Past is over, the future is yet to happen. You are in NOW. So what you like about your environment and what you dislike? What are you afraid of and what you want to continue?

Money, sex, politics, job, food, living, dying, old people, young people....ozone layer, Dupont...Hong Kong, King Kong...child labor, child ponography, south carolina law....

Jeez I never knew you were so opposed to future thinking. Then again there aren't any posts or forums about the future in general.

But to awanser your question, I think we aren't doing all that bad right now.

Rivalry? neh...just to have some fun....

All in good humor my friend...all in good humor...

On the otherhand, the economy sucks, Bush is doing nothing...we who have to put food on the table...things are bad, man...really bad. If things do not turn around , we will be heading for a depression...and that is not fun....

Here is what Randolfo said that is germane to this and the future topic too.



Originally posted by Randolfo
I live a comfortable, middle-class American life, the problem for me is that the future looks bleak, we use too much 'clunker' technology, ideas, lifestyles, resources, etc.. to sustain our Western ways. Almost everything that we use, tears up our world; from cars that not just pollute, but use tons of resources to stay running, to the ag industry that feeds us, to simple things, like single use utensils. And this does not include lives; of our 3rd world slaves overseas, of the people here (both immigrants & native-born), that work backbreaking jobs until they are used-up, the homeless, the welfare-class, the druggies, alkies & mental patients, etc...

From what I see, at least in this Western country, we can not sustain this system for long, we need a breakthrough either in thinking or doing things that will make a difference for hopefully all of us. :confused:

kmguru,
I am starting to get used to your method of posting. I must admit that I am gullible in that I tend to take things at face value without looking too much deeper. I find that time after time the subject had another depth or level to it than initially stated. I do not have any bones to pick with you, as it is your method and my lack. This one is extremely fascinating as it has the potential of quite some depth to it.

To address the question/statement, I think that I would first go to Randolfo's quoted statement. To condense it down, he wonders about our throwaway lifestyles and economy and what its results are to those around us and what the end implications are.

I would think that we need major overhaul in expectations. Of what is satisfactory. To state we need to do so and so to start on the road of correcting a perceived problem is fine. But when it comes right down to it, your money is a vote. You spend for what you want/need and in doing so you send the message that I want this service/product over that one. So the businesses, who keep track of buying statistics, of what influences the consumer, (you and me) to buy this over that design their products to fit those wants. Those who don't fall by the wayside and go out of business if they do not change to what the consumer demands. In example of this look at the automotive industry. In the 70's-80's you could buy a new car that the molding fell off of in 6 months. The consumer rejected the idea that cost vs. product was not important and started choosing foreign to domestic products wanting something more durable. The big three automakers did not retool to provide a response to this shift of demand until much later. As a result, they lost a large share of the consumers product trust and hence a respectable share of the market. Which I might add has never returned in full bloom.

Countries like China and India have much to offer in the way to live and exist over long periods of time. Things we could certainly learn to use to our advantage. To do so would mean that we must be willing to give up luxuries that we now take for granted and as our right to expect. As our standard of living. Without that desire we will continue right down the same path we are headed.

You have in the Philosophy sections brought up the subject of caste. As also the economic caste system. Randolfo also speaks of this. So what is the answer? I do not think there will be an answer that is acceptable to the public at large. Perhaps this is the inbred seed of our destruction.

I seem to be rambling quite a bit here so I think I will stop and gather thoughts. I have only addressed a small part of what I wished to at the start of this tirade.

Wet1, thank you again for the compliment and for your accurate inference. I do the best I can on this forum while multitasking my real work (that puts food on the table). This is one of those times, I have to switch task to finish a report.

The problem with our present society is that we do not know, how to do the forensic of critical factors. After that it goes downhill. Doing analysis on scant and sometimes contaminated information is bad enough, when you do statistical operation on those "dirty" data, the results can be anything. Finally, after your faulty observation, your inference and advice no longer remain germane to the original issue at hand.

Prof. Arturo would know what I am talking about. Forensic Science, Intelligence Analysis (like they do in CIA), Psychology, Sociology, Statistics, Discontinuity Probability, Database Management, Metrics, Processes, and a whole lot of other specialities are necessary to provide the correct "Inference" and hence "Action Items".

How many MBAs you know that have a thorough understanding of all these fields to make an accurate assesment? That is why, our economy is a mess and the end is nowhere in sight. The pension funds have lost Billions of dollars that will never be recovered. And the teenagers who run the companies today are thinking - "Economy is not so bad, but if the company blows up, I will move in with my Mom & Pop".

So is Life....

Hmm... Is this like one of those this-is-the-first-day-of-the-rest-of-your-life things?

My concern is that I live in a world that follows a green paper carrot. We really are a dysfunctional family.

This one is important. What about <b>NOW</b>?

What do you suggest?

One particular thing always gets me chuckling. The woe is me over the now generation from the previous one. This goes back for ages it seems. Each complaining over the fact that the newest is not what the older was. SO WHAT! No one I know of swallows goldfish live as a fad. But it was a common practice in the days of the flapper generation. It just shows that things change, nothing more. That each generation has that which makes them unique to some extent from the next. I say let them have their fun. Be it dancing, clubbing, rave, or whatever. It is not necessary that the future generation be a carbon copy of the last.

Here is something that will bake your noodles:

"The perception of the young that society has become a society of organizations, and that this is in striking contrast to the society of our textbooks, our political rhetoric, and our conventions is sound and realistic insight. The response, however, futile......The organizations will not go away. Repudiating them is not going to make themdisappear. It will not even reduce their power.

Indeed, scorning power only makes it more oppressive. Power has to be used. It is a reality. If the decent and idealistic toss power in the gutter, the guttersnipes pick it up. If the able and educated refuse to exercise power responsibly, irresponsible and incompetent people take over the seats of the mighty and the levers of the power. Power not being used for social purposes passes to people who use it for their own ends. At best, it is taken over by the careerists who are led by their timidity into becoming arbitrary, autocratic, and bureaucratic." - The age of discontinuity, guidelines to our changing society by Peter Drucker 1968.

I could not have said any better...It is my thoughts to you.

This to has been evident through our generation. From the Beatles rage alone. No, not the organizations or policital parties but rather the surge of young minds who group together into a common cluster for the enjoyment of music. Yes, I understand what you are referring to. That any such grouping represents the source of a power. One that will be used by some enterprising person or group to be the leader. Or, in the case of the Beatles, thrust into such position by the force of their followers. If they had a message beyond love, peace, and drugs, to push on their followers where might that have taken them? Or us? What and how might the world have been led?

.

I think we talked about this in another thread:

irresponsible and incompetent people take over the seats of the mighty and the levers of the power.

<i>"What do you suggest?"</i>

I dunno. The Now seems important. Should we cause change or sit back and watch it happen?

Some of us will cause change while others will sitback and watch.

Some of us will cause change while others will sitback and watch.

Aah yes, but sometimes it is better for people to sit back and watch. Just think if Hitler didn't do anything how different this world would be For better or worse, who knows?

Last night I was watching the History channel. It was about big ships of the Navy from wooden days to modern. When British built the 12 inch gun dreadnaught, they were working on dominating and keeping their empire in tact around 1904. Others started competing. The second world war was the result of that competition with so much fire power.

If hitler would not have been there, the whole world could have been under British Rule, who knows. Some say that for every major conflict, emerges a new more advanced and adaptable society. May be there was a major conflict 200,000 years ago among the simian race and one race became victorious. It may be natures way....

Yes, conflict causes change. It unites people, as WWII did for Americans and Russians. The two countries became super powers because of the war.

I wonder if that applies to personal situations. I mean, how many people went through personal conflict or job loss and emerged as stronger, better and carried forward....

I would think so. My thought is that you can fall no farther then bottom, and from there can only move up, providing you choose to not linger in those dark places.

I think the conflicts in our lives do make us stronger, but they also cause us to grow old.

I think the conflicts in our lives do make us stronger, but they also cause us to grow old.

You mean, hairs turning grey! :D Any conflict causes a lot of cortisol production and stress. Prolonged stress is bad for health. I think "Zen" teaches to stay calm...which is difficult to do if you do not have a safety net.

That brings us to the medicare, health insurance for all, welfare issues that can be a point of discussion in the NOW and Future topic.

Once you have been scarred...

how will our children of NOW change the FUTURE?

Here is Now looking at the future: (two good links)

"It happened quickly; few saw it coming. Over the past 20 years, the PC, the Internet, and the protean enterprises that arose around them propelled an economic transformation as sweeping as any since the Industrial Revolution. Together these changes were responsible for the lion's share of industrial and service-sector growth. They allayed the fear that U.S. competitiveness was in steep decline. They sparked a wave of corporate restructuring, spurred improvements in productivity, and ushered in what even traditionalists like Fed chairman Alan Greenspan acknowledged as a new economy. And by collapsing distance and traversing national borders, they helped turn Marshall McLuhan's notion of the world becoming a global village from theory into practice."

http://www.pcmag.com/article/0,2997,s%253D1754%2526a%253D10158,00.asp

"Imagine a Web, circa 2030, that will offer a panoply of virtual environments incorporating all of our senses, and in which there will be no clear distinction between real and simulated people. Consider the day when miniaturized displays on our eyeglasses will provide speech-to-speech translation so we can understand a foreign language in real time—kind of like subtitles on the world. Then, think of a time when noninvasive nanobots will work with the neurotransmitters in our brains to vastly extend our mental capabilities."

http://www.pcmag.com/article/0,2997,s%253D1754%2526a%253D10163,00.asp

<i>"I can't help but think that some set of moral/ethical/political frameworks will become a part of the debate to a much greater degree than they are now, if for no other reason than there is just so much weird shit going on!"</i>

kmguru,

Thank you for those two links. The two articles were very interesting. I think <b>we</b>, as a global village, need to decide what is important.

I can't wait to see what the future holds, and personally I hope it has all those things and more.
But as far as the present, we have some big obstacles to get through before we can make it that far.
The U.S., which has always been known for being the land of the free is slowly but surely removing any freedom that gets in the way of their making money.
World relations this is a current list of wars and other little nasty things going on: http://comnet.org/local/orgs/wilpf/listofwars.html
I think the world need a lot of work to get out of the sad state of affairs it's in.

So, avarice is not the sole motivation for creating conflict?

I'm sorry I did not mean to imply that that was the ONLY reason, With that I was mostly referring to the DMCA RIAA thing.
I think a lot of it is more of a PR thing. Making it seem that they are the greatest government out there. Making sure that the only things getting reported media wise, are what they want known to the public.