Hello everybody,

There are many that don't believe anything about the First Coming, and
the Second Coming to come. Some say the Second Coming came already.
But among those that believe in such occurances there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. One may ask, why is the Second Coming nessessary?

THE SECOND COMING? --- Among christians, there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. The big question is, who is going
to welcome the Second Coming? Would it be the Western and/or Eastern
Catholics, the Atheist, the Mormons, the Jehovah Wittness, the Amish,
the Quakers? the Baptists, the Seven Day Advents, the Pentecostals,
the Anglicans, the Mennonites, the Faith and/or Trinity Lutherans,
the Hutterites, and the list goes on and on? There are over 1,000
Christian faith groups in North America alone. Are the Jewish people
going to welcome the Second Coming, when as of yet they have not
accepted the First Coming? What about the people of all the other
religions of the world, are they going to welcome the Second Coming?
Are the religious of any religion, denomination or sects going to
welcome the Second Coming? From what is written, the kings of the
earth and their armies and those that worship the beast will not
welcome the Second Coming. When the First Coming came ---> Jesus was
not received very kindly by the religious and powerful of his day.
The chief priests and officers answered to Pilate, "We have a law, and
by our law He ought to die, because He made himself the Son of God" -
(John 19:7). When the Second Coming comes, Jesus the Alpha and Omega who sits upon the throne of his Father, and the Lamb who is He that overcometh, even as Jesus overcame will come with wrath. "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great day of his wrath is come: and who shall be able to stand?


Peace be with you, Paul

Its just a fairy tale. No evidence/ proof whatsoever has ever been produced by any religion. Its just the intelligentsia of the time controlling the plebs by fear/ reward if they follow their rules.
Their is no second coming, its not gonna happen. Why not just live your life with your christian ideals, they are not to bad a set of rules to live by. But the rest is just tripe

Oh yeah, welcome ! :)

Hello everybody,

There are many that don't believe anything about the First Coming, and
the Second Coming to come. Some say the Second Coming came already.
But among those that believe in such occurances there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. One may ask, why is the Second Coming nessessary?

THE SECOND COMING? --- Among christians, there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. The big question is, who is going
to welcome the Second Coming? Would it be the Western and/or Eastern
Catholics, the Atheist, the Mormons, the Jehovah Wittness, the Amish,
the Quakers? the Baptists, the Seven Day Advents, the Pentecostals,
the Anglicans, the Mennonites, the Faith and/or Trinity Lutherans,
the Hutterites, and the list goes on and on? There are over 1,000
Christian faith groups in North America alone. Are the Jewish people
going to welcome the Second Coming, when as of yet they have not
accepted the First Coming? What about the people of all the other
religions of the world, are they going to welcome the Second Coming?
Are the religious of any religion, denomination or sects going to
welcome the Second Coming? From what is written, the kings of the
earth and their armies and those that worship the beast will not
welcome the Second Coming. When the First Coming came ---> Jesus was
not received very kindly by the religious and powerful of his day.
The chief priests and officers answered to Pilate, "We have a law, and
by our law He ought to die, because He made himself the Son of God" -
(John 19:7). When the Second Coming comes, Jesus the Alpha and Omega who sits upon the throne of his Father, and the Lamb who is He that overcometh, even as Jesus overcame will come with wrath. "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great day of his wrath is come: and who shall be able to stand?


Peace be with you, PaulFrom what I learned the second coming will be a little bit different from the first. It will be like a lightning whos light will shine from horizon to horizon, as I've understood it everybody will be able to see Him exactly at the same time. Thus His return might be obvious to all.

This may go hand in hand with the description of Gods kingdom, when they asked Him where it were going to be, He answered that it wouldn't be a place which you could point and say it is here or there, the kingdom of God is within us.

How can a specific group "welcome" the Second Coming?

It is written in scripture:

Matthew 7
21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'


OBVIOUSLY "that day" has NOT come! It can't get any clearer than that.

From what I learned the second coming will be a little bit different from the first. It will be like a lightning whos light will shine from horizon to horizon, as I've understood it everybody will be able to see Him exactly at the same time. Thus His return might be obvious to all.

This may go hand in hand with the description of Gods kingdom, when they asked Him where it were going to be, He answered that it wouldn't be a place which you could point and say it is here or there, the kingdom of God is within us.
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M*W: I'm am not only a former Catholic and now an Anti-xian, I can understand your point from a Humanist's perspective. I don't believe in the second coming of a man (Jesus or whomever it might be), but I do believe in the "enlightment" of the human race. Perhaps, we are talking about the same concept of "lightening up (not like "lightning" striking) of humanity from "horizon to horizon." Although, "horizon to horizon" only covers the hemisphere from where each of our perspective is, this would, indeed, imply that this "enlightening" would occur all over the world, which in my understanding, would include all of humanity. I believe Jesus was an enlightened historical character but that he wasn't the "Messiah." Of course, any messiah would/should bring enlightenment to others. From my standpoint, when it was said that "the kingdom of God is within" each of us, that is from where this "light" will emanate. We each have the kingdom of God (our Creator) within the temple of our bodies. There is only one body of humanity, although we may be of different colors and construction individually, we all share in this "enlightenment" of spirit. I like to call this the One Spirit of God. It is the connecting force that binds the human race together. It is possible as you said that we may be able to see this light all at the same time, but I believe it is already appearing in certain individuals. This new enlightenment humanity has long awaited since the ancient Hebrews began waiting for their Messiah who has as yet not come. This light will emanate from inside the all of humanity when the time is right. Unfortunately, no Christians have as yet "seen the light" nor reported it. By that, I believe they are living in eternal darkness refusing to see the light of God within. They are still looking for God to come through the clouds with trumpets blaring, but it's not going to happen that way. That's just a fairy tale. The light will come from within. That is where the "kingdom of God" dwells.

How farfetched can you possibly get? :eek:

Well at least you claimed your bias and ugly generalization.

How farfetched can you possibly get? :eek:

Well at least you claimed your bias and ugly generalization.
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M*W: So far that you will never understand it.

["How can a specific group "welcome" the Second Coming?"] There are faith groups out there that believe that they are chosen, such as JWs, Mormon, and so on. A lot of these religious organizations are in the business of selling salvation or the Kingdom of God. We may be very much surprized who will not welcome the Second Coming, who will welcome the Second Coming. The self-righteous?

Peace be with you, Paul

battig, I believe as the anti-christ gains power all of the sects teaching slightly different versions of what they believe is true will be destroyed. They might even be reunited before then.

As evil becomes clearer, so will good. The depravity of the anti-christ's and what he gives mankind will be in clear sight. Someone who resists the anti-christ will be given the grace and knowledge necessary to do so fully, and this grace and knowledge will be divinely revealed.

there wont be any Jesus coming,its just a story to keep the JC followers hoping for heaven.
from www.geocities.com/inquisitive79/index.html click on Jesus

The actual promise
Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. 35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Mark 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. 31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
Luke 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled. 33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

this was 2000 years ago,and still nothing, ;)

At THE FIRST COMING --- Jesus said, "These things I spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be in good cheer; I have overcome the world." - (John 16:33) --- "ALL POWER is given unto Me in heaven and earth" - (Matthew 28:18), and because of this, Jesus was and is granted his new name, meaning his new title, the ALPHA and OMEGA, THE ALMIGHTY. For this reason at THE SECOND COMING, Jesus cannot return as 'The Christ', but HE will return as his FATHER came in THE FIRST COMING, but with WRATH with the Lamb of the Second Coming. "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great day of his wrath is come: and who shall be able to stand?" - (Rev.6:16)

"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but MY WORDS shall not pass away."

Jesus introduced himself to John with his new name saying [new name = new title] , "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending" , saith the Lord, which is and which was, and which is to come, THE ALMIGHTY." - (Rev. 1:8). ---> Here Jesus speaks " --- " as He and the Father are One. Before Jesus went to the Father, his name (title) was the Christ, but since Jesus went to his Father, He no longer goes by the name Christ, which means Messiah, but has been given his new name, ALPHA and OMEGA, THE ALMIGHTY, the granted position of His Father, from His Father, GOD ALMIGHTY. --- ( 'The Christ' ---> the anointed one, the Greek name for Messiah; )

Before Jesus went to his Father, Jesus said, "because I go to my Father, and ye SEE ME NO MORE." - (John 16:7-13), --- "Ye shall NOT SEE ME henceforth, till ye shall say, "Blessed is He that cometh in the name of the Lord." - (Matt.23:39). Also Jesus warned, "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive 'The Very Elect'." - ( Matt. 24:24 ). THANK OUR GOD which sits upon the throne that 'The Very Elect' was not deceived, for he was found worthy to open, and read the book. Also 'The Very Elect' is the Lamb of the Second Coming that took the book out of the right hand of Him that sat upon the throne. - (Rev.5:2-7). 'The Very Elect' was not even deceived by the false Christ that came to Saul on the road to Damascus and in Jerusalem. Anyone that seen Jesus the Christ since Jesus went to His Father has been deceived. 'The Very Elect' "that cometh in the name of the Lord" will come in the new name of our God, which is the Alpha and Omega, THE ALMIGHTY. Jesus the Alpha and Omega said, "To Him that overcometh, I will write upon Him MY NEW NAME."

In the first three chapters of the Revelation to John, Jesus, the Alpha and Omega, who sits upon the throne of his Father, spoke to John about Him that overcometh who is The Very Elect, the Lamb of the Second Coming. After this John saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, "Who is worthy to open the book", then John wept because no man was found worthy to open, and to read the book. But one of the elders said to John, "Weep not": --- in the midst of the throne, --- stood a Lamb as it had been slain, --- He ( the Lamb of the Second Coming who is also 'The Very Elect' ) came and took the book out of the right hand of Him that sat upon the throne." (Rev.5:2-7) Him that sat upon the throne is Jesus the Alpha and Omega. The Lamb of the Second Coming is not Jesus the Alpha and Omega, but is the One that Jesus the Alpha and Omega will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." - (Rev.3:20-21). "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to recieve power --- ." - (5:12) The Lamb that is spoken of here is to recieve power from our God, Jesus which sits upon the throne. ---> Him that overcometh - (Rev. 2:26-27), ---> the man child - (Rev. 12:5), ---> the King to come that had a name written, that no man knew, but He himself. - (Rev.19:12-16). Many years before John's Revelation Jesus already had been given ALL POWER in heaven and earth. This is why Jesus said to John "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending". The Lamb that was slain to recieve power is He that overcometh, as the Alpha and Omega said, "to him will I give power over the nations:" - (Rev.2:26).

Also John said, every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, --- "Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." - (Rev.5:13) --- "--- Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. - (Rev. 7:10) --- "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:" The Lamb here is the Son of Jesus the Alpha and Omega as Jesus was the Son of his Father at the First Coming. Jesus the Alpha and Omega, the Father of Him that overcometh, shall be seen in the same manner as when Jesus explained to Philip, in John 14:8-11. Philip asked Jesus, "Show us the Father". JESUS answered, "he that hath seen the Me hath seen the Father; --- Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father is me: ---". As the Father was in Jesus, the Christ, so shall Jesus, the Alpha and Omega come in to the Lamb of Second Coming, Him that overcometh, the man child, the King who shall rule all nations with a rod of iron. ---> "I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." "To Him that overcometh, will I grant to sit with Me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne." - (Rev.3:20-21).

Jesus, the Alpha and Omega said, "He that overcometh, --- , to Him will I give power over the nations: and He shall rule them with a rod of iron; ---: even as I received of my Father. - (Rev. 2:26-27).
--->"Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to recieve power --- ." - (Rev. 5:12).
---> Him that overcometh shall rule them with a rod of iron - (Rev. 2:26-27)
---> The man child shall rule all nations with a rod of iron - (Rev. 12:5).
---> The King to come shall rule them with a rod of iron: - (Rev.19:12-16).
---> "He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my Son."- (Rev. 21:7). As you can see here, He that overcometh is the Son of Jesus, the Alpha and Omega, who also is the Lamb, the man child, the King to come, who shall rule all nations with a rod of iron, which is the Second Coming.

Jesus was the FIRST to overcome the beast, Satan, since the world began, --- and He that overcometh, the man child, the King to come, is the SECOND to overcome, as Jesus overcame. He that overcometh will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: He shall testify of Jesus and glorify Jesus. He shall sit upon the throne of 'his glory', ( 'his glory' is his Father the Alpha and Omega) ---> "He that overcometh, will I grant to sit with Me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne." - (Rev. 3:21). And before Him shall be gathered all nations; and He shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats. - (Matt.25:32) He shall be given power over the nations:- and He shall rule them with a rod of iron; ---: even as Jesus received of His Father.-(Rev.2:26-27)

Before Jesus went to the Father, He said, "I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another comforter, that He may abide with you forever;" (John 14:16), ). --- "But when the comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of Truth, which proceedeth from the Father, "He shall testify of Me." - (John 15:26) This other Comforter that Jesus spoke about here is the Lamb, The Very Elect that was not deceived, who was found worthy to receive power from the Alpha and Omega. This Comforter shall testify of Jesus and --->

"He shall glorify Me: for He shall receive of mine, and the Father
hath are mine: therefore said I, that He shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you." - (John 16:14-15).

"He will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:"
"Of Sin, because they believe not on Me;
Of Righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye SEE ME NO MORE.
Of Judgment, because the Prince of this world is judged." - (John 16:7-11)

Jesus said, --- "Nevertheless I tell you; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send Him unto you."

Jesus the Alpha and Omega said to John, He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my Son." - (Rev. 21:7). This is why He that overcometh is also called the Son of Man.

ONLY Jesus the Alpha and Omega, and He that overcometh knows the names that are written upon Him that overcometh, because it it written that "He had a name written, that no man knew, but He himself" - (Rev.19:12).
---"will I make A PILLAR in the temple of my GOD, and he shall go no more out: ---> ( a PILLAR in him that overcometh)
---"and I will write upon Him the name of my GOD, ---> ( THE WORD OF GOD - Rev. 19:13 )
---"and I will write upon Him the name of the city of my GOD, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my GOD: ---> ( the NEW HOLY CITY to be --- the Greatest Place to be, which is in THE PEACE COUNTRY )
---"and I will write upon Him MY NEW NAME." ---> ( Alpha and Omega, THE ALMIGHTY )

Who shall inherit the kingdom to come? For those who want to inherit the kingdom to come, it is of the greatest importance to know first of what is required. Then comes the doing of what is required, to inherit the kingdom to come. It is written in Matt.25:31-46, who shall, and who shall not inherit the kingdom to come. Read it carefully, it is The Word of God. What is required is to allow love to rule, not only in mind but in the doing. Jesus said, "Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them." Jesus said; " why call me Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? --- "Thou shalt love the lord thy God with all thy heart, and all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two comandments hang all the law and the prophets." - (Matt.:22:37-40). --- "love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again: and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil." - ( Luke 6:27-38 )

About those that do not welcome the Second Coming, "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great day of his wrath is come: and who shall be able to stand?" - (Rev.6:16) Him that sitteth upon the throne of his Father is Jesus the Alpha and Omega, and Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to recieve power who is Him that overcometh, the man child, the King to come, who shall rule all nations with a rod of iron.--->(Rev. 2:26-27)--->(Rev. 12:5)--->(Rev.19:12-16)..

About those that welcome the Second Coming, --- Jesus said, "Ye shall NOT SEE ME henceforth, till ye shall say, "Blessed is He that cometh in the name of the Lord." - (Matt.23:39), ---> in the new name of the Lord. "--- a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, --- and cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb." - (Rev 6:17 and Rev.7:1-12). Our God is Jesus the Alpha and Omega which sitteth upon the throne, and the Lamb of the Second coming is the Son of Jesus the Alpha and Omega, Him that overcometh, the man child, the King to come, who shall rule all nations with a rod of iron.--->(Rev. 2:26-27)--->(Rev. 12:5)--->(Rev.19:12-16).

As Jesus received from his Father, so shall Him that overcometh, the man child, King to come receive from Jesus the Alpha and Omega--->(Rev.2:26-27). --->"for He (the Comforter, the Elect, the Lamb of the Second Coming) shall receive of mine, and the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that He shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you." - (John 16:14-15).

"--- there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened." The one man that was found worthy to open, and read the book is the Elect, Him that overcometh, the man child, the Son of the Alpha and Omega, the King to come

LET US BE THANKFUL to JESUS that overcame at THE FIRST COMING and was granted ALL POWER in heaven and earth, and to The Elect who was not deceived by any false Christs, and false prophets, and also for The Elect's sake, flesh shall be saved. It is written, "Every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, --- "Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." - (Rev.5:13)


Our GOD, and my FATHER, JESUS the ALPHA and OMEGA, THE ALMIGHTY said, "BEHOLD, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be." - (Rev.22:12) "Heaven and earth shall pass away, but MY WORDS shall not pass away."

"Come you blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom to come."

"Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth, as it is in heaven"

Let the Spirit of Love and Truth be with you and guide you.

Peace be with you, Paul

Mormons aren't Christian, battiq, and if the Second Coming actually happened, I'm pretty sure atheists would not welcome it. Anyways, Christians have been eagerly awaiting the apocalypse for essentially the church's entire existence. The Seventh Day Adventists are the spiritual descendants of one such eager group.

Okinrus,

all of the sects teaching slightly different versions of what they believe is true will be destroyed. Excellent - since they are all slightly differnt to each other then your statement means they will ALL be destroyed - at last the end of Christianity. Something worth celibrating.

I guess you were taking the position that your particular variation is the only correct version, right? Just like every Christian in every sect/cult.

Kat

Battig,

Fortunately the scriptures only speak of everyone on this earth being judged. As we move out into space, settle on the other planets, and progress to the stars then we can leave the Christian god behind to blow-up the planet as he wishes, right?

2000 years ago the world population was only 150 million and I suspect the Christian myth-makers of those times only imagined a god judging these few, and certainly had no concept of the universe being any larger than the earth. There are now 6+ billion people and growing at an exponential rate. It is also estimated that there are around 22,000 separately identifiable different Christian sects/cults around the world. A number that is likely to rise as the population increases and grows in diversity and philosophies. Remember that Christianity is still a minority perspective in the world with two thirds of the world having other beliefs or non-beliefs.

If the second coming doesn’t come soon, say in the next 1000 years, and given the exponential rate of technology progress then it seems quite likely that we will have indeed spread out into the universe and grown in numbers to many trillions, such is the result of exponential arithmetic.

At what point would it make sense for this god to declare he has enough followers? Millions, billions, trillions or trillions of trillions? We already know that he is vain, jealous, and egotistical, as we can see from many biblical texts, and I would think his ego would be best served if he could maximize the number of people that will be forced to worship him. But since the numbers of humans could grow indefinitely it would seem he would never reach a maximum and will always be putting off the second-coming.

But is Christianity really suggesting that their god will really wipe out an entire species throughout the universe to satisfy his ego?

If the purpose of the second coming is to judge those who have lived to divert them to either heaven or extinction, then it seems the best chance people have of achieving the better choice would be to die as a newborn baby who would not have had time to become bad. Perhaps if we really did want to do the best for others then we should start a new policy of killing all new-born babies to ensure they enter heaven. And that would solve the population growth problem as well.

Like the rest of Christian mythology the second coming is just more paradoxical gibberish.

Kat

Excellent - since they are all slightly differnt to each other then your statement means they will ALL be destroyed - at last the end of Christianity. Something worth celibrating.

We don't typically refer to ourselves as members of a sect or denomination. But even if we did, destroy n - 1 of the sects and the nth one is no longer a sect.


I guess you were taking the position that your particular variation is the only correct version, right? Just like every Christian in every sect/cult.

You also must believe that your particular variation of the truth is true.

Okinrus,

We don't typically refer to ourselves as members of a sect or denomination.Of course not just like terrorists never refer to themselves as terrorists.

You also must believe that your particular variation of the truth is true.Which one is that? I don’t make claims but I do point out that you can’t show any credible evidence for your incredible unbelievable claims.

Kat

Of course not just like terrorists never refer to themselves as terrorists.

It's for the most part somewhat standard terminology. While we can loosely speaking use the word "sect", a sect is really a splinter off of a church.


Which one is that? I don’t make claims but I do point out that you can’t show any credible evidence for your incredible unbelievable claims.

Your posts lead me to believe you have lost any hope of knowing God. Athough you are agnostic, you do not seem to even trust God to allow him to present his own evidence, in his own time and way what is best for you.

Okinrus,

Your posts lead me to believe you have lost any hope of knowing God. The Christian god for sure since there are too many paradoxes in Christian mythology that makes the Christian ideas impossible. My only hope is to convince others who do believe, that their beliefs are false and counter-productive to the good of the species and in turn help to bring about the ultimate destruction and end of Christianity.

Athough you are agnostic, you do not seem to even trust God to allow him to present his own evidence, in his own time and way what is best for you.I cannot trust in the idea of something that to me has no credibility. And I cannot conceive of a condition where blind faith has value above reason, and hence any institution that insists on this can have no value or credibility either. Neither can I conceive of a just god who could not appreciate my position.

In terms of labels the term agnostic does not describe me. I am a Bright which is far more appropriate since that reflects my world view as being naturalistic

Kat

The Second Coming is only there because what people thought the First Coming was, it wasn't, and it went so horribly wrong and didn't save the Jews from their sufferable lives they led, so they still continue to rely on that divine hope of SOMEDAY being saved. And whatever the people may feel is the Second Coming, once that doesn't save them, writings of a Third Coming will come to be. ;)

- N

Okinrus,

Excellent - since they are all slightly differnt to each other then your statement means they will ALL be destroyed - at last the end of Christianity. Something worth celibrating.
Kat
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M*W: Kat, this is truly the Good News! I'll bring the champagne, and humanity shall rejoice for all eternity!!!

I don't believe in the second coming of a man (Jesus or whomever it might be), but I do believe in the "enlightment" of the human race.

Those are my beliefs as well. I don't believe in a second coming with all sorts of hocus pocus or anything like that, but I believe in an enlightenment of the human race. Some day, something profound will happen that will change our outlooks on life. Whether it's a scientific discovery, aliens arriving, our planet about to be destroyed, something will slap the silly mythology outta our minds and wake us up.

- N

Those are my beliefs as well. I don't believe in a second coming with all sorts of hocus pocus or anything like that, but I believe in an enlightenment of the human race. Some day, something profound will happen that will change our outlooks on life. Whether it's a scientific discovery, aliens arriving, our planet about to be destroyed, something will slap the silly mythology outta our minds and wake us up. - N
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M*W: This is what I believe. I foresee it as an awakening, like when a light bulb goes off in our head. This knowledge has been there for all existence, but when that light goes on, and we awaken from our sleep throughout the darkness of human evolution, we will see that man-made religions were only created to explain that which we couldn't see, understand or explain.

Hmm, I kinda get impatient if the second cuming doesn't come in seconds - oops wrong forum.

The Alpha and Omega spoke to John about Him that overcometh who will be the Lamb of the Second Coming, the King to come.[QUOTE]
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M*W: This is a lengthy post to answer, but I shall try.
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"He that overcometh, -- to him will I give power over the nations: and He shall rule them with a rod of iron;" -- even as I received of my Father." - (Rev.2:27).
*************
M*W: Jesus is speaking here about his progeny. He is the Alpha, and his progeny will be the Omega. He who "overcomes" the lamb will be the son(child) of the Lamb. You must understand here that Jesus was NOT born December 25, he was born a Capricorn. (There was a song in the 70s entitled "Jesus was a Capricorn.") The "lamb" refers to the constellation Aries. That is when Jesus was born, therefore, he is called the "lamb." (Son of a ram, etc.) The "rod of iron" refers to "knowledge" as in education, the "learning" about spiritual matters.
*************
"He that overcometh, --- I will not bot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels." - (Rev.3:5)
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M*W: This means to me that Jesus was referring to "knowledge." When one overcomes the lies of Christianity, he will be one with Jesus and his creator.
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"To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne" - (Rev.3:21).
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M*W: Overcoming ignorance is what Jesus is asking for. When you overcome ignorance, you will be able to sit with him and our creator for eternity.
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"I will give unto him that is a thirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; I will be his God, and he shall be my Son."-(Rev.21:6-7)

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M*W: The One Spirit of God through Jesus will spiritually quench the thirst in all creation. That's what he means by saying "ye shall inherit the Earth."
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All the above verses the speaker is Jesus the Alpha and Omega that said, "my Father", so the Alpha and Omega is Jesus, the Son of his Father.
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M*W: Again, the Alpha is Jesus, the Omega are his progeny, the sons of his father.
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Here, Jesus spoke about Him that overcometh;
-- shall be given power over the nations; and He shall rule them with a rod of iron; (EDUCATION)
-- will be granted to sit with Jesus in his throne, as Jesus is sat down with his Father in his throne; (HIS PROGENY)
-- shall be the Son of Jesus the Alpha and Omega that shall inherit all things, as Jesus is the Son of his Father. (JESUS' CHILDREN)
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M*W: The progeny of Jesus will provide eternal life to humanity, because they are a part of it.
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Him that overcometh is the Lamb of the Second Coming who was found worthy to open, and to read the book, and He is the One that took the book out of the right hand of Him that sat upon the throne who is Jesus the Alpha and Omega (Rev.5:2-7)
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M*W: Jesus overcame the crucifixion and sired children with MM. Therefore, he speaks of the "second coming" which refers to his natural children and their coming to Earth through their mother MM. The "throne" Jesus speaks of is his dynasty.
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I do not know of anyone that has ever spoke or written about this before. Do you know anyone that has spoke or written about what is said above?
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M*W: I have written of this herein. These are my beliefs. This Jesus is not the Jesus of Christianity but the Jesus of the One Spirit of God -- unlike the Jesus of Paul.
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Peace be with you, Paul

How farfetched can you possibly get?

...and how farfetched would the story of Jesus be to you if you had never heard of it before?

Jesus was a pantheist!

sings of the second coming of Jesus!!!!!

http://www.jesuswillreturn.com/signs/signs_index.html

all have happened, click on each sign for more details.

i was looking for this link for a long time and now i've finally dfound it!

Great, where can I get tickets for the second crucifixion of Jesus?

Hello everybody,

There are many that don't believe anything about the First Coming, and
the Second Coming to come. Some say the Second Coming came already.
But among those that believe in such occurances there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. One may ask, why is the Second Coming nessessary?

THE SECOND COMING? --- Among christians, there is a lot of
discussion about the Second Coming. The big question is, who is going
to welcome the Second Coming? Would it be the Western and/or Eastern
Catholics, the Atheist, the Mormons, the Jehovah Wittness, the Amish,
the Quakers? the Baptists, the Seven Day Advents, the Pentecostals,
the Anglicans, the Mennonites, the Faith and/or Trinity Lutherans,
the Hutterites, and the list goes on and on? There are over 1,000
Christian faith groups in North America alone. Are the Jewish people
going to welcome the Second Coming, when as of yet they have not
accepted the First Coming? What about the people of all the other
religions of the world, are they going to welcome the Second Coming?
Are the religious of any religion, denomination or sects going to
welcome the Second Coming? From what is written, the kings of the
earth and their armies and those that worship the beast will not
welcome the Second Coming. When the First Coming came ---> Jesus was
not received very kindly by the religious and powerful of his day.
The chief priests and officers answered to Pilate, "We have a law, and
by our law He ought to die, because He made himself the Son of God" -
(John 19:7). When the Second Coming comes, Jesus the Alpha and Omega who sits upon the throne of his Father, and the Lamb who is He that overcometh, even as Jesus overcame will come with wrath. "--- hide us from the face of Him that sitteth upon the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great day of his wrath is come: and who shall be able to stand?


Peace be with you, Paul

Battig do you know about the "catching up" also known as the "rapture". It is believed that there will be no followers of The Messiah On earth to welcome Him because all His Followers will be transformed into their new bodies and caught up into the clouds either at the second coming or just before.

It is recorded that the Jewish people will mourn when they see Him coming in the clouds. because they will know who He is and they will know that they rejected Him. As for the rest of the world they will be in great fear at the coming of the Messiah.

All praise The Ancient Of Days

It is written in scripture:

Matthew 7
21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'


OBVIOUSLY "that day" has NOT come! It can't get any clearer than that.

Don't most Christians believe that in order to go to 'heaven' you must accept Jesus as your 'savior'? I went to a Evangelical Christian school for two years, and this is the message that was always portrayed. None of this "Works gets you into heaven" mumbo-jumbo. Which is it?

I agree that the second coming is a load of crap. There is no way to prove that there was a first coming, much less that there will be a second. If something like this does happen, I tend to believe along the lines of what MedicineWoman said.

Battig do you know about the "catching up" also known as the "rapture". It is believed that there will be no followers of The Messiah On earth to welcome Him because all His Followers will be transformed into their new bodies and caught up into the clouds either at the second coming or just before.

It is recorded that the Jewish people will mourn when they see Him coming in the clouds. because they will know who He is and they will know that they rejected Him. As for the rest of the world they will be in great fear at the coming of the Messiah.

All praise The Ancient Of Days

This may be a bit off topic, but can you not see how illogical and ignorant that sounds?

Tranformed into their new bodies? :bugeye:
Caught up in the clouds? :bugeye:
The Jews, The Chosen Ones, being rejected or scorned? :bugeye:

As for the last part, if I am around, I can assure you that I will not be in 'great fear' at the second coming of the messiah.

Who would welcome a 2nd Coming of Christ.

Actually there are some very Ecumenically Minded people out there. Many of the Contemplative Catholic Religious Orders see themselves in close relationship to the Sufi and the Sanskrit Tradition Mystical Traditions. As far as the Jews go, one needs to differentiate between the Zionists whose Religion has become Real Estate, and those whose attention to Mysticism forces them to recognize a Unity with the rest of Mankind (instead of insisting upon being the New Master Race).

I had a vision in which I was told that the Three Higher Religions would be brought to a new Dispensation which would quench their long suffering thirst. I should have had the presence of mind to ask the Angels just what these Three Higher Religions were. I guess that they are Catholicism, Islam, and the Sanskrit Traditions. Judaism had rejected Christ, and Protestantism had rejected Christ's Church, and they are both Religions without any sign of Saint or Miracle. Catholicism, Islam, and the Sanskrit Religions are not overwhelmed with Saints and Miracles -- they are in fact dieing of thirst as the Angels said -- but these Three Religions at least have a History of Saints and Miraculous Verifications that they are indeed Trees of Good Fruit.

Battig do you know about the "catching up" also known as the "rapture". It is believed that there will be no followers of The Messiah On earth to welcome Him because all His Followers will be transformed into their new bodies and caught up into the clouds either at the second coming or just before.
The idea of a "rapture" isn't Biblical. It's based on a misunderstanding of the text and popularized by authors like Tim la Haye. The only people who will already be with the Lord when He returns are those who have died. Their bodies will be resurrected when He comes, "For the Lord himself will come down from heaven ... and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them..." (1 Thess. 4:16-17). How can there be any "who are still alive and are left" to be caught up, if there has been a "rapture" of the living? The Bible makes it clear that this is a once and final event.

It is recorded that the Jewish people will mourn when they see Him coming in the clouds. because they will know who He is and they will know that they rejected Him. As for the rest of the world they will be in great fear at the coming of the Messiah.
The Bible says "all the nations of the earth will mourn" (Matt. 24:30 and Rev.1:7). It does not destinguish between Gentiles and Jews, except to say that both are bound to disobedience. Only those who have rejected God's salvation have something to fear.
I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.

And so all Israel will be saved [Jewish and "Gentile" Israel]... As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your account; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. Romans 11
In other words, just because Jews oppose Christians it doesn't mean they oppose God. They might still be obedient, and God's covenant with them is still valid. We have only been included in it, by His mercy - not because we're "special" and they're not.
Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious.

The idea of a "rapture" isn't Biblical. It's based on a misunderstanding of the text and popularized by authors like Tim la Haye. The only people who will already be with the Lord when He returns are those who have died. Their bodies will be resurrected when He comes, "For the Lord himself will come down from heaven ... and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them..." (1 Thess. 4:16-17). How can there be any "who are still alive and are left" to be caught up, if there has been a "rapture" of the living? The Bible makes it clear that this is a once and final event.


It helps to read a post before replying to it. I said:
His Followers will be transformed into their new bodies and caught up into the clouds either at the second coming or just before.


Even the scriptures you quoted confirm the catching up:
"we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them."


The following scripture describes the cathching up/rapture better.

1 Corrinthians15: 49,54
49And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

Here Paul is saying that as we inhabit earthly bodies derived from dust so shall we inhabit new bodies changed and not made of dust. Paul goes on to explain why:


50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption.

So the bodies that we inhabit cannot enter the Kingdom of God and also "corruption" dead bodies must also be changed also. Then Paul reveals a mystery:


51Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed-- 52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

So Paul is saying that "we shall not all sleep" now I hope everyone can agree that he is talking about physical death here? Paul is saying not everyone will experience physical death. He goes on to say that "we shall all be changed" both the dead and the living "in a moment", now at this point it could be argued that both the dead and the living could be changed in a moment in time, but at different times. That is to say the moment is only referring to the time it takes to change, not at the same moment. But we read on and Paul states the moment will be. "in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet." So not only shall both the living and the dead be changed to inherit the Kingdom of God But they will both change at the same moment, at the last trumpet. As He goes on to say "For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." Paul goes on to explain it in more detail:


53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: "Death is swallowed up in victory.

So here again we see Paul referring to the two states of being that the saints will be in at the time of the 1st Resurrection/Rapture "So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality," Dead saints and living saints caught up together in a twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet.

So from what I have read the first resurrection and the rapture (although different experiences for them that take part) will happen at the same instant in time at the last trumpet.

So now we go on to the next scripture:


Revelation10: 7

7but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.

Now the sounding of the seventh Angel is the last of a series of seven trumpets in revelation. Note that the scripture says the "Mystery of God would be finished" now the coming of the Messiah has been described by scripture at a coming in the sky (a darkened sky) and all people will see Him. Now after this event there will be on ifs or buts about the Mystery of God because all will see that God is and who He is. Everyone will know from that moment on, there will be no Mystery left. As for the darkening of the sky this is described as happening beforehand on the sounding of the forth trumpet:


Revelation 8
12 Then the fourth angel sounded: And a third of the sun was struck, a third of the moon, and a third of the stars, so that a third of them were darkened. A third of the day did not shine, and likewise the night.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Hi, I don't know why it is neccessary for the Second Comming in Christianity, but I will tell you why it is important in Islam.

First of all Muslims don't believe that Jesus rose on the three day and three night part.

We believe Jesus will come toward and close to the End Times

This is the List of Things that he will do. (Not is order)

1. Tell the People what the true Religion is.
2. Kill the Dajjal (Anti-Christ)
3. Kill Yajoj and Majoj (Don't know the names in English, sorry)

I think this is all, but there might be more which I don't recall right now.