probably feels good .....else they wouldn't do believe it, would they?

How many people do you know who believe in ideals believe it because it makes them sick or ill? :D

Baron Max

As per request...

I think only Xev can answer this question.

I feel special.
Belief: a strongly held conjecture. Inner "knowledge" that something is true.

No matter how 'materialist' (I've never been quite clear what that meant) someone is, they cannot escape believing things are true with lack-of, inadequate, inconclusive, etc. evidence. Basically to apply hard critical evidence-based thinking to every assertion confronted with takes way to much energy and a 'materialist' likely applies it to information that potentially has alot of importance to them.

That, and the famous example of "how do you KNOW that the lights will turn off when you flip the switch?" The fact that they always do isn't proof.

...LOL! Well, Chewing Gum, I'd say, just offhand, that for the racists believing in racism it probably feels good .....else they wouldn't do believe it, would they?The evidence, then, that several posts here are looking for into something as intangible as racism might be in the end something just as intangible:Belief: a strongly held conjecture. Inner "knowledge" that something is true.Hence this evidence –belief– is mercurial in its nature as it bobs about changing form from person to person and people to people. But in the end "belief" rewards a person in the affirmative: a person will feel at an advantage, they'll feel good about themselves, feel superior. What more evidence is required when you're "above it all"?

The evidence, then, that several posts here are looking for into something as intangible as racism might be in the end something just as intangible:Hence this evidence –belief– is mercurial in its nature as it bobs about changing form from person to person and people to people. But in the end "belief" rewards a person in the affirmative: a person will feel at an advantage, they'll feel good about themselves, feel superior. What more evidence is required when you're "above it all"?

Ah, we're going back to Dawkins idea of memes.....SAM will be pleased.

Im sure written documents such as the jim crow laws, or video evidence of persecution of certain ethnic groups would allow for some proof

I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

No. Racism doesn't exist on it's own. In relation to the social sphere, there are people who's views can be considered racist. Ideas don't exist of themselves.

Let's use:

racism 1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.

There's only one one race, the human race. Everyone has different ethnic backgrounds but we are all the same when you speak about humanity.

I feel special.

In a special kind of way no doubt. :p


Belief: a strongly held conjecture. Inner "knowledge" that something is true.


In that case it's not coherent enough to say whether it exists or not. I have no idea what "Inner knowledge" is.


That, and the famous example of "how do you KNOW that the lights will turn off when you flip the switch?" The fact that they always do isn't proof.

If the light switch is operational and there are no other sources of electricity feeding into the bulb then we know the lights will turn off because we are cutting off the flow of electrons and lights will not function without it.

Do Smurfs exist? I clearly saw a TV program about them, so it must be so.

Do Smurfs exist? I clearly saw a TV program about them, so it must be so.

I think I saw that same documentary.

In that case it's not coherent enough to say whether it exists or not. I have no idea what "Inner knowledge" is.

Ah. Okay, OED:

"belief

• noun 1 a feeling that something exists or is true, especially one without proof. 2 a firmly held opinion. 3 (belief in) trust or confidence in. 4 religious faith.

— PHRASES beyond belief astonishing; incredible.

— ORIGIN Old English."

All four definitions hinge on my "inner feeling" - belief seems to be inherently subjective.

If the light switch is operational and there are no other sources of electricity feeding into the bulb then we know the lights will turn off because we are cutting off the flow of electrons and lights will not function without it.

You suck! I was going for something like this:
http://www.philosophypages.com/hy/4t.htm
(Scroll down to "matters of fact")

The best I can do now is:

"How do we know that the light won't stay on without being exposed to an electric flow? We've never observed it to happen, but that doesn't mean that it can't."

Which sounds awfully retarded. Hume's example is better. :(

Ah. Okay, OED:

"belief

• noun 1 a feeling that something exists or is true, especially one without proof. 2 a firmly held opinion. 3 (belief in) trust or confidence in. 4 religious faith.

— PHRASES beyond belief astonishing; incredible.

— ORIGIN Old English."

All four definitions hinge on my "inner feeling" - belief seems to be inherently subjective.

In that case 'belief' can be proven to exist by examining what beliefs people claim to hold and what work such people are investing effort into. The contents of 'belief' are obviously subjective, but the state of 'believing' is quite objective. Also, because we are all human we all experience belief and it is quite self-evident as a result.



You suck! I was going for something like this:
http://www.philosophypages.com/hy/4t.htm
(Scroll down to "matters of fact")

The best I can do now is:

"How do we know that the light won't stay on without being exposed to an electric flow? We've never observed it to happen, but that doesn't mean that it can't."

Which sounds awfully retarded. Hume's example is better. :(

Hehehehhehehe. I think what you might be getting is is how do we know the laws of physics wont change? The answer is we dont. If the laws of physics were to change then it could falsify what is proven to be true today. Of course if the laws of physics change, the change might be too great for human life to exist. Any proof relies on the laws of physics being consistent, persistent, and non-contradictory.

In that case 'belief' can be proven to exist by examining what beliefs people claim to hold and what work such people are investing effort into. The contents of 'belief' are obviously subjective, but the state of 'believing' is quite objective. Also, because we are all human we all experience belief and it is quite self-evident as a result.

Well, that's where I got confused as to what One Raven was asking. We know that the idea "racism" exists because people write things that are racist, describe themselves as racist, and act in ways that are in accordence with the idea of "racism."


Hehehehhehehe. I think what you might be getting is is how do we know the laws of physics wont change?

Yeah but I'm badly hungover so not very coherent. :)

I suppose my point is that we don't "know" anything, it all rests on assumptions. We assume that we understand physics, we assume that effect follows cause.
But this is a really shallow observation.

Well, that's where I got confused as to what One Raven was asking. We know that the idea "racism" exists because people write things that are racist, describe themselves as racist, and act in ways that are in accordence with the idea of "racism."

My impression is that One Raven might be struggling about separating objective from subjective and using that knowledge to help determine what is truth and what is delusion.




Yeah but I'm badly hungover so not very coherent. :)

If it was the result of a good party then it is soooo worth it :)


I suppose my point is that we don't "know" anything, it all rests on assumptions.

So long as a base assumption stays consistent (ex. reality's laws will not change tomorrow) then we can know quite a bit and only within that context.


We assume that we understand physics, we assume that effect follows cause.
But this is a really shallow observation.

We do understand alot about physics and will understand more in the future. I think our understanding of "cause an effect" doesn't assume that everything has cause for example. Considering that humans are wired for survival and not visibility into or comprehension of reality, we are doing an awesome job.

But I am looking for objective measurments and proof.
His blood pressure could be rising due to sexual attraction - or any other number of reasons.


Dammit, go and learn how they do phsychology experiments these days. For example, other possibilities eg sexual attraction, would be controlled for by showing a mix of pictures, of the same gender as the person involved in the experiment (Assuming they are heterosexual). Other things can be controlled for by checking when they last ate, a briefing and debriefing, careful selection of pictures, and use of placebos and double blinding etc.

My impression is that One Raven might be struggling about separating objective from subjective and using that knowledge to help determine what is truth and what is delusion.


I think that he didn't feel that my response was germane to the issue. I'm so not sure what the issue is.
Really, there's no strict delination between the objective and subjective. The difference especially breaks down on the quantum level.

If it was the result of a good party then it is soooo worth it :)

Always.

We do understand alot about physics and will understand more in the future. I think our understanding of "cause an effect" doesn't assume that everything has cause for example. Considering that humans are wired for survival and not visibility into or comprehension of reality, we are doing an awesome job.

Very true, especially in light of the last 150 or so years of non-Euclidean geometry, 11-dimensional theories, special relativity, quantum mechanics and so on.

Guthrie:
Dammit, go and learn how they do phsychology experiments these days. For example, other possibilities eg sexual attraction, would be controlled for by showing a mix of pictures, of the same gender as the person involved in the experiment (Assuming they are heterosexual). Other things can be controlled for by checking when they last ate, a briefing and debriefing, careful selection of pictures, and use of placebos and double blinding etc.

I think his point was that all of these things have multiple interpretations. How do we KNOW (in the eternal form of capslock-knowing) that something subjective exists?

Actually, One Raven needs to come back so I don't argue for him!

I think that he didn't feel that my response was germane to the issue. I'm so not sure what the issue is.
Really, there's no strict delination between the objective and subjective. The difference especially breaks down on the quantum level.

Oh but there is a huge difference between subjective and objective. Objective is information absent of interpretation (or misaligned interpretation). Subjective is information that is interpreted.

I don't know if I agree with that definition. I am too tired to think at this moment, but objective historically means facts or knowledge that are established without the participation of observers. Subjective means facts or knowledge that cannot be established unless the observers participate.

Do ideas exist? Plainly, they do. When we have conversations with other people, evidence abounds that ideas are being exchanged, interpreted and modified. I don't see how someone could say that ideas don't exist, simply because they have no obvious physical substrate like physical objects do.

I posit that ideas and other non-physical things like racism exist exactly as physical things do and the question is somewhat difficult because of the relative ephemerality of evidence for ideas. One only needs to look to see that ideas obviously exist, but they're not solid like books and people and motorcycles.

But you know? I bet ideas and physical things are at some level not very different. I'd bet some day it might be possible through brain scanning techniques to analyze someone's brain and perhaps see the imprints of facts and ideas--actually see what that particularly brain knows. Those imprints are facts and ideas in stasis--frozen in the brain. Still, they're only patterns in the brain, they're not things. Then when that brain wants to communicate those ideas, he encodes them and speaks. If you analyze those new encoded messages, you'll find those ideas yet again: more evidence of the existence of those ideas.

But what are real physical objects? They're solid, dense things that we know are there, right? Actually, they're not solid and some physicists would argue that matter is only information. Matter is patterns.

That's what ideas are. Patterns. It's just how our brains make sense of the world. Some patterns we perceive as beautiful poetry, some patterns we see as blunt objects. A little while ago I remember watching this documentary about this guy named Daniel Tammet who is an Asperger's Syndrome savant. He has unbelievable mathematical and linguistic capabilities. He's also experiences some sort of synesthesia. He experiences strong emotions when he thinks about or sees numbers. He says that each number has a different shape, color and attached emotion, all the way up into the 20,000s. Would you say that a number is an actual real thing? I'd bet he might have a different answer from you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbASOcqc1Ss

I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?

Rather than asking whether or not racism exists, use the scientific method to make a prediction based on observation and do the tests.

So how would racism exist scientifically?

I agree that God exists as an idea in people's heads, but you know that's not what I refer to when I say God doesn't exist.

So how would racism exist scientifically?

Begin with an observation of racism.

The observation's done. Then?

The observation's done. Then?

Ok, what IS the observation, exactly?

Hey, I haven't volunteered to be canvassed; I'm not a scientist.

A group of people assembled on this side of the street, and a group of people on the other, and there are bats and fists and both groups are eyeing each other with suspicion and hatred.

Looking closer, one notices that both groups comprise two distinct ethnic backgrounds.

One group is of the local ethnicity of the country and we hear one of them yell, "go back to Whoville where you belong!"

Hey, I haven't volunteered to be canvassed; I'm not a scientist.

A group of people assembled on this side of the street, and a group of people on the other, and there are bats and fists and both groups are eyeing each other with suspicion and hatred.

Looking closer, one notices that both groups comprise two distinct ethnic backgrounds.

One group is of the local ethnicity of the country and we hear one of them yell, "go back to Whoville where you belong!"

Ok. you've got an observation, now make a prediction based on that observation. Then, test the prediction.

The results of that prediction will have to wait until the next elections are held.

I have a question for those who say that nothing (from God to telepathy to ghosts) exists which does not have physical evidence that can be objectively measured in "scientific" tanigbles.

Does racism exist?

Outside anecdotal evidence, what is the proof of this?



Racism is a concept of attitude and human actions, not matter or a being so yes it exists and does not have to be quantifiable by scientific methods any more than optimism does.

Sorry for answering the question so swiftly.

Out of interest can anybody seriously condense what the last 3 pages of complete and utter twaddle - imo - has all been about? :shrug:

I answered in twenty seconds and two concise sentences, man...whats wrong with you people?.

Seriously..get out out and smell the coffee before its too late.

sheesh! :cool:

<< grumbles >>

Oli..can I get anything approaching a sensible answer on this one..Isnt Racism deemed important to anyone here? .I don't have the patience to spend several hours thinking up the pithy reply of a Sixth form student.

Oli..can I get anything approaching a sensible answer on this one..
Why ask me?
I haven't posted in this thread 'til now.

Isnt Racism deemed important to anyone here?
The thread's not about racism qua rascism...

I don't have the patience to spend several hours thinking up the pithy reply of a Sixth form student.
Some of us don't need hours to sound like sixth formers...

Seriously..get out out and smell the coffee before its too late.I'm afraid the coffee is stale at this point.

Why ask me?
I haven't posted in this thread 'til now.


The thread's not about racism qua rascism...



I'm not exactly sure what its about?..semantics presumably.