This thread is for Christians only.
It is a place where we can come together and discuss our doctrines and its relevance to society, its relevance to science, and its contribution towards the development of Mankind.

Note:

1. Only mainstream Protestant Denominations
2. Roman Catholic and Orthodox
3. Atheists can just read but must not contribute. Preferable that they
dont visit this thread at all.
4. Mormons are not allowed.
Topics can be started by anyone, about anything that you feel we as Christians must be aware of.

The Creator Loves You. :)

Moderator note - since the forum is open to everyone then so is this thread, despite the originator's hope for exclusivity.

Hi, I'm agnostic, but was raised catholic... Can I join? :(

The Creator Loves You.
how can you make such a statement? if there is a god, you would be claiming to know its mind. where is the basis for your claim that "god" loves anyone?

p.s. when I opened a thread for just atheist, all kinds of Christians posted, this is payback =]

4. Mormons are not allowed.
Why? Mormons are christians, you spinning fop, just a really weird sect of it.

This is a public forum, not your private BLOG.
This is not an "Exclusive Christain Gathering Place".
You are even trying to exclude *some* Christians because, what? you think their version of the religion is somehow inferior to yours?
How very "Christian" of you.

god's been sucking my &^%$ for years now. Want to talk to him directly? I can hook your ass up if you like.

I said - Christians Only Thread !!!!!

READ MY INSTRUCTIONS.

I WILL NOT BE REPLYING TO ANY ATHEIST OR ANY NON CHRISTIAN.

THANK YOU.

THE CREATOR LOVES YOU. !!!!!

Get Lost Atheists And Mormons - This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only.!!

Do Not Contaminate This Thread With Your Ugliness.

Thank You.

I dunno if you are for real, but anyway... You can't tell people not to post here because it is a public forum with rules, and the same rules apply to this thread, therefor it's OK for me as an agnostic to post here, wether you say so or not.

I suggest you go to a christian forum were you will be surrounded by similarly simple minded people like yoruself and mods who will probably and ban all the evil forsaken atheists.

The creator hates us.

This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only

Weak.

Angelic,

There are many entire websites dedicated to such matters. I recommend you go to one of those sites. This forum is open to everyone who wishes to engage in debate, whatever their beliefs or non-beliefs.

Get Lost Atheists And Mormons - This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only.!!

Do Not Contaminate This Thread With Your Ugliness.

Thank You.

So you are saying I am ugly?

Hi Angelic,

I am Arch-angel Neo (sometimes called Mike or Gabbie). Can i post?
*Touches the sword in anticipation of refusal*

Interesting that you should choose only Christians for this thread, this circle of friendship. Jesus included all kinds of people, often sinners, within his circle of friends. Samaritans, tax-collectors, prostitutes, lepers, etc... How entirely unChristlike it is of you to be so exclusive, Angelic Being. I am Christian, so you cannot tell me to hush hush by your own intructions.

often sinners
Preferrably sinners, it seems...
NIV Matthew 9:9As Jesus went on from there, he saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax collector's booth. "Follow me," he told him, and Matthew got up and followed him.

10While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. 11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?"

12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 13But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

It seems, Jesus rejected the belief that we are all born sinners, from Mat 9:13.

Or at least can transcend sin without him.

"This thread is for Christians only.
It is a place where we can come together and discuss our doctrines and its relevance to society, its relevance to science, and its contribution towards the development of Mankind."

isn't that what church is for mate?

Ah, yes. Christian hypocracy rears it's ugly head once again.

Get Lost Atheists And Mormons - This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only.!!

Do Not Contaminate This Thread With Your Ugliness.

Thank You.
1. most christians are far from beautiful- AFAICT, all of the hot chicks at my school are athiest, agnostic, or buddhist.

2. Mormons are christians. Excluding them from your "christian-only" thread only proves your bigotry even further.

hey, im scott, and im a devout christian ;)

but i disagree with rule 4
"Mormons are not allowed."
our creator loves all of his creations, should we not model ourself after the almighty and love our mormon bretheren?

peace

This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only.!!

"I don't want you and I don't need you
Don't bother to resist, I'll beat you
It's not your fault that you're always wrong
The weak ones are there to justify the strong

The beautiful people, the beautiful people
It's all relative to the size of your steeple
You can't see the forest for the trees
You can't smell your own shit on your knees."

~Marilyn Manson

i'm a christian atheist, am i allowed here?

i'm a christian atheist, am i allowed here?

No. We should ask whether we are WELCOME here.

So now, Angelic Being, are we welcome?

Christians are so out of touch with reality that is kinda makes me sad... then I realize they are mostly hypocritical jerks, and I don't feel so bad.

1. most christians are far from beautiful- AFAICT, all of the hot chicks at my school are athiest, agnostic, or buddhist.

not in my country. in my class there was like 12 girls and 2 of them were christians (they said) and they were both pretty and there was 1 pretty atheist

Christians are so out of touch with reality that is kinda makes me sad... then I realize they are mostly hypocritical jerks, and I don't feel so bad.

NOT ALL CHRISTIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

NOT ALL CHRISTIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
99% of the christians. That's almost all. Close enough.

i'm a christian atheist theres no such thing, that's an oxymoron.

its relevance to science

I can state for you that religion has no relevance to science.

Yes, I am an atheist - but a small point you forgot all about is that I do not take orders from you. It's like a slug telling a lion it's not allowed to roar. Please, don't make me laugh.

not in my country. in my class there was like 12 girls and 2 of them were christians (they said) and they were both pretty and there was 1 pretty atheist

It is well worth pointing out that there is no correlation between looks and religiosity. I think you're all twits for even discussing the issue in a serious manner.

theres no such thing, that's an oxymoron.

wy nut?

It is well worth pointing out that there is no correlation between looks and religiosity. I think you're all twits for even discussing the issue in a serious manner.
you're weird if you think we were being serious! but i don't think you were serious when thinking that we were being serious....

wy nut?
Because christianity is a religion and implies theism.
Atheism is the refusal of religion and theism.
They are polar opposites, and therefore saying that you are a "christian athiest" is an oxymoron, moron.

you're weird if you think we were being serious! but i don't think you were serious when thinking that we were being serious....

Oh c'mon.. You've already proven to pretty much everyone out there in cyberspace that you're a complete drivelling nutbag. Of course you were being serious. Yes, I also know that when you get in too deep you like to then respond: "I was only joking!", but I know enough about humans and how their minds work to not fall for that old schoolyard foolishness.

While Hapsburg is somewhat excluded simply because he's young, you do not have that luxury. You're just a crackpot.

Oh c'mon.. You've already proven to pretty much everyone out there in cyberspace that you're a complete drivelling nutbag. Of course you were being serious. Yes, I also know that when you get in too deep you like to then respond: "I was only joking!", but I know enough about humans and how their minds work to not fall for that old schoolyard foolishness.

but i was just kidding that i was kidding.....

Because christianity is a religion and implies theism.
Atheism is the refusal of religion and theism.
They are polar opposites, and therefore saying that you are a "christian athiest" is an oxymoron, moron.
Atheism is not a refusal of religion, it is a non-belief in God.
Someone can consider himself a Christian and an Atheist, if he follows the philosophy of teh teaching of Jesus Christ, simply does not believe in God.
Just as someone can consider himself a Buddhist and not be an Atheist, even though the Buddha was.

but i was just kidding that i was kidding.....

Clearly demonstrating my point. And now you're just going to say that you were kidding that you were kidding that you were kidding - and thus ensure that this discussion is dragged so far away from it's intended purpose that hopefully nobody will ever notice that you're a bonefide halfwit.

You're still a halfwit, no matter how many "kidding's" you respond with.

I see all you heathens ignored Angelic Being's very clear instructions. How disgraceful of you all. How disruptive. How insubordinate and insolent.


Can I join too? :cool:

You're still a halfwit, no matter how many "kidding's" you respond with.
I doubt it.

Atheism is not a refusal of religion, it is a non-belief in God.
Someone can consider himself a Christian and an Atheist, if he follows the philosophy of teh teaching of Jesus Christ, simply does not believe in God.
Just as someone can consider himself a Buddhist and not be an Atheist, even though the Buddha was.

Do you think that your fellow atheists agree with your idea, because I believe I mentioned something like that in my previous thred - The Creator Loves You - which was locked by the owners of this forum, believe me I got alot of opposition from your fellow atheists. I was even asked to apologise as I had insulted all atheists.

This is part of the reason why I specifically stated that no Atheists are to cooment on this thread because to tell you the truth I am not learning anything new from you guys.

Could Christians please state themselves first so that I can have a sensible discussion with them - sorry but it seems that the I may have to accept that atheists are like flies, they just cannot learn.

Thank you.

I am not an atheist.
I would be willing to bet some atheists would agree with me, and some of them wouldn't (I know at least one does -c7ityi_).
I would also be willing to bet that some Christians would agree and some would disagree (I know at least one does -c7ityi_ ;))
Your other thread was locked because it turned into nothing more than people throwing stupid insults and making juvenile remarks back and forth. It was not leading to any worthwhile discussion.

By the way, who asked you to apologize for offending atheists at large, and what was said to offend them? I doubt it was the simple notion that someone can be both a Christian and an Atheist.

You are welcome.

You are free to ignore anyone you wish and simply respond to Chrstians if you want to. No one is focing you to respond to anyone. This is, however, as was pointed out, not you personal forum, it is open to all.
Being that there are at least as many atheists as theists here (if not substantially more) perhaps this isn't the best place for you to discuss religion if you don't want to have your ideas challenged by people with opposing viewpoints.

sorry but it seems that the I may have to accept that atheists are like flies, they just cannot learn.

Or perhaps they are persistent and that annoys you.

I'm not sure you can truly call yourself a christian. I have many great friendships with christians, and I'm pretty sure they like me despite my beliefs.

That you cannot begin to accept a differing point of view let alone consider the people that hold those points of view of any worth indicates that you disregard the teaching of your own dogma.

In provoking responses from people you would rather not hear from, it seems to me you go out looking for ratification of something bordering on hatred for people whose paradigm of beliefs contains an aspect of atheistic credence.

The Creator Loves You? How about you display some of this love you so confidently espouse instead of being a complete hypocrite.

Or perhaps they are persistent and that annoys you.

I'm not sure you can truly call yourself a christian. I have many great friendships with christians, and I'm pretty sure they like me despite my beliefs.

That you cannot begin to accept a differing point of view let alone consider the people that hold those points of view of any worth indicates that you disregard the teaching of your own dogma.

In provoking responses from people you would rather not hear from, it seems to me you go out looking for ratification of something bordering on hatred for people whose paradigm of beliefs contains an aspect of atheistic credence.

The Creator Loves You? How about you display some of this love you so confidently espouse instead of being a complete hypocrite.


Okay you guys are like children now -WHATS LOVE GOT TO DO WITH IT!!!!!?

angelic being
Get Lost Atheists And Mormons - This Thread Is For Christians Aka Beautiful People Only.!!

This thread is the funniest. I got a good chuckle from reading every post. Sorry angelic being I am sure you can start a better thread soon. This thread is civilization at its best.But to be honest are you not supposed to spread the gospel? so why the segregation. everyone simmer

Okay you guys are like children now -WHATS LOVE GOT TO DO WITH IT!!!!!?

Is that not a principle tenant of christianity? And what you always end your posts with, but something to which you do not adhere?

What's worse is that you have just made an assumption about me, then applied it to everyone else here. Further you just started insulting me for no good reason. I made an observation about your behaviour which was not a personal attack. Not simply that your posts displayed an eloquence of thought that would allow me to make the assumption that you were mentally under-developed.

Go somewhere else, not because I want you to, but because it will better fulfil the purposes you put forward at the beginning of this thread.

Hi, angelic being.

I am a former Christian who has joined the ranks of communism and recently my respect for atheists has put me on the agnostic boundary in terms of belief.

I believe in evolution and the Big Bang.

I think many religious fundamentalists exhibit severe intolerance, both in the intellectual and moral senses. Such is one of the reasons which I have rejected the mentality of these people.

I believe that the Bible must be interpreted more symbolically in order to survive and reconcile with science.

That is all I have to say.

Oh, by the way, am I invited?

Hi AB Jadon. Thread seems to be a bust huh?

muwahahahaha, sweet sweet payback for christians ruining my atheist-only thread. man this is sweet. =]

just for fun, why don't I hit you with a flaw in christianity.

if god grants any prayer then he is taking away someone's free will, think about it. even if you pray for a safe trip home (which would take away the free will of anyone wanting to do you harm) or more patients (which takes your own free will to be impatient), the bottom line is that god must take away free will to grant prayers. so what is right? does god take away our free will? or is one of the staples of christianity (prayer) wrong?

I love this one:

"god bless America"

Translate: Please god, let us dominate the world and be successful in decimating our enemies because we are better than them. Amen.

I spew you out of my mouth with projectile vomiting!

there are the elect. 144,000 people whom God has elected to remain on earth after he, for the second time, removes man from the planet. These are those who kept his commandment. You know, those commandment to that part of the bible that yours was tacked onto the end of.

♥ superluminal ♥, i'm sorry i said i didn't like the word bias... i didn't mean to...

You!

This thread is for Christians only.It is a place where we can come together and discuss our doctrines and its relevance to society, its relevance to science, and its contribution towards the development of Mankind.Note:

1. Only mainstream Protestant Denominations
2. Roman Catholic and Orthodox
3. Atheists can just read but must not contribute. Preferable that they
dont visit this thread at all.
4. Mormons are not allowed.
Topics can be started by anyone, about anything that you feel we as Christians must be aware of.

The Creator Loves You.
This is the funniest thing I've read all day! :p
Either you are a master troll AB or just about the fundiest fundy I've ever met! Don't you know you can't discriminate here on sciforums?

You!


Jeepers, everyone wants to be beautiful - even the atheists!!!

The Creator Loves You.

I too, do not understand people calling themselves Christian, and then displaying the very opposite (I do believe they call they hypocracy). Jesus accepted everyone. Some day, very soon, I do believe that we will come to find out much about his life, and what has been hidden from us for centuries, as a form of control...many secrets exist. Some secret would shake certain religions by their roots. I believe in God, his son, and also many other enlightened beings who walked this earth....Nostradaumus, Buddha, Daniel, Edgar Cayce, etc....in order to get in touch with God, one merely has to ask.Preferrably sinners, it seems...
NIV Matthew 9:9As Jesus went on from there, he saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax collector's booth. "Follow me," he told him, and Matthew got up and followed him.

10While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. 11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?"

12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 13But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

But...but...what does love have to do with it?

- KitNyx

what's love, but a second hand emotion... :p

Sorry guys,

I am busy at the moment but is there any serious Christian out there?

Would you like to discuss some Christian Issues?

Stay Beautiful.

The Creator Loves You.

They are discussing a Christian issue: that of your hypocrisy, and hypocrisy in general.

"serious Christian"

Is this not an oxymoron?

most definitely.

in order to get in touch with God, one merely has to ask.

Tried, tested and failed.

As a result, your statement is wrong.

Oh c'mon.. You've already proven to pretty much everyone out there in cyberspace that you're a complete drivelling nutbag. Of course you were being serious. Yes, I also know that when you get in too deep you like to then respond: "I was only joking!", but I know enough about humans and how their minds work to not fall for that old schoolyard foolishness.Actually some of them were actually joking, then they saw you, everything got serious and they felt like nutcases and they tried to tell you they were only joking. Even on this forum you didn't see that. No fear involved, you just didn't see.

Maybe it's because they explain it foolishly, but hey, it's easier to understand than to reactionary respond to each impulse...at least it's easier in the end.

There probably are those who are serious and then say they were joking too. But the reasoning they hade a few posts ago were not that serious as to my understanding, much more a "fun" excersise of thought, in which they through different views try to make valid a falsity. I just hope they remember that it was a falsity after they made it valid...through my experiances not all do.

While Hapsburg is somewhat excluded simply because he's young, you do not have that luxury. You're just a crackpot.Who is Hapsburg?

Tried, tested and failed.

As a result, your statement is wrong.Oh, you forgot to wait.

Oh, you forgot to wait.
We are a hasty people. Too wrapped in our own worlds to wait for any help, when there are many immediate solutions to life's problems. In our pride, we think that an eternal creator should serve us in our timing. There are two things wrong with an attitude like that.

Who is Hapsburg?
That'd be me, ya fuckin' n00b.

While Hapsburg is somewhat excluded simply because he's young,
No I'm not. I'm just a murderous looney. :p

That'd be me, ya fuckin' n00b.Oh, sorry, didn't read who said what did I?

But don't take it so hard, if you only wrote "That'd be me" then the sound of it would be much nicer.

If you don't know who I am, you haven't been here long enough, are therefore new, ergo a newb also spelled n00b.

Also, I'm just pissed because I had a fuckload of work to do in class today...I hate my geometry teacher so much.

We are a hasty people. Too wrapped in our own worlds to wait for any help, when there are many immediate solutions to life's problems. In our pride, we think that an eternal creator should serve us in our timing. There are two things wrong with an attitude like that.It's a great problem that people expect God to behave in a way that makes Him lower than us, atheists see God as our creation, which is totally the opposite of what it should be, maybe some atheists can stretch their mind to the idea of a god being greater than us, but that idea usually don't last very long - or so it seems. At least they should believe that WE believe in a God greater than ourself. Maybe that's why they can't understand us, because they think we blindly believe in our own creation, and not the creator. Our belief is greater than that.

If you don't know who I am, you haven't been here long enough, are therefore new, ergo a newb also spelled n00b.

Also, I'm just pissed because I had a fuckload of work to do in class today...I hate my geometry teacher so much.I understand, but I really have been here for a while, (wouldn't have got 767 posts otherwise would I?) but I had a period when I wasn't here at all so some of the names of people I didn't discuss things with just faded away. I do recognise your name from before now that I understand he meant someone posting here on sciforums.

So sorry, I just have these moments were my understanding of the conversation fails...

Actually some of them were actually joking,

Oh, so shockingly gullible. I suppose you need to go the rounds with Yorda a few times before you can read him like an open book.

then they saw you, everything got serious

Oh, I think you look at me in the wrong way. I think you consider me too serious, and on this forum I most certainly can be. I think that's because I do not come here to share jokes, but to debate certain issues that I like to debate. When I want to joke I go to a joke site/forum.

Even on this forum you didn't see that. No fear involved, you just didn't see.


Says the sheep, being led to the slaughterhouse oblivious. Of course, you were right in saying there's no fear involved. Why you even made the sentence is a mystery.

Maybe it's because they explain it foolishly, but hey, it's easier to understand than to reactionary respond to each impulse...at least it's easier in the end.

If it is 'foolish', then one has the right to point that out.. no? I respond to whatever I feel like responding to - be they foolish posts or not. I think you need to understand that you do not feature anywhere in my chain of command. I responded to Yorda probably for the very same reason you've responded to me.

There probably are those who are serious and then say they were joking too.

Certainly, and I felt like pointing it out.

But the reasoning they hade a few posts ago were not that serious as to my understanding

If there's one thing you should know about schoolboys, (if you've ever been one), it's that they take 'women' and 'good looking' seriously. Well, straight boys do.

But anyway, none of this is really of any worth.. I much prefer your next response to me:

Oh, you forgot to wait.

Might I ask how long that is? I'm just curious, and have a specific reason to be which I shall highlight for you now:

A while back I wrote a letter to a mutual enemy. He hates me, I hate him. We always have - as far back as I can remember knowing him, and although I have no idea why, it has been consistent for the past quarter of a century. So anyway, I sent this letter, and to my surprise I got a letter back from him.

So I got to thinking, given your statement.. If a human that absolutely detests me can respond within a week, why can't a being that supposedly loves me dearly respond within a 7 year period?

Ok, I do appreciate that my worldly enemy most likely doesn't have millennia of backlog to catch up with, but I also know he is not omnipotent - which should most certainly make clearing up several millennia of backlog rather easy.

While I forgive the stupidity of your statement, I can not forgive the manner in which it has seemingly been implied. Perhaps it's just me, but it comes across as if you're making out that I have done something wrong - that I have somehow not done what is needed to get to know this omnipotent, omnipresent being that loves his creation so much he got himself killed and is considered 'perfect'.

Given the statement by the last poster, this is clearly bollocks. "All you need to do is ask". That was the qualifying criteria. There was no mention of waiting for a decade anywhere in his statement. There was no mention of the all-loving god being slower to say 'hi' than the biggest enemy I have ever known.

I wonder, and I ask, would satan wait 7 years to respond to a call? When the biggest, most evil bastard in the history of the universe responds faster than the most loving being in the history of the universe, you know there's a serious problem.

So Cyperium, how long is the waiting list?

I wonder, and I ask, would satan wait 7 years to respond to a call? When the biggest, most evil bastard in the history of the universe responds faster than the most loving being in the history of the universe, you know there's a serious problem.

So Cyperium, how long is the waiting list?

Good question.

So, how long does Satan wait to respond sometimes?

We are quite capable of taking care of things on our own to the best of our ability, are we not? When I do things God's way, it is so perfect that I can't help but laugh at my unbelief and be overjoyed at God's love.

The waiting list varies, but it is worth the wait....you know the saying.

The one thing that I know is that out of 29 years on this Earth, God has never let me down, even when I wanted nothing to do with him. And it takes hindsight to admit this.

I understand, but I really have been here for a while, (wouldn't have got 767 posts otherwise would I?) but I had a period when I wasn't here at all so some of the names of people I didn't discuss things with just faded away. I do recognise your name from before now that I understand he meant someone posting here on sciforums.

So sorry, I just have these moments were my understanding of the conversation fails...
Yeah, I know, too many people to fuckin' remember.

Hey guys!!!

Hope everyone is okay.

I am sitting by my window, it's cold and raining, and I am having a nice hot cup of coffee - thinking.

Be back in three hours time, meanwhile to all Christians-

Stay Beautiful!!

Thank You. :cool:

I'm all aquiver - let us know when you go to the bathroom.

Hey guys!!!

Hope everyone is okay.

I am sitting by my window, it's cold and raining, and I am having a nice hot cup of coffee - thinking.

Be back in three hours time, meanwhile to all Christians-

Stay Beautiful!!

Thank You. :cool:
In the words of Dennis Leary-
"No cares, you little $%&*ing ^#%&hole!

I'm LDS not "mormon" so can i post now?

You can post anytime you want, in whatever thread you want. It's a public forum. Jadon can't stop you from posting.

who is jadon?

who is jadon?

Angelic Being.

who is jadon?

Angelic Being. (He changed his name a short while ago from Jadon [aka-dumbass] to Angelic Being [aka-dumbass].)

Angelic Being. (He changed his name a short while ago from Jadon [aka-dumbass] to Angelic Being [aka-dumbass].)

Thanks - now you can kiss my beautiful .......!!!!!!

Jadon, what denomination of christendom do you hail from?

AB Jadon,

If you don't become more tolerant, you will go to hell. You should be able to take all of the insults and slander in the world and remain respectful toward us. That is, if you are a True Christian™. The Christ^® would not behave so.

The Christ would not stick around long enough to find out whether or not He would behave so.

This is true. If I were The Christ^® I would send AB Jadon to hell just for being an arrogant, hypocritical, fairly dull witted, failure of a creation.

Jadon, what denomination of christendom do you hail from?

I prefer to call myself a Christian - but I believe if you read my previous statements , you might think that I am a Liberal Christian.

I prefer talking to Christians really or to people who profess in the reality of The Christ - this is the most important criteria to taking part in this thread.

I believe that Christianity is in fact a Science and that the word Religion has become convoluted with mans inferior ideas.

I believe that The Creator is the Highest Being, the All Powerful, the King of Kings - the Most Superior 'Race'


Whereas atheists choose to believe that it is only us in this universe, I believe that there are other civilizations out there - definitely more advanced.

Christianity is a way of life - it is a life of Learning, Giving, Loving your neighbors as Yourself, and again Learning.

I believe that because our leaders of science have rejected The Creator we as a race have missed out on alot of scientific information and knowledge.

The Scriptures say that Knowledge comes from the ONE who gives it - THE CREATOR - but if we continue to be stubborn and ignore HIM, then I am telling you 'someone will have to go' and it will be us.

When we were put on this planet, we were told to prove that we deserve Living here. Right now, the destruction and devastation we are commiting on our Home, in our Home is indescribable.

I feel sorry for mankind, my heart is saddened at the level that we as a whole have sunk down to. Sometimes I feel like giving up but I know that there only few people like me and as long as there are people like me, Our Voices will always 'sound in the wilderness'. It will be a beacon guiding redeemable ones back home.

Stay Beautiful.
The Creator Loves You!!!!!!!.

AB JAdon:

Whereas atheists choose to believe that it is only us in this universe, I believe that there are other civilizations out there - definitely more advanced.

While the rest of your post is typical AB Jadon idiocy, this statement is just an outright lie and an indication of your complete lack of understanding of anyone but your ego absorbed self.

Some atheists believe there are other advanced civilizations in the universe, some don't. This is a matter for scientific investigation (SETI). So, you believe that god and christ were/are space aliens?

LOL. AB Jadon is totally lost.

LOL. AB Jadon is totally lost.
So are you

So are you

Your point? My point is that he, and maybe you, are lost and don't realize it.

Your point? My point is that he, and maybe you, are lost and don't realize it.

Can you stop your childish behaviour and get off my thread????

It is sadly interesting that you and people like you keep on pestering me. I wonder if this is just the Spiritual Law of Nature where sinners like you like to associate with Godly people like me.

Could it be that The Christ did not go to the sinners rather the sinners went to Him?

Thanks atheists/sinners - I am beginning to understand you better now. You just can't help yourself, you are attracted to Godly people like me because deep inside each of you, you are hurting and you feel safe around Godly people.

Memo: atheists/sinners are scared and insecure.


Except for the Unreedemable Sinners - The Creator Loves You.

What you, AB, haven't realized yet, is that the creator actually hates you and me. he is a piece of dog shit that I might find on my shoe.

While the rest of your post is typical AB Jadon idiocy, this statement is just an outright lie and an indication of your complete lack of understanding of anyone but your ego absorbed self.


Isn't that what future sons in law are for???

Just kidding..........

So, AB Jadon,

God and the man Jesus: Space aliens or what?

What you, AB, haven't realized yet, is that the creator actually hates you and me. he is a piece of dog shit that I might find on my shoe.


Okay, now someones raving mad!!!!

Okay, now someones raving mad!!!!


I can live with that. Not god.

AB Jadon:

Isn't that what future sons in law are for???

Die you gravy sucking pig.

Just kidding.......... :D

Don't kid, Superluminal. :cool:

When we were put on this planet, we were told to prove that we deserve Living here. Right now, the destruction and devastation we are commiting on our Home, in our Home is indescribable.
What destruction and devastation.

I believe that because our leaders of science have rejected The Creator we as a race have missed out on alot of scientific information and knowledge.
Just curious like what?

Just some simple advice please stop asserting statements and try proving them for once in your life. Perhaps then you would get more respect around here. Also be careful of you ad hom attacks like this one below...

Memo: atheists/sinners are scared and insecure.

I could easily say that all Christians are close minded, anal, egotistical, fundies given your behaviour around here reciently, but I know that your behaviour AB is not indicitive of the whole Christian population.

What do you want me, an atheist, to think about, Angelic Being? One thing that really has a hold on you. What do you want me to know? Seriously.

Your point? My point is that he, and maybe you, are lost and don't realize it.
It doesn't matter if we are lost.

It doesn't matter if we are lost.

Good for you. I'm glad you realize that. It doesn't matter to god, so why should it matter to humanity?

What do you want me, an atheist, to think about, Angelic Being? One thing that really has a hold on you. What do you want me to know? Seriously.

You need Reflection.

You need to see the real You.

If you don't understand this simple words, then I am sorry - You have gone beyond the point of no return.

Thank you.

I am very serious and very christian, and I would like to talk about christian matter with you AB!
:)

If only all these mean nasty pagan types would quit bothering us pure folk!
I think you are right! Inside, they are hurting from not knowing the saving grace of god and Jesus', our lord and savior, love. I think they are affraid to let themselves believe and be forgiven because they think that no one would love them, even though God loves all his chilldren, they just don't get it. It's dad, don't you think?
I wish that they would let themselves believe, then we would all get along and there would be on war or pain or suffering or misery and everybody would be happy and that mean old nasty satan guy would just have to go back to hell and sit on a coal all day cause no one would be fooled by him anymore becuase everyone would be together in the love and grace of god almighty.
Don't you think?

You need Reflection.

You need to see the real You.

If you don't understand this simple words, then I am sorry - You have gone beyond the point of no return.

Thank you.

What should I reflect on? You capitalized the 'Y' in You. Do you think I am god?

For your information, I was a die-hard "christian" for the first 30 years of my life. I know a little more about "christianity" than you may think. One thing I feel that I know is that the bible is a crock of shit.

What should I reflect on? You capitalized the 'Y' in You. Do you think I am god?

For your information, I was a die-hard "christian" for the first 30 years of my life. I know a little more about "christianity" than you may think. One thing I feel that I know is that the bible is a crock of shit.

You big old mean cottontop1 why would you ever say such mean ansty and untrue things!!! Of course the bible is the truth,'cause it is god's own words! It has to be true because it is gods word and god is perfect and loves us all and he wouldn't let his word be twisted or ever lie to us cause he loves us all and wants us to be happy.

You are just affraid of the real you, the you that god has put on the earth for a reason. He want's you to accept our lord jesus christ as your savior and to be happy and saved and live in grace Cotton top!! why are you affraid to let god into your life?

Good god Mephura.

Have you really, really been converted? Please don't buy the shit that AB is selling. I couldn't stand to lose you to the dark side.

If you want a Christians only thread, just like you want a christians only world, go post on a Christian board.
Otherwise I'm gonna put my 2 cents in about your delusional childish beliefs that are really nothing more than beliefs in the tooth fairy and santa claus.

Grow up.


If "Adam and Eve" only had two boys, "Cain" and "Abel", and if Cain killed Abel (Genesis 4:8), who did Cain fuck to make more children? His mother Eve?

If "Adam and Eve" only had two boys, "Cain" and "Abel", and if Cain killed Abel (Genesis 4:8), who did Cain fuck to make more children? His mother Eve?Of course. Back then, things were "different."

What should I reflect on? You capitalized the 'Y' in You. Do you think I am god?

For your information, I was a die-hard "christian" for the first 30 years of my life. I know a little more about "christianity" than you may think. One thing I feel that I know is that the bible is a crock of shit.

Then you really have been lost.

I am sorry but from now on I will not be replying to any of your statements.

Fortunately you have medicine woman and hasbeen/hasburg as your posse, so chin up and enjoy your life to the full (the 'fool' of sin - he! he!)

Thank you.

Poor me.

"I believe that because our leaders of science have rejected The Creator we as a race have missed out on alot of scientific information and knowledge."

yep, religion sure has helped with science, i mean, just a few years ago (it was during this millenium sometime) the catholic church admitted the world was a sphere

If you want a Christians only thread, just like you want a christians only world, go post on a Christian board.
Otherwise I'm gonna put my 2 cents in about your delusional childish beliefs that are really nothing more than beliefs in the tooth fairy and santa claus.

Grow up.


If "Adam and Eve" only had two boys, "Cain" and "Abel", and if Cain killed Abel (Genesis 4:8), who did Cain fuck to make more children? His mother Eve?

I suppose it would make sense that adam who lived for 960 years and his wife eve who lived for over 900 years also would have had only two sons - according to the descriptions of cain and Abel given they would have had to have been over forty years at the most at the time of the murder.

Unless they had family planning I just cannot believe that adam and eve would not have had other children - you dunce!!!!

Cain would have had numerous sisters - at the time the genetic effects of incest would not affect their offsprings because they were just one generation away from being created by GOD.

It is only today that some mentally sick people are committing incest - a thing that was later on banned by GOD a coupole of generations after adam and eve.

Cain would have had numerous sisters - at the time the genetic effects of incest would not affect their offsprings because they were just one generation away from being created by GOD.
Another good example how you throw out assertions, but cannot back them up with any facts. Please prove that at one time incest was acceptable and did not lead to genetic deformities. Simply stating that it was because Adam's children were only one generation from being created by god means nothing.

Hey,

Have you all noticed that "The Creator Loves Us!!!!" less and less with each of AB Jadons posts? I think his xian sensibilities are taking a real beating. He's pissed. Good.

AB Jadon:

Cain would have had numerous sisters - at the time the genetic effects of incest would not affect their offsprings because they were just one generation away from being created by GOD.

Ha! Stupid, weak minded, idiotic, brain dead, blathering moron. So genetics are the only reason not to have incest? What about brothers/sisters, fathers/daughters who have vasectomies or tubal ligations? Is it ok then? Also, genetic diversity of parents helps to mediate the effects of inbreeding (whis is less dangerous than you think. Do some research.)

The first generations "close to god" would have been genetically pure and would have resulted in horrible mutations. So, god condones incest. Cool.

Cain would have had numerous sisters

Where in the bible does it state that? Or did you just make that one up yourself?

Did you forget about the Land of Nod?

We are quite capable of taking care of things on our own to the best of our ability, are we not?

So you're saying we don't need god? If not I fail to see the worth of your statement in the context of discussion. It was stated that: "To find god all you need to do is ask", to which I responded that it has been tried and tested, and failed. That instantly negates the posters statement.

I was then told that I have not waited long enough to which I have asked how long is the waiting list.

As you can see, there is no implication from anyone that people cannot 'take care of things' by themselves.

I am asking a) How long one must wait after asking, and b) Why an "all-loving" being would wait so long.

When I do things God's way, it is so perfect that I can't help but laugh at my unbelief and be overjoyed at God's love.

While that's nice for you, it is of no relevance to what I asked or posted.

The waiting list varies, but it is worth the wait....you know the saying.

So why do you religious folk bust my balls for being an atheist when I am so simply because I'm still stuck on god's waiting list? Nobody can rush that list except god - and if he doesn't want to, he doesn't want to. As such we can only conclude that I am an atheist because god wants me to be.

The one thing that I know is that out of 29 years on this Earth, God has never let me down, even when I wanted nothing to do with him. And it takes hindsight to admit this

In over 29 years my mother has never let me down, the local hospital has never let me down, the cigarette shop has never let me down, my car has never let me down, this computer has never let me down - but for the past decade or so god has decided to ignore me - ergo; let me down.

Yes, you can say that's his right as god, but basically I just negated any worth your statement might have had.

Might I ask how long that is? I'm just curious, and have a specific reason to be which I shall highlight for you now:

A while back I wrote a letter to a mutual enemy. He hates me, I hate him. We always have - as far back as I can remember knowing him, and although I have no idea why, it has been consistent for the past quarter of a century. So anyway, I sent this letter, and to my surprise I got a letter back from him.

So I got to thinking, given your statement.. If a human that absolutely detests me can respond within a week, why can't a being that supposedly loves me dearly respond within a 7 year period?

Ok, I do appreciate that my worldly enemy most likely doesn't have millennia of backlog to catch up with, but I also know he is not omnipotent - which should most certainly make clearing up several millennia of backlog rather easy.

While I forgive the stupidity of your statement, I can not forgive the manner in which it has seemingly been implied. Perhaps it's just me, but it comes across as if you're making out that I have done something wrong - that I have somehow not done what is needed to get to know this omnipotent, omnipresent being that loves his creation so much he got himself killed and is considered 'perfect'.

Given the statement by the last poster, this is clearly bollocks. "All you need to do is ask". That was the qualifying criteria. There was no mention of waiting for a decade anywhere in his statement. There was no mention of the all-loving god being slower to say 'hi' than the biggest enemy I have ever known.

I wonder, and I ask, would satan wait 7 years to respond to a call? When the biggest, most evil bastard in the history of the universe responds faster than the most loving being in the history of the universe, you know there's a serious problem.

So Cyperium, how long is the waiting list?This is looking to be a good discussion!

So there are some alternatives to go through first.

1) Maybe you allready got your answer?
2) Maybe you didn't really need the answer?
3) Maybe God saw that the answer would do more harm to you than good?
4) Maybe God wanted us to have this discussion :) maybe not but think that maybe the consequences you got from Him not answering were the consequences you should have had.

About the fourth one:
Maybe you haven't had the same experiance as I have, but sometimes I have made a choice not to do someones request because I've sensed that it might be bad for him, and afterwards I've felt like he was feeling that I let him down, and I have hoped that he understood that it was for his best.

The fourth one is a alternative that God maybe did best not to answer.

Anyway, God won't show Himself to you at your command, and remember not to test God.

Since I don't know what you asked I can't say that much more.

1) Maybe you allready got your answer?

If I did, we would not be discussing this. The post that I responded to was the one that said: "To find god all you need to do is ask". I have not found god, although I have asked. As such the statement made By FreedomCry is false, and number 1 can safely be excluded.

2) Maybe you didn't really need the answer?

I really did need the answer. My son had just died.

3) Maybe God saw that the answer would do more harm to you than good?

Why? Could he not have made himself known to me and told me my child was in heaven? Of course you could be right though - perhaps my son is in hell, because as god clearly states in the bible: he punishes children for the sins of their fathers. While telling me he'd done that wouldn't make me like him, it would clarify his existence.

However, regardless to any of that number 3 would again shows FreedomCry's statement as false - and that's all I was debating against.

4).. maybe not but think that maybe the consequences you got from Him not answering were the consequences you should have had

So in other words: god wanted me to remain an atheist. Thus I am only an atheist because god wants me to be, and am doomed to hell because god wants me to be.

About the fourth one:
Maybe you haven't had the same experiance as I have, but sometimes I have made a choice not to do someones request because I've sensed that it might be bad for him, and afterwards I've felt like he was feeling that I let him down, and I have hoped that he understood that it was for his best.

A) You are completely irrelevant to the discussion. You are not an "all-loving" god, and nobody made the statement that "all you have to do is ask", with regards to you. If you go back you'll see my original post was that FreedomCry's statement was wrong. It still is wrong.

However, what you're saying is that all these atheists that have at one time or another asked for god to make himself known have been refused, (because god was worried that getting to know him would be a bad thing for them), are forced into remaining as atheists - and ultimately doomed to hell because of it. I thought hell was as bad as it gets, so the excuse that god wont say 'hi' because he think's it's bad for them is seriously weak.

Anyway, God won't show Himself to you at your command

And he wont show himself to you at your asking either - which is what my first post was all about - to debunk FreedomCry's claim of "all you have to do is ask". It's no longer a case of just asking, indeed no - you have added all kinds of qualifying criteria to it: from waiting for a decade to somehow thinking that an eternity of hell is less "harmful" to me than god saying 'hi'.

and remember not to test God.

So now asking god to come to you is testing him? This guy seemingly has a whole load of excuses for remaining non-existant. But then perhaps it's not him, but just you?

I'm sure if I had have come in this post stating how I asked for god and he came down and filled my heart with joy, you'd be telling me how awesome god is and that he loves his children and "never lets them down" and is always there for them yada yada yada - but because I said he never did, you instantly pull out your book of one million and one excuses for a non-existant deity and think it will work. Give it up.

All you've ended up doing is arguing my point that "all you have to do is ask", is wrong. We're all in agreement here, including god - who stated in the bible:

2 Corinthians 4:4
The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

As an undeniable result of that, it stands that one can only find god if god wants them to, one can only believe in jesus if gods wants them to - and man is doomed to hell if god wants them to be.

So you're saying we don't need god? If not I fail to see the worth of your statement in the context of discussion. It was stated that: "To find god all you need to do is ask", to which I responded that it has been tried and tested, and failed. That instantly negates the posters statement.

Obviously, we don't need God to live this life. The question is how we want to live this life and how we want to spend eternity, if there is one.

God does not fail, we fail him, and sometimes we fail him by not waiting, pretending like we are immortal.


I was then told that I have not waited long enough to which I have asked how long is the waiting list.

As you can see, there is no implication from anyone that people cannot 'take care of things' by themselves.

I am asking a) How long one must wait after asking, and b) Why an "all-loving" being would wait so long.

I don't know, I'm not God. But I have had long times of waiting before. Sometimes years, but not always. Besides, patience builds character.


So why do you religious folk bust my balls for being an atheist when I am so simply because I'm still stuck on god's waiting list? Nobody can rush that list except god - and if he doesn't want to, he doesn't want to. As such we can only conclude that I am an atheist because god wants me to be.


True, you are who you are on purpose. I would not be who I am today had I not gone through my agnostic years. That burns my butt too, we should not be busting your balls for being an atheist. It just gives the image of a blathering idiot and does no good whatsoever. Jesus never busted anyone's butt for not believing in him. He busted the balls of people who did so, when they themselves were not perfect.


In over 29 years my mother has never let me down, the local hospital has never let me down, the cigarette shop has never let me down, my car has never let me down, this computer has never let me down - but for the past decade or so god has decided to ignore me - ergo; let me down.

Yes, you can say that's his right as god, but basically I just negated any worth your statement might have had.

Is it God who has let you down, though? If you are asking God, you need help with something, right? So, who or what has let you down? I love it when I am let down by the world because it reminds me that I don't belong here.

I seriously don't think God has let you down, but perhaps you have let him down by shutting and locking the door on his existence...but what choice do you have. The evidence demands you to conclude the non-existence of God.

The nature of God is to empower us and include us in the solutions of life, not do the work for us. I can understand your questioning that if he loves you, why make you wait when he knows it will destroy your faith. That is a good question. Sometimes, there are no answers. Which leaves an illogical choice to believe in something that has not proved itself true, but that is why they call it faith.

And when you go ahead and make the illogical choice to continue to believe, God honors your faith that you didn't shut the door. Then he answers. He does that to me sometimes, and I always understand why after I have gone through the test.

Remember, some of the most righteous men and women today and yesterday sought to erase Christianity's illogical faith. Those people became Christians. Men like the Apostle Paul who made it his mission to debate the church, little did he know the tables would be turned, and he would be the one being ridiculed for his faith.

Obviously, we don't need God to live this life. The question is how we want to live this life and how we want to spend eternity, if there is one.


This isn't of any relevance to what I asked or what I was saying.

God does not fail, we fail him, and sometimes we fail him by not waiting, pretending like we are immortal.

How do you get to "pretending we are immortal"? Wouldn't it be "acting like we are mortal" instead? When it comes down to the crunch I cannot wait forever - after all, I might get splatted by a bus tomorrow. How would a persons need to find god, to have a relationship with god, to even be impatient to get to know the most loving being in the universe be "failing god"? Well? Can you explain that please - how you consider trying real hard, and not wanting to wait for a decade as failing him?

But I have had long times of waiting before. Sometimes years, but not always.

Times? Surely it only happens once and then you know he exists? It would seem that you have confused the issue, (most likely my fault), and think that I was asking for a handout. That is not my nature. I merely asked to know god - for him to say "hi", and he didn't manage. You would claim that I didn't wait long enough for him to say hi, and somehow that equates as being me failing him.. I personally consider that borderline lunacy. If one cannot say hello to the most all-loving being in the universe without having to wait over a decade to get a "hi" back, there is a serious problem.

Besides, patience builds character.

The issue is not patience, and you know it.

True, you are who you are on purpose.

There you go.

Is it God who has let you down, though?

So an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, all loving being can't take 10 seconds to say hello and it instantly becomes my fault? I've somehow let him down, (as you implied earlier)? You religious types are amusing, I'll give you that.

If you are asking God, you need help with something, right?

I am not quite so shallow. I shall leave that in the hands of the devout religious folk. All I wanted was a "hello".

So, who or what has let you down?

Once again I would ask that you not try and point fingers at me. A simple hello from an all loving, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent is not asking for much is it?

I seriously don't think God has let you down, but perhaps you have let him down by shutting and locking the door on his existence

Again blaming me. Look pal, he did that all by himself.

...but what choice do you have. The evidence demands you to conclude the non-existence of God.

I have no choice. This doesn't even have to come down to demands of evidence - but as even yourself stated: "True, you are who you are on purpose."

god wants me to be an atheist. (As it states clearly in 2 Corinthians).

The nature of God is to empower us and include us in the solutions of life, not do the work for us.

No offence, but I cannot say "hello" from him for him. Only he can do that. I did not ask for solutions or wads of cash. I asked for a hello. Even the strange checkout woman at the local Tesco's can manage that much.

Sometimes, there are no answers.

That's the problem with being religious. No answers, just wild guesswork and make believe.

Which leaves an illogical choice to believe in something that has not proved itself true, but that is why they call it faith.

One cannot have faith when god has made him an atheist "on purpose", (to use your own words).

And when you go ahead and make the illogical choice to continue to believe, God honors your faith that you didn't shut the door.

Now you're just being silly. We've already agreed that I have no choice in the matter. god made me the way I am "on purpose". Nothing I can do about it.

Remember, some of the most righteous men and women today and yesterday sought to erase Christianity's illogical faith. Those people became Christians.

Remember, some of the most christian men and women in the world became non-believers. While your example is understandable, the latter isn't - and shows the complete worthlessness of faith.

If "Adam and Eve" only had two boys, "Cain" and "Abel", and if Cain killed Abel, who did Cain fuck to make more children? His mother Eve?
So? Oedipus did it. Who cares? We're all the same species anyway.

Unless they had family planning I just cannot believe that adam and eve would not have had other children - you dunce!!!!

Cain would have had numerous sisters - at the time the genetic effects of incest would not affect their offsprings because they were just one generation away from being created by GOD.


Oh how convenient for you!! How come it doesn't mention that important detail in the almighty bible? Perhaps because it was written by human beings?

Isn't genetics - and the science of genetics and genetic defects, kind of a science thing, that contradicts the bible?
OH I SEE! "God" must have CLONED "Eve" from "Adams" RIB!!! WOW!

Don't call me a dunce, I'm studing a double bachelors degree in Science at University. I don't believe there are any academic requirements to become a priest.

By the way, it was 1992 when the Vatican apoligised to Galileo, and admitted that infact, the world was ROUND after all....

Huwy catholics (at least the way it is offically taught here, including at the registed University where my mother got her Batular of education) dont belive that the earth is the center of the universe anymore or they belive that god comes through in science and that the 2 are not mutually exsulsive. That is what they have been teaching since vatican 2

adam and eve is a story told to people without the background science we have to explaine the reality to them, just like most of the other storys are metifores or have a similar purpose in explaining the unexplainable when they were written

AB,

It is only today that some mentally sick people are committing incest - a thing that was later on banned by GOD a coupole of generations after adam and eve. You cannot be serious.

I think it's possible that he may be.

AB Jadon,

It is sadly interesting that you and people like you keep on pestering me.I think you have that in reverse.

I wonder if this is just the Spiritual Law of Nature where sinners like you like to associate with Godly people like me. So, you aren’t a sinner then? Nice example of arrogance.

Thanks atheists/sinners - I am beginning to understand you better now. You just can't help yourself, you are attracted to Godly people like me because deep inside each of you, you are hurting and you feel safe around Godly people.LOL. More like a pack of hyenas who can smell weakness a mile off and are here for the kill.

Memo: atheists/sinners are scared and insecure.If you are a descendent of A &E, as you seem to believe then you must also be a sinner – doesn’t that make you scared and insecure as well according to your assertion?

Except for the Unreedemable Sinners - The Creator Loves You.Naturally – the Creator is fickle and unjust – as expected from Christian insanity.

how can you make such a statement? if there is a god, you would be claiming to know its mind. where is the basis for your claim that "god" loves anyone?

p.s. when I opened a thread for just atheist, all kinds of Christians posted, this is payback =]

What if God revealed His mind in the form of the Bible and in everyday life?

Any one know where mr 'Angelic Being' disapeared off too??

If I did, we would not be discussing this. The post that I responded to was the one that said: "To find god all you need to do is ask". I have not found god, although I have asked. As such the statement made By FreedomCry is false, and number 1 can safely be excluded.



I really did need the answer. My son had just died.



Why? Could he not have made himself known to me and told me my child was in heaven? Of course you could be right though - perhaps my son is in hell, because as god clearly states in the bible: he punishes children for the sins of their fathers. While telling me he'd done that wouldn't make me like him, it would clarify his existence.

However, regardless to any of that number 3 would again shows FreedomCry's statement as false - and that's all I was debating against.



So in other words: god wanted me to remain an atheist. Thus I am only an atheist because god wants me to be, and am doomed to hell because god wants me to be.



A) You are completely irrelevant to the discussion. You are not an "all-loving" god, and nobody made the statement that "all you have to do is ask", with regards to you. If you go back you'll see my original post was that FreedomCry's statement was wrong. It still is wrong.

However, what you're saying is that all these atheists that have at one time or another asked for god to make himself known have been refused, (because god was worried that getting to know him would be a bad thing for them), are forced into remaining as atheists - and ultimately doomed to hell because of it. I thought hell was as bad as it gets, so the excuse that god wont say 'hi' because he think's it's bad for them is seriously weak.



And he wont show himself to you at your asking either - which is what my first post was all about - to debunk FreedomCry's claim of "all you have to do is ask". It's no longer a case of just asking, indeed no - you have added all kinds of qualifying criteria to it: from waiting for a decade to somehow thinking that an eternity of hell is less "harmful" to me than god saying 'hi'.



So now asking god to come to you is testing him? This guy seemingly has a whole load of excuses for remaining non-existant. But then perhaps it's not him, but just you?

I'm sure if I had have come in this post stating how I asked for god and he came down and filled my heart with joy, you'd be telling me how awesome god is and that he loves his children and "never lets them down" and is always there for them yada yada yada - but because I said he never did, you instantly pull out your book of one million and one excuses for a non-existant deity and think it will work. Give it up.

All you've ended up doing is arguing my point that "all you have to do is ask", is wrong. We're all in agreement here, including god - who stated in the bible:

2 Corinthians 4:4
The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

As an undeniable result of that, it stands that one can only find god if god wants them to, one can only believe in jesus if gods wants them to - and man is doomed to hell if god wants them to be.I'm sorry for your loss, some people feels God reveals things to them when such a thing happen, that is not to say it happens to everyone.

Now, I don't know in what way God would reveal Himself to you, and I think that He might allready have done that. It depends on how much you really want to know and what you expect. God reveals Himself to man in many ways. God also know more about what you need than you do. I don't know you, I don't know how you handle the tragedy of your son.

I guess;
You can't do anything without God, so with Him you can find Him (that doesn't mean that you'll see Him though).


No one can see God and live.


It just sounds like excuses to you, and you think less of people that talk to you. To me it sounds you need to work on that, I wonder how you would handle Gods appearance...

Sorry. I just hope you allow yourself to feel relieved and let life continue.

God reveals Himself to man in many ways.

That makes no sense. If he did such a thing, everyone would have a different perspective of him, contrary to what he would expect of us. Why would he want everyone to disagree?

Do these commandments mean nothing?

Protestant: "Thou shalt have no other gods before me."

Catholic: "I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me."

Hebrew: "Thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth..."

God reveals Himself to man in many ways.

That makes no sense. If he did such a thing, everyone would have a different perspective of him, contrary to what he would expect of us. Why would he want everyone to disagree?

Do these commandments mean nothing?

Protestant: "Thou shalt have no other gods before me."

Catholic: "I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me."

Hebrew: "Thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth..."God knows. Thus what He does and what He see that we understand as a symbol for His appearence and His love.

God knows. Thus what He does and what He see that we understand as a symbol for His appearence and His love.

He may, but you certainly don't. And that is entirely the point.

So an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, all loving being can't take 10 seconds to say hello and it instantly becomes my fault? I've somehow let him down, (as you implied earlier)? You religious types are amusing, I'll give you that.


I'm sorry for laying blame on you, I am just going on my experience that I find out in my own impatience that God was always there and I was foolish to doubt. I'm just trying to relate my own experiences with God, so that it could help you understand at least, not the existence of God, but that your situation was not any different between you and I. I just made a different choice and became agnostic. As I recall, there was an occasion in the scripture where Gideon tested God's existence. Not tempting, but testing.
I left the door cracked because of if God is real, there is a lot at stake.


I have no choice. This doesn't even have to come down to demands of evidence - but as even yourself stated: "True, you are who you are on purpose."

god wants me to be an atheist. (As it states clearly in 2 Corinthians).

Perhaps for now God does. Perhaps God sees you as a fire-builder, but fire consumes.


That's the problem with being religious. No answers, just wild guesswork and make believe.

Problem? I see it as a strength to admit one will never have all the answers. It is also a credit to the might of God. As I said before, if I had all the answers God could not exist. Science is too hasty and often changes its conclusions due to new evidence. Science stems from philosophy of old years, and philosphy said the world was flat, then round after new evidence was discovered. In short, I cannot put my faith in my perception of the evidence.


Remember, some of the most christian men and women in the world became non-believers. While your example is understandable, the latter isn't - and shows the complete worthlessness of faith.
We can speculate the meaning: Those who leave Christianity are like I was. First, I claimed to be a Christian, then I didn't as reason entered in. Faith like that is worthless and might as well had never been. It is unchangeable and rigid like a brick, black and white, with no allowance for God to be greater than what we read about in a book.

God reveals Himself to man in many ways.

That makes no sense. If he did such a thing, everyone would have a different perspective of him, contrary to what he would expect of us.

Isn't that one of the problems of world religions?


Why would he want everyone to disagree?


It could be God's intention, or it might not be.

We are imperfect and only convinced of truth by our perception of what we experience through the senses.

There was one instance where we all did agree, or so the story goes of the Tower of Babel.

Isn't that one of the problems of world religions?

More precisely, it is one of the many problems of all religions.

It could be God's intention, or it might not be.

If it was gods intention, what purpose would a god serve if he confuses everyone and then punishes the confused? If it wasn't, why then not rectify the situation?

We are imperfect and only convinced of truth by our perception of what we experience through the senses.

Then, by your own logic, all religions must be wrong.

We may be imperfect, but wouldn't god want everyone to have a crystal clear perception of him?

Again, what is his intention, to confuse or not?

Then, by your own logic, all religions must be wrong.
I never thought of it like that, but it makes sense to me, but that does not validate that all religions worship the same God.

If all religions are wrong, then how can one teaching be the right teaching? In my agnostic years, I came to the conclusion that if one teaching is right, it would be Christianity. I support this view mostly on two facts: that the prevelant religions today were centered on one man's perceptions, and they were created at the point of a sword. I trust no one man's perception, and I am against oppression and brainwashing of tyranny. The Christian Crusades were wrong (after the first) and not as successful as the first, which was the only one that should have taken place because they were being oppressed by Isalmist states. Muhammed was a man who converted Christians nations by Jihad war. Today, I experience God, so I know that Christianity is wrong, but follows the right and one god. So, yes, all religions are wrong, but Christianity and Judaism follow the right god. The others know that there is a God, but are blinded by their perception. My own perception is wrong, but it is in the process of clearing every day I live.


We may be imperfect, but wouldn't god want everyone to have a crystal clear perception of him?

Again, what is his intention, to confuse or not?
I cannot presume to know God's intention, but I can speculate, because he is my friend, that he does want everyone to have a clear perception but we get in the way and muddle things up because we have free will. We want the Bible to say this, so that we can understand it. We want to worship like this, because we like it that way. God says this so you are wrong. Our desires distort our perception of God. We Christians need to back off and just let God be greater than our imagination.

We Christians need to back off and just let God be greater than our imagination.
You Christians are better than others, aren't you?

You Christians are better than others, aren't you?

No, I'm afraid we have the potential to be the worst, that is why I am criticizing the Christian religion, not God.

When it comes to morality, we are exactly the same as non-Christians. The only difference in us is Christ who sustains us, but we are held to a higher standard and will face a worse punishment if we screw up, scripture says so. God despises the hypocritical Christian, and it angers him. It would be better to have not been a Christian.

Oh...

If all religions are wrong, then how can one teaching be the right teaching?

There are two answers to that.

All religions are wrong and manmade.
Only one religion is right.

The first answer is self-evident, but the second requires that each person would had to have god revealed to them, and without them talking to one another, be able to explain their view of god in detail. Each explanation would have to be identical in order for that religion to have credibility.

Further to that, everyone in the world would also have to agree.

Which of the two answers is more plausible?

Our desires distort our perception of God.

Would your desires distort your perception of an apple? Can we both agree an apple is an apple if one were revealed to us?

If all religions are wrong, then how can one teaching be the right teaching?

There are two answers to that.

All religions are wrong and manmade.
Only one religion is right.

I agree, I have proposed support for this opinion in my previous response that only one religion is right.


The first answer is self-evident, but the second requires that each person would had to have god revealed to them, and without them talking to one another, be able to explain their view of god in detail. Each explanation would have to be identical in order for that religion to have credibility.

We have several accounts recorded in the Bible, so does that mean it is credible?


Further to that, everyone in the world would also have to agree.

Why? If God was known to all, free will would cease to exist as we would have no choice, but to believe in God.


Our desires distort our perception of God.

Would your desires distort your perception of an apple? Can we both agree an apple is an apple if one were revealed to us?

Yes, but what if you saw the stem, and I saw the color?

Now, I don't know in what way God would reveal Himself to you, and I think that He might allready have done that.

You know, if you took the time to actually read my posts to you, you'd realise we've already been through this and I've already given you the answer:

There have been no answers given by any gods. If there had have been we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Now, you can say 'he might have', as many times as you like - it doesn't in any way change the reality of the situation.

You can't do anything without God

Let's be accurate about this: You can't do anything without gods, I can.

No one can see God and live.

What that means is: Nobody has seen god. As such nobody has the justification to even say one exists. As a result of that, saying one exists, humans can't do anything without it etc etc is an excercise in stupidity.

It just sounds like excuses to you, and you think less of people that talk to you. To me it sounds you need to work on that

Let's quickly go back to something you said earlier in your response:

"I don't know you".

You were right the first time - you don't know me. Kindly stop trying to pretend that you do. Not only is it wrong, it's also rude.

I wonder how you would handle Gods appearance...

Given your earlier statement it can only be stated that I would die, as would you and as would everyone else. Duh, do you even pay attention to your own statements?

Sorry. I just hope you allow yourself to feel relieved and let life continue.

Really? Oh I'm so glad you've helped me. Lol.

I'm sorry for laying blame on you, I am just going on my experience that I find out in my own impatience that God was always there and I was foolish to doubt. I'm just trying to relate my own experiences with God, so that it could help you understand at least, not the existence of God, but that your situation was not any different between you and I.

Our situations were different.

I just made a different choice and became agnostic.

Became? So you were religious to begin with? Dude, I've always been an atheist.

As I recall, there was an occasion in the scripture where Gideon tested God's existence. Not tempting, but testing.

Good for him. I can only say that if god doesn't want to be tested he shouldn't have made humans with the express nature to test things. That's idiocy.

I left the door cracked because of if God is real, there is a lot at stake.

Ah, a 'coward christian'. I consider them worse than the standard christians because they have no self respect.

Perhaps God sees you as a fire-builder, but fire consumes.

Then 'perhaps', if he has a problem with it, he souldn't have fucking made me that way.

Problem? I see it as a strength to admit one will never have all the answers.

And a serious weakness to then say: "the clouds are alive!". You've never seen this or any other god, you're going on the word of people you've never met and will never know that lived several thousand years ago and thought the world was a pancake - only because you don't have any self respect whatsoever. You're afraid that if you're wrong the very same being you believe in will send you to an eternal lake of fire, and through that fear you place your belief in him and pretend to the world that you actually love this being that has got you so scared you must believe in him just incase it's true.

It's truly sickening.

It is also a credit to the might of God.

No, it's a lack of credit to the might of your brain.

Science is too hasty and often changes its conclusions due to new evidence.

Dude, you religious nuts change your conclusions with every sentence you write. Don't think for one nanosecond that your cloud fairy beliefs can even begin to stand up against science. I know you wish it could, but the fact is it can't. It is because of science that you're even alive.

I cannot put my faith in my perception of the evidence.

So with overwhelming stupidity you put your 'faith' in your perception of a total lack of evidence.

I pity you, truly.

We can speculate the meaning: Those who leave Christianity are like I was. First, I claimed to be a Christian, then I didn't as reason entered in. Faith like that is worthless and might as well had never been.

At the time they would have sworn blind that they have a relationship with this being and so on. At the end of the day you're all like this. You haven't seen, heard or had a relationship with shit other than a malfunctioning part of your brain. When you 'see the light', god slips down the toilet bowl.

I agree, I have proposed support for this opinion in my previous response that only one religion is right.

Would you not entertain the first answer, not even a little?

We have several accounts recorded in the Bible, so does that mean it is credible?

It would be if all were able to duplicate those accounts without reading the bible.

I think it better to not include the bible, since god should be in everyones mind. Why would we need someone elses accounts, they are but only several views?

If God was known to all, free will would cease to exist as we would have no choice, but to believe in God.

Not really, if god was in all mens minds, and that knowledge came from god, we would still have the free will to reject it.

Yes, but what if you saw the stem, and I saw the color?

Funny. But I meant the entire apple, as god would want himself revealed.

The key here jay, is that most theists assume their concepts of god based on what they want from religion. I wouldn't advocate that at all because it is egotistical.

If gods message was to know him, he would reveal himself to all equally and unequivocally, and then allow each person to decide to accept him. There would be no question in anyones mind who or what god was and whether he existed or not. The choice then, would be ours to make.

That, imho, would be his intent.

Cain would have had numerous sisters

Where in the bible does it state that? Or did you just make that one up yourself?

Did you forget about the Land of Nod?

No I did not.

Nod means the land to the East - Dunce!!!

AB, you are the dunce.

Another good example how you throw out assertions, but cannot back them up with any facts. Please prove that at one time incest was acceptable and did not lead to genetic deformities. Simply stating that it was because Adam's children were only one generation from being created by god means nothing.

Incest as meant in The Holy Scriptures mainly referred to brother and sister sexual relations - it was described back then as an abhorent act.

After a couple of generations the ' earth was filled with multitudes of people' - this would be in a span of 1000 years after the creation of Adam and Eve.

When The Creator was certain that there had become enough genetic diversity, HE then gave instructions for the banning from then on the union of a brother and sister.

If you were to believe that Adam lived for 960 years and that subsequent generations after him lived up to 500 years and more, then you have to admit that these ones had a genetic structure that was less contaminated with faults as we have today - the reason for the average life span today being less then 80 years.

Thank You.

Ha! Stupid, weak minded, idiotic, brain dead, blathering moron. So genetics are the only reason not to have incest? What about brothers/sisters, fathers/daughters who have vasectomies or tubal ligations? Is it ok then? Also, genetic diversity of parents helps to mediate the effects of inbreeding (whis is less dangerous than you think. Do some research.)

The first generations "close to god" would have been genetically pure and would have resulted in horrible mutations. So, god condones incest. Cool.

Stop your rambling - you really have an overactive imagination!!!

You did not get my point - Alas!!!!!

Nod means the land to the East - Dunce!!!

Wrong. "Nod" is the Hebrew root to the verb to wander.

Cain was cursed to 'wander,' not exiled to the 'land of the wanderers.'

Should I call you the dunce?

If I did, we would not be discussing this. The post that I responded to was the one that said: "To find god all you need to do is ask". I have not found god, although I have asked. As such the statement made By FreedomCry is false, and number 1 can safely be excluded.



I really did need the answer. My son had just died.



Why? Could he not have made himself known to me and told me my child was in heaven? Of course you could be right though - perhaps my son is in hell, because as god clearly states in the bible: he punishes children for the sins of their fathers. While telling me he'd done that wouldn't make me like him, it would clarify his existence.

However, regardless to any of that number 3 would again shows FreedomCry's statement as false - and that's all I was debating against.



So in other words: god wanted me to remain an atheist. Thus I am only an atheist because god wants me to be, and am doomed to hell because god wants me to be.



A) You are completely irrelevant to the discussion. You are not an "all-loving" god, and nobody made the statement that "all you have to do is ask", with regards to you. If you go back you'll see my original post was that FreedomCry's statement was wrong. It still is wrong.

However, what you're saying is that all these atheists that have at one time or another asked for god to make himself known have been refused, (because god was worried that getting to know him would be a bad thing for them), are forced into remaining as atheists - and ultimately doomed to hell because of it. I thought hell was as bad as it gets, so the excuse that god wont say 'hi' because he think's it's bad for them is seriously weak.



And he wont show himself to you at your asking either - which is what my first post was all about - to debunk FreedomCry's claim of "all you have to do is ask". It's no longer a case of just asking, indeed no - you have added all kinds of qualifying criteria to it: from waiting for a decade to somehow thinking that an eternity of hell is less "harmful" to me than god saying 'hi'.



So now asking god to come to you is testing him? This guy seemingly has a whole load of excuses for remaining non-existant. But then perhaps it's not him, but just you?

I'm sure if I had have come in this post stating how I asked for god and he came down and filled my heart with joy, you'd be telling me how awesome god is and that he loves his children and "never lets them down" and is always there for them yada yada yada - but because I said he never did, you instantly pull out your book of one million and one excuses for a non-existant deity and think it will work. Give it up.

All you've ended up doing is arguing my point that "all you have to do is ask", is wrong. We're all in agreement here, including god - who stated in the bible:

2 Corinthians 4:4
The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

As an undeniable result of that, it stands that one can only find god if god wants them to, one can only believe in jesus if gods wants them to - and man is doomed to hell if god wants them to be.

If you are telling the truth then YOUR UNBELIEF WILL MAKE YOU NOT SEE YOUR SON.

When The Creator was certain that there had become enough genetic diversity, HE then gave instructions for the banning from then on the union of a brother and sister.

I would ask why he didn't just make more than 2 people and avoid the whole problem in the first place? This god of yours certainly seems limited.

If you were to believe that Adam lived for 960 years and that subsequent generations after him lived up to 500 years and more, then you have to admit that these ones had a genetic structure that was less contaminated with faults as we have today - the reason for the average life span today being less then 80 years.

I love how you religious fundies switch whenever it suits you. The reason for the life span of today is because god got pissed at humans. Don't you even read the bible?

Oh how convenient for you!! How come it doesn't mention that important detail in the almighty bible? Perhaps because it was written by human beings?

Isn't genetics - and the science of genetics and genetic defects, kind of a science thing, that contradicts the bible?
OH I SEE! "God" must have CLONED "Eve" from "Adams" RIB!!! WOW!

Don't call me a dunce, I'm studing a double bachelors degree in Science at University. I don't believe there are any academic requirements to become a priest.

By the way, it was 1992 when the Vatican apoligised to Galileo, and admitted that infact, the world was ROUND after all....

So?, whats your point? - the Vatican was always wrong on that issue. The prophet Job had declared clearly that the earth was round 3000 years ago.

AB Jadon,

I think you have that in reverse.

So, you aren’t a sinner then? Nice example of arrogance.

LOL. More like a pack of hyenas who can smell weakness a mile off and are here for the kill.

If you are a descendent of A &E, as you seem to believe then you must also be a sinner – doesn’t that make you scared and insecure as well according to your assertion?

Naturally – the Creator is fickle and unjust – as expected from Christian insanity.

I suppose a pack of hyenas would do damage to a LION? - standard description of Christians in The Holy Scriptures.

You Dunce.!!!

If you are telling the truth then YOUR UNBELIEF WILL MAKE YOU NOT SEE YOUR SON.

He's dead, dickhead. It's a fact of life that you might come to understand when you've grown up.

However, as you obviously missed it the first time: I do not have a choice in the matter - so sayeth god:

2 Corinthians 4:4
The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

I am an unbeliever because god wants me to be - because he has blinded me. Instead of thinking you're making a point by typing in caps, how about you switch your brain on and then try a proper response? If you cannot manage that then I would ask that you not bother talking to me. I hate to say it but I do not have the energy to waste time arguing with mental deficients.

You Christians are better than others, aren't you?


Hello??????!!!!!!!!!!!

No, I'm afraid we have the potential to be the worst, that is why I am criticizing the Christian religion, not God.

When it comes to morality, we are exactly the same as non-Christians. The only difference in us is Christ who sustains us, but we are held to a higher standard and will face a worse punishment if we screw up, scripture says so. God despises the hypocritical Christian, and it angers him. It would be better to have not been a Christian.

Correct, but the punishment is death or 'cutting off' from the Ressurection.

sounds acceptable to me.

Nod means the land to the East - Dunce!!!

Wrong. "Nod" is the Hebrew root to the verb to wander.

Cain was cursed to 'wander,' not exiled to the 'land of the wanderers.'

Should I call you the dunce?

Arent we talking about the same thing? If he wandered he would be wandering to the east obviously.

Whatever, the thing is that his descendeants would be wiped out in the Great Flood if there were any around and I doubt that there would have been any good descendants of his.

Thank you.

I would ask why he didn't just make more than 2 people and avoid the whole problem in the first place? This god of yours certainly seems limited.


Actually, I sometimes wish that adam and eve been removed and for a new begining to happen.

But the thing is - Who am I to want to suggest an alternative to The Creator?

And if The Creator had done what I said above - dot you think that the devil would have won the debate?

Oh, and it is only you that is limited.

Thank you.

Arent we talking about the same thing?

Obviously not.

If he wandered he would be wandering to the east obviously.

No, its not obvious. He could have gone north, south or west. It just happened to be east.

What is obvious thoug