View Full Version : The Meaninglessness of Conversation and The Puzzle of Life


TruthSeeker
12-18-02, 11:43 PM
Why do we talk with each other? To express our ideas? To find out other's ideas? Or we just always search for everyone to agree with us? Whatever intention we might have while talking with one another, the idea is never and probably will never be accuratly expressed. Why? Let's take a look on some of the aspects of conversation (given that it is held in the same language and the level of language between the two people is the same).

The first thing about conversations is that it always only happens with two people. It is always a relationship with 2 people where each action/word leads to a reaction/answer of the other, and it happens back and forth, like a pingue-pong game.

Also, if you are dealing with a group of people, the situation gets much more complex. To actually say something that someone previously said is certainly a recipe for disaster. The way the human mind can twist someone's words is very impressive:eek: . If you doubt me, just play that game where you have to whisper something in someone's ear and that person has to pass it through until the first person hear it. In the end, the message is completly different! :bugeye:

The second thing is that each person will react in a different way to every word, as they actually have their own personal conceptions about every single word, based in their past experiences. If you have a loving family, when someone speaks to you about family, you will understand it as a group of people that is always helping and encouraging each other. If you have a family that abuse you, when someone speaks to you about family, you will understand it as a group of people that is always fighting and hurting each other.

My third point is derived from the second one. If each person has a different set of experiences/beliefs of each word (concept), the probability that you will ever communicate what you are trying to say tend to be very close to zero! If you understand others with your own concepts, you will most likely misunderstand everyone around you (what it's actually what usually happens!). This implies that we all live in separate "realities", in completly different worlds; and that we all try to understand each other by looking through our own world (which is the reason why most people can't understand each other very well). This also means that the whole world that we know in our minds is made of a bunch of illusions derived from ourselves. Unless we can look at things without using what we know, our experiences, then our understanding of the world will always be illusional. This world is a big illusion.

My last point is that our actions follow the "reality" that we know through our past experiences and our distorded view of the world, hence all the mistakes everyone make.

If you ever wondered why atheists can't understand you, or why theists can't understand you... :rolleyes: :bugeye: :eek:

Concluding, the only possible way to really understand this world and understand each other is by trying to be completly impartial and completly open-minded about everyone. If we don't co-operate with each other it is very likely that anyone will ever understand this world or life itself.

We are all pretty blinded by our own eyes...!:bugeye: :eek:

notme2000
12-26-02, 08:38 PM
I'd say communication came from a deep seeded need by human beings. Survival was a distant second. Conversation is the human being striving to escape his solitude. Without communication we are trapped in our heads, peering out our eye sockets. Communication is a portal in to the consciousness of the person talking to you. And an invitation for them to join you in yours. The point (the main point at least) isn't to convince someone something, but to get some company in our lonely consciousness.

TruthSeeker
12-27-02, 01:29 PM
You mean the point was this, eh?
Look to this world. Why there are wars? Why there is a lot of polution? Why there is law? Answer those questions and you will get to my point...

notme2000
12-27-02, 01:32 PM
My point: Why did you start this thread? Why not keep this idea to yourself? Cause if you were to always keep everything to yourself you'd feel pretty cut off from everyone. Pretty isolated. Alone.

Look to this world. Why there are wars? Why there is a lot of polution? Why there is law? Answer those questions and you will get to my point...
Perhaps I'm missing something. Please be blatant with your point cause I'm not catching it as of yet...

TruthSeeker
12-27-02, 02:08 PM
Your point is right, but is not all that is on the subject.
I meant that one of the main reasons why we communicate is to pass a point or an idea to someone. Scientists do that all the time. However, since they have their own perspective, each scientist will see the world in a very different way.

But the most significant thing of what I said above is with our judgement, and how we see the world. In a court, for example, everyone is trying to prove themselves right. Who is right? Most likely nobody.

My very point here is that you cannot judge people by their actions, you must judge them by their intentions. Since we are not perfect and we may make mistakes, our actions are not a pure expression of our intention! People should be judged (or maybe not judged at all...:bugeye: ) by their intentions, not their actions. But how can we know somebody's intentions? Not very easily, since a lot of people lie. So I conclude that there is no way we can actually know people's intentions (and even if they say the truth, it is very unlikely that it will be understood...!)...

moonman
12-27-02, 02:15 PM
I don't think people should be judged at all.:) Only loved.

notme2000
12-27-02, 02:17 PM
No argument here. Ah the perils of being a self-aware species, lol.

moonman
12-27-02, 02:25 PM
hehe- Self-awareness a gift or a curse?

hmm, essay title brewing here.

TruthSeeker
12-27-02, 03:11 PM
I don't think people should be judged at all. Only loved.
Awesome! That's the very core of the thread. I'm happy someone do realize... :)

TruthSeeker
12-27-02, 03:13 PM
Notice why I talk so much about Love and why I insist that everyone shoul love one another unconditionally...? Here is the reason... :)

spookz
12-27-02, 03:27 PM
how can one claim to be impartial if an emotion such as love enters the equation? emotions are nothing but a distraction

intent is already a factor in legal judgements

moonman
12-27-02, 03:41 PM
how can one claim to be impartial if an emotion such as love enters the equation?
Impartial love, and all else ceases to matter.

spookz
12-27-02, 04:58 PM
acceptance and all else ceases to matter?

susan
12-27-02, 05:03 PM
I talk and enjoy conversation because i like to perform.
i wish i could be an actress. i mean, on a stage or in a movie.
sometimes i get to 'perform' in just plain old life and make
it more fun for others.

TruthSeeker
12-27-02, 09:20 PM
Original posted by moonman:
Impartial

That's the magic word. :)
Along with "unconditional"... ;)

notme2000
12-28-02, 01:29 PM
Try unconditional impartialness...

TruthSeeker
12-28-02, 03:08 PM
That works too...:D