I'm not to sure that I should post under this catagory but there doesn't seem to be a correct one at this time of morning (call it lack of caffine).

After rolling the Mars Global Surveyor 25º to get a good shot, new photos have been taken of the “face” mountain on Mars. The new photo is sharper than the original which was taken while looking for possible landing sites. Due to the bad conditions while taking the photo, winter, obscuring clouds, bad angle of sight, ect. The total came up to look like a face.

Old Viking 1 photos:

http://www.space.com/images/h_marsface_compare_010525_02.jpg

New photo of face
http://www.space.com/images/h_marsface_april2001_010525_02.jpg

It looks like a blown up cake to me :)

another example that all those stories of aliens and live on Mars finally appear to be false....

We never had contact with any extraterrestrial life-form!!!!!
(just needed to note that)

If you go Here (http://www.metaresearch.org/solar%20system/cydonia/asom/artifact_html/default.htm)

they have som pretty convinceing evidence of other structues on mars

just a quick note when i look at the 3 photos>
it looks like someone shot it with a missile just before the 98 photo :D
does anyone know what the white stuff is?

groove on all :)

How can you not believe when the truth is slapping you in the face! Additional evidence of intelligent life was collected in 1999 when mapping photos revealed:

http://www.vvm.com/~rsadler/coverarchive/imagescover/hapface.jpg

The Smiley Face!

Hey,
I like that!

I think we see what we want to see.
We would like intelligent life to be extraterrestrial. BUT we need not look at Mars to find it... ;)
Here is the butterfly alphabet
http://www.butterflyalphabet.com/images/bigpostermain.jpg

I learned about this alphabet when I was studying Biology. The introductory textbook by Keeton & Gould ("Biological Sciences", 5th edition, 1993) showed its title in these letters on the cover.

To my great surprise some people thought this is proof that God invented the alphabet long before 'we' did.
At least I had a laugh out of it.

What an unusal alphabet. It's rather nice. I wonder if I can set it into my fonts?

Controversy continues to mount surrounding the Face.

The first image is the raw data returned from The Mars Global Surveyor (MGS) spacecraft. Public opinion as to origins run the spectrum from "mere coincidence" to "religious fervor".

http://home.earthlink.net/~bartonmg/images/smiley.gif


The following image, subject to meticulous digital enhancement by NASA's most powerful computers seems to remove all doubt...


http://home.earthlink.net/~bartonmg/images/smileyen.gif

You be the judge.

:D
I am a believer now!

oh dear god !!!
the seventies have invaded mars !!!

Keep looking, there's bound to be a disco joint in there somewhere!

hey all :)

DIDNT YOU ALL REALISE that the WHOLE concept of
EXTRA-TERESTRIALS and GOD
were made up to stop all the
NICE people from killing all the NASTY people. :)

@_@
\vvv/


groove on all :)

If you look closely at the recent photo, you will see the face of a cat. Martians are CAT people.....

One interesting feature is that the mountain looks like rectangular in shape with perfect straight lines. If so, does that mean it was a pyramid - some 250 million years ago?

Nice to speculate. Even if there could be a very advanced civilization in Mars, say 250 million years ago, no man made advanced technology will survive that long with the collision of a large astoroid similar to the one that wiped 95% of life in Cambrian period....

More importantly, what can we do if we find out that an Extinction Level Event is about to occur say 50 years from now here? and that life will come back to normal in 50 million years? Can we leave a computer running deep sea for that long? Any MTBF experts here?

In a span of 250 million years, nothing man made (except for maybe twinkes) would survive. Only stone, fossilized or other would have a chance and that would need to be buried to prevent erosion. Any idea how hard it is for archeologists to make sense out of what they find that are only a few thousand/s years old? Such finds are usually incomplete, of poor detail, and require a lot of thought on what it might be or how it got there.

As for a asteroid terminal event, (or whatever you would call such) what was at ground zero, so to say, would be vaporized and gone. No trace. Whatever else might be on the planet elsewhere after such a period of time would probably be gone. Worn down to nothing. I doubt that even the pyramids would survive such a long span if you take in to account the weathering from our atmosphere. Nice speculation though. I seriously doubt that any kind of mechanical device stands any chance of surviving even a few hundred years in working order.

That is exactly my point. However, some advanced alien civilization can build a machine to stay 2 miles underground or the sea floor and be the guardian of their knowledgebase that they hope a new and intelligent life form will find after they are gone.

I am working on a project to collect the present knowlegebase to set in a time capsule. Presently they are set to written works and passive devices. I am still at a loss to find an active device that can be maintained in a nitrogen filled capsule for a very long time.

Hypothetically speaking lets say the Earth had no life on it and Mars did. Say last year the Martians sent a probe to map the Earth's surface. Lets also assume that the Martians look like snakes. (I know this sounds far out, but stick w/me) When the probe's data comes back they see the Grand Canyon. Being snakes, and the Canyon being a huge long winding structures maybe some of the aliens would think that the Canyon was dug out by an ancient civilization to resemble themselves, and so that others may know that they once lived there.

Sound stupid? Yeah, so does the notion that ancient Martians had humanoid faces to begin with, that they existed, or that they would spend considerable time on the galaxy's biggest sand castle.

Just because all traces of civilization is gone does not mean there was none in say 50 million years ago. Now suppose there was, how can we find them, like dinosaurs?

I thoght you are watching the game....

There are only 2 ways that I can think of...



To put something in space and surround it with and asteroid and then make something about it odd so that it would be recognized.

To modify the genetic coding in life in some unusal way and hope it survived that long.



Either way is slim. Other than that not a clue. But if they existed and no trace could be found then it wouldn't matter. The universe and your world would be as you now know it. Nothing else.

Good point wet1, if we take your ideas further, here is what I propose.

Manipulate the ant gene or whichever can survive millions of years with the asteroid bombardment, to create their habitat in a mathematical precision such that when we know how to do it, we can instantly recognize the pattern. We could encode in the pattern something like "Killroy was here"

Thanks for helping generate the idea. Now if we can patent it....

As a matter of fact I did watch the All Star game, (GO A.L.!) it started at eight, and there was a good 15 minutes of junk before the game itself started.

Until I find artifacts or fossil evidence, than there will be no believe in my mind that there wasn't or is any Martian civilization. Single-celled life is much, much more likely.

Hi all,

I realize I'm coming to this thread a little late but I just thought of something. If you buried something to protect it or kept it on the sea floor (same reason) wouldn't plate techtonics eventually destroy it just as thoroughly as erosion, asteroid impacts, etc?

Now, I realize that mars has no movement in it's crust but don't you think that it would have had a more fluid crust at one time in order to support oceans and life? Can you have a stable, unchanging planet surface and develop the rudiments of life?

Just some thoughts.

Shadow

kmguru,

I really like your idea for posterity but wouldn't the cockroach be more suitable? They (whoever "they" are) say that roaches would not have trouble surviving nukes.


Shadow

Yes Shadow,
Something like that. What I would like to see in these boards is to push our imaginations, think out of the box. We can easily dismiss to that Mars is barren, venus is dead. But in a cosmic scale say during our cambric period if life elsewhere in our solar system did develop. Or even before say 500 million years ago?

Of course that will require understanding of level of solar energy, magnetic field of the planets etc and any new data that NASA has gathered so far.

I think Sciforum will be an excellent place to think ahead say 2 to 5 years if not more, before it becomes general knowledge. Two years ago I did some research into PCOS syndrome for someone dear to me, I came to a certain conclusion for which no cure was available then. Today my conclusion is widely used as a treatment program. So, yes we can stay ahead of the game.

Otherwise it is no fun....

Something else I happened to think of, it's roaches adaptability that allows them to survive everything so any genetic modifications may actually rapidly change over a short time span to the point of being unrecognizable, not noteworthy. Maybe we would need a more stable type of life. Ants probably would be better.


Shadow

Now that you mentioned it. We have fireants in our yard. They do not have any natural predators. So it is very difficult to get rid of them. I have to use pesticide (I do not like to) to control the growth.

I do not like to use pesticides or herbicides. One of our friend who constantly used it died of liver cancer at a very young age. That is another thread.

Back to ants. If as a society we know we are doomed, I am sure we will come up with something for posterity. Also I believe our destiny is out there among stars too. As I wrote in one of these columns, we will contact aliens in about 100 years. They will be slightly less developed than us (that is good for our moral). Do not ask me how I know. Nothing esoteric.

Over the span of time that we have discussed there would certainly come a predator into the fire ant nich. So much unchallenged food does not remain as unchallenged without good reason. And when there is a good reason it just takes a little longer for the nich to fill. But fill it does. There are very few life forms on the planet that does not have a predator of some kind.

Michrondia DNA seems to last the longest unchanged. At least that I have heard. And it would seem like we could insert snippets with ususal code or prehaps a message that when finally figured out takes the reader step by step from one conclusion to the next. Maybe at the end of the message is the location of the asteroid. A passing thought...

Good thought. The only thing I can add is that if we are manipulating the ant genome, we could give them some adaptability so that they will find a way to survive.

Are we the result of that adaptability? Hummm...

Or will there be a superior predator coming after us?? Is AIDs one of them?

Are we the result of that adaptability?

So you refer to the seeding postulation? Or prehaps to the idea of alien visitors with (to our viewpoint) "good intentions"? Or prehaps that some previous advanced early civilization with a need to help themselves out?


Or will there be a superior predator coming after us?? Is AIDs one of them?

I not sure that a predator, previously unknown would be required. We already have predators, however unsuccessful in the long term, of the species. Be it bug or fauna. To the negetive side, it may well be that some heitherto unknown virus/bacteria has come down the ages with us. Maybe we have mutated to some degree and lessened/elimanated the threat. Maybe the bug has. Pure speculation....

hey all :)
cool debate !/topic of discussion
its nice to c a parabolic emotional flux :D
within the realms of even temperd communication :D

i have heard that scorpians and cockroaches were found alive in the blast zone of nukes-thus not affected by the rads.
and-maybe a point of more philosophy but AIDS would not be a preditor if we were not around and some people are immune anyway.
soo maybe that gives strength to the addaptive theory of life?
or continuosely cyclecal random variation :D
i think it is time we looked at segrigating scientist from the tax base society so they can concentrate on their work...(or maybe area 51 "was" filling the gap?)
:)

we could use the gravitational feild of the sun to regulate the solar orbit of a message in binairy code. ?

groove on all :)

I question whether the scorpions and cockroaches came away unscathed from the raditation. Prehaps this generation but sooner or later it would have to have an effect. It would seem to me to be a driver for mutation that would indeed show up. Maybe we didn't stay around in the hotspot long enough to witness such a change?

Anyone else have thoughts on this?

I agree,

Receiving such a massive dose of radiation has to have scrambled some of the DNA, to what effect though...

Something that should be checked out. It would make interesting study to see the effects over multiple generations, especially considering how short a generation span is for a roach.

Shadow

The lethal dose of radiation has been tried from fruitflies to roaches to a host of species. Detail results are probably classified.

What if a benign virus in one of the species mutates to AIDs? There was some study in Japan after the Bomb. It was found that those who were at the ground zero vaporized but farther out some survived with minimal damage. Conclusion was that the DNA was able to repair the cell damage to a workable state and offsprings showed no sign of damage.

Hi all,

I know this post does not belong here, I've travelled this site far and wide, but I must say - I'm so glad I found you. I've been living in NC for 10 years and my brain has about atrophied. Most of what I hear here has to do with God or barbecue. It's great to finally come upon some intelligent, outspoken people with widely based opinions and great discussion material. Thanks.

Shadow

Hellow Shadow:

We will make an exception here for you. Life is too short to do otherwise. Welcome.

You will find that we debate, post our opinions without a knock down dragout fight. A good cebral intelligent discourse is more stimulating than WWF championship. Remember it is the brain that produces the endorphins and adrenalin.

Once you get into that groove you will be rocking again.....

Indeed welcome shadow. If you would care to join in we will happily drag up an extra chair. Or for others for that matter. I would think the more the merrier.

So we are to think that once outside of a certain dosage limit that lower forms will regenerate or self-repair? It's a shame that we higher life forms do not enjoy the same capability. What say you to the advancement stage of medically assisted regeneration? Any predictions in relation to when we might see such as everyday?

...and while I am at it, several times kmguru, you have brought in the topic of Aids being a preditator of the species (in thought of Merlijn). Though we have not expanded on it. The topic seems ripe with possibilities.

Also shadow and some other posters have had some pretty good ideas bounced in. I would love to hear some expansion on them.