Israeli military stands by its policy on shelling populated areas (http://www.cbc.ca/cp/world/060411/w041108.html)
There has been no change in policy," an Israeli military spokesman said, speaking on customary condition of anonymity. "We will continue to fight them (the rocket launchers) intensely, while trying to avoid hurting innocent civilians." Hadil Ghraben was killed and 13 other people were wounded when two shells blew huge holes in a concrete block house in Beit Lahiya in the northern Gaza Strip on Monday afternoon.
Coupling the Israeli policy of an economic/starvation blockade of Palestinian territories with this Israeli policy of shelling civilian areas , I can firmly conclude that this is nothing more than a policy of ethnic cleansing, pure and simple .

And what, pray tell, does it have to do with Purimfest? Or is this more of your attempts to link political issues with Israel with Jewish people and beliefs?

Moreover, what should the Israelis do then? Sit and take the rockets? I'm sure that would calm the terrorists right down.

Not surprised.

Geoff

If I poke you with a pencil, don't you have the right to hit me? You are completely delusional, Brian.

noone pays attention, huh?
delusional, AND stupid.
great combination. you should run under a republican ticket.

And what, pray tell, does it have to do with Purimfest? Or is this more of your attempts to link political issues with Israel with Jewish people and beliefs?
Purim is a Jewish festival where they celebrate the mass murder of thousands of Persians , very appropiate title for the thread for what they are doing to Palestinians .
If I poke you with a pencil, don't you have the right to hit me? You are completely delusional, Brian.
Oh right so shelling a completely innocent neighbourhood indiscriminately is acceptable retaliation ? The fact is Israel has those territories locked down tighter than a steel drum , all they have to do is send in military/police teams to catch the offenders like they do when they want to arrest certain Palestinian criminals . There again if the Israelis treated Palestinians as human beings and lifted the anti-human economic embargo and stopped assasinating and oppressing them they wouldnt be fire rockets into Israhell , now would they .

And the fact is these rockets because of a buffer zone land harmlessly in no mans land not endangering any chosen person . And we only have Israels word these rocket attacks have taken place , and Israhell is a compulsive liar .

The fact is this is a collective punishment aimed at nobody in particular but intimadating everyone , killing indiscriminately and making Palestinians flee to Egypt or Jordan , in other word ethnic cleansing .

I dare you to prove your Purim theory as other than fantasy. Many scholors agree that there is little historical support for the story in the first place.

Please describe why you think the shelling is "indiscriminate". And yes, I think the retaliation is appropriate, why should they risk the lives of military/police teams? These rocket attacks have gone on far too long.

More important, I think, is the murder of thousands of pastries (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purim#Traditional_foods).

Purim is a Jewish festival where they celebrate the mass murder of thousands of Persians

O bigot, thy information smells fishy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purim

"Purim (Hebrew: פורים Pûrîm "Lots", from Akkadian pūru) is a joyous Jewish holiday that commemorates the deliverance of Persian Jews from the plot of the evil Haman to exterminate them, as recorded in the biblical Book of Esther. It is characterized by public recitation of the Book of Esther, giving mutual gifts of food and drink, giving charity to the poor, and a celebratory meal (Esther 9:22); other customs include drinking alcohol, wearing of masks and costumes, and public celebration."

Deliverance from a plot to exterminate them. I can see why the traditional celebration would frighten you: gift-giving and charity - have the Jews no shame?

Oh right so shelling a completely innocent neighbourhood indiscriminately is acceptable retaliation ?

And again, your very first post in the thread reveals your bias. You deliberately avoid the first paragraph which is in fact:

"JERUSALEM (AP) - The Israeli military said Tuesday that it stood by its new policy of firing artillery shells into populated Palestinian areas in an effort to stop rocket fire at Israel, even after a round killed an eight-year-old Palestinian girl.

"There has been no change in policy," an Israeli military spokesman said, speaking on customary condition of anonymity. "We will continue to fight them (the rocket launchers) intensely, while trying to avoid hurting innocent civilians." Hadil Ghraben was killed and 13 other people were wounded when two shells blew huge holes in a concrete block house in Beit Lahiya in the northern Gaza Strip on Monday afternoon."

So, nothing indiscriminate about it, liar. You can't even seem to understand that they're firing on enemy artillery positions - which, suprisingly enough, always seem to get located in populated areas. Now why might that be? A few more shaheeds for the locals? Too bad Saddam isn't around to pay out their families like he used to eh?

The terrorists position themselves in populated areas deliberately, so that a response will cause civilian casualties, which they can then make maximum use of in the media.

Ironically, you seem unconcerned about the fact that the Israelis are firing back at terrorists (not civilians) who are firing deliberately at their civilians in a deliberate effort to kill them. But perhaps such niceties are lost on you.

To use Foleyan logic: "never once in that article does it say the Israelis aren't justified in doing this. I dare you to show me where it says that."

To wit: "Islamic Jihad, which has been behind much of the rocket fire, said it would continue the attacks."

And the fact is these rockets because of a buffer zone land harmlessly in no mans land not endangering any chosen person .

LMAO - Israelis aren't compulsive liars, but you seem to be. That was almost the worst lie you've told yet.

The fact is this is a collective punishment aimed at nobody in particular but intimadating everyone , killing indiscriminately and making Palestinians flee to Egypt or Jordan , in other word ethnic cleansing .

Prove it, Foley. The fact is that you don't know what you're talking about.

Geoff

And the fact is these rockets because of a buffer zone land harmlessly in no mans land not endangering any chosen person .
You're insane.

I dare you to prove your Purim theory as other than fantasy. Many scholors agree that there is little historical support for the story in the first place.
What the Fuck has this to do with anything ? I picked that title Purimfest 2006 because that’s what Jews celebrate saying they had to pre-emptively murder 75000 innocent human beings to protect themselves from an unfounded threat . And seriously reading that wanker IDF soldiers comments the parallel with the story of Purim and justification of this shelling of innocent civilians is accurate .
Please describe why you think the shelling is "indiscriminate".
Read the Fucking article they openly say they are shelling civilian areas in retaliation for supposed rocket attacks . In other words they are making no effort to apprehend the perpetrators , that becomes collective punishment a war crime .
And yes, I think the retaliation is appropriate, why should they risk the lives of military/police teams?
Retaliation ? You mean Palestinians who have been herded up like farmyard animals and corralled up in human cages like Gaza by the Jewish state is the reason for this trouble ? Your ignorance is fantastic the Palestinians are a defenceless population with no Airforce nor Army . The funny thing is South Africa in all its racist barbarity never stooped so cowardly low to bomb Black homelands as collective punishment , that is how severe Palestinian oppression is spider and you defend it .
These rocket attacks have gone on far too long.
My problem is that these rocket attacks aren’t of a longer range nor accurate enough and not enough of them . Hopefully Israel makes the mistake of attacking Iran , and Iran gives the Jewish state a barrage of proper rockets in kind , give them a taste of their own repulsive medicine .
More important, I think, is the murder of thousands of pastries.
And 100 to 1 this pious individual lights a candle at his Synagogue for the memory of those who perished in the Warsaw Ghetto .
O bigot, thy information smells fishy:
Purim 5766 - And Still Going Strong by Levi Chazen (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/article.php3?id=6084)
Some might indeed mistakenly come to the conclusion that all killing is a bad thing. In fact, we find even among fellow liberal Jews that the holiday of Purim can make them blush and feel uncomfortable, for here we find the Jews celebrating the downfall of their enemies after killing some 75,000 of them.
My God that is strange because here in a Torah study from an actual Jewish site by an actual Rabbi on the Israel Nation News they say the opposite .
You're insane.
And your a chicken cluck cluck , everyone check out this clown bowing out of debate with me on my Iran thread ;)

So as I understand it, your position is:

Israel is killing innocent Palestinians.
Israel's reason for doing so (response to rockets) isn't good enough, in fact it may be a lie.
But if it weren't a lie you'd prefer the rockets to be more effective so Israel would be hurt by violence similar to that you believe it inflicts.
Israel does this because they believe they are the chosen people with a right to murder others and celebrate this murder as in Purim.

Is this correct?

The fact is this is a collective punishment aimed at nobody in particular but intimadating everyone
Tell me, does this quote refer to the rockets or the Israeli attacks?

And 100 to 1 this pious individual lights a candle at his Synagogue for the memory of those who perished in the Warsaw Ghetto .
Nope; and I was referring to Purim, not the Palestinians. I deplore loss of human life, but modern-day celebrations of Purim seem to involve more eating than slaughtering ;)

...that’s what Jews celebrate saying they had to pre-emptively murder 75000 innocent human beings to protect themselves from an unfounded threat.
And you are able to judge both what happened and why thousands of years after the fact, and contrary to historians who say the truth is unclear if there even was such a battle? I don't think the Jews were ever in Persia, as they are native to Judea, the whole thing is as much of a myth as their supposed exodus from Egypt.

"We will continue to fight them (the rocket launchers) intensely, while trying to avoid hurting innocent civilians."
You know, it sounds to me like Palestinian militants are using their own people as human shields, it wouldn't be the first time.

You know, it sounds to me like Palestinian militants are using their own people as human shields, it wouldn't be the first time.
No they are not using there own people as shields , any fool with a unbiased opinion can see that in Gaza which is the size of Manhattan and holds 2 million people is a densely populated urban environment , and such resistance/liberation activities can only be done in and around or close proximity to populated areas . Northern Ireland had the same urban warfare where a lot of non-combatants were inadvertently killed in military/resistance operations by IRA soldiers . It’s a fact of urban warfare , if Isarel wants it stop then stop oppressing the Palestinians , end of story .
So as I understand it, your position is:
Israel is killing innocent Palestinians.
Yes .
Israel's reason for doing so (response to rockets) isn't good enough, in fact it may be a lie.
Yes
But if it weren't a lie you'd prefer the rockets to be more effective so Israel would be hurt by violence similar to that you believe it inflicts.
I believe racist Zionism which imprisons the Palestinian people in oppression must be resisted at all costs . Unfortunately for the Palestinians , like all unprotected oppressed peoples , they can only fight back with slingshots and homemade weapons , as opposed to the IDF’s first world technology which they employ without hesitation against the Palestinians such as in Jenin . My wish is that Palestinian resistance is more effective against Zionist barbarism , surely you cant disagree with that .
Tell me, does this quote refer to the rockets or the Israeli attacks?
Collective punishment can only be inflicted on a civilian community which is under a military/police occupation . And the Palestinians are a such people , and Palestinian resistance is only retaliation against prior Israeli aggression like last weeks assassination which killed a few innocent Palestinians .
Nope; and I was referring to Purim, not the Palestinians. I deplore loss of human life, but modern-day celebrations of Purim seem to involve more eating than slaughtering
Im sorry I took it as sarcasm my apologies .

Israel does this because they believe they are the chosen people with a right to murder others and celebrate this murder as in Purim.

And you are able to judge both what happened and why thousands of years after the fact, and contrary to historians who say the truth is unclear if there even was such a battle? I don't think the Jews were ever in Persia, as they are native to Judea, the whole thing is as much of a myth as their supposed exodus from Egypt.
This is extremely interesting and revealing I only used the term Purimfest which describes pre-emptive killing to prevent a imagined threat against themselves as a parallel . I made no religious overtones yet you 2 have become extremely defensive , you 2 have made on several occasions much of Islamic religious mania as to what drives a lot of terrorism . Could it be you see a parallel here with Jewish extremism with a scriptural base with Islamic extremism ?

Purim is a Jewish festival where they celebrate the mass murder of thousands of Persians , very appropiate title for the thread for what they are doing to Palestinians .

no. jews celebrate purim becuase they believe a mass murder of jews in persia was prevented. check your sources, the jews were the victims and not otherwise. you better look up for the jewish calender too, since purim was 4 weeks ago - they are celebrating passover now.
so once again, you don't know what you're talking about. however, it's still a very appropiate title for this thread. after all, the jews were saved in purim and that's exactly what israel is trying to do now.


Oh right so shelling a completely innocent neighbourhood indiscriminately is acceptable retaliation ?

the neighbourhood isn't completely innocent. have you forgot that terrorists launch rockets from inside the houses?? in this case, the area turns to be a war zone and so israel has the right to retaliate. i bet you would do the same, if not worse.


The fact is Israel has those territories locked down tighter than a steel drum , all they have to do is send in military/police teams to catch the offenders like they do when they want to arrest certain Palestinian criminals .

criminals? i thought there are no bad palestinians. all this time you called them "freedom fighters". what's up with you, Brian?
anyway, israel went out from gaza only months ago and now you want it back inside? who will approve such action?


There again if the Israelis treated Palestinians as human beings and lifted the anti-human economic embargo and stopped assasinating and oppressing them they wouldnt be fire rockets into Israhell , now would they .
this is much more complicated than you think. israel is no longer in gaza, but the palestinians are still launching rockets from there forcing israel to retaliate and kill innocent people. explain.


The fact is this is a collective punishment aimed at nobody in particular but intimadating everyone , killing indiscriminately and making Palestinians flee to Egypt or Jordan , in other word ethnic cleansing .
you should blame the rocket launchers for that, they used them as they were human shields.

First syllable, as in Edgar Allen-

and second, big Russian Noise

-GROM!

If I poke you with a pencil, don't you have the right to hit me? You are completely delusional, Brian.

Yeah, he has a right to hit you if you poke him with a pencil. However, he doesn't have the right to use a car and crash into you taking your whole classroom out with you.

I've no problem with Israel retaliating and going after the Palestinians responsible for the rocket attacks, but not having them bomb other Palestinan civilians. That makes as much sense as the U.S. taking out Saddam because he's a horrible dictator that tortures his populace only to come in and do the exact things we accuse Saddam of, ala Abu Graib.

Seriously, WTF..

:rolleyes:

But killing more Palestinans is the exact reason why Israel does what it does. They don't want any Palestinans there. This is why Palestinians are confined to their small areas living in a hellhole and under constant watch while Jewish settlers continue to colonize what little land the Palestinians have left. To deny otherwise is to ignore all the facts and acts Israel does and has done. There's a reason why Israel has the most U.N. violations of all countries and is why almost everyone other than their religious butt-buddies, the U.S., dislikes Israel.

- N

To deny otherwise is to ignore all the facts and acts Israel does and has done.
I'm afraid you're a bit out of date there. Israel has already pulled out of the Gaza strip (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip#Background). Kadima, a party which advocates pulling out of the West Bank, got the most votes in the recent elections. I think from these facts it is undeniable that Israel doesn't as a whole want 'colonisation of Palestinian lands'.

There's a reason why Israel has the most U.N. violations of all countries
To quote a pro-Palestinian website (http://www.endtheoccupation.org/article.php?id=166), the reason is:

"Other countries - Algeria, Sierra Leone, Uzbekistan, many more - commit massive human rights violations against their own population, but only Israel carries out those actions against a population that is supposed to be protected by the Geneva Conventions, which guarantee safety for people living under occupation."

No they are using there own people as shields

Spelling errors aside, I'm glad you can at least admit this.

I believe racist Zionism which imprisons the Palestinian people in oppression must be resisted at all costs . Unfortunately for the Palestinians , like all unprotected oppressed peoples , they can only fight back with slingshots and homemade weapons

And AKs, and RPGs, and Russian-built rockets passed through Egyptian channels. All home-made, o' course. By hundreds of elves in "Yasser's Workshop".

Collective punishment can only be inflicted on a civilian community which is under a military/police occupation .

Or by lobbing rockets indiscriminately at their territory from Palestinian territory.

And Foley calls the Israelis indiscriminate. "Stand things on their head" seems to be his mantra.

GEoff

This is why Palestinians are confined to their small areas living in a hellhole and under constant watch while Jewish settlers continue to colonize what little land the Palestinians have left. To deny otherwise is to ignore all the facts and acts Israel does and has done. There's a reason why Israel has the most U.N. violations of all countries and is why almost everyone other than their religious butt-buddies, the U.S., dislikes Israel.

- N

There's lots of reasons for that: some of them being the uniformity of Arabist/islamic voting at the UN, and one of the others being the fact that the Israelis are mostly Jews.

I agree that the conflict is tragic and that the Palestinians should be free. But at the same time the present situation is grounded in regrettable but solid history. If the inhabitants of the region had not tried oppressing Jewish immigrants from the start - and it is my hypothesis that adherence to the concept of dhimmitude was the directive for this - then there would not have been any counter-rioting, not been any attacking of each other's villages, not been finally any declaration of statehood and then no invasion in 1948, nor an attempted one in 1967, nor the surprise attack on Yom Kippur 1973.

Geoff

Spelling errors aside, I'm glad you can at least admit this.
Thanks for that I just edited and corrected my post , now if only your posting was as accurate as your spelling ............................
then no invasion in 1948,
We have already shown you on another thraed that Israel immediately adavnced on Palestrinain areas in 1948 and the Arabs advanced to stop Jewish aggression , why do insist on carrying on this charade ?
nor an attempted one in 1967,
Israel launched a aggressive pre-emptive strike on its neighbours to seize lands which make up Ertz Israel .
nor the surprise attack on Yom Kippur 1973.
And this was an Arab attack to reagin what Israel took in 1967 .

no. jews celebrate purim becuase they believe a mass murder of jews in persia was prevented.
The Jews supposed an event was prevented not a certainty .
check your sources, the jews were the victims and not otherwise.
You mean more accurately Jews were the perpertrators of an act of mass murder against an innocent people .
you better look up for the jewish calender too, since purim was 4 weeks ago - they are celebrating passover now.
purim , passover , delicatessen hey whatever .
so once again, you don't know what you're talking about. however, it's still a very appropiate title for this thread. after all, the jews were saved in purim and that's exactly what israel is trying to do now.
Yeah precisely murder thousands of innocent Palestinians in the hope that those who witness this slaughter are frightened into fleeing into Egypt , Joradan , Lebanon and Syria in other words ethnic cleansing , or Purim Fest .
the neighbourhood isn't completely innocent.
Thats what the Nazis said at Lidice when they wipe out its inhabitants seein the assassins of Heydrich killed him there . Your just justifying collective punishment .
have you forgot that terrorists launch rockets from inside the houses??
So Israel courtesy of the US taxpayer has a massive military then go out and catch the men who fired these rockets . Why fire destructive artillery shells killing dozens of Palestinians who were not aware of what happened ?
criminals? i thought there are no bad palestinians. all this time you called them "freedom fighters". what's up with you, Brian?
Dont turn it on its head ! The Israeli police regularly enters Gaza to apprehend Palestinian smugglers and other criminals to stand trial in Israel . So why cant the IDF enter Gaza to apprehend these rocket lauchers ?
anyway, israel went out from gaza only months ago and now you want it back inside? who will approve such action?
Israel has never left Gaza , all they have done is heremetically seal the entire strip and place it under a economic embargo in effect the Israelis have Watrsaw Ghettoized the Gaza .
this is much more complicated than you think. israel is no longer in gaza, but the palestinians are still launching rockets from there forcing israel to retaliate and kill innocent people. explain.
There are no innocent Israelis , Israelis are fully aware of what crimes they are commiting against Palestinians the Jews fully support each respective goverment . The fact is Israelis must accept the consequences of their goverments actions , as the Germans had to with the actions of the Nazis and the Americans have to accept the consequences of their goverments actions in the mideast .
you should blame the rocket launchers for that, they used them as they were human shields.
No they dont dont use them as human sheilds , they the Palestinians are living in a densely packed urban enviroment . Where 2 million human beings are crammed into a small enclave the size of Manhattan , resistance , desparate and ineffective as it is , in such an enviroment is impossible to avoid casualties .

You read about the Warsaw uprising they were very brave , but there action resulted in a barbarous Nazi assault killing thousands . But the fact is those Jews had to fight because the option was death or oppression , and that is the parallell of Palestinians today in Gaza .

I'm afraid you're a bit out of date there. Israel has already pulled out of the Gaza strip.

Yeah, only to have Israeli settlers, the following day, begin moving in on other Palestinian land.

All they're doing is playing musical chairs. Israel gives up some land only to take another section of land so we wind up with Israel not losing any land nor Palestinians gaining any. It's an endless circle that looks like action is being done, but the end result winds up the same as from where they started.

- N

And the fact is these rockets because of a buffer zone land harmlessly in no mans land not endangering any chosen person . And we only have Israels word these rocket attacks have taken place , and Israhell is a compulsive liar .

So for the record you are saying that no rockets have killed any Isrealis? You cannot be that blind and dumb! We all know your a little bit out there with your theories, but to completely ignore reported facts is crazy!

Responding to a call made by Palestinian Authority (P.A.) Chairman Mahmoud ‘Abbas to stop firing rockets at Israeli targets, Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri announced that “it was the rockets that ended the occupation.”

I guess the word of Hamas isnt good enough for you either...

The Israeli police regularly enters Gaza to apprehend Palestinian smugglers and other criminals to stand trial in Israel . So why cant the IDF enter Gaza to apprehend these rocket lauchers ?
That's a good question - if that's the case, that certainly would be a better option. But when I googled "israeli police" gaza all I found were articles about Israeli police clashing with settlers before/during the Gaza pullout (http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/07/19/mideast.protest/) and something about detaining a Hamas leader at a checkpoint (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4882084.stm).

The fact that these articles talk about actions in settlements and checkpoints leads me to hypothesise that Israeli police don't have authority to act in areas controlled by the Palestinian Authority. If you have any sources which say they do, I'd like to see them.

Israel has never left Gaza , all they have done is heremetically seal the entire strip and place it under a economic embargo in effect the Israelis have Watrsaw Ghettoized the Gaza .
They dismantled all Israeli settlements and military installations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_pullout_plan) in Gaza. I thought that was part of what the Palestinians wanted?

As a forced displacement, the removal of settlers was technically ethnic cleansing. Since they were Israeli citizens, though, Israel had the final say and presumably thought it was worth it.

There are no innocent Israelis , Israelis are fully aware of what crimes they are commiting against Palestinians
That's exactly the same attitude hardline Israelis use to support military action against Palestinians in response to terror attacks.

the Jews fully support each respective goverment .
Did you know that in Israeli politics almost no party (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Israel#Political_parties_and_elections ) ever gets a majority? They have to build coalitions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalition_government) with other parties just to form a government.

of course he knows nothing about israeli politics, or jewish people, or israeli people..or anything he talks about on this subject.

his daddy was upset at jews in the past, and so he cant see farther than his own nose on the subject. living in a shack in the middle of nowhere kind of hampers your ability to see the outside world.

loosen the tin foil hat, foley.

please ban brian foley.

The Jews supposed an event was prevented not a certainty .
.. and? what's your point? as i said they BELIEVE so.


You mean more accurately Jews were the perpertrators of an act of mass murder against an innocent people .
i mean the jews were the innocent people. purim is based on the story of "queen ester". read about it.


purim , passover , delicatessen hey whatever .
yeah whatever. next time do your homework.


Yeah precisely murder thousands of innocent Palestinians in the hope that those who witness this slaughter are frightened into fleeing into Egypt , Joradan , Lebanon and Syria in other words ethnic cleansing , or Purim Fest .

again, what has purim to do with the current situation in gaza?


Thats what the Nazis said at Lidice when they wipe out its inhabitants seein the assassins of Heydrich killed him there . Your just justifying collective punishment .


"There are no innocent Israelis , Israelis are fully aware of what crimes they are commiting against Palestinians the Jews fully support each respective goverment . The fact is Israelis must accept the consequences of their goverments actions , as the Germans had to with the actions of the Nazis and the Americans have to accept the consequences of their goverments actions in the mideast ."


So Israel courtesy of the US taxpayer has a massive military then go out and catch the men who fired these rockets . Why fire destructive artillery shells killing dozens of Palestinians who were not aware of what happened ?

once the rocket has been launched, you can't find the men who did it. you think they'll just sit and wait for the army to arrest them?


Why fire destructive artillery shells killing dozens of Palestinians who were not aware of what happened ?
Brian, don't be stupid. the army only fires into an area where a launched rocket was detected. wouldn't you be aware of that if someone is constantly launching rockets from where you live?
and why isn't the new palestinian government doing something about it, like taking control of its own territories, unless it supports the launching.


Dont turn it on its head ! The Israeli police regularly enters Gaza to apprehend Palestinian smugglers and other criminals to stand trial in Israel . So why cant the IDF enter Gaza to apprehend these rocket lauchers ?
because israel would have to stay there and take full control of the area. that means even more casualties and innocent people killed. the situation will get worse.


Israel has never left Gaza , all they have done is heremetically seal the entire strip and place it under a economic embargo in effect the Israelis have Watrsaw Ghettoized the Gaza .

the army left gaza, and now the rockets are getting even closer to the cities in israel. that makes people in israel very angry since the palestinians promised they will stop when israel leaves gaza.


There are no innocent Israelis , ...
once again, you talk about something which you don't have a clue about.
7 million israelis are living in israel. about 1.5 of them are non-jews. should the israeli arabs, and the palestinians that are israeli citizens accept the same "consequences" you mentioned earlier?


No they dont dont use them as human sheilds
they are. they launch from the palestinian villages. they take advantage of the situaion. that's why they don't launch in open areas, since it would be much easier for the army to just bomb the hell out of them.


You read about the Warsaw uprising they were very brave , but there action resulted in a barbarous Nazi assault killing thousands . But the fact is those Jews had to fight because the option was death or oppression , and that is the parallell of Palestinians today in Gaza .

that would be the same case if only the jews had kassams to launch at hitler. but it is far from being simillar.

Brian Foley no the reason they had to fight was their only choise was fight and die on their feet, or die in the gass chambers or the ovens on their backs, they were already opressed, get your facts straight.

Just noticed this response.

We have already shown you on another thraed that Israel immediately adavnced on Palestrinain areas in 1948 and the Arabs advanced to stop Jewish aggression , why do insist on carrying on this charade ?

I beg your pardon? Which "other thread" was this, pray tell?

Israel launched a aggressive pre-emptive strike on its neighbours to seize lands which make up Ertz Israel .

Actually Israel launched a pre-emptive strike to prevent being overrun by the weight of three armies. Worked pretty well too. And lookie, you used the phrase "pre-emptive".

Let's see what Wikipedia has to say about "pre-emptive":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-emptive

"A preemptive attack (or preemptive war) is waged in an attempt to repel or defeat an imminent offensive or invasion, or to gain a strategic advantage in an impending (usually unavoidable) war. Preemptive war is often confused with the term preventive war. While the latter is generally considered to violate international law, and to fall short of the requirements of a just war, preemptive wars are more often argued to be justified or justifiable.

The intention with a preemptive strike is to gain the advantage of initiative and to harm the enemy at a moment of minimal protection, for instance while vulnerable during transport or mobilization.

While the labeling of an attack (on strategic and tactical levels) seldom is controversial, it is much more so in regard to the initiation of a war. For propagandist reasons, and in the name of information warfare, an adversary's defensive dispositions may often be attributed offensive purpose alleging the necessity of the own attack.

One hypothetical example of a preemptive war would be an attack staged against enemy troops, massed at a state's border, that were preparing to invade."

So: to "an imminent offensive or invasion". So by use of the term "pre-emptive", you admit that the attack by the combined Arab armies was indeed "imminent"; that is to say, about to occur.

Now why would they have thought that?

************************************************** ****************************************

http://www.yahoodi.com/peace/sixdaywar.html

May 14, 1967: Egypt's President Gamal Nasser demands the withdrawal of United Nations force--established in 1957 as an international "guarantee" of safety for Israel--from the Sinai peninsula. The UN meekly obeys; the United States and Britain fail to rouse the Security Council to take action.

May 15: Three Egyptian army divisions and 600 tanks roll into the Sinai. World community does nothing.

May 17: Cairo Radio's Voice of the Arabs: "All Egypt is now prepared to plunge into total war which will put an end to Israel."

May 18: Voice of the Arabs announces: "As of today, there no longer exists an international emergency force to protect Israel. We shall exercise patience no more. We shall not complain any more to the UN about Israel. The sole method we shall apply against Israel is a total war which will result in the extermination of Zionist existence."

May 18: Nasser announces blockade of Straits of Tiran in the Red Sea, severing Israel's southern maritime link to the outside world. Israel considers the closure an act of war. (US President Lyndon Johnson later says: "If a single act of folly was more responsible for this explosion than any other it was the arbitrary and dangerous announced decision that the Straits of Tiran would be closed.")

May 20: Syria's defence minister (now president) Hafez el-Assad says: "Our forces are now ready not only to repulse the aggression but to initiate the act of liberation itself, and to explode the Zionist presence in the Arab homeland. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united ..."

May 27: Nasser: "Our basic [object] will be the destruction of Israel. The Arab people want to fight."

May 30: Nasser : "The armies of Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Lebanon are poised on the borders of Israel."

May 30: Jordan's King Hussein signs a five-year mutual defence pact with Egypt and the two set up a joint command, making clear its stance in any future conflict.

My 31: Egyptian newspaper Al Akhbar reports: "Under terms of the military agreement signed with Jordan, Jordanian artillery, co-ordinated with the forces of Egypt and Syria, is in a position to cut Israel in two ..."

May 31: Iraqi President Rahman Aref announces: "This is our opportunity to wipe out the ignominy which has been with us since 1948. Our goal is clear--to wipe Israel off the map."

June 4: Iraq joins Nasser's military alliance against Israel./B]

"[B]Never in human history can an aggressor have made his purpose known in advance so clearly and so widely. Certain of victory, both the Arab leaders and their peoples threw off all restraint. Between the middle of May and fifth of June, world-wide newspapers, radio and, most incisively, television brought home to millions of people the threat of politicide bandied about with relish by the leaders of these modern states. Even more blatant was the exhilaration which the Arabic peoples displayed as the prospect of executing genocide on the people of Israel ... In those three weeks of mounting tension people throughout the world watched and waited in growing anxiety--or in some cases, in hopeful expectation--for the overwhelming forces of at least Egypt, Syria, Jordan and Iraq to bear down from three sides to crush tiny Israel and slaughter her people."

- Samuel Katz, Battleground: Fact and fantasy in Palestine

"Israel's critics maintain that the 1967 War was one of Israeli aggression rather than a war of Israeli self-defense. Yet, on May 15, Israel's Independence Day, Egyptian troops began moving into the Sinai, massing near the Israeli border. By May 18, Syrian troops, too, were preparing for battle along the Golan Heights, 3000 feet above the Galilee, from which they had shelled Israel's farms and villages for years. Egypt's Nasser ordered the UN Emergency Force (UNEF), stationed in the Sinai since 1956, to withdraw, whereupon the Voice of the Arabs proclaimed, on May 18, 1967..."

************************************************** ****************************************

Etc etc, ad infinitum. I recommend visiting the site; very informative indeed.

Foley, I thank you for your inadvertent help in proving my point.

And this was an Arab attack to reagin what Israel took in 1967 .

Conducted as a surprise attack - for which, in a perverse way, they could be commended since it was their only chance. And it still failed.

Oy vay.

Geoff

Here's another good quote about the 1948 war:

""the surviving Jews would be helped to return to their native countries, but my estimation is that none will survive"
- Ahmed Shuqeiri (later to be PLO chief) quoted in Churchill and Churchill, p. 52 "

Geoff

As a forced displacement [Israeli pullout of Gaza], the removal of settlers was technically ethnic cleansing.

Haha, oh God. Let's hope we don't hear spin on this by Israel: THE 2nd JEWISH HOLOCAUST! :bugeye:

*chokes & gags*

- N

Haha, oh God. Let's hope we don't hear spin on this by Israel: THE 2nd JEWISH HOLOCAUST! :bugeye:

*chokes & gags*

- N

Yeesh, I hope not ;) but you've got the sides mixed up: Israel would never say that - right wing ex-settlers might say it of Israel, though :p

Ah. I think I may have struck gold here.
http://www.israelipalestinianprocon.org/
Neutral source as categorised here (http://www.politicalcrossfire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=51341), presents opinions on both sides. Reading encouraged.

I'm afraid you're a bit out of date there. Israel has already pulled out of the Gaza strip (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip#Background). Kadima, a party which advocates pulling out of the West Bank, got the most votes in the recent elections. I think from these facts it is undeniable that Israel doesn't as a whole want 'colonisation of Palestinian lands'.

If that were true then why haven't they done so already? Why are they still unlawfully occupying Palestinian land?

If you have any sources which say they do, I'd like to see them.
Usually its commamdos who do the extraction work on behalf of the police , I mean you do realise Israeli law supercedes the Palestinian authority .
Israeli commandoes raid Palestinian jail (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4809696.stm)
IDF to raise alert level for elections (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1139395664155&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull)
During the raid, troops arrested two members of Islamic Jihad and one Fatah terror suspect. In Tulkarm, three Hamas militants were also apprehended.
Palestinian killed in Israeli raid (http://www.isn.ethz.ch/news/sw/details.cfm?ID=15416)
Israeli troops killed a Palestinian man during an arrest raid in Nablus on Friday morning
They dismantled all Israeli settlements and military installations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_pullout_plan) in Gaza. I thought that was part of what the Palestinians wanted?
Well Fuck mate its increasing obvious all that has happened is that Israel has barbed wired up the Gaza and has placed an Economic embargoe on it and are routinely shelling the strip or firing missiles at them I think its safe to say the Palestinians realise they are sitting ducks .
As a forced displacement, the removal of settlers was technically ethnic cleansing. Since they were Israeli citizens, though, Israel had the final say and presumably thought it was worth it.
They were illegally there in the first place but they were handsomely paid compensation I believe it was US$750,000 per household and resettled in Israel , courtesy of the non-Jewish American taxpayer who funded the entire operation .
Did you know that in Israeli politics almost no party (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Israel#Political_parties_and_elections ) ever gets a majority? They have to build coalitions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalition_government) with other parties just to form a government.
The fact is all those Israeli political parties may differ on economic platforms but they are all still the same when it comes to the Treatment of Palestinians .
again, what has purim to do with the current situation in gaza?
As I said I found what the IDF commander said about shelling to prevent more rocket attacks a parallel with the Purim .
once the rocket has been launched, you can't find the men who did it. you think they'll just sit and wait for the army to arrest them?
Doesnt matter what is making these Palestinians fire these rockets ? It is Israeli policies , so if you want them to stop Israel can remedy the situation by treating Palestinians as equals in law .
Brian, don't be stupid. the army only fires into an area where a launched rocket was detected. wouldn't you be aware of that if someone is constantly launching rockets from where you live?
The IDF has launched many unprovoked raids and full scale attacks into Palestinian territrories the most notorious was the Jenin raid .
and why isn't the new palestinian government doing something about it, like taking control of its own territories, unless it supports the launching.
What can the now bankrupt Palsetinian goverment which Israel has done to it do ? Seriously the Palestinians have a lightly armed and undermanned and ill trained police force to cope . That is by Israels design the fact is aaa this is a problem created by Israels policy and this is the end result .
because israel would have to stay there and take full control of the area. that means even more casualties and innocent people killed. the situation will get worse.
So here you make an admission that the IDF would be killing on a large scale , when you understand and comprehend Palestinian anger then you shall take a more realistic and responsible as well as a more critical view of Israels actions . Wiuld wish to be traeted like the Palestinians ?
the army left gaza, and now the rockets are getting even closer to the cities in israel. that makes people in israel very angry since the palestinians promised they will stop when israel leaves gaza.
And how angry do you think the Palestinians feel living with 60% unemployment and 5th world squalor ?
once again, you talk about something which you don't have a clue about. 7 million israelis are living in israel. about 1.5 of them are non-jews. should the israeli arabs, and the palestinians that are israeli citizens accept the same "consequences" you mentioned earlier?
These non-Jews do not share full citizenship with Jews there are as I believe some 19 separate laws where these non-Jewish citizens can be stripped of the citizenship .
they are. they launch from the palestinian villages. they take advantage of the situaion. that's why they don't launch in open areas, since it would be much easier for the army to just bomb the hell out of them.
As I said before Gaza is an extremely small and overcrowded strip of land no matter where they fire these rockets from they will always be in close proximaty to civilians .
that would be the same case if only the jews had kassams to launch at hitler. but it is far from being simillar.
So here you actually endorse the Nazi mass murder in the attack on the Ghetto ?
I beg your pardon? Which "other thread" was this, pray tell?

Friends of HAMAS (http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=52592&page=1&pp=20)
Now go away .

Why, you lying little toad.

Now go away .

Oh - not now. Not when I'm now having so much fun, Brian.

As for your link - the immediate fighting began about November 29, 1947:

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/1948_War.html

"Violence in the Holy Land broke out almost immediately after the UN announced partition on November 29, 1947. Jamal Husseini, the Arab Higher Committee's spokesman, had told the UN prior to the partition vote the Arabs would drench "the soil of our beloved country with the last drop of our blood . . . ."1

Husseini's prediction began to come true after the UN announcement. The Arabs declared a protest strike and instigated riots that claimed the lives of 62 Jews and 32 Arabs. By the end of the second week, 93 Arabs, 84 Jews and 7 Englishmen had been killed and scores injured. From November 30-February 1, 427 Arabs, 381 Jews and 46 British were killed and 1,035 Arabs, 725 Jews and 135 British were wounded. In March alone, 271 Jews and 257 Arabs died in Arab attacks and Jewish counter*attacks.2"

So the attacks started with Arabist riots, not Israeli counterattacks. Oopsie!

Not to mention which....the link you cited specifically states that Plan Daleth was:

not a plan for mass expulsion or "ethnic cleansing" of Palestinians from wide areas

It was not an offensive plan-- it was meant to activated only in the event of an attack initiated by the Arab side, though that attack was thought to be inevitable.

It did not call for massacres such as the massacre perpetrated at Deir Yassin by the dissident Irgun and Lehi forces.

It was not an "expansionist" plan: "Generally, the aim of this plan is not an operation of occupation outside the borders of the Hebrew state."

And yet you said:

No rumours below is an actual plan at removing the palestinians .

Well, well. Guess I should check your links more thoroughly more often, eh?

So now that I've discredited you using your own link, will you do the honourable thing and admit fault?

Geoff

There was stuff before 1948 that didn't much help trust on either side.
http://www.israelipalestinianprocon.org/bin/procon/procon.cgi?database=5%2dF%2dSubs%2edb&command=viewone&id=17&op=t

This leads to situations where extremists wield more power than they ought. A statement by Lehi against Arabs might be mistakenly interpreted as representing all Jews; a statement by the Mufti against Jews might be mistakenly interpreted as representing all Arabs...

True enough.

My suspicion is still that the concept of dhimmitude is ultimately to blame: this base assumption that non-muslims must be subjugated by muslims as second-class citizens. The oppressive marches of 1921 designed to humiliate Christians dragged the Jews into the fray and, unlike the locals, they didn't respond as they were meant to. Other may think differently; this is my suspicion only.

Geoff

As for your link - the immediate fighting began about November 29, 1947:
LOL what an Arsehole !The Fucking idiot gives me a quote about riots and tries to pass them off as military operatons !
Military operations began on the 21st of December 1947 (http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Palestine-Remembered/Story564.html#1948) when Jewish forces attacked Palestinians Haganah and IZL attack villages and Bedouin settlements of coastal plain north of Tel Aviv in first coastal "clearing" operation.Haganah and IZL paramilitary gangs perpetrate Balad al-Shaykh (Haifa) massacre, in which more than 60 civilians are murdered.
You got your arse kicked on that thread , you tried to insinuate that the Arab nations and palestinians initiated the attacks , remember .
Not to mention which....the link you cited specifically states that Plan Daleth was: Where the Fuck did I claim that plan was a blueprint for ethnic cleansing ?
I used Plan D to answer your claim here . The Zionists "advanced" on no one. Rumours were deliberately spread by Arabist, rather than Zionist forces that the Palestinians were going to be massacred by the Israeli forces victorious after the first war. The Palestinians then fled en masse. Unsurprisingly (and understandably) Israeli forces occupied the areas to improve their buffer zone.
And the Plan itself called for attcks on civilian villages , and this is what caused the panic . But that plan was claer evidence evidence of Jewish iniation of military operations .
Plan Dalet. (http://www.mideastweb.org/pland.htm) which is Mounting operations against enemy population centers located inside or near our defensive system in order to prevent them from being used as bases by an active armed force. These operations can be divided into the following categories:

Destruction of villages (setting fire to, blowing up, and planting mines in the debris), especially those population centers which are difficult to control continuously.

Mounting search and control operations according to the following guidelines: encirclement of the village and conducting a search inside it. In the event of resistance, the. armed force must be destroyed and the population must be expelled outside the borders of the state.
And the Plan was put into operation .
4 April 1948 Haganah launches Plan Dalet.
6-15 April 1948 Operation Nachshon: In first operation of Plan Dalet Haganah Giv'ati Brigade and other units capture villages along Tel Aviv-Jerusalem road from local Palestinian militia.
13-20 April 1948 Operation Har'el under Plan Dalet launched at conclusion of Operation Nachshon. Villages along Jerusalem road attacked and demolished. All subsequent Haganah operations until 15 May 1948 undertaken within framework of Plan Dalet.
And that’s where you bowed out of the debate , remember ?
So now that I've discredited you using your own link, will you do the honourable thing and admit fault?
Go away you stupid lying ignorant Arsehole .

There was stuff before 1948 that didn't much help trust on either side.
http://www.israelipalestinianprocon.org/bin/procon/procon.cgi?database=5%2dF%2dSubs%2edb&command=viewone&id=17&op=t

This leads to situations where extremists wield more power than they ought. A statement by Lehi against Arabs might be mistakenly interpreted as representing all Jews; a statement by the Mufti against Jews might be mistakenly interpreted as representing all Arabs...
Oh yeah , a Israeli/Jewish site !
Staffing: (http://www.israelipalestinianprocon.org/aboutus.html)
4. Staffing:

Site editor was formerly Steven C. Markoff (now Chairman and President). Editor as of 12/07/04 is Kambiz Akhavan. Jeff Yablan is the site's researcher.
And not a Palestinian to be found !

Apparantly Brian cannot admit facts without twisting. Sad.

LOL what an Arsehole !The Fucking idiot gives me a quote about riots and tries to pass them off as military operatons !

I didn't say they were military; I do say they were aggression against immigrants.

Military operations began on the 21st of December 1947 (http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Palestine-Remembered/Story564.html#1948) when Jewish forces

My dear Foley: this is incorrect.

Violence in the Holy Land broke out almost immediately after the UN announced partition on November 29, 1947. Jamal Husseini, the Arab Higher Committee's spokesman, had told the UN prior to the partition vote the Arabs would drench "the soil of our beloved country with the last drop of our blood . . . ."1

Husseini's prediction began to come true after the UN announcement. The Arabs declared a protest strike and instigated riots that claimed the lives of 62 Jews and 32 Arabs. By the end of the second week, 93 Arabs, 84 Jews and 7 Englishmen had been killed and scores injured. From November 30-February 1, 427 Arabs, 381 Jews and 46 British were killed and 1,035 Arabs, 725 Jews and 135 British were wounded. In March alone, 271 Jews and 257 Arabs died in Arab attacks and Jewish counter*attacks.2

The chairman of the Arab Higher Committee said the Arabs would "fight for every inch of their country."3 Two days later, the holy men of Al-Azhar University in Cairo called on the Muslim world to proclaim a jihad (holy war) against the Jews.4

The first large-scale assaults began on January 9, 1948, when approximately 1,000 Arabs attacked Jewish communities in northern Palestine. By February, the British said so many Arabs had infiltrated they lacked the forces to run them back.5 In fact, the British turned over bases and arms to Arab irregulars and the Arab Legion.

In the first phase of the war, lasting from November 29, 1947 until April 1, 1948, the Palestinian Arabs took the offensive, with help from volunteers from neighboring countries. Well THAT doesn't sound familiar, does it? - GeoffThe Jews suffered severe casualties and passage along most of their major roadways was disrupted.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/1948_War.html

So the Palestinians were on the offensive starting in November 1947. That would be a month prior to your date of Dec 21, 1947, indicating that the Palestinians started the attacks.

You got your arse kicked on that thread , you tried to insinuate that the Arab nations and palestinians initiated the attacks , remember .

LMAO - funny, I don't remember. However, it seems that the real interest has just started, Brian.

Where the Fuck did I claim that plan was a blueprint for ethnic cleansing ?

That would be:

No rumours below is an actual plan at removing the palestinians .

Bad grammar aside, did you then mean they were to be peaceably removed? Sure doesn't sound like you mean it that way. :D

I used Plan D to answer your claim here .

Oh dear. Well, then, you used it wrongly. You see, Foley, the website you cited insists the following:

It was not a plan for mass expulsion or "ethnic cleansing" of Palestinians from wide areas

It was not an offensive plan-- it was meant to activated only in the event of an attack initiated by the Arab side, though that attack was thought to be inevitable.

It doesn't say anything about offensive action on the part of Israel other than for tactical advantage. Nor does it say anything about conquering territory.

And the Plan itself called for attcks on civilian villages , and this is what caused the panic . But that plan was claer evidence evidence of Jewish iniation of military operations .

It does indeed mention taking villages used as a staging area for Arab attacks...but not that the territory is being taken for the purposes of enlargening Israel, which seems to be your thrust. Rather, the territory is that of tactical value. Translation: they didn't want it because Arabs were living there, but rather because it had defensive value or might be used as an offensive base. Compare that to the statements of the Arab leaders at the time...they planned massacre right to the Mediterranean Sea, not limited control for the sake of tactical redress. Please don't be ridiculous.

And, of course, the link also says: "it was meant to activated only in the event of an attack initiated by the Arab side". Ergo, not offensive, but reactive.

And that’s where you bowed out of the debate , remember ?

...? I just said: don't be ridiculous. But if it makes you feel any better, I allow you to think so. Of course, you must then also accept the fact that I am "back".

Go away you stupid lying ignorant Arsehole .

Brian, I can't tell you how happy it makes me when you resort to that sort of nonsense.

Geoff

this guys full of shit.

Apparantly Brian cannot admit facts without twisting. Sad.
Hey its the 31 year old introvert who is obsessed with star wars and star trek is back ! Mey moonbeam what would dr Spock do if he was Golda Meir?
I didn't say they were military; I do say they were aggression against immigrants.
Another climb down .
So the Palestinians were on the offensive starting in November 1947. That would be a month prior to your date of Dec 21, 1947, indicating that the Palestinians started the attacks.
The Jewish virtual library as your source ! You biased article paints Israel as a victim and places all blame on the Arabs you couldnt find a non-biased source . See here is a source :
1948 - First Arab-Israeli War (http://www.palestinehistory.com/time1900.htm#1948-1)
In Palestine, Arab protests against partition erupted in violence, with attacks on Jewish settlements in retaliation to the attacks of Jews terrorist groups to Arab Towns and villages and massacres in hundred against unarmed Palestinian in there homes , that soon led to a full-scale war. The British generally refused to intervene, intent on leaving the country no later than August 15, 1948, the date in the partition plan for termination of the mandate.
See that is the reason for those riots .
When it became clear that the British intended to leave by May 15, leaders of the Yishuv decided (as they claim) to implement that part of the partition plan calling for establishment of a Jewish state. In Tel Aviv on May 14 the Provisional State Council, formerly the National Council, “representing the Jewish people in Palestine and the World Zionist Movement,” proclaimed the “establishment of the Jewish State in Palestine, to be called Medinat Israel (the State of Israel) … open to the immigration of Jews from all the countries of their dispersion.”
And here is where the Jews decalare their state provoking the war .
That would be:
I didnt say ethnic cleansing at all .
No rumours below is an actual plan at removing the palestinians .
Removing is what I said , and that is precisely what Plan D says .
Plan Dalet. (http://www.mideastweb.org/pland.htm) In the event of resistance, the. armed force must be destroyed and the population must be expelled outside the borders of the state.
Hmm now this sounds very clear " the population must be expelled outside the borders of the state. " .
Brian, I can't tell you how happy it makes me when you resort to that sort of nonsense.
You are just a dork , seriously , you have been caught twice contradicting yourself on sciforums , you have twice been caught out deceptively supplanting my name into quotes and a bald face lie about me on the jews rule the world thread .

The Jewish virtual library as your source ! You biased article paints Israel as a victim and places all blame on the Arabs you couldnt find a non-biased source . See here is a source :
Your source (palestinehistory.com) is pro-Palestinian and also biased...
(see this link (http://www.politicalcrossfire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=51341) for one list of sources...)

Another climb down .

No, it's a "slap-up". As in: upside your head. Anti-Jewish riots began in 1947, not 1948, and were in response to the declaration of separation.

The Jewish virtual library as your source ! You biased article paints Israel as a victim and places all blame on the Arabs you couldnt find a non-biased source . See here is a source :

Oh, well your source isn't biased at all. LOL

And I note that your source didn't mention anything about the Arab riots of 1947 - more than half a year before August 1948 - in which the Arabs were the aggressors, and which is illustrated by comments from the Arab Higher Committee. Read them yourself; the spokesman does sound pretty high:

Violence in the Holy Land broke out almost immediately after the UN announced partition on November 29, 1947. Jamal Husseini, the Arab Higher Committee's spokesman, had told the UN prior to the partition vote the Arabs would drench "the soil of our beloved country with the last drop of our blood . . . ."1

See that is the reason for those riots .

It's part of the reason. The other part is that the local Arab councils were bigoted demagogues.

And here is where the Jews decalare their state provoking the war .

Or, rather, stating their independence from a population that wanted to kill them and a foreign army so effete in protecting them as be ineffectual.

I didnt say ethnic cleansing at all .

You implied it and you drew parallels with Purim, which you directly called "ethnic cleansing". Shall I go check your other threads, Brian? Sure you've never used the term more explicitly in reference to the Palestinians?

In any event, the thread clearly refutes you:

Hmm now this sounds very clear " the population must be expelled outside the borders of the state. " .

In certain locales where attacks were going to be mounted. Again, this fits with pre-emptive justified action - which is how you described the Israeli campaign.

You are just a dork , seriously , you have been caught twice contradicting yourself on sciforums , you have twice been caught out deceptively supplanting my name into quotes and a bald face lie about me on the jews rule the world thread .

Those, in fact, are lies. I changed my opinion once, and attributed to you once something you hadn't written, but probably believe anyway. I, however, have proven that you lied about responding to threads and about the existence of links to try and undermine my arguments.

Liar.

I also noticed that you used the phrase "And here is where the Jews decalare their state provoking the war"

Not Israelis, not immigrants, you said - Jews.

Gotcha again, Foley.

Geoff

Oh yeah , a Israeli/Jewish site !

And not a Palestinian to be found !
Does "Kambiz Akhavan" really sound like an Israeli name to you? According to his about page (http://www.procon.org/aboutkamy.htm) he speaks Farsi (Persian) among other languages but no mention of Hebrew.

*sits back, relaxing pleasantly*

geez you guys, i dont even need to say anything to the resident bigot today! you (geoff and zephyr) did my work for me...thanks!!

Foleys slacking.

he is a joke.

Hay Susan, you still haven't answered about the Foley in the news over here, who got 25 years for buggering his son, dose it run in the family?

*sits back, relaxing pleasantly*

geez you guys, i dont even need to say anything to the resident bigot today! you (geoff and zephyr) did my work for me...thanks!!

No worries Devil. He's probably run off to an activist site again.

The thing is, I wouldn't have kicked him around so hard if he hadn't accused me of being a liar.

Geoff

No, it's a "slap-up". As in: upside your head. Anti-Jewish riots began in 1947, not 1948, and were in response to the declaration of separation.
And once again the discussion was about which side initiated military operations against whom which are deliberately trying to turn around on its head , like on the original thread you broke away refusing to answer me or mountainhare .
You implied it and you drew parallels with Purim, which you directly called "ethnic cleansing". Shall I go check your other threads, Brian?
No Arsehead gather your bearings Purim is on this thread , what you are discussing here is from another thread which by the way you introduced .
Those, in fact, are lies.
No you are the only one who has told lies here on sciforum in fact we can start here fom this thread which you have not returned to answer your accusers .
So what if Jews rule the world? (http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=53741&page=2&pp=20)
Geoff: Again falsely attributing another statement to me , 2 days ago you falsely applied my name to a quote I never made . Where the FUCK !!! did I say Jews ruled the World , I have never stated anything of the sort you LIAR ! I demand you prove that I said this . Show where on sciforums I made such an allegation , or apologize . ” Oh, please. You infer it all the bloody time by making associations between the US and Israel. Go wash your hood. Ahh, I see. So you CAN'T quote Brian making the claim that Jews ruled the world. Quite revealing...
GeoffP
I am unable to find the post where you apologized for attributing remaks to Brian Foley that can not be cited;
As I said and as others know you are a liar . You have also deliberately attached my name to quotes I never made as well as insert your name into one of my links to take credit for it . You have been caught outcontradicting yourself of Jews being race and then claiming they weren’t a race , also claiming Iran was building an A-Bomb then contradicting yourself and saying that they possibly might be building one . You’re a Arsehole pure and simple Geoff .
Does "Kambiz Akhavan" really sound like an Israeli name to you? According to his about page he speaks Farsi (Persian) among other languages but no mention of Hebrew.
No shit , he speaks Persian , he must be unbiased then ! LOL .
Hay Susan, you still haven't answered about the Foley in the news over here, who got 25 years for buggering his son, dose it run in the family?
Cupcake , ahhh …. if I am living here in Australia and the event happened in America ….. nah , nah never mind .
On the flip side of the buttock
Yes Brian, how about a pub in Texas I know of, I would like to meet you personally and up close Pubs , beer drinking and getting up close and personal , hmmm your time in the military did you partake in the game barrack blanket bingo with the others ?
ps: I'll wear my chastie belt.
What Fucking man owns a chastity belt ? Do you sit down to take a piss or maybe it was from all those GI conga lines in the showers !

Chosen People = Racist Supremacist Ideology (http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=53574&page=1)
if you persist on spreading lies, i will report you every single time you post, and it wont be long before you are banned, im sure.
*reports this thread as inappropriate to the religion forum, as it relates to not religion, but racism.*
Yes the much vaunted and confident boast .
So what if Jews rule the world? (http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=53741&page=2&pp=20)
The Devil Inside:

Please do not insult other posters, or you may be banned from sciforums.

Also, be aware that we have a policy of banning people who call on the banning of others. If you continue in the same vein, I intend to implement that policy.
ROFL it is him who is now looking as worn as Buffalo Roams rectal orifice his one man crusade has turned to shit .

Yea Foley, around aussie like you a man has to protect his back side, I hear you learned everything you know from buggering sheep, turn the mug up and tell me about the black stump.

tell me about the black stump.
Why is the pommel horse to high for you ? ;)
over a pomel horse and givening him the Wellington Boot
Hey and as for fucking sheep you must of seen Brokeback Mountain its about 2 gay Texan cowboy sheep herders like yourself .

http://entimg.msn.com/i/150/mo/OneSheets/brokebackmountain_onesheet_150x225.jpg

Apparently velcro gloves are a necessity ;)

you are right, foley.
you show your idiocy better than i ever could.
fuck a koala, racist.

please ban brian foley.

I've been away too long.

These kinds of personal attacks on each other
will end. Please take this as your only warning.