Has anyone ever spent any time thinking about this? Ever since the invention of birth control, people have been spending their paychecks and hours upon hours every week trying to "score". However, what is actually achieved by this other than scratching a biological itch?

There is one ultimate purpose for sex: making babies. I'm sure you all know that.

After thinking about this for a while, I wondered, what exactly is the difference between sex purely for pleasure and bulimia?

You get horny. You look for sex, you get sex. No babies are made.
A bulimic gets hungry. They eat food. They vomit food.

Is there really any point to sex for pleasure other than....it feels good? And if that is the case, how much time do we pointlessly waste looking for it and doing it? How many hours do men waste chasing their genitalia around the world achieving absolutely nothing?

People go to the movies and have fun. Is that "bulimia" as well? :rolleyes:

My advice: grow up and get a girlfriend. :rolleyes:

Wow, I didn't expect that reply. Way to miss the point. This is meant to be a discussion.

I bet you buy lots of shiny silver things with lots of buttons, right?

Next.

Bulimia is eating to excess and is beyond the bulimic's control. The same isn't necessarily true of people who have sex for pleasure although, as with any biological drive, some make a vice of it. Moderation is the key.

Is there really any point to sex for pleasure other than....it feels good? And if that is the case, how much time do we pointlessly waste looking for it and doing it? How many hours do men waste chasing their genitalia around the world achieving absolutely nothing?
What else would you have them do with their time? Focus on their careers? Go to the movies? Hang out with their friends? What's wrong with people deciding for themselves how their time is best spent?

I'm not telling anyone what to do with their time.

There are many human activities that exist mainly or solely for pleasure. Why does recreational sex bother you?

Where did I say it bothered me? You've got one more assumption before I stop replying to you.

This is just a discussion. No one is going to take your penis away.

Well then I guess the answer to your question is fairly straightforward. Sex serves whatever purpose you want it to serve. If you do it solely for pleasure, then by definition there's no other point to it. Some people might do it for additional reasons though, eg. bragging rights.
After thinking about this for a while, I wondered, what exactly is the difference between sex purely for pleasure and bulimia?
Among other things, sex doesn't make you throw up afterward.

Uhhh last I checked neither does bulimia. It's a voluntary act, the same as slipping on a condom or taking a birth control pill.

I think you missed the parallel there.

Uhhh last I checked neither does bulimia.
That's not what you said here:
A bulimic gets hungry. They eat food. They vomit food.
I think you missed the parallel there.
You're comparing bulimia and sex bacause of the "hunger" that drives people to it. First of all, bulimia is an eating disorder that's usually linked with stress or depression - not hunger. Even ignoring that, pointing out some similarities between bulimia and recreational sex doesn't imply that they share even more properties - like a health hazard. I see your parallel, but I don't see why you brought it up.

I missed out the two fingers down the throat? Is that it? Well, I missed out the part before "you get sex" about finding a woman or even taking your clothes off, does that mean we are now humping a stray dog in futility through our trouser crotch? Do I also have to type "breath in, breath out"?

Is that assumption number three?

Now you're not making any sense.

Well, as far as I can tell, you assumed that because I didn't explicitly type "They put two fingers down their throat" I was under the false impression that the "vomiting" part of bulimia was involuntary.

Ah. Ok. Still, bulimia can be very harmful for a sufferer's health, and is usually an indication of psychological issues. This is why it is considered a problem - not because of the food wasted.

"Feeling good" is nothing to be disparaged. Why must there be any point besides "feeling good"? Feeling good is an indication of the proper functioning of an organism.

Maybe so, but "putting their fingers down their throat" is also part of the sickness of bulimia and as such is hardly a "voluntary" act

Ever since the invention of birth control, people have been spending their paychecks and hours upon hours every week trying to "score".

I hate to break it to you but ever since humans have had genitals to rub together we've been sex crazed, it's not some new fad. Birth control just makes it less risky. Not to mention Condoms have been with us in one form or another since the classical era.

Also sex for reasons other than procreation can be a beautiful thing, an intimate expression of love, and such, unless you're a frigid prude, I guess.

As far as the biological reasons for why we feel the urge to screw everything that moves and has the right holes, it's a survival adaptation. If we are driven to have sex frequently then we'll also compete to have sex, strong men get to do it frequently and women with the strongest males, and because there's just more sex all around than if it were some drudgery we undertook purely and solely to create a child, birth rates are much higher, and tribal populations balloon. I know that that doesn't exactly fit with our 1950s Leave it to Beaver family values type ideals, but hey that's primeval man, gotta make babies faster than the saber toothed cats can eat ‘em!

Such impulses don't serve us very well in modern civilized society, and certainly not if we choose to adopt prudish Victorian attitudes towards our own bodies. We are free, though, to choose to either kill our desires surgically or chemically (maybe freeze some sex-cells for an immaculate insemination later in life) or simply deal with it and join the rest of society and try to enjoy our physical impulses rather than fight against them constantly. That's not to say that it's a good thing to literally screw every member of the opposite (or same) sex as yourself, everything in moderation, of course and neither extreme is necessarily healthy.

Another random point: Homosexuality was ancient man's birth-control! ha! Well that and the rhythm method. . . but I guess the Greeks and Romans didn't like keeping to schedules like that.

Where did I say it bothered me?

In your initial post. Give people credit and don't play silly semantic games, just because you didn't come right out and say "I don't like that people have sex for fun" doesn't mean that you didn't express that idea. Your language made it very clear that this is not a social trend which you think very much of.

If you need me to be a little clearer, you compared sexual promiscuity to an eating disorder, and claimed to have knowledge of the single true purpose of sex- taking these comments into context with your full post it's pretty obvious what your opinion is. If this isn't the message you intended to put across then you should apologize for being unclear and offer to more clearly explain either what you meant or what your feelings on the matter really are.

For extra points try to critically analyze this post and figure out how I feel about being a condescending prick when I feel others have been a bit rude and dishonest in their own threads.

Answer written below in white - highlight to read.
It gives me a big smirking grin!

Has anyone ever spent any time thinking about this?

The premise is extraordinary to me.

It seems to suppose that there is no significance to sexual frustration apart from the event of an actual sexual encounter, which would be to say that the general physical and mental health of a sexually mature adult is unaffected, that there is no discernible difference between the conduct of a person sexual satisfied as compared to one deprived.

If only because of my own experience I doubt this to the extent that I have to doubt the sincerity of the argument to begin with.

--- Ron.

Well apart from being stricken with the inability to get laid, what you guys say is beyond the point.

Looked at from a modern scientific point of view sex is just designed to allow the best to breed into more of the best, hopefully ending with the best of the best.

Because I'm not the best, not even close, I live at home, am a 25 year old virgin, I basically am never getting screwed. However if you look at it from this point of view ehh who cares. So one guys not getting laid, woman need men that have money and can make babies.

In fact just a little while ago I had someone mention to me I was not making enough so I couldn't get with her, but that she was willing to be friends. How nice right? Sexy, hot, fine, married with 2 kids and still won't sleep with me LOL. She kinda made fun actually, near the time I was leaving. It was something I'd not really have liked, but she did it. I think more it was to let me know she's never, on the planet, going to bang me. I appreciate that I really do, it just is the way nature works.

I do however feel I've gone somewhat beyond nature in my thinking, sometimes I feel like I'm not of this world, perhaps so different from everyone that I will never get any sex. I do have antidepressants!

Sex is fun, it's good, but the ultimate purpose is to breed.

Looked at from a modern scientific point of view sex is just designed to allow the best to breed into more of the best, hopefully ending with the best of the best.


Looked at from my poiint of view the best thing about actually doing it is to then be rid of the need for the modern scientific point of view of it.

--- Ron.

I live at home, am a 25 year old virgin

I am almost in the same boat as you. I realised yesterday I hardly even think about getting sex....the other day I just realised it's been more than 5 years since I was with a chick and even longer since I had a girlfriend, and I really don't care. I see everyone having break up troubles and people getting divorces and all this other nonsense, and I can't help but think life is so much easier without all that shit to worry about.

What you come away with depends on what you take to a situation.

Sweet wine is not made from sour grapes.

--- Ron.

I see everyone having break up troubles and people getting divorces and all this other nonsense, and I can't help but think life is so much easier without all that shit to worry about.
I agree here, actually. Most people seem to think it's worth it though.

I agree here, actually. Most people seem to think it's worth it though.


It depends on what you need from a relationship and how honest you can be about it. If you just need sex, that's harder if one of the two gets emotionally involved.

In my case, I feel honesty is very important, right from the beginning; I also believe that going into a relationship merely for sex does not create a good basis for a relationship ( I'm old fashioned, I guess). Friendship is important to me, alongwith the spark, plus stuff in common to talk about and do together and also a basic morality about what's right and wrong.

If you can get this, well then it needs work and love and laughter to sustain it. It needs understanding and compromise to make it work. Finally, believe me, its all worth it. :)

Sex is fun, it's good
Woah ... I think that depends on the situation. Unsafe massive orgy sex with AIDS carrying crack addicts wouldn't qualify as 'good' in my book. :eek:

G. F. Schleebenhorst,

What's your point? I presented you with a reductio ad absurdum. You are not going to accept it? ;)

....You get horny. You look for sex, you get sex....
My advice: grow up and get ...
Well apart from being stricken with the inability to get ....
...If you can get this...

It depresses me, all this get get get get get.

It is also possible to give, to improve the good in general.

--- Ron.

It depresses me, all this get get get get get.

It is also possible to give, to improve the good in general.

--- Ron.

Well of course, but its hard to give if you're not getting; both have to invest equally (well almost) in the relationship

Yes...

Well of course, but its hard to give if you're not getting; both have to invest equally (well almost) in the relationship

I don't like it, the terminology, "getting laid" and "having sex".

Works better when I let it have me.

--- Ron.

I don't like it, the terminology, "getting laid" and "having sex".

Works better when I let it have me.

--- Ron.
I learnt to live with that. I find it kinda funny now, though I still find those expressions kinda vulgar...

It depresses me, all this get get get get get.

It is also possible to give, to improve the good in general.

--- Ron.

So you do not like selfishness? It could be argued that people give so they can feel good about themselves, thus thinking about themselves. I think wes morris argued this point, and I agree with him.

Seems all actions, as selfless as some might seem, are done to meet one's own needs or wants. So one is still "getting" more than than is given. An even trade is not worthwhile.

I've somehow oversickened the need for romantic relationships and sex.
I was all into girls when most others were playing in the sandbox (literally), even teachers complained about me, and I quit and had enough of relationships at about 18.

Now I have no emotional need for another human being whasoever. I think my studies and practice of buddhism is the reason. I like the freedom and being out of the game. :)

So you do not like selfishness? It could be argued that people give so they can feel good about themselves, thus thinking about themselves. I think wes morris argued this point, and I agree with him.

Seems all actions, as selfless as some might seem, are done to meet one's own needs or wants. So one is still "getting" more than than is given. An even trade is not worthwhile.

Sex is not an even trade.

--- Ron.

Sex is not an even trade.

--- Ron.

Well for one, I was not thinking about sex when I replied as my reply was in terms of the game "give and recieve" for any such game. It's a nonzero-sum game. And two, tell me why sex is not an even trade. Who receives more? Who gives more?

And what I mean by a "trade" is what you (or anyone else) GIVE balanced against what you RECEIVE. What you receive does not have to come from the giver.

Now I have no emotional need for another human being whasoever. I think my studies and practice of buddhism is the reason. I like the freedom and being out of the game. :)

I felt like that a few years ago, and more recently for that matter, but my wife was not so pleased with it.

--- Ron.

I don't like it, the terminology, "getting laid" and "having sex".

Works better when I let it have me.

--- Ron.

Didn't you read my post; I don't mean it in terms of just sex; the whole relationship is important to me. Sex is best with someone who loves and understands you and that is made up of a million things. Not just the things you say and do when both are at the best, more, I think the interactions between them when either is at their worst ( or even both, which is really difficult). Its more about the little day to day things than the grand occasions and the support you are willing not only to give but also to accept ( a lot of people have issues even accepting support).

So when I say "get" or "give" I mean all these things; its a lot of work and most people nowadays are disinclined to put in the effort.

Didn't you read my post; I don't mean it in terms of just sex; the whole relationship is important to me. Sex is best with someone who loves and understands you and that is made up of a million things. Not just the things you say and do when both are at the best, more, I think the interactions between them when either is at their worst ( or even both, which is really difficult). Its more about the little day to day things than the grand occasions and the support you are willing not only to give but also to accept ( a lot of people have issues even accepting support).

So when I say "get" or "give" I mean all these things; its a lot of work and most people nowadays are disinclined to put in the effort.
I totally agree with that sam. These guys are a bunch of troglodytes.

So when I say "get" or "give" I mean all these things; its a lot of work and most people nowadays are disinclined to put in the effort.

Steady on, ... I was not trying to get at you.

It the nowadays thing that gets to me, seems to be so different now. When I was younger there was never the same sense of difficulty about it.

--- Ron.

And two, tell me why sex is not an even trade. Who receives more? Who gives more?


Come on.

Keep the score.

How many women would take money from you for sex and how many would give you money for sex?

--- Ron.

There is one ultimate purpose for sex: making babies. I'm sure you all know that.While this may be its primary purpose it has more than one important secondary purpose, especially in the case of humans. These secondary functions require that it also be fun and meaningful.

I would argue that the primary purpose of sex is pleasure and bonding and that reproduction is secondary. Given all the sex that goes on, it only results in a baby a tiny fraction of the time. Except for expanding the genetic pallette of the offspring, sex is not necessary. Many organisms reproduce asexually.

Come on.

Keep the score.

How many women would take money from you for sex and how many would give you money for sex?

--- Ron.

Hmm why would women pay guys? They can easily get them for free :D

This is invalid logic. Sex orignated as a means of reproduction and is thus, automatically, primary. Evolution has adapted this primary function to fulfill the important secondary functions you mention.
It is irrelevant that some organisms (most organisms) reproduce asexually. The post thread was addressing human sexuality and for humans the primary function is reproduction, for without it the species would end.

Nice picture Perplexity

The post thread was addressing human sexuality and for humans the primary function is reproduction, for without it the species would end.


The primary biological function may be reproduction but super's right there's much more sex that goes on than reproduction (which is a good thing considering the present population); besides, how would your logic apply for homosexuality? There's only pleasure involved there.

Hmm why would women pay guys? They can easily get them for free :D

If you prefer quantity to quality.

--- Ron.

If you prefer quantity to quality.

--- Ron.

It was a joke, but seriously, considering that, how does the equation change once you're in a relationship?

Come on.

Keep the score.

How many women would take money from you for sex and how many would give you money for sex?

--- Ron.

I am talking about the actual act. Man and woman are about to have sex, have sex, and then stop. Regardless of who receives more or gives more, my point is that they both end with POSTIVE score (recieve more than they give)... it's a selfish game. It's mostly a subconscious game, but it is being played.

I feel cognitive dissonance plays a part in this.

This is invalid logic.
Yeah? So?

Fine. I retract my statement. But sam has a point with the homosexual thing. Of course, ancient humans probably didn't reason that if they didn't have sex, they'd die out. Clearly sex has to be nicely motivational to the organism on an unconscious, emotional and physical level. Which it is. Very nicely indeed. What's the topic here again? :confused:

I totally agree with that sam. These guys are a bunch of troglodytes.
Yes I agree too sam, you're brilliant you are!

Do you fancy having sex at all?

I am talking about the actual act. Man and woman are about to have sex, have sex, and then stop. Regardless of who receives more or gives more, my point is that they both end with POSTIVE score (recieve more than they give)... it's a selfish game. It's mostly a subconscious game, but it is being played.

I feel cognitive dissonance plays a part in this.

Sounds like you're thinking too much

Yes I agree to sam, you're brilliant you are!

Do you fancy having sex at all?

Not right now thanks. My boyfriend might have issues. :D

I am talking about the actual act. Man and woman are about to have sex, have sex, and then stop. Regardless of who receives more or gives more, my point is that they both end with POSTIVE score (recieve more than they give)... it's a selfish game. It's mostly a subconscious game, but it is being played.

Does this apply to rape?


I feel cognitive dissonance plays a part in this.

a part in ...?

Please elaborate. You have lost me there.

--- Ron.

Sounds like you're thinking too much

How? My point is to attack the assertion that we should give more than receive. Really when you think about it that is off-topic.

And I do not know why I am even a part of this thread.

It was a joke, but seriously, considering that, how does the equation change once you're in a relationship?

Depends on those concerned, doesn't it?

I have the impression that an equal balance of sexual proclivity is rare in relationships.

Makes me think of the "How much older" thread.

One problem is that women seem to only know what they need when they've already had it.

--- Ron.

My point is to attack the assertion that we should give more than receive.


I do not recall that this was asserted.

Perhaps you'd better read the postings again.

A lot of the time you might just have to give more than you receive. It depends. For an "equal trade" two people would need to be equally disposed emotionally and in terms of experience. In the real World one of the two usually makes the running. Seduction is about domination and surrender, not like you sit down to negotiate a business deal.

--- Ron.

How? My point is to attack the assertion that we should give more than receive. Really when you think about it that is off-topic.

And I do not know why I am even a part of this thread.

The topic is sex for pleasure so how are you off-topic?
What do you mean give more than receive; this is not an and/or situation. Sex is mutual, there are two people involved ( or should be) and its about mutual give and take. You're not supposed to follow a Sex in 3 easy steps or keep count of anything.

Ron is right. You guys are making it too complicated. It's not that much of an effort.

It depends on what you need from a relationship and how honest you can be about it. If you just need sex, that's harder if one of the two gets emotionally involved.
That's my point: I don't really *need* anything. I often feel I'd like a girlfriend (a real relationship, not a temporary sex partner) - but I know from experience that there are things I'm much more likely to be successful at, so I focus on those instead.
( I'm old fashioned, I guess).
No you're not. So-called "players" and "sluts" (not meant derogatively - just for lack of better terms) have always been around. They may be louder/draw more attention to themselves, but that doesn't necessarily make them the norm. Not that I really care what the statistics look like.

I do not recall that this was asserted.

Perhaps you'd better read the postings again.

--- Ron.

I suppose you are correct!

It depresses me, all this get get get get get.

It is also possible to give, to improve the good in general.

I suppose it reminded me of an issue me and Mr. Morris supported some time in the past, and I molded your statement into an attack on that. Sorry :o

Ron is right. You guys are making it too complicated. It's not that much of an effort.

Well as Ron helped me realize, I was turning this discussion into a philosophical problem (or psychological) that would have quickly gone completely off-topic.

Edit: To be honest, I never actually read the first post of this thread to know what it is that we suppose to discuss :rolleyes:

Edit: To be honest, I never actually read the first post of this thread to know what it is that we suppose to discuss :rolleyes:


Well that would have helped :D

Well as Ron helped me realize, I was turning this discussion into a philosophical problem (or psychological) that would have quickly gone completely off-topic.


I like to mix sex with psychology and philosophy.
I find that it doesn't hurt to do so, to come to terms with what really goes on.
Better that way than like sex is animal, beastly, not the sort of thing for a really intelligent person to attempt.
Sex is a big part of life. Look at how much of the internet is sex.
Sex matters. It makes a difference.

--- Ron.

G. F. Schleebenhorst,

What's your point? I presented you with a reductio ad absurdum. You are not going to accept it? ;)

I might accept it if I knew what a reductio ad absurdum was.

I like to mix sex with psychology and philosophy.
I find that it doesn't hurt to do so, to come to terms with what really goes on.
Better that way than like sex is animal, beastly, not the sort of thing for a really intelligent person to attempt.
Sex is a big part of life. Look at how much of the internet is sex.
Sex matters. It makes a difference.

--- Ron.

I think I do that too. Sex should also be fun though.

I like to mix sex with psychology and philosophy.
Most people do this, whether they want to or not. That's because for most of us, much more than being a simple biological function, sex and it's aftermath shapes our identity.

That's my point: I don't really *need* anything. I often feel I'd like a girlfriend (a real relationship, not a temporary sex partner) - but I know from experience that there are things I'm much more likely to be successful at, so I focus on those instead.

Well you're probably young and there's no harm in taking your time

No you're not. So-called "players" and "sluts" (not meant derogatively - just for lack of better terms) have always been around. They may be louder/draw more attention to themselves, but that doesn't necessarily make them the norm. Not that I really care what the statistics look like.

I didn't mean so much as sleeping around, more in terms of expectations from a relationship.

Well you're probably young and there's no harm in taking your time
I'm 19 :mad:

I'm big and old and wise and grown up and mature and as experienced as I'll ever be and ...
I didn't mean so much as sleeping around, more in terms of expectations from a relationship.
I'm no expert, but your expectations seemed perfectly normal to me - not idealistic or old-fashioned. Just saying.

I'm 19 :mad:

I'm big and old and wise and grown up and mature and as experienced as I'll ever be and ...



I knew so much more when I was 19 than I do now.

The lost causes and broken hearts were all somebody else's fault.

--- Ron.

I knew so much more when I was 19 than I do now.

The lost causes and broken hearts were all somebody else's fault.

--- Ron.

Sounds like mental retardation and arrogance ;)

I'm 19 :mad:

I'm big and old and wise and grown up and mature and as experienced as I'll ever be and ...

Well I'm 36 and I used to feel old at 16 but now I'm growing younger everyday, so you will too. Just B positive.

I'm no expert, but your expectations seemed perfectly normal to me - not idealistic or old-fashioned. Just saying.


Well in my experience ( limited though it may be :) ), thats the feeling I always had. Used to feel out of step in the beginning, but I grew into my skin and I'm pretty comfortable with it now. Probably depends on the kind of people you meet too I guess; I grew up in a major metropolis, so that may have factored into it.

I knew so much more when I was 19 than I do now.

The lost causes and broken hearts were all somebody else's fault.

--- Ron.

You probably recovered from them pretty fast too I bet. :)

You probably recovered from them pretty fast too I bet. :)

Afraid not.

I used to run away from the pain, and the more I ran away the more it followed me around.

Only recently did I learn to run back at it.

--- Ron.

Afraid not.

I used to run away from the pain, and the more I ran away the more it followed me around.

Only recently did I learn to run back at it.

--- Ron.

So what do you think of the sex for pleasure approach; you said there was not this sense of difficulty when you were younger. So what do you see so different now?

So what do you think of the sex for pleasure approach; you said there was not this sense of difficulty when you were younger. So what do you see so different now?

A terrible lack of practical initiative.

The spoon-fed generation.

--- Ron.

A terrible lack of practical initiative.

The spoon-fed generation.

--- Ron.

I get the spoon fed, what do you mean by practical initiative? The fact that they seem to live for the present, without thought of the future?

So what do you think of the sex for pleasure approach; you said there was not this sense of difficulty when you were younger. So what do you see so different now?
The Beatles split up, frequenters of San Francisco bath-houses suddenly started becoming very ill and thus the permissive generation became the AIDS generation.

Also, I think women are more wary of being tagged with certain labels these days (in my experience the tagging is done more by other women than by men).

It follows from spoon-fed.

If it is not immediately there to be had, they don't go look.

When I was young the old were pragmatic and the young were the dreamers. Now it is the other way around.

--- Ron.

When I was young the old were pragmatic and the young were the dreamers. Now it is the other way around.

--- Ron.

I never thought of it that way, but you are right.

You're a deep thinker, Ron; you should write a book.

You're a deep thinker, Ron; you should write a book.

I have been told that before but I am pragmatic about it, ... only if a publisher puts the money up front.

--- Ron.

Ron, you old hopless romantic, you.

The young (me being 44) are full of inexperience. This is what characterizes most of their behavior. Years of experience can sour you or enlighten you. Much of that seems to be a choice to me. I choose to proceed as if all of the trials, heartache, and confusion have been enlightenening experiences, propelling me from self-assured, arrogant youth into... ummm... self assured, arrogant maturity. :D

The young (me being 44) are full of inexperience. This is what characterizes most of their behavior. Years of experience can sour you or enlighten you. Much of that seems to be a choice to me. I choose to proceed as if all of the trials, heartache, and confusion have been enlightenening experiences, propelling me from self-assured, arrogant youth into... ummm... self assured, arrogant maturity. :D

Yes, everytthing appears very earth shattering when you're young, feel like you're never going to get over it. But as you grow older, I think you not only learn more about people about relationships, you also learn what it is that you want from an intimate relationship. You have to be lucky enough to find the person who best complements you. Sometimes the trials are learning experiences, sometimes they teach you things about yourself you did not know and may not like. One more thing I noticed ( about myself) is I've become a lot more choosy now about who I am willing to be with, less flexible in that but more willing to compromise. Strange.

agreed for once superluminal. hopeless.
ya'll talkin bout' lesbians in this thread? seems to me u were talkin about lesbians and pleasure.

Ron i'll have to disagree - sorry, - but women don't "learn what they need", unless they're first ignorant of the truth. Fact of the matter is that what they need or get or whatever the hell, is actually, the whole point.

It's simple. Not very difficult. Lesbians, are lesbians. Ok. Men and women, that is the key. Men and women, they can do a lot of cookey things, not only is it fun. I believe a bit of viagra and the pleasure is fun -er than hell.

So i'm confused about this crazy thread.

The primary biological function may be reproduction but super's right there's much more sex that goes on than reproduction (which is a good thing considering the present population); besides, how would your logic apply for homosexuality? There's only pleasure involved there.
Consider also that women have breasts all the time and their ovulation is concealed. Human females are always receptive to sexual advances. The absence of swollen genitals and the constant presence of breasts keep males always under their spell. If sex were solely for reproduction, women would go into heat and humans would mate only then. It seems likely that human females devised this strategy as a means of keeping males around to protect them as well as their young. Since human infants are so helpless, females who followed this strategy no doubt were at a reproductive advantage over females that only put out when they were ovulating.

Ron i'll have to disagree - sorry, - but women don't "learn what they need", unless they're first ignorant of the truth. Fact of the matter is that what they need or get or whatever the hell, is actually, the whole point.


That annoys me, quoting something never written.

I wrote
"One problem is that women seem to only know what they need when they've already had it."

N.B. "seem".

Unfortunately I have not yet met the one you describe, so clear about the truth of what she needs.

What she does not need, that is another matter. Rarely too much doubt about that.

--- Ron.

The young (me being 44) are full of inexperience. This is what characterizes most of their behavior. Years of experience can sour you or enlighten you. Much of that seems to be a choice to me. I choose to proceed as if all of the trials, heartache, and confusion have been enlightenening experiences, propelling me from self-assured, arrogant youth into... ummm... self assured, arrogant maturity. :D

Do you choose what makes your heart beat?

I have to search around for it, the motivation, something to care enough about.
Carrot and stick, pie in the sky and jam tomorrow, they don't do it for me.
Wasted too much time on barking up the blind alleys before.

That is what I like with sex, the immediate appreciation.
It works, does the trick.

--- Ron.

There is one ultimate purpose for sex: making babies. I'm sure you all know that. Is there really any point to sex for pleasure other than....it feels good?
A very small amount of animals derive pleasure from sex. Primates and cetaceans, and that's about it. Thusly, we should respect and use the capabilites that we evolved to have. They are what make us human.

I read that only humans and dolphins have sex for pleasure :cool:

Other apes too.

Do you choose what makes your heart beat?

I have to search around for it, the motivation, something to care enough about.
Carrot and stick, pie in the sky and jam tomorrow, they don't do it for me.
Wasted too much time on barking up the blind alleys before.

That is what I like with sex, the immediate appreciation.
It works, does the trick.

--- Ron.

Doesn't everyone need a reason to get up in the morning?

More and more people make it work these days, but work by itself can only be intellectually fufilling. You still need emotional fulfilment and joy in your life to make it worthwhile.

But sex? by itself, I would think of it as just momentary pleasure which gets jaded after a while. Its the other aspects of the relationship which alongwith sex make for that feeling of completion. Otherwise, without those feelings its just an act to get over with.

i got the point of the bulimia analogy. people eat food to live supposedly but then some will throw it up, ultimately defeating the purpose of eating in the first place. keeping that in mind, people tend to have sex, which was ( i used past tense for a reason ) the way to have offspring, only to prevent conception, which theoretically defeats the purpose of having sex.
however, people don't need to have sex to survive so bulimia tends to be a much more severe problem than having fruitless sex. hell, sex isn't really a problem unless you want to get into the religious ramifications of it (go forth and multiply).
it is true though that women have developed ways to use sex as a way to keep babies that will be created alive into adulthood; keeping the man interested, around, and useful in the event of danger.
and while we're on the subject of sexual pleasure, has anyone noticed that the animals that do it for pleasure are group animals? apes, dolphins, whales, etc. all "herd" animals. is it also a tool for keeping the group togethor? if so, would the fact that humans like having sex allude to the fact that orgies are more natural than society is comfortable with?
just a thought. :D

Doesn't everyone need a reason to get up in the morning?

More and more people make it work these days, but work by itself can only be intellectually fufilling. You still need emotional fulfilment and joy in your life to make it worthwhile.

But sex? by itself, I would think of it as just momentary pleasure which gets jaded after a while. Its the other aspects of the relationship which alongwith sex make for that feeling of completion. Otherwise, without those feelings its just an act to get over with.

i agree. but i am a woman and sex is not an actual driving force in my life. males are naturally driven to seek out mates, as many as possible at that, in order to spread their genes. women are the ones that need the emotional attachment and women are the ones that needed and developed a way to keep the male around.
i swear i am not a sellout to my gender. but i have spent more time around my brother and his friends than is most likely healthy. men are a totally different species in my opinion. but their simplicity - not mentally. altogether - is great. of course i've had a better time of making and keeping male friends than female.
...i'm probably going to get thrashed for this post...

i agree. but i am a woman and sex is not an actual driving force in my life. males are naturally driven to seek out mates, as many as possible at that, in order to spread their genes. women are the ones that need the emotional attachment and women are the ones that needed and developed a way to keep the male around.

And I thought it was men who wanted exclusivity to be sure of their progeny?
After all, there's never any doubt who the mother is. :p

i swear i am not a sellout to my gender. but i have spent more time around my brother and his friends than is most likely healthy. men are a totally different species in my opinion. but their simplicity - not mentally. altogether - is great. of course i've had a better time of making and keeping male friends than female.
...i'm probably going to get thrashed for this post...

Their friendships are different from those of women, I wouldn't necessary classify them as better.

I know what you mean, though, I was surrounded by guys growing up so I deal better with them; I've had some good friendships with women too, though I admit I seem to be missing the cootchie-coo gene.

And I thought it was men who wanted exclusivity to be sure of their progeny?
After all, there's never any doubt who the mother is.

you have a point there. i think men today are so uptight about the child belonging to them is because they will be having to take care of it. :rolleyes:


Their friendships are different from those of women, I wouldn't necessary classify them as better.

I know what you mean, though, I was surrounded by guys growing up so I deal better with them; I've had some good friendships with women too, though I admit I seem to be missing the cootchie-coo gene.

all my relationships with women tend to end disastrously. i think i'm missing something inherently female. like strings. :D my brothers girls were shameless.
seriously, i've had bad relationships too because men are always waiting for the other proverbial shoe to drop and when it doesn't, they go out of their mind and accuse me of trying to play them. :bugeye:
why is it my fault that i'm not a gold digger?!

you have a point there. i think men today are so uptight about the child belonging to them is because they will be having to take care of it.


Ya, I hate these paternity tests; can't fool the guys anymore :D


all my relationships with women tend to end disastrously. i think i'm missing something inherently female. like strings.my brothers girls were shameless.
seriously, i've had bad relationships too because men are always waiting for the other proverbial shoe to drop and when it doesn't, they go out of their mind and accuse me of trying to play them.
why is it my fault that i'm not a gold digger?!

men are simple creatures; they can't understand a woman who can think for herself. You have to be sort of needy and ignore them both at the same time. Thats their comfort zone. :D

Same thing with the girls; if you're like me you probably can't stand the wispy baby doll look. Women don't get it anymore than the men.

Same thing with the girls; if you're like me you probably can't stand the wispy baby doll look. Women don't get it anymore than the men.

yuck. barbies.
gotta give 'em credit though. they do play the game well. :rolleyes:

yuck. barbies.
gotta give 'em credit though. they do play the game well. :rolleyes:

Maybe, but I doubt the look wears well; though considering some of the men I know, it probably doesn't matter.

I read that only humans and dolphins have sex for pleasure :cool:
Other primates do as well, such as Bonobos and Chimps and Gorillas. In addition, many cetaceans enjoy sex, but dolphins (including Orcas) are foremost amongst them.

Other primates do as well, such as Bonobos and Chimps and Gorillas. In addition, many cetaceans enjoy sex, but dolphins (including Orcas) are foremost amongst them.

i saw a documentary on bonobos. i saw that they enjoy homosexual sex. as a matter of fact, don't all animals that actually enjoy copulation perform homosexual acts? what bearing does that have on homosexuality among humans?

I think its a psychological thing. Self Satisfaction, Control and among other things perception.

I'll start with the first one i mentioned
1. Self Satisfaction, Men and women have a primordial urge to have sex and have it alot (women not as much as men). The whole spread the genes, survival of the species not to mention the fittest. Subsequently thats what we do... If you look at alot of other species you'll find that animals, inparticular male animals, dress themselves up so that the female is more attracted to them. Peacock is the best example of that, although pansy looking, the male peacock has those beautiful feathers to attract females. So when it comes to Friday and Saturday nights (used to be thursday for me :p) single people dress themselves up, spend hard earned cash, go out and find that potential mate who will father, or mother, their children. Having said that, what if the person is not ready for children, can't raise financially or don't think they're mature enough? Doesn't stop that urge from being there. So they must satisfy it.

2. Control, Men in particular like to be in control, once again a primordial urge. Its a power thing. If they can find the most "mates" then they're clearly the Alpha male in the group. Sort of like how a pride of lions work. The Lion will be in charge of the pride, and have many lioness's whom he'll mate with so that his genes are spread and the species survives.

3. Perception, This one sort of blends with the above one. Males all strive to be the Alpha, be the boss of the group and be the best. The more women one mates with, the male perceives that he is the best and therefore out matches any other male "challenger".

Like i said, all psychological... There are many more points i could cover but right now i think i should head off to bed

But sex? by itself, I would think of it as just momentary pleasure which gets jaded after a while. Its the other aspects of the relationship which alongwith sex make for that feeling of completion. Otherwise, without those feelings its just an act to get over with.
Such a female thing to say. To a man, sex is an apetite almost as strong as food. You know how when you're really hungrey, food tastes better? The longer it's been for a man, the better looking every women he meets seems and the less he can think about anything else.

Such a female thing to say. To a man, sex is an apetite almost as strong as food. You know how when you're really hungrey, food tastes better? The longer it's been for a man, the better looking every women he meets seems and the less he can think about anything else.

That's very interesting; I've never heard it described quite like that before.

Women are more particular, I'm afraid, there are some men we will just never ever consider, no matter how long its been. :p Maybe I should qualify that to some women. I'm not certain I can speak for all. Some of my friends have weird tastes. :D

That's very interesting; I've never heard it described quite like that before.

And I would have to agree with him. Try going as long as I have without sex then pretend you are a guy. :bugeye:

i saw a documentary on bonobos. i saw that they enjoy homosexual sex.
Bonobos don't seem to care if it's male, female, or a tree. They'll fuck it. :D
as a matter of fact, don't all animals that actually enjoy copulation perform homosexual acts?
Though your statement is true, it's not just animals that are known to enjoy fuckin' that will do that. Almost every single animal species have shown evidence of engaging in homosexual activity from time to time.
what bearing does that have on homosexuality among humans?
It just goes to show ya, that we animals are crazy-assed lifeforms. :p

And I would have to agree with him. Try going as long as I have without sex then pretend you are a guy. :bugeye:

Sorry, I'm not into penis envy :)

Gee sam.

Gee sam.

Hey Brent! Lets hear your thoughts on sex for pleasure.

That's very interesting; I've never heard it described quite like that before.

Women are more particular, I'm afraid, there are some men we will just never ever consider, no matter how long its been. :p Maybe I should qualify that to some women. I'm not certain I can speak for all. Some of my friends have weird tastes.

she's right. on an instinctual level women try to stay away from genetic don'ts. it all comes down to women being the ones that choose the best set of genes(jeans?) to procreate with where men just want to get their genes out there. why is that women always have the hard jobs?! :mad: pregnancy, delivery, raising the child (in most cases), and choosing the best man to mate with. while you men get to run around and do as you please. so not fair.
as far as what a man will and won't have, there's a t-shirt out there. "i need another beer 'cause you're still ugly." :D

I'll agree with the above: providing you add the words "in general" :D

I'll agree with the above: providing you add the words "in general" :D

you mean men won't screw anything that moves? :p

Well I know some guys that leave hedgehogs alone.....

well, they just haven't gotten desperate enough. that's all. :D
alright, alright. "generally speaking" blah, blah...
it's probably just my feminine narcussism(?) rearing its beautiful head again.
seriously though. there are women that will have any man that gives them attention. and men that are extremely picky.
... ... ...
:eek:
what about women that cry rape the next morning? can we talk about that?

Is that covered in the topic?
Well if you're a UK citizen and the new ruling comes in then IN LAW women are incapable of judging their own capacity for alchohol... Slight blow for equality, methinks.

Is that covered in the topic?
Well if you're a UK citizen and the new ruling comes in then IN LAW women are incapable of judging their own capacity for alchohol... Slight blow for equality, methinks.

:bugeye: seriously? no i'm american.
so, what? women can't drink alone? or if they were drinking "the night before" then they're held responsible?

So what do you think is the trend these days? More sex for pleasure? Less? No change?

today, based on the percentage of failed marriages, i would say that sex is mostly for pleasure under the guise of love and relationships.
people want to do it, want to justify it, and ruin their lives because of it... sad.

why is that women always have the hard jobs?! :mad: pregnancy, delivery, raising the child (in most cases), and choosing the best man to mate with. while you men get to run around and do as you please. so not fair.


Everything is subjective. Men have to deal with their own difficulties in life. It may seem like men rule the world, but women have just as much power as men. Men spend most of their lives competing with each other to attract females. Practically everything that a man does is all about the mating game. As soon as all of our basic needs are taken care of, our attentions quickly shifts to the mating game. Men are willing to lie, cheat, steal, and kill each other for money. What do most men do with money? They buy things to attract females. (Cars, designer clothing, jewelry, Ect.)

The alpha females in developed countries have more power than they’ve ever had in our society. Women are making more money. They’re choosing to have children when the time is right for them. And they are forcing alpha males to change the way that they think and act. In the past most females were nothing more than pieces of meat that men used for their sexual pleasure. In the present, males have to do a lot of things that they do not want to do to have a relationship with a beautiful intelligent woman.

I will admit that men are lucky that they don’t have to go through the pain and misery of pregnancy and childbirth.

But if there are so many failed relationships, maybe the desire for sex is more indicative of affirming your attractiveness than for pleasure. You know "I can still get a guy/girl to sleep with me, ergo, I'm attractive". I've noticed that singles seem to be discriminated against as compared to couples. What do you think?

Nubian:
the new ruling (proposed) is that a woman (if she so wishes) will be able to claim rape (IIRC up to one week later) on the grounds that she was so drunk she didn't know what she doing. But being drunk will not be an excuse for anything else (driving, public urination etc.) and the guy won't be able to use the fact that he was drunk - otherwise he wouldn't have slept with her in the first place. How do you "prove" you were drunk a week after the event? Basically it'll mean (in law) that women are not capable of judging their alchohol intake and stop before they lose control...
Sam:
I got divorced a couple of years ago and ended back on the "dating scene" Ha! dating my arse. Most of the time it's "Hey, you look shaggable, wanna go back to my place and give me a good seeing to?" (Word for word, I swear, from three separate women in the space of two nights... and I grew up in the days when it was more or less three dates before you even kissed :eek: ).
From a personal perspective, far more sex for pleasure, and women are equally predatory. Came as some surprise...

You know "I can still get a guy/girl to sleep with me, ergo, I'm attractive". I've noticed that singles seem to be discriminated against as compared to couples. What do you think?
From personal experience (and mainly observation) it looks to be about having as much variety as possible, nobody (in general, of course) seems to be bothered about getting and keeping a partner, so long as they have a partner once the pub's shut.

From personal experience (and mainly observation) it looks to be about having as much variety as possible, nobody (in general, of course) seems to be bothered about getting and keeping a partner, so long as they have a partner once the pub's shut.

So do you believe that marriage is becoming redundant as a social institution?

And if the sex is only for variety and pleasure. has it changed the way you look at women?

So do you believe that marriage is becoming redundant as a social institution?
Probably. But maybe not as fast as some would have it. Most of the younger kids I know (I moved back to my home town after the divorce and ended "falling in" with the student crowd - good live music scene) plan on getting married or end up surprising themselves and deciding to get married. But generally they're leaving it later in life (more disposable income and less discrimination against single women - no "old maid" syndrome).

And if the sex is only for variety and pleasure. has it changed the way you look at women?
Most definitely. I think. If you mean "slag" etc (dunno if that word means what it does here - a nasty word for a woman who has sex without being married and admits to enjoying it), then the word was used when I was at school, and if anyone uses it these days it's the women themselves. Usually with a sense of pride. I find it refreshing that a generation appears to have come out of nowhere (I didn't get out much when I was married... :D ) that knows what it wants and doesn't see any shame in admitting it. Good for them. OTOH it also made life slightly easier for me - not knowing the protocol thses days for making an approach to someone I liked the look of. Although the forthright attitude did take some getting used to... "Nooo, when I asked if I could buy you drink I MEANT I wanted to buy you a drink, and maybe get to know you. Not shag you sideways in the alleyway five minutes after meeting you".

Nubian:
the new ruling (proposed) is that a woman (if she so wishes) will be able to claim rape (IIRC up to one week later) on the grounds that she was so drunk she didn't know what she doing. But being drunk will not be an excuse for anything else (driving, public urination etc.) and the guy won't be able to use the fact that he was drunk - otherwise he wouldn't have slept with her in the first place. How do you "prove" you were drunk a week after the event? Basically it'll mean (in law) that women are not capable of judging their alchohol intake and stop before they lose control...
Sam:
I got divorced a couple of years ago and ended back on the "dating scene" Ha! dating my arse. Most of the time it's "Hey, you look shaggable, wanna go back to my place and give me a good seeing to?" (Word for word, I swear, from three separate women in the space of two nights... and I grew up in the days when it was more or less three dates before you even kissed :eek: ).
From a personal perspective, far more sex for pleasure, and women are equally predatory. Came as some surprise...
In college in the US, specifically at Indiana University, I was told basically the same thing. A women can not give consent when drunk. To have sex with a drunk chick is date rape, period. Fortunately, I've never heard of it being enforced and most of us rolled our eyes and continued looking for drunk chicks.

Fortunately, I've never heard of it being enforced and most of us rolled our eyes and continued looking for drunk chicks.
Aaah callow youth. When a drunken woman tries picking me up the reply is "Sod off - if you want to have sex with me I want to be sure you're sober enough to remember it"

Sex for displeasure.

In college in the US, specifically at Indiana University, I was told basically the same thing. A women can not give consent when drunk. To have sex with a drunk chick is date rape, period. Fortunately, I've never heard of it being enforced and most of us rolled our eyes and continued looking for drunk chicks.
Precisely why I prefer to chow on passed out guys. They don't remember or even know anything happened. And if they did they would never report being....molested or raped. Drunk chicks are a ticking time bomb. You're just asking to be on the local news.

So do you believe that marriage is becoming redundant as a social institution?

And if the sex is only for variety and pleasure. has it changed the way you look at women?

do you mean getting married just to have sex? i would say yes. but (having been married, divorced, and now married again...i'm 26!) i now know that marriage is more than loving and scrogging your partner. it has financial and social issues tied to it...but there is common-law marriage...and let's not forget that no matter how evolved we've become on the subject of single parents, it's still considered a shame (and in some circles, a psychological disaster) to let a child grow with only the one parent.
...you know what? i think it is redundant.

oli: how insulting! and yet, it's a way to get petty revenge on the one that talked too much shmack...hmmm...torn between being a decent person and a scorned woman... :D

oli: how insulting!
? Assume you mean the "Sod off" to drunken women... Okay, reverse it. If a guy's pissed out of his head and gives you the come-on, would you do it? (If single?).
It's not "revenge" it's a statement of fact - I don't want to have sex with someone that's not sober enough to appreciate it, and who believes that I'm willing to sleep with her simply because she's available.

do you mean getting married just to have sex? i would say yes. but (having been married, divorced, and now married again...i'm 26!) i now know that marriage is more than loving and scrogging your partner. it has financial and social issues tied to it...but there is common-law marriage...and let's not forget that no matter how evolved we've become on the subject of single parents, it's still considered a shame (and in some circles, a psychological disaster) to let a child grow with only the one parent.
...you know what? i think it is redundant.

Interesting. The concept of marriage as a social institution is different in the East than in the West. In the East, you don't just marry your significant other, in effect you marry his culture, his customs, his traditions and his family. The sex is a part of it, but the responsibility to support and fulfil the family is far greater. Of course, with the breakdown in family ties post-Westernization, a lot of couples are moving away from the older ideas, but they are also losing the support systems that enabled them to get through persoanl crises. So while there was rarely ( almost nil in fact) divorce in the older settings, its becoming pretty common now.

? Assume you mean the "Sod off" to drunken women... Okay, reverse it. If a guy's pissed out of his head and gives you the come-on, would you do it? (If single?).
It's not "revenge" it's a statement of fact - I don't want to have sex with someone that's not sober enough to appreciate it, and who believes that I'm willing to sleep with her simply because she's available.

no, no. i meant what you said about women being unable to judge their limit. it makes me feel torn between playing the part of a helpless witless girlie to get revenge on a guy for whatever petty reason :D or acting my age.
i understand your aversion to drunken women.
...i like when my husband is drunk :bugeye: ...is that unhealthy?

Interesting. The concept of marriage as a social institution is different in the East than in the West. In the East, you don't just marry your significant other, in effect you marry his culture, his customs, his traditions and his family. The sex is a part of it, but the responsibility to support and fulfil the family is far greater. Of course, with the breakdown in family ties post-Westernization, a lot of couples are moving away from the older ideas, but they are also losing the support systems that enabled them to get through persoanl crises. So while there was rarely ( almost nil in fact) divorce in the older settings, its becoming pretty common now.

aaah. it used to be that way. maybe not that noble. i'd say that my generation has been the worst. but when my parents were my age, it was necessary to make the marriage work because neither had any other choices. kids were usually the first order of business and it's harder with kids. today, couples are getting married younger, and having kids later. it's almost like it's just a piece of paper because if something goes wrong, they can still support themselves, have no kids to worry about, and have party buddies they can fall back on as roomies, to share the weight.
marriage today means nothing to the young ones getting married. it means they can sleep in the same bed and play house. it took a divorce for me to understand what marriage really is suppose to be.

no, no. i meant what you said about women being unable to judge their limit.
Ah, got you. Well the limits thing isn't stated, but that's my take on it. Purely from a self-defence point of view. A guy will not be allowed to use the alchohol excuse under any circumstances... so it sort of pisses me off.
Especially as, like I said somewhere above, women are far more predatory when it comes to sex now than they were when I was originally single.
I think if it's actually made law then there'll be a large number of disappointed women going home on their own on Saturday nights, since the guys won't dare risk it.
...i like when my husband is drunk ...is that unhealthy?
Whatever floats your boat. The no sleeping with drunken women thing is my personal stance (even if I'm in a relationship with them!).
And I suppose never having got drunk myself skews my view...

And if the sex is only for variety and pleasure. has it changed the way you look at women?
Oh yeah. And (personal experience - not hard numbers) about a quarter to a third of the young females are openly (or more accurately - deliberately and ostentatiously) bisexual as well - there seems to be sort of attitude that "if I can have sex, I going to have it with anyone and everyone" going on.

Progress in modern science will make men redundant in the future

Good, it'll mean I can catch up with my reading and not have to explain every five minutes when I'm trying have a quiet pint why I don't bother any more.

Is that supposed to give the impression that scores of attractive women are trying to get it on with you?

The self delusion is worse than I thought :D

I never said they were attractive :D . Just single. Like I said, it's "I haven't got anyone to go home with, he'll do". Scores? No, four in one night, tops.

The joys of singledom

No, that's what I'm saying. I want to be single. And the women don't understand that, "if he's on his own he must be out on the pull".

I would think, if he's alone AND he wants to be single, he must be gay (I've met a lot of men who were commitment phobic but one who wanted to sleep alone?)

Err, well I've had the "gay" as well (sometimes from guys who thought they'd got lucky) but mostly women and mainly because of the fact that I actually dress before I go out (as opposed to slinging on the nearest, least dirty pair of jeans).

Why should I spend the night with someone I don't know and only met five minutes ago?

Personally I'm not in any way gay, I just don't need romantic relationships, have no desire to bond with other people beyond friendship. I'm self sufficient in the psychological department.

Err, well I've had the "gay" as well (sometimes from guys who thought they'd got lucky) but mostly women and mainly because of the fact that I actually dress before I go out (as opposed to slinging on the nearest, least dirty pair of jeans).


Maybe its where you're going thats the problem

Why should I spend the night with someone I don't know and only met five minutes ago?

Dude, you are so uncool! ( in English, this means you are an anachronism)

Maybe its where you're going thats the problem
Out? Every single pub and nightclub is the same. (and not just in my home town either).
Dude, you are so uncool! ( in English, this means you are an anachronism)
Not the impression I get from everyone else. :D But: it's cool to sleep with anyone who gives you the opportunity? Nah. Anachronistic, yeah. I have a sense of personal honour (which seems to be in short supply these days), I consider myself a gentleman etc.
Seriously though, if I wouldn't let most strangers into the house why should I let them into my bed? For a ten-minute shag? (or however long :) ) Usually unfulfilling and not generally worth the intrusion into my life.

[QUOTE]Out? Every single pub and nightclub is the same. (and not just in my home town either).

As far as I can tell, going to a pub all dressed up is a signal for sex.

Not the impression I get from everyone else. :D But: it's cool to sleep with anyone who gives you the opportunity? Nah. Anachronistic, yeah. I have a sense of personal honour (which seems to be in short supply these days), I consider myself a gentleman etc.

Chivalry lives! ( but who cares?)

Seriously though, if I wouldn't let most strangers into the house why should I let them into my bed? For a ten-minute shag? (or however long :) ) Usually unfulfilling and not generally worth the intrusion into my life.

You're not supposed to use your brain for sex :D

I don't get dressed UP, I just dress in a manner I consider comfortable. So I'd rather have a clean pair of jeans that happen to be black, as opposed to last year's worn-out denims. Good grief, I spend most of my time in a twenty year old (with crash/ scuff marks) leather biker jacket. That's dressing up?
Chivalry lives! ( but who cares?)
I do?
You're not supposed to use your brain for sex
Yeah but when you do then the non-brain sort kind of pales...
And, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I vaguely remember someone posting something along the lines of What's between the ears is more important than what's between the legs.
Hmmm?

I don't get dressed UP, I just dress in a manner I consider comfortable. So I'd rather have a clean pair of jeans that happen to be black, as opposed to last year's worn-out denims. Good grief, I spend most of my time in a twenty year old (with crash/ scuff marks) leather biker jacket. That's dressing up?

In that case I think the pubs are too upscale and they think you're a gigolo.

I do?

:rolleyes: <----this is me not giving a rat's ass.

Yeah but when you do then the non-brain sort kind of pales...
And, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I vaguely remember someone posting something along the lines of
Hmmm?

We're not talking about me; I believe in the ability to entertain a thought without accepting it.

In that case I think the pubs are too upscale and they think you're a gigolo.
You haven't seen the local pubs. Most of them "upscale" is having different coloured lights over the bar.
this is me not giving a rat's ass.
That's okay. I'm not doing for you. I'm doing it because that's what I do.
We're not talking about me; I believe in the ability to entertain a thought without accepting it.
Okay. How about this: I'd far rather have a mind-fuck than a "real one". Brains everytime. Without exception.

You haven't seen the local pubs. Most of them "upscale" is having different coloured lights over the bar.


Which says very dubious things about your taste :D

That's okay. I'm not doing for you. I'm doing it because that's what I do.

:rolleyes: <---still there

Okay. How about this: I'd far rather have a mind-fuck than a "real one". Brains everytime. Without exception

I see evolution has weeded you out of the running; I hope you've done the progeny thing already.

( Is this mind-fuck exclusive of the physical thing or do they go together?)

Which says very dubious things about your taste
Nope, it says more about the lack of facilities availbale here.
I see evolution has weeded you out of the running; I hope you've done the progeny thing already.
Nope. But that's another story.
( Is this mind-fuck exclusive of the physical thing or do they go together?)
Well the way I worded it, i.e. "as opposed to" was meant to imply that it excluded the physical - but that's only if it's an either (mental)/ or (purely physical) choice. Going together is far preferable, but like I said, it sorta takes any "zing" out of the physical without the mental. Hence one reason why I don't go looking any more.

Nope, it says more about the lack of facilities availbale here.

I guess there are other advantages to the place?

Nope. But that's another story.

You're full of stories.

Well the way I worded it, i.e. "as opposed to" was meant to imply that it excluded the physical - but that's only if it's an either (mental)/ or (purely physical) choice. Going together is far preferable, but like I said, it sorta takes any "zing" out of the physical without the mental. Hence one reason why I don't go looking any more

I see you follow my principle:

Winston Churchill : "Never never never give up"

Sam: "Alright the first couple of times, sure, but why be a damn fool about it?"

I guess there are other advantages to the place?
Moved back here after the divorce 'cos I have family. (Including semi-fictional mother).

You're full of stories.
Aren't we all? One reason I actually go out rather than staying home all the time. People.

I see you follow my principle:

Winston Churchill : "Never never never give up"

Sam: "Alright the first couple of times, sure, but why be a damn fool about it?"
Or as I put: how many times do you have to get kicked in the teeth before you realise it's not worth getting up again?
Trust is hard thing to fix once shattered.

Moved back here after the divorce 'cos I have family. (Including semi-fictional mother).

I'm not sure that will help the healing; or maybe you are using a greater pain to help alleviate the lesser one ( I guess eating plastic wire can keep your mind pretty occupied)

Aren't we all? One reason I actually go out rather than staying home all the time. People.

Same reason I stay in rather than go out.


Trust is hard thing to fix once shattered.

So true

I'm not sure that will help the healing; or maybe you are using a greater pain to help alleviate the lesser one
Parents and both sisters. So someone knows me, as opposed to to not knowing anyone at all after 20 years of being married in another town...
( I guess eating plastic wire can keep your mind pretty occupied)
I didn't actually eat it, I was just fed it.
Same reason I stay in rather than go out.
It got to the stage of stay in one more week and I knew I'd probably never go out again. And probably turn the gas on without lighting it.
So true
I said we all had stories.
(Back in about 3 hours.)

Progress in modern science will make men redundant in the future

that reminds me of a comedy show. i think it was In Living Color. anyway, there were only two men left on the face of the earth - a handsome, heroic type guy and a geeky, scaredy type guy - the handsome one died, leaving the geeky one as the last man on earth.
the women caught up with him and he begged them to be gentle...but all they wanted him to do was masturbate into a plastic cup so that they could start a sperm bank! :D
that was so funny.

that reminds me of a comedy show. i think it was In Living Color. anyway, there were only two men left on the face of the earth - a handsome, heroic type guy and a geeky, scaredy type guy - the handsome one died, leaving the geeky one as the last man on earth.
the women caught up with him and he begged them to be gentle...but all they wanted him to do was masturbate into a plastic cup so that they could start a sperm bank! :D
that was so funny.

Think of all the problems that would disappear from the world if we could only get rid of the men (*plotting possible scenarios*)

Somewhere in some mythology ( I just remember)--as GOD's avtara's words, indicated that sex done for reproduction is not a sin otherwise is.

May it be alike, anything done for need or for progress of nature as per its balance or done for need instead of greed or luxuary can be thought as sin...which may impact our health at individual or universal level.

Think of all the problems that would disappear from the world if we could only get rid of the men (*plotting possible scenarios*)

Now think of all the wonderful new problems women would create. Then again.. think about the catfights (*grin*)

"World shoe shortage deepens".

"World shoe shortage deepens".

hah, hah... :mad:
you guys are just afraid to face the possiblity of a world that doesn't need you. :p

sam: i'm 100% with you. ;)

Now think of all the wonderful new problems women would create. Then again.. think about the catfights (*grin*)

hey, catfights are waaay better than nuclear warfare. where men go and get their buddies and brothers to fight with them. women simply remove their shoes and jewelry and get ready for the knock-down-drag-out. :D

(Misogyny)

Frankly, I'd rather be nuked than get on the wrong end of some aggrieved, drunken witch's fingernails.

(/Misogyny)

Somewhere in some mythology ( I just remember)--as GOD's avtara's words, indicated that sex done for reproduction is not a sin otherwise is.
That's 100% correct. It's mythology.

have sex for pleasure? never!
people never have sex for pleasure.

Think of all the problems that would disappear from the world if we could only get rid of the men (*plotting possible scenarios*)
Come on now. You know that behind every power mad man, there's a female egging him on. Practically everything men do is an attempt to get chicks. No females, no reason for us men to fight.

besides, what would you women do the next time you seen a cockroach in the bathroom?

You get horny. You look for sex, you get sex. No babies are made.
A bulimic gets hungry. They eat food. They vomit food.

Is there really any point to sex for pleasure other than....it feels good? And if that is the case, how much time do we pointlessly waste looking for it and doing it? How many hours do men waste chasing their genitalia around the world achieving absolutely nothing?

erm not a very good analogy, getting horny is biolgically dictated, being bulimic is initiating a ritual in order to achieve an end result which is generally to be thin, remain thin or to exert control over part of life as rest is out of control.

I have had periods of zero horniness and thus did not seek or have sex. However, this is not now the case. I feel horny and act accordingly. I am driven by my drive. And why not? A fabulous mutual pleasing rewarding free (to most) harmless to others past time.

Pointless you say? You're doing it wrong.

Has anyone ever spent any time thinking about this? Ever since the invention of birth control, people have been spending their paychecks and hours upon hours every week trying to "score". However, what is actually achieved by this other than scratching a biological itch?

There is one ultimate purpose for sex: making babies. I'm sure you all know that.

After thinking about this for a while, I wondered, what exactly is the difference between sex purely for pleasure and bulimia?

You get horny. You look for sex, you get sex. No babies are made.
A bulimic gets hungry. They eat food. They vomit food.

Is there really any point to sex for pleasure other than....it feels good? And if that is the case, how much time do we pointlessly waste looking for it and doing it? How many hours do men waste chasing their genitalia around the world achieving absolutely nothing?

Although "optimal level" is best but still, Can't it be meant for a prpose-- to encourage and maintain hunger>>Vitality (think-"Use it or lose it" :D), more energetic/encouraged sperms>> survival of fittest/Natural selection etc.?

What is fate of our genetic materials and supporting secretions on not using these for prolonged time?

(Misogyny)

Frankly, I'd rather be nuked than get on the wrong end of some aggrieved, drunken witch's fingernails.

(/Misogyny)

don't you forget it. :D

besides, what would you women do the next time you seen a cockroach in the bathroom?

:eek: that hit dangerously close to home. my kryptonite. cockroaches. i have to get my husband to kill them and dispose of them for me...*shudder!*

we'll just create automatons to deal with our awe-inspiring intelligence to deal with things of that nature. :D

Think of a world without piles of dirty underwear, where we could actually get the remote when we wanted it....(*still dreaming*)

we'll just create automatons to deal with our awe-inspiring intelligence
It'll never get built:
"I told you chenille was a necessary component!"
"Don't be silly, everyone knows intulgorted sockets use shirring elastic"
"Can I have one in pink?"

It'll never get built:
"I told you chenille was a necessary component!"
"Don't be silly, everyone knows intulgorted sockets use shirring elastic"
"Can I have one in pink?"

as opposed to:

"No, you are wrong about this terribly important, lives-depend-on-it calculation because your cocknballs aren't as big as mine."
"Don't be an idiot. Just make it pick up the game in color."
"It has to have a buttscratcher!"

:D

As compared to:
" Have you seen the whatchamacallit on that pickup?"
" Lets spend one more season watching grown up guys hit round objects with sticks all day long"
"I need a clean shirt like I need a hole in my head?"

You're right.
How could it possibly work (*sniff*)

Think of a world without piles of dirty underwear, where we could actually get the remote when we wanted it....(*still dreaming*)

all you have to do to get the remote is distract him with something shiny and scented with pig skin and beer. :p

Come on now. You know that behind every power mad man, there's a female egging him on. Practically everything men do is an attempt to get chicks. No females, no reason for us men to fight.

hey, we don't tell him how to do it. we just want it done. :rolleyes: and besides, we have to take what we can get from this male-dominated society. to get our end met, we have to settle for man's way of doing it. if women owned the process from start to finish, it wouldn't be so...ugly.
women are masters of diplomatic affairs and compassionate. as long as you don't mess with "our men" we like you alright.

Nope. You see we men have developed something women could NEVER do. A separate subspecies called the GEEK. Not interested in sport, buttscratching, remote controls, dominance games etc - they just like to make things.
They have been specially bred, and would never consider ridiculous ephemera like shoes matching handbags - impossible for women.

The Geek ?

Is that the same sub-species that never gets laid ?

Ya right. Women are responsible for evolution you know, and we take our job of filtering out the weeds very seriously

So if you filter out the geeks who's gonna develop the next sewing machine? Who'll calculate and design the shoe shops? Who will you have to flirt with to get the guy you're really interested in jealous?

So if you filter out the geeks who's gonna develop the next sewing machine? Who'll calculate and design the shoe shops? Who will you have to flirt with to get the guy you're really interested in jealous?

Like I said we take our jobs seriously; so we'll keep enough of them around to fulfill these necessary functions :rolleyes:

So how do you decide which ones to keep? (I could have personal investment here :D ). Or is it just a general wave and "That one. Have him stripped, bathed and sent to my chambers. Let the rest die out".

Well I'm not much into sewing or making guys jealous; but I will plead guilty to the shoes;

so I guess the desire to go frequently for shoe shopping accompanied by the ability to gasp ecstatically at new and beautiful shoes will be a prime consideration.

so I guess the desire to go frequently for shoe shopping accompanied by the ability to gasp ecstatically at new and beautiful shoes will be a prime consideration.
So we're either doomed or have to develop the ability to convincingly lie about shoes?
How about "Hey, those shoes would fit your feet"? Or "This is the third shoe shop we've been to to so far. I suppose it wouldn't actually kill me to visit another five"? That sort of ecstatic gasping?
Or how about "Well they're green. They'll go with your, ummm, something you own MUST be green. Ish".?

You're out (*scratching off Oli's name from list*)

NEXT!

I was jumping up and down while I said it.

It was the convincingly lie about shoes that did it (*shaking head in disgust*); how can anyone not take SHOES seriously! I didn't even read the rest!

Sorry. Male speak. It was highly technical term for "be absolutely enthused about".

So considering that you're a cerebral geek who is allergic to barbiedollism; what advice do you give to the younger(ahem!) like minded individuals in their quest for sexual pleasure? (*advances microphone to Oli*)

Ummm, can you hear me on this? Err, forget about it. You don't make the choice, SHE does. The only real option you EVER have is to turn it down or not. And if you say "no" then you're quickly labelled as a freak, and if you say "yes" then equally quickly you're "interested in only one thing". And women talk to each other... in ways most men wouldn't believe.*
Sometimes you (both) get lucky and find someone to stick with. But I couldn't say anything worth hearing about that.
It's a lottery, and you don't even get to choose your ticket, someone else picks it for you. Live with it.
* but if you ever get the chance to sit in on a real "girly conversation" don't pass it up (one guy I know refused to even stay in the room for the rest of the university course). It's real education.

Stop fudging and get down to it.

And if you ever hear that phrase at a critical time you KNOW you've blown it. :D
Sorry. That's my accumulated knowledge on the subject of women - there's an old phrase about guys running after a womean until she catches him?
Edit: unless you want a bitter full-throated rant about "fidelity"? Nah. Endedit.

Unless you're talking about "technique"? Aaah well. They pass word round on that s well - which totally make or break you. It's just off-putting when you walk into the pub and the conversation starts "Is he the one who...?" And then turns into whispers and unbelieving stares.

Nope. You see we men have developed something women could NEVER do. A separate subspecies called the GEEK. Not interested in sport, buttscratching, remote controls, dominance games etc - they just like to make things.
They have been specially bred, and would never consider ridiculous ephemera like shoes matching handbags - impossible for women.


Awwwwwwwwwwww this is my bfriend you are describing here, he even hands me the control without my even requesting it. Oh and Sam there are no problems re the laying down of items. (Long version of your short version).

And he is very original in his dress sense and does accessorise. He's adorable.
Has rings he made himself :) oh and quite a few bags..for disguising his laptop lol. Not so many shoes tho?

A one in a million, all geek and I love him to bits. You can keep your macho butt scratching footie watching beer bellied beef eating etc etc.........

i leave for a few hours to go and count the pairs of shoes i own (inventory. you know how it is.) and you guys start quipping without me. :(

Awwwwwwwwwwww this is my bfriend you are describing here, he even hands me the control without my even requesting it. Oh and Sam there are no problems re the laying down of items. (Long version of your short version).

And he is very original in his dress sense and does accessorise. He's adorable.
Has rings he made himself :) oh and quite a few bags..for disguising his laptop lol. Not so many shoes tho?

A one in a million, all geek and I love him to bits. You can keep your macho butt scratching footie watching beer bellied beef eating etc etc.........

hey! i happen to love my footie watching beer bellied beef eating etc etc!

you missed one thing on women, oli.
if we can't win at something, because it's just that insignificant and it never really interested us in the first place, you have to be adept at letting us win without letting us win. figure that one out. :D

you missed one thing on women, oli.
if we can't win at something, because it's just that insignificant and it never really interested us in the first place, you have to be adept at letting us win without letting us win. figure that one out. :D

Don't tell him all our secrets!!

Don't tell him all our secrets!!

it's only one. :)
and besides. i like oli. i think he should be one of the ones we keep around. :D

Well he struck out on the shoes; we should see how trainable he is

( more of the same starting here:
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?p=1085319&#post1085319)

if we can't win at something, because it's just that insignificant and it never really interested us in the first place, you have to be adept at letting us win without letting us win. figure that one out.
I you win you win. Which means you're better than me. And vice versa. If winning's so important to you that I feel I have to cheat and lose then why should I bother? I mean, what would it do to your self-respect?
i like oli. i think he should be one of the ones we keep around.
Does this mean you're gonna invite me out on a "girls only" night like most of my female friends do?

I you win you win. Which means you're better than me. And vice versa. If winning's so important to you that I feel I have to cheat and lose then why should I bother? I mean, what would it do to your self-respect?


Our self-respect is attached to winning Olie, don't you get it? And you don't let on that you let us win (*exasperated sigh*). Do we have to lead you by the ham...I mean hand?


Does this mean you're gonna invite me out on a "girls only" night like most of my female friends do?


Depends on your stamina :D

Our self-respect is attached to winning Olie, don't you get it? And you don't let on that you let us win (*exasperated sigh*). Do we have to lead you by the ham...I mean hand?
Okay, then why should I respect you, if I have to cheat to lose, merely to keep you happy? And if I don't respect then why should I let you win?
Depends on your stamina
Had zero complaints so far.

Okay, then why should I respect you, if I have to cheat to lose, merely to keep you happy? And if I don't respect then why should I let you win?

You're a lost cause Olie; don't you know if you let a woma