I for one am open to any idea or theory that makes much sense and proves itself pretty much (I mean, lets say christianism, wheres the proof?). Of course, if God actually does exist, I'm willing to be at his service - and if he doesn't want me to do something, then he only has to tell me personally, in a way I WILL understand, and I won't do it. But now, dont tell some freaks to tell it to some other freaks to tell it to some other freaks and so on to tell it to me - because to me that would sound much like a human invention and I fail to believe in it and ruin my happiness caring about not doing "sins", and being a "good believer" or whatever, only to get laughed at by the creators of the "rumour".

He has written on every heart what is good and what is bad. As for some proof, here's an apparition of Mary.

http://www.zeitun-eg.org/start.htm

Please read my original post again. Honestly I don't see what's so wrong with most "sins", either. The point is: if theres a good reason NOT to do it, then have god tell me personally and sure I'll listen to him. But I don't see any and he doesn't seem to be talking to me.

Please read my original post again. Honestly I don't see what's so wrong with most "sins", either. The point is: if theres a good reason NOT to do it, then have god tell me personally and sure I'll listen to him. But I don't see any and he doesn't seem to be talking to me.

All sin harms us and others so those are the two reasons. And we all have concience. For example, if you went and stole something, you'd probably feel bad. But you do not need to read that stealing is wrong, you already knew it was wrong.

I would feel bad for the person yes. But that has nothing to do with God.
Feeling bad for sinning in general comes from the brainwashing, which is the reason I'm not sorry for living my own life and saying God is kinda the suck. Like I said in my previous posts, he only has to tell me personally, not some freaks to tell me - and I'll do whatever he pleases.

Brainwashing? Ok, why do you feel harming others is bad? God is not going to tell every minute detail of what is wrong, because our forefather ate the fruit of knowledge of good and evil. The fact that you are questioning if it's wrong or not, in most cases means that it is wrong.

God will not explain me by himself because it is unlikely that he actually exists as you see him.

As for the fruit of knowledge of good and evil, considering adam and eve did NOT know what was good and what was bad before they ate of it, how could they have known that the serpent was bad and god was good? and thus how can they be blamed for eating it?

As for the fruit of knowledge of good and evil, considering adam and eve did NOT know what was good and what was bad before they ate of it, how could they have known that the serpent was bad and god was good? and thus how can they be blamed for eating it?

Well, looking at the story from a literalist standpoint. Adam and Eve both knew that God was their creator. He walked with them daily. Adam asked God for a companion and God made it. He was well aware that God was the creator of the world and was in charge. Therefore disobedience to God was disobedience to his creator.

God will not explain me by himself because it is unlikely that he actually exists as you see him.
Your testing God. It's a vain attempt.


As for the fruit of knowledge of good and evil, considering adam and eve did NOT know what was good and what was bad before they ate of it, how could they have known that the serpent was bad and god was good? and thus how can they be blamed for eating it?

Jesus said that only God was good. So the tree that they ate from was tainted knowledge, while before having this knowledge, they only knew the goodness that was God.

Or you can always make your task easier and say,
"I do not wish to know the truth, I simply abide by the rules and legends that were given to me by some freaks" or even "I'm too afraid to find out the truth, which is why I believe in this without asking any questions."

Or you can always make your task easier and say,
"I do not wish to know the truth, I simply abide by the rules and legends that were given to me by some freaks" or even "I'm too afraid to find out the truth, which is why I believe in this without asking any questions."

I don't deny that God cannot go talk to you. For example, Abimalech was about to sleep with Sarah when God came to him in a dream and told him that she was married, but God did not come to him to tell that adultry was wrong.

You did not read the site I gave you. The church was built in 1920 due to Mary's request and she predicted that she would come back in 50 years, another message at another site predicted that Mary was going to come to Egypt and the apparition was seen by millions and we have photographs. So this is not a legend. This is something that we have proof of and is not a legend.

Want to really amaze me? Tell me about how god has actually entered into contact with YOU, and how you are so sure that you're not wrong. As for the website: I'm sorry, I couldn't be assed to read it, I dislike losing time reading the same christian thing over and over again: when they speak and seem to be SO sure of themselves, and seem to take the bible as a 100% proof of god's existance, actions, and so on. (and when they don't want to accept to hear what you're trying to tell them..)

Want to really amaze me? Tell me about how god has actually entered into contact with YOU,

I do not know if it was God or not. What good is "trust me" if you do not know how?

Anyways, you have no excuse. At least look at the pictures(I've attached one), what UFO is like this?

To me it seems like.. not very real? :)

The Quran is the word of God if you want to hear what he has said. The Bible and Torah have also the words of God, but over time, the holy books were corrupted. Kings changed it. Priests changed it. They all changed it to suit their needs.

As for me, I just have a feeling God is there. Sometimes I don't follow what I'm told and I sin, but I do ask for forgiveness. It is my fault. But even as I sin, I know God is watching me and is aware of my actions.

Also, you call the Christians freaks. Therefore, you disagree with their thoughts and probably mine too and do not respect their views, hence the freaks.

I suggest you do a little reading into the holy books. It might help. But in my opinion, I'm thinking you might be looking for a sign. Like you would go to church and when you walk out, you would see a rainbow.

A sign I would understand and that I could use as a proof to myself (and myself only). And no I didn't say you were freaks because of your points of view.

It was on egyptian television and she has been seen by 1000s in egypt. It's not like some hoax or anything. The egyptian authorities even looked for some means of projection. When you put together all the people, including muslims, who have seen her and photographic evidence, it makes a fairly convincing argument. http://members.aol.com/bjw1106/marian7.htm

Mithadon,
Have you ever considered that God might not be limited to the currently accepted modes of thought? Why should He adapt to us? God has described the path to wisdom - the path to knowledge about Him, and it is by including Him in your reality.

Let me make an extreme example: Say you were exceptionally rational and honest: a good man with good principles - but that living this way meant that you only accepted what you saw in your immediate presence as real. Nothing outside what you could experience and verify with all five your senses exists or can change your life. You are also living in a small wooden house in the middle of nowhere.

By your own decisions, you choose to exclude any possibility of God from your life. You say you invite God in, but at the same time you make yourself into a little ball, cup your hands, and say: this is where I want Him to be.

On the other hand, if you believe that God can and wants to enter our life, you must be open to any possibility of who God might be, what He could do - and be prepared for the possibility that it might not be within your current sphere of reasoning. Of course God can intrude, shake things up a bit, make you wonder... but will you acknowledge that it was Him, or was it just hormones? Remember: nothing - nothing - can encompass more than denial.

My personal experience is that knowledge of God exists within the parameters of doing what God wants you to do. Nothing is automatically excluded or automatically included. You say God should prove himself to you...

What if He already has? Would you see it? Would you accept it? I'm not talking photographs of apparitions, miraculous events in your life, or sudden enlightenment - these are all things that suppose God cannot do something that is simply what it is - that He is not simply "who He is". If you can't experience God in your ordinary life, it means He is limited to "extra-ordinary" experiences. What do you think?

You seem to talk about God as a person more than the "spirit who created the universe and us all". If God is so forgiving and understanding, then why can't he read my brain (for that is all I am for now, matter) and give me a chance to know that he exists without being told by fools who simply follow the wave without asking a question?

Have you ever considered you might be wrong, Jenyar?
The truth is, there is no proof that God exists. And since I dislike the idea of saying "God has created us all, praise God" without asking a single question because I'm too afraid to look for the truth, I'd rather stick to science and do what I please (I'm not the kind of person who's going to steal anything from the shop, or insult people for fun or anything) instead of giving my life to a spirit (who, as you say, created us all) without even having a good reason to.

Mithadon God can show you a sign but first you will have to trust in them to give you what you need to believe. Also your not reading what I gave you. The information and complaints department of Egypt, Zeitun says that it is an undeniable fact. Unless if you show evidence that contradicts Mary visiting Zeitun, then a scientisit would choose the most obvious explanation.

Originally posted by Mithadon
You seem to talk about God as a person more than the "spirit who created the universe and us all". If God is so forgiving and understanding, then why can't he read my brain (for that is all I am for now, matter) and give me a chance to know that he exists without being told by fools who simply follow the wave without asking a question?
I have reasons for doing that. And who says He can't (and doesn't) read your mind? You have the chance to know that He exists. But it is evidently not the kind of knowledge that just appears (is there any kind of knowledge that just appears?).

May I quote something in this regard?

Romans 10
13... "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Joel 2:32)
14How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? 15And how can they preach unless they are sent?

Christianity is evidently not a "wave" I follow, since it is not the predicatble, rational, acceptable mode of thought a person is expected to follow, is it? It is a message that has originated in Jerusalem at around 40AD. The only "wave" seems to be that God does not exist, or that Jesus was deluded.

Have you ever considered you might be wrong, Jenyar?
Frequently. But I also question the the question, if I could put it that way. Their is nothing that indicates I should be wrong. One of my reasons is that nowhere have I ever found anybody who was undeniably right. I certainly am not "right". But I have reason to believe in the credibility of those of who claim to have heard and experienced, because I see the same truth around me everywhere I look. It is something I take hold of, not something I own or thought out.

Who said "spend time with people who are looking for the truth, but flee from those who claim to have found it"? Truth can still exist even when people doubt it.

The truth is, there is no proof that God exists. And since I dislike the idea of saying "God has created us all, praise God" without asking a single question because I'm too afraid to look for the truth, I'd rather stick to science and do what I please (I'm not the kind of person who's going to steal anything from the shop, or insult people for fun or anything) instead of giving my life to a spirit (who, as you say, created us all) without even having a good reason to.
Is that really the truth? What made you believe it? What is the nature of the god you have disproven? The only god I have ever seen undeniably disproven is the scientific one - the god who is subject to the abilities of his creation.

The God I believe in has a history that goes as far back as humanity itself. He is a God who has made choices, has shown no favouritism, and has a record of being merciful. To deny that He exists, you have to deny everything those who know Him and those who He revealed Himself to have ever believed. On what grounds do you do this? Does reason really prevent you from believing in God, or is it just an excuse?

You are an honest person, and it would be a bad idea to stop asking questions. But make certain you do not ask only the questions you know the answers of. If you want a sign or wonder, why wouldn't Jesus resurrection be suffiecient?