Why have the president of the United States and its congress yet to form a bureau of psychics to aid in homeland security? Our primary problem with fighting the war on terror is a lack of sources of information, psychics could provide us with the leads we need to prevent future catastrophes but so far it seem that the Bush administration is asleep at the helm as far as this goes. Is it because psychics vote green? Is that the problem? It seems like an awful partisan reason to ignore such an important national resource.

What do any psychics, or psychic enthusiasts, think of this antipathy towards psychic intelligence gathering? The president claims to be a spiritual man, he should be all for it. If you are a psychic, would you participate in a program that would make the nation safer from militant extremists?

I thought it was Ronnie Raygun and his missus that was a regular visitor to psychic medium?

So wrong pres. Bush jnr might be a dipshit, but even he hasn't sunk so low as to believe in psychics. Yet.

The reason they don't do this is because they have no evidence of psychics even existing. It would be a waste of money to form a bureu full of con artists

Originally posted by SpyMoose
If you are a psychic, would you participate in a program that would make the nation safer from militant extremists?

Are you kidding here?? No psychic would participate in this effort as they would have to produce actual results. It's much easier to continue running their cons on the credulous and promote their efforts on LKL.

Barkhorn.

Couldn’t they at least get Silvia Brown to go down to Guantanimo bay in Cuba to work a crowd of detainees and tell which ones were just poor dirt farmers and which ones were the Taliban liaison to Al-Queda ? I mean heck, shouldn’t that work even if her abilities are just a lot of fast talking flummery?

I mean, even if debunkers are right, and she gets you to volunteer information, and homes in on that, and she just keeps talking until people start telling her things, and there is no real mind reading going on wouldn’t that work with those people?

Didn't David A. Morehouse already address the issue of psychics and government in his book http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0312964137/ref=sib_dp_pt/103-5960764-3263036#reader-link ? :eek:

Sorry maybe a better site would be:
http://www.psychicwarrior.com/default.html

Didn't David A. Morehouse already address the issue of psychics and government in his book http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0312964137/ref=sib_dp_pt/103-5960764-3263036#reader-link ? :eek:

Sorry maybe a better site would be:
http://www.psychicwarrior.com/default.html

...and your point is what, exactly?

Barkhorn.

My point was directed to the question posted "Why have the president of the United States and its congress yet to form a bureau of psychics to aid in homeland security?"

Pyschics and Homeland Security had already been investigated according to those that were a part of the program.

I hate to point out the ... uh ... obvious, but Dubya doesn't need psychics on the Homeland team. Remember that he claims to get his orders directly from God, and who could possibly have better intel?

Er ....

My point was directed to the question posted "Why have the president of the United States and its congress yet to form a bureau of psychics to aid in homeland security?"

Pyschics and Homeland Security had already been investigated according to those that were a part of the program.

Yes - according to those that were part of the program. So...if RV works - then were the hell is Osama and how come it took so long to find Saddam????

Look, it's like this;
1. The Pentagon/CIA a bunch of $$$ on RV - and other ESP nonsense for years.
2. They finally decided to give up as the results were not there.
3. Ex-program members now run around touting the fact that they worked for the government on these projects.
4. What they neglect to tell you - as they so cheefully take your $$$ - is that the government no longer funds programs like these because, THEY DON'T WORK.

Barkhorn.

I agree, they don't work, RV has it's limitations such as accuracy in the realm of future infinite possibilities.

Are you all still talking about RV i thought it was established several times that RV is false.

Why everyone knows that psychics are all Democrats and wouldn't help the Republicans! :D :D

I agree, they don't work, RV has it's limitations such as accuracy in the realm of future infinite possibilities.

What we generaly concider as military intelegince also has these exact same faults, because the future is not 100% predictable. This is not a valid excuse for why real psychic phenomina is not being exploited.

Why everyone knows that psychics are all Democrats and wouldn't help the Republicans! :D :D

Really? They must know something we don'. We aught to vote democrat in the next election, lest what the psychics see coming comes to pass.

I did not mention predictability but accuracy in the possibilities.

This is not a valid excuse for why real psychic phenomina is not being exploited.


Umm...and this "real" phenomina has been proven, how??

Barkhorn.

Umm...and this "real" phenomina has been proven, how??

Barkhorn.

I can't believe I even have to dignify this with a response. Sure there is no 'evidence' for psychic phenomenon, but in case you hadn't noticed there is an entire forum right here dedicated to it, and dozens of people here alone who claim to be able to use it in some capacity or other. Like NEMESIS in his thread "To All Esp Skeptics: Read It And Weep!". They can't all be self absorbed liars who want desperately to be special, can they?

Sure there is no 'evidence' for psychic phenomenon, but in case you hadn't noticed there is an entire forum right here dedicated to it, and dozens of people here alone who claim to be able to use it in some capacity or other. ?

Just because some Woo Woo posts about his anecdotal experiences or in one breath makes mention of a one shot experiment that has significant results, and in the next claims that, "well you really can't test PSI anyway, yadda, yadda", you expect me to discard my present understanding of how the world works in favor of some metaphysical phenomena, the workings of which you can't even explain???? Get real guy!

Like NEMESIS in his thread "To All Esp Skeptics: Read It And Weep!". ?

The NEMESIS thread proves NOTHING. NEMESIS fails to understand the scientific method (re: repeatability) and believes his incredibly vague Tarot card readings actually signify a special talent. The funniest guy is Quantum Quack w/ his crack-brained theory of Skeptical interference ("Too many negative waves, Moriarity!"), he puts the Woo in WOO WOO.

They can't all be self absorbed liars who want desperately to be special, can they?

No, but some are, others fail to understand/allow for the following;
cold reading
communal reinforcement
Occam's razor
the placebo effect
the post hoc fallacy
selective thinking
self-deception
subjective validation
wishful thinking

Barkhorn.

you expect me to discard my present understanding of how the world works in favor of some metaphysical phenomena, the workings of which you can't even explain???? Get real guy!

Look again, I think I also called you closed minded. I do believe I'm covering all my bases. (Note: If upon a rereading of this thread you think you detect a hint of flipant irony... maybe you do)

So wrong pres.

I assure you that everything the goodly moose said was congruous with identifying George W. Bush, he doesn't have the wrong man. Your idea that he may be talking about Regan seems to be based entirely upon your interpretation of the moose's post as perceived through the filters of your own poor reading comprehension skills.

I suggest writing the moose's thread down, then bringing it to your English teacher and having him help you slowly through each sentence so that you can properly understand what he's talking about.

I hate to point out the ... uh ... obvious, but Dubya doesn't need psychics on the Homeland team. Remember that he claims to get his orders directly from God, and who could possibly have better intel?

Er ....

That's a good point, Tiassa. Also I'd mention that it seems that the Bush administration seems to have no problem at all with fabricating information, so what real purpose would the psychic department fulfill? They'd be nothing but a redundant waste of tax-payer money when dubbaya can have is own very convincing visions of WMD and terrorists in Iraq.

I did not mention predictability but accuracy in the possibilities.

So essentially what you're saying is that it's indistinguishable for guess work? Goodness, what an incredibly useful phenomena.

If there are any homeland security people listening in: I had a dream related to 9/11 that was most complex, this morning I had a smaller dream about trains on fire and a large industrial complex exposion and fire. Don't know much else but that maybe its in a small town area.

There was a famous Horizon programme on BBC2 about RV, which for most of its length appeared to take it seriously, before pointing out the flawed basis for its operation, and ultimately its untruth. In hindsight it beggared belief that the US government spent so much money on something that could produce no real results - only "test" results on known targets, in which of course those human failings listed above form an important part.

But it seems to me from that link that RV is definitely dead and buried, because David Morehouse describes himself as the World's leading teacher of "Remote Viewing and Spiritual Transformation".

Can anyone give me a guess as to how much money the US government would have spent on RV if it was called Remote Viewing and Spiritual Transformation in the first place?

For the believer no proof necessary, for the sceptic no proof possible.
Psychics by the way have already been proved in laboritory tests.
Anyone to say that psychism and psychics do not exist is truly ignorant.
Next time you get a sensation of being completely safe or on the other extreme really unsafe in a new situation, what will you refer that to?
Will you say it was intuition (a normal natural phenominon) or will you say you didn't have a feeling?

Will you declare that you don't have feelings? If you do you are saying you are senseless...
Yes, there are con artists and charlatans in the psychic field. But aren't there charlatans everywhere in every other industry?
Are your expectations of us that high that you do not allow psychics to be human too????????
I have an extreme distaste for any person posing as a psychic who has no skill or ethics. That is why I belong to a professional association which I thoroughly researched before joinging. I was tested, vetted, checked and finally listed.

As psychics we endanger ourselves when we report our impressions of events to come, or locate the bodies of abduction and murder victims.
James Van Praagh found numerous bodies of adolescent victims of abduction and murder and was at one stage accused of having had somethign to do with it until he found a victim still alive which he dug up out of the grave that the kid had been buried in!!! The perp was found and he was declared innocent of any involvement other than his psychic skills in finding the bodies and solving the murders.

If we are not endangered by the perpretrators when we report our impressions, we are certainly endangered by what we know, and the claim from right wing idiots that we have conspired or to have been involved in the inital crime upon which we are getting impressions.

The war is no longer between countries it is between the right wing and free thought. I do not like Saddam or Osama, so don't get me wrong there either.

George W is going to hell in the next two years and his father with him.
He did anything and everything to ensure he would be re-elected including under handed deals, voter intimdiation behind the scenes as well as organising a whole bunch of his right wing followers to come to aid of his voting numbers. America said they re elected him on moral issues (gays etc) how moral is it to blow up 100,000 civilians in Iraq? I guess morality must be geographical rather than universal musn't it?

We as psychics (in the group I am involved in) did know this was going to happen before it did, but what is the point of broadcasting it when we are attacked so openly. Right wing people feel perfectly safe to attack us for being what we are which is spiritually gifted people. They justify killing by saying they are doing god's work of anhiliating anyone who opposes them, or is different. How is this holy? The Catholic saints-if you actually read your history were rather psychic and had horridly difficult lives. Most people who are psychic-a-phobic really just would like to be psyhic and are jealous. Its like a homophobic homosexual.

The truth is the democrats don't have much of a polairty to offer to stand against the burning Bush. They need Hillary to come in as leader if they are to get anywhere, because she's the only one that offers something different completely. The Bin Laden and Bush families along with the Cheneys have been in business and in league together for decades, so what did you really expect?

Amanda
(My assumed name).
I would be stupid to name myself or come forward when this would endanger my personal safety.

Hmm if its been proven in laboratory testing why don't you show us reliable documents proving physics exists? As for knowing about Bush's involvment in Iraq, anyone could have made that assumption, his acts weren't what I would call out of the ordinary.

Next time you get a sensation of being completely safe or on the other extreme really unsafe in a new situation, what will you refer that to?
Will you say it was intuition (a normal natural phenominon) or will you say you didn't have a feeling?

Personally I would refer to it as my subconcious.

We as psychics (in the group I am involved in) did know this was going to happen before it did, but what is the point of broadcasting it when we are attacked so openly.

Oh, let's think, ... to save 3.000 lives in the WTC, and the tens of thousands slain in reprisals in Afghanistan and Iraq maybe?

Your inaction demonstrates lack of any ability. You should assume the name of 'Charlotte-Ann' perhaps?