Why is everyone obsessed with SW these days ST is much better than SW. To be blunt SW sucks! I like it yes but it still SUCKS! ST is much better why dont ppl see this?

I was in a chat room and we were *talking* about if the ST univerese met SW who would win in a fight. well they all said the Jedi would wave their hands and doa mind trick thing and the ENTIRE BORG collective would be destroyed while this is WRONG i could accept that but when i said to them that Q would not let the Jedi eliminate all species from that universe (becuase they would try to eliminate the Q) they said that the emperer would do some dark side thing and kill Q when i told them Q is a species and much more powerfull than the force they said the emperer cant not die... basicly i am saying ST would win against SW and ST is much much much much much BETTER :)

:rolleyes: Are you sure that this war of words with the SW people is really necessary? After all they are imaginary universes, with no basis in fact, just wishful thinking! Anyway, I do hope for a Star Trek future, but for that I think we need to work together as a people, that includes SW, B5, ST & non-SciFi peoples!!!
Live long and prosper.

Lest you forget that without Star Wars, the recent resurgence of Science Fiction that led to the success of the returning Star Trek franchise, might not have occured. They are both very good and I cannot see we can't enjoy both for what they are: SW a space opera, and ST a more classic science fiction universe.

Oh come on we all know that Janeway would just go in there and kick some butt, not to metnion that if the Babylon5 universe got involved ST and B5 would team up and beat the crap out of SW. And yes I believe that ST would win the fight between the two because in ST you got all sorts of creatures, not just a stupid robot and a man who can choke people with his mind. Now if the Farscape Universe got involved it might have a different outcome.

We had this discussion on the board two years ago.

I think SW would win. There's not as much red tape and political bungling, so SW could go in for the quick kill. Plus the force.

ST has ships and stuff but they aren't as good as SW ships.

But I like both for what they are. They are two different shows and comparing them is a bit like Vanilla and Chocolate Icecream. Different flavours of the same substance.

"But I like both for what they are. They are two different shows and comparing them is a bit like Vanilla and Chocolate Icecream. Different flavours of the same substance."

And I agree completely! But your forgeting that in the ST universe there is this being named Q he can do what ever he wants and is practically immortal, so if he didn't like your Mr.Choke hold guy then he would just throw him into space, and since time is meaningless to the Q he could just go back in time and kill Mr.Choke hold before he was even born. Better yet he could go kill George Lucas before he had a chance to make the Episode 1 film, because we all know we hated that, right? Or Q could just get rid of the SW universe it's that simple for him. And I agree that some of the SW ships are cool looking but on a Federation starship they have shields and can travel faster then the Millineium Falcon. So i yes I like starwars but when you get down to it ST would hurt them, hurt them real bad.

who is Q? Is he/she/it some sort of alien?

But actually while in the real world Q could do that to star wars your forgetting that Star Trek is a TV show. No TV show ever takes the easy way out, they always have to do everything the hard way meaning that it aint going to happen. ;)

"No TV show ever takes the easy way out."

Really?!? Ever hear of Dallas does no one remember how that show ended, they took the easy way out. Besides Q is a very powerful alien. and there are these beings called the wormhole aliens and they took out an entire fleet of starships that were about to attack the federation! so please these aliens would protect the federation because they enjoy messing with it.

Tell me one occupation in the ST universe that´s cooler than being a Jedi.. eh? Nothing beats a Jedi knight.
:DStarWars rules!!!:D

Actually I do enjoy startrek immensly. But for hardcore mythological heroics, the starwars universe is the place to be :)

I prefer William Gibson's and other writers of the Cyberpunk Genres image of the world and it's surrounding universe, Okay it's a little close to the here and now in comparison to ST/SW.

Perhaps I'm the only one that dreams of Simstim stars, Perhaps metabolising into a Keyboard Samurai or Unwitting Cowboy.... Maybe A Panther Modern or an Artiste....

My personal favourite thought is looking at the similarities of Quantists and Johnny Mnemonic, okay you might not spot them... but I can sense them .....

Oh, And what are Jedi's or The Federation going to do about Black Ice and the rise of the artificial intelligences?

Oh I know what you really want Stryder. It´s the primate lovemaking simstim :D

Hey, Isn´t Artoo and Threepio AI´s?
Veeery scary :D

But yeah, the federation really should worry ´bout the Panthers.
They´d mess them up real bad. The federation is so subtly fascistic. Like good natured colonials that love showing off their grade of civilization and making first contacts looking down their noses. They need a good dose of techno anarchy :D

There are so many powerful aliens in ST universe. I am not talking about the humanoid ones that Human meets day to day. I am talking about aliens like Q, Specie 8472, the Caretakers, Wormhole aliens, etc. Also ST contains multi-dimensions, parallel/mirror universes, and time travels. Force is powerful, but then what will a jedi do if he meets his future himself?

I am talking about aliens like Q, Specie 8472, the Caretakers, Wormhole aliens, etc


You left out the borg, Klingons, Romulans, who by the way all banded together to defeat the domnion, who are very powerful. Except the borg didnt help to defeat them but im sure if the federation would have lost the war that the borg would step in and asimilate everyone.

P.S. Darth Vader can't control the borg, and the Klingons would just drive there ships into his ships because they dont really care. It would be honorable.

MuliBoy,

Okay RTD2 and CP3O would be classed as artificial intelligences, but they aren't the same time as a Matrix consciousness potrayed within Gibsons world.

I suppose I'm just whole heartly hooked to the idea of accessing "the Grid", travelling to the perimeters of someones system and viewing it in as VRML or a virtual representation. I could access the information that's available on a 2 dimensional pop-up, or step back and start firing packets at the Ice, to try and get around it's security... (Dum--dee--dum... *whistles* not that it's illegal or anything.)

So the Ice starts melting at a good blow torch.... and low and behold, the security triggers an AI to intervene, and some stupid little *$@!£% taught them how to make your Virtual equipment (Gloves and visor) how to become a tool of torcher to teach you not to access with such a medium. (Boy! do we hate blackice...)

So you have to unplug, or have the AI turn up your visor to blind you, or force a feedback of power through your gloves sensors to burn you.

That's why when you watch the Simstim's you don't wear the gloves while your... contemplating whats going on, just incase that AI has shoved a timer on your gloves superconducting heat.

As for the Monkey Simstim... That's snuff, we don't watch that Trash....

as for the Panthers, Well you must know they like to get their hands on state of the art equipment and warez, the federations mainframe would definitely be infiltrated.

Maybe the Borg would learn the value of our AI companions, suffering at the hands of terminating Blackice.

Nobody wins the character comparison. Everyone's character is the best and will kick the butt of the other guy's.

Stryder seems to be in some place that we have yet to penetrate.

I love both to pieces, but must admit that ST owns a bigger chunk of my favor due to the amazing Enterprise.

For the uninitiated I will recommend the undisputed king of science fiction in the book realm: Dune! I have yet to hear a good way to beat prescience!

Yeah Stryder, I wouldn´t say 3PO is a AI to worship (unless you´re a ewok of course) :D

I can say I´m already jacking in to the network of organic superconsciousness through the psilocybin deck. There´s some serious hacking to be done with the code of material space and just wait until you stand avatar to avatar with the machinemonsters of corporate concrete.
These things will go for the neurons right away and strangle you like a chinese fingertrap. Go limp and slip throught the fractal cogworks :)
Flatline three times in one session and tamper with the ghosts of reality coding.

Been there, done that.
The mycel network´s been there since day one. It is pure code.
Wanna sign up for psychonaut duty?:)

Guys, guys,
Lets try it this way. Who would win in the following match ups?

C3P0 vs Mr Data
Chewbacca vs Worf
Skywalker vs Tash Yar
Yoda vs Spock
The Princess vs Seven

And the badguys

Emperor vs Borg Queen
Emperors Elite Guard vs Klingon Empire
Storm Troopers vs The Borg
The entire starwars universe vs Q


Lets not forget the specs of Enterprise E compared to the Falcon

this is between Star Trek universe and the Star Wars universe.

I beleive st would win. the st universe is populated by MANY powerful species and the sw universe seems to be pretty scarce in the powerful species area... btw the sw universes tech is like 700 years at least behind that of st. they use LASERS and actual missles with explosives in them. sure they have a big ray gun that looks like a beach ball but what good would that do them if the st species decided they didnt like it and played kick ball with it? hell in the movies the rebels did it the hard way it was orbiting a moon.... make a bunch of "tractor" ships and disable the things engines and push it into the damn moon:) the st species could do that or just blow the damn thing up.

I like sw btw. the jedis are cool:) but still all their useing pretty much is laser swords.and they all use lasers and iferior cloaking devices and explosives:) oh and some species still use kinetic weapons aka rifles and pistols.

I think the weapons in Star Trek are more powerful, but the ships in Star Wars could easily outrun them.

Remember in The Empire Strikes Back, when the Millenium Falcon is being chased by the Star Destroyer, and they elude them by attatching on to the back of it. The crew of the Star Destroyer think they went to hyperspace and one of them says that the Falcon could be at the other end of the galaxy by now. Compare that with the 70 yr trip that Voyager was expected to make just to get to the alpha quadrant. Those darn warp engines were proven to be damaging to the environment too in one episode of TNG. The Millenium Falcon is so tiny and efficient compared to the snail-crawl of the goliath Enterprise. You trek people are still using those slow, bulky, environment-damaging warp engines when you should be investing in cheap, clean, efficient hyperdrive units

Xwing fighters would run circles around those shuttlecrafts, and their proton torpedos could knock out the shields in a couple of hits.
Yoda and Mr Spock would probably fly off to debate the existence of the universe and those Lightsabers could turn those Klingon weapons into paperclips.

I agree that Q would be able to wipe out the Star Wars universe, but knowing Q, he would just sit back and grab some popcorn

err...no offense drac but the x-wings use lasers..almost all ships in the sw universe use lasers and the proton torpedoes are still regular explosives! anyways that was a galaxy class ship in tng now i think its an excelsior class and voyager has the most advanced warp engines the federation has. and that officer was just giveing a huge distance just to say that it was to far away to go after now. its some sort of english term thing dont know what though. in the sw universe they put alot of power in one place theyre big ships and stuff well if you just blow that one up thats alot of their power gone:)

Draculas Guest!
Hi.
When you say the other side of the galaxy, do we know if it's the other sided of the galactic plane or the galactic disc?
Bear in mind that warp 9 for Enterprise E is 1516 times c (light speed).
And thats not top speed which is about 9.7.
And the increment from the intergral factor is exponential.

And the reason the Rebel Alliance have never been to fluidic space?
They don't know how to get there!

Heres an interesting site for you to ponder over..

http://h4h.com/louis/speed.html

Its a whole debate on the technology of Star Trek Vs Star Wars. I admit the phasers are probably more powerful than lasers, but then none of those buggers had the guts to make a planet destroying super laser. And so what if a proton torpedo is standard explosives. Their still capable of damaging the shields on a puny shuttle.

Everytime the Enterprise gets hit by somethin, a bunch of computer consoles explode killing off the odd ensign. Someone said on TV recently, its like having a car with a dashboard that blows up in your face when you hit a traffic cone.

Voyager, fast?? Ha hahahaha, you must be joking, remember in Star Wars we are dealing with a GALACTIC empire, not some small time federation that has set itself up in the corner of the galaxy using Toilet roll tubes as engines.

Here is the list of pages on the site, but it is not always available

http://h4h.com/louis/sitefaq.html
http://h4h.com/louis/weap.html
http://h4h.com/louis/droids.html

Why would anyone in Star Wars need to visit fluidic space?? The Borg tried to conquer 8472 and ended up causing a war between them that could have wiped out every species in the galaxy. What were the words 8472 used, "This realm shall perish" or "be purged". Surely they would have been better off for not visiting fluidic space in the first place!

The people in Star Wars have much more sense then to go barging into other peoples dimensions and get themselves wiped out. duh! Stupid is as stupid does

Interesting site.
Just one question.
If the whole SW thing is set a long time ago in a galaxy far away...
Just what galaxy is this?
Surely not ours!
How big is it, diametrically?
Would this not affect comparisons made using galactic radii?
Is there an official, sanctioned reference source?
OK. That was more than one question, but I just can't help myself.

I cant be sure that the galaxy in Star Wars is the same size as ours, but if you look at that site, the bloke has done the maths, and calculated the speeds

Heres an excerpt:

"x C LY/hour
Warp 1 1.00 0.000
Warp 2 10.00 0.001
Warp 3 39.00 0.004
Warp 4 102.00 0.012
Warp 5 214.00 0.024
Warp 6 392.00 0.045
Warp 7 656.00 0.075
Warp 8 1,024.00 0.117
Warp 9 1,516.00 0.173
Warp 9.2 1,649.00 0.188
Warp 9.5 1,882.40 0.215
Warp 9.6 1,909.29 0.218
Warp 9.9 3,052.95 0.348 (E-D's max)
Warp 9.975 5,754.23 0.656 (Voyager's max)

Transwarp is twenty times faster than Voyager (Voyager series), which puts it at about 11 light years per hour.

ST sub-space comms is 22.8 light-years per hour, or about twice as fast as transwarp, so they can still get advance warning of a Borg cube approaching.

Slower ships in SW, like twenty year old Victory-class destroyers, can make 127 light-years per hour (direct from "Dark Force Rising"). That is 200 times faster than Voyager, twenty times faster than sub-space communications, and ten times faster than transwarp.

In the movies, ships cover distances of 30,000 light years in a day or two, implying speeds of upto 10,000,000 times light-speed, or up to seven times faster than Victory-class destroyers."

That pretty much says it all. Besides, whats the problem, Star Trek has the weaponry, Star Wars has the speed, dont get greedy!

I've already seen the site......

But what you said was right.
I do get greedy.
I just can't help myself.
Sorry!

I'll disarm the self replicating mines.

It would be interesting to see how the tech from B5 would fit into all of this. Their hyperspace is like another dimension. I think they still use lasers, and they dont have shields as such, but some ships like the white star have organic skins which can adapt to energy blasts.

This site is a laugh:

http://www.electricferret.com/fights/defiant.htm

Comic book battles, one of the funniest sites I've seen in ages. :D

Great Site!
Not too sure about the result of the Defiant / Whitestar matchup, but there you go.

Originally posted by esp
Great Site!
Not too sure about the result of the Defiant / Whitestar matchup, but there you go.

Har me neither, those quantum torpedoes should have ripped it to shreds, but then the White Star is a sexy mutha of a ship. :cool:

Well what are yalls favorite ships? Mine are:

1. Defiant
2. Whitestar
3. Deathstar

Can't we enjoy the best from each show? AND IT IS just A SHOW

ooh, tough one

(not in order of preference)

1 Shadow vessel (B5, creepy looking ship and quite powerful)

2 White Star (B5, sleek and cool looking with its bio-skin)

3 Millenium Falcon (SW, a bit beat up and shabby looking, but very fast in hyperspace)

4 USS Prometheus (ST, multi vector attack, can transform into a mini fleet and trounce the romulans, nifty)

5 Klingon Bird of Prey (ST, Star Trek 6 was one of my fav ST films, involved a prototype ship that can fire when cloaked)

Negh'var class warship
D'Deridex class warbird
Galaxy class starship
USS Phoenix (Defiant prototype)
Talon
Tie Fighter ('cause they're just so nifty)

Again in no order.

As esp mentioned, a long time ago, a galaxy far far away.
In the starwars universe the epic tale is ancient. You trekkies have forgotten to evolve the sw-technology at least a few centuries.
Bye Borgs, bye klingons. The jedis laugh at their collectives and clans.
You might say what you like, StarWars still looms tall above your petty federation *pokes tounge out and gives you lip music*

:D:D:D

My favorite has to be the White Star, although I don't watch B5 more than once a month :p

Species 8472 has pretty neat little ships too, not much to look at but the organic nature and the planet destroying grouping weapon thingy are cool ;)

Muliboy,

please let's not go there again. Last time it took days to stop the arguing!
:)

I´m just messing :)

I fail to comprehend why anyone would have to choose between Starwars and StarTrek. SW is fantasy and ST is SciFi.
Both are wonderful, and great contributions to the iconography of the human race :)

Originally posted by MuliBoy
I´m just messing :)

I fail to comprehend why anyone would have to choose between Starwars and StarTrek. SW is fantasy and ST is SciFi.
Both are wonderful, and great contributions to the iconography of the human race :)

"Ditto" , "Ditto" and "Ditto"

By the way this is how this thread started:

Originally posted by Borg255
Why is everyone obsessed with SW these days ST is much better than SW. To be blunt SW sucks! I like it yes but it still SUCKS! ST is much better why dont ppl see this?

I was in a chat room and we were *talking* about if the ST univerese met SW who would win in a fight. well they all said the Jedi would wave their hands and doa mind trick thing and the ENTIRE BORG collective would be destroyed while this is WRONG i could accept that but when i said to them that Q would not let the Jedi eliminate all species from that universe (becuase they would try to eliminate the Q) they said that the emperer would do some dark side thing and kill Q when i told them Q is a species and much more powerfull than the force they said the emperer cant not die... basicly i am saying ST would win against SW and ST is much much much much much BETTER :)

Originally posted by Randolfo
:rolleyes: Are you sure that this war of words with the SW people is really necessary? After all they are imaginary universes, with no basis in fact, just wishful thinking! Anyway, I do hope for a Star Trek future, but for that I think we need to work together as a people, that includes SW, B5, ST & non-SciFi peoples!!!
Live long and prosper.

That's my thoughts and I'm sticking by them.

:D :D ;)

I personally don't like ST. There is no overall storyline, those little peices of metal on their chest majically translates an alien's entire language from just one sentance (plus, they are supposed to be durable, but in one Voyager episode some primitive humanoid took a rock and smashed it to pieces in one hit, I mean, by 2400 or so AD I'm sure they could implant those things into the brain or something). The episodes are getting so predictable now that it's getting sad. Every episode there is both a people based problem and a technology based problem.

Usually (at least in STNG), the first 40 minutes dealt with the people problem, then at the end they just threw in an attack or spacial anomaly of some kind. Did I mention it has no storyline?

The only ST I have come to respect is Voyager, I think they did a much better job with it than STNG or DS9 (or Enterprise). Although, the Dominion-DS9 fight was quite entertaining ;)

Right now I'm just waiting for a new SciFi series to come out that's actually worth spending an hour a week watching.