Were the X-Files right? Does the government perform tests on us for the sake of the military? The first recorded case of this was in 2000, so it's recent.

ROOSEVELT PARK, MICH. -- Liam Hoekstra was hanging upside down by his feet when he performed an inverted sit-up, his shirt falling away to expose rippled abdominal muscles.

It was a display of raw power one might expect to see from an Olympic gymnast.

Liam is 19 months old. But this precocious, 22-pound boy with coffee-coloured skin, curly hair and washboard abs is far from a typical toddler.

"He could do the iron cross when he was five months old," said his adoptive mother, Dana Hoekstra of Roosevelt Park. She was referring to a difficult gymnastics move in which a male athlete suspends himself by his arms between two hanging rings, forming the shape of a cross.

"I would hold him up by his hands and he would lift himself into an iron cross. That's when we were like, 'Whoa, this is weird,' " Ms. Hoekstra said.

Liam has a rare genetic condition called myostatin-related muscle hypertrophy, or muscle enlargement. The condition promotes above-normal growth of the skeletal muscles; it doesn't affect the heart and has no known negative side effects, according to experts.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070530.STRONGMAN30/TPStory/?query=muscle

Interesting. What have these people been like when they've grown up? I'm curious as to the quality of the muscle since there are so many variations. Such as, does it build more fast twitch fibers or slow twitch?

Well the oldest one right now is seven, as the first recorded case was in 2000. So I imagine we're not certain what happens to these children when they grow up. But damn curious.

It sounds like the child has a series of other health problems... If we could reproduce this, it sounds like the caloric needs are so high that it would be difficult to sustain in a combat.

But I have to admit, a real "Bam Bam" is interesting.

thats why the us government used lsd to try and create super soildiers. i wonder if it worked?

thats why the us government used lsd to try and create super soildiers. i wonder if it worked?

No it didn't, too unpredictable in its results. And it wasn't to create "super soldiers", it was attempt to (among other things, most of them particularly unfounded) find a "perfect truth drug".

I knew a guy with this, he had HUGE calves, HUGE DELTS, etc. never worked out a day in his life, in fact he tried once and couldn't. He was a total BRAIN, he is now a chemist for DOW Chemical I think...

If you surprised him or tried an "i made ya flinch" move on him, his eyes would blink for like an hour uncontrollably. It's not without disadvantage...

According to the research I've found (which I will link soon) on this condition, there are few physical downsides besides the constant need for calories. And yes, that is a huge bummer.

Hmm, that sounds pretty interesting, please do link the research youv'e found.

This might have made the ultimate soldier about a thousand years ago, but even a really strong guy will fall over dead when hit by a rifle bullet. Combat effectiveness isn't closely tied to physical strength any more. I'm sure it would be helpful if soldiers could carry more gear in the field, but it certainly doesn't seem likely that the government would make any special effort to breed super-strong soldiers. Most likely they would spend the money on trying to make a better tank, or slightly faster jet, or almost anything else.

Hm, well the government does try to make "super soldiers" at Darpa. Even today it would be an incredible advantage to have soldiers with very superior physicality. DARPA usually doesn't give out interviews, so I heard, but playboy magazine worked for years and years and finally got a small one, about this subject. They had a whole editorial about human modification. Anyway at DARPA they said their model was Lance Armstrong.

a thread dedicated to me, how expected.

peace.

I knew a guy with this, he had HUGE calves, HUGE DELTS, etc. never worked out a day in his life, in fact he tried once and couldn't. He was a total BRAIN, he is now a chemist for DOW Chemical I think...

If you surprised him or tried an "i made ya flinch" move on him, his eyes would blink for like an hour uncontrollably. It's not without disadvantage...

Why do you suppose his eyes would blink? I see no reason to presume it is related. The brain is a muscle indeed. If you force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once, you can actually feel the muscles in your brain clenching. I once tried and was afraid that a blood vessel would burst.

If you force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once, you can actually feel the muscles in your brain clenching. I once tried and was afraid that a blood vessel would burst.

:roflmao:

Hm, well the government does try to make "super soldiers" at Darpa. Even today it would be an incredible advantage to have soldiers with very superior physicality. DARPA usually doesn't give out interviews, so I heard, but playboy magazine worked for years and years and finally got a small one, about this subject. They had a whole editorial about human modification. Anyway at DARPA they said their model was Lance Armstrong.

DARPA considers muscle enhancing outfits as opposed to genetic alteration. I would agree that that is better.

:roflmao:

You don't believe it's possible?

You don't believe it's possible?

Muscles clenching in the brain?
Blood vessel rupture from "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once".
:rolleyes:

Dude, it is a well known fact.

Sorry guys, I'm in the middle of moving houses, so I won't have time to hook up all that research. But in case no one noticed; the ultimate soldier thing was more a joke. I've just been watching x-files a lot and thought that was a funny way to introduce the story.

Were the X-Files right? Does the government perform tests on us for the sake of the military? The first recorded case of this was in 2000, so it's recent.The “ultimate soldier”?

A dumb, ignorant, buffoon, willing to do anything in the service of the herd and brought up in fanaticism and the glorification of violence and pseudo-machismo.

In other words an American.

lmao at that comment, what a gem

DARPA is our best glimmer of hope when it comes to defence. Their creation of Arpanet was genius (this of course lead later to the internet). It was a response to the Russians not being well-liked for their hastiness in the arms race.
It is not surprising that America, a nation of great diligents, could allow this travesty. The grand experiment has been ahead at everything throughout the last 2 centuries.

A good soldier would be have to be physically adequate to the task but the main ceiling is mental. The intellect and will to control the physical body is what determines what that body can do. Its like software and hardware. Without one the other is useless. The hardware requirements for soldiering are usually minimal. The software ones can be quite high. Knowing what to do in combat when the shit hits the fan is what determines the outcomes of battles. If you read about heroes like Audy Murphy you will find healthy guys who did the right thing at the right time and were lucky enough that it worked out well for them. Weapons, armor, and strenght help but willpower and brains will usually prevail. If you look at the guerilla warfare that brought communism into China, got the US kicked out of Vietnam, and got the British kicked out of the US you can find evidence of this.

Audie Murphy is an excellent example of what you just said yes. He was turned down for the Marines and Paratroopers (too small).

There are numberous highly decorated people that lied in order to be accepted in fighting ranks. You simply cannot come up and design the "perfect soldier".

Dude, it is a well known fact.
What is?
That you have muscles clenching in the brain? That you can feel clenching?
Or that blood vessel rupture from "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once". And just how do you "force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once"?

DARPA is our best glimmer of hope when it comes to defence.
DARPA is just one organistion out of many, even if you consider only the USA.
Their creation of Arpanet was genius (this of course lead later to the internet).
No mention of Europe and CERN?
The grand experiment has been ahead at everything throughout the last 2 centuries.
In which fields?

A good soldier would be have to be physically adequate to the task but the main ceiling is mental. The intellect and will to control the physical body is what determines what that body can do.
But warfare is about team interaction and abilities. Hence the concentration on improved intra- and inter-team communications and improved situational awareness.
The hardware requirements for soldiering are usually minimal.
So why do militaries spend most of their research budgets on improving hardware?
Knowing what to do in combat when the shit hits the fan is what determines the outcomes of battles.
Knowing what to do when the shit hits the fan determines the outcome in any part of life. Some people just function better than others in combat.
Weapons, armor, and strenght help but willpower and brains will usually prevail. If you look at the guerilla warfare that brought communism into China, got the US kicked out of Vietnam, and got the British kicked out of the US you can find evidence of this.
Of course you can find the evidence. If you ignore everything else. Political will, other interests, alliances, logistics, supply chain length etc. etc.

What is?
That you have muscles clenching in the brain? That you can feel clenching?
Or that blood vessel rupture from "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once". And just how do you "force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once"?

Concentrated mental energy that causes you to lose focus of everything else. I have found that to sustain that for an excessive period of time requires the brain muscles to exert themselves. Practice helps.

DARPA is just one organistion out of many, even if you consider only the USA.

No mention of Europe and CERN?

Well as this thread is about ultimate soldiers it seemed only fitting to bbring to bare what I heard to be the nation's leading experts in super soldier projects. It is neither a claim to authority nor a testiment to the expertise of others.

In which fields?

For a fairly new country, it is fairly safe to grant that the US is home to a relatively large number of scientific minds. In addition, they clearly flock their after being recognized. Compare the relatively extensive history of Britain to that of America, now consider the number of scientific accomplishments. Of course, America has inventors like Thomas Edison. Watson of Watson and Crick. A farily admirable line of scientists which deserves some acknowledgement.
On the other hand, when it comes to Literature we may spot a few - Robert Frost, John Kenneth Galbraith, Mark Twain, Dr. Seuss.

he would have been when we fought with swords but how can he stand up to a bullet?

Concentrated mental energy that causes you to lose focus of everything else.
This is "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once"? Maybe you just never tried before. And this ruptures blood vessels?
To paraphrase Neal Stephenson, I bet you have a special expression on your face when you think, just indicate that you're thinking. Why should you need a special expression for something that should be done all the time?
"Mental energy"? Pffft. Spurious crap.
I have found that to sustain that for an excessive period of time requires the brain muscles to exert themselves. Practice helps.
Intelligence helps. There are no "muscles in the brain".
Well as this thread is about ultimate soldiers it seemed only fitting to bbring to bare what I heard to be the nation's leading experts in super soldier projects. It is neither a claim to authority nor a testiment to the expertise of others.
So you're quoting others (without credit) and cherry-picking amongst facts so that you ignore reality?
For a fairly new country, it is fairly safe to grant that the US is home to a relatively large number of scientific minds.
That's granted, but the statement being queried was:
The grand experiment has been ahead at everything throughout the last 2 centuries.
So why did/ does the USA get so many innovations from elsewhere? Especially military ones? Bigger budgets in the US are one factor for the lead, but "ahead of everything else for two centuries" is neither factual nor truthful.
Compare the relatively extensive history of Britain to that of America, now consider the number of scientific accomplishments.
When did the scientific revolution start? The "relatively extensive history of Britain" is largely irrelevant since science qua science didn't start that long ago.
Of course, America has inventors like Thomas Edison. Watson of Watson and Crick. A farily admirable line of scientists which deserves some acknowledgement.
On the other hand, when it comes to Literature we may spot a few - Robert Frost, John Kenneth Galbraith, Mark Twain, Dr. Seuss.
Acknowledgement certainly, but pre-eminence? If you want to get into name-listing go ahead, but I'll give you credit for being able to find European or even just English authors (or scientists) to match each and every one you've named for stature or reputation.

What is?
That you have muscles clenching in the brain? That you can feel clenching?
Or that blood vessel rupture from "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once". And just how do you "force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once"?

Forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once.

When I say dude that is my way of being sarcastic online :p

The “ultimate soldier”?

A dumb, ignorant, buffoon, willing to do anything in the service of the herd and brought up in fanaticism and the glorification of violence and pseudo-machismo.

In other words an American.

LOL i was done reading the first paragraph and i thought to myself that i will reply to this post with, "what you mean an american?"

damn you :) now i dont have a witty retort.

peace.

Forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once.
So how do you know what your previous capacity was? And how come you haven't pushed your limits before? What is your capacity? What methods do you use to get the information in?

When I say dude that is my way of being sarcastic online :p
You ain't met MY methods of being sarcastic yet. :D

give me a task to do that will make my brain tense up. if i know muscles then working them out and tensing them combined with protein makes them stronger and bigger,

peace.

"now i dont have a witty retort."

you never did.

"now i dont have a witty retort."

you never did.


ofcourse it would have been witty. obvious but witty no less.

peace.

No it didn't, too unpredictable in its results. And it wasn't to create "super soldiers", it was attempt to (among other things, most of them particularly unfounded) find a "perfect truth drug".

the i wonder if it worked comment was supposed to be ironic i know it didn't work

Logistics are important, but a good guerilla commander can make his adversaries logistics his. It happened in Vietnam, my dad was a Marine SGT there and he talked about how the VC would sneak over and turn claymore mines around so they'd face the Americans. Maybe fighting for your home is an edge or maybe commie infiltrators are better than regulars. I really don't know. The point is large forces can be beat by smaller ones up to a point. The civil war is a great example. Most historians would proabably say Lee was a better General than Grant, problem is Lee was hopelessly outnumbered so he was eventually doomed from the start. I'm no real historian but I know that will is very powerful and can win up to a point. ie Most Americans want illegals deported yesterday but they have not been. Now why do you suppose that is?

the i wonder if it worked comment was supposed to be ironic i know it didn't work

Sorry. But apparently DARPA are having better luck with the latest "enhancements". Inasmuch as they announced they had some, they were going into field testing and then... zip, nothing more after two-three years. My assumption (assumption only) is that if it had been a failure I'd have heard about it on the grapevine... :shrug:

The point is large forces can be beat by smaller ones up to a point.
Agreed. My main comments were directed largely at the got the British kicked out of the US you can find evidence of this.
comment. Since we were fighting Dutch at time, the French were helping the budding US and there was considerable support in our Parliament for the American cause, it wasn't so much guerilla forces that won as lack of overall ability and will on our part. Fighting a transatlantic war was non-winnable from the start without a 100% effort. And that wasn't on the cards at all.

Agreed. My main comments were directed largely at the
comment. Since we were fighting Dutch at time, the French were helping the budding US and there was considerable support in our Parliament for the American cause, it wasn't so much guerilla forces that won as lack of overall ability and will on our part. Fighting a transatlantic war was non-winnable from the start without a 100% effort. And that wasn't on the cards at all.

Are you presently residing in Britain Oli? I am very curious about this pronoun "we".

What is?
That you have muscles clenching in the brain? That you can feel clenching?
Or that blood vessel rupture from "forcing yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once". And just how do you "force yourself to obtain information above any previous capacity all at once"?


DARPA is just one organistion out of many, even if you consider only the USA.

No mention of Europe and CERN?

In which fields?


But warfare is about team interaction and abilities. Hence the concentration on improved intra- and inter-team communications and improved situational awareness.

So why do militaries spend most of their research budgets on improving hardware?

Knowing what to do when the shit hits the fan determines the outcome in any part of life. Some people just function better than others in combat.

Of course you can find the evidence. If you ignore everything else. Political will, other interests, alliances, logistics, supply chain length etc. etc.

maybe thats my problem i have burst all the blood vessels in my brain......:splat:

It sounds like the child has a series of other health problems... If we could reproduce this, it sounds like the caloric needs are so high that it would be difficult to sustain in a combat.

If we can sustain the caloric needs of Blackhawks and Abrams....

DARPA is our best glimmer of hope when it comes to defence. Their creation of Arpanet was genius (this of course lead later to the internet). It was a response to the Russians not being well-liked for their hastiness in the arms race.
It is not surprising that America, a nation of great diligents, could allow this travesty. The grand experiment has been ahead at everything throughout the last 2 centuries.

And after Arpanet comes Skynet, and after Skynet, well, we all know what comes next.

http://www.solarnavigator.net/images/terminator_robot.jpg

And after Arpanet comes Skynet, and after Skynet, well, we all know what comes next.

http://www.solarnavigator.net/images/terminator_robot.jpg

Oh my god! We need to locate and destroy Skynet!

Perhaps we can get the hot chick from Terminator 3 to play in this one!

The “ultimate soldier”?

A dumb, ignorant, buffoon, willing to do anything in the service of the herd and brought up in fanaticism and the glorification of violence and pseudo-machismo.

In other words an American.

Please tell me this is not how Americans are sir. This would destroy my hopes of standing up for the anthem at the next Superbowl.

My father was a perfect example of what you descibe come to think of it now. Yes, it was the era of Rambo, He-Man, Thundercats. Incredible how we speak of the past as though it were relevant to our present. It can stand in conversation as a symbol of culture which binds people who share a deep sentiment. This is the American man's romance - a Stephen Speilberg creation of fantasy adventure. Thankyou Arnold Schwarzenegger for taking me through a movie about your movies as a kid, which you gave the ignorant title "Last Action Hero".

Edit: I just want you to know that it is for these reasons that sciforums is home to some of the wackiest individuals I've ever encountered. Far better than comic conventions.

Are you presently residing in Britain Oli? I am very curious about this pronoun "we".

Presently residing in Britain?
I'm English, born and bred.