This is royalty folks
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4170623.stm

I can't believe this insensitive fag, with the 60th anniversary for the liberation of auschwitz coming up? Why even pretend?? Its not funny or ironic.

After the queen dies, the British monarchy should be dissolved.

Kids make stupid mistakes. I blame his royal entourage of teachers, consultants, etc.. Although it was insensitive, isn’t it the purpose of a costume to attract attention an be the “talk of the town”? It certainly achieved that goal. Is a costume of Bin laden or saddam hussein “insensitive”? Also, wouldn’t dressing up as Bush be insulting to some (many) people?

British tabloids most be bored, who cares it was a costume party

p.s. its not only the britieh gosip paper...

I was kind of shocked to see this - he really sould have know better. It's not as if he hasn't had a decent enough education.

That picture is going to haunt him for the rest of his life now and will be bought up time and time again.

Bet his mom loved that pic...

dunno...it is kind of part of the British culture to make fun of Nazis...just look at 'Alo alo...

Maybe in the past (Fawlty Towers etc etc) but i thought that had died out.

Prince Harry comes from a long line of german ancestry.
The boy is obviously celebrating his ancestry and culture. Let's not forget we brits massacred millions in the name of the empire. and if that wasn't enough we gave the world George Michael :)

The paper that took the photo is called the Sun. But is known as the scum. This is just a non-story.A photo of a spotty 18yr old out having a laugh with his mates, wearing a swastika, whiffy boo. Poor sod was just going to a private party and the paparazzi got a shot of him which they knew would sell around the world for thousands. I can walk down the road here and rent a nazi outfit, its no big deal. Maybe somebody or one of the many sycophants that surround him should of said something, but hey, lets put it in context in the grand scheme of things. Its just not important.

Who else thinks that charlie is not his dad? James Hewitt anyone?

Maybe in the past (Fawlty Towers etc etc) but i thought that had died out.

No, we still take the piss out of the germans. But it is in a lighthearted way ;)

If he were just any 18 year old boy, it wouldn't matter as much. We're not asking him to be an advocate for human rights like his mom... Just to show a little tact, since he represents the royal family

James Hewitt? nah. More like cromwell

It has also prompted suggestions from some that Prince Harry should not be allowed to enrol at Sandhurst military academy. The Ministry of Defence has said it will not affect his place.

The status quo: If some public figure does something stupid you can always expect the public outcry to be far stupider.

...oh, and the gall of the foriegn politicians to be criticizing him is just outright hillarious.

ok, calling him an insensitive fag was overkill. But don't you think he should at least know better?

ok, calling him an insensitive fag was overkill. But don't you think he should at least know better?

Ofcourse he should and this is why it puzzles me. He isn't a wildchild, and is fairly grounded. This isn't becoming of him, but calling for his removal from his choice school is just plain moronic and needless.

What he did is solved by an apology and he apologized...el fin.

calling for his removal from his choice school is just plain moronic and needless.

Yes, people make mistakes and should be forgiven. I agree with you on that.

Either way, this has convinced me that the monarchy is officially dead.

Either way, this has convinced me that there's no place in Britain for a monarchy anymore.

Isn't there? They are last shred of Old British pride that they have left. They may not have any real political power but they serve as an image...and they are rich as hell. They wouldn't be there if them majority of the British people didn't feel a need for them.

BTW...are their belongings privately owned or can they be taken away by the government? Even if they do get kicked out their 22 billion dollars worth of 600 Da Vinci pieces should keep them floating, unless that gets taken from them too.

"Know better?" By whose standards? Somehow, wearing a nazi symbol at a theme party, where his brother was dressed as a cat, serves, it seems to me, to diminish the vitality of that symbol -- but to react in shock to this is to seek to keep that vitality alive. Isn't that what's behind this?

Off topic. Dismantling the monarchy will not dismantle the royal family's prestige in the world -- thus they will be free to not keep their mouths shut.

I think we are taking it a bit far...I mean to be fair it was a dress up party, and I doubt he is a Nazi thats stupid to even thing such stupidity, was it insensitive? Sure, was it intelligent to do...no...but that doesn't make him a Nazi...its not what you wear that makes you a nazi it is what you think that matters. I bet you many "Nazi's" don't even know they are Nazi's.

If you want to talk about insensitive, let's talk about the way people gossip about the royal family. It's not like they chose to be famous; they were born into it, and had no chance to keep the media from smearing their personal life all over the place. Dressing up as a Nazi doesn't make Harry a Nazi or someone who agrees with what the Nazis did. Ever heard of Halloween? Loads of people dress up as axe murderers or the like, but that doesn't mean that they're in favor of murdering people. The only reason people have an issue about this is because turning everything that the royal family does into a big deal has become acceptable.

So I have a challenge for anyone who wants to complain about Harry's costume: share with us some detail from your personal life. Ever said something disrespectful? Done something that might offend people? Kissed someone, or even just talked to someone of the opposite gender? But perhaps you don't want everyone knowing about it. I'm sorry, how insensitive of me.

Good thing for you it's not already on national (and international) television.

Also, I really must protest to the use of the word "fag".

lol, whoaaaa Beryl, I like your tone! Keep it coming.

If you want to talk about insensitive, let's talk about the way people gossip about the royal family. It's not like they chose to be famous; they were born into it, and had no chance to keep the media from smearing their personal life all over the place.
I took back my 'insensitive fag' statement earlier, that was wrong of me, but I stand behind my reasoning. And I wouldn't call such public knowledge gossip, since I don't do that. The point which you seem to have missed is that 'After the queen dies, the British monarchy should be dissolved.'

Prince Harry is the (2nd) youngest of this British royalty. For all the privileges he gets he has some responsibilities. One of which is to behave himself in public, which means not doing any overtly offensive. Its not much to ask of someone who won't have to work a day in his life, and it doesn't mean he has to be a Robot and travel through london on a white horse either. I'm sympathetic to his situation. Harry can't just pick up and leave the family due to his circumstances (which it looks like wants,) but imagine how many other kids his age are in the same predicament? Maybe you'll feel this way when you're older. (tangent: ..maybe this is the source of his petulance)

Now, I don't know about you, but I have very deep ties to the people that the Nazi's victimized and I find his humor..err choice in costume disgusting. I'm the calmest guy I know, it takes *a lot* to offend me, but he would have gotten a mouthful if I was there. Anybody who knows what the Nazi's did, and then dresses up as one as a joke is slapping me in the face.

Are brits supposed to look up to people that can so easily forget the events tied to that costume as kings??

AFAIK, this is a clear indictation that he has no interest in being one and thats perfectly fine. So lets dissolve this outmoded monarchy. Its already irrelevant. I'm sure Harry would be all the happier too.

Dressing up as a Nazi doesn't make Harry a Nazi or someone who agrees with what the Nazis did. Ever heard of Halloween? Loads of people dress up as axe murderers or the like, but that doesn't mean that they're in favor of murdering people. The only reason people have an issue about this is because turning everything that the royal family does into a big deal has become acceptable.

No, of course not. It makes him ignorant to the fact that he has no regard for the people that look to him for leadership. And BTW, I take issue with anyone who dresses as a Nazi. I don't care what their intentions were or who they are.

Obviously, the Sun doesn't care about the real Nazi's out there, otherwise they'd be reporting them. The fact that he's 'gossip material' now doesn't redeem him for what he's done. Only an honest "sorry'" can do that.

So I have a challenge for anyone who wants to complain about Harry's costume: share with us some detail from your personal life. Ever said something disrespectful? Done something that might offend people? Kissed someone, or even just talked to someone of the opposite gender? But perhaps you don't want everyone knowing about it. I'm sorry, how insensitive of me.
I'm an open book. What do you want to know specifically?
-Ever said something disrespectful?
Many times, usually accidentally. Sometimes on purpose. Never for fun(maybe a couple times actually, borderline accidental).

-Done something that might offend people?
I farted in class once :)
ok seriously I have, but I don't do something that I know is going to offend for the sake of offending, unless I have a specific reason (I'm still wondering what Harry's reason was.)

-Kissed someone, or even just talked to someone of the opposite gender?
How would that be embarrasing?

Good thing for you it's not already on national (and international) television.
Rumors spread quickly and effectively in small tight groups. I'm not sure which is more devastating. Harry will never have to meet the peasantfolk that watch TV, I see them everyday, though unlike him, I know how to cope. He's probably messed up good for being chased since childhood. I have pity for him in that respect

Anyways, you sound upset. Sorry if I offended you?

Sargentlard,

Isn't there? They are last shred of Old British pride that they have left. They may not have any real political power but they serve as an image...and they are rich as hell. They wouldn't be there if them majority of the British people didn't feel a need for them.

BTW...are their belongings privately owned or can they be taken away by the government? Even if they do get kicked out their 22 billion dollars worth of 600 Da Vinci pieces should keep them floating, unless that gets taken from them too.

They'll go out of fashion eventually. The old Brittain died after WWone.

And the money? Its a lot like how Quebec and Canada are tied together by debt. I'm not sure what the solution would be. They definately wouldn't be thrown onto the street.

but to react in shock to this is to seek to keep that vitality alive. Isn't that what's behind this?.
I think thats the effect he was going for..like taunting the bull with a red flag, eh? just who is responsible

I think we are taking it a bit far...I mean to be fair it was a dress up party, and I doubt he is a Nazi thats stupid to even thing such stupidity, was it insensitive? Sure, was it intelligent to do...no...but that doesn't make him a Nazi...its not what you wear that makes you a nazi it is what you think that matters. I bet you many "Nazi's" don't even know they are Nazi's.

From what I've seen, Harry is a nice guy. Like one of the people I'd play street hockey with or just hang out casually. Not Royalty. He's grown up as a completely average person locked in a cell, and Harry wants out. So who's with me. Should the monarchy be dissolved or not? (I'd like to here from you too Beryl)

Xerxes,

In a way I think you're right that the Monarchy should be dissolved, since they don't have any power anyhow and I have to think life would be better for them if they weren't royal. Therefore that viewpoint in itself I don't have an issue with, but together with what else you said I didn't like the way it sounded.

I know that plenty of people have good reason to be offended by Harry's actions, but I feel sure that it wasn't his intention to offend, nor is it fair that his actions even have the chance to offend so many people. I could dress up as a Nazi for a costume party and chances are the only people who could be offended by it would be the other people at the party. I also think that people should realize Prince Harry is not the first person to use the Nazi's as humor or as some form of entertainment; I'm not saying it's funny, but it is something that's been done before and something that to the best of my knowledge people don't usually take such issue with.

Kissing someone or talking to someone of the opposite gender isn't embarrassing, but it is the sort of thing that people tend to hear about when Harry or William does it. I'm sure it's not the most troublesome thing for them, but I should think that it would get rather obnoxious.

I am upset, but not specifically with you. Although I do still find the word "fag" offensive... not because you used it about Harry, but because it's a word that shouldn't be used.

That's all the posting I can do for tonight because it's already past the time that I'm supposed to be offline, but I'll be checking back on the thread tomorrow (unless my internet connection isn't working; it's been a bit grouchy lately.)

What the hell? People dress up as gladiators and all kinds of people who would or most definatly have killed.

There's nothing wrong with dressing up as a Nazi - for one, the Nazis dressed very well!

for fucks sake, it was a costume party, if it was some normal kid no-one would care, why do the tabloids even follow him, he never did anything worth recognition, he was born into the royal family, great acheivement therei

its jsut like people who obsess over movie stars, they are just donig their job, their are people who do great things who are never even acknowledged, but if someone gets shown on TV they are important?? WTF??

for fucks sake, it was a costume party Absolutely. Not to mention the fact that this story serves to spread a stereotype; people who wore Nazi uniforms were evil. People with fascistic principles or ideals, sure. But the monarchy still need to go. As if it wasn't enough that they own billions in property,art, etc, they only recently started paying taxes, and they receive millions every year from the government to help with "housekeeping".

No one has good reason to be offended. They reserve the right to be embarrassed and ashamed if they are offended by this.
Everyone that is offended by this, or "rabble rabble rabble"ing about it, should be rounded up and put in special death camps.

Thinking back, the article I read this in seemed to be most offended by the fact that he was wearing a swastika armband, which is even less offensive than a German uniform, since the swastika was a religious symbol for hundreds of years before the Nazi movement. It's like calling the carrying of the Olympic flame offensive, because of its associations with Nazism.

Dr Lou,
No one has good reason to be offended. They reserve the right to be embarrassed and ashamed if they are offended by this.
Everyone that is offended by this, or "rabble rabble rabble"ing about it, should be rounded up and put in special death camps.

If no one has the right to criticize another person, then once again your commentary is misplaced.

That said, I'm all in favour of re-examing my attitude towards others.

Geodesic,
Thinking back, the article I read this in seemed to be most offended by the fact that he was wearing a swastika armband, which is even less offensive than a German uniform, since the swastika was a religious symbol for hundreds of years before the Nazi movement. It's like calling the carrying of the Olympic flame offensive, because of its associations with Nazism.

Did the followers of this religion wear red armbands and a military uniform? Lets not get into the semantics of wearing a swastika. Its the whole package.

Absolutely. Not to mention the fact that this story serves to spread a stereotype; people who wore Nazi uniforms were evil. People with fascistic principles or ideals, sure. But the monarchy still need to go. As if it wasn't enough that they own billions in property,art, etc, they only recently started paying taxes, and they receive millions every year from the government to help with "housekeeping".

Evil? No, no. I think the stereotype we're looking for is dumbshit. Put a Nazi uniform on and presto!! Its more effective than the dunce cap for conveying ones intelligence.

Vslayer,
for fucks sake, it was a costume party, if it was some normal kid no-one would care, why do the tabloids even follow him, he never did anything worth recognition, he was born into the royal family, great acheivement therei

its jsut like people who obsess over movie stars, they are just donig their job, their are people who do great things who are never even acknowledged, but if someone gets shown on TV they are important?? WTF??
Why do the tabloids follow him you ask? Have you been paying attention dude? He's the second bloody heir to the throne.

If he were a common peasant then of course no one would care -- we're not expecting the average person to function as a king one day.

(If I were concerned with fame, I'd rather be posting threads on Pitt & Aniston, Michael Jackson, Eminem. This isn't about fame, so stop trying to focus on that.)

Blue_Uk
What the hell? People dress up as gladiators and all kinds of people who would or most definatly have killed.

There's nothing wrong with dressing up as a Nazi - for one, the Nazis dressed very well!
You say there's nothing wrong with it. Fair enough, but I have a question for you:
What would you consider 'wrong' by your personal definition? Crossing the line?

By mine--again- he was in the wrong.

Beryl,
I know that plenty of people have good reason to be offended by Harry's actions, but I feel sure that it wasn't his intention to offend, nor is it fair that his actions even have the chance to offend so many people. I could dress up as a Nazi for a costume party and chances are the only people who could be offended by it would be the other people at the party.
Like I said, their intentions don't mean squat to me. I can walk through campus with a loaded uzi, but do you think security cares when I tell them it was my intention to take it to the science lab for analysis? It means only that I can be forgiven more easily than if, say, I had plans to massacre the student body.

Also, the fact that this was supposedly a private party is to me the same as saying that Ted Kaczyinsky was a private serial killer(differences aside). There's no such thing as privacy outside the safety of your home, and its foolish for Harry to expect that. Anything that makes it to national news -that I find interesting- deserves to be scrutinized in my eyes. Its worth the flak I get for being accused of jumping on the gossip train.

I also think that people should realize Prince Harry is not the first person to use the Nazi's as humor or as some form of entertainment; I'm not saying it's funny, but it is something that's been done before and something that to the best of my knowledge people don't usually take such issue with.
Ehh..have you ever been in contact with some sort of skinhead, or somebody who was doing it as a joke? If Harry were Palestinian, would it be fair of me to assume that he wasn't joking if he was aware that myself or another person might be offended?

I don't think it matters. If a person is willing to take that risk then they should be prepared to take all of the heat that comes with it and not expect any sympathy. Thats one of the reasons I find it so laughable when people jump to his defense. I mean-- If I'm overeacting, why should so many people take the time to step in and repeat the same thing- that 'we shouldn't criticize poor Harry, he was just having fun. Its only a costume'?

Basically, tell me why I'm wrong, not why its wrong for me to criticize-- there's absolutely nothing wrong if the criticism is constructive both ways, which I'm trying to facilitate

Kissing someone or talking to someone of the opposite gender isn't embarrassing, but it is the sort of thing that people tend to hear about when Harry or William does it. I'm sure it's not the most troublesome thing for them, but I should think that it would get rather obnoxious.
Yup, no fault of their own. They have hardly any privacy, not that I think their particularly deserving of any. Harry needs to sort that whole privacy thing out for himself. In the meantime, he can have his privacy by simply avoiding the papers, tv and gossip. Same way regular people deal with rumors. (It feels almost as if you're getting away with some dirty thing)

I would've been much more satisfied if Harry stated his intentions and refused to apologize instead of offering his complete conciliation. Real kings don't do that.

I am upset, but not specifically with you. Although I do still find the word "fag" offensive... not because you used it about Harry, but because it's a word that shouldn't be used.
;) But good people use the word 'fag' all the time. What if my intentions were good? What if I just wanted a ciggarette...?
j/k
ok, I take the word fag back. Swearing is something I hardly ever do. In this case, it was out of context.

"Why do the tabloids follow him you ask? Have you been paying attention dude? He's the second bloody heir to the throne.

If he were a common peasant then of course no one would care -- we're not expecting the average person to function as a king one day."

the king has no power tho, the government can run completely separate to the crown

"Why do the tabloids follow him you ask? Have you been paying attention dude? He's the second bloody heir to the throne.

If he were a common peasant then of course no one would care -- we're not expecting the average person to function as a king one day."

the king has no power tho, the government can run completely separate to the crown

The tabloids were just having a no news day, its the paparazzi over here that follow people about, just hoping for the cash cow photograph like this one. It does'nt matter that he's the second in line, we get lots of silly stories about the royals fucking it up all the time. Its just that this one got a bit of international coverage. Dissolve the monachy, don't think it will ever happen, they bring in too much money in tourism etc. I'm not a huge fan of them, but i would'nt want to see them go. The inbreeding experiment is to much fun :D Mind you harry has buggered that one up, 'cos there aint no way prince charles is the father :eek:

Beryl,

Ehh..have you ever been in contact with some sort of skinhead, or somebody who was doing it as a joke? If Harry were Palestinian, would it be fair of me to assume that he wasn't joking if he was aware that myself or another person might be offended?

Oh, so now Palestinians are Nazis? Interesting theory, but it doesn't carry much weight.

The sort of humor I was specifically speaking of was funny (or at least, attemptedly funny) movies with Nazis in them, et cetera.


I don't think it matters. If a person is willing to take that risk then they should be prepared to take all of the heat that comes with it and not expect any sympathy. Thats one of the reasons I find it so laughable when people jump to his defense. I mean-- If I'm overeacting, why should so many people take the time to step in and repeat the same thing- that 'we shouldn't criticize poor Harry, he was just having fun. Its only a costume'?

Uh... maybe because we don't like it when people overreact in a harmful way? I mean, if someone made you mad and you tried to kill them, would it be unreasonable for us to try to stop you? This is of course a milder than that, but it makes as much sense. Besides, I'm not sure Harry specifically does expect any sympathy. Does that mean I can't be sympathetic?

Basically, tell me why I'm wrong, not why its wrong for me to criticize-- there's absolutely nothing wrong if the criticism is constructive both ways, which I'm trying to facilitate

Why you're wrong about what?


Yup, no fault of their own. They have hardly any privacy, not that I think their particularly deserving of any. Harry needs to sort that whole privacy thing out for himself. In the meantime, he can have his privacy by simply avoiding the papers, tv and gossip. Same way regular people deal with rumors. (It feels almost as if you're getting away with some dirty thing)

I'm not getting away with anything, but plenty of people do. Not because they take any great care to maintain their privacy, either; it just comes pretty automatically to the most of us.


I would've been much more satisfied if Harry stated his intentions and refused to apologize instead of offering his complete conciliation. Real kings don't do that.

Wow, so would I have been. However, perhaps his course of action was really better... a simple "I'm sorry I offended people" instead of making known to everyone his reasons behind it. At least his thoughts are still private.

And Harry is not a King. There is a very good chance he never will be.


;) But good people use the word 'fag' all the time. What if my intentions were good? What if I just wanted a ciggarette...?
j/k
ok, I take the word fag back. Swearing is something I hardly ever do. In this case, it was out of context.

Thank you. (Although if you had good intentions, you're welcome to share them with us.)

This is royalty folks
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4170623.stm

I can't believe this insensitive fag, with the 60th anniversary for the liberation of auschwitz coming up? Why even pretend?? Its not funny or ironic.

After the queen dies, the British monarchy should be dissolved.

its pretty funny that after you use the word insensivite, you use a term relating to ones sexuality that is suppsed to be negative. being gay is a bad thing? whos the insensitive "fag" now?

also a huge thing you dont understand is the actual circumstances that lead up to him wearing a nazi uniform, i myself have some ww2 novelty items, and i find some good points in several things the nazis did differently than the rest of the world. does me owning a nazi uniform, make me an anti-semite?(well the answer is no, but im very anti religious so... i guess i am ona theological level, just not a racial level)

and who are you to be the judge of what is ultimately humor or not? do you even understand what humor is?


"sry just read first post and got pissed, didnt reallize ppl got onto before me., my bad"

Source: Scotsman.com (http://news.scotsman.com/)
Link: http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=4006930
Title: "MP to Renounce Queen's Oath after Harry's Nazi Gaffe"
Date: January 16, 2005

“My father suffered enormously at the hands of the Nazis and the stories he told me were horrific,” he said. “So to see that image was very upsetting.”

Palaszczuk said he would seek to withdraw his allegiance to the Queen – part of the oath of office for Australian MPs – at the start of parliamentary proceedings tomorrow.

Palaszczuk also said Harry’s subsequent apology did not go far enough.

“I don’t think that counts as a real apology,” he said.

Scotsman.com (http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=4006930)

Seems Harry's touched a nerve.

And BTW, I take issue with anyone who dresses as a Nazi. I don't care what their intentions were or who they are.

I take it you're against any video game that allows one to play themself as a Nazi too? This is ridiculous. It's a costume party! What makes Nazi's so much worse than any other nation? I guess I'd hate to see an Iraqi dressed up as an American soldier, a Chinese person dressed up as a Japanese soldier of the Rising Sun, or an American dressed up as a Muslim.

The Japanese in WWII were more vile and malicious than Nazi's! At least Nazi's only killed a select groups whereas the Japanese did the same, if not worse, to anyone who flat out wasn't Japanese. And we all know how many people were victim to American bombs over time as well.

Now because Iraqi's, the Chinese, or even Americans may look at certain other countries in historical distaste, does that mean NOBODY whatsoever from any country can ever dress up as an a Muslim, an American or Japanese soldier? One can find fault being dressed up as anything. If it weren’t for Jews being so loud and whiney, Harry being dressed in his Nazi costume wouldn’t have been so bad. And no, all because one says something bad, no, actually true, about a Jew, it doesn’t mean I’m anti-semetic because I know that insult is gonna be coming my way, lol.

Evil? No, no. I think the stereotype we're looking for is dumbshit. Put a Nazi uniform on and presto!! Its more effective than the dunce cap for conveying ones intelligence.

How's putting on a Nazi uniform show one's intellegence as a "dumbshit"? There's nothing that should be shameful about being one. Everyone has various radical ideals no different than you or me and I'm sure many will claim ours are illogical or not realistic. The only shame a Nazi should have is in them having failed in their conquest just as America is going to feel like “dumbshits” when failing the crusade of trying to spread democracy throughout the world. We feel democracy is the best choice but not everyone. We're no different than Nazis. We’re forcefully spreading our own idealism on others. The Nazis put people in deathcamps and we bomb em. I don't care what method is used as the outcome is the same. In the end, both sides are either good or both sides are either bad. One side can’t be exempt from ridicule. The only reason why what we Americans are doing isn’t looked as being bad (well, it actually is, heh) is because we’re the #1 superpower in the world. Once we fail and are no longer a superpower, voices will be much louder. Imagine if another country were trying to do what we’re doing? They’d be looked at as monsters too.

- N

Tiassa,

I too, have withdrawn my support. And not just because of the Nazi thing. The monarchy is completely useless.

ZenEthics,
and who are you to be the judge of what is ultimately humor or not? do you even understand what humor is?
I judge everything. I'm me, me be, godamm, I am. Anybody who disagrees is welcome to challenge me to a wrestling match.

Another thing,- I'm not a loud person but my friends know me for my humor and good nature. Its rare for me to get this upset at something.

its pretty funny that after you use the word insensivite, you use a term relating to ones sexuality that is suppsed to be negative. being gay is a bad thing? whos the insensitive "fag" now?

I retracted it, not because I think its a bad word, but because its out of place. It has absolutely nothing to do with anyones sexuality, but 'fag' in its abstract form ie, deviant, unorthodox.

Beryl
Oh, so now Palestinians are Nazis? Interesting theory, but it doesn't carry much weight.

I left out some pertinant background info: I'm Jewish. If he knew this, given the bloodshed between our people, wouldn't it be in extremely bad taste? I know I wouldn't dress in military uniform around my arab friends.

Uh... maybe because we don't like it when people overreact in a harmful way? I mean, if someone made you mad and you tried to kill them, would it be unreasonable for us to try to stop you? This is of course a milder than that, but it makes as much sense. Besides, I'm not sure Harry specifically does expect any sympathy. Does that mean I can't be sympathetic?

To me, its a lot more harmful to undereact and keep it all pent up inside. I want to overreact so that people understand my disgust.

As for trying to kill Harry-- its not something I would even consider. You could try and stop, but it wouldn't do much good.

Also, you may be right- I don't think Harry expects sympathy from us, but I'm just saying that we should be complete free to voice our disgust. I try to feel sympathy for everyone, especially myself ;). In this case, there's nothing wrong with feeling sympathy for Harry's situation just as there's nothing wrong with feeling disgust, as long as we're both honest, both emotions are good things.

Why you're wrong about what?

Actually I was just using that as an opportunity to comment on what Dr Lou said about me not having a right to be offended. (point being that instead of saying that, he should have stated why)

I'm not getting away with anything, but plenty of people do. Not because they take any great care to maintain their privacy, either; it just comes pretty automatically to the most of us.

Agreed. Not saying that you are getting away with anything. Its all in our heads how we feel about privacy.

perhaps his course of action was really better... a simple "I'm sorry I offended people" instead of making known to everyone his reasons behind it. At least his thoughts are still private.
Personally, I don't think it did him any good. Its just giving critics more ammo 'cause it could easily be taken as a concilliatory sorry (like the australian mp did). I don't think he feels he did anything wrong ethically or morally, so I take it as a sign of insincerity which is worse.

Thank you. (Although if you had good intentions, you're welcome to share them with us.)
No good intentions, just bugging you about the whole benefit of the doubt thing.

Really, if I offended you, sorry :)

slotty,
Dissolve the monachy, don't think it will ever happen, they bring in too much money in tourism etc. I'm not a huge fan of them, but i would'nt want to see them go. The inbreeding experiment is to much fun Mind you harry has buggered that one up, 'cos there aint no way prince charles is the father
You're probably right. As long as people think its prestigious to get knighted, the monarchy will stick around. Just curious how long that will last.

vslayer,
the king has no power tho, the government can run completely separate to the crown

I realize that, but they have way too much influence and are too full of it to put it to good use. Therefore the monarchy should be discarded.

edit:
Neildo,
just saw your post, I'll respond tomorrow.

Oh, so now Palestinians are Nazis? Interesting theory, but it doesn't carry much weight. - someone

I left out some pertinant background info: I'm Jewish. If he knew this, given the bloodshed between our people, wouldn't it be in extremely bad taste? I know I wouldn't dress in military uniform around my arab friends. - Xerses

Exactly, it would be in bad taste to wear an Israeli uniform "around" your Arab friends. However, does that stop you from being able to wear that uniform period? Nope. You say a person is automatically a "dumbshit" by wearing a Nazi uniform all because *you* may have been afflicted by those people, but what about people who weren't afflicted by them? For now on, nobody shall be allowed to wear an Israeli uniform period because of the tension between them and Arabs. And I'm not talking when you're around an Arab, but anywhere period even if you're in a place that don't mind Israelies.

Harry was having fun at his own party. The only people allowed to be offended by his costume are the ones at that ball. For anything else, they just need to shut the hell up and quit sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong.

Why is it though that Jews are able to scream bloody murder and always try to get their way when something offends them? They stick their noses into everything! I don't hear any other country or ethnic group complaining about someone wearing an outfit somewhere else on Earth of some country or group that did harm to them. Oh wait, there was the kid who wore a Hezbolah armband in some college and then, oh wait, it was Jewish people again that complained about that as well. Funny how it's always them complaining, telling others what to, and what not to, do. Quit being babies about everything, Yah-f'ing-weh.

Hey, and aren’t you offending yourself by having the posting handle of a Persian king? No wearing an Arab or Persian outfit near yourself or being called the name of one! See how ridiculous this can be? Just.. quit. .worrying.. so.. much..

- N

I judge everything. I'm me, me be, godamm, I am. Anybody who disagrees is welcome to challenge me to a wrestling match.

i challenge you to a wresltling match.(being that i wreslted for 6 years of grade school and 4 of college) its actually very strange that you would make the one physical act that i excell at the challenge. thats a pretty big coincidence.

Why is it though that Jews are able to scream bloody murder and always try to get their way when something offends them? They stick their noses into everything! I don't hear any other country or ethnic group complaining about someone wearing an outfit somewhere else on Earth of some country or group that did harm to them.

The Nazis happened to 'dislike' other ethnic groups besides jews too. And even the ethnic groups they didn't particularly dislike they treated rather 'unpolitely'.

He's right though, the japanese were at least as bad.
The point isn't that nazis were nice guys who were just misunderstood or anything like that, they were bad guys, they just weren't as outstandingly horrible as is made out.
They didn't do enough to warrant being singled out as the single most despicable force in the histoy of the world.
This crap with harry is such a big deal, not because of how bad the nazis actually were, but rather how adept jews are at complaining and blowing things out of proportion. They've built nazis into the epitome of evil rivalled by nothing known to man.
Like a thomsens gazelle saying to the zebra "cheetahs are the most horriffic brutal predator on the plains" and the zebra saying "I don't know, lions are pretty bad" to which the gazelle replies "Oh no, cheetahs are much worse" and the zebra says "yeah whatever, I don't care anymore" and the gazelle nods "yeah, you wouldn't, because lions are no where near as terrible as cheetahs are".
Jews were just determined to kick up the biggest stink of all victimised groups. Thats why "nazi" is such a popular term for describing evil.

I don't care if some loser is personally offended by a nazi outfit, thats like saying "Omg, my dad was hit by a blue train you insensitive jerk" when you see someone in a thomas the tank engine t-shirt. Get over it, douche.

Of all the reasons to renounce allegiance to the Crown, this just seems an odd catalyst.

Dr. Lou:

On the one hand, I agree that the Nazis, while bad guys, have become overstated poster children for evil. This might be explained at least in part by their stunning efficiency, the fact that their evil was carried out in plain sight, and also by the guilt of the industrialized world for not having intervened sooner.

To the other, the train didn't try to hit someone's dad. I don't think it's a fair comparison, as the device of will is different.

The kid went to a costume party. I don't think he walks around everywhere in a Nazi uniform. If he'd gone dressed as the devil he'd have probably been labelled as a Satanist or Devil worshipper. If he hadn't dressed up, he'd have been labelled as a party pooper for not playing along. It was a friggin costume party. Lou is right. Get over it.

Neidlo,

Couldn't you have been more efficient in saying all that? For example:
I guess I'd hate to see an Iraqi dressed up as an American soldier, a Chinese person dressed up as a Japanese soldier of the Rising Sun, or an American dressed up as a Muslim.
One instance would have been sufficient, more readable, and would've driven your point home. The need to use three indicates to me that your not confident enough in your argument.

I take it you're against any video game that allows one to play themself as a Nazi too?
Nope. Unless its something like concentration camp tycoon.

The Japanese in WWII were more vile and malicious than Nazi's!

Actually, I prefer the Japanese because they didn't pick favourites. If you weren't explicitly on their side, you were their enemy. None of this wishy washy dehumanizing Nazi crap where you had Jewish kapo's trading their dignity for a little extra life. The Japanese soldiers were vicious bastards, but at least they had an honour system.
Indiscrimate killing > genocide

Now because Iraqi's, the Chinese, or even Americans may look at certain other countries in historical distaste, does that mean NOBODY whatsoever from any country can ever dress up as an a Muslim, an American or Japanese soldier? [quote]
Dressing up as a solider while NOT on duty seems like a pretty stupid thing to me. But to answer your question: no. As long as they realize they may be stepping on somebodies toes and are willing to accept the consequences.

[quote]If it weren’t for Jews being so loud and whiney, Harry being dressed in his Nazi costume wouldn’t have been so bad.
Wrong order. Here's the correct form of that sentence:
If Harry dressing up as a Nazi weren't so bad, Jews would not be so loud and whiny.
cause-> effect, not the other way around. You can expect at this point in history for Jews to be offended. Harry needn't be a physicist.

And no, all because one says something bad, no, actually true, about a Jew, it doesn’t mean I’m anti-semetic because I know that insult is gonna be coming my way, lol.
Presumption-- another sign of skewed reasoning. Notice how I didn't call Harry an 'anti-semite' but rather, an insensitive person.

How's putting on a Nazi uniform show one's intellegence as a "dumbshit"? There's nothing that should be shameful about being one.
Because people who dress like Nazi's are either unaware or ignorant of the ideas tied to them. These ideas, like the stench on a funeral service suit, can only be washed away by hundreds of years of temporal distance. Otherwise, its voluntary shame for them to dress as such a low form of humanity. I define that as stupidity.

Everyone has various radical ideals no different than you or me and I'm sure many will claim ours are illogical or not realistic.
Mine are rational and ironic. I'm not 'radical' for the sake of humor like some.

The only shame a Nazi should have is in them having failed in their conquest just as America is going to feel like “dumbshits” when failing the crusade of trying to spread democracy throughout the world.
The majority of Germans were not in favour of the Nazi's. And you're absolutely right; innocent children of Jewish and Gypsie descent hanging from the gallows is an accomplishment to be proud of. Not looked down on in shame.

We feel democracy is the best choice but not everyone. We're no different than Nazis. We’re forcefully spreading our own idealism on others. The Nazis put people in deathcamps and we bomb em. I don't care what method is used as the outcome is the same. In the end, both sides are either good or both sides are either bad. One side can’t be exempt from ridicule. The only reason why what we Americans are doing isn’t looked as being bad (well, it actually is, heh) is because we’re the #1 superpower in the world. Once we fail and are no longer a superpower, voices will be much louder. Imagine if another country were trying to do what we’re doing? They’d be looked at as monsters too.

Isn't that beside the point? You're comparing apples to oranges. Even though the underlying logic is correct, Nazi's got away with much worse than evangelists.

Exactly, it would be in bad taste to wear an Israeli uniform "around" your Arab friends. However, does that stop you from being able to wear that uniform period?
It doesn't. And I wouldn't wear an Israeli uniform period (what would be the point?)

The thing you miss is that I'm not dumb enough to do something which I know is going to unnecessarilly aggrevate people when I'm aware of their sensitivity to the subject.

For now on, nobody shall be allowed to wear an Israeli uniform period because of the tension between them and Arabs. And I'm not talking when you're around an Arab, but anywhere period even if you're in a place that don't mind Israelies.
I don't see why anybody would want to? Costumes are supposed to be fun not provocative. Leave that for the catwalk.

Harry was having fun at his own party. The only people allowed to be offended by his costume are the ones at that ball. For anything else, they just need to shut the hell up and quit sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong.
When I see something that offends me, I don't slink away because I'm not involved directly. Its my businness if I want it to be and any attempts to 'shut me up' are futile.

Why is it though that Jews are able to scream bloody murder and always try to get their way when something offends them?
Perhaps it has something to do with events leading up to the holocaust? Does crystal nacht ring a bell?

Oh wait, there was the kid who wore a Hezbolah armband in some college and then, oh wait, it was Jewish people again that complained about that as well.
Why would anyone wear an armband unless they were deliberately trying to provoke?

Hey, and aren’t you offending yourself by having the posting handle of a Persian king?

http://www.arizonapersian.com/iranopinion/_disc8/0000000f.htm
"In relative terms, the Persian treatment of other religions, including the jews, is among the first enlightened and universal practice of religious tolerance in ancient times, a practice which was perhaps more universal and inclusive than the restricted religious tolerance of the Moslems limited to "the people of the book.""
Xerxes was awesome, and on the whole, so was persia.
The fact that he married a Jewish woman is proof that he wasn't an anti-semite.

ZenEthics,
i challenge you to a wresltling match.(being that i wreslted for 6 years of grade school and 4 of college) its actually very strange that you would make the one physical act that i excell at the challenge. thats a pretty big coincidence.
Its also the phyical act which I excel at. Well, I'll be waiting for you. We can do it in the snow behind my house.

Dr Lou,
This crap with harry is such a big deal, not because of how bad the nazis actually were, but rather how adept jews are at complaining and blowing things out of proportion. They've built nazis into the epitome of evil rivalled by nothing known to man.
You know, you're right. Burning people alive, and keeping a quota of others around for hard labour, experiments that we don't even perform on animals, starvation and exposure to the elements really isn't that bad.

I don't care if some loser is personally offended by a nazi outfit, thats like saying "Omg, my dad was hit by a blue train you insensitive jerk" when you see someone in a thomas the tank engine t-shirt. Get over it, douche.
You do care. That or, you've misallocated your precious time. Not something intelligent people are known for.

Bells,
There's really nothing to get over. Had I posted a wanderer-long essay..maybe. Instead, it was only a few sentences about my distaste for this sort of thing. I promise you I'm not loosing sleep.

I left out some pertinant background info: I'm Jewish. If he knew this, given the bloodshed between our people, wouldn't it be in extremely bad taste? I know I wouldn't dress in military uniform around my arab friends.

My best friend is Jewish, and she's one of the few people who I think I could wear a Nazi uniform in front of (for a costume party, of course) without having them think poorly of me for it. I wouldn't, because it would feel weird to me, but if I did I really don't think she'd have a problem with it. And as for the Israeli/Palestinian conflict... it isn't just about religion, and I for one would never make my decisions about something like that based on religion.

No good intentions, just bugging you about the whole benefit of the doubt thing.

Oh. Sorry, it didn't bug me...

Really, if I offended you, sorry :)

Hey, I thought you were opposed to apologies.

I'm opposed to insincerity, not apologies. If Harry really was sorry then of course he's forgiven. Its just looks like one of those things were he was told to apologize. Not that there's much else he can do short of getting down on his knees.. I don't expect him to go out of his way to visit auschwitz either. Thats his business.

I know what you mean about the best friends thing. Mine sometimes poke fun at me (that I love prunes and gefilte fish?) but its cool because we understand eachother, and I poke fun of them too. Seeing that come from a person in a position of political power kind of struck a chord you know. If you aren't close friends, then there's room for confusion. Thats what I'm trying to avoid.

Anyways..I've been spending too much time on sciforums. Of to hockey...

Only attractive blondes should be allowed to wear Nazi uniforms. Anything else is an insult to the purity of the Aryan race.

"If Harry really was sorry then of course he's forgiven"

Why should he be sorry? The only apology necessary is:
"I'm sorry you faggots have nothing better to think of."

"Because people who dress like Nazi's are either unaware or ignorant of the ideas tied to them"

Are you high on crack, jew-boy?

I doubt this is true in Harry's case. It's also highly unlikely that he's a neo-Nazi.
Although that would be stunningly hilarious.

Why should he be sorry? The only apology necessary is:
"I'm sorry you faggots have nothing better to think of."

Like I said, that would've been way better than a conventional apology. You people have to admit, gossiping about prince harry and renouncing my allegiance to the Crown is a creative way to kill a weekend. :m:

Couldn't you have been more efficient in saying all that? For example: One instance would have been sufficient, more readable, and would've driven your point home. The need to use three indicates to me that your not confident enough in your argument.

Oh, I'm quite confident in my argument. And yup, I could have put it short and simple, but the reason why I tend to repeat things in different ways is to drill my point into your brain. If you would have read the short and simple version, it would have made no impact and you would have just schluffed it off. But the more ways I put it, the more it gets stuck in your head. It's the only way to convert sensitive or weak-minded people without using any physical means.

I take it you’re against any video game that allows one to play themselves as a Nazi too? – N

Nope. Unless its something like concentration camp tycoon.

Why not? What’s the difference? Because it’s just a “game”? Good. Well now you at least somewhat get it. Now don’t be so upset with Price Harry because it was just a “costume party”. Otherwise you’re just bitching for the sake of bitching.

The Japanese in WWII were more vile and malicious than Nazi’s! - N

Actually, I prefer the Japanese because they didn't pick favourites. If you weren't explicitly on their side, you were their enemy. None of this wishy washy dehumanizing Nazi crap where you had Jewish kapo's trading their dignity for a little extra life. The Japanese soldiers were vicious bastards, but at least they had an honour system.
Indiscrimate killing > genocide

Symantics. And you’re also full of it too. I can almost guarantee that if the Japanese were the ones harming Jewish people, you would be screaming as much bloody murder against them rather than the Nazis’.

And what do you mean the Japanese weren’t indiscriminate? They flat out killed anyone who wasn’t Japanese. Now if they did kill lots of Japanese with no remorse, than you’d have a point. Killing all races is worse than picking on one (which Jews weren’t the only ones to be picked on) because rather than one race going bye bye, we’ll have all being removed off the face of the Earth. An honor system.. heh, that’s pretty amusing. I’ll try and use that excuse sometime if I ever do something bad.

Dressing up as a solider while NOT on duty seems like a pretty stupid thing to me.

I guess you haven’t been to many costume parties then.

But to answer your question: no. As long as they realize they may be stepping on somebodies toes and are willing to accept the consequences.

Well we’re at least in agreement here. But again, the problem is how loud the Jews cry when something offends them. The only ones worse than Jews when it comes to complaining is the ACLU. Again, where is all the news and cries of outrage of other groups offended by someone being dressed up in an offending outfit to them? I don’t see ANY news footage or articles about others, but if something that offends only the Jews, all of a sudden BLAM, it makes headline news and is talked about for the next couple days. Those other people don’t even get a small blurb. You guys are acting like little babies with no self-control.

And no, all because one says something bad, no, actually true, about a Jew, it doesn’t mean I’m anti-semetic because I know that insult is gonna be coming my way, lol. – N

Presumption-- another sign of skewed reasoning. Notice how I didn't call Harry an 'anti-semite' but rather, an insensitive person.

True, and that’s my fault. But for me even having to say something like that so I wouldn’t be called it shows that there’s a problem. Usually when I read or hear something said wrongly, even if it may be true, about Jews, 75% of the time the only rebuttal I hear is that they’re an anti-semite. I’m always going to wonder if you would have called me that if I wouldn’t have made that “save my ass from being called it” comment.

Because people who dress like Nazi's are either unaware or ignorant of the ideas tied to them. These ideas, like the stench on a funeral service suit, can only be washed away by hundreds of years of temporal distance. Otherwise, its voluntary shame for them to dress as such a low form of humanity. I define that as stupidity.

As I said, many groups have done bad things yet nobody fusses about them as much as Jews do about Nazis’. Just because Nazis’ may have done bad things such as what they did to Jewish people, does it mean everything they stood for is completely evil and should be ignored? They had many good concepts so I see no reason for people to ignore them completely. The only reason why many do is because they failed in what they set out to do. If they would have kept control of most of Europe and existed as a country today, they would be no different than Americans of today. America has done many horrendous things, killed lots of innocent people, and while people have good reason to be angry at us, I don’t hear them screaming bloody murder about such small trivial things as someone being dressed up as an American soldier or waving the U.S. flag.

Now don’t get me wrong, you have every right to hate Nazism, just don’t cry like babies about every single little thing, even if hearing or seeing the word. Be the bigger person and show some restraint and self-control. This campaign that Jews launch at them -- heck, anyone who dislikes, or says anything bad about Jews, period -- is just flat out ridiculous though.

Everyone has various radical ideals no different than you or me and I'm sure many will claim ours are illogical or not realistic. – N

Mine are rational and ironic. I'm not 'radical' for the sake of humor like some.

Yours are only rational and ironic according to yourself. It’s mere opinion. I can guarantee there will be groups of people that are offended by your views, as harmless as they may seem. What is considered rational, ironic, and radical is all subjective. It all depends on who you’re asking.

The majority of Germans were not in favour of the Nazi's. And you're absolutely right; innocent children of Jewish and Gypsie descent hanging from the gallows is an accomplishment to be proud of. Not looked down on in shame.

Where did I say that? What I said is that many groups have done disgusting things, some even worse than Nazis’, yet they’re not seen to be as bad as them which is stupid. The only reason why Nazis’ are seen as bad as they are is because of the Jewish campaign trying to make everyone feel pity for them. Your crying has already gotten you your own country so you can stop now, but I guess you’ll never stop till you have everything. Everything which the Nazis’ tried to get as well but just failed at. If you want to talk about horrific acts, don’t even let me bring up things that Israeli’s have done! This is why it makes people look so bad when they complain so much because the skeletons in their closet will make them look like fools as well.


We feel democracy is the best choice but not everyone. We're no different than Nazis. We’re forcefully spreading our own idealism on others. The Nazis put people in deathcamps and we bomb em. I don't care what method is used as the outcome is the same. In the end, both sides are either good or both sides are either bad. One side can’t be exempt from ridicule. The only reason why what we Americans are doing isn’t looked as being bad (well, it actually is, heh) is because we’re the #1 superpower in the world. Once we fail and are no longer a superpower, voices will be much louder. Imagine if another country were trying to do what we’re doing? They’d be looked at as monsters too. – N

Isn't that beside the point? You're comparing apples to oranges. Even though the underlying logic is correct, Nazi's got away with much worse than evangelists.

Well first off, Nazis’ didn’t get away with anything (other than the scientists and a few bad people that snuck away). It’s everyone else that has, such as my own country, the United States. I’m not comparing apples to oranges when one group that has commited bad acts is made to be seen as the Army of Satan, yet another group that is just as bad DOES get away with it and is seen as being saviours. And while there are people that dislike or may even loath the U.S., why is it that some are able to get away with looking at the U.S. in a good light without being called something bad, yet when someone looks at Nazism even in a slight light, is then a total ignoramus and is called every insult in every dictionary of the world? Yes, Nazis’ did bad things to people, but you guys have gone overboard with it.

For now on, nobody shall be allowed to wear an Israeli uniform period because of the tension between them and Arabs. And I'm not talking when you're around an Arab, but anywhere period even if you're in a place that don't mind Israelies. – N

I don't see why anybody would want to? Costumes are supposed to be fun not provocative. Leave that for the catwalk.

While you may not see why anyone would want to, many do. Just don’t stick your nose in everything and start critizing them for doing something that is different from your belief.

Harry was having fun at his own party. The only people allowed to be offended by his costume are the ones at that ball. For anything else, they just need to shut the hell up and quit sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong. – N

When I see something that offends me, I don't slink away because I'm not involved directly. Its my businness if I want it to be and any attempts to 'shut me up' are futile.

Well you have some self-control issues then if you’re going to voice your differing opinion on everything. But even if I have no problem with your doing so, at least try not to blow it out of proportion which sadly is what is being done with Prince Harry. This is the problem that people have when Jews cry about something. It’s not that they don’t have the right to, but because of the huge mess they turn it into! That is probably the ONLY problem (at least regarding myself) some have with them, but unfortunately it’s a biggy.

"In relative terms, the Persian treatment of other religions, including the jews, is among the first enlightened and universal practice of religious tolerance in ancient times, a practice which was perhaps more universal and inclusive than the restricted religious tolerance of the Moslems limited to "the people of the book.""
Xerxes was awesome, and on the whole, so was persia.
The fact that he married a Jewish woman is proof that he wasn't an anti-semite.

Thanks for the further info. But hey, quit with the mention of the whole anti-semite thing.

Oh wait, there was the kid who wore a Hezbolah armband in some college and then, oh wait, it was Jewish people again that complained about that as well. – N

Why would anyone wear an armband unless they were deliberately trying to provoke?

Well I forget the exact details, but at the time when I was keeping up with that story, I agreed with the person. I had something to do with some class or subject regarding freedom of belief and also oppression. I dunno, like I said, I forget the details. But hey, whatever the reason for it, even if it were to provoke, it still made headlines and was on the news for a couple days. Funny how it’s only things that offend Jews that make such headlines. You guys scream the loudest and it’s quite annoying. Your campaign of the oppression of the Jews is never-ending and it only adds to the number of people that may dislike you guys rather than trying to gain sympathizers. Like I said, you have every right to and I don’t blame you guys, just don’t get so carried away with it!

You know, you're right. Burning people alive, and keeping a quota of others around for hard labour, experiments that we don't even perform on animals, starvation and exposure to the elements really isn't that bad.

Things which the Japanese did as well, if not even more worse things, yet almost everyone loves Japanese people and their culture. Other than reading about, or watching a documentary on, it, I don’t think I’ve ever heard of anyone complaining about the Japanese. The Jewish propoganda is just like Bush propoganda. Point out a flaw and complain about something so that everyone forgets about the worse problem and they get away scot free.

- N

P.S. – Holy crap that was long, heh.

no-one i know badmouthes japan or germany, and im sure that after the US revolution we will speak no bad ofy them either. people get over things, its only when this vile essence known as the media steps in and makes claims that anyone cares, people need to fiind some real leaders if they gave a shit about this, media are nto world leaders, kofi annan is

I'm opposed to insincerity, not apologies.

Ah. Well, your apology seems a little insincere to me.

Mod Hat - Grand Reopening

Let me make something clear: I allowed the original "fag" issue to stand merely because other people reasonably beat me to it.

The latest revival did not please me.

Now, I'm not about to start telling men to stop acting like women, or women to stop acting like bitches. But if that doesn't make the point clearly enough, this and any other discussion using such terms as the basis for insult will be closed faster than a furniture store.

This topic is reopened per a reasonable poster request. Aside from that, I must insist that people give more consideration to the bases of their insults. I, for one, am sick and tired of people exploiting my gay neighbors in order to insult a heterosexual, although I'm quite sure the dogs couldn't care less about who is or isn't a bitch. If you wish to take a chance and insult someone directly, I will deal with those issues as they come: sometimes people are proud to be fags or bitches or whatever. But disparaging someone who is not (A) made of wood, (B) on fire and between your lips, or (C) homosexual as a faggot splatters your wrath on too many people.

Nor should I have to explain this in the first place.

• • •

Now then, everybody go about your business.

What would you consider 'wrong' by your personal definition?

Good question!

'Wrong' is what the consensus says makes people feel bad. There is nothing set in stone to stop us from skinning live babies, but I imagine almost everyone would feel disgusted/horrified at the thought. That is all wrong is - just a feeling and nothing more. There is no right or wrong in my book. Just what gives me satisfaction and disatisfaction.

So if the prospect of a species-ending nuclear war pleases people, it's the right thing to do?

How about as a pre-emptive measure?

Extreme, I admit, but since we're already skinning babies ....

<a href="http://www.freewebs.com/beryleddi2/leavethemalone.htm" target=newwindow>Visit</a> my newly created page about the issue.

<Small>*Psst* . . . Beryl . . . That's a link to the SciForums index page.</Small>

<Small>*Psst* . . . Beryl . . . That's a link to the SciForums index page.</Small>

Whoa, how'd that happen? :D Thanks for catching that. *goes and fixes it*

Whoa, how'd that happen? :D Thanks for catching that. *goes and fixes it*

No problem. :)

*psst* ...athelwulf... youre a gay nigger.

Oh . . . owch<Sub>i</Sub> I'm, like, so in a world of hurt now<Sub>i</Sub> I'm gonna cry now<Sub>i</Sub>

I don't have a link or anything as I saw it on the news, but now the EU is wanting to ban any and all "Nazi symbols" because of the Prince Harry incident, heh. Carried away..

- N

Been in and out all day. Await my response sometime tomorrow.

Didn't we already have a discussion on this and find out that the Swastika is not an 'evil' symbol?

Ignorance breeds ignorance.

I would never wear a Nazi uniform simply on principle and I am a nobody.....I can't imagine how a "somebody" could do such an insensitve act........

He probably has a sense of humour or something. What was he thinking acquiring one of those?

Comedy is conflict. Humor is victimization. Anything else the audience usually rejects as too high-minded, abstract, or elitist.

Conflict is often comedic, and victimisation is often humourous.
Comedy and humour aren't limitted to those areas, but they certainly encompass them. And if you don't think so you're too closed minded to ever really experience all that comedy has to offer.
The prince of england dressing up as a nazi IS funny, BECAUSE of who he is.
It's not side splitting hilarity that will make you think for weeks, but it's as good a costume to wear as any other in the comedic sense if you are prince harry.
I'm pleased with his chosen attire, it exhibits his sense of humour quite fashionably.
If your knickers are in a twist about it, he was making fun of you and you are the idiot, congratulations. Harry wins.
He was being inappropriate on purpose, there's nothing "stupid" about it at all. People who get offended are stupidly predictable as evidenced by his joke on them.
I commend prince harry.

So if the prospect of a species-ending nuclear war pleases people, it's the right thing to do?

Yes. How do we know if something is wrong/right? Purely from how we feel about the issue. So if, in your hypothetical case, nuclear war pleased people it would be the right thing to do.

So much for Darwin, eh? Or would that mean Darwin was right, and nature selected humanity to leave the arena?

I would never wear a Nazi uniform simply on principle and I am a nobody.....I can't imagine how a "somebody" could do such an insensitve act........

What an absurd comment! Retract it please!

So you expect him to genuflect to your absurdly arbitrary and circular preferences? Just because he is a "somebody"?!

Does that line of logic even make sense to you? It is absurd! I almost passed out reading it. No wonder the poor chap did it anyway. The day when fools blather on what they want the social dress code should be! Idiocy! Utter idiocy!

:mad:

Conflict is often comedic, and victimisation is often humourous.
Comedy and humour aren't limitted to those areas, but they certainly encompass them. And if you don't think so you're too closed minded to ever really experience all that comedy has to offer.
The prince of england dressing up as a nazi IS funny, BECAUSE of who he is.
It's not side splitting hilarity that will make you think for weeks, but it's as good a costume to wear as any other in the comedic sense if you are prince harry.
I'm pleased with his chosen attire, it exhibits his sense of humour quite fashionably.
If your knickers are in a twist about it, he was making fun of you and you are the idiot, congratulations. Harry wins.
He was being inappropriate on purpose, there's nothing "stupid" about it at all. People who get offended are stupidly predictable as evidenced by his joke on them.
I commend prince harry.

Bravo!

southstar I suppose you thought the posting of the American flag in Iraq immediately after invasion as witnesses by global TV was a sensitive and tactful statement too.....

not to mention tormenting Iraqi prisoners and having the good sense to take trophy photographs as well.........

Whilst I don't agree with Xerxes wording I agree with the object of his thread starter.

Whether Harry likes it or not the media has him in their sights. He can not avoid their attention. It is true that his actions only show other peoples sensitivities, but shit man that is life.....and if an offended person aims a snipers rifle at his head for his foolishness and insensitivity I suppose we can all say
" oh well...Harry was just being a boy and now he has a bullet between the eyes"
In the real world there are some pretty strange ideas and Harry has just made himself a target for the very extremism that he wished to make fun of.....

Err.. Quantum Quack

Instead of making a strawman argument, why don't you just admit that your logic does not follow.

The reason for the outrage is simply that there are people that ARE very sensitive and whilst it isn't Harry's fault that they are so sensitive, he still has to live with the consequences of his actions whether those consequences [actions] are Rational or not.
Some old fogey living in the west end may decide to teach the young man a lesson about what it's like to loose a family to a Nazi bomb.

Okay, let me clarify something.

None of us are arguing that he doesn't have to live with the consequences of his actions. We all have to (unless we die, in which case we don't really have to LIVE with them...) what is being argued is what the "consequences" of his actions were and the fact that I could do the very same thing and not have those consequences. Arguing against defending someone because "they have to live with the consequences" is ridiculous... if that were a valid argument then it would never be right to defend someone, and although you can say that if you want I'm not going to believe it. The fact is, I don't think there was anything wrong with Harry's costume. I don't think it's right for people to treat him this way over it, nor do I think it's right the way the media always treats him and his brother. And I'm going to stick up for my beliefs... which, in this case, includes defending Harry.

The reason for the outrage is simply that there are people that ARE very sensitive

Is that why people sit in front of their televisions and watch Anna Nicole Smith (and call it entertainment)?

Note: Jokes aside, your point is quite irrelevant. In that case, should I shut my mouth in case I say something that might be construed as insensitive? Or should I cower because of what foolish double standards society has set?

and whilst it isn't Harry's fault that they are so sensitive, he still has to live with the consequences of his actions whether those consequences [actions] are Rational or not.

And yet when you sit in front of your computer screen and criticize him by evoking non-rational arguments, we are supposed to nod in agreement?

Some old fogey living in the west end may decide to teach the young man a lesson about what it's like to loose a family to a Nazi bomb.

And the young man might just teach the idiot fogey not to impress his foolish whims on other people especially when they are not even rational to begin with.

The point is:
If you are going to bash Harry because he did not act rationally, then you must call yourself a hideous hypocrite because your reasoning is even less rational. That is the simple consequence of your being overbearing.

ha...you are calling me overbearing....ha what a joke.....

To quoque?

speak english boy!!!!......[QQ attempt at being over bearin]

Beryl,
Ah. Well, your apology seems a little insincere to me.

It was sincere. Feel free to interpret any way you like.

The fact is, I don't think there was anything wrong with Harry's costume. I don't think it's right for people to treat him this way over it, nor do I think it's right the way the media always treats him and his brother. And I'm going to stick up for my beliefs... which, in this case, includes defending Harry.
Theres nothing wrong with sticking up for your beliefs if that involves defending Harry. Just don't try to take away my right to stick up for my beliefs in the process. Argument is good.

Blue_UK,
Good question!

'Wrong' is what the consensus says makes people feel bad. There is nothing set in stone to stop us from skinning live babies, but I imagine almost everyone would feel disgusted/horrified at the thought. That is all wrong is - just a feeling and nothing more. There is no right or wrong in my book. Just what gives me satisfaction and disatisfaction.

I used to think that way too. But it seems so lazy to reject good/bad on the basis convenience.

vslayer,
media are nto world leaders, kofi annan is

Kofi Annan? You mean that guy who talks passionately about making the world a better place and does nothing :confused:

Neildo,
the reason why I tend to repeat things in different ways is to drill my point into your brain.
If your argument was cutting, it wouldn't need manual drilling.

" it would have made no impact and you would have just schluffed it off."
Exactly-Do we blame your weak argument, or you lack of manipulating?

It's the only way to convert sensitive or weak-minded people without using any physical means.

Manipulating? You amateur.
I can think of a million ways to do it.

Why not? What’s the difference? Because it’s just a “game”?

Nope. Its called tact. You may enounter it someday.

I can almost guarantee that if the Japanese were the ones harming Jewish people, you would be screaming as much bloody murder against them rather than the Nazis’.

The Japanese were in a marriage of convenience with the Germans. In reality, the Japanese harboured hundreds of Jewish families during the war

And what do you mean the Japanese weren’t indiscriminate? They flat out killed anyone who wasn’t Japanese.

Dude, this is flat out stupid. I said that
"the japanese killed indiscriminately"
which is equivelant to
"They flat out killed anyone who wasn’t Japanese."

'indiscriminately' means anyone, regardless of religion, race, sex, etc...

An honor system.. heh, that’s pretty amusing. I’ll try and use that excuse sometime if I ever do something bad.

Kamikaze takes balls.

I don’t see ANY news footage or articles about others, but if something that offends only the Jews, all of a sudden BLAM, it makes headline news and is talked about for the next couple days. Those other people don’t even get a small blurb. You guys are acting like little babies with no self-control.

The Jews are in a very unique position. Maybe you should factor that into your thought to understand why.

75% of the time the only rebuttal I hear is that they’re an anti-semite. I’m always going to wonder if you would have called me that if I wouldn’t have made that “save my ass from being called it” comment.

To say that something is categorically true about a group of people as diverse as Jews is quite a lot stupider than being called an anti-semite. I think these people are just being kind by not using harsher language.

Also, thats still weak grounds for 'protecting yourself'. Whats so bad about being called an anti-semite if you know its not true?

As I said, many groups have done bad things yet nobody fusses about them as much as Jews do about Nazis’. Just because Nazis’ may have done bad things such as what they did to Jewish people, does it mean everything they stood for is completely evil and should be ignored? They had many good concepts so I see no reason for people to ignore them completely. The only reason why many do is because they failed in what they set out to do.

Man, you really lack any kind of perspective on history.

The Nazi's made truckloads of SOAP from dead prisoners. Efficiency, or madness? You be the judge. If you can think of any good ideas, exclusive to the Nazi ideology then I'd like to hear them.

Be the bigger person and show some restraint and self-control.

Sounds like taking more crap from people than you rightfully deserve-- which I like to think is zero. Nothing honourable about that.

What I said is that many groups have done disgusting things, some even worse than Nazis’, yet they’re not seen to be as bad as them which is stupid. The only reason why Nazis’ are seen as bad as they are is because of the Jewish campaign trying to make everyone feel pity for them. Your crying has already gotten you your own country so you can stop now, but I guess you’ll never stop till you have everything.
The Jewish campaign is to raise awareness about genocide and racial conflict around the world. I haven't been to a single yom hashoah where there hasn't been mention of some other genocide going how we should all be working to put an end to it.

The problem of course, is that if falls on deaf ears because people are so convinced its a campaign of pity.

If you don't speak out, you will never be heard.

Well first off, Nazis’ didn’t get away with anything
Does the number 6 million mean anything to you.

Just don’t stick your nose in everything and start critizing them for doing something that is different from your belief.

I'll criticize anyone I feel like criticizing. Notice how this differs from persecution.

Well you have some self-control issues then if you’re going to voice your differing opinion on everything.

I'm an easygoing person. I rarely feel the need to voice my opinion to a roomful of people who don't care, but when I do, I don't hold back. I come here expecting to find people who care at least a little. Nothing wrong with that.

I don't stand on crates and yell at the people passing by me.

Funny how it’s only things that offend Jews that make such headlines. You guys scream the loudest and it’s quite annoying. Your campaign of the oppression of the Jews is never-ending and it only adds to the number of people that may dislike you guys rather than trying to gain sympathizers.

Forget the fact you've repeated yourself for the umpteenth time. THe point is, Jews are strong lobbyists and if that annoys you, I personally don't care.

Things which the Japanese did as well, if not even more worse things, yet almost everyone loves Japanese people and their culture. Other than reading about, or watching a documentary on, it, I don’t think I’ve ever heard of anyone complaining about the Japanese.

Part of the reason the Japanese are so advanced is because they're packed so tightly together. They understand way more about culture, manners, tact and honor than most of the world, so I don't think its surprising that we idealize them.

Conflict is often comedic, and victimisation is often humourous.

True. This says more about the audience than anything else.

Comedy and humour aren't limitted to those areas, but they certainly encompass them.

As a pure concept, I agree. It is the audience that limits them.

The prince of england dressing up as a nazi IS funny, BECAUSE of who he is.

If who he is matters at all, then it matters.

He was being inappropriate on purpose, there's nothing "stupid" about it at all.

I think he doesn't want to be royalty at all. With that privilege of royalty comes responsibility; in rejecting the latter, Harry makes a statement about the former.

People who get offended are stupidly predictable as evidenced by his joke on them.

That's debatable. In the meantime, you're a great example of the audience I was referring to.

I commend prince harry.

For mocking human atrocity? Or for rejecting his royalty?

For mocking human atrocity? Or for rejecting his royalty?

Wearing a swastika = mocking human atrocity?

Come now tiassa.. don't disgrace yourself.

Theres nothing wrong with sticking up for your beliefs if that involves defending Harry. Just don't try to take away my right to stick up for my beliefs in the process. Argument is good.

Well then, we're agreed. I wasn't trying to.

Whats so bad about being called an anti-semite if you know its not true?

I can't answer for anyone else, but to me the problem is simple: I'm not an anti-Semite. I dislike people who are. And the more people call things anti-Semitism that aren't really, the more people start thinking of all anti-Semitism as equally mild.

Some old fogey living in the west end may decide to teach the young man a lesson about what it's like to loose a family to a Nazi bomb.

Or losing a family to an American bomb or any other violent action caused by any other country? Yet hey, there is no problem showing Americanism or any other country pride. Worse actions have happened to more people than they have to Jews, by other countries that weren’t Nazis’ as well. Yet the amount of hatred compared to those other countries do not compare to the outrage shown by Jews from Nazis’. C’mon, let’s hear the outrage when someone waves their American flag for all the atrocities they have commited. Why don’t wear hear about that, eh?

Nope. Its called tact. You may enounter it someday.

Tact? Funny. So you have no problem with millions of people playing the role of a Nazi in a video game, yet you’re going to scream bloody murder for one person wearing a Nazi uniform? Heck, YOU need to show tact and restraint in your cries of vicitimization. If anything you should be complaining about the millions of people reinacting the role of a Nazi rather than one person doing so.

I wouldn’t mind this huge fuss that Jews are making of seeing the swastika IF those Jews were actually victims in WWII, but most people that complain about it weren’t even alive in those days. So for those people, I have the utmost respect of, but any other Jew complaining about it, they need to chill the heck out.

I’m curious, just how many more years are we going to have to hear about the holocaust or other Jewish persecution from you guys? Because if it’s going to go on for another 2,000 years which most of you have never lived through, I’m going to start complaining about lots of victimization that my people have gone through even if it may be hundreds of thousands of years in the past as well, which of course, I’ve never lived through either. Does that sound silly of me? If so, go look in the mirror (not directed at you, but everyone in general).

Manipulating? You amateur.
I can think of a million ways to do it.

Oh, I’m suuuure you could. ;)

If your argument was cutting, it wouldn't need manual drilling.

" it would have made no impact and you would have just schluffed it off."
Exactly-Do we blame your weak argument, or you lack of manipulating?

Neither. I blame your fanatical, no-way-in-hell-am-I-changing-my-position stance in which you have. There’s absolutely nothing I can say that will change your opinion, however, that doesn’t apply to other people. There are more people that feel the action of Prince Harry isn’t as bad as others that scream bloody murder think it was. So in that case, I have no weak argument if most agree with that. It’s just that there’s nothing I can say or do to sway your opinion on the matter.

The Japanese were in a marriage of convenience with the Germans. In reality, the Japanese harboured hundreds of Jewish families during the war

No, it was China, the victims of the Japanese, that harboured the Jews during the war.

Dude, this is flat out stupid. I said that
"the japanese killed indiscriminately"
which is equivelant to
"They flat out killed anyone who wasn’t Japanese."

'indiscriminately' means anyone, regardless of religion, race, sex, etc...

Yeah, I know, another word popped into mind, heh, my bad. But still, it’s silly to think the genocide of one race is worse than the genocide of all. The Japanese in that war were worse than the Nazis’.

An honor system.. heh, that’s pretty amusing. I’ll try and use that excuse sometime if I ever do something bad. ” - N

Kamikaze takes balls.

Ha, ha, f’in ha! You have no idea how funny yet idiotic I find this statement to be coming from you, a Jewish person. I guess I don’t even need to mention the balls of Palestinian suicide bombers. So if you weren’t the victims (sheesh, everyone is just out to getcha, eh?) of Palestinians, you’d be behind them 100% because of the balls and honor it takes to blow themselves up?

I don’t see ANY news footage or articles about others, but if something that offends only the Jews, all of a sudden BLAM, it makes headline news and is talked about for the next couple days. Those other people don’t even get a small blurb. You guys are acting like little babies with no self-control. - N

The Jews are in a very unique position. Maybe you should factor that into your thought to understand why.

A unique position my arse. Oh wait, they’re God’s Chosen People, so I guess that makes it all okay. As I said earlier, worse atrocities have happened and more people have died than Jews, yet their outcries combined from all those people compare nothing to that of you guys.

75% of the time the only rebuttal I hear is that they’re an anti-semite. I’m always going to wonder if you would have called me that if I wouldn’t have made that “save my ass from being called it” comment. ” - N

To say that something is categorically true about a group of people as diverse as Jews is quite a lot stupider than being called an anti-semite. I think these people are just being kind by not using harsher language.

Also, thats still weak grounds for 'protecting yourself'. Whats so bad about being called an anti-semite if you know its not true?

I actually have no problem being called anti-semite (which I’m not) as the word is meaningless these days due to the overuse of it. The ONLY problem I have with the word “anti-semite” isn’t the word itself but the constant overuse of which Jews use it. When an argument doesn’t go their way, they resort to calling someone an anti-semite as if it’s a trump card to try and end the conversation and make themselves out to be the victim and winner of the conversation.


If you can think of any good ideas, exclusive to the Nazi ideology then I'd like to hear them.

You put emphasis on “exclusive” which is what I find amusing. Why do I? Because there are no exclusive ideology which they had. They were just doing what EVERYONE else was either already doing or trying to do. Try and get rid of the lesser peoples of the world and breed a super race? They borrowed it from America. Conquer the world to create a one world government? That’s what everyone wants to try and do even if they deny it. Heck, that’s what America wants too.

Nazi ideology takes the best, yet controversial and extreme, ideas from everyone and actually put it into practice for everyone to view. That’s the only reason why people hate them. They weren’t doing anything new that wasn’t already being done by others, it’s just that people actually got to see it without it being so discrete and “behind the scences” which other governments and countries did. In this case, ignorance is bliss, but that doesn’t stop those actions from continuing to take place. Nazis’ only suck because they failed, yet were so close, in doing what they were trying to do. Once any other country or government gets as close to accomplishing what the Nazis’ did, that’s when they’ll get hated. Why do you think everyone hates America so much? There isn’t much difference between America and Nazis’ other than the discreteness of it all. This is why other countries got away with doing the exact same things the Nazis’ did.

Which brings me to:


The Jewish campaign is to raise awareness about genocide and racial conflict around the world. I haven't been to a single yom hashoah where there hasn't been mention of some other genocide going how we should all be working to put an end to it.

The problem of course, is that if falls on deaf ears because people are so convinced its a campaign of pity.

If you don't speak out, you will never be heard.

That’s good and all. If you want to spread awareness then do so. However, the only things I ever hear coming out from your corner is Nazi exclusive things which is why it IS a campaign of pity. Usually it’s about the problems and victimizations which you guys had to deal with as opposed to the opression and victimization of humanity as a whole. Preach about humanity = a good thing that gains massive respect. Preach only about yourselves = stfu you stingy bastards. That’s the problem.

Perhaps you should start a campaign against various news outlets that are painting you people in a bad light. They don’t focus on your awareness for all but only when it comes to bitching about things that only affect yourselves. Seriously, the only public things I ever hear of is only that and I doubt I’m not alone. If you truly care about humanity as a whole, take it up with the news networks and tell them to quit showing only you guys as victims, and please, do not call them anti-semites for doing so as that’ll just ruin your chance.

“ Well first off, Nazis’ didn’t get away with anything ” - N

Does the number 6 million mean anything to you.

And where are the Nazis’ today? They didn’t get away with anything. Where are the governments and countries that did the exact same thing Nazis’ did? They exist to this day. Therefore the OTHER governments and countries are the ones to have gotten away with it all. Heck, your "honourable" Japanese killed 8 million Chinese civilians (read 20M, all the way up to 60M) vs your 6 million Jews, which to this day, the amount continues to decrease. What's the latest number? Only 750k-1M Jews died from the Nazis'? Heck, the Nazis' called the Japs the Japanese Killing Machine because they made the Nazis' look like nothing!


“ Well you have some self-control issues then if you’re going to voice your differing opinion on everything. ” - N

I'm an easygoing person. I rarely feel the need to voice my opinion to a roomful of people who don't care, but when I do, I don't hold back. I come here expecting to find people who care at least a little. Nothing wrong with that.

I don't stand on crates and yell at the people passing by me.

Cool, I’m behind you 100% then. However, that’s just you. Why is it we constantly hear about Jewish victimization then? Why is it nobody cries as loud as you guys when it comes to bad things that have happened to ya? I mean c’mon, because of this Prince Harry incident, now all of the EU wants to ban swastikas, lol. Seriously, when it comes to Jews, Gays, the NAACP, and the ACLU complaining about things, I’ve had enough. We hear too much about it. Each of those groups are COMPLETELY justified in what they’re arguing against and discrimination for all should be abolished. But when we constantly hear about that crap, rather than gaining sympathizers, those groups then lose em. You mentioned tact, well, they all need to learn it.

“ Things which the Japanese did as well, if not even more worse things, yet almost everyone loves Japanese people and their culture. Other than reading about, or watching a documentary on, it, I don’t think I’ve ever heard of anyone complaining about the Japanese. ” - N


Part of the reason the Japanese are so advanced is because they're packed so tightly together. They understand way more about culture, manners, tact and honor than most of the world, so I don't think its surprising that we idealize them.

Sorry, but this is another comment which I find funny yet so idiotic. So because a country somehow has culture, manners, tact, and honor, that gives them a get out of jail free card? So one can commit horrendous crimes and violent acts, yet if they have culture, manners, tact, and honor, it’s okay? That’s just absurd and no wonder all these countries “got away” with all of their crimes! Heck, the more I think about that unbelievable mindset, the more I’m actually gonna start feeling sorry for yes, the Nazis’ of all people, for getting such a bad rap and being the huge scapegoat of everything. Sorry Nazis’, but if you would have shown some manners, tact, and honor in the way you killed all those people, you would have been able to get away with it all. Nobody would have stopped you from conquering the world because you would have just been so awesome to be ruled by with your cool culture and all. :confused:

- N

The NZ Herald, published in Auckland, put it in context; there was a cartoon the day after this kerfuffle broke out. A guy in an academic capand gown was hanging by his wrists on the walls of a prison cell. He turns to a fellow prisoner and answers a question--"Me? I was Prince Harry's history teacher."

Southstar,
"Wearing a swastika = mocking human atrocity?"

He was in full Nazi dress, complete with armband. This is different from wearing a swastika alone.

Beryl,
I can't answer for anyone else, but to me the problem is simple: I'm not an anti-Semite. I dislike people who are. And the more people call things anti-Semitism that aren't really, the more people start thinking of all anti-Semitism as equally mild.

I understand what you're saying. Essentially, stating the obvious or untrue discredits the argument (years of sciforums experience speaking!!) Lobbyists though use this all the time. Its effective if you've got enough backup.

Neildo,
C’mon, let’s hear the outrage when someone waves their American flag for all the atrocities they have commited. Why don’t wear hear about that, eh?

Nazi uniform is synonymous with the Third Reich and everything it stood for. The American flag, while tied to some negative things, stands for things like freedom, democracy, right to a fair trial.

Which is worse?

I'm not a fan of flagwavers, but I don't think you can compare the two.

Tact? Funny. So you have no problem with millions of people playing the role of a Nazi in a video game, yet you’re going to scream bloody murder for one person wearing a Nazi uniform? Heck, YOU need to show tact and restraint in your cries of vicitimization.

Dude, its you who needs to chill down. I merely pointed out what a dumbass thing it was for him to do and you call that 'cries of victimization'?

I have a problem with video games that portray war as more than a first person shooter and mock atrocity. Its disrespectul and also... tactless.

I’m curious, just how many more years are we going to have to hear about the holocaust or other Jewish persecution from you guys?

Well after you're dead I'm guessing. You're going to hear less about it as the years go on, but talk of the holocaust won't die out in this lifetime.

Neither. I blame your fanatical, no-way-in-hell-am-I-changing-my-position stance in which you have. There’s absolutely nothing I can say that will change your opinion, however, that doesn’t apply to other people.

I've admitted to being on the wrong side of an argument in the past, but in this case.. I think I'm right.

There are more people that feel the action of Prince Harry isn’t as bad as others that scream bloody murder think it was. So in that case, I have no weak argument if most agree with that. It’s just that there’s nothing I can say or do to sway your opinion on the matter.

So, if the majority of people agree with you, you're right? sweet, I guess you're right man.

No, it was China, the victims of the Japanese, that harboured the Jews during the war.

No, actually, they came from China. I was shocked by the story, I'll see if I can pull up a link for you.

Yeah, I know, another word popped into mind, heh, my bad. But still, it’s silly to think the genocide of one race is worse than the genocide of all. The Japanese in that war were worse than the Nazis’.

I don't think so. Indiscrimate killing is not the same as genocide. Its kind of like what ghenghis khan and his crew did. They marched up to a city, gave its residents one chance to surreder and pay tribute, OR fight to the death, be raped and have their cities burnt to the ground.

Not nice, but not systematic and planned like genocide. They laid out the rules in advance, rather than blocking migration to another continent just so there would be enough to kill.

Ha, ha, f’in ha! You have no idea how funny yet idiotic I find this statement to be coming from you, a Jewish person. I guess I don’t even need to mention the balls of Palestinian suicide bombers. So if you weren’t the victims (sheesh, everyone is just out to getcha, eh?) of Palestinians, you’d be behind them 100% because of the balls and honor it takes to blow themselves up?

Just because I'm Jewish doesn't mean I need to fit on a certain side of argument. I take this prejudice as another sign of weakened reasoning.

Suicide bombers and kamikaze pilots may be foolish but I prefer them to the people who don't opinions(note that some suicide bombers/kamikaze fit into this category).

Oh wait, they’re God’s Chosen People, so I guess that makes it all okay. As I said earlier, worse atrocities have happened and more people have died than Jews, yet their outcries combined from all those people compare nothing to that of you guys.

Numbers are meaningless. The most important thing in considering genocide is the methods used by the killers. Nazi's tricked (?) Jews onto cattle trains, demoralized them, starved them, performed awful experiments and used the ashes for soap.

The khmer rouge were close, if not worse in their techniques, even though many fewer people were people were killed by the khmers. Get my point?

I actually have no problem being called anti-semite (which I’m not) as the word is meaningless these days due to the overuse of it.

I think Hitler was quoted as saying the exact same thing 70 years ago. You may be right - and I don't think you're a self-realized anti-semite- but theres no way of knowing for sure.

You put emphasis on “exclusive” which is what I find amusing. Why do I? Because there are no exclusive ideology which they had. They were just doing what EVERYONE else was either already doing or trying to do. Try and get rid of the lesser peoples of the world and breed a super race? They borrowed it from America. Conquer the world to create a one world government? That’s what everyone wants to try and do even if they deny it. Heck, that’s what America wants too.

In defense of:
They had many good concepts so I see no reason for people to ignore them completely.

What I want to hear is one of the 'good concepts' you claim they had which hadn't already been in existence.

Usually it’s about the problems and victimizations which you guys had to deal with as opposed to the opression and victimization of humanity as a whole. Preach about humanity = a good thing that gains massive respect. Preach only about yourselves = stfu you stingy bastards.
In this case it is. Obviously, because thats the subject matter. We don't take unnecessary tangents. But I'm sure it would've been far less 'funny' to you if he'd have dressed up like a khmer if thats what you're talking about. We see pictures of it in color and many survivors are still around.

As for getting me to stfu, if you still think you can do that then you simply don't learn.

And where are the Nazis’ today? They didn’t get away with anything.

Simply existing is getting away with something. Do you really believe 6 million unprevented brutal murders don't count?

Only 750k-1M Jews died from the Nazis'

I'd like to see where you get your numbers. Mel Gibson?

Heck, your "honourable" Japanese killed 8 million Chinese civilians

Please don't put words in my worth. The fact that they didn't put people in those awful concentration camps is itself more honorable. It doesn't mean the Japanese government did a good thing by killing people, only that their methods of indiscrimate killing, rules out in advance, were better than genocide.

Why is it we constantly hear about Jewish victimization then?

I hear more people complaining about the people who complain about Jewish victimization than I do about Jewish victimization itself. But I've come to expect this.

Nobody would have stopped you from conquering the world because you would have just been so awesome to be ruled by with your cool culture and all.

The German spirit that dominated that timeframe -- one of optimism and scientific progress would've been enough to spread a huge influence. The Nazi's are often credited with starting that, but the fact is they only destroyed it.

Wearing a swastika = mocking human atrocity?

Come now tiassa.. don't disgrace yourself.

Oh, come now, §outh§tar, you know I'm not so simplistic as that.

The prince of england dressing up as a nazi IS funny, BECAUSE of who he is.
It's not side splitting hilarity that will make you think for weeks, but it's as good a costume to wear as any other in the comedic sense if you are prince harry.
I'm pleased with his chosen attire, it exhibits his sense of humour quite fashionably.
If your knickers are in a twist about it, he was making fun of you and you are the idiot, congratulations. Harry wins.
He was being inappropriate on purpose, there's nothing "stupid" about it at all.

Now, let's just stop and think about it from Lou's perspective. Let's pretend that he's got Harry nailed on this one.

For what do we commend Prince Harry? For being intentionally inappropriate? Well, why be intentionally inappropriate? If it's about rejecting notions of royalty, I'm with Lou on this one and give him applause. If, however, it's about "winning", then I must disagree with Lou, because it's a stupid way to go about accomplishing what really is a silly point: Look at me, I can twist yer knickers!

"Good, Harry. Now sit. Beg. Roll over. Be predictable. That you're royalty at all is enough to twist some folks' knickers. And snap a perfectly good elastic waistband, too!"

Were he American and, say, a Kennedy, we'd all be writing Dr. Phil and blaming it on Charles.

(And how often do we get to make Teddy Kennedy "the attractive one"? Gary Shandling once reasoned that Denny's restaurants employed ugly waitresses in order to make the food look better. You know, "Waitress, these eggs look terrible!" So she picks it up, holds it next to her face, and says, "How about now?" Well, there you go. Make the British royals Kennedys, and Teddy can feel young again. He could take Charles out for a night on the town without feeling he's lost his role of, "the handsome one". You know, hey baby, and she says, "Sorry, you bloated sack of sh@t, you don't look too hot." So he grabs Charles, pulls him close, grins, and says, "How about now, baby?")

Anyway, if Prince Charles ends up on Dr. Phil because of this, then Harry can say, "I win!"

No, actually, they came from China. I was shocked by the story, I'll see if I can pull up a link for you.

Here's something I found during a quick search. Mentions both China and Japan's involvement with Jews.

http://www.jewishsightseeing.com/china/shanghai/19981030-shanghai_jews.htm


Just because I'm Jewish doesn't mean I need to fit on a certain side of argument. I take this prejudice as another sign of weakened reasoning.

Suicide bombers and kamikaze pilots may be foolish but I prefer them to the people who don't opinions(note that some suicide bombers/kamikaze fit into this category).

Well in that case, you've gained a bit of respect from me as it shows you're not a hypocrit even though those tactics may be being used against ya. Thank goodness, we need more like ya.

The same applies to me about “terrorists”, which 9/11 wasn’t a terrorist act. The U.S.S. Cole or any embassy bombing isn’t a terrorist act either. Now killing people of an Olympic team, THAT is a terrorist act! Heck, any attack, even if it were from a legitimate country’s army would have caused “terror” in people for the simple fact of something actually happening on our soil, but that doesn’t mean it was from “terrorists” unless you want to call any act of war a terrorist act. That’s the only “terrorizing” factor of 9/11.

The World Trade Center was a huge economic center that caused a nice blow to us. The other targets were the White House and the Pentagon. Those weren’t attacks directed at “civilians” but rather the government. Sure, civilians died but it was more along the lines of “expendible losses” to make their mission happen NO differently than all the civilians that happen to die during the Iraq war. If there were no civilians in those buildings and instead the U.S. Army or some robots ran them, the target would have still been the same. Those expendible losses are no different from one another. And if you want to change